9 ms·

Formula E Gen3: The world’s most efficient race car

97 points by RickJWagner 5y ago

altarius 5y ago
I'm always curious about carbon fiber recycling. It is my understanding that as long as you're using an epoxy matrix the best you can do is "down cycle", i.e. you shred your part, literally burn off the resin and reuse the scraps with new binder into e.g. airplane trays. It sounds like maybe switching to a thermoplastic ("remeltable") matrix might be better but it will probably take decade(s) to research how to optimally produce and use those new parts.
- turbinerneiter 5y ago
  BMW worked on that for the i3, but I couldn't find any good source about what came of it and if they used it for the i3.
  - moffkalast 5y ago
    They must've allocated all the funding from the body design team, the i3 has some serious Fiat Multipla vibes.
  - Gravityloss 5y ago
    They used leftover carbon fiber for the roof. Sandy Munro has an episode on the i3.
epolanski 5y ago
> line with Formula E’s achievement as the first net-zero sport I don't understand how can they claim such things, what is the definition for "net-zero". Doesn't matter how optimized, say, the production of a car is, say it produces 10 metric tons of CO2, how are they gonna offset it? And all the rubber, travelling, batteries, etc?
- PavleMiha 5y ago
  Carbon offsets are super complicated, potentially shady, and I don’t fully understand them, but the gist of it is that they pay money to companies to either not produce carbon that they otherwise would have, or use the money to install and operate equipment in factories and powerplants that captures carbon before it goes out into the world. You can also do things that pull carbon out of regular air but I think the first two options are so much more efficient that they dominate the market. It seems like the system could be gamed, but as far as I know it broadly works.
  - basisword 5y ago
    >> Carbon offsets are super complicated, potentially shady, and I don’t fully understand them How can you judge them while openly admitting you don’t understand them?
    - junofan 5y ago
      There are clear perverse incentives and well-documented abuses.
    - yywwbbn 5y ago
      I think they are purposefully confusing to obfuscate the fact that offsets are primarily a PR mechanism
- V__ 5y ago
  > These unavoidable emissions from the past six seasons have now been certified as offset through investment in Gold Standard and Verified Carbon Standard UN projects in-line with the UNFCCC’s Clean Development Mechanism. > From biogas energy generation in China to landfill gas energy generation in Mexico and wind power energy generation in Morocco, the offsetting projects Formula E has partnered with are carefully selected based on their social or ecological benefits, and on their location, all of which are situated in regions that we’ve raced in, from Season 1 to-date. [1] https://www.fiaformulae.com/en/news/2020/september/three-steps-to-net-zero https://www.fiaformulae.com/en/news/2020/september/three-ste...
inb4_cancelled 5y ago
Why did they go fully open-wheel when aiming for higher efficiency? I always thought that the wheels produce some brutal drag.
- metadat 5y ago
  To keep them cool, because grip is everything and you don't want them too hot or cold. Sweet spot is key.
  - gameswithgo 5y ago
  - jackvalentine 5y ago
    In this kind of series the tyre’s overheating and degradation characteristics are carefully designed in to them. The factory has taken in to account covered/uncovered airflow on the wheel. You control overheating by tuning camber and caster.
- aquajet 5y ago
  It's also a revered part of "the formula", mainly for aesthetics. I'm guessing they want the cars to look more like the other formula series.
  - moffkalast 5y ago
    Yeah, add wheel covers and you basically have the LeMans prototypes instead.
rco8786 5y ago
> Formula 1 cars average speeds between 220 and 230MPH during a Grand Prix, This must be a typo. Maybe kph? 220mph is maybe like a theoretical max speed, but certainly not an average over a race.
- benoliver999 5y ago
  Monaco is gonna be wild this year
  - ohgodplsno 5y ago
    If you don't go for a gap that exists and don't yeet yourself to death at maximum speed on short track circuits, you cannot call yourself a racer
- kissiel 5y ago
  220mph is typical speed on longer straights, so I guess It should have been "F1 cars on average have a top speed between 220 and 230mph.
- ot 5y ago
  Yes they likely meant "typical top speeds". According to Wikipedia, all "Highest average" speed records (for race, lap, and qualifying) happened in Monza, and they're all around 250km/h, or 155mph. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Formula_One_race_records https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Formula_One_race_recor...
lostdog 5y ago
