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LAPD Officer Killed During Training Exercise Was Investigating Cops About Rape

712 points by lend000 4y ago

aagha 4y ago
Both IA and FBI should be involved by now.
tb_technical 4y ago
What a coincidence! /s
throwayyy479087 4y ago
- lazyasciiart 4y ago
  > Misinformation like “it’s bad to kill cops looking into malfeasance” Is there a mistake in this sentence?
  - throwayyy479087 4y ago
    No, you can trust the government. This kind of thing never happens.
    - alexb_ 4y ago
      Your trolling lacks subtlety.
- notch656a 4y ago
  Not a single person here claimed anything resembling "Dorner was the good guy."
  - devteambravo 4y ago
    Oh? Please illustrate who the "good guy" was on that story then.
    - lawn 4y ago
      The innocent people driving a truck and got blasted with 107 bullets?
quantified 4y ago
> But a county medical examiner ruled Tipping's death an accident, saying the suspicious injuries revealed in the autopsy were sustained during attempts to save his life. If he sustained those injuries during an attempt to save his life, those officers definitely need to be taken off the street anyway. More dangerous "helping" people than just sitting in their cars.
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  > He did grapple with another officer, and both fell to the ground, resulting in a catastrophic injury to his spinal cord." Gage claims that Tipping wound up with three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck. "His heart eventually stopped working because of his injuries" and "he was paralyzed….He had subdural hematomas at three places on the left side and three places on the right side. There is no way that grappling would have caused those injuries the way the LAPD portrayed it." Rib fractures occur during CPR if CPR is being done correctly. The rest sounds like it was caused by the "grappling", which I suspect is a euphemism for the other cops beating the life out of him.
  - tyingq 4y ago
    Broken ribs that lacerate your liver wouldn't be normal in CPR.
    - Enginerrrd 4y ago
      "Chest compression is the most essential component of CPR and it is performed on the lower half of the sternum. During CPR, many complications may occur because of chest compressions, especially chest injuries including sternum and rib fractures. Rarely tracheal injury, rupture of the stomach, or liver or spleen injury may also occur as complications. In this study, we present two cases of liver injury caused by resuscitation. With this article, we want to emphasize the importance of making correct chest compressions. "[1] "In the general population, a well-described complication of cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR), liver laceration and injury, is reported at a rate of between 0.5-2.9% after CPR." [2] [1] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27896328/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27896328/ [2] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29097198/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29097198/ The ribs/liver is not the suspicious part to me. It's the multiple subdural hematomas on both sides of his head in addition to the spinal cord injury. Something about that doesn't sound right.
alx__ 4y ago
Nothing the LAPD does shocks me anymore. They've normalized their awful behavior as the norm
- notch656a 4y ago
  Remember when they were looking for Dorner and they just started shooting up pickup trucks that vaguely looked like Dorner's? "At about 5:30 am (PST), at least seven[98] LAPD officers on a protection detail of an unnamed LAPD official's residence in the 19500 block of Redbeam Street[99] in the Los Angeles County city of Torrance opened fire on the back of a light blue Toyota Tacoma and shot its two occupants, Emma Hernandez, 71, and her daughter, Margie Carranza, 47,[98][100] delivering newspapers for the Los Angeles Times.[10][101] The vehicle, according to officers, was spotted exiting a freeway and heading to the area of the residence that officers were protecting, was thought by police to match the description of Dorner's 2005 gray Nissan Titan and was moving without its headlights on.[97][102] Hernandez was shot in the back and Carranza received wounds to her hand. Their attorney claimed police "had no idea who was in that vehicle" when they opened fire, and that nothing about his clients or their vehicle matched the descriptions given of the suspect or his truck.[103] The two women stated that they were given no warning prior to being fired upon.[104]" -- wiki LAPD will happily attempt to kill anyone vaguely matching the description of someone they have beef with.
  - scottyah 4y ago
    They fired 107 shots, some of which made it into my old teachers’ house. Completely wild that none were charged as those actions were actually worse than a gang related drive by.
    - Alupis 4y ago
      > They fired 107 shots I don't know anything about this incident, and will not comment on such. I just wanted to point out the number of shots fired here from 7+ individuals is not unusual in the slightest, and is not an argument point that should be used to convince anyone of anything. Too often uninformed folks throw around the number of shots fired as-if it means incompetence/maleficence/or worse. It rarely if ever does. EDIT: Allow me to add an edit here since no one seems capable of understanding the nuance in my original post above. DO NOT Use round count as an indicator of anything, or as a cornerstone for an argument. You will be trying to imply something that is just flatly wrong, and it will reduce your argument to being an uninformed person. DO Focus on the facts of the events and ensure outrage is placed where it should be. Round count is not it. With that said - allow me to further clarify my original disclaimer. Should the events of that day taken place? From my uninformed opinion (having only read the above quote) - no, they should not have. In summary, don't quote round counts like it means something. It doesn't, and it only serves to make you look uninformed.
IAmGraydon 4y ago
- alach11 4y ago
  HN tends to have an interest in anti-authoritarian and anti-corruption stories.
  - muaytimbo 4y ago
    Are you suggesting these sorts of injuries are "run-of-the-mill" for bicycle training and that this is a non-story?
xracy 4y ago
The detective work on this one must be difficult. Doesn't seem like the LAPD is up to the task.
- Bilal_io 4y ago
  This should be investigated by the FBI in my opinion. Is it usually the FBI that investigstes police departments?
  - NoGravitas 4y ago
    I believe it's usually the state bureau of investigation, unless there's an interstate angle.
- snarf21 4y ago
  Yeah, IA isn't enough. We need the FBI to step in on all OI deaths.
  - pstuart 4y ago
    We need systemic outside oversite of the police. They are granted extraordinary powers and should have corresponding accountability.
    - muaytimbo 4y ago
      we have that, an "independent judiciary".
slaw 4y ago
Three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck and finally death from 'bicycle' exercise.
- birdyrooster 4y ago
  The author switches between a bicycle and grappling exercise and it makes it really confusing. Were they grappling people off of bicycles? Like why are people being thrown around and having their spinal cords broken from bicycle use?
  - SketchySeaBeast 4y ago
    The author isn't doing the switching: > According to Gage [the family lawyer]...The training at which he sustained injuries "was supposed to be bicycle training," but somehow wound up entailing the "grappling exercise" that the LAPD says killed him. I think that they article shows that there's confusion as to how bicycle training lead to a grapple exercise. Even the Police Chief is reporting grappling: > "He did grapple with another officer, and both fell to the ground, resulting in a catastrophic injury to his spinal cord."
