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(Just my personal, anecdotal experience - I have strong family history of depression and anxiety on both sides of my family and it's something that's afflicted

(Just my personal, anecdotal experience - I have strong family history of depression and anxiety on both sides of my family and it's something that's afflicted me since I was a teenager.) I will be extremely hesitant to take antidepressants and anti-anxiety medications ever again after my last experience with them. For me, the medications helped by tempering all of my feelings - I no longer felt sad or anxious, instead I just felt mellow and apathetic about everything. And feeling apathy is an incredibly scary thing because I also no longer derived any joy from my hobbies, from sex, from exercise, etc. I could no longer feel sad but I could no longer feel happy, either. Even worse, I found myself engaging in behaviors I would never have engaged in otherwise, like compulsive lying. My moral code was compromised because I no longer felt the guilt and shame that normally inhibits unscrupulous behavior. I look back on that time now and I think about some of my actions and I feel nauseous. There is value to medications that inhibit or regulate serotonin, and every individual's experience will be slightly different based on their genetics and the circumstances of their life. However, for me, even though I benefited from them at various points in my life (especially as a teenager), as an adult now I'm much more likely to depend on coping strategies I've learned through therapy than medication when it comes to dealing with my mood.

dave_sullivan 5y ago
Not sure if you ever tried a DSRI but it could be your serotonin levels are fine but your dopamine levels are out of whack. SSRIs are just one class of drug. Speaking from a history of anxiety and depression, the wrong drugs were not helpful, but the right drugs opened up a whole new version of self. In my case, that was buproprion.
- qwertyuiop_ 5y ago
  Do these work for panic attacks ? I think anxiety and depression are related. I was prescribed SSRI for anxiety.
  - mattgreenrocks 5y ago
    > I think anxiety and depression are related. I was prescribed SSRI for anxiety. They often accompany one another. I've had panic attacks in the past, and was diagnosed with generalized anxiety disorder. I can't claim that bupropion fixes panic attacks proper, and I'm not a doctor, but it does help me with my depression. (I haven't had a panic attack in a long time.) It's not a silver bullet; you can still find yourself in mentally stuck states, the difference is the physical side of things seems to be 'gated' at the low end so that your spiraling down isn't as deep as it is before. There's still a lot of work to do to recognize + slow that descent, but it is a tool to help with that.
  - heavyset_go 5y ago
    Mirtazapine can help with depression, anxiety and panic, and it isn't an SSRI. There are also newer drugs that are marketed as SMS drugs instead of SSRIs, like vilazodone and vortioxetine. Buspirone binds to 5HT1A directly, instead of inhibiting the serotonin transporter like other drugs. Wellbutrin and NDRIs typically aren't that great for anxiety, but they can help.
- mattgreenrocks 5y ago
  Same situation as you. SSRIs seemed mostly ineffective, or sometimes had crazy side effects (will never forget Effexor-induced zaps despite tapering off following the directions to the letter). Bupropion has been fantastic for me since I started and I wished I'd found it 20 years ago.
  - wincy 5y ago
    That’s great! Bupropion caused a psychotic episode for me maybe ten years ago. Most terrifying day of my life, when the razor blades were calling out to me telling me to cut myself. To be clear, I’ve never had anything like that happen before or since. My daughter spent 9 months in the NICU and got genetic testing for various drugs, with 1 being the baseline expected (I’m going off memory here) and 9 or 10 being “wtf this is super weird”. She got a 9 for bupropion. I’m assuming she got that from her father.
    - tablespoon 5y ago
      > My daughter spent 9 months in the NICU and got genetic testing for various drugs, with 1 being the baseline expected (I’m going off memory here) and 9 or 10 being “wtf this is super weird”. She got a 9 for bupropion. I've never heard of that. Why would they be testing an infant for their reaction to an antidepressant drug? Just curious.
      - heavyset_go 5y ago
        The genetic tests use genotypes to make statistical inferences about efficacy and metabolism for certain drugs. Wellbutrin is a common medicine, and the testing company probably had it as part of their panel.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
      Wow, sorry. Bupropion is an SNRI, not SSRI. SSRIs are 'dangerous' IMHO, except for the special cases mention here (suicide ideation, extreme non-functioning). I would have hoped clinicians would start at the lowest possible dose, and titrate up. I've certainly heard of the "you need about xx mg, use this dose" first doses, tho. To me, this is Yet Another reason one should never receive medical advice alone, especially when thinking is impaired. That trusted friend / partner needs to ask the hard questions of the prescribing clinician; but rules make any 3rd party except spouse difficult for adults.
