12 ms·

Binance served crypto traders in Iran despite U.S. sanctions

147 points by mrkramer 4y ago

olalonde 4y ago
As well as thousands of businesses worldwide? I don't believe that the Cayman Islands, where Binance is registered, has sanctions against Iran.
- uniqueuid 4y ago
  It seems you either ignore or lack understanding of how penal law works.
  - olalonde 4y ago
    Please elaborate?
    - uniqueuid 4y ago
      Well, "Ostensibly bilateral US foreign policy actions, such as sanctions, can influence third-party compliance with US policy preferences. US sanctions simultaneously signal US preferences and demonstrate leverage, which can motivate third parties to avoid or change proscribed behavior proactively. " [1] In other words, (US) sanctions have a lot of ways to affect even corporations from third-party countries. [1] https://asu.pure.elsevier.com/en/publications/sanctions-and-third-party-compliance-with-us-foreign-policy-prefe https://asu.pure.elsevier.com/en/publications/sanctions-and-... [edit] Perhaps a more readable text is https://www.williamsmullen.com/news/us-sanctions-laws-dangers-ahead-foreign-companies https://www.williamsmullen.com/news/us-sanctions-laws-danger...
- ceejayoz 4y ago
  “But officer, what about all the times I didn’t speed?” is not a winning strategy.
  - olalonde 4y ago
    A better analogy would be: "Canadian man smoked marijuana despite US marijuana prohibitions."
    - spywaregorilla 4y ago
      Perhaps an analogy is not sufficient to capture the nuances of US sanction laws.
      - bannedbybros 4y ago
    - ceejayoz 4y ago
      > That November, Binance informed traders in Iran it would no longer serve them, telling them to liquidate their accounts. Sure seems like they thought they were subject to them.
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - olalonde 4y ago
        Not necessarily. The owner of Binance is a Canadian citizen, so it seems more likely to me that he was complying with Canadian sanctions on Iran.
- PeterisP 4y ago
  They're free to ignore US sanction laws as long as they don't want to receive money from US customers and US dollars from anyone.
  - olalonde 4y ago
    That's exactly what they are doing. They created Binance US as a separate entity due to this issue (among others).
    - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
      > exactly what they are doing Pretty sure the non-US Binance entity would like to be able to maintain dollar bank accounts, or let their executives and employees travel to America and allied territory. (Which is why they banned these users.)
      - olalonde 4y ago
        I don't believe that's how it works. There are plenty of businesses that do business with both Iran and USA, without apparent issue. Xiaomi (https://www.xiaomiiran.ir/ https://www.xiaomiiran.ir/), Samsung (https://www.samsung.com/iran/ https://www.samsung.com/iran/) or LG (https://www.lg.com/ir https://www.lg.com/ir) for example.
        JumpCrisscross 4y ago
        > don't believe that's how it works It is. > Xiaomi for example Xiaomi was blacklisted [1]. Their CFO was arrested in Canada for fucking this up [EDIT: Nope!]. Xiaomi turned off their devices in Iran last year [2] in a bid to lift the restrictions. > Samsung There was a brief respite in sanctions during the nuclear deal. The pages you’re citing are from that era. Samsung withdrew from Iran [3]. Iran, for good measure, responded by banning them [4]. [1] https://www.cfo.com/accounting-tax/2021/01/xiaomi-and-cnoonc-added-to-list-of-blacklisted-chinese-firms/ https://www.cfo.com/accounting-tax/2021/01/xiaomi-and-cnoonc... [2] https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202109/1234058.shtml https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202109/1234058.shtml [3] https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Iran-tensions/Iran-sanctions-threaten-Samsung-and-LG-s-grip-on-local-market https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Iran-tensions/Iran-sanctio... [4] https://asiatimes.com/2021/11/iran-bans-goods-from-south-koreas-samsung-and-lg/ https://asiatimes.com/2021/11/iran-bans-goods-from-south-kor...
- apozem 4y ago
  The answer to your question is contained within the linked article. > Lawyers say this structure means Binance is protected from direct U.S. sanctions that ban U.S. firms from doing business in Iran. This is because the traders in Iran used Binance's main exchange, which is not a U.S. company. But Binance does run a risk of so-called secondary sanctions, which aim to prevent foreign firms from doing business with sanctioned entities or helping Iranians evade the U.S. trade embargo. As well as causing reputational damage, secondary sanctions can also choke off a company's access to the U.S. financial system. I know it's the internet and everyone just reads the headline but you could at least Ctrl- or Cmd-F before commenting.
- seanhunter 4y ago
  The Cayman Islands does indeed have sanctions against Iran. https://www.cima.ky/upimages/commonfiles/SanctionsOrderslastupdatedFebruary2019_1549294466.pdf https://www.cima.ky/upimages/commonfiles/SanctionsOrderslast... is the current official list.
2Gkashmiri 4y ago
boo fucking hoo. why is that a big deal? why isn't china on the banned list if there is oh so trade war with them? is binance an american company? if not then why should it care about american sanctions? wasn't a few days ago that coinpayments.net exited USA from payments because of ongoing political events or some other reason? so they literally put USA in the same list of sanctioned countries that USA made in the first place. lol
- mrkramer 4y ago