    - godelski 4y ago
      So... were the two cops just fighting?
      - slaw 4y ago
        Breaking someone's neck is not 'just' fighting, also when you look at injuries it doesn't look like it was one on one fight.
        godelski 4y ago
        I meant "fighting" as in "not a 'grappling exercise'".
- vkou 4y ago
lawn 4y ago
> He added that the LAPD said no video footage of the training exercise exists, even though these sorts of trainings are often recorded. That seems like standard procedure by now. When something happens, conveniently the video footage that should exist, magically doesn't.
- Arrath 4y ago
  Time to start prorating individual officer's salary for the % of their shift time that has extant video footage? These body cams are useless if the video can go conveniently missing whenever it needs to.
  - hanniabu 4y ago
    Won't change a thing, they'd happily be paid 8hrs less if it means not going to jail
    - wahnfrieden 4y ago
      It would have the same effect as this early american law: > There was little doubt that fence cutting would be criminalized, but what was to be done about ranchers who were fencing over public roads and lands? Here the Texas Legislature stood with the rich, making fence cutting a felony punishable by two to five years in prison, while for the cattle barons who encroached on public land, the punishment was a misdemeanor and a small fine of $10 to $100. ie levying a slight tax to enable it rampantly through surface-level law and order
  - edgyquant 4y ago
    Nope time to throw cops and their supervisors in jail who lose or forget to record footage
    - rightbyte 4y ago
      Fun times when your body cam breaks. Just upload the video automatically to some central server. Then the corruption on police station level can't get to it. You could do the upload via mobile network if a "bang" is heard too.
Overtonwindow 4y ago
After Christopher Dorner nothing surprises me with LAPD. I don't think this was a training accident, the injuries are too severe, more akin to a beating.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
Hnrobert42 4y ago
Lots of speculation and innuendo in that article. - Officer Tipping wasn’t investigating rape, but simply took the victim statement. - The officer in the training exercise that killed Officer Tipping has the same name as the officer in Tipping’s report, but they are not sure if it is the same person. - The medical examiner ruled the killing an accident. The article then quotes a tweet that says medical examiners undercount murders by police, implying collusion or coverup. - There is no recording of the training. The article states that often video recordings are made, implying a cover up. Abuse of power by the police is heinous. They are supposed to be our protectors, so I hate it as much as the next person. But we must be led by fact not belief or we are no better than those who believe the Big Lie.
- ethanbond 4y ago
  I wonder how a medical examiner could possibly distinguish between bludgeoning injuries sustained as part of a simulated mob attack (accidental) and bludgeoning injuries sustained as part of a murder that took place during a simulated mob attack (not accidental).
  - jaywalk 4y ago
    I believe medical examiners make that determination based off the police report in cases like this. So if the cops said it was an accident, and the ME finds that the accidental injury was the cause of death, then it's an accidental death.
- mpalczewski 4y ago
  What's the "Big Lie"?
  - sjsdaiuasgdia 4y ago
    Generally speaking, "the Big Lie" refers to the idea that the 2020 US presidential election's result was fraudulent and Donald Trump was the true winner.
    - 4y ago
wnevets 4y ago
I am 100% confident the LAPD will investigate themselves and find they did nothing wrong.
woodruffw 4y ago
And so continues one of the oldest traditions in American policing: attempting[1] to drive out or kill any cop who doesn't comply with the wall of silence. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Serpico https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Serpico
- int_19h 4y ago
  A more recent example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Schoolcraft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Schoolcraft "Adrian Schoolcraft (born 1976) is a former New York City Police Department (NYPD) officer who secretly recorded police conversations from 2008 to 2009. He brought these tapes to NYPD investigators in October 2009 as evidence of corruption and wrongdoing within the department. The tapes were used as evidence of arrest quotas leading to police abuses such as wrongful arrests, and that emphasis on fighting crime sometimes resulted in under-reporting of crimes to artificially deflate CompStat numbers. After voicing his concerns, Schoolcraft was repeatedly harassed by members of the NYPD and reassigned to a desk job. After he left work early one day, an ESU unit illegally entered his apartment, physically abducted him and forcibly admitted him to a psychiatric facility, where he was held against his will for six days. Schoolcraft alleges in the lawsuit that NYPD spokesperson Paul Browne was present at the 31 October 2009 raid. Browne is a "top aide" to Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly. According to the Village Voice: "If proven true, Browne's presence at Schoolcraft's home on Oct. 31, 2009 suggests that Commissioner Kelly was aware of the decision by Deputy Chief Michael Marino to order Schoolcraft handcuffed and dragged from his own apartment just three weeks after he reported police misconduct to the unit which audits NYPD crime statistics."
readonthegoapp 4y ago
Sounds like a typical murder -- like freddie gray, etc.
woodruffw 4y ago
I'll point out another dimension to this: it can be entirely true that Tipping's death was an accident, because the other cops at the training exercise may have "merely" intended to beat him within an inch of his life for daring to break the wall of silence. In other words: defenses on the grounds of his death being an "accident" are not sufficient. What matters is the totality of circumstances, and those include the implicit threat of violence against any cop who dares to out the crimes of their peers.
- MichaelCollins 4y ago
  If they only intended to beat him up but accidentally killed him, that would be second degree murder. It could possibly be first degree murder, if California's felony murder rule were applied, maybe using the crime of torture as the felony.
  - woodruffw 4y ago
    That's a good point; I forgot about felony murder.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - samatman 4y ago
    Witness intimidation is definitely a felony, even (especially) when the police do it.
    - MichaelCollins 4y ago
