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Alaska's one-house town, home to hundreds (2015)
- beardog 5y agoThe tower is governed by a condominium association, so essentially everyone in this town has to follow private contract law as opposed to government ordinances. Here's their rules https://begichtowers.com/uploads/3/4/0/4/34048295/house_rules_2011.pdf https://begichtowers.com/uploads/3/4/0/4/34048295/house_rule...
- beardog 5y agoThey do have a mayor and city council too, but I imagine the tower association has just as much if not more impact on day to day life
- renewiltord 5y agoWhat an absolute nightmare of rules haha. Jesus Christ, what a miserable existence.
- i80and 5y agoI don't see anything particularly out of line with regular apartment rules in my experience. The only thing I can see is the quiet hours do start a little early; 11pm is more common than 10pm.
- datameta 5y agoYeah I'm generally not taken aback much, sounds about in line with a large NYC apartment. The one thing I can't live with is no roof access when there is such an elevated expansive view.
- syshum 5y agoTo many of us a large NYC Apartment also sounds like a nightmare... For me when I bought my house the number 1 rule, unbreakable that I gave my realtor was absolutely, under no circumstances how me a house with a HOA...
- gizmo686 5y agoThese people didn't buy a house, they bought a portion of a larger building. That entire premise is utterly unworkable without some organization managing the larger structure. Most of the rules in the above document relate to usage of the shared portions of the building, not the specific condo that the person owns.
- FredPret 5y agoApartment rules are necessary but not to everyone’s taste
- adventured 5y agoPeople on here that are unfamiliar with rigid quiet hours, allow me to introduce you to how Germany does things (Ruhezeit) - https://blog.lingoda.com/en/what-is-ruhezeit-in-germany/ https://blog.lingoda.com/en/what-is-ruhezeit-in-germany/
- majewsky 5y agoAnother German here. I'm legitimately surprised by this article saying that the entirety of Sunday is considered Ruhezeit. It's true that most stores are closed on Sunday, but I've done plenty of vacuuming and laundry on Sundays and never had anyone complain. Just to be sure, I just checked the house rules attached to my lease contract, and they define Ruhezeiten as Mon-Fri 13-15, 22-6 and Sat-Sun 13-15, 22-8. This is in East Germany, maybe the entire Sunday thing is a West German thing?
- Moru 5y agoI was helping my mother in law mow the lawn a sunday afternoon, just like swedish people does it. Turns out that is a nono. West Germany.
- ajmurmann 5y agoI remember not being allowed to mow the lawn on Sundays. Nobody would call the cops on you, but your neighbors sure wouldn't like it.
- Laforet 5y agoWhy 13-15? Is siesta a thing in Germany too?
- noneeeed 5y agoI kind of miss when the UK had much stricter Sunday trading laws. I'm not religious, but there was something kind of nice about having at least a part of the week when pretty much everyone was off work, and most things were closed. Of course it was also a massive pain in the backside if you needed something and the shop was shut.
- 5y ago
- jader201 5y ago> The only thing I can see is the quiet hours do start a little early; 11pm is more common than 10pm. If we lived there, my wife would appreciate 10pm vs. 11pm being quiet hours, as she's often in bed well before 11pm.
- pc86 5y agoOk
- datameta 5y agoLooks like some of the few newer rules are from 2007 which is when the railroad tunnel became also accessible to vehicles. PR move for visitors, it seems.
- KennyBlanken 5y agoMost of the rules struck me as being driven by necessity because a few eccentric assholes. Example: > The tops of the elevators shall not be used to move any materials Imagine the very deep sighs from the board when they had to institute that rule because some asshole was tripping maintenance mode on the elevator and using the top to move stuff for some reason...and when told not to, shouted "IT'S NOT AGAINST THEM ROOLS!" The rule about kids not playing with toys in hallways seems a bit authoritarian but was probably prompted by parents not sufficiently supervising their kids and toys getting left around and stepped/tripped on. The rules regarding entering an apartment are a bit more protective than in my state; a landlord has to provide notice (but only if not an emergency) and certainly doesn't have to leave a note, nor have a third party present, nor maintain a log. The biggest thing I see a problem with are the laundry room policies which seem like how they leverage control (ten days, in Alaska, to get a washer/dryer if you get a laundry room? Come on) and their excessive impound fees. Fifty bucks if you leave your gear in the wrong place at the wrong time of year? Fifty bucks if you don't return a cart within thirty minutes of using it? Fifty bucks if you leave your car in the loading dock longer than 30 minutes after unloading it? Basically violating any rule is "at least" fifty bucks. If you do it again, the fine doubles. It sounds like the fine doubles indefinitely, too. I did laugh at the "Horizontal Properties Regime Act". That is some straight-up dystopian-sounding bullshit.
