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My First 80 Days of VR for Exercise
- auslegung 5y agoThis is very intriguing. I can see myself using this during my lunch break where otherwise I just watch YouTube videos. I’d love to hear others’ experience. Anyone else here do this, or know of other articles like this? I’d prefer not to buy anything from Facebook for privacy issues, though…
- berberous 5y agoVR is a good workout, but to be honest, I still find the headsets unpleasant enough to not want to use this over other forms of exercise. The headsets are too heavy, moving vigorously cause them to move and lose your visual sweetspot, they got hot, the foam interface gets sweaty and gross, etc. And for the amount of time I spend on screens, I’d rather go for a run outside and enjoy the fresh air. But I could see most of the above being improved in a few generations such that it’s a really great exercise option.
- Freaken 5y agoThe stock headset definitely needs to be upgraded for this kind of application. I own a BoboVR headband with an external battery, which helps balance the weight of the headset. I had the elite strap with external battery and the BoboVR is much more comfortable for me. It’s also leatherette instead of foam, so much easier to clean. I also have a fan (BoboVR F2) attached to the face mask in order to prevent condensation and overall I get a great experience even when I drip of sweat after exercising.
- mchaynes 5y agoIf you have the oculus quest, put on the silicon/rubber piece over the foam. I’m pretty sure that’s how they intended people to use it. I just had the foam for a while as well and it was disgusting.
- squeaky-clean 5y agoFrom what I understand, the silicon cover was only added to the Quest in September of last year. Though if you have a model from before then you can get one for free. https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/consumer-products/video-games/recall-check-facebook-recalls-4m-oculus-quest-2-accessories-after-thousands-report-skin-irritation-hives/ https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-settlements/consumer-pro... https://www.oculus.com/quest-2/removable-facial-interface-alert/ https://www.oculus.com/quest-2/removable-facial-interface-al...
- zeta0134 5y agoI've been using Beat Saber as a cardio mixup, though I agree with the sentiment that the headset gets a little stuffy. My bigger issue with VR in general is that the tethered PC experience has a lot of friction. The Oculus has more "pick up and go" power, but Facebook is a hard pass, so I'm patiently waiting for some other company (anyone, really) to come out and compete with a similar form factor. VR doesn't replace exercise for me; my regular routine involves weights, but it compliments it nicely on my off days. I think it's good to mix in, but wouldn't want to rely on it as the sole form of exercise. Maybe that's just me; I can't do the same thing every day, and since weight training requires a strict routine, cardio is where I mix things up for spice.
- spywaregorilla 5y agoI have an index and have done a bit of beat saber. I wouldn't really recommend it for exercise. Beat saber specifically, can be exhausting, but it doesn't require much more than moving your arms for most levels. You may soon learn to adapt and actually just move your wrists more than your arms. I can do all but 5 or so of the base content songs on expert+ and while I do enjoy and recommend the game, I cannot say its a great idea for exercise. Being out of breath isn't actually great evidence of of a good exercise. A few things I particularly dislike: * Headset gets sweaty * Content that requires you to perform well can be harder to do when tired, so the exercise part gets less and less as you just fail. Yeah, you can tweak settings to not auto lose, but if the gamification of your exercise stops working then you might as well just do real exercise. This goes the other way too in that you may just get too good at the game and the gamification part is gone for all but the most extremely difficult pieces of content.
- sli 5y ago> You may soon learn to adapt and actually just move your wrists more than your arms. I'm not convinced that someone learning that they can cheat themself out of the exercise, and then doing it, is a proper criticism of Beat Saber.
- spywaregorilla 5y agoBeat saber is not an exercise program. It's a rhythm game. It's not a criticism of the game to say that all of its design elements aren't conducive to a good workout. Novice players will move their arms much more than they have to. As you get better at the game you will probably learn to move your arms less. This is my point. Playing better tends to result in exercising less. Saying you'll just play suboptimally to get more exercise is counterintuitive and will probably not work as it will force you to ignore all of the feedback that the game gives you, e.g. score and missing blocks.
- Freaken 5y agoI do pretty much the same thing. I own a Quest 2 and I play Pistol whip, Thrill of the fight and Moon rider (a free VR game which is played in the browser where you need to hit blocks with your hands synced to music). The only issue I have with Thrill of the fight is that when I get into it, I hit hard, but find no resistance as I would hitting a punching bad or sparring with someone, so my elbow tends to overextend and I feel some pain for a couple days after playing for about 30 minutes. That’s something that will probably get better over time as I gain more control, but as of now, that’s something I need to be careful of.
- jedberg 5y agoIf you tie an elastic around your elbow and hold it in your hand or hold one around your back and in both hands, you won't overextend your elbow and it should give you the resistance you are looking for.
- Freaken 5y agoWill try that for sure. Thanks!
- CobaltFire 5y agoI was gifted a punching rig for exactly this type of workout a few years ago. You’ll find them around a few types of gyms sometimes (MMA, Military). It’s similar to what was mentioned elsewhere (elastic wrapped around body) except as an actual rig that is adjustable for resistance and reach.