- plutonorm 5y ago
  Not available in the UK because reasons.
  - mxmilkiib 5y ago
    Not available directly from a GP, but if one gets referred to a clinical psychiatrist they can permit a prescription.
    - plutonorm 5y ago
      True. But it won't be easy. You will mostly likely be put on combination therapies first. Then onto combo SSRIs and Antipsychotics, then maybe you might get something that ups dopamine, maybe. If you look a bit bipolar though you'd likely go onto a mood stabiliser (i.e. calm the f down you over-active neurons, have some more gabba/ block those calcium channels etc). and personally that's what worked best for me, over active mind induced perpetual exhaustion -> anhedonia from the stress of a mind that never stops.
Jerrrry 5y ago
Similar thoughts. I think SSRI's are the wrong direction. Acute drug experiences with therapy and behavioral modification are the future. do some molly and ketamine and have a good talk.
- KittenInABox 5y ago
  Caveat: If you have dissociative symptoms, are prone to anxiety, have a family history of psychosis or have a psychosis in your symptom profile, seriously reconsider the above advice.
- astrange 5y ago
  If you don't want to mess with serotonin don't go take MDMA…
- nobodyofnote 5y ago
  As someone who has done both on multiple occasions and not come out of the experiences suffering any less, I can say that these are by no means the panacea they're often held out to be. It's fantastic that these options seem to be very helpful to many, but I feel that MDMA and Ketamine - as well as Psilocybin - are suggested with far too much confidence on the outcome.
- andrei_says_ 5y ago
  How does the dissasociative ketamine help?
  - loves_mangoes 5y ago
    Ketamine (as its S-isomer) is approved by the FDA for treatment-resistant depression. Note that while the evidence for Ketamine's antidepressant effect is actually strong, that does not mean you should get into the habit of snorting a gram of special K a day. Ketamine abuse is known to cause serious, practical damage to the GI tract, the urinary system, the liver, and the brain.
    - andrei_says_ 5y ago
_pyqs 5y ago
Might it be SSRI-induced indifference[0]? I had a similar experience when I was on SSRI antidepressants. [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2989833/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2989833/
PragmaticPulp 5y ago
> There is value to medications that inhibit or regulate serotonin, and every individual's experience will be slightly different based on their genetics and the circumstances of their life. Not just slightly different. It can be extremely variable from person to person. It’s well-known in medical research and clinical practice that medications likes SSRIs range from helpful to neutral to net negatives depending on the patients and situation. Sadly, too many people fixate on the potential negative side effects and avoid trialing treatments altogether. For anyone suffering: It’s true that medications might not work out for you, but if they do address your condition and you’re one of the many people whose lives benefit greatly, then it would be tragic to avoid medications based on fear of potential negative outcomes.
- kbenson 5y ago
  > Not just slightly different. It can be extremely variable from person to person. Not just SSRIs. I had a very bad experience with Mucinex D (or DM?) about 12 years ago, the first time I tried it. I can only imagine it was what clinical depression is like. For two days (until I stopped taking because I was so scared) I lost all interest in my life. I wasn't interested in my young children, ow my wife, or watching anything on TV I usually like, or playing a game. I was questioning my work life choices as well because nothing at work held the slightest interest. I would go home, do what was required of me, then sit in bed and stare at the wall until I went to bed. That is, to this day, one of the scariest experiences in my life. I've since heard of one or two other people that had similar experiences with it.
  - aos 5y ago
    Mucinex DM has dextromethorphan[0] which can act as a non-selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor. [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dextromethorphan https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dextromethorphan see section on dependence and withdrawal
    - kbenson 5y ago
      Well, that makes sense then. Thanks for the additional info. Honestly have been kinda scared of the whole class of medication that affects mood since this experience, but I've been lucky enough to not feel the need for medication nor been prescribed any of that sort, so haven't had to make that choice.