  Former Ethereum developer Virgil Griffith was sentenced to 5+ years in jail in US for evading sanctions on North Korea[1][2]. US is not joking. [1] https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/12/former-ethereum-developer-virgil-griffith-sentenced-to-5-years-in-prison-for-north-korea-trip/ https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/12/former-ethereum... [2] https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizen-who-conspired-assist-north-korea-evading-sanctions-sentenced-over-five-years-and https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizen-who-conspired-assi...
  - olalonde 4y ago
    He is a US citizen, big difference.
    - mrkramer 4y ago
      Binance.US has license in US for crypto trading and at the same time their parent company binance.com is evading US sanctions. License can be revoked by SEC and DOJ can order FBI to seize Binance.US
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - arcticbull 4y ago
        Technically binance.com is not the parent company of binance.us - they set this all up under the framework of the so-called 'Tai Chi' document. [1] CZ is on the board of the '.us' and '.us' licenses the brand and technology from '.com' With that in mind, the law takes a dim view of such shenanigans. I suspect that '.com's tacit acceptance of VPNs in serving US customers is probably more than enough for a judge to pierce the corporate veil. [1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaeldelcastillo/2020/10/29/leaked-tai-chi-document-reveals-binances-elaborate-scheme-to-evade-bitcoin-regulators/?sh=6bc5382d2a92 https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaeldelcastillo/2020/10/29/l...
3np 4y ago
In other news: Xaomi stills sells to Russia despite EU sanctions. (and so on and so forth)
- HyprMusic 4y ago
  There are no sanctions on selling goods to general consumers, most companies have just chosen not to do so.
  - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
    > are no sanctions on selling goods to general consumers While technically true, the sanctions on its banks and central bank in practice mean it’s virtually impossible to be paid by an Iranian for your goods. (No, crypto doesn’t work, unless that consumer doesn’t interact with its banking system and you can convince the U.S. you’ve verified this.)
  - throwaway290 4y ago
    But once your 'general consumer' is e.g. Gazprom, aren't you liable? And it's virtually impossible to guarantee otherwise.
istanbul7 4y ago
rvz 4y ago
So did GitHub, and Signal for their users? But we are not screaming at them are we?
- arcticbull 4y ago
  So if three cars are speeding, right, and an officer pulls over the first but lets the other two go - you know what's not a good defense? "But officer, they were speeding too!! Therefore speeding must be ok, right? I'll be going now." [edit] to rephrase: US cops close like 50% of murder cases. Is your gut reaction anger that since they can't catch 100% of them, they may as well not bother catching any at all? It's not really fair to the ones who get caught if some of their peers are getting away with it yeah?
  - selfhoster11 4y ago
    The third vehicle that was pulled over was not even a car - it was a tank. Source code hubs or instant messaging are nowhere near as worthy of restricting as avenues of money transfer are.
- Cthulhu_ 4y ago
  Are "we" screaming at Binance? Github got a license to operate in Iran: https://github.blog/2021-01-05-advancing-developer-freedom-github-is-fully-available-in-iran/ https://github.blog/2021-01-05-advancing-developer-freedom-g.... I don't know about Signal though, but they have been banned by Iran anyway because it allowed open communications to the outside.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- selfhoster11 4y ago
  Let's be real, how much damage can sanction-related misuse of (free) version control and (free) instant messaging do? Being able to transfer money is a much more powerful enabler for sanctioned activity.
- maxst 4y ago
Shadonototra 4y ago
Another reason to promote Binance over Coinbase Binance trully is independent Coinbase will freeze your assets the day the US doesn't like your face anymore It already happened, and Coinbase is plagued with insider trading https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31012462 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31012462
- closewith 4y ago
  The long term prospects for companies which bust US sanctions are unlikely to be good.
- toolz 4y ago
  No, binance has a separate platform (that is quite different than their original platform in terms of services/products offered) for US users that is very much not independent from US influence. e.g. binance trades XMR (monero) while binance-US does not allow that coin.
- ceejayoz 4y ago
  You're right; Binance has the handy "text the CEO's mother" approach if your account gets frozen. Way better. > Out of desperation he sought information online and wound up texting the mother of Binance.US CEO Catherine Coley so he could get his funds unstuck. Now, Binance is closing his account. https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/05/12/so-many-locked-out-binance-users-say-their-accounts-have-been-frozen-for-months/ https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/05/12/so-many-locked-out-...
- 323 4y ago
  > Crypto exchange Binance blocks Russian users targeted by sanctions > "We're blocking accounts of those on the sanctions list (if they have Binance accounts) and ensuring that all sanctions are met in full," https://www.reuters.com/technology/crypto-exchange-binance-says-it-wont-unilaterally-freeze-accounts-russia-2022-02-28/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/crypto-exchange-binance-s...
neotek 4y ago