- raducu 5y agoI loved Thrill of the Fight. I sweat like a pig on it. Too bad I get obsessed with fast knockout punches and my shoulders hurt like hell after a couple of days. I also learnt the hardway you cannot outrun a bad diet. I would routinely burn 600+ callories in Thrill of the Fight only to get extremely hungry after and eat double what I've burnt. For me weight training is better than cardio because I don't get the same hunger afterwards, on the countrary, if I do it late in the evening I can't eat at all. I also can't sleep afterwards. I also became obsessed with shooting/hunting simulators and haven't done any exercise in VR for a long time.
- michaelbuckbee 5y agoFor others that are interested in VR fitness games, here's a few more suggestions: - SuperHot: while less cardio focused at the higher levels it really has you doing a lot of slow, deep squats and stretches as you dodge and move around. I recommend trying to do the "Whole game in 10 minutes" mode as that's an easy chunk of time to spend. It's been great to loosen up my back after being at the desk for too long or as a quick way to get over the sleepiness of a big lunch. - Synthriders: a lot of people know BeatSaber already, but I prefer this as the music is more vaporwave and there's a more varied move set and better 360 mode. - The Climb 1+2: more a pleasant mental break than anything else, but fun.
- jsf01 5y agoI’d throw in pistol whip as a cardio recommendation to anyone that enjoys superhot. A few back to back rounds at a higher difficulty will get you moving and squatting a lot
- CoastalCoder 5y agoI've really enjoyed "Until you Fall" on the Index. Most first-person VR games (including Half-life Alex) make me motion-sick. But for some reason that doesn't happen with Until you Fall. I really hope they make a sequel or similar game.
- sli 5y agoMost people can grind through motion sickness. If you're willing to deal with feeling queasy for a night or two, it's worth the effort. I wasn't able to handle continuous motion in VR until I decided to just play through Boneworks repeatedly until I could handle it. Ended up only taking about 20 minutes and I've been good ever since.
- philjohn 5y agoSame with Sim Racing in VR for me - the trick is small repeated exposure I found. After a couple of days it was absolutely fine and I do 1 hour+ races in VR in iRacing without any issues - although the karussell at the Nordschleife still makes me a tiny bit dizzy for a split second.
- sanj 5y agoI’ve been enjoying supernatural for the last few months. When I focus on form, I’m just a little sore from pushing myself past my comfort zone. Most importantly, it gets me out of bed because I look forward to the 20min of zen and focus I get while listening to great music.
- blakeinate 5y agoIf you enjoy supernatural, I highly recommend PowerBeatsVR. It's not nearly as polished as supernatural, but the workout configuration options are very effective, plus no subscription fees.
- bgroins 5y agoSeconded. It can use some work but I do enjoy the ability to add my own music and workout to a favorite album with the playlist option.
- tawan 5y agoShameless plug: if you are into VR fitness but you think the existing solutions are missing multiplayer options, my brother and I are building Space Punch [1] which is a multiplayer fitness app. It is currently released in early access on Sidequest, and it’s functional. We are working out Monday to Friday 4:30pm UTC. If you have a Quest and want to work out together as group, then drop into our Discord sever. I’ll personally make sure you get an access key and I will show you the App from within. [1] https://sidequestvr.com/app/5820/space-punch https://sidequestvr.com/app/5820/space-punch [2] https://discord.gg/MKsZqrZh https://discord.gg/MKsZqrZh
- vyrotek 5y agoLooks fun! Reminds me a lot of Blaston which I love and is indeed quite a workout with all the dodging. https://www.oculus.com/experiences/quest/2307085352735834/ https://www.oculus.com/experiences/quest/2307085352735834/
- tawan 5y agoThanks! Yep, I also played Blaston a while and really liked it. We basically replaced shooting with a gun with punching in order to make it even more intense. In addition we also want to build out the social part and create a community of Space Punchers that work out together and motivate each other to stick to a regular schedule. I find it really fascinating how immersive VR can be and really make you think that you are in the same place with your friends. If we can translate this energy into forming a healthy habit of working out regularly with a community than we are on a good path.
- zmmmmm 5y agoPerhaps because I'm an introvert, but never quite understood the motivation for social exercise in VR. Half the advantage of it is that I can work out on my own time, in private without being coupled to fixed schedules or other people's expectations.
- JonathanFly 5y agoSame motivation as social exercise generally. It can make a mundane task more fun.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- foolfoolz 5y agothe most outlandish thing about this post is waking up at 5:30am to work
- ryanklee 5y agoWhat's outlandish about it? Some people wake up on the early side for all sorts of reasons -- disposition, physiology, mix of responsibilities requires it, household functioning, kids, etc., etc. There are many different kinds of people in this world. It pays to think of all the reasons there might be for even one single behavior.
- foolfoolz 5y agobecause waking up and putting your first effort to your job seems misplaced if you have such strong personal goals such as daily working out. what’s more important, your job or yourself?
