6 ms·

When I'm standing on a corner somewhere and I can use GPS, live traffic data, restaurant reviews and simultaneously make call to someone, at that moment I don't

When I'm standing on a corner somewhere and I can use GPS, live traffic data, restaurant reviews and simultaneously make call to someone, at that moment I don't think about my beloved PC at home, sorry. You can always use a burner phone with a fake identity if you want to stick it to the man.

xtanx 5y ago
> You can always use a burner phone with a fake identity if you want to stick it to the man. You cannot do that everywhere (legally). For example in Greece you are required to give your id to the network provider or they block your sim card.
r3trohack3r 5y ago
> You can always use a burner phone with a fake identity if you want to stick it to the man. For the uninformed, living in the U.S., how do I get a burner phone that isn’t associated with my identity? I’ve looked in the past, it’s been a few years admittedly, but it seemed non-trivial.
- AlwaysRock 5y ago
  You can buy one with cash at most corner stores.
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago
  Getting the phone is easy, just pay cash. Getting the SIM is a bit more tricky, and might involve someone in a dark alley.
- RandallBrown 5y ago
  Walk in to a convenience store and buy a prepaid phone with cash.
  - ape4 5y ago
    And now its ok to wear a mask while doing that.
- paxys 5y ago
  USA is probably the only country in the world where you can still buy a cellphone/smartphone with a working number somewhat anonymously. Walk into any convenience store/gas station and buy a cheap phone with a prepaid plan and pay cash. In most other countries they are required to verify and scan some official ID first.
  - selfhoster11 5y ago
    US is far from the only place where this is possible. It's entirely possible to use cash to purchase a used unlocked smartphone plus a prepaid SIM card here in the UK.
    - eptcyka 5y ago
      I don't think I've seen a non-CCTV'd store that sells those in years.
      - dragonwriter 5y ago
        I don't think I’ve seen a non-CCTV’d store in the US for years, especially not a convenience store/gas station, so that's not a difference.
        zdragnar 5y ago
        You might be surprised at the number of cameras that are fake, or not actually recording. It largely depends on whether the business has insurance and if the local police actually investigate petty theft.
        dragonwriter 5y ago
        Convenience stores and gas stations in the US are frequent targets of armed robbery, which is what the security is for, not petty theft. (There may be some that count on camera shells as a deterrent rather than having live cameras, but if so it has nothing to do with whether the police investigate petty theft.)
- inportb 5y ago
  You could use the likes of Tracfone, Total Wireless, or Simple Mobile... but you'd have to provide some identity (whatever you want).
- grishka 5y ago
  As foreigner who traveled to the US a couple of times: how do you get a phone number that is associated with your identity in the US? I recall only needing $60 and a compatible phone to put the sim card into.
  - astura 5y ago
    >how do you get a phone number that is associated with your identity in the US? If you sign up for a post-paid cell phone plan. That comes with a credit check an the option to finance your phone.
- bell-cot 5y ago
  > ...how do I get a burner phone that isn’t associated with my identity? What adversary are you worried about? Taking to a divorce lawyer without your spouse knowing? Not having higher-skill cybercriminals bypass your SMS-based 2FA via SIM-swap? Outsmarting the NSA? The answer really depends...
- Damogran6 5y ago
  Tracfone paid using cash from a Walmart...but even then, it's not like you're not being observed at checkout.
- astura 5y ago
  Walk into any Walmart and buy a TracFone. It's about as trivial as can be. This is what I used to do back when I was poor and couldn't afford a cell phone plan. It was pre-smartphone, but I see data included on the prepaid "minutes" now. Before cell phones I used to buy minutes on calling cards[1] at Walmart in order to call long distance. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_card https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_card
HWR_14 5y ago
Can I just say "phone calls" are something that dumb phones can do. GPS and live traffic data are, essentially, the same service in that they fill the same need. Restaurant reviews? Who actually needs those except maybe on a road trip? And then it really seems like a GPS-style feature. It seems like the phone as GPS+ is use-case you identified. I will say though, even dumb phones have web browsers, and have for a long time. You can access Yelp over the internet on a candybar from a decade ago.
- mdoms 5y ago
  > GPS and live traffic data are, essentially, the same service in that they fill the same need What? > Restaurant reviews? Who actually needs those except maybe on a road trip? Anyone who likes to visit new restaurants.
  - HWR_14 5y ago
    GPS and live traffic data are both "route me to X". I don't think people really have another use case for either, although in some cases the "route me to X" may include "X is a close gas station" or "best route is to wait 45 minutes before leaving". Do people really choose new restaurants while out (unless on a road trip)? I can see using Yelp while planning to go somewhere with friends, but once you're actually outside the house? In other words, I don't see a use case for Yelp outside the computer, with the exception of a road trip.
    - mdoms 5y ago
      > GPS and live traffic data are both "route me to X". I don't think people really have another use case for either, although in some cases the "route me to X" may include "X is a close gas station" or "best route is to wait 45 minutes before leaving". None of this is true. > Do people really choose new restaurants while out (unless on a road trip)? Yes, very often. Maybe I'm at the pub with my partner and we decide to get dinner somewhere. I'll use reviews to find something. It's a very very common use case.
      - 5y ago
xdennis 5y ago
I don't think he's saying you shouldn't be able to use maps and call people. The problem is that we've gotten used to devices which turn us almost exclusively into consumers instead of using computing devices more as Douglas Engelbart envisioned them: human intellect force-multipliers. Part of the problem with phones is intentional (massive centralization), but some can't be helped (input capabilities are very limited on a phone). We should probably be part of the solution.

xtanx 5y ago

> You can always use a burner phone with a fake identity if you want to stick it to the man. You cannot do that everywhere (legally). For example in Greece you are required to give your id to the network provider or they block your sim card.

r3trohack3r 5y ago

> You can always use a burner phone with a fake identity if you want to stick it to the man. For the uninformed, living in the U.S., how do I get a burner phone that isn’t associated with my identity? I’ve looked in the past, it’s been a few years admittedly, but it seemed non-trivial.