Findecanor 5y ago
I've used SSRIs a long time ago with therapy, and without a few years ago. In my opinion, SSRIs should only be used as a tool to help make the patient more receptive to therapy. It should never ever be used a substitute for therapy. I too have noticed that without someone to help keeping your behaviour in check, some undesirable (but not necessarily dark) personality traits could take over. Not to mention that someone needs to be there to check on you during the first weeks of use when the drug actually causes a deeper depression before it starts mellowing your feelings. BTW. My second SSRI use also left me with permanently dry eyes and nose: me needing eye drops and to avoid dusty, dry environments for the rest of my life.
- sjtindell 5y ago
  I loosely agree. I feel SSRIs should be used in cases where someone feels so down they cannot function. Once they are functional enough for therapy and other support, they may want to consider carefully stopping.
treeman79 5y ago
Had similar. Was suffering from clots and doctors decided it was anxiety. I stopped caring about anything. Saw a love one injured. I felt nothing at all. Someone whom I was normally very protective. Never took another pill.
selectodude 5y ago
As a contra-point to this (I feel like these sorts of threads bring out everybody who ever had negative experiences with xyz drug and that can be very harmful to those with mood disorders): The only reason I'm still alive is due to SSRIs, they have definitely taken away some of the highs of life but they also took away the incessant thoughts of suicide. They have side effects. They suck and the idea of being physically and mentally addicted to a mood stabilizer is a huge bummer. But I know that the people around me (and you) want us around, even if it's not 100 percent of who we really are. If your meds are working for you, messing around with them because you want to "hack" your brain isn't necessarily the best course of action. Be smart.
- loceng 5y ago
  Did you try or were offered anything else before trying medications?
  - selectodude 5y ago
    Yes, >1yr of talk therapy.
    - loceng 5y ago
      Thanks. Was it same person who also prescribed the medication?
      - selectodude 5y ago
        No, I continued to decline and created a plan to end my life. I told my psychologist and she referred me to a psychiatrist to begin a concurrent pharmaceutical treatment to go along with talk therapy.
        xkbarkar 5y ago
        Good to hear the meds are working for you. Clinical depression is life threatening and no joke to walk around with untreated. Whatever that treatment might be.
loceng 5y ago
Have you ever researched or tried MDMA? It's "single use" vs. daily and habit/dependency forming. MAPS.org did clinical trials, MDMA-assisted psychotherapy for veterans with treatment resistant PTSD, to great success.
- jnovek 5y ago
  Psychedelics seem very promising for the treatment of PTSD at some point down the line, but it’s not even close to studied enough. E.g. a recent promising study in Nature was 90 participants. Taking street MDMA is not the same as being administered MDMA in a clinical setting as an aid to talk therapy. I am enthusiastic about the advancement of research in this area and frustrated that it was delayed for so long due to political reasons, but please keep in mind that people with mood disorders or trauma can be desperate and may not make the best choices for themselves on their own.
  - loceng 5y ago
    Are you familiar with the Maps.org study and results? 100 participants with 17.5 years average of treatment resistant PTSD. The placebo at the end of 1 year: 80% had no improvement, 20% some [expected], the group who did just 2-3 sessions with therapeutic dose of MDMA (100-120mg) at the end of 1 year: 80% no longer qualified for PTSD diagnostic, 20% had some or no improvement; MAPS released/published their 69 page guide for therapists - the two main important components being varied music selection (with more specific definition/explanation given), and an empathetic listener - someone present who will actually fully listen and respond whole-heartedly if the client needs to share something. Your final sentence also rings true for any remedy including SSRIs which many people have been harmed by, likewise your pointing out to this research not advancing due to political reasons - including system and regulatory capture - can be applied to existing treatments that were approved but perhaps should not have been; the conspiracy hypothesis that's becoming mainstream is that things like MDMA, psychedelics et al, were suppressed by for-profit industrial complexes via "the war on drugs" because pharma's patented daily-use recurring business model products couldn't compete with the very cheap to make, administer "2-3 times per year" chemicals that don't have anything close to the same "side" effect profile. You can see how this regulatory capture still has a hold in Canada for the alcohol industry, where alcohol's a known carcinogen, and as a society we put warnings on tobacco products but no such warnings on alcohol - and this isn't the only incongruence in Canadian policy/culture.
aantix 5y ago
Have you tried any supplements? SSRIs aren’t the only promising solution.
- tablespoon 5y ago
  > Have you tried any supplements? > SSRIs aren’t the only promising solution. I don't think it's very helpful to vaguely bring up "supplements" like that. There are so many, and they range from being harmful, to being placebos, to being actually helpful. Plus there's a huge amount of utter quackery around them. Do you have any specific "promising" ones in mind?
