3 ms·

The article outlined at least one option that Apple has: stay on the 5nm node for a bit longer. It doesn't seem impossible at all that TSMC would cave/agree to

The article outlined at least one option that Apple has: stay on the 5nm node for a bit longer. It doesn't seem impossible at all that TSMC would cave/agree to only a 2-3% hike in 6 months. While a greater lead is I'm sure welcome, it's not like Apple isn't _extremely_ well positioned in every market they operate in, even on 5nm.

drexlspivey 4y ago
“N3 technology will offer up to 70% logic density gain, up to 15% speed improvement at the same power and up to 30% power reduction at the same speed as compared with N5 technology” Kinda crazy to not pay 6% for these gains but that’s just me!
- Octoth0rpe 4y ago
  Well, there are lots of weasel words in there, as well as leaving out the error rate.
- necovek 4y ago
  Only if your customers are willing to pay that much. While Apple chips are highly sought after in the West, that's still a minor part of the worldwide market altogether (and while I'd be happy to go back to M1 Max, I couldn't care less for their glossy displays, shallow keyboards and sharp edges — not to mention incomplete Linux support).
  - GekkePrutser 4y ago
    Same here. My Thinkpad doesn't look as cool but it's so much better to work on. Amazing keyboard, matte screen that even has touch, no sharp edges. And it has PORTS! Apple solved these issues somewhat with the new MBP but the keyboard and screen still sucks for me. Their new SoCs are great though.
  - solarkraft 4y ago
    ... so? The customers they do have pay ridiculously high prices. Even a 6% rise of the full unit price would barely register, especially considering the increase in performance, which would probably easily justify 20%.
    - necovek 4y ago
      Or they could simply wait it out, use the new process on the next generation, and justify upgrades by the performance jump. IOW, they can keep the cycle going for longer.
  - mcphage 4y ago
    > Only if your customers are willing to pay that much. Yeah, I think they probably are. > While Apple chips are highly sought after in the West, that's still a minor part of the worldwide market altogether It is, but it's also the part of the worldwide market that actually makes high profits.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- oefrha 4y ago
  Kinda crazy to not pay up to 6% for these up to gains.
- ac29 4y ago
  I dont think TSMC was saying N3 costs 6% more than N5, they were saying N3 costs 6% more than N3 previously did. Presumably it was significantly more expensive than N5 even before the price hike.
raverbashing 4y ago
Given that Apple is very competitive even in 5nm I'd say that, yes, yes, they can stay at that process for as long as they want (which is probably +2yrs let's say)

drexlspivey 4y ago

“N3 technology will offer up to 70% logic density gain, up to 15% speed improvement at the same power and up to 30% power reduction at the same speed as compared with N5 technology” Kinda crazy to not pay 6% for these gains but that’s just me!

Octoth0rpe 4y ago
Well, there are lots of weasel words in there, as well as leaving out the error rate.
necovek 4y ago
Only if your customers are willing to pay that much. While Apple chips are highly sought after in the West, that's still a minor part of the worldwide market altogether (and while I'd be happy to go back to M1 Max, I couldn't care less for their glossy displays, shallow keyboards and sharp edges — not to mention incomplete Linux support).
- GekkePrutser 4y ago
  Same here. My Thinkpad doesn't look as cool but it's so much better to work on. Amazing keyboard, matte screen that even has touch, no sharp edges. And it has PORTS! Apple solved these issues somewhat with the new MBP but the keyboard and screen still sucks for me. Their new SoCs are great though.
- solarkraft 4y ago
  ... so? The customers they do have pay ridiculously high prices. Even a 6% rise of the full unit price would barely register, especially considering the increase in performance, which would probably easily justify 20%.
  - necovek 4y ago
    Or they could simply wait it out, use the new process on the next generation, and justify upgrades by the performance jump. IOW, they can keep the cycle going for longer.
- mcphage 4y ago
  > Only if your customers are willing to pay that much. Yeah, I think they probably are. > While Apple chips are highly sought after in the West, that's still a minor part of the worldwide market altogether It is, but it's also the part of the worldwide market that actually makes high profits.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
oefrha 4y ago
Kinda crazy to not pay up to 6% for these up to gains.
ac29 4y ago
I dont think TSMC was saying N3 costs 6% more than N5, they were saying N3 costs 6% more than N3 previously did. Presumably it was significantly more expensive than N5 even before the price hike.

raverbashing 4y ago

Given that Apple is very competitive even in 5nm I'd say that, yes, yes, they can stay at that process for as long as they want (which is probably +2yrs let's say)