> Inside, an electric motor can deliver 350kW of power (470BHP) to reach top speeds of 200MPH (320 km/h). For reference, Formula 1 cars average speeds between 220 and 230MPH during a Grand Prix. There's either some typos here, or just bad writing. The speed record for Formula 1 looks to be 231.4 mph, so the E top speed looks to be pretty close. That's cool! I wonder if we'll see the top races turn into electric at some point.
- kissiel 5y ago
  As with all engineering there's a tradeoffs dance. The F1 one cars pull insane G's in the bends, and all that downforce requires a lot of power. I'd like to know what kind of g-forces those FE cars reach. I think the best way to compare the overall performance is to compare the average speed on the same track.
  - jw14 5y ago
    I think Formula E is kind of useless. Racing competitions can be a good engine for innovation, but last I heard Formula E has all cars using a standard battery. Isn't the battery the biggest thing we want to improve on EVs? They hold the races in cities instead of "real" race tracks, which I guess is cool if that's your home town but as a (lukewarm) racing fan I would rather see tracks I know. I wonder if they also want to avoid comparisons with ICE race cars. The Gen 2 Formula E did 0-60 in 2.8s... which is achievable in some ICE street cars. Hopefully the Gen 3 is more impressive.
    - jwcooper 5y ago
      I'm not really sure Formula E is big enough yet to put a lot of resources into battery tech like Formula 1 can engine tech. I believe the biggest reason they are in cities now is that the battery capacity/tech just isn't there yet for something like Spa or COTA for the distance and speeds required for an interesting race. City courses allow for a design that offers a lot of regenerative braking. Another reason to host them in cities is that cities are great for fans. Lots of hotels, restaurants, people buy tickets, etc. Cities are likely more open to Formula E due to the quieter cars and lower pollution too. So, not useless, just maybe not interesting to you.
jonathankoren 5y ago
Formula E is pretty interesting. All the races are on YouTube. It’s enjoyable, and the races have some interesting gimmicks that electric cars can give you. First, the race is n minutes + 2 laps instead of a set distance. Functionally, it’s not really any different from a regular distance race, since you have to be on the lead lap to win. The other gimmick is that video game speed boosts are a thing. You can drive through areas to have your motor run at a higher output for a limited time. I do like the aesthetics for the new cars, and the battery technology has improved from the earliest version where the drivers had to change cars in the middle of the race because the batteries were too weak.
- BrandoElFollito 5y ago
  I've never heard of such races until a few days ago when I was in Monaco. The city was getting ready for the race and they were heavily promoting the electric part (especially in a large meeting center that was expected to hist all things electric). I will gladly have a look at the YouTube recordings of the races as I am wondering whether they are basically silent compared to their fuel-based counterparts. The silence factor of a car is really something. I recently got a hybrid car (self-recharging version) and I love the sound of the first meters, solely electric. My next car will be a 100% electric one for sure.
  - unethical_ban 5y ago
    Off-topic: What is Monaco like? Is it fun? Is English somewhat common there? And finally, is it affordable for a middle class couple?
    - BrandoElFollito 5y ago
      Monaco is good for a one day visit, at best. Of course this depends on your preferences, I like middle-sized, rather open cities such as Versailles. Monaco is very cramped with lots of buildings and roads that are not easy to cross. There are nice parks, though - but everything seems really cramped. The prices are outrageous, but this is the case in many places in the south of France. You do not live in Monaco comfortably with a middle-class income. France is a marvelous country, with beautiful places and climates - there are really better places to choose from.
olivermarks 5y ago
BEVs are great for hill climb (Pikes Peak record held by incredible VW BEV https://youtu.be/2K2paIN20mU https://youtu.be/2K2paIN20mU) and for low end drag racing (NEDRA in the US http://www.nedra.com/record_holders.html http://www.nedra.com/record_holders.html), but for circuit racing they are years away from being able to run more than a few laps at a time with sub formula III performance. I'd be interested to see more hybrid racing, which would help with hybrid street R&D, but the BEV world is imo currently limited to sprint performance, not multiple lap competitive racing
riidom 5y ago
It's phrased a bit unclear in the article, but the 250kW front engine is actually for recuperation only.
smallerfish 5y ago