      IANAL but I believe California's felony murder rule only applies to specific kinds of felonies, and I don't believe witness intimidation is included: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=PEN&sectionNum=189 https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySectio... > (a) All murder that is perpetrated by means of a destructive device or explosive, a weapon of mass destruction, knowing use of ammunition designed primarily to penetrate metal or armor, poison, lying in wait, torture, or by any other kind of willful, deliberate, and premeditated killing, or that is committed in the perpetration of, or attempt to perpetrate, arson, rape, carjacking, robbery, burglary, mayhem, kidnapping, train wrecking, or any act punishable under Section 206, 286, 287, 288, or 289, or former Section 288a, or murder that is perpetrated by means of discharging a firearm from a motor vehicle, intentionally at another person outside of the vehicle with the intent to inflict death, is murder of the first degree. Torture seems the most likely to apply in this situation: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=206.&lawCode=PEN https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySectio... > Every person who, with the intent to cause cruel or extreme pain and suffering for the purpose of revenge, extortion, persuasion, or for any sadistic purpose, inflicts great bodily injury as defined in Section 12022.7 upon the person of another, is guilty of torture. I think a revenge beating meets that definition of torture, and torture is one of the felonies specifically listed in California's felony murder rule.
c7b 4y ago
I happen to have seen a recording of a crowd control exercise including regular police, a riot control unit and even a SWAT-style unit, including "arrests" and "resistance", and it was a lot tamer than the description may make it sound. A bicycle exercise for regular police spontaneously morphed into a mob control exercise spontaneously morphed into a grappling match definitely sounds fishy on its own.
- Hnrobert42 4y ago
  Wait. Do we know that bicycle training spontaneously morphed or was it a change on the schedule? Was it a grappling match or did grappling occur during the simulated riot? Was the riot training you’ve seen the same protocol used during the incident. I hate that I’m in the position of defending a possible cover up of a possible murder to cover up the possible rape by police officers. But damn people. Stick to verifiable facts.
  - kbelder 4y ago
    Don't be shy in your defense of truth, on whichever side it falls. It's noble.
cool_dude85 4y ago
Anyone know what set the 4 alleged rapists are in, if any? Has there been any public speculation on the possibility of either the alleged rapists or the cops who beat this guy being in a gang?
mikotodomo 4y ago
WTF. Police are supposed to be catching rapists. Not doing the rapes themselves!
SleepilyLimping 4y ago
I enjoy that there's just this demoralization of "yeah, I'm not surprised, and it's going to make me sadder to think about how little consequences are going to come of it."
insane_dreamer 4y ago
Whether murder or accidental, what kind of "bicycle training" exercise that includes grappling is designed in such a way that it may unintentionally result in the death of one of the trainees? So even if it wasn't intentional (and it's awful suspicious) the LAPD should be on the hook for running a training exercise that risky.
- hinkley 4y ago
  In other words, if trainees are dying that means civilians will die as well.
  - insane_dreamer 4y ago
    in fact, it's plausible that civilians are more likely to die than police trainees should such a simulated event take place in real life
  - nullc 4y ago
    It's difficult to restrain a healthy adult without simultaneously endangering his life especially without unduly risking your own, except where you have a significant size advantage. Consider it from an evolutionary perspective: a pinned animal is a dead animal. So we should expect animals to resist being trapped to the point of killing themselves / dying from the stress of fighting to break free. It's well known to be true for many animals and its also true for humans. Anytime a person is forcefully restrained there is a risk of death.
    - balaksakrionon 4y ago
      This is a good point and George Floyd is a sad example of this in action during a police encounter. He exerted himself tremendously for many minutes while under the influence of various drugs, and with a seriously compromised heart, and then succumbed while being restrained. Knowing that people get into this instinctual "fight" mode frequently during police encounters, to the point where they'll exert themselves to the point of exhaustion and beyond, I do wish police had a greater duty of care standard to check on people and assess for medical emergencies during such scuffles.
maratbn 4y ago
So far arguments can be made that officer Tipping was not really murdered, or that the woman was not really raped, but it is known for sure from prior cases, including criminal convictions, that there are plenty of rapists and murderers and all sorts of sick individuals in the police, that obviously should not be in the police. Many articles and discussions on police criminal activity carry a tone of surprise, but in my view nothing here is surprising considering that large numbers of questionable individuals who passed some subjective selection process are armed with guns and placed into what are essentially life-long appointments where lots of money and power is at stake. In my mind it would be surprising had there been no criminal activity within the police under the current system. It would be just as surprising if dictators stayed benevolent and never abused their authority. I'd say the solution to this problem is to have the public democratically elect police just like politicians, and to also have them be subjected to term limits just like politicians. So far this system has successfully prevented most people who should not be politicians from becoming politicians or maintaining political power, and I argue that in the same way it would prevent lots of people who should not be in the police from becoming or remaining police officers.
- knome 4y ago
  >the solution to this problem is to have the public democratically elect police just like politicians Doesn't seem to stop people from electing horrible sheriffs time and again. >So far this system has successfully prevented most people who should not be politicians from becoming politicians Is your comment satire?
  - maratbn 4y ago
    Generally public officials in countries with fair elections are an order of magnitude better than public officials in countries without fair elections. For example, compare Bush II with Ahmadinejad. > Doesn't seem to stop people from electing horrible sheriffs time and again. There are some problems with the current election system in the US in that many potential voters don't register to vote to not get summoned for jury duty and similar issues, while lots of police vote in blocks guided by powerful police unions. These problems can be fixed, and overall the US election system is better than in countries like Russia. > Is your comment satire? Even US politicians who are massively disliked are way better than their counterparts in countries without fair elections. Furthermore, these massively-disliked politicians get voted out at the end of term if a better politician runs against them. And even if they don't get voted out, they have to leave eventually due to hard term limits. I'm not saying that democratic elections with term limits for police will keep absolutely all bad people out of police, but what I am saying is that there will be an order of magnitude less bad people in the police, and they will also be an order of magnitude less bad than under the current traditional employment scheme.
pyuser583 4y ago
It’s worth mentioning - when officials commit crimes, early press reports usually reflect what the criminal wants. It’s only after looking into it much deeper that it’s clear the initial story was a “setup.”
MisterTea 4y ago