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - Aldrynt 5y ago
throwaway2331 5y ago
The assortment of medication available for depression is laughable. Even for other neurological disorders, they're so unselective and "broad spectrum," affecting numerous other systems, that it turns into an absurdity: how are we this far behind? Wasn't modern medicine supposed to equal better living? It's like zero thought has been put into quality of life by practitioners, so long as their metrics are met E.g. "x, y, z attributes on the ABC scale went down. Looks like you're in remission!" "But doctor, my dick doesn't work, I've gained 40lbs, and everything feels flat." "We can prescribe a stimulant for appetite suppression, a vasodilator for the libido... but the 'flat' is all in your head. I'm going to write you a recommendation to a psychologist so they can talk to you about it." Absolute ninnies. I understand what you mean about engaging in out-of-personality behaviors, lack of moral code, and the nausea and panic that accompanies the memories of "who you were" on a certain medication (they do go away, with time. And they lose their emotional impact once you accept that it was due to medication, and rationalize it away). They warn you that there might be personality changes, and you'll feel different, but I don't think they understand the absolute gravity of what that means. Even pharmacists go on their soapbox every time you ask for a different brand (because X brand doesn't feel the same, and the FDA has issued numerous warnings about quality control): "the only thing different about brand name medication is the marketing. They're all bio-equivalent and it's all in your head." Fuck off. This isn't even addressing that it's likely most of the "anti-depressive" effect is placebo in SSRIs and the like. "Oh I feel very different now from this medication. That means it's strong, and effective, and I should be getting better now"; it's in the same vein as chiropractic, except with more woo-woo and theatre ("modern medicine!!!"). There are better substances that can be used off-label/aren't "copyrighted" that actually solve emotional issues by (properly) regulating neurotransmitters and genomic expression to achieve pro-humanist results, instead of soulless pro-metrics and "quantitative" results. But they're not being marketed, because the current batch of psychoactive chemicals is riding on decades of marketing and "works" (see: generates outsized profits). In my opinion, almost all of these have been a net-negative on society. Opiates, benzos, "anti-psychotics," "anti-depressives," and the like: they're all shit. There are better chemical (and lifestyle solutions) to these problems, but right now the medical complex has a hard-fought monopoly on health treatment; so anything that would usurp power from them is a no-no (a la "fuck pro-consumer, I'm getting mine").
johnchristopher 5y ago
> My moral code was compromised because I no longer felt the guilt and shame that normally inhibits unscrupulous behavior. Hope I am not out of bond but I think this demonstrates why a moral code also has to be an intellectual thing and not just an instinct thing.
- o10449366 5y ago
  I agree and for me it is, but what I learned from that experience is how powerful and influential our emotional state is. It really made me feel like a psychopath at times because I would understand how I "should" feel or do in a given situation, but without a strong emotional signal it felt like it didn't matter what choices I made.
  - kzrdude 5y ago
    I think you learned something really profound (you could use it to understand others or why people even accept acting without conscience sometimes), thank you for sharing, too. Tangentially related - I had the experience - from being in a depression - of empathizing more with people down on their luck, people who are chronically grumpy or unlikable etc, or maybe those that are afraid of unknown people. I'm not sure how to explain it, but it made me see different sides of the human experience and I got out alive.
- sneak 5y ago
  Morals are about as far from instinct as one can get. They're also entirely subjective, fwiw.
  - skissane 5y ago
    Morals are (at least in part) based on generalising instinct. Most people would be instinctively repelled and outraged if they saw an adult torturing a child – morality is not that instinctive feeling itself, but when we reflect upon that feeling intellectually, especially when in doing so we universalise it, moving from "I am repelled and outraged by this, so I won't do it and do I what I can to stop others from doing it" to "everyone ought to be repelled and outraged by this, therefore nobody ought to do it and everybody ought to do what they can to stop others from doing it", that's when we've turned instinct into morality. Is morality "entirely subjective"? When someone says, "Torturing children is immoral", do you really want to reply "That's entirely subjective". The very reply itself seems morally compromised, even immoral. A good philosophical argument for the objectivity of morality is the "companions in the guilt" argument. Most people accept the objectivity of rationality, even those who deny the objectivity of morality. And yet, when we examine the two in detail, we can find a great many similarities between rationality and morality – morality says "don't do X", where X might be torturing a child, rationality says "don't believe X", where X might be the QAnon conspiracy theory; morality values states of affairs positively or negatively (moral vs immoral), rationality does the same (rational vs irrational) – in light of these similarities, how is it not special pleading to affirm the objectivity of one yet deny it of the other? To justify treating them differently, you'd need to give a good reason for doing so – but rarely is any reason given at all, and I don't think any of them are good. Rationally, we must either affirm the objectivity of morality or deny the objectivity of rationality. I think, to affirm the objectivity of morality is the better horn to take – we might even conclude it is the more rational one, if we believe that rationality itself requires belief in its own rationality. Hence, morality is objective.