Why does it seem like every single crypto company inevitably engages in shady business practices and ends up collapsing in a scandal? How hard can it be to just make a shitload of money taking your skim from trades or lending at appropriate rates for an appropriate return?
- abakker 4y ago
  no harder, but slower! stake in a business is obviously slower yet. The ultimate scam is to just manufacture equity and do a pump and dump. any resemblance to an actual business is unintentional.
- Traubenfuchs 4y ago
  The risk of ignoring sanctions probably comes with a big premium. Indeed it's all fine until they get caught! The perfect fit for short term inflation of evaluation.
- toolz 4y ago
  Because normal people will click on crypto scams. They're scared of what they don't understand - are you aware of how many billions of dollars of fines every single major bank pays routinely? Probably not, because that's boring and doesn't make headlines you see as often. 8 of the top 10 most penalized companies in the world are banks that have nothing to do with crypto.
  - rajamaka 4y ago
    So you're saying 2 of the ten most penalized companies in the world are crypto companies? That's actually remarkable considering their relatively inconsequential market
    - mhmmmmmm 4y ago
      the remaining 2 companies could be anything, just not banks.
    - toolz 4y ago
hunglee2 4y ago
honouring the decentralised ethos of crypto, free from political control!
- toolz 4y ago
  exactly, it's absurd that literal fruits and nuts sellers (one of Irans top 5 exports) are being penalized for political reasons the same as anything related to war efforts (like oil exports). Sanctions are often more palatable than war to people who can more easily overlook the death and suffering caused by poverty relative to the death and suffering caused by weapons. If you're in the US, just look at how often you see headlines about murders by gun are explicitly reported on (as if any subcategory of murder was easier to solve with policy than the many many many things in poverty that kill people daily).
LatteLazy 4y ago
Good. Sanctions against Iran are counterproductive and should have been dropped years ago.
- xtracto 4y ago
  And Cuba, and Russia and Venezuela. Sanctions punish the wrong set of people. But for some reason the US loves them.
  - cbHXBY1D 4y ago
    There was a good book that got released earlier this year on the development of sanctions as an act of war. Highly recommend: https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300259360/the-economic-weapon/ https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300259360/the-economic-w...
bouncycastle 4y ago
Ironically, it's the Iranian people, not the Iranian government, who need crypto the most.
- fatjokes 4y ago
  Isn't being able to evade sanctions one of the few tangible benefits of crypto?
  - bouncycastle 4y ago
    You cannot evade sanctions because you still need to disclose your delivery address.
- yoavm 4y ago
  Well, if the only thing that could take down the Iranian government is its own people, then perhaps them having an alternative currency to trade with the world and ease their economical situation is actually the best possible thing for the survival of their government.
  - bouncycastle 4y ago
    No, it's the opposite. Their government's survival depends on the complete control of their fiat currency. Their national currency is a tool to maintain control.
vgatherps 4y ago
Headline: "Binance served crypto traders in Iran despite US sanctions" Content: "Binance banned Iranian users after sanctions, 7 got missed/found a workaround, they were banned later anyways"
- jchiu1106 4y ago
  Reuters is deliberately ruining their own credibility.
  - sfusato 4y ago
    Do they still have one though?
- duxup 4y ago
  I don’t think those are all that different headlines. Folks who expect the headline to be extra detailed will always be dissatisfied IMO. It’s on the individual to read the story. Folks who don’t will misunderstand regardless. But to be clear I’ve got no problem with your clarification here either.
  - vgatherps 4y ago
    Despite being technically correct, "Binance continued serving Iranians despite sanctions" doesn't imply "Binance stopped serving Iranians and later caught more that fell through the cracks". I would definitely have gotten marked down in school if I submitted an article where the headline was such inaccurate summary of the story. It's not even like there's nothing to be seen! "Binance may have turned a blind eye to and encouraged VPN usage" would have been a much better summary!
    - bombcar 4y ago
      I feel headlines in papers were a bit more "legitimate" but now in the era of click-bait they're as sensational as they can be whilst not being technically incorrect. I try to guess what the headline means before reading the article; if I guessed wrong I downgrade that source.
Fargoan 4y ago
They're not a US based company so why should I care? The sanctions are bullshit anyway.
amanj41 4y ago
I don't see the problem here. For regulatory reasons, Binance is a separate entity from Binance US and American users are not able to use it. Binance would not be violating sanctions as it does not operate in the US
upupandup 4y ago
It just puzzles me how bold and reckless CZ is. Who and what is behind him that he would violate US sanctions to openly? Same with Do Kwon. What is responsible for this blatant disregard for the law?
- d23 4y ago
  It seems to be a broader trend, even in the US. High level politicians and political operatives seem to be openly committing crimes and defying the law with no fear of repercussions.
humbleMouse 4y ago
M_jahanpour 4y ago
It is true that I am an Iranian and I use Binance services in Iran
dxbrty_545 4y ago
[dead]
Iranian 4y ago