The police departments attract the same kind of thuggish person who joins a gang. Someone hungry for power and respect. Many times there are people who have an axe to grind with society or were bullied so its time for payback I had a friend who became a cop and he changed in a bad way, the power went to his head. After two incidents, one involving him pulling out his off duty gun in a crowded bar I cut him off. I did not report him out of fear of retaliation. "Retaliation"? I talked to another friend, a former cop painted a hellish picture of the police: "Its a power struggle internally with everyone forming cliques and hierarchies trying to brown nose superiors to garner favors, overtime and promotions. Anyone who breaks rank will be targeted for harassment. If you report him there's a chance you'll be "randomly" pulled over one day and suddenly there's drugs and/or a gun in your car. They will ruin your life. Just keep your mouth shut." I am genuinely scared of cops.
efficax 4y ago
i would definitely not put it past the lapd to murder their own but it seems like the guy was just a patrol cop who took a statement, not internal affairs or sex crimes detective who would actually make an arrest in a case like this, so why kill him?
unity1001 4y ago
If this happened in any other country, the US media & establishment would be screaming at the top of its lungs about how brutal and evil that country was. But its happening in the US. So its 'okay'.
fritztastic 4y ago
>Gage claims that Tipping wound up with three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck. "His heart eventually stopped working because of his injuries" and "he was paralyzed….He had subdural hematomas at three places on the left side and three places on the right side. There is no way that grappling would have caused those injuries the way the LAPD portrayed it." Sure sounds less like a simulation and more like an actual event. It's really not easy to have someone die during an exercise with this many injuries caused by physical contact. Things like drownings, falls, and collisions can occur in a hugh risk training event- but this extent of injuries from falling on the ground seems real tough to spin as accidental or unintentional. At best you'd have to be extremely negligent, at worst this was a deliberate choice. You'd really think someone would notice the person they're training with is actually hurt and stop to check in on them, presumably there are measures in place to pause the exercise which people are aware of before starting- were these ignored? I guess we'd have to have a discussion on the intent of the exercise and the extent to which force is used with no regard for safety during training, which is a whole other issue.
- philipov 4y ago
  Eyyy, he just fell down the stairs. Don't worry about it!
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
- Brybry 4y ago
  Broken ribs are common from CPR. They even mention it during CPR training (and they told us to keep going anyway). I don't remember anything about liver lacerations but a quick google does say it happens: looks like the sternum can slice your liver during compressions[1] (warning: graphic). No idea on head injuries or a broken neck from "grappling" though. [1] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S245224731630111X https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S245224731...
  - FireBeyond 4y ago
akiselev 4y ago
This is a great reminder that the LAPD is largely a bunch of thugs with badges and guns. I don’t mean that in a teenage angst “every cop is a thug” way, but in a “raining federal convictions” way. [1][2] The current sheriff was a member of the “Grim Reapers” [3] and the battle against the thugs has been on going for fifty years [4] [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LASD_deputy_gangs https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LASD_deputy_gangs [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Baca https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Baca [3] https://www.dailynews.com/2022/07/01/former-top-aide-to-villanueva-says-he-belonged-to-alleged-grim-reaper-deputy-gang/amp/ https://www.dailynews.com/2022/07/01/former-top-aide-to-vill... [4] https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/06/06/the-la-county-sheriffs-deputy-gang-crisis https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/06/06/the-la-county-...
- CameronNemo 4y ago
  LAPD and LASD are different orgs, but yeah they are probably both corrupt to the core. I know for a fact that there was a LASD gang called the Compton Executioners that excluded women and people of color.
  - maratbn 4y ago
    damn, with a name like "Compton Executioners" I would be proud to be excluded
  - akiselev 4y ago
    Great catch! As a long time resident of LA, few people make the distinction (I surely didn’t). The LAPD has its fair share of awfulness [1] but when the allegations are this bad it’s important not to paint every cop as guilty by association without evidence (and the evidence against the LASD is very strong) [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Los_Angeles_riots https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Los_Angeles_riots
    - weaksauce 4y ago
      > paint every cop as guilty by association without evidence it was the LAPD that opened fire on two old ladies in a truck that was the wrong type and color in the middle of the day when they were trying to murder their colleague that put out a manifesto about how corrupt they were. Sure he was killing cops that he thought were corrupt but that's against the fold and a sign that they hold themselves to be unaccountable. dorner was the guy who they eventually burned to death in a cabin in the mountains. the old saying about the rotten apple is not that there is a rotten apple that is alone in the doings it's that the rotten apple spoils the barrel. you see one bad cop and if you don't have a system that stops that you will have a barrel full of rotten cops.
concordDance 4y ago
Why is this on Hacker News? Seems very non tech related and the type of article that generates heat rather than light.
- x86_64Ubuntu 4y ago
  There are plenty of articles that make their way to HN that have nothing to do with anything technical.
  - concordDance 4y ago
    At this rate hackernews will just be another reddit.
- system2 4y ago
  Maybe it will inspire a hacker from HN to hack LAPD and we finally get some insights of what they are doing internally.
honkycat 4y ago
The scary question is: "why do they keep them employed?" The answer is: As long as they are busting the right heads, they are doing their jobs perfectly. It is not about protecting citizens. It is about corralling and controlling them. You will stew in your decaying cities full of people experiencing mental crisis and drug addicts, and you will not complain as we do nothing.
WrtCdEvrydy 4y ago
Well, guess we don't need to investigate anymore?
PointA2B 4y ago
Just another extremely fortunate coincidence for people possessing lots of power, nothing to see here folks.
10g1k 4y ago
Nothing fishy going on at all.
badinsie 4y ago
3/5 cops take illegal steroids. 4/5 cops in LA are in a gang. i say just throw them all in prison.
lewdev 4y ago
Holy crap, "Gage claims that Tipping wound up with three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck." Ohhh, they were bicycle training. Sarcasm aside, it's insane that after this incident, it's being labeled as a "training accident" when it so obviously wasn't.
JoeyBananas 4y ago
It's a good thing that a police department is actually doing training.
phendrenad2 4y ago
The double-standards for cops feels to me like the first step in the USA becoming a fascist state. One of the first things that happened in 1933 Germany was the breakdown between the police and the courts. Germany maintained a court system which, on paper, looked fair, but in practice the police had their own parallel justice system which just made up rules as it went along.