- montag 5y agoNot just work. Deep Work.
- kitsunesoba 5y agoOne thing that’s good to point out to anybody looking to get into VR for fitness is that Beat Saber becomes radically more challenging when playing custom community-made maps instead of the stock/DLC maps. The higher difficulty community maps require a lot of speed, precision, and stamina, and I’m only beginning to be able to play them decently after a few months of practice. It’s almost an entirely different game. Unfortunately, support for custom maps/mods for the standalone Quest version of the game is not great, so it’s best to play the PC version if the community maps are of interest (which can be done with a Quest via PC link).
- rahimnathwani 5y agoWhere's the best way to get started with these community mods. I have: 1. A Quest 2 2. A PC with an RTX 20XX graphics card (usually running Linux, but can boot into Windows 10) and USB C port 3. Beat Saber (standalone version) I guess I need: 4. A long USB C cable (or the official one)? 5. Beat Saber for PC (best to buy on Oculus or Steam?) 6. Some instructions for finding, installing and using these community mods. Is there a particular place (e.g. Reddit community) that's the best place to find 'getting started' info?
- kitsunesoba 5y agoThat PC should be more than adequate. I wouldn’t personally recommend the official link cable — it’s expensive, and in my case it was flaky. I’m currently using a cable made by Cable Matters[0] that works well. Most people buy the Steam version, though either can work. I personally lean more towards Steam so if I change headsets to something non-Facebook (like Valve’s rumored upcoming quest competitor), I can still play Beat Saber without a second purchase or weird hacks. For installing mods, ModAssistant[1] has worked well for me. It’s pretty foolproof; the “standard” mods are pre-selected for installation by default, so for a minimal setup just open ModAssistant, point it at your Beat Saber installation, and install the standard mod set. From there you can search and install custom maps in-game. I don’t have too many other useful links for you, but r/beatsaber on Reddit is pretty active and good for asking questions that haven’t already been covered by that subreddit’s wiki. [0]: https://www.cablematters.com/blog/Virtual-Reality/oculus-quest-2-cable https://www.cablematters.com/blog/Virtual-Reality/oculus-que... [1]: https://github.com/Assistant/ModAssistant https://github.com/Assistant/ModAssistant
- gkfasdfasdf 5y agoWhat happens when you get sweaty?
- tootie 5y agoYou get sweaty. The silicon spacer helps make it easier to cleanup. I usually have a small room fan blowing directly on me when I VR.
- beeskneecaps 5y agoif you have the stock cloth piece in your headset, it gets disgusting and you'll have acne by day 3. No way to clean it unless you buy the aftermarket eye piece that isn't porous. I tried working out in VR but realized that working out in RR is way more fun.
- fouc 5y agoRR.. Real Reality? Funny. I'm gonna remember that one.
- beeskneecaps 5y agohaha thanks. Yeah I'm trying to make RR the next big thing. Near zero load times, no suit required for haptic feedback, two 576MP cameras, the list goes on. The birds are still obviously drones though.
- jozzy-james 5y ago> two 576MP cameras my model must be defective :(
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- fouc 5y agoInterestingly the figure for "the eye has a resolution of 576 megapixels" comes from this article: https://clarkvision.com/articles/eye-resolution.html https://clarkvision.com/articles/eye-resolution.html
- ianbutler 5y agoI’ve been doing workouts in VR for over two years now and it’s my preferred for HIIT and Cardio in general. I do mix in elliptical and treadmill sometimes but I’ve found VR far more convenient, just get up turn around put the headset on, start the tracker on my watch and get going versus going out to the gym in my building. Every reduction of friction helps me keep working out. FitXR and Thrill of The Fight are my gotos and I typically maintain 150-170bpm workouts between 3-4 times per week for 40-50minutes. With a resting heart rate in the 50s and around a 7 minute mile time I’d say it’s doing the job for someone who’s not trying to be an elite athlete just keep in shape while working a desk job. I’m 27 for context.
- Cycl0ps 5y agoFor anyone wanting additional info, the VR Health Institute has been reviewing games by their intensity and estimates calorie burn per minute of playing. https://vrhealth.institute/vr-ratings/ https://vrhealth.institute/vr-ratings/
- crashingintoyou 5y ago
- tootie 5y agoA lot of people love Thrill of the Fight for exercise. It's funny because it isn't really directed exercise, it's a boxing sim. You can take it slow but the game makes you feel like you have no choice but to punch for your life. It gets you really worked up. I actually ended up with a bit of repetitive strain from throwing hooks and had to switch to Supernatural. It's a monthly fee but it's more purpose-built for exercise.
- sli 5y agoThrill of the Fight has an adaptive punch power setting that lets you play it at a lower intensity, that might help you.
