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Omega-3 fatty acids and exercise: a review of their combined effects (2011) [pdf]
- amelius 4y agoConclusion: > At this time, research is largely inconclusive as to the potential synergistic benefits when n-3 [i.e., Omega-3 fatty acids] is supplemented in conjunction with exercise.
- MPSimmons 4y agoI am glad that negative results are still published and receive some attention.
- deleted 4y ago[deleted]
- DerekBickerton 4y agoI take fish oils for brain health, since our brain is made of fat and the more (good) fats we have in our diet, the better it is for the brain. I also use MCT oil and combine it with eggs and use it as dressing on salad. If I was going to use supplements for exercise, I would use protein, glucosamine (for joint health) and maybe 200mg of caffeine as a pre-workout stimulant to help me focus. Milk, especially 'protein milk' which they sell in my local supermarket can alleviate sore muscles.
- copperx 4y ago> I take fish oils for brain health, since our brain is made of fat and the more (good) fats we have in our diet, the better it is for the brain. Is that an assumption, or is it based on fact?
- deepnet 4y ago“There is no difference between a stick of butter and your brain.”, Hibbeln - https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg17523575-800-the-happy-fat/ https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg17523575-800-the-happ... "A study by JR Hibbeln showed that around the world, countries that consume the least amount of fatty fish show the highest levels of major depression (MDD) in their population. And countries where fatty fish is the main diet show the lowest incidence of MDD." - https://www.loricalabresemd.com/blog/effect-of-fatty-acids/ https://www.loricalabresemd.com/blog/effect-of-fatty-acids/
- bostonpete 4y agoWould be nice if they linked the study or at least an article about it.
- jackmott 4y ago
- vixen99 4y agoWith respect, 'More we have, the better it is' is not a sensible idea to follow with diet. Hold on I'm being too polite. It's dead wrong. Better to Look for optimum intake according to best advice you can glean. As the paper itself reminds us, 'too much omega-3 fat is immunosuppressive and prolongs bleeding time.'
- amelius 4y agoI once took fish oil supplements. Then somebody told me how they make them. They put fish remnants in a pot with water, boil it, then scrape the fat from the top of the pot. Since there are basically no checks for how supplements are made it's a much better idea to eat high quality unprocessed foods.
- colordrops 4y agoYou can take algal oil, same thing and much less repulsive.
- adrian_b 4y agoAlso 8 times more expensive.
- colordrops 4y agoOk but it's not too expensive in terms of absolutes as well as the value of good health. And if you are vegan it's the only option.
- sillystuff 4y agoYou can add seaweed aka sea vegetables to your diet. e.g., https://draxe.com/nutrition/kelp/ https://draxe.com/nutrition/kelp/ If you live on the coast, there are almost certainly culinary varieties of sea weed in your area. You may need a fishing license-- in California, we can take up to 10 lbs (~4.5 kg) without a license. Avoid areas anywhere near the outfall of a stream, storm drain, etc.
- SmellyPotato22 4y agoSeems like an effective way to extract the fat and get use out of whole fish. Similar to any soup. I do wish FDA regulated some supplements but I think reputable brands are doing the good for the most part.
- sgtnoodle 4y agoHow else would you extract oil from a fish?
- dehrmann 4y ago> glucosamine (for joint health) Studies on it are mixed. Interestingly, you omitted creatine. Studies on it are not mixed; it increases power output.
- recyclelater 4y agoNit pick, it just provides extra creatine in muscles, which is required for atp. You basically get a couple extra reps per set if you workout, not necessarily more power. Helps you gain muscle by giving you more energy to stress your muscles, so they adapt more.
- spamizbad 4y agoVitamins and supplements stay losing. What a racket.
- collaborative 4y agoVitamins and minerals have cured my hopeless eczema. No doctor could do that for nearly a decade
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago> have cured my hopeless eczema I’m glad you found something that worked. But you’re describing, by definition, a vitamin deficiency. (That can cause dermatitis.)
- mattgreenrocks 4y agoWhat deficiencies can cause eczema? Pretty sure mine is a side effect of my allergies but interested in covering my bases.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago> What deficiencies can cause eczema? Dermatitis/eczema (the terms are used frustratingly interchangeably) describes a set of symptoms. It covers poison ivy rashes (contact) to cradle cap (biotin deficiency). Atopic dermatitis [1], is not tied to any nutrition deficit. (My sister had atopic dermatitis growing up.) So if you displayed dermatitis symptoms and found vitamins cured it, it may have been non-atopic. Your method worked. But it hasn't been shown to help someone with the atopic kind. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atopic_dermatitis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atopic_dermatitis
- mattgreenrocks 4y agoThanks!