712 points by lend000 4y ago

aagha 4y ago

Both IA and FBI should be involved by now.

tb_technical 4y ago

What a coincidence! /s

throwayyy479087 4y ago

lazyasciiart 4y ago
> Misinformation like “it’s bad to kill cops looking into malfeasance” Is there a mistake in this sentence?
- throwayyy479087 4y ago
  No, you can trust the government. This kind of thing never happens.
  - alexb_ 4y ago
    Your trolling lacks subtlety.
notch656a 4y ago
Not a single person here claimed anything resembling "Dorner was the good guy."
- devteambravo 4y ago
  Oh? Please illustrate who the "good guy" was on that story then.
  - lawn 4y ago
    The innocent people driving a truck and got blasted with 107 bullets?

quantified 4y ago

> But a county medical examiner ruled Tipping's death an accident, saying the suspicious injuries revealed in the autopsy were sustained during attempts to save his life. If he sustained those injuries during an attempt to save his life, those officers definitely need to be taken off the street anyway. More dangerous "helping" people than just sitting in their cars.

MichaelCollins 4y ago
> He did grapple with another officer, and both fell to the ground, resulting in a catastrophic injury to his spinal cord." Gage claims that Tipping wound up with three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck. "His heart eventually stopped working because of his injuries" and "he was paralyzed….He had subdural hematomas at three places on the left side and three places on the right side. There is no way that grappling would have caused those injuries the way the LAPD portrayed it." Rib fractures occur during CPR if CPR is being done correctly. The rest sounds like it was caused by the "grappling", which I suspect is a euphemism for the other cops beating the life out of him.
- tyingq 4y ago
  Broken ribs that lacerate your liver wouldn't be normal in CPR.
  - Enginerrrd 4y ago
    "Chest compression is the most essential component of CPR and it is performed on the lower half of the sternum. During CPR, many complications may occur because of chest compressions, especially chest injuries including sternum and rib fractures. Rarely tracheal injury, rupture of the stomach, or liver or spleen injury may also occur as complications. In this study, we present two cases of liver injury caused by resuscitation. With this article, we want to emphasize the importance of making correct chest compressions. "[1] "In the general population, a well-described complication of cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR), liver laceration and injury, is reported at a rate of between 0.5-2.9% after CPR." [2] [1] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27896328/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27896328/ [2] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29097198/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29097198/ The ribs/liver is not the suspicious part to me. It's the multiple subdural hematomas on both sides of his head in addition to the spinal cord injury. Something about that doesn't sound right.

alx__ 4y ago

Nothing the LAPD does shocks me anymore. They've normalized their awful behavior as the norm

notch656a 4y ago
Remember when they were looking for Dorner and they just started shooting up pickup trucks that vaguely looked like Dorner's? "At about 5:30 am (PST), at least seven[98] LAPD officers on a protection detail of an unnamed LAPD official's residence in the 19500 block of Redbeam Street[99] in the Los Angeles County city of Torrance opened fire on the back of a light blue Toyota Tacoma and shot its two occupants, Emma Hernandez, 71, and her daughter, Margie Carranza, 47,[98][100] delivering newspapers for the Los Angeles Times.[10][101] The vehicle, according to officers, was spotted exiting a freeway and heading to the area of the residence that officers were protecting, was thought by police to match the description of Dorner's 2005 gray Nissan Titan and was moving without its headlights on.[97][102] Hernandez was shot in the back and Carranza received wounds to her hand. Their attorney claimed police "had no idea who was in that vehicle" when they opened fire, and that nothing about his clients or their vehicle matched the descriptions given of the suspect or his truck.[103] The two women stated that they were given no warning prior to being fired upon.[104]" -- wiki LAPD will happily attempt to kill anyone vaguely matching the description of someone they have beef with.
- scottyah 4y ago
  They fired 107 shots, some of which made it into my old teachers’ house. Completely wild that none were charged as those actions were actually worse than a gang related drive by.
  - Alupis 4y ago
    > They fired 107 shots I don't know anything about this incident, and will not comment on such. I just wanted to point out the number of shots fired here from 7+ individuals is not unusual in the slightest, and is not an argument point that should be used to convince anyone of anything. Too often uninformed folks throw around the number of shots fired as-if it means incompetence/maleficence/or worse. It rarely if ever does. EDIT: Allow me to add an edit here since no one seems capable of understanding the nuance in my original post above. DO NOT Use round count as an indicator of anything, or as a cornerstone for an argument. You will be trying to imply something that is just flatly wrong, and it will reduce your argument to being an uninformed person. DO Focus on the facts of the events and ensure outrage is placed where it should be. Round count is not it. With that said - allow me to further clarify my original disclaimer. Should the events of that day taken place? From my uninformed opinion (having only read the above quote) - no, they should not have. In summary, don't quote round counts like it means something. It doesn't, and it only serves to make you look uninformed.

IAmGraydon 4y ago

alach11 4y ago
HN tends to have an interest in anti-authoritarian and anti-corruption stories.
- muaytimbo 4y ago
  Are you suggesting these sorts of injuries are "run-of-the-mill" for bicycle training and that this is a non-story?

xracy 4y ago

The detective work on this one must be difficult. Doesn't seem like the LAPD is up to the task.