- throwaway0a5e 5y agoThe problem with all this "driven by necessity" crap is that if you let it run its course it turns into an authoritarian dump. At some point you need to put down your foot and say "common resources can be used by everyone even in uncommon ways"
- haroldp 5y ago> The rule about kids not playing with toys in hallways seems a bit authoritarian but was probably prompted by parents not sufficiently supervising their kids and toys getting left around and stepped/tripped on. When I was a little kid growing up in Whittier, my neighbor across the hall would come out and scream and threaten us for playing there. He'd yell, "You don't live on this floor!" to my friends. It was winter outside, and dark and snowy, so there was really no other common area we could play in. I remember getting a big slot-car race track for xmas and setting it up in the common laundry room so we could play without getting in trouble.
- standardUser 5y agoYou might be shocked at how unreasonably repressive a lot of standard condo and apartment rules can be. I worked in the industry and recall one building where every unit had a really nice balcony, but they were almost all empty and unused because the rules were so strict. But in practice, I think most of these types of rules are rarely if ever enforced.
- Gunnerhead 5y agoHaha, yup, that's what my previous condo was like in Toronto, Canada. Pretty much nothing allowed in the balcony, no flags, furniture, bikes, etc.
- MithrilTuxedo 5y agoMakes me think of the Mayflower Compact.
- dmoy 5y ago> If you do drip water or fish slime in the building, you must immediately clean up after yourself or call maintenance for assistance. (Adopted April 13, 2007) I wanna know what on earth happened in March 2007 lol
- konschubert 5y agoSomeone slipped?
- moralestapia 5y ago"Oh yes, of course, the great slime event of 2007 ..."
- kingcharles 5y agoFirst rule of Begich Towers is... we don't talk about March 2007...
- FalconSensei 5y agoThe article could really use a couple pictures of inside and outside the building.
- troupe 5y agoHere are some pictures from an apartment sold in 2021: https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/100-Kenai-St-510-511-Valdez-AK-99686/2067197876_zpid/ https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/100-Kenai-St-510-511-Vald...
- camtarn 5y agoHuh! It's a lot more colourful than I'd expected, given its origins as a military base. I guess that having something bright and colourful probably helps a lot in the grim weather.
- vmception 5y agodon't trust real estate agents.
- haroldp 5y agoI grew up in Whittier and those photos really take me back. Apartment 510 means fifth floor, north-east side. I was 905, ninth floor north west side, same layout, but mirrored. They have retained the original shitty steel kitchen cabinets and steel trimmed formica counters where my mom made all our meals, and baked bread and made wild blueberry jam, and all that.
- inetsee 5y agoThere's an NPR article with a nice picture at the top showing the Begnich Towers building, with a dry-docked boat in front of it. https://www.npr.org/2015/01/18/378162264/welcome-to-whittier-alaska-a-community-under-one-roof https://www.npr.org/2015/01/18/378162264/welcome-to-whittier...
- nickysielicki 5y agoIf you ever end up in Whittier, make sure you eat at Wild Catch Cafe.
- datameta 5y agoI have taken the tunnel mentioned in the article in 2011, I believe it was out of Whittier to Anchorage after arriving on a ferry from Seward. It's an interesting experience - single lane for what seemed like 5 minutes. Strangely, I don't remember the BTI building at all.
- KennyBlanken 5y agoIt's weird that they haven't come up with a better system other than "the tunnel changes directions every hour and shuts down at a certain hour, forcing people to sleep in their cars." In the boonies when they have to make a bridge one-way they put traffic lights at each end with radar presence sensors. Seems like the rule is serving as an unofficial (and frankly illegal) town "drawbridge" to keep the riff-raff out. Edit: to all the replies telling me how it couldn't possibly work because people will break the rules: which is also true of the current system? And gates are a thing, folks. So is automated enforcement? If it's a private tunnel, nothing stops the railroad from saying "if you ignore the traffic control system, we fine you $x. If you do it again, you're barred from using the tunnel for a month and have a fine of $x*2. If you do it again, you're barred from using the tunnel permanently." Watch how fast people follow the rules.