- crorella 5y agoslightly unrelated, but it seems tripp [1] is also a nice approach to meditation using VR 1. https://www.tripp.com/ https://www.tripp.com/
- deltree7 5y ago
- blhack 5y agoI recently (today!) started playing vzfit, which is a bicycle simulator. You get in an exercise bike (with a cadence tracker, which is a device thag measures pedal movement) and ride through 3D environments via google street view. It’s really, really cool. Also, best saber is great for getting a little sweaty. So is holopoint.
- pmarreck 5y agoHas anyone solved the ventilation problem for headsets yet? I seem to be convinced that the right light-absorbent baffles that still allow air through are possible, but no one seems to have attempted this in a product
- rolandr 5y agoI didn’t really believe it would work until I tried it, but having a fan blowing on you at high speed works to cool your whole body, including inside the headset. I no longer experience fogging of lenses or sweat dripping down into my eyes, which previously would become a problem after 15 minutes of intense activity. An added bonus is that the breeze can give you a sense of which direction you’re facing.
- makeitdouble 5y agoThere are face interfaces with the ventilation holes set above that don’t leak light. Must be the hole angles, the ones I use seem to be fine (can’t provide links, they come from a random vendor on Aliexpress). I believe the versons with fans also don’t leak light.
- SirZimzim 5y agoCan't say ventilation has been an issue for me on the Quest 2, I have a pleather type face cover and there is a hole by the nose area so it's not an air tight seal. I have done many long sessions with it.
- JonathanFly 5y agoI turn on an overhead and a box fan, and use upgraded facial interface, and disposable covers if I'm going especially hard.
- crashingintoyou 5y agoWhat worked for me to avoid fogging is to wear the headset kind of like a visor for a few minutes before starting your workout, which warms it such that I haven't worried about fogging much since (which initially was a problem). There is, e.g, the BOBOVR F2 which will add a battery-powered fan to your Quest 2 to add some venting, but I haven't personally tried it.
- nsxwolf 5y agoI can't get into VR boxing. I have both Thrill of the Fight and Rocky. It never feels like you're really landing any punches. You're basically shadow boxing, which can really hurt your shoulders if you don't know what you're doing. I'm surprised we don't hear more complaints of injuries.
- dinkleberg 5y agoForgive my ignorance, but I always see the quest mentioned. Are there any comparable devices that don’t require Facebook? I’ve sworn off FB and while VR for cardio has me intrigued, nothing is gonna get me to sign back in there.
- kuang_eleven 5y agoIt isn't really comparable, but the only other real VR competitor out there is the Valve Index, which is considerably more expensive, requires base stations and requires a cord to a (beefy) computer, but on the flip side can support many more games, with much better controllers and is much more powerful.
- ehnto 5y agoWhy not the Vive? They've made huge progress in the last few years.
- kuang_eleven 5y agoThat's true, I just forgot about them. From what I've seen, the Vive occupies a midpoint in price and quality between the Oculus products and the Index. EDIT: I hadn't actually seen much of the Vive Pro 2, it looks... comparable to the Index? Both price and feature-wise?
- ehnto 5y agoThat's still their flagship I think, check out their other lines like the cosmos which has AR/VR type camera integration etc, room scale without the base stations and so on.
- bubbab 5y agoNot really a midpoint, but more on a similar level to Index. Generally, people like Index more than the Vive Pros on most points (display, audio, controllers, etc.) except for the wireless capability, and some niche features like eye tracking on the Vive Pro Eye. If you want a wireless high-end headset, Vive is the only game in town (Index is wired-only) so you have to get a Vive. It'll end up being more expensive than Index because the wireless adapter is $350. Since the Vive Pros and Index share the same tracking system, people do mix and match equipment other than the headset though. Many people will buy a Vive Pro headset and use Index controllers with them, since they're better. Index users will buy Vive trackers for full-body tracking because nothing equivalent exists for the Index.
- d--b 5y agoI don’t own a VR headset, but working out is one of the main reasons I could buy one. I have some questions though: 1. Isn’t the headset moving when doing fast moves? 2. Does the headset get dirty from sweating? 3. Does any sweat build up inside the device? 4. Did anyone break their device by moving too fast?
- kuang_eleven 5y ago1. Some, but if it's well fitted, it's not a big deal. 2. Yup. 3. Yup again, especially around the... face gasket? 4. Haven't broken it yet, but I definitely have windmilled my controllers into various things. Part of that is that I don't really have enough floor space for VR.