Bilal_io 4y ago
This should be investigated by the FBI in my opinion. Is it usually the FBI that investigstes police departments?
- NoGravitas 4y ago
  I believe it's usually the state bureau of investigation, unless there's an interstate angle.
snarf21 4y ago
Yeah, IA isn't enough. We need the FBI to step in on all OI deaths.
- pstuart 4y ago
  We need systemic outside oversite of the police. They are granted extraordinary powers and should have corresponding accountability.
  - muaytimbo 4y ago
    we have that, an "independent judiciary".

slaw 4y ago

Three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck and finally death from 'bicycle' exercise.

birdyrooster 4y ago
The author switches between a bicycle and grappling exercise and it makes it really confusing. Were they grappling people off of bicycles? Like why are people being thrown around and having their spinal cords broken from bicycle use?
- SketchySeaBeast 4y ago
  The author isn't doing the switching: > According to Gage [the family lawyer]...The training at which he sustained injuries "was supposed to be bicycle training," but somehow wound up entailing the "grappling exercise" that the LAPD says killed him. I think that they article shows that there's confusion as to how bicycle training lead to a grapple exercise. Even the Police Chief is reporting grappling: > "He did grapple with another officer, and both fell to the ground, resulting in a catastrophic injury to his spinal cord."
  - godelski 4y ago
    So... were the two cops just fighting?
    - slaw 4y ago
      Breaking someone's neck is not 'just' fighting, also when you look at injuries it doesn't look like it was one on one fight.
      - godelski 4y ago
        I meant "fighting" as in "not a 'grappling exercise'".
vkou 4y ago

lawn 4y ago

> He added that the LAPD said no video footage of the training exercise exists, even though these sorts of trainings are often recorded. That seems like standard procedure by now. When something happens, conveniently the video footage that should exist, magically doesn't.

Arrath 4y ago
Time to start prorating individual officer's salary for the % of their shift time that has extant video footage? These body cams are useless if the video can go conveniently missing whenever it needs to.
- hanniabu 4y ago
  Won't change a thing, they'd happily be paid 8hrs less if it means not going to jail
  - wahnfrieden 4y ago
    It would have the same effect as this early american law: > There was little doubt that fence cutting would be criminalized, but what was to be done about ranchers who were fencing over public roads and lands? Here the Texas Legislature stood with the rich, making fence cutting a felony punishable by two to five years in prison, while for the cattle barons who encroached on public land, the punishment was a misdemeanor and a small fine of $10 to $100. ie levying a slight tax to enable it rampantly through surface-level law and order
- edgyquant 4y ago
  Nope time to throw cops and their supervisors in jail who lose or forget to record footage
  - rightbyte 4y ago
    Fun times when your body cam breaks. Just upload the video automatically to some central server. Then the corruption on police station level can't get to it. You could do the upload via mobile network if a "bang" is heard too.

Overtonwindow 4y ago

After Christopher Dorner nothing surprises me with LAPD. I don't think this was a training accident, the injuries are too severe, more akin to a beating.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

Hnrobert42 4y ago

Lots of speculation and innuendo in that article. - Officer Tipping wasn’t investigating rape, but simply took the victim statement. - The officer in the training exercise that killed Officer Tipping has the same name as the officer in Tipping’s report, but they are not sure if it is the same person. - The medical examiner ruled the killing an accident. The article then quotes a tweet that says medical examiners undercount murders by police, implying collusion or coverup. - There is no recording of the training. The article states that often video recordings are made, implying a cover up. Abuse of power by the police is heinous. They are supposed to be our protectors, so I hate it as much as the next person. But we must be led by fact not belief or we are no better than those who believe the Big Lie.

ethanbond 4y ago
I wonder how a medical examiner could possibly distinguish between bludgeoning injuries sustained as part of a simulated mob attack (accidental) and bludgeoning injuries sustained as part of a murder that took place during a simulated mob attack (not accidental).
- jaywalk 4y ago
  I believe medical examiners make that determination based off the police report in cases like this. So if the cops said it was an accident, and the ME finds that the accidental injury was the cause of death, then it's an accidental death.
mpalczewski 4y ago
What's the "Big Lie"?
- sjsdaiuasgdia 4y ago
  Generally speaking, "the Big Lie" refers to the idea that the 2020 US presidential election's result was fraudulent and Donald Trump was the true winner.
  - 4y ago

wnevets 4y ago

I am 100% confident the LAPD will investigate themselves and find they did nothing wrong.

woodruffw 4y ago

And so continues one of the oldest traditions in American policing: attempting[1] to drive out or kill any cop who doesn't comply with the wall of silence. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Serpico https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frank_Serpico

int_19h 4y ago
A more recent example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Schoolcraft https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Schoolcraft "Adrian Schoolcraft (born 1976) is a former New York City Police Department (NYPD) officer who secretly recorded police conversations from 2008 to 2009. He brought these tapes to NYPD investigators in October 2009 as evidence of corruption and wrongdoing within the department. The tapes were used as evidence of arrest quotas leading to police abuses such as wrongful arrests, and that emphasis on fighting crime sometimes resulted in under-reporting of crimes to artificially deflate CompStat numbers. After voicing his concerns, Schoolcraft was repeatedly harassed by members of the NYPD and reassigned to a desk job. After he left work early one day, an ESU unit illegally entered his apartment, physically abducted him and forcibly admitted him to a psychiatric facility, where he was held against his will for six days. Schoolcraft alleges in the lawsuit that NYPD spokesperson Paul Browne was present at the 31 October 2009 raid. Browne is a "top aide" to Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly. According to the Village Voice: "If proven true, Browne's presence at Schoolcraft's home on Oct. 31, 2009 suggests that Commissioner Kelly was aware of the decision by Deputy Chief Michael Marino to order Schoolcraft handcuffed and dragged from his own apartment just three weeks after he reported police misconduct to the unit which audits NYPD crime statistics."

readonthegoapp 4y ago

Sounds like a typical murder -- like freddie gray, etc.

woodruffw 4y ago

I'll point out another dimension to this: it can be entirely true that Tipping's death was an accident, because the other cops at the training exercise may have "merely" intended to beat him within an inch of his life for daring to break the wall of silence. In other words: defenses on the grounds of his death being an "accident" are not sufficient. What matters is the totality of circumstances, and those include the implicit threat of violence against any cop who dares to out the crimes of their peers.