meiji163 5y ago
- ikiris 5y ago
  I hear insulin is the same way. Eventually they still die, and OMG IF THEY STOP THEY DIE TOO. /sigh. please stop this, you're contributing to the stigma both in terms of mental health, and that lifesaving medication is somehow an addition.
  - mitchdoogle 5y ago
    The person you're replying to has multiple sources to defend their comment. It's not a big secret that antidepressants are overprescribed and extremely easy to obtain. Sure, they have their uses and may be life saving to some, but their use should also be questioned from time to time.
    - PragmaticPulp 5y ago
      > The person you're replying to has multiple sources to defend their comment. Click their first citation. It’s a study that shows that people who discontinue their antidepressants are more likely to relapse than people who continue taking them. It also says that relapse is more likely if the person was depressed for longer before receiving treatment (e.g. excessively delaying treatment made relapse more likely) It doesn’t support their wild anti-psychiatry rant at all. Don’t be fooled by off the wall comments that try to overload you with a list of citations that they know most people won’t read.
    - hellbannedguy 5y ago
  - nradov 5y ago
    Insulin is a bad example. Research has shown that many type-2 diabetics no longer need exogenous insulin after they make the correct lifestyle changes. https://www.sciencealert.com/science-proves-diet-can-send-type-2-diabetes-into-remission-and-there-s-more-than-one-option https://www.sciencealert.com/science-proves-diet-can-send-ty...
andrei_says_ 5y ago
I would like to recommend a lecture by George Lakoff - The Neuroscience of Language and Thought https://youtu.be/JJP-rkilz40 https://youtu.be/JJP-rkilz40 Within the first 10 minutes he speaks of the fact that rational thought as we see it simply does not exist. All our choices are based on the ability to distinguish a preference and that ability is based on emotion. It would only make sense that medication impairing our emotions would also impair our choice making.
- Enginerrrd 5y ago
  Not only that, but if meditation has taught me anything, it's that your "conscious rational thought" isn't really conscious. ...like, basically at all. The decisions are getting made unconsciously and then kicked up to your conscious attention, already made.
  - mirekrusin 5y ago
    There is a proof for this - when you're dreaming and hear some noise that wakes you up, in many cases the plot of your dream in last second or so will be constructed around that sound - in other words, your brain would have to know the future if it was all realtime, it leaks out faking reality perception.
  - mistermann 5y ago
    For additional insight, try floating this idea when the topic of discussion is something other than psychology. Better, test it on a variety of demographics (education level, etc) and see if you detect substantial differences in reaction.
    - Enginerrrd 5y ago
      This seems leading enough that I'm curious if you have more to add on the subject? In general, I've found this idea was quite natural to me, but always seems quite foreign to others except those with a background in neurology, meditation, sometimes physics, and Buddhist circles. People seem especially hostile to this when you start talking about the criminal justice system.
rjh29 5y ago
Anecdotally I had the same response. I found they helped anxiety a lot, but did not help depression as I just felt even more disconnected and apathetic to things. What helped me was switching away from a first-line SSRI and onto something a bit more niche: Mirtazapine. It's definitely worth trying a variety of SSRIs because everyone is different and it's really common for the first one or two that you try to not work well. I agree that ultimately therapy/coping strategies are the right cure, medicine is a way to bootstrap otherwise incapable people into persuing exercise, therapy, social stuff etc. If you can achieve that without the help of meds, more power to you!
- tamaharbor 5y ago
  Does the Mirtazapine make you sleepy all the time?