- tragictrash 5y agoBut the silicone face gasket. You won't regret being able to clean it
- billti 5y agoI have the Quest I and Quest II. Thrill of the Fight is my main "workout" game, so now I use the Quest I exclusively for that (works just as well), because I do worry about the amount of sweat I get on it. I use the Quest II for the less physically punishing apps to maintain its longevity. The Quest II actually feels a little more uncomfortable to be for exercise anyway. It seems like the lenses are closer to the face and the unit gets a little warmer. So to you question, yes the face gasket and head strap can get quite sweaty, but not so much "inside" the device far as I can tell. To the last point, I've punched the headset with the controllers a few times (usually going for a short inside uppercut), but they seem pretty sturdy. (Or maybe my punches just have no power :-)
- invalidator 5y ago1) Games take this into account. There's no "Headbanger Hero VR". The headset holds on just fine with moderate acceleration. 2) The face gasket gets damp with a moderate workout, and sometimes I soak it if I push really hard. It air-dries between uses. It's made of antimicrobial something-or-other which seems to last a long time before it turns funky. When it does, new ones are 2 for $40, so you just throw it away and snap a new one on. The rest of the headset doesn't get wet. 3) I haven't had problems with it, but some people feel it gets too hot and humid. If so, you can get aftermarket fans which fit in the frunk to circulate air through it. 4) I haven't yet! The headset stays on fine. I have clapped the controllers together moderately hard a few times with no apparent damage. Everything seems well-made, and you can buy individual pieces if you do manage to break something. My experiences are all with the Valve Index. YMMV with other setups.
- dmontero 5y agoWhat is so bad about just going out and doing sports with people and having real contact? I guess that everyone is different. In my case I really enjoy participating in HIT workouts with people; the group competition drives me to push myself. That's one of the reasons for having better results in a marathon than during training: group competitiveness The second benefit is also obvious to me: socializing. Just the fact of doing sports together gives you a sense of bonding, of going through similar pain and succeeding. One can argue you can achieve the same with VR meanwhile for me is just a poor replacement.
- toastal 5y agoDid you forget about the ongoing pandemic?
- barry-cotter 5y agoIf you haven't been vaccinated or received a booster I strongly encourage you to do so.
- dmontero 5y agoOutdoor group sports wasn't really forbidden in many countries, or just for a small period of time. It wasn't my goal to alienate anybody. On the contrary I was trying to highlight the advantages of group sports.
- zmmmmm 5y ago> What is so bad about just going out and doing sports with people Inflexible, time intensive, lacks variety, intimidating to those with lower fitness, dealing with annoying people, competition limited to whoever you work out with rather than matching your level, affected by weather, injuries, expense ....
- j245 5y agoAgree with all the benefits you listed about in-person sport. Main issue is the time commitment with team sports. VR is in and out in 30-40 mins and the sports venue is your living room or garage (no travelling required) IME - VR can be more fun than the gym. VR can be social and competitive. Many online e-sports are. Horses for courses etc..
- fouc 5y agoIs exercise with VR significantly better or more convenient than non-VR options? Were Wii Fit or Xbox One Kinect or DDR or other options any good?
- baby 5y ago- kinect: I haven’t tried the latest but it’s not really immersive. I find it dull. The feedback/accuracy is also not great - DDR or games that require a mat: great! I used to have the britney spears one when I was younger (because I couldn’t find DDR) and what a fun workout it was! - wii fit: really cool experience! Really intense. I think I have more fun with DDR but wii fit feels like a real session at the gym - VR: best for immersion and feedback, you’re really somewhere else. I’ve only done beat saber, I feel like you tend to quickly understand how to do the less amount of movements to play, so it turns from a workout to a game after some hours. Curious about the other games tho
- zmmmmm 5y agoVR exercise was a bit of a revelation for me. Used to run 8km per day but lockdown convinced me to try exercise at home using VR and I fell in love with it. Apart from being fun (you're literally playing computer games), I got a much better workout, exercising parts of my body that running didn't touch. I actually started bulking up in my upper arms for the first time in my life. Really surprised me and sold me that this could be one of the real "killer apps" for VR if enough people knew about it.
- wingerlang 5y ago> I actually started bulking up in my upper arms for the first time in my life. Correct me if I am wrong, but there is no way VR will bulk up your arms in a way that a simple dumbbell won't do better in 5-15 minutes per day, right? > exercising parts of my body that running didn't touch Similarly, running will exercise parts of your body that VR won't touch right?
- Lewton 5y ago> there is no way VR will bulk up your arms in a way that a simple dumbbell won't do better in 5-15 minutes per day, right? Right, targeted exercise will bulk you up more > running will exercise parts of your body that VR won't touch right? What? No Which muscles do you think you use while running that you don’t use jumping around in vr?
- littlecranky67 5y ago> no way VR will bulk up your arms in a way that a simple dumbbell won't do better in 5-15 minutes per day True, but you underestimate the most important thing when working out: consistency - doing it regularly over long periods of time. VR/AR trainings will take off in the future, as the "gamification" (read: instant gratification) will help motivate people to stick with a workout routine and achieve that consistency.
- wingerlang 5y agoI don't think I underestimate it, just in case someone is coming here and thinking that VR is a good way to bulk up their arms, I'm just saying that it won't compare to even the minimum of using dumbbells.