MichaelCollins 4y ago
If they only intended to beat him up but accidentally killed him, that would be second degree murder. It could possibly be first degree murder, if California's felony murder rule were applied, maybe using the crime of torture as the felony.
- woodruffw 4y ago
  That's a good point; I forgot about felony murder.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- samatman 4y ago
  Witness intimidation is definitely a felony, even (especially) when the police do it.
  - MichaelCollins 4y ago
    IANAL but I believe California's felony murder rule only applies to specific kinds of felonies, and I don't believe witness intimidation is included: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=PEN&sectionNum=189 https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySectio... > (a) All murder that is perpetrated by means of a destructive device or explosive, a weapon of mass destruction, knowing use of ammunition designed primarily to penetrate metal or armor, poison, lying in wait, torture, or by any other kind of willful, deliberate, and premeditated killing, or that is committed in the perpetration of, or attempt to perpetrate, arson, rape, carjacking, robbery, burglary, mayhem, kidnapping, train wrecking, or any act punishable under Section 206, 286, 287, 288, or 289, or former Section 288a, or murder that is perpetrated by means of discharging a firearm from a motor vehicle, intentionally at another person outside of the vehicle with the intent to inflict death, is murder of the first degree. Torture seems the most likely to apply in this situation: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=206.&lawCode=PEN https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySectio... > Every person who, with the intent to cause cruel or extreme pain and suffering for the purpose of revenge, extortion, persuasion, or for any sadistic purpose, inflicts great bodily injury as defined in Section 12022.7 upon the person of another, is guilty of torture. I think a revenge beating meets that definition of torture, and torture is one of the felonies specifically listed in California's felony murder rule.

c7b 4y ago

I happen to have seen a recording of a crowd control exercise including regular police, a riot control unit and even a SWAT-style unit, including "arrests" and "resistance", and it was a lot tamer than the description may make it sound. A bicycle exercise for regular police spontaneously morphed into a mob control exercise spontaneously morphed into a grappling match definitely sounds fishy on its own.

Hnrobert42 4y ago
Wait. Do we know that bicycle training spontaneously morphed or was it a change on the schedule? Was it a grappling match or did grappling occur during the simulated riot? Was the riot training you’ve seen the same protocol used during the incident. I hate that I’m in the position of defending a possible cover up of a possible murder to cover up the possible rape by police officers. But damn people. Stick to verifiable facts.
- kbelder 4y ago
  Don't be shy in your defense of truth, on whichever side it falls. It's noble.

cool_dude85 4y ago

Anyone know what set the 4 alleged rapists are in, if any? Has there been any public speculation on the possibility of either the alleged rapists or the cops who beat this guy being in a gang?

mikotodomo 4y ago

WTF. Police are supposed to be catching rapists. Not doing the rapes themselves!

SleepilyLimping 4y ago

I enjoy that there's just this demoralization of "yeah, I'm not surprised, and it's going to make me sadder to think about how little consequences are going to come of it."

insane_dreamer 4y ago

Whether murder or accidental, what kind of "bicycle training" exercise that includes grappling is designed in such a way that it may unintentionally result in the death of one of the trainees? So even if it wasn't intentional (and it's awful suspicious) the LAPD should be on the hook for running a training exercise that risky.

hinkley 4y ago
In other words, if trainees are dying that means civilians will die as well.
- insane_dreamer 4y ago
  in fact, it's plausible that civilians are more likely to die than police trainees should such a simulated event take place in real life
- nullc 4y ago
  It's difficult to restrain a healthy adult without simultaneously endangering his life especially without unduly risking your own, except where you have a significant size advantage. Consider it from an evolutionary perspective: a pinned animal is a dead animal. So we should expect animals to resist being trapped to the point of killing themselves / dying from the stress of fighting to break free. It's well known to be true for many animals and its also true for humans. Anytime a person is forcefully restrained there is a risk of death.
  - balaksakrionon 4y ago
    This is a good point and George Floyd is a sad example of this in action during a police encounter. He exerted himself tremendously for many minutes while under the influence of various drugs, and with a seriously compromised heart, and then succumbed while being restrained. Knowing that people get into this instinctual "fight" mode frequently during police encounters, to the point where they'll exert themselves to the point of exhaustion and beyond, I do wish police had a greater duty of care standard to check on people and assess for medical emergencies during such scuffles.

maratbn 4y ago

So far arguments can be made that officer Tipping was not really murdered, or that the woman was not really raped, but it is known for sure from prior cases, including criminal convictions, that there are plenty of rapists and murderers and all sorts of sick individuals in the police, that obviously should not be in the police. Many articles and discussions on police criminal activity carry a tone of surprise, but in my view nothing here is surprising considering that large numbers of questionable individuals who passed some subjective selection process are armed with guns and placed into what are essentially life-long appointments where lots of money and power is at stake. In my mind it would be surprising had there been no criminal activity within the police under the current system. It would be just as surprising if dictators stayed benevolent and never abused their authority. I'd say the solution to this problem is to have the public democratically elect police just like politicians, and to also have them be subjected to term limits just like politicians. So far this system has successfully prevented most people who should not be politicians from becoming politicians or maintaining political power, and I argue that in the same way it would prevent lots of people who should not be in the police from becoming or remaining police officers.

knome 4y ago
>the solution to this problem is to have the public democratically elect police just like politicians Doesn't seem to stop people from electing horrible sheriffs time and again. >So far this system has successfully prevented most people who should not be politicians from becoming politicians Is your comment satire?
- maratbn 4y ago
  Generally public officials in countries with fair elections are an order of magnitude better than public officials in countries without fair elections. For example, compare Bush II with Ahmadinejad. > Doesn't seem to stop people from electing horrible sheriffs time and again. There are some problems with the current election system in the US in that many potential voters don't register to vote to not get summoned for jury duty and similar issues, while lots of police vote in blocks guided by powerful police unions. These problems can be fixed, and overall the US election system is better than in countries like Russia. > Is your comment satire? Even US politicians who are massively disliked are way better than their counterparts in countries without fair elections. Furthermore, these massively-disliked politicians get voted out at the end of term if a better politician runs against them. And even if they don't get voted out, they have to leave eventually due to hard term limits. I'm not saying that democratic elections with term limits for police will keep absolutely all bad people out of police, but what I am saying is that there will be an order of magnitude less bad people in the police, and they will also be an order of magnitude less bad than under the current traditional employment scheme.

pyuser583 4y ago

It’s worth mentioning - when officials commit crimes, early press reports usually reflect what the criminal wants. It’s only after looking into it much deeper that it’s clear the initial story was a “setup.”