147 points by mrkramer 4y ago

As well as thousands of businesses worldwide? I don't believe that the Cayman Islands, where Binance is registered, has sanctions against Iran.

uniqueuid 4y ago
It seems you either ignore or lack understanding of how penal law works.
- olalonde 4y ago
  Please elaborate?
  - uniqueuid 4y ago
    Well, "Ostensibly bilateral US foreign policy actions, such as sanctions, can influence third-party compliance with US policy preferences. US sanctions simultaneously signal US preferences and demonstrate leverage, which can motivate third parties to avoid or change proscribed behavior proactively. " [1] In other words, (US) sanctions have a lot of ways to affect even corporations from third-party countries. [1] https://asu.pure.elsevier.com/en/publications/sanctions-and-third-party-compliance-with-us-foreign-policy-prefe https://asu.pure.elsevier.com/en/publications/sanctions-and-... [edit] Perhaps a more readable text is https://www.williamsmullen.com/news/us-sanctions-laws-dangers-ahead-foreign-companies https://www.williamsmullen.com/news/us-sanctions-laws-danger...
ceejayoz 4y ago
“But officer, what about all the times I didn’t speed?” is not a winning strategy.
- olalonde 4y ago
  A better analogy would be: "Canadian man smoked marijuana despite US marijuana prohibitions."
  - spywaregorilla 4y ago
    Perhaps an analogy is not sufficient to capture the nuances of US sanction laws.
    - bannedbybros 4y ago
  - ceejayoz 4y ago
    > That November, Binance informed traders in Iran it would no longer serve them, telling them to liquidate their accounts. Sure seems like they thought they were subject to them.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - olalonde 4y ago
      Not necessarily. The owner of Binance is a Canadian citizen, so it seems more likely to me that he was complying with Canadian sanctions on Iran.
PeterisP 4y ago
They're free to ignore US sanction laws as long as they don't want to receive money from US customers and US dollars from anyone.
- olalonde 4y ago
  That's exactly what they are doing. They created Binance US as a separate entity due to this issue (among others).
  - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
    > exactly what they are doing Pretty sure the non-US Binance entity would like to be able to maintain dollar bank accounts, or let their executives and employees travel to America and allied territory. (Which is why they banned these users.)
    - olalonde 4y ago
      I don't believe that's how it works. There are plenty of businesses that do business with both Iran and USA, without apparent issue. Xiaomi (https://www.xiaomiiran.ir/ https://www.xiaomiiran.ir/), Samsung (https://www.samsung.com/iran/ https://www.samsung.com/iran/) or LG (https://www.lg.com/ir https://www.lg.com/ir) for example.
      - JumpCrisscross 4y ago
        > don't believe that's how it works It is. > Xiaomi for example Xiaomi was blacklisted [1]. Their CFO was arrested in Canada for fucking this up [EDIT: Nope!]. Xiaomi turned off their devices in Iran last year [2] in a bid to lift the restrictions. > Samsung There was a brief respite in sanctions during the nuclear deal. The pages you’re citing are from that era. Samsung withdrew from Iran [3]. Iran, for good measure, responded by banning them [4]. [1] https://www.cfo.com/accounting-tax/2021/01/xiaomi-and-cnoonc-added-to-list-of-blacklisted-chinese-firms/ https://www.cfo.com/accounting-tax/2021/01/xiaomi-and-cnoonc... [2] https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202109/1234058.shtml https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202109/1234058.shtml [3] https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Iran-tensions/Iran-sanctions-threaten-Samsung-and-LG-s-grip-on-local-market https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Iran-tensions/Iran-sanctio... [4] https://asiatimes.com/2021/11/iran-bans-goods-from-south-koreas-samsung-and-lg/ https://asiatimes.com/2021/11/iran-bans-goods-from-south-kor...