AlwaysRock 5y ago
You can buy one with cash at most corner stores.
seanmcdirmid 5y ago
Getting the phone is easy, just pay cash. Getting the SIM is a bit more tricky, and might involve someone in a dark alley.
RandallBrown 5y ago
Walk in to a convenience store and buy a prepaid phone with cash.
- ape4 5y ago
  And now its ok to wear a mask while doing that.
paxys 5y ago
USA is probably the only country in the world where you can still buy a cellphone/smartphone with a working number somewhat anonymously. Walk into any convenience store/gas station and buy a cheap phone with a prepaid plan and pay cash. In most other countries they are required to verify and scan some official ID first.
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  US is far from the only place where this is possible. It's entirely possible to use cash to purchase a used unlocked smartphone plus a prepaid SIM card here in the UK.
  - eptcyka 5y ago
    I don't think I've seen a non-CCTV'd store that sells those in years.
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      I don't think I’ve seen a non-CCTV’d store in the US for years, especially not a convenience store/gas station, so that's not a difference.
      - zdragnar 5y ago
        You might be surprised at the number of cameras that are fake, or not actually recording. It largely depends on whether the business has insurance and if the local police actually investigate petty theft.
        dragonwriter 5y ago
        Convenience stores and gas stations in the US are frequent targets of armed robbery, which is what the security is for, not petty theft. (There may be some that count on camera shells as a deterrent rather than having live cameras, but if so it has nothing to do with whether the police investigate petty theft.)
inportb 5y ago
You could use the likes of Tracfone, Total Wireless, or Simple Mobile... but you'd have to provide some identity (whatever you want).
grishka 5y ago
As foreigner who traveled to the US a couple of times: how do you get a phone number that is associated with your identity in the US? I recall only needing $60 and a compatible phone to put the sim card into.
- astura 5y ago
  >how do you get a phone number that is associated with your identity in the US? If you sign up for a post-paid cell phone plan. That comes with a credit check an the option to finance your phone.
bell-cot 5y ago
> ...how do I get a burner phone that isn’t associated with my identity? What adversary are you worried about? Taking to a divorce lawyer without your spouse knowing? Not having higher-skill cybercriminals bypass your SMS-based 2FA via SIM-swap? Outsmarting the NSA? The answer really depends...
Damogran6 5y ago
Tracfone paid using cash from a Walmart...but even then, it's not like you're not being observed at checkout.
astura 5y ago
Walk into any Walmart and buy a TracFone. It's about as trivial as can be. This is what I used to do back when I was poor and couldn't afford a cell phone plan. It was pre-smartphone, but I see data included on the prepaid "minutes" now. Before cell phones I used to buy minutes on calling cards[1] at Walmart in order to call long distance. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_card https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_card

HWR_14 5y ago

Can I just say "phone calls" are something that dumb phones can do. GPS and live traffic data are, essentially, the same service in that they fill the same need. Restaurant reviews? Who actually needs those except maybe on a road trip? And then it really seems like a GPS-style feature. It seems like the phone as GPS+ is use-case you identified. I will say though, even dumb phones have web browsers, and have for a long time. You can access Yelp over the internet on a candybar from a decade ago.

mdoms 5y ago
> GPS and live traffic data are, essentially, the same service in that they fill the same need What? > Restaurant reviews? Who actually needs those except maybe on a road trip? Anyone who likes to visit new restaurants.
- HWR_14 5y ago
  GPS and live traffic data are both "route me to X". I don't think people really have another use case for either, although in some cases the "route me to X" may include "X is a close gas station" or "best route is to wait 45 minutes before leaving". Do people really choose new restaurants while out (unless on a road trip)? I can see using Yelp while planning to go somewhere with friends, but once you're actually outside the house? In other words, I don't see a use case for Yelp outside the computer, with the exception of a road trip.
  - mdoms 5y ago
    > GPS and live traffic data are both "route me to X". I don't think people really have another use case for either, although in some cases the "route me to X" may include "X is a close gas station" or "best route is to wait 45 minutes before leaving". None of this is true. > Do people really choose new restaurants while out (unless on a road trip)? Yes, very often. Maybe I'm at the pub with my partner and we decide to get dinner somewhere. I'll use reviews to find something. It's a very very common use case.
    - 5y ago

xdennis 5y ago

I don't think he's saying you shouldn't be able to use maps and call people. The problem is that we've gotten used to devices which turn us almost exclusively into consumers instead of using computing devices more as Douglas Engelbart envisioned them: human intellect force-multipliers. Part of the problem with phones is intentional (massive centralization), but some can't be helped (input capabilities are very limited on a phone). We should probably be part of the solution.