> Gen3 won’t rely solely on batteries for power. Around 40 percent of the energy cars will use during an E-Prix will be produced by regenerative braking. Definitely bad writing. Where do they think the energy that got the car up to speed originally (which is then partially recouped via regenerative braking) came from?
- emmelaich 5y ago
  Don't be too hard on them, it reads fine for most people. I mean by your argument, ICEs are solar powered, right? :-)
- taspeotis 5y ago
  Didn’t they used to store energy recovered from braking in flywheels? Not chemical batteries in a more conventional sense. And yes fundamentally it comes from their batteries first and foremost.
incomingpain 5y ago
I am a F1 fan. OMG Hamilton what happened? I watched some of season 7 of Formula E on youtube and just couldn't get into it. I really would love to get into it. Attack mode is weird to me. 10% power boost, twice? No DRS? Everyone is sort of the same power same car? Driver skill doesnt seem to change much? It doesn't feel like a competition. No pitting or tire strategy? Wtf? No pit charging to dump several kwh in quickly? There's no refueling in F1 because stuff catches on fire, Formula E doesn't have that problem. Perhaps more indy car style where only 1 person can swap tires to delay pits to get good value out of charging? I also had thought, instead of attack mode, why not kind of mario kart rules lol? Red shell that fires forward and harms people in front? Drop banana to harm people behind you. Could make the race funnier.
- yywwbbn 5y ago
  Several minute long pit stops don’t sound too exciting, they might just split into multiple races with a normal start (which they did).
  - incomingpain 5y ago
    Well I wouldn't say several minutes long. Indy car has 4 people out, 1 for each tire and their pit stops are still only seconds. In terms of quick charging, teams get to design their own bank of supercaps that dump as much power into the car as fast as possible. I dont know, I really want to watch formula e over f1 but sure doesnt make it for me.
clouddrover 5y ago
> Then there’s the motor efficiency. Formula E says the electric power units can convert over 90 percent of their energy to mechanical power, compared to around 40 percent for an ICE motor. Formula 1 cars have over 50% thermal efficiency: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.how-f1-technology-has-supercharged-the-world.6Gtk3hBxGyUGbNH0q8vDQK.html https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.how-f1-technology... F1 cars are running faster using less fuel than they were 9 years ago.
tlb 5y ago
They're measuring efficiency in miles per joule, but really the output of a race car is entertainment. You want the most entertainment per joule. If you make the cars smaller (call the scale s), they have a smaller frontal area by s^2. They can also go slower and look the same on camera, again by a factor of s. Since energy consumption scales as speed^3 * frontal area, you get a remarkable power ∝ s^5 So if you make half-sized cars you can use 1/32 of the energy. And you can have an identical visual spectacle as long as you scale the camera positions, reduce the tire grip by s^2, and find some 3' tall drivers.
- smilekzs 5y ago
  Risking pointing out the obvious: Did you mean: RC racing?
  - tlb 5y ago
    I think it's more entertaining with drivers in them. But sufficiently lifelike robot drivers might suffice.
    - gumby 5y ago
      Especially if they bleed. I honestly wonder how much of the appeal of car and motor bike racing is the anticipation of a crash.
      - wombat-man 5y ago
        you can have quite a crash these days in a modern race car and walk away. Probably will race in the next one.
      - PraetorianGourd 5y ago
        Absolutely none of the appeal is anticipating a crash. If someone claims to be a race fan and likes the crashes, they are by definition not a race fan as there is no racing in a crash. I remember watching when Jules Bianchi had his fatal accident and I remember where I was when I read of Antoine Hubert had his fatal crash and I remember watching Romain Grosjean somehow walk away from an incredibly violent crash. Each one made me seriously consider giving up on the sport, but the racers racing and each crash has led to massive safety improvements. I hope there is never another fatal or injury accident in motor racing. In F1 there was a long gap between Senna and Bianchi, let's hope the next gap never ends.
xiphias2 5y ago
I never followed Formula, so forgive my ignorance, but if the car is that great compared to ICE cars as the article suggests, why not try to put them together in the same race with the same parameters/limitations on the outside? I would love to watch that.
- yywwbbn 5y ago
  Because besides being significantly slower and inferior in almost every conceivable way Formula E cars would run out of power after 1/3 of an F1 race (Formula E races are under 90 km while the minimum required distance for an F1 race is 305km).
  - aaaaaaaaata 5y ago
    So make the power pack replaceable during the pit stop.