apozem 4y ago
The answer to your question is contained within the linked article. > Lawyers say this structure means Binance is protected from direct U.S. sanctions that ban U.S. firms from doing business in Iran. This is because the traders in Iran used Binance's main exchange, which is not a U.S. company. But Binance does run a risk of so-called secondary sanctions, which aim to prevent foreign firms from doing business with sanctioned entities or helping Iranians evade the U.S. trade embargo. As well as causing reputational damage, secondary sanctions can also choke off a company's access to the U.S. financial system. I know it's the internet and everyone just reads the headline but you could at least Ctrl- or Cmd-F before commenting.
seanhunter 4y ago
The Cayman Islands does indeed have sanctions against Iran. https://www.cima.ky/upimages/commonfiles/SanctionsOrderslastupdatedFebruary2019_1549294466.pdf https://www.cima.ky/upimages/commonfiles/SanctionsOrderslast... is the current official list.

2Gkashmiri 4y ago

boo fucking hoo. why is that a big deal? why isn't china on the banned list if there is oh so trade war with them? is binance an american company? if not then why should it care about american sanctions? wasn't a few days ago that coinpayments.net exited USA from payments because of ongoing political events or some other reason? so they literally put USA in the same list of sanctioned countries that USA made in the first place. lol

mrkramer 4y ago
Former Ethereum developer Virgil Griffith was sentenced to 5+ years in jail in US for evading sanctions on North Korea[1][2]. US is not joking. [1] https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/12/former-ethereum-developer-virgil-griffith-sentenced-to-5-years-in-prison-for-north-korea-trip/ https://www.coindesk.com/business/2022/04/12/former-ethereum... [2] https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizen-who-conspired-assist-north-korea-evading-sanctions-sentenced-over-five-years-and https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/us-citizen-who-conspired-assi...
- olalonde 4y ago
  He is a US citizen, big difference.
  - mrkramer 4y ago
    Binance.US has license in US for crypto trading and at the same time their parent company binance.com is evading US sanctions. License can be revoked by SEC and DOJ can order FBI to seize Binance.US
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - arcticbull 4y ago
      Technically binance.com is not the parent company of binance.us - they set this all up under the framework of the so-called 'Tai Chi' document. [1] CZ is on the board of the '.us' and '.us' licenses the brand and technology from '.com' With that in mind, the law takes a dim view of such shenanigans. I suspect that '.com's tacit acceptance of VPNs in serving US customers is probably more than enough for a judge to pierce the corporate veil. [1] https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaeldelcastillo/2020/10/29/leaked-tai-chi-document-reveals-binances-elaborate-scheme-to-evade-bitcoin-regulators/?sh=6bc5382d2a92 https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaeldelcastillo/2020/10/29/l...