- aaronbrethorst 5y ago“Tiny Habit” TIL. I’ve been doing this forever, but it’s kind of nice to have a zeitgeisty label to slap on the activity. For example, I’ve been doing somewhere between 5 minutes and 60 minutes of yoga every day for about a year now. Some days it’s more, other days (or weeks) it’s less. But I’ve found that needing to do something with no minimum standard every day keeps it top of mind, but never stressful. And it helps that even five minutes of stretching after sitting in front of a computer all day does help to keep me from feeling terrible. Also, my wife and I have gotten really into doing Apple Fitness+ strength training videos together. It requires an Apple Watch because Apple, but no weird VR headset. I’m sure you could find any number of comparable videos on YouTube. I don’t think you need to buy a thing to start feeling healthier.
- WalterBright 5y agoGeez, go outside for a run. Get some fresh air, smell the rain, say hi to the neighbors, watch houses being built, get chased by a dog, check the Little Library for something interesting, swallow a bug, see if anyone has a cool car in their garage.
- metahost 5y ago100% this. After spending the entire day in front of screens going out for a workout run is such a refresher. However, to each their own.
- Nevermark 5y agoGoing on a walk works for my mind, I can think really well walking or hiking. But more intense exercise without a novel mental aspect (i.e. a game) interferes with my ability to think hard and I find myself constantly frustrated and/or bored. Now if I could go on physical exhausting, mentally entertaining, medieval quests in the real countryside that would be great. Maybe sunshine, Vitamin D and augmented reality are waiting in my future.
- caslon 5y agoCounterpoint: No. VR is great. You don't have to spike your risk of skin cancer, you don't have to deal with allergies, you don't have to run along a road that constantly has drunken teenagers crashing into mailboxes, there are no mosquitos that will make your life miserable, and you can play with friends, regardless of the fact that they're traveling, or live elsewhere. You don't have to deal with motion sickness as you're driving to a more interesting location, and you don't have to comply to the schedule of your immediate environment. But none of that is quite as important as what really matters: The real world is boring. If the parts accessible to everyone were half as interesting as a world defined in silicon, people wouldn't strap an LCD screen onto their face and spend all day in it. $300 for a device that you can do your work in, watch movies with friends in, play pretty intensive, full-motion e-sports in, meet new people every single night without having to pay a cover fee in, and program your own world around your preferences in is a hell of a deal. These things are popular because the real world sucks in comparison for 80% of the population. Not everyone's a dotcom bubble millionaire, not everyone attends any university, let alone a good one, not everyone lives in the suburbs or in an urban environment. It's more fun to see someone stand up on a virtual stage and give a presentation to eighty people on something that wouldn't be significant in real life, like a mainline Linux kernel running in a written-for-this-talk RISC-V emulator inside of a pixel shader inside of the video game you're currently standing in's virtual world[1] than it ever could be to watch birds. I have one of the best views imaginable in real life, with as much land as a person could want to mess around with vehicles, run, or make impromptu sleds to see how fast you can go down a steep hill without toppling, and it doesn't hold a candle to VR. Most of my hours spent outside now are based in running with my pet or walking through the woods, because there's no point in going outside every day for its own sake. If it weren't for my pet, I probably wouldn't spend more than an hour outside every day. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2u7NOpzcBQ&t=5054s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2u7NOpzcBQ&t=5054s
- Nevermark 5y agoI wear a 20 lbs weight vest, 3.5 lbs wrist weights and 5 lbs ankle weights at all times when using my Oculus Quest 2. The point of always wearing them, even for low intensity use, is I never have to motivate myself to put on extra weight - and I strongly associate the weighted feeling, and the endorphins I get from them, with having fun. This is how our bodies evolved to live ... or it should have been, lol.
- notefaker 5y agoJust be careful with vest, wrist, and ankle weights. They’re great for static exercises, think leg lifts or arm raises, but can wreck your ankles, wrists, and back while doing any sort of cardio, even walking: https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/wearable-weights-how-they-can-help-or-hurt https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/wearable-weig...
- AndrewSChapman 5y agoJust wanted to add that Eleven (VR table tennis) is absolutely brilliant for exercise. After an hour of eTT and you will be sweating and have increased your step count a lot. Moreover, the better you get at it, the more energy you can put into it. * If you're wanting to have some change of skill transference into real world table tennis, get an adapter for your dominant hand paddle so your bat has the right weight, position and feel. Also, never forget that the table isn't real.
- krajzeg 5y agoSeconded! I do an hour of it every day and it's had way more staying power for me than Beat Saber due to the competitive aspect of climbing up the rankings.
- tifadg1 5y agoWhat do you find about VR in fitness context that's helping you stay committed for longer periods of time? Presumably it's the follow-along concept, but you don't need VR for that.
- westoncb 5y agoInstead of being "follow-along" it's interactive. You have goals, can compete with others, explore, etc. just like in ordinary games.