97 points by RickJWagner 5y ago

I'm always curious about carbon fiber recycling. It is my understanding that as long as you're using an epoxy matrix the best you can do is "down cycle", i.e. you shred your part, literally burn off the resin and reuse the scraps with new binder into e.g. airplane trays. It sounds like maybe switching to a thermoplastic ("remeltable") matrix might be better but it will probably take decade(s) to research how to optimally produce and use those new parts.

turbinerneiter 5y ago
BMW worked on that for the i3, but I couldn't find any good source about what came of it and if they used it for the i3.
- moffkalast 5y ago
  They must've allocated all the funding from the body design team, the i3 has some serious Fiat Multipla vibes.
- Gravityloss 5y ago
  They used leftover carbon fiber for the roof. Sandy Munro has an episode on the i3.

epolanski 5y ago

> line with Formula E’s achievement as the first net-zero sport I don't understand how can they claim such things, what is the definition for "net-zero". Doesn't matter how optimized, say, the production of a car is, say it produces 10 metric tons of CO2, how are they gonna offset it? And all the rubber, travelling, batteries, etc?

PavleMiha 5y ago
Carbon offsets are super complicated, potentially shady, and I don’t fully understand them, but the gist of it is that they pay money to companies to either not produce carbon that they otherwise would have, or use the money to install and operate equipment in factories and powerplants that captures carbon before it goes out into the world. You can also do things that pull carbon out of regular air but I think the first two options are so much more efficient that they dominate the market. It seems like the system could be gamed, but as far as I know it broadly works.
- basisword 5y ago
  >> Carbon offsets are super complicated, potentially shady, and I don’t fully understand them How can you judge them while openly admitting you don’t understand them?
  - junofan 5y ago
    There are clear perverse incentives and well-documented abuses.
  - yywwbbn 5y ago
    I think they are purposefully confusing to obfuscate the fact that offsets are primarily a PR mechanism
V__ 5y ago
> These unavoidable emissions from the past six seasons have now been certified as offset through investment in Gold Standard and Verified Carbon Standard UN projects in-line with the UNFCCC’s Clean Development Mechanism. > From biogas energy generation in China to landfill gas energy generation in Mexico and wind power energy generation in Morocco, the offsetting projects Formula E has partnered with are carefully selected based on their social or ecological benefits, and on their location, all of which are situated in regions that we’ve raced in, from Season 1 to-date. [1] https://www.fiaformulae.com/en/news/2020/september/three-steps-to-net-zero https://www.fiaformulae.com/en/news/2020/september/three-ste...

inb4_cancelled 5y ago

Why did they go fully open-wheel when aiming for higher efficiency? I always thought that the wheels produce some brutal drag.

metadat 5y ago
To keep them cool, because grip is everything and you don't want them too hot or cold. Sweet spot is key.
- gameswithgo 5y ago
- jackvalentine 5y ago
  In this kind of series the tyre’s overheating and degradation characteristics are carefully designed in to them. The factory has taken in to account covered/uncovered airflow on the wheel. You control overheating by tuning camber and caster.
aquajet 5y ago
It's also a revered part of "the formula", mainly for aesthetics. I'm guessing they want the cars to look more like the other formula series.
- moffkalast 5y ago
  Yeah, add wheel covers and you basically have the LeMans prototypes instead.

rco8786 5y ago

> Formula 1 cars average speeds between 220 and 230MPH during a Grand Prix, This must be a typo. Maybe kph? 220mph is maybe like a theoretical max speed, but certainly not an average over a race.

benoliver999 5y ago
Monaco is gonna be wild this year
- ohgodplsno 5y ago
  If you don't go for a gap that exists and don't yeet yourself to death at maximum speed on short track circuits, you cannot call yourself a racer
kissiel 5y ago
220mph is typical speed on longer straights, so I guess It should have been "F1 cars on average have a top speed between 220 and 230mph.
ot 5y ago
Yes they likely meant "typical top speeds". According to Wikipedia, all "Highest average" speed records (for race, lap, and qualifying) happened in Monza, and they're all around 250km/h, or 155mph. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Formula_One_race_records https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Formula_One_race_recor...