3np 4y ago

In other news: Xaomi stills sells to Russia despite EU sanctions. (and so on and so forth)

HyprMusic 4y ago
There are no sanctions on selling goods to general consumers, most companies have just chosen not to do so.
- JumpCrisscross 4y ago
  > are no sanctions on selling goods to general consumers While technically true, the sanctions on its banks and central bank in practice mean it’s virtually impossible to be paid by an Iranian for your goods. (No, crypto doesn’t work, unless that consumer doesn’t interact with its banking system and you can convince the U.S. you’ve verified this.)
- throwaway290 4y ago
  But once your 'general consumer' is e.g. Gazprom, aren't you liable? And it's virtually impossible to guarantee otherwise.

istanbul7 4y ago

rvz 4y ago

So did GitHub, and Signal for their users? But we are not screaming at them are we?

arcticbull 4y ago
So if three cars are speeding, right, and an officer pulls over the first but lets the other two go - you know what's not a good defense? "But officer, they were speeding too!! Therefore speeding must be ok, right? I'll be going now." [edit] to rephrase: US cops close like 50% of murder cases. Is your gut reaction anger that since they can't catch 100% of them, they may as well not bother catching any at all? It's not really fair to the ones who get caught if some of their peers are getting away with it yeah?
- selfhoster11 4y ago
  The third vehicle that was pulled over was not even a car - it was a tank. Source code hubs or instant messaging are nowhere near as worthy of restricting as avenues of money transfer are.
Cthulhu_ 4y ago
Are "we" screaming at Binance? Github got a license to operate in Iran: https://github.blog/2021-01-05-advancing-developer-freedom-github-is-fully-available-in-iran/ https://github.blog/2021-01-05-advancing-developer-freedom-g.... I don't know about Signal though, but they have been banned by Iran anyway because it allowed open communications to the outside.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
selfhoster11 4y ago
Let's be real, how much damage can sanction-related misuse of (free) version control and (free) instant messaging do? Being able to transfer money is a much more powerful enabler for sanctioned activity.
maxst 4y ago

Shadonototra 4y ago

Another reason to promote Binance over Coinbase Binance trully is independent Coinbase will freeze your assets the day the US doesn't like your face anymore It already happened, and Coinbase is plagued with insider trading https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31012462 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31012462

closewith 4y ago
The long term prospects for companies which bust US sanctions are unlikely to be good.
toolz 4y ago
No, binance has a separate platform (that is quite different than their original platform in terms of services/products offered) for US users that is very much not independent from US influence. e.g. binance trades XMR (monero) while binance-US does not allow that coin.
ceejayoz 4y ago
You're right; Binance has the handy "text the CEO's mother" approach if your account gets frozen. Way better. > Out of desperation he sought information online and wound up texting the mother of Binance.US CEO Catherine Coley so he could get his funds unstuck. Now, Binance is closing his account. https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/05/12/so-many-locked-out-binance-users-say-their-accounts-have-been-frozen-for-months/ https://www.coindesk.com/tech/2021/05/12/so-many-locked-out-...
323 4y ago
> Crypto exchange Binance blocks Russian users targeted by sanctions > "We're blocking accounts of those on the sanctions list (if they have Binance accounts) and ensuring that all sanctions are met in full," https://www.reuters.com/technology/crypto-exchange-binance-says-it-wont-unilaterally-freeze-accounts-russia-2022-02-28/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/crypto-exchange-binance-s...

neotek 4y ago

Why does it seem like every single crypto company inevitably engages in shady business practices and ends up collapsing in a scandal? How hard can it be to just make a shitload of money taking your skim from trades or lending at appropriate rates for an appropriate return?