- zfnmxt 5y agoVR exercise is a remarkably poor allocation of time (if your interest is physical fitness, efficiently). It also leaves out the most important adaptation of all: strength. Effective training (not exercising) requires a progression model. That is, on some time frame you must exceed your performance at the end of that time frame when compared to the beginning of the time frame. This must be done in some measurable way--trying "harder" is ineffective. For example, if you squatted 120 kg x 5 two days ago, today you need to squat 122.5 kg x 5. VR cannot support such a progression model because it is incapable of producing a sufficiently intense stimulus (obviously for strength, but also for cardiovascular fitness) to result in continued adaptations; i.e., you cannot effectively scale the stress to produce meaningful adaptations after an initial period of adaptations. I'm sure if the author of the post continues for another 80 days, you'll see progress mostly stall. At any rate, the bigger issue is that the most important component of fitness--strength--is left out entirely. Strength is extremely correlated with decreased morbidity/mortality but, perhaps more tangibly, becoming strong results in vast, systemic changes to your body and (especially if you're older or extremely unfit already) similarly vast improvements to your quality of life. You are a physical entity and the way you interact with your environment is expressed through forces; the degree to which you can produce such forces is strength. We all depend on strength. As anyone who is strong will tell you, being strong is a far superior state to being weak. If you only "exercise" or just go for runs or only do VR exercise, you are weak. (Effective) strength training trains your entire body. Your bones, your nervous system, your balance, and yes, even cardiovascular fitness. You can become very strong lifting just 3x a week for one hour each time. Throw in some HIIT (which takes 15 minutes and results in better cardiovascular fitness than VR exercise because it has a progression model and is sufficiently intense to result in sufficient stress to evoke an adaptation) on a rest day and you have a far, far more effective recipe for general fitness with significantly less time spent. All other factors being equal, the man who can squat 400 lbs will always be fitter than the man who plays VR for 45 minutes every day--and the former can do it with a smaller time investment. For any naysayers arguing that strength training isn't fun (like VR is): it is fun. You're playing Pokemon, just leveling up IRL instead of your Clefairy. The progression model I explained above makes it fun.
- hombre_fatal 5y ago
- Simon_O_Rourke 5y ago> I wake up at 5:30, and do some deep work; at 7:15 an alarm goes off, which reminds me to fire up my Oculus Quest and start my VR workout. Not being bad about it, but if you find a gym that's open at 5:30 it's going to be pretty empty, that's if COVID worries are keeping the OP out of these environments. > I clear out my workout space and make sure my cats aren't in the main play area. No wife and kids huh? I don't think it's going to scale to having a couple of toddlers running about when you're plugged in and jumping about the place blindly.
- paperpunk 5y agoThe author does say they have a wife. But I know what you mean – I took my Quest to my sister's over Christmas and there were many near-misses with a two-year old not understanding the adult is not playing with them. If I had young kids I would probably want to put a lock on the door for when I'm going to use it.
- seanmcdirmid 5y agoI tried doing VR with my toddler around once. Now whenever he sees me with it on he thinks I’m going to accidentally bop him. Definitely not toddler friendly, you need the kid at daycare or with your partner and the room needs to be locked so they don’t wander in.
- stewbrew 5y ago"I wake up at 5:30, and do some deep work; at 7:15 an alarm goes off, which reminds me to fire up my Oculus Quest and start my VR workout." So in VR, you don't have family?
- noneeeed 5y agoIt's interesting to see all the same conversations happening around VR exercise as there was about Wii Fit. And it's the same split, those who find it useful for consistently doing light exercise, and those who criticise it because it isn't as effective as lifting weights or some "proper" gym/fitness routine
- periphrasis 5y agoA few subjective observations that may be totally wrong when applied to others despite their normative tone: * VR makes me sweaty… because it induces minor vertigo. * Anything which requires intense, complete focus to do right is never boring. Exercise, both strength and cardio, requires this level of focus. * Exercise is essential to physical and mental well-being, especially as you age. The difference between having plenty of energy throughout the day and fighting through deep fatigue is profound. With exercise you are sharpening the tool that is your body, for both physical and intellectual output, and time spent keeping your tools sharp is never wasted. * Exercise is a skill that supports measurable progressive mastery. If gamification helps your motivation, then the advent of smart watches and fitness trackers makes it extremely easy to watch your “stats” go up. * Exercise and sports provides a venue to meet new people, which as you get older only gets harder and harder. You may think you are an introvert and dislike being around others, but that likely points to unresolved social anxiety. You’re a human: you evolved to be a social animal. You may indeed need less socialization time and fewer friends than more gregarious humans, but you do need it. The extent to which you are introverted only emphasizes the importance of finding opportunities to make new acquaintances and friends because introversion has probably left you with fewer than you need. Exercise and sports is a great such opportunity. * Exercise is fun. It taps into a very animal sense of conquest, and the joy of pure physical sensation. I’ve been doing a lot of road cycling lately following a running injury that I’m still recovering from, and the exhilaration of speed, of instinctively responding to possibly dangerous surprises, and of pushing your legs and your lungs to go ever faster is joyful. Even overcoming the misery of winter cycling weather becomes it’s own source of accomplishment: “I pushed through sub freezing temperatures and a brutal headwind today. I am strong and resilient.”