- adamhearn 5y agoThe tunnel is the only way, besides helicopter to get to Whittier besides the port. https://dot.alaska.gov/creg/whittiertunnel/faq.shtml https://dot.alaska.gov/creg/whittiertunnel/faq.shtml Why is Whittier so important to the Alaska Railroad? From an economic and geographic standpoint, Whittier represents the Alaska Railroad's only viable freight interchange point for its barge service connecting Alaska with the lower 48 states and Canada. Seward and Anchorage are not viable port alternatives for barge interline service. Anchorage is not free of ice year-round and Seward requires traveling over a mountain pass at a 3% grade (it would take six locomotives to haul a heavy load from Seward versus two from Whittier). Whittier is a year-round, ice-free, deep-water port. It is located only 50 miles from Anchorage and has slight grades for trains and engines. For these reasons, all the Alaska Railroad's railcars, locomotives, and rail-borne freight must enter and depart via Whittier.
- KennyBlanken 5y agoThat building sounds like a real-life version of the subterranean shelter in Wool, only...more Christian.
- TomAbel 5y agoWhats Wool?
- KennyBlanken 5y agoHugh Howley book about life inside a subterranean shelter, where the cardinal rule is "if you talk about going outside, you get your wish." You're given a piece of wool to clean the lens on the camera before you die. I enjoyed the first three books, but the "prequels", decidedly less so. YMMV.
- FalconSensei 5y agoFirst book in the Silo trilogy by Hugh Howey. I finished the 2nd book a couple weeks ago and so far, highly recommend - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silo_(series) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silo_(series)
- mistrial9 5y agoand Coober Pedy, Australia right?
- qnsi 5y agoI wonder what it does to people? Never leaving a building, not seeing sun for some people I speculate for days or weeks One of the important things everyone should do is see natural light (not through windows) in first hour after waking up.
- nickysielicki 5y agoThat’s not possible during large stretches of winter in Alaska regardless of what kind of building you live in.
- vidarh 5y agoGrowing up in Southern Norway, during winter it'd usually be pitch black when I got up, and I'd not only not see much natural light in the first hour after waking up, but it'd still be twilight until the first school lesson was underway. It might be nice, but it's not that important.
- SeanAnderson 5y agoWhy does observation through a window change anything?
- redweer 5y agothey heard it on a podcast
- solarmist 5y agoI don't think it applies at apartment windows, but I believe many sky scrapes would have UV treatments on their windows.
- mariebks 5y agoSunlight through a window is much less bright according to lumen meters than when you’re outside. We have neurons that wake you up more and directly respond to bright light early in the morning. (paraphrased, source from Huberman Lab podcast).
- wizzwizz4 5y ago
- Lamad123 5y agoHeaven!
- blamazon 5y agoI found this amusing: >"Thompson pays a hefty sum for her junk food and returns to school. She shows off an indoor hydroponic garden she started so the kids would appreciate fruits and vegetables more. The school acquired the equipment after the police busted a guy who was using it to grow pot in his BTI condo."
- Tronno 5y agoObviously we don't know the details of this bust, but it probably happened just before Alaska legalized posession of plants for personal use. The article was written in mid-2015, and legalization passed in February of that year. Whatever pointless, unjust penalty this person suffered, in addition to having their property seized, makes this story seem less than amusing. Maybe the words you're looking for are "tragic" or "dystopian"?
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- blamazon 5y agoMmm, wasn't aware of the timeline. My presumption was that the grow operation was only a problem because it was too close to a school, which is generally verboten even in legal states. My presumption being they reallocated the equipment and left the justice at that. I will retain my amusement at the reallocation but agree there may be a tragic or dystopian story we are not party to.
- haroldp 5y agoAlaska has had a crazy history with marijuana legalization. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis_in_Alaska https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis_in_Alaska
- baybal2 5y agoVery small by Chinese standard. What about living in a condo compound with 8000 flats? I think the biggest apartment complex in the country (and probably in the world) went as far as 20000 flats with 20 towers joined at stylobate.
- Scoundreller 5y agoDoes China have them as standalones with basically nothing otherwise nearby?
- baybal2 5y agoIf something like that built in a smaller town, it surely "sucks life out" of the rest of the neighbourhood as most of commerce migrates into a place with better deal for rent/revenue. There is a village called Sanmen in Zhejiang where the manufacturer of scooters I dealt with was located. It was a rather big village, turning into an industrial town. The moment they got a nuclear plant, a ton more of industry moved in there. A huge residential development with 40 highrise towers was built near the industrial park, and almost anybody of notable level of income in the village moved there, and all the commerce followed
- Riseed 5y ago> Whittier, including its hospital, school and city government, functions within one self-sufficient structure The story is not so much about a big building, but rather about an isolated town that exists inside only one building. Do these condo compounds with 8000 flats include the hospital, schools, city government, general store, post office, etc?
- baybal2 5y agoThe mall taking up to 4th storey is bigger than most malls you see in the US. Some GP mini-clinics are surely there.