  - LASR 5y ago
    Not OP, but to answer your question: no, not all the time. If you take it before bedtime, it sedates you in a deep sleep. But 3-4 hours later, if you wake up, it would be like you didn’t take anything. You may even have trouble going back to sleep if you wake up early. Of course all this varies greatly for every individual.
- xedrac 5y ago
  Mirtazapine worked wonders for me... for about 2 weeks. After that it seemed to have no effect at all, except for extreme constipation.
SavantIdiot 5y ago
Sounds like anomie. What did your therapist say about this? Different anti-depressants have different effects. Not sure what you were on, but if it was an SSRI, perhaps a tricyclic would have been better, or vice versa. The symptoms you explain are why it is important to pair therapy with antidepressents. I'm very surprised your therapist did not alter your scrip.
- o10449366 5y ago
  They did. If it's prescribable as a medication to treat anxiety or depression in the United States, I've tried it. I try and keep a very open mind, so even when many medications didn't work, I continued to try new ones and combinations with sufficient trial periods, but in the end what worked best for me (at that point in my life) was just not taking anything at all. I'm not saying medication is not effective - it was extremely effective for me in different phases of my life and probably saved me from suicide, however in my adult life I found the emotional blunting and apathy that came with not just SSRIs but DSRIs and other classes of medications to be extremely concerning.
999900000999 5y ago
Lost Connections is a very good book on the topic. Read it, the author points out in countries where people don't have 3k a month for pysc meds, somehow they aren't all miserably depressed. One story is really sweat, a poor farmer is helped by his community after being left unable to work. In the west we'd say file for SSI and get some SOMA. The entire mental health industry is focused on extracting as much from vulnerable people as possible. Unless you have a spare 1200$ to 1600$ a month laying around you won't be able to afford therapy anyway...
sorethescore 5y ago
This is why antidepressants should only be used during periods of crisis when a person is at risk; in my opinion, for no longer than 3-6 months at most, after which they should be tapered off and transitioned to a more sustainable long term treatment modality.
tsol 5y ago
My experience was the opposite. In fact, after taking medication to fix it I later stopped because of this naturalistic fallacy. I knew it was bunting some of my emotions and I figured whatever the drugs are doing I can do with lifestyle changes. 10 years later, a daily habit of exercise and cold showers, a variety of daily natural supplements like turmeric and magnesium, and a career later.. I was no different. I'd wonder why everything felt so hard for me, why I was so stressed out all the time. And how it could be that no one else seemed to be horrified by the existential realities of life. At the same time I wanted to participate in life so I could help change things for the better-- but damn every morning was a new battle. And then I decided to start the same medication again, and boom. About a year later and I feel normal. It's amazing. I'm like.. is this how people feel all the time? You guys just wake up and don't dread the day? Lol it's almost funny now. They blunt my emotions.. but turns out i was hyper sensitive to everything. In an awful , stressful way. I still have white hair from that period of life. Sometimes, medication is the answer. I had a perfectly fine life on paper yet couldn't be happy. My theory is this was because of some adverse childhood events I experienced, that seemed to change something in me. Thank God for modern medicine. And I learned sometimes the best advice is don't listen to others-- only you know what's best for you. People are complicated and therapy doesn't always work.
- thelittleone 5y ago
  > My theory is this was because of some adverse childhood events I experienced, that seemed to change something in me. Have you considered some sort of regression therapy such as hypnotherapy or if more adventurous, plant medicine? I sat next to a pretty senior FBI guy on a domestic US flight once. He was a hypnotherapist who claimed that in almost all cases they were able to use hypnosis to get information about what happened even if the conscious person was completely unable to recall any details. In most shamanic traditions, a lot of work is devoted to bringing up and purging out past trauma. Examples include plant vapor baths to sweat things out, purgatives to release emotional trauma (often present in the stomach / belly) and plant medicines such as ayahuasca that act as both a purgative and help form new perspectives of past experiences.
  - twofornone 5y ago
laurent92 5y ago
For me, serotonin blockers just made me asexual. It was a flat organ even when activated. It also defeats the purpose of taking antidepressants to enter a more positive spiral with girls… But it is also very frightening as a man.