lostdog 5y ago

> Inside, an electric motor can deliver 350kW of power (470BHP) to reach top speeds of 200MPH (320 km/h). For reference, Formula 1 cars average speeds between 220 and 230MPH during a Grand Prix. There's either some typos here, or just bad writing. The speed record for Formula 1 looks to be 231.4 mph, so the E top speed looks to be pretty close. That's cool! I wonder if we'll see the top races turn into electric at some point.

kissiel 5y ago
As with all engineering there's a tradeoffs dance. The F1 one cars pull insane G's in the bends, and all that downforce requires a lot of power. I'd like to know what kind of g-forces those FE cars reach. I think the best way to compare the overall performance is to compare the average speed on the same track.
- jw14 5y ago
  I think Formula E is kind of useless. Racing competitions can be a good engine for innovation, but last I heard Formula E has all cars using a standard battery. Isn't the battery the biggest thing we want to improve on EVs? They hold the races in cities instead of "real" race tracks, which I guess is cool if that's your home town but as a (lukewarm) racing fan I would rather see tracks I know. I wonder if they also want to avoid comparisons with ICE race cars. The Gen 2 Formula E did 0-60 in 2.8s... which is achievable in some ICE street cars. Hopefully the Gen 3 is more impressive.
  - jwcooper 5y ago
    I'm not really sure Formula E is big enough yet to put a lot of resources into battery tech like Formula 1 can engine tech. I believe the biggest reason they are in cities now is that the battery capacity/tech just isn't there yet for something like Spa or COTA for the distance and speeds required for an interesting race. City courses allow for a design that offers a lot of regenerative braking. Another reason to host them in cities is that cities are great for fans. Lots of hotels, restaurants, people buy tickets, etc. Cities are likely more open to Formula E due to the quieter cars and lower pollution too. So, not useless, just maybe not interesting to you.

jonathankoren 5y ago

Formula E is pretty interesting. All the races are on YouTube. It’s enjoyable, and the races have some interesting gimmicks that electric cars can give you. First, the race is n minutes + 2 laps instead of a set distance. Functionally, it’s not really any different from a regular distance race, since you have to be on the lead lap to win. The other gimmick is that video game speed boosts are a thing. You can drive through areas to have your motor run at a higher output for a limited time. I do like the aesthetics for the new cars, and the battery technology has improved from the earliest version where the drivers had to change cars in the middle of the race because the batteries were too weak.

BrandoElFollito 5y ago
I've never heard of such races until a few days ago when I was in Monaco. The city was getting ready for the race and they were heavily promoting the electric part (especially in a large meeting center that was expected to hist all things electric). I will gladly have a look at the YouTube recordings of the races as I am wondering whether they are basically silent compared to their fuel-based counterparts. The silence factor of a car is really something. I recently got a hybrid car (self-recharging version) and I love the sound of the first meters, solely electric. My next car will be a 100% electric one for sure.
- unethical_ban 5y ago
  Off-topic: What is Monaco like? Is it fun? Is English somewhat common there? And finally, is it affordable for a middle class couple?
  - BrandoElFollito 5y ago
    Monaco is good for a one day visit, at best. Of course this depends on your preferences, I like middle-sized, rather open cities such as Versailles. Monaco is very cramped with lots of buildings and roads that are not easy to cross. There are nice parks, though - but everything seems really cramped. The prices are outrageous, but this is the case in many places in the south of France. You do not live in Monaco comfortably with a middle-class income. France is a marvelous country, with beautiful places and climates - there are really better places to choose from.

olivermarks 5y ago

BEVs are great for hill climb (Pikes Peak record held by incredible VW BEV https://youtu.be/2K2paIN20mU https://youtu.be/2K2paIN20mU) and for low end drag racing (NEDRA in the US http://www.nedra.com/record_holders.html http://www.nedra.com/record_holders.html), but for circuit racing they are years away from being able to run more than a few laps at a time with sub formula III performance. I'd be interested to see more hybrid racing, which would help with hybrid street R&D, but the BEV world is imo currently limited to sprint performance, not multiple lap competitive racing

riidom 5y ago

It's phrased a bit unclear in the article, but the 250kW front engine is actually for recuperation only.

smallerfish 5y ago

> Gen3 won’t rely solely on batteries for power. Around 40 percent of the energy cars will use during an E-Prix will be produced by regenerative braking. Definitely bad writing. Where do they think the energy that got the car up to speed originally (which is then partially recouped via regenerative braking) came from?