- collaborative 4y ago
- vocram 4y agoI wish I could perceive some kind of even minuscule cause-effect for any of the supplements I take, barring caffeine
- DantesKite 4y agoThat reminds me of how people who wear WHOOP watches stop drinking alcohol as much because they noticed the impact it had on their cardio. Would be interesting if you could reliably measure certain health metrics beyond heart rate over time. I bet that would get people to take or avoid certain things.
- adamdusty 4y agoDo you know anybody with one? I've never heard of WHOOP before. It looks cool, but $30/month for what seems like a fitbit is a bit much for me. I guess the difference is the WHOOP device is included in the subscription. Id be interested to hear someone's experience with it vs a 'normal' fitness tracker.
- toddm 4y agoI've been a fitness and gadget junkie for a long time. I was gifted a WHOOP 6-month subscription in December 2020, and I used it from then until the end of that 6-month term. This was the 3.0 platform. It was fine for the price - $0 - and provided me with HRV and a "sleep score", which is of interest to me and other athletes as one indicator of "fitness." I did not - and will not - pay $360/year for WHOOP. I could actually buy a pretty nice state-of-the-art new real fitness tracker for less than that, and the features that were somewhat novel to WHOOP are now standard on other hardware platforms (Garmin, Polar, others). Note that with many Fitbits and clones, you get GPS built-in so you can leave your phone at home and do your thing. It differed from other fitness trackers mostly by what it didn't have, and DC Rainmaker has exhaustive reviews up to and including the current 4.0 release. In short, it's not a fitness tracker like a Fitbit Charge 4 or a Garmin Venu 2 Plus - I own both - because it doesn't track steps, has no GPS (you need to lug around your phone for that), and relies entirely on HR for what it tells you - all for a pretty heavy price tag. It also doesn't pair with 3rd party HR hardware (such as the usually more accurate EKG-based ones like a Garmin or TICKR chest strap) and relies on wrist optical sensors. There are a number of metrics WHOOP reports, but they are simply rehashed versions of metrics developed by Andy Coggan and others some time ago. TL;DR: WHOOP is overpriced and not feature-rich as a fitness/activity tracker. If you get one for free, try it out. You can easily get the same functionality and more for half the price of a yearly subscription.
- upsidesinclude 4y agoO-3s have been proven to reduce stress and anger! Believe that? From a study on it in Norway. So I guess regardless of what this- now 11 year old study- had to say on the issue, it is likely quite beneficial if you lack adequate amounts in your normal diet. You can easily get adequate amounts by eating the right foods, namely fish and nuts. But you don't have to eat those things if you don't like them and can take krill oil pills or something. Supplements aren't created equal. It is important to verify the ones you take are from legitimate brands with 3rd party testing. It's a huge industry and that means fraud. It's also life today in the world where olive oil, maple syrup and honey are often fake. And guess what!? That fake olive oil made with rapeseed/"vegetable" oil isn't great for you either. There aren't many people making sure that stuff is real either.
- luckman212 4y agoThis is so depressing. Is there any way to test your oils at home for authenticity?
- upsidesinclude 4y agoThere are a few groups that do testing and report findings for various foodstuffs[0]. It is definitely worth the time to keep up to date 0. https://nclnet.org/evoo_testing/ https://nclnet.org/evoo_testing/
- vocram 4y agoextra virgin olive oil has a very distinctive taste and smell… guess of what?
- olddustytrail 4y ago
- hombre_fatal 4y agoOlive oil diluted with cheaper oils may still taste/smell like olive oil.
- bicijay 4y agoI know people are like parrots and like to repeat the same "multivitamins are useless", but after starting it, i noticed some improvements on my digestive system and fatigue after covid. Sometimes anecdotals are useful, whatever works for you.
- raverbashing 4y agoWhoever says that usually follow a tautological way of thinking, that is "people in perfect health don't need it" but of course having a vitamin deficiency is not having "perfect health"
- joshuajill 4y agoExactly, and there is far too little vitamin deficiency testing.
- swatcoder 4y agoFor most people, “X is useless” is a short way of saying: Based on the headlines and search results I’ve skimmed, X has not been proven useful in whatever handful of demographic and contextual cross-sections have been studied. In accordance with other intuitions of my own, I extrapolate this to mean that X is useless in all demographics and contexts, that the question of value is conclusively answered in the negative, and — for some reason — it’s now important to me that you draw the same conclusion, even if you have reason to keep an open mind or conclude otherwise. The shorthand phrasing omits all the pesky subjective, unscientific stuff as well as the weird emotional investment in other people’s thinking, so it might be helpful to just keep the long form version in mind when you hear the parrots.
- bicijay 4y agoSame thing happens with GABA, theoretically it should not work in a supplement form because it does not cross the BBB. And it always comes with the same "GABA is useless" advice. Except im literally dreaming again after starting taking it. Could it be a placebo? Sure. But if its working, why should i believe its useless? I know HN is probably not the right place to say it, but taking every decision in your life (even minimals one like starting take a vitamin) based on underfunded studies might lead you to miss some some improvements in your life.