- heavyset_go 5y ago
  Ironically, it is actually serotonin blockers that can help with SSRI sexual side-effects. Activation of 5HT2C via SSRIs is what is hypothesized to be responsible for those specific side-effects, and blocking 5HT2C can help alleviate them.
heavyset_go 5y ago
That truthfully sounds like symptoms of hypomania, which can be exacerbated by antidepressants. If that's the case, then antidepressants alone were not a good choice for you, because they are meant to only treat depression.
throw0101a 5y ago
> I will be extremely hesitant to take antidepressants and anti-anxiety medications ever again after my last experience with them. For me, the medications helped by tempering all of my feelings - I no longer felt sad or anxious, instead I just felt mellow and apathetic about everything. For some folks this is actually roughly the ailment that they suffer from: > Anhedonia is a diverse array of deficits in hedonic function, including reduced motivation or ability to experience pleasure.[1] While earlier definitions emphasized the inability to experience pleasure, anhedonia is currently used by researchers to refer to reduced motivation, reduced anticipatory pleasure (wanting), reduced consummatory pleasure (liking), and deficits in reinforcement learning.[2][3][4] * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anhedonia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anhedonia
neuro_image2 5y ago
I strongly encourage anyone reading this to watch Dr Ben Sessa's lecture on using MDMA to treat addiction and trauma. https://youtu.be/11u7iX4j1tA https://youtu.be/11u7iX4j1tA The reality is, SSRIs and other pharmaceuticals that have been used to treat common psychiatric illnesses (anxiety/depression) have dismal outcomes and fail the vast majority of patients that they have been given to. Fortunately, there is a growing body of evidence that MDMA and psychedelic assisted therapy could revolutionize the treatment of mental health disorders. Unfortunately, for the last 50 years, governments, industry and the military industrial complex (together with the MSM) have spread lies and scaremongering to block the therapeutic use of these life-changing therapies. Here is another video for anyone wanting to know more about the topic: (Lecture by Prof. David Nutt: The New Psychedelic Revolution) https://youtu.be/1JjzVcfei60 https://youtu.be/1JjzVcfei60 I'm optimistic that the next few decades will bring about better approaches to these massively underserved (and largely exploited and discarded) people. References: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01336-3 https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01336-3 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09540261.2021.1919062 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09540261.2021.1...
copperx 5y ago
Regarding lying, I actually brought this up in my last therapy session because an SSRI gave me the opposite effect. Taking sertraline greatly reduced my ability (or rather, willingness) to lie. My psychiatrist attributed it to my improved self-confidence while on the drug. I'm not totally convinced. I do feel greater confidence indeed, but it seems like I'm less worried about what others think of me. It feels like there's not too much to gain from lying. I have taken other SSRIs before, but it is puzzling how each one has its own particular behavioral effects even though they all are increasing serotonin.

dave_sullivan 5y ago

Not sure if you ever tried a DSRI but it could be your serotonin levels are fine but your dopamine levels are out of whack. SSRIs are just one class of drug. Speaking from a history of anxiety and depression, the wrong drugs were not helpful, but the right drugs opened up a whole new version of self. In my case, that was buproprion.

qwertyuiop_ 5y ago
Do these work for panic attacks ? I think anxiety and depression are related. I was prescribed SSRI for anxiety.
- mattgreenrocks 5y ago
  > I think anxiety and depression are related. I was prescribed SSRI for anxiety. They often accompany one another. I've had panic attacks in the past, and was diagnosed with generalized anxiety disorder. I can't claim that bupropion fixes panic attacks proper, and I'm not a doctor, but it does help me with my depression. (I haven't had a panic attack in a long time.) It's not a silver bullet; you can still find yourself in mentally stuck states, the difference is the physical side of things seems to be 'gated' at the low end so that your spiraling down isn't as deep as it is before. There's still a lot of work to do to recognize + slow that descent, but it is a tool to help with that.
- heavyset_go 5y ago
  Mirtazapine can help with depression, anxiety and panic, and it isn't an SSRI. There are also newer drugs that are marketed as SMS drugs instead of SSRIs, like vilazodone and vortioxetine. Buspirone binds to 5HT1A directly, instead of inhibiting the serotonin transporter like other drugs. Wellbutrin and NDRIs typically aren't that great for anxiety, but they can help.
mattgreenrocks 5y ago
Same situation as you. SSRIs seemed mostly ineffective, or sometimes had crazy side effects (will never forget Effexor-induced zaps despite tapering off following the directions to the letter). Bupropion has been fantastic for me since I started and I wished I'd found it 20 years ago.
