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Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference
- elkos 5y agoHere's a post on GPS signal intereference by HawkEye360 a RF data analytics company that has a LEO CubeSat platform to collect data https://www.he360.com/hawkeye-360-signal-detection-reveals-gps-interference-in-ukraine/ https://www.he360.com/hawkeye-360-signal-detection-reveals-g...
- janmarsal 5y agoFake news. This is not unusual. Just one of those things that keeps happening when Russia is your neighbor.
- quattrofan 5y agoHuh? How is it fake news if it's happening and you seem to agree it is with "Russia on your border"
- tuwtuwtuwtuw 5y agoIf it happens all the time, then how is it "unusual" as the title say?
- account-5 5y agoSo it's not fake news then.
- userbinator 5y agoI think your sarcasm detector might need some recalibrating.
- dazc 5y agoHe is saying it is not 'news', not that the story is fake.
- account-5 5y agoOld news then.
- nextlevelwizard 5y agoYes the fakest of news of things that are literally happening. I wish they would ready block all Russian traffic from the Internet, you guys are getting out of hand.
- rich_sasha 5y agoThe clear suggestion is that it is Russia doing it. Other than as an f-u, I don’t understand why they would though. If I have an effective weapon (GPS spoofer), surely I don’t want to alert the enemy to it, lest they develop defences. So eg say NATO were overreliant on GPS, incidents of spoofing like this will cause them to rethink and reduce that reliance, or harden the system.
- waihtis 5y agoSuggesting Russians are playing a rational game here? I think the cover has been pulled on the Russian "master strategy".. it's literally a hierarchy of terror and lies, where everyone will do whatever it takes to please the irrational autocrat. I have been spamming this lecture everywhere since the war started and again I think anyone who's still questioning the Russian operative reality should watch it: Evaluation of Russia by Finnish Intelligence Colonel (subtitles) | December 3, 2018 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kF9KretXqJw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kF9KretXqJw
- jimbob45 5y agoThis must be how the allies felt in 1939 wondering what Germany’s master plan could possibly have been. Of course, they couldn’t have foreseen Hitler being a bumbling buffoon all along.
- labster 5y agoYeah, but Hitler had the Wehrmacht and all the competence there. Putin only has… whoever is responsible for that megaconvoy stalled for a week, in uncontrolled airspace.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- raverbashing 5y agoIt's all tactics but no strategy Blowing up stuff is certainly bad, but their lack of planning met considerable resistance Not to mention the strict top-down delegation and low morale.
- bagels 5y agoUnited States has the capability to degrade or deny GPS based on location. Russia has also demonstrated the ability to spoof GPS signals. Either is a likely cause here.
- miohtama 5y agoWhat would be the United States's interest to mess up with GPS now?
- bagels 5y agoTo deny access to Russia is one reason. Not saying it's the only reason, or that it's not more likely that Russia has done this.
- brandmeyer 5y agoIts a stupid reason. Russian military equipment uses GLONASS. Granted, GLONASS is just barely limping along, but it does work.
- RobertMiller 5y agoIt's possible that GLONASS isn't working well for them for some reason. They've been using relatively few precision munitions. And of those few, many of them them seem to be missing by quite a lot. Some of the ballistic missiles they threw at runways look like they were probably under inertial guidance, judging by how badly they missed.
- noughtme 5y agoJamming and spoofing GPS poses less risk than imposing a no fly zone.
- nosianu 5y ago> a no fly zone. Uhm... Finland is several countries north of Ukraine. This is about the eastern Baltic region. I guess you are referring to the rejected NATO-maintained no-fly zone over Ukraine? Or do you mean a no-fly zone imposed by Russia for its Baltic region neighbors?? > According to reports, the interference isn't limited to Finland but also affects Poland, Lithuania, Latvia, and the broader Baltic region. Also, a jammed GPS has little impact on flying, especially not on Russian military flying. They have their own system GLONASS (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GLONASS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GLONASS).
- hericium 5y agoDisrupting GPS may result in some economic chaos - it is used for precise time synchronization on financial markets.
- andylynch 5y agoIt would be annoying but far from chaos for a few reasons - Its pretty easy to detect. Similar problems come up occasionally, often due to drivers jamming their companies’ remote monitoring. - The time services in any well operated network will operate well within tolerance for very extended periods without this signal (some bigger ones don’t use GPS time at all for reasons like this) Time labs offer their own signals.
- nly 5y agoEh? Many exchanges don't offer timestamps beyond millisecond accuracy, which is easily achievable via NTP and atomic clocks on the ground. Maybe some extreme HFTs doing arbitrage between markets
- RF_Savage 5y agoGPS is an universally used timing source. For everything from SCADA to cellphone base stations to NTP Stratum-1 time servers. It's easy, cheap and precise.