- cbreynoldson 4y agoImportant to point out, for those that try supplements and "don't notice anything different," sources (and types) matter. In this case, fish oil sources matter. Oxidation, polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs) matter. You can filter for quality sources that meet the International Fish Oil Standards here: https://certifications.nutrasource.ca/certified-products?type=certification&value=IFOS https://certifications.nutrasource.ca/certified-products?typ...
- jackmott42 4y agoI am 43 years old and having been into various kinds of fitness (weight lifting, endurance cycling, etc) I've seen hundreds of supplement fads come and go, and come back. The typical progression is: * Everyone is excited about X which improves Y * Studies looking into X find no improvement in Y and/or some people don't notice X improve Y * People invested in X argue that they are not timing/dosing X properly, or people do not have the right form of X It usually descends into absurdities where you are supposed to find this rare unicorn brand that has the proper quality (for now, who knows next year!) then dose it at some exact time before bed time, but avoiding calcium or citric acid or something because that would nullify it etc etc. Supposing the supplement even ever worked, it simply is not practically useful with such constraints. I'm not going to get a PHD in fish oil quality in order to achieve some single digit risk reduction of heart disease.
- adamdusty 4y agoAt least it's getting studied. Most fitness supplements are total garbage advertised by equally garbage people trying to make money risking other people's health. The paper pretty much says fish oil + exercise does not increase performance ("inconclusive") and some evidence for improved fat loss. Many of the studies reviewed by the paper show evidence that heart rate is lower during "submaximal" exertion. GP links to a list of "certified" fish oil sources, so if you wanted to at minimum test for yourself, you could just pick one from the list before you pursue your fish oil PhD.
- tedunangst 4y agoIt has to be only turmeric grown above 5000 ft elevation.
- nonameiguess 4y agoThis is a lit review. The studies cited were: - Participants assigned to fish oil + exercise, fish oil, corn oil, and control. After 12 weeks, only fish oil + exercise resulted in significant fat loss, but no exercise only control group. - Participants assigned to fish oil + exercise, fish oil only, exercise only, and control. After 10 weeks, no body composition differences noted between any groups, but no group was very fat to begin with. - Fat participants assigned to either fish oil + exercise, sunflower oil + exercise, fish oil alone, or sunflower oil alone. Fish oil + exercise significantly outperformed other protocols after 12 weeks. - Fat participants assigned to either fish oil + exercise or placebo + exercise. After 24 weeks, both groups lost about 5% of their fat without any significant difference between groups. - I have no idea what "RBC deformability" is, but two studies assessed it by having participants perform cycling time trials in a hypobaric chamber. One study gave fish oil for 6 weeks and found a significant difference. One gave fish oil for 3 weeks and found no difference. - Well-trained cyclists assigned to either take fish oil or olive oil for 8 weeks. Fish oil group saw significantly lower heart rates during submaximal exercise, but no difference in peak oxygen consumption. - A 60-day study of national football players assigned to either fish oil or control. The fish oil group saw better lipid profiles at the end. - A study of elite Australian rules football players assigned to either fish oil or sunflower oil while training normally for 5 weeks. They performed treadmill speed trials at the end. The fish oil group had lower heart rates while running, but no performance difference between groups. Take of this what you will. The reasons usually given to take fish oil are for long-run heart health. This seems to indicate you probably won't perform better or lose more fat compared to someone who exercises the same way but doesn't take fish oil, but you may see improvements in blood lipid profile, lower heart rates, and less oxygen consumption during submaximal exertion. All of those sound like good things to me.
- annexrichmond 4y agoThanks for summarizing this, pretty interesting. Admittedly I didn't read the study, but how were the groups assigned the oils in these studies? Raw form, or were they tasked to eat specific foods with these oils added?
- ralusek 4y agoBesides exercise I'm here yet again to evangelize sunlight. Getting 15-30 minutes of direct sunlight in my garden per day has changed my life. Impossible to overstate how much better I feel.
- staticassertion 4y agoThat's interesting because sunlight is also something I imagine a lot of doctors (certainly a dermatologist) will recommend avoiding. Do you wear sunscreen?
- justinator 4y agoAvoid sunlight in excess is different than avoiding sunlight completely. Getting exposed to early morning light for 15-30 minutes has shown to be very beneficial.
- mark_l_watson 4y agoI try to maximize Omega-3 intake, primarily by making and eating lots of Chia Seed puddings and preferring quality sourced sardines for protein. Sorry to be subjective, but all I have is my opinion: I feel better when I maximize Omega-3 and do some other easy diet things like avoiding packaged foods and eating plenty of berries and fresh vegetables. I used to be fussier about my diet but now I just do these simple things.
- evo_9 4y agoMore recent study on Omega-3 and its impressive heart-health benefits: https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/article/S0025-6196(20)30985-X/fulltext https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/article/S0025-6196(20)...