MisterTea 4y ago

The police departments attract the same kind of thuggish person who joins a gang. Someone hungry for power and respect. Many times there are people who have an axe to grind with society or were bullied so its time for payback I had a friend who became a cop and he changed in a bad way, the power went to his head. After two incidents, one involving him pulling out his off duty gun in a crowded bar I cut him off. I did not report him out of fear of retaliation. "Retaliation"? I talked to another friend, a former cop painted a hellish picture of the police: "Its a power struggle internally with everyone forming cliques and hierarchies trying to brown nose superiors to garner favors, overtime and promotions. Anyone who breaks rank will be targeted for harassment. If you report him there's a chance you'll be "randomly" pulled over one day and suddenly there's drugs and/or a gun in your car. They will ruin your life. Just keep your mouth shut." I am genuinely scared of cops.

efficax 4y ago

i would definitely not put it past the lapd to murder their own but it seems like the guy was just a patrol cop who took a statement, not internal affairs or sex crimes detective who would actually make an arrest in a case like this, so why kill him?

unity1001 4y ago

If this happened in any other country, the US media & establishment would be screaming at the top of its lungs about how brutal and evil that country was. But its happening in the US. So its 'okay'.

fritztastic 4y ago

>Gage claims that Tipping wound up with three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck. "His heart eventually stopped working because of his injuries" and "he was paralyzed….He had subdural hematomas at three places on the left side and three places on the right side. There is no way that grappling would have caused those injuries the way the LAPD portrayed it." Sure sounds less like a simulation and more like an actual event. It's really not easy to have someone die during an exercise with this many injuries caused by physical contact. Things like drownings, falls, and collisions can occur in a hugh risk training event- but this extent of injuries from falling on the ground seems real tough to spin as accidental or unintentional. At best you'd have to be extremely negligent, at worst this was a deliberate choice. You'd really think someone would notice the person they're training with is actually hurt and stop to check in on them, presumably there are measures in place to pause the exercise which people are aware of before starting- were these ignored? I guess we'd have to have a discussion on the intent of the exercise and the extent to which force is used with no regard for safety during training, which is a whole other issue.

philipov 4y ago
Eyyy, he just fell down the stairs. Don't worry about it!
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
Brybry 4y ago
Broken ribs are common from CPR. They even mention it during CPR training (and they told us to keep going anyway). I don't remember anything about liver lacerations but a quick google does say it happens: looks like the sternum can slice your liver during compressions[1] (warning: graphic). No idea on head injuries or a broken neck from "grappling" though. [1] https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S245224731630111X https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S245224731...
- FireBeyond 4y ago

akiselev 4y ago

This is a great reminder that the LAPD is largely a bunch of thugs with badges and guns. I don’t mean that in a teenage angst “every cop is a thug” way, but in a “raining federal convictions” way. [1][2] The current sheriff was a member of the “Grim Reapers” [3] and the battle against the thugs has been on going for fifty years [4] [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LASD_deputy_gangs https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_LASD_deputy_gangs [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Baca https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Baca [3] https://www.dailynews.com/2022/07/01/former-top-aide-to-villanueva-says-he-belonged-to-alleged-grim-reaper-deputy-gang/amp/ https://www.dailynews.com/2022/07/01/former-top-aide-to-vill... [4] https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/06/06/the-la-county-sheriffs-deputy-gang-crisis https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/06/06/the-la-county-...

CameronNemo 4y ago
LAPD and LASD are different orgs, but yeah they are probably both corrupt to the core. I know for a fact that there was a LASD gang called the Compton Executioners that excluded women and people of color.
- maratbn 4y ago
  damn, with a name like "Compton Executioners" I would be proud to be excluded
- akiselev 4y ago
  Great catch! As a long time resident of LA, few people make the distinction (I surely didn’t). The LAPD has its fair share of awfulness [1] but when the allegations are this bad it’s important not to paint every cop as guilty by association without evidence (and the evidence against the LASD is very strong) [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Los_Angeles_riots https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Los_Angeles_riots
  - weaksauce 4y ago
    > paint every cop as guilty by association without evidence it was the LAPD that opened fire on two old ladies in a truck that was the wrong type and color in the middle of the day when they were trying to murder their colleague that put out a manifesto about how corrupt they were. Sure he was killing cops that he thought were corrupt but that's against the fold and a sign that they hold themselves to be unaccountable. dorner was the guy who they eventually burned to death in a cabin in the mountains. the old saying about the rotten apple is not that there is a rotten apple that is alone in the doings it's that the rotten apple spoils the barrel. you see one bad cop and if you don't have a system that stops that you will have a barrel full of rotten cops.

concordDance 4y ago

Why is this on Hacker News? Seems very non tech related and the type of article that generates heat rather than light.

x86_64Ubuntu 4y ago
There are plenty of articles that make their way to HN that have nothing to do with anything technical.
- concordDance 4y ago
  At this rate hackernews will just be another reddit.
system2 4y ago
Maybe it will inspire a hacker from HN to hack LAPD and we finally get some insights of what they are doing internally.

honkycat 4y ago

The scary question is: "why do they keep them employed?" The answer is: As long as they are busting the right heads, they are doing their jobs perfectly. It is not about protecting citizens. It is about corralling and controlling them. You will stew in your decaying cities full of people experiencing mental crisis and drug addicts, and you will not complain as we do nothing.

WrtCdEvrydy 4y ago

Well, guess we don't need to investigate anymore?

PointA2B 4y ago

Just another extremely fortunate coincidence for people possessing lots of power, nothing to see here folks.

10g1k 4y ago

Nothing fishy going on at all.

badinsie 4y ago

3/5 cops take illegal steroids. 4/5 cops in LA are in a gang. i say just throw them all in prison.

lewdev 4y ago

Holy crap, "Gage claims that Tipping wound up with three broken ribs, a lacerated liver, head injuries, and a broken neck." Ohhh, they were bicycle training. Sarcasm aside, it's insane that after this incident, it's being labeled as a "training accident" when it so obviously wasn't.

JoeyBananas 4y ago

It's a good thing that a police department is actually doing training.

phendrenad2 4y ago

The double-standards for cops feels to me like the first step in the USA becoming a fascist state. One of the first things that happened in 1933 Germany was the breakdown between the police and the courts. Germany maintained a court system which, on paper, looked fair, but in practice the police had their own parallel justice system which just made up rules as it went along.