- JoeDaDude 5y agoI am reminded of the quote attributed to Socrates: "No man has the right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. It is a shame for a man to grow old without seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable." As the proverbial 90 lb weakling who never did anything athletic, I can attest that once I started, I was amazed at what my body was capable of. To be fair, we should also understand the context of the quote, which is that Socrates advocates physical strength and training so men could be useful to the states [1]. [1]. https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/5hcclh/did_socrates_even_lift/ https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/5hcclh/did_s...
- alexknowshtml 5y agoI'm 38. Never had a workout or fitness routine in my entire life except for a few brief and unsustained periods of working with a trainer, but quit. Last May I bought a Quest 2 specifically to try Supernatural, a mix of Beatsabre with a Pelaton-style experience with pre-recorded song-driven sessions. I did one 5 song session (20 mins or so) and for the first time in my life I was dripping with sweat and thought to myself "that was fun as hell, I want to do another one." That want did not fade. I haven't missed a day since May 5th of 2021. I go harder some days than other. I take my Quest on vacation and do at least one session. I focus on closing rings on my Apple watch. I have become more mindful of my eating too. I was also surprised that with Supernatural specifically, the inclusion of a game mechanic that translates to squats and lunges means has translated to pretty significant increase in strength as well, even though it's "just" body weight exercises. I was skeptical about the additon of Boxing to Supernatural, but it's become my fav mode. I get to a target heart rate faster, and I've seen significant changes in my body since adding it. Over the last 12 months I've lost almost 60lbs, feel better, am stronger, and enjoy the process. I'm headed towards a weight I haven't been since college, and it's clearly within reach. This never happened before VR in spite of time and money spent on professional services, products, and trainers. I'm adding a Tempo Move for some weight training, but I don't expect to give up Supernatural anytime soon, if ever!
- xarez 5y agoThis is amazing to read. When people are looking for advice on what to do to be more healthy they're usually pointed towards routines or habits of exercise. In truth I feel like the best way is finding something you have fun with, routine comes in pretty easily after.
- alexknowshtml 5y agoThank you! I’d add kudos to the Apple Watch, which I bought a few months before the quest. I never thought of myself as a “don’t break the chain” habit person but the watch proved me wrong!
- vlunkr 5y agoWho would have thought video games would get people to excercise! That's really cool, I wasn't sure VR would stick around this time, but it seems like it's found some good niches
- sdf323 5y ago
- nutate 5y agoVR seems great for folks, but you're putting your eyes' ciliary muscles into a cast and then working the rest of you out. Few activities put your eyes at a fixed 1.3m focal distance for the entire time.
- ricardobeat 5y ago75% of people work on a computer every day, for hours at a time. Those extra hours are unlikely to do any more damage…
- umutisik 5y agoExercise is the killer app for VR. If they figure out full body tracking too, they will give (and capture) a ton of value.
- blensor 5y agoWe've added rudimentary foot tracking to our fitness game ( https://youtu.be/ZBdYOnZ35Lk https://youtu.be/ZBdYOnZ35Lk ) and are working with SlimeVR to get full body tracking into our game ( which will be an important aspect ) but it will still take VR some time before that becomes a smooth experience that's available everywhere
- formvoltron 5y agoOn the subject of knee pain. I'm 48, have never really jogged consistently. I bought a treadmill for a treadmill desk. At first walking was a bit painful when walking more than an hour a day. Now, after a couple months, I not longer have pain when walking even a few hours. In fact, it feels better to walk than to stand. And now walking doesn't create knee or leg pain, I am starting to jog. At first once every 2 or 3 days. Now about nearly every day for 20-30 minutes. Though if I feel worn out, I'll skip a day to avoid any injuries. i try to jog outside, but when it's too cold, i jog inside on the treadmill, while watching queued youtube vids.
- darthShadow 5y agoAs someone who is deciding whether to splurge on a Quest 2 for exercising, how good is it without a computer system to link with? Also, is there any step that requires a computer system like the initial setup etc.? Any recommendations for initial games to try and guides for getting the optimal adjustment are also appreciated.
- obscuren 5y agoYou do not need a computer for the setup. You’ll need your mobile phone instead. You may, if you wish, hook up the Q2 to a a PC to play steamVR and Oculus Games. The oculus quest 2 has a separate store (in VR) in which you purchase new games.
- darthShadow 5y agoPerfect, thanks. Any first game recommendations btw?
- david_allison 5y ago* Beat Saber * Until You Fall * In Death: Unchained (not good for fitness) * Thrill Of The Fight
- crocwrestler 5y agoI'm usually pretty sedentary, generally don't have the best diet and haven't looked after myself so well. VR exercise has been a real gamechanger for me, well worth the cost of the VR system alone. I exercise every day, and look forward to it, I really enjoy it. I feel a lot more energy in my day to day life and feel just generally great. My focus and general emotional health is a lot better, and I also see some benefits with creativity. So yes, it may just be light cardio or whatnot, not the same as a gym workout, but I don't see myself doing a gym workout so regularly or having such fun.
- potato5567 5y ago