abakker 4y ago
no harder, but slower! stake in a business is obviously slower yet. The ultimate scam is to just manufacture equity and do a pump and dump. any resemblance to an actual business is unintentional.
Traubenfuchs 4y ago
The risk of ignoring sanctions probably comes with a big premium. Indeed it's all fine until they get caught! The perfect fit for short term inflation of evaluation.
toolz 4y ago
Because normal people will click on crypto scams. They're scared of what they don't understand - are you aware of how many billions of dollars of fines every single major bank pays routinely? Probably not, because that's boring and doesn't make headlines you see as often. 8 of the top 10 most penalized companies in the world are banks that have nothing to do with crypto.
- rajamaka 4y ago
  So you're saying 2 of the ten most penalized companies in the world are crypto companies? That's actually remarkable considering their relatively inconsequential market
  - mhmmmmmm 4y ago
    the remaining 2 companies could be anything, just not banks.
  - toolz 4y ago

hunglee2 4y ago

honouring the decentralised ethos of crypto, free from political control!

toolz 4y ago
exactly, it's absurd that literal fruits and nuts sellers (one of Irans top 5 exports) are being penalized for political reasons the same as anything related to war efforts (like oil exports). Sanctions are often more palatable than war to people who can more easily overlook the death and suffering caused by poverty relative to the death and suffering caused by weapons. If you're in the US, just look at how often you see headlines about murders by gun are explicitly reported on (as if any subcategory of murder was easier to solve with policy than the many many many things in poverty that kill people daily).

LatteLazy 4y ago

Good. Sanctions against Iran are counterproductive and should have been dropped years ago.

xtracto 4y ago
And Cuba, and Russia and Venezuela. Sanctions punish the wrong set of people. But for some reason the US loves them.
- cbHXBY1D 4y ago
  There was a good book that got released earlier this year on the development of sanctions as an act of war. Highly recommend: https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300259360/the-economic-weapon/ https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300259360/the-economic-w...

bouncycastle 4y ago

Ironically, it's the Iranian people, not the Iranian government, who need crypto the most.

fatjokes 4y ago
Isn't being able to evade sanctions one of the few tangible benefits of crypto?
- bouncycastle 4y ago
  You cannot evade sanctions because you still need to disclose your delivery address.
yoavm 4y ago
Well, if the only thing that could take down the Iranian government is its own people, then perhaps them having an alternative currency to trade with the world and ease their economical situation is actually the best possible thing for the survival of their government.
- bouncycastle 4y ago
  No, it's the opposite. Their government's survival depends on the complete control of their fiat currency. Their national currency is a tool to maintain control.

vgatherps 4y ago

Headline: "Binance served crypto traders in Iran despite US sanctions" Content: "Binance banned Iranian users after sanctions, 7 got missed/found a workaround, they were banned later anyways"

jchiu1106 4y ago
Reuters is deliberately ruining their own credibility.
- sfusato 4y ago
  Do they still have one though?
duxup 4y ago
I don’t think those are all that different headlines. Folks who expect the headline to be extra detailed will always be dissatisfied IMO. It’s on the individual to read the story. Folks who don’t will misunderstand regardless. But to be clear I’ve got no problem with your clarification here either.
- vgatherps 4y ago
  Despite being technically correct, "Binance continued serving Iranians despite sanctions" doesn't imply "Binance stopped serving Iranians and later caught more that fell through the cracks". I would definitely have gotten marked down in school if I submitted an article where the headline was such inaccurate summary of the story. It's not even like there's nothing to be seen! "Binance may have turned a blind eye to and encouraged VPN usage" would have been a much better summary!
  - bombcar 4y ago
    I feel headlines in papers were a bit more "legitimate" but now in the era of click-bait they're as sensational as they can be whilst not being technically incorrect. I try to guess what the headline means before reading the article; if I guessed wrong I downgrade that source.

Fargoan 4y ago

They're not a US based company so why should I care? The sanctions are bullshit anyway.

amanj41 4y ago

I don't see the problem here. For regulatory reasons, Binance is a separate entity from Binance US and American users are not able to use it. Binance would not be violating sanctions as it does not operate in the US

upupandup 4y ago

It just puzzles me how bold and reckless CZ is. Who and what is behind him that he would violate US sanctions to openly? Same with Do Kwon. What is responsible for this blatant disregard for the law?

d23 4y ago
It seems to be a broader trend, even in the US. High level politicians and political operatives seem to be openly committing crimes and defying the law with no fear of repercussions.

humbleMouse 4y ago

M_jahanpour 4y ago

It is true that I am an Iranian and I use Binance services in Iran

dxbrty_545 4y ago

[dead]

Iranian 4y ago