- TrackerFF 5y agoRussia has previously and frequently conducted (GPS) jamming exercises in the northern area, which has resulted in the same thing for pilots there. EDIT: These things are more likely to happen in times of military exercises or similar activities. Right now there's lots of activity in the Baltic region - which is likely why things are happening. Whenever there's large NATO exercises in Northern Norway, these things start happening.
- T-A 5y ago> Whenever there's large NATO exercises in Northern Norway, these things start happening. https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/news_192351.htm https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/news_192351.htm
- manuel_w 5y agoPlease don't just drop a link but elaborate a bit what your trying to say by posting that link. Was expecting something interesting GPS jamming related, but the article doesn't even contain the word "GPS". You likely posted it to tell there are currently NATO exercises going on in northern Norway. Your post could have benefited from adding this bit of info.
- T-A 5y ago
- speedgoose 5y ago> GPS spoofing is hard to stop because the signal the satellites emit from low-Earth orbit to potentially add encryption and certificates cannot be changed. Why ? I thought the military GPS signals were encrypted. They could make a new GPS version on a new frequency with at least crypto signed messages. We can’t have such a flaw on the protocol forever.
- amelius 5y agoPerhaps the aircraft they talk about don't use the military grade gps.
- tialaramex 5y ago> I thought the military GPS signals were encrypted I'm sure this is true in the sense that general publications use "encrypted" to mean, "There was some sort of cryptographic stuff involved and it went over my head" rather than actually encrypted. Like they do when they tell you that the passwords stolen in a breach were "encrypted with bcrypt" for example. The key thing to pay attention to here is that unlike say, TLS, this is not a conversation. A GPS receiver is just that, a receiver passively observing the signals. You would usually "bend" GPS by relaying signals from somewhere or somewhen else, and the passive receiver concludes that it must be where the signals it is receiving seem to suggest it is. Take an easy scenario, imagine I'm in a warehouse that has been designed as a Faraday cage. You've fit a handful of transmitters to the warehouse, and you play back a recording of GPS signals received three weeks ago in the desert outside Las Vegas. How does my GPS receiver know (using some hypothetical "encrypted military signal") that it isn't in fact near Las Vegas three weeks ago? That's what the signals seem to suggest and there is literally no contradictory data available.
- chockchocschoir 5y agoI do know the basics of GPS but not much further than this. Wouldn't it be possible to embed a clock in a GPS receiver that gets used when decrypting the packets it receives? So instead of just receiving a encrypted packet and trusting it, it'll decrypt it and check when the message was from and if the slew is more than ~1 minute or whatever, then it is probably forged. That would at least prevent the scenario that you're describing, but since I don't know enough about GPS, it probably introduces other problems.
- rq1 5y agoOh really? Apparently Russia is conducting a military exercise in Ukraine.
- NaN1352 5y agoInteresting, there were also all those drone incursions over nuclear facilities…
- stevespang 5y ago
- interfixus 5y agoMy Casio watch normally syncs six times a day from the DCF77 transmitter in Frankfurt. In freak weather it may occasionally skip a sync or two, but otherwise it has been rock steady through more than two years of operation. Until about five days ago. Every attempt has failed since then. Meanwhile, two wallclocks have been sitting with flashing sync-icon for a couple of days, but now seem to be online again. Presumably, they have much larger antennae than my Casio. Someone knowledgeable, please explain to me: Is the signal potentially being tinkered with, or is this just a strange coincidence?
- RF_Savage 5y agoI'd blame local interference. Bought any cheap electronics recently? Your neighbors new phone carger from aliexpress is a more likely reason than jamming or other intentional interference on 77.5kHz.
- interfixus 5y agoNo. Nothing changed locally, and I live fairly isolated. And anyway, we get around, me and my Casio.
- maratc 5y ago> the software to simulate realistic GPS satellite radio signals is generally widely available. This is interesting. Someone knows if I can spoof GPS signals using my Raspberry Pi -- plus maybe some SDR hat or add-on?
- Rebelgecko 5y agoYou can get a GPS signal generator for a few thousand dollars and hook it up, although I don't know of any that would work with a Pi
- noipv4 5y agoTake a look at Adalm Pluto or USRP B200/ B210 boards to generate GPS signal. If you want to use Pluto, you need a better clock crystal (lower ppm) for GPS usage. You will need current almanac data and the spoofing generator software on rPI. Also, if you want more fun and learn about GPS signals, you can use gnss-sdr open source software GPS/GNSS signal decoder.
- omgmajk 5y agoThis is happening in Sweden as well, on the east coast. Which is not strange considering what is going on.
- eternalban 5y agoThis article focuses on US military GPS tests in US and airline safety mainly, but does mention similar tests happening in Europe and China. Regarding these latter it does not name who is doing the jamming. https://spectrum.ieee.org/faa-files-reveal-a-surprising-threat-to-airline-safety-the-us-militarys-gps-tests https://spectrum.ieee.org/faa-files-reveal-a-surprising-thre...
- noipv4 5y agoA great tutorial on how GPS works. https://ciechanow.ski/gps/ https://ciechanow.ski/gps/