emmelaich 5y ago
Don't be too hard on them, it reads fine for most people. I mean by your argument, ICEs are solar powered, right? :-)
taspeotis 5y ago
Didn’t they used to store energy recovered from braking in flywheels? Not chemical batteries in a more conventional sense. And yes fundamentally it comes from their batteries first and foremost.

incomingpain 5y ago

I am a F1 fan. OMG Hamilton what happened? I watched some of season 7 of Formula E on youtube and just couldn't get into it. I really would love to get into it. Attack mode is weird to me. 10% power boost, twice? No DRS? Everyone is sort of the same power same car? Driver skill doesnt seem to change much? It doesn't feel like a competition. No pitting or tire strategy? Wtf? No pit charging to dump several kwh in quickly? There's no refueling in F1 because stuff catches on fire, Formula E doesn't have that problem. Perhaps more indy car style where only 1 person can swap tires to delay pits to get good value out of charging? I also had thought, instead of attack mode, why not kind of mario kart rules lol? Red shell that fires forward and harms people in front? Drop banana to harm people behind you. Could make the race funnier.

yywwbbn 5y ago
Several minute long pit stops don’t sound too exciting, they might just split into multiple races with a normal start (which they did).
- incomingpain 5y ago
  Well I wouldn't say several minutes long. Indy car has 4 people out, 1 for each tire and their pit stops are still only seconds. In terms of quick charging, teams get to design their own bank of supercaps that dump as much power into the car as fast as possible. I dont know, I really want to watch formula e over f1 but sure doesnt make it for me.

clouddrover 5y ago

> Then there’s the motor efficiency. Formula E says the electric power units can convert over 90 percent of their energy to mechanical power, compared to around 40 percent for an ICE motor. Formula 1 cars have over 50% thermal efficiency: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.how-f1-technology-has-supercharged-the-world.6Gtk3hBxGyUGbNH0q8vDQK.html https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.how-f1-technology... F1 cars are running faster using less fuel than they were 9 years ago.

tlb 5y ago

They're measuring efficiency in miles per joule, but really the output of a race car is entertainment. You want the most entertainment per joule. If you make the cars smaller (call the scale s), they have a smaller frontal area by s^2. They can also go slower and look the same on camera, again by a factor of s. Since energy consumption scales as speed^3 * frontal area, you get a remarkable power ∝ s^5 So if you make half-sized cars you can use 1/32 of the energy. And you can have an identical visual spectacle as long as you scale the camera positions, reduce the tire grip by s^2, and find some 3' tall drivers.

smilekzs 5y ago
Risking pointing out the obvious: Did you mean: RC racing?
- tlb 5y ago
  I think it's more entertaining with drivers in them. But sufficiently lifelike robot drivers might suffice.
  - gumby 5y ago
    Especially if they bleed. I honestly wonder how much of the appeal of car and motor bike racing is the anticipation of a crash.
    - wombat-man 5y ago
      you can have quite a crash these days in a modern race car and walk away. Probably will race in the next one.
    - PraetorianGourd 5y ago
      Absolutely none of the appeal is anticipating a crash. If someone claims to be a race fan and likes the crashes, they are by definition not a race fan as there is no racing in a crash. I remember watching when Jules Bianchi had his fatal accident and I remember where I was when I read of Antoine Hubert had his fatal crash and I remember watching Romain Grosjean somehow walk away from an incredibly violent crash. Each one made me seriously consider giving up on the sport, but the racers racing and each crash has led to massive safety improvements. I hope there is never another fatal or injury accident in motor racing. In F1 there was a long gap between Senna and Bianchi, let's hope the next gap never ends.

xiphias2 5y ago

I never followed Formula, so forgive my ignorance, but if the car is that great compared to ICE cars as the article suggests, why not try to put them together in the same race with the same parameters/limitations on the outside? I would love to watch that.

yywwbbn 5y ago
Because besides being significantly slower and inferior in almost every conceivable way Formula E cars would run out of power after 1/3 of an F1 race (Formula E races are under 90 km while the minimum required distance for an F1 race is 305km).
- aaaaaaaaata 5y ago
  So make the power pack replaceable during the pit stop.