- bootlooped 5y agoThere was a This American Life about it, centered around a family that moved there from American Samoa. https://www.thisamericanlife.org/555/transcript https://www.thisamericanlife.org/555/transcript
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- jader201 5y agoThis video interviews the teacher mentioned in the article (Erika Thompson) and shows shots of life in the building, which helps give you a much better idea of their daily lives. Before watching this, I had a much different impression of what the building looked like/how life was, from reading the article alone. https://youtu.be/naPguX84Amg https://youtu.be/naPguX84Amg EDIT: And an even more recent one (from 2021) with Erika, that covers more of the city itself, vs. more focus on the BTI building. (The video above is from 2013.) https://youtu.be/P0y4D5RJuXE https://youtu.be/P0y4D5RJuXE
- standardUser 5y agoThank you for this! It was exactly as I pictured it from the article. One tidbit not mentioned in the article is that the town is a tourist destination during the summer, which was the first thing that came to my mind when I looked on Google maps and saw a museum, lounge and seafood restaurant: https://www.google.com/maps/@60.7739931,-148.6857725,1497m/data=!3m1!1e3 https://www.google.com/maps/@60.7739931,-148.6857725,1497m/d...
- throwaway48375 5y ago
- danielvaughn 5y agoI went there in 2008, it was the first time I’d ever kayaked. I remember seeing the building in the distance, thinking it seemed like a fairly depressing place to live, even if the surrounding area is beautiful.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- peter303 5y agoWhittier is Anchorage's "port" where where cruise ships stop. There are shops inport. You can take day trips to Anchorage or overnight to Denali National Park. Whittier has other boats too forbwhale andbglacier tours, fishing, etc.
- kgin 5y agoPossibly a case study for future space settlements.
- every 5y agoReminds me of the Soviet Siberian "towns"...
- suzzer99 5y agoSeems like a ton of problems could be solved by just keeping the tunnel open an hour or so later. Maybe they don't want people driving drunk back from Anchorage. Force them to end their night early.
- judex 5y agoThis is normal e.g. in Hong Kong. I have met people who live like this there with everything in one huge building. Probably similar in many other asian cities - just guessing. Really interesting. Would you like to live like that?
- seanmcdirmid 5y agoI don't think that is very normal in HK. Ya, they have a lot of tall buildings, but people still go out to shop/eat/work (unless you mean...they never have to go outside because of the subway tunnels in Central HK?). Maybe when the Kowloon walled city was still around, but that is just an area that turned into a bunch of buildings that grew into each other.
- bobthepanda 5y agoRight, the interesting thing is that the people here literally do not have a choice. In non-pandemic times, HK people live like people in any other city; they usually don't work where they live, and often times they don't necessarily do all their shopping there either, because people like variety. (Although with how crazy the real estate was getting in Hong Kong, I remember each visit that it seemed like each mall was slowly turning into the same chains and whatnot in every one.)
- seanmcdirmid 5y ago> Although with how crazy the real estate was getting in Hong Kong, I remember each visit that it seemed like each mall was slowly turning into the same chains and whatnot in every one. That's just normal for the rest of China as well. HK still has much more retail diversity than say Shenzhen, but the gap is closing quickly.
- bobthepanda 5y agoYeah, I've not been to the mainland so I can't say much about that part. At least in HK it's particularly bad in the new town areas like Tsueng Kwan O and Ma On Shan, since there isn't really much traditional non-mall retail to begin with in those areas.
- bitwize 5y agoNeat. A prototype arcology.
- aussieguy1234 5y agoI'm curious if humans ever lived on another planet where they couldn't go outside because of a toxic atomosphere if it might look something like this. A whole town or city inside one structure.
- fortysixdegrees 5y agoWould be a good PhD subject, studying this place through that lens
- sangnoir 5y agoIf you are be interested in written-form scifi stories based on that idea, I strongly recommend Wool by Hugh Howey - the book series also goes by the same name,IIRC. A TV show based on the books is also in the works.
- haroldp 5y agoI grew up in Whittier and answered some questions about it in a previous HN thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8840005 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8840005
- craigching 5y agoI saw the post on CNN before seeing it here, remembered your thread, and went back and read it again. It was fun reading the first time around and I enjoyed it again!
- timonoko 5y agoYou cannot obviously anchor at Anchorage. Mud flats and tidal currents. Strange name then. And why do they not improve the tunnel, because Whittier is the best harbour near by. I tried to start kayaking from the Anc Airport, but some responsible citizens prevented it and told me to take a bus to Whittier. Probably saved my life.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]