- wincy 5y ago
  That’s great! Bupropion caused a psychotic episode for me maybe ten years ago. Most terrifying day of my life, when the razor blades were calling out to me telling me to cut myself. To be clear, I’ve never had anything like that happen before or since. My daughter spent 9 months in the NICU and got genetic testing for various drugs, with 1 being the baseline expected (I’m going off memory here) and 9 or 10 being “wtf this is super weird”. She got a 9 for bupropion. I’m assuming she got that from her father.
  - tablespoon 5y ago
    > My daughter spent 9 months in the NICU and got genetic testing for various drugs, with 1 being the baseline expected (I’m going off memory here) and 9 or 10 being “wtf this is super weird”. She got a 9 for bupropion. I've never heard of that. Why would they be testing an infant for their reaction to an antidepressant drug? Just curious.
    - heavyset_go 5y ago
      The genetic tests use genotypes to make statistical inferences about efficacy and metabolism for certain drugs. Wellbutrin is a common medicine, and the testing company probably had it as part of their panel.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
    Wow, sorry. Bupropion is an SNRI, not SSRI. SSRIs are 'dangerous' IMHO, except for the special cases mention here (suicide ideation, extreme non-functioning). I would have hoped clinicians would start at the lowest possible dose, and titrate up. I've certainly heard of the "you need about xx mg, use this dose" first doses, tho. To me, this is Yet Another reason one should never receive medical advice alone, especially when thinking is impaired. That trusted friend / partner needs to ask the hard questions of the prescribing clinician; but rules make any 3rd party except spouse difficult for adults.
plutonorm 5y ago
Not available in the UK because reasons.
- mxmilkiib 5y ago
  Not available directly from a GP, but if one gets referred to a clinical psychiatrist they can permit a prescription.
  - plutonorm 5y ago
    True. But it won't be easy. You will mostly likely be put on combination therapies first. Then onto combo SSRIs and Antipsychotics, then maybe you might get something that ups dopamine, maybe. If you look a bit bipolar though you'd likely go onto a mood stabiliser (i.e. calm the f down you over-active neurons, have some more gabba/ block those calcium channels etc). and personally that's what worked best for me, over active mind induced perpetual exhaustion -> anhedonia from the stress of a mind that never stops.

Jerrrry 5y ago

Similar thoughts. I think SSRI's are the wrong direction. Acute drug experiences with therapy and behavioral modification are the future. do some molly and ketamine and have a good talk.

KittenInABox 5y ago
Caveat: If you have dissociative symptoms, are prone to anxiety, have a family history of psychosis or have a psychosis in your symptom profile, seriously reconsider the above advice.
astrange 5y ago
If you don't want to mess with serotonin don't go take MDMA…
nobodyofnote 5y ago
As someone who has done both on multiple occasions and not come out of the experiences suffering any less, I can say that these are by no means the panacea they're often held out to be. It's fantastic that these options seem to be very helpful to many, but I feel that MDMA and Ketamine - as well as Psilocybin - are suggested with far too much confidence on the outcome.
andrei_says_ 5y ago
How does the dissasociative ketamine help?
- loves_mangoes 5y ago
  Ketamine (as its S-isomer) is approved by the FDA for treatment-resistant depression. Note that while the evidence for Ketamine's antidepressant effect is actually strong, that does not mean you should get into the habit of snorting a gram of special K a day. Ketamine abuse is known to cause serious, practical damage to the GI tract, the urinary system, the liver, and the brain.
  - andrei_says_ 5y ago

_pyqs 5y ago

Might it be SSRI-induced indifference[0]? I had a similar experience when I was on SSRI antidepressants. [0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2989833/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2989833/

PragmaticPulp 5y ago

> There is value to medications that inhibit or regulate serotonin, and every individual's experience will be slightly different based on their genetics and the circumstances of their life. Not just slightly different. It can be extremely variable from person to person. It’s well-known in medical research and clinical practice that medications likes SSRIs range from helpful to neutral to net negatives depending on the patients and situation. Sadly, too many people fixate on the potential negative side effects and avoid trialing treatments altogether. For anyone suffering: It’s true that medications might not work out for you, but if they do address your condition and you’re one of the many people whose lives benefit greatly, then it would be tragic to avoid medications based on fear of potential negative outcomes.

kbenson 5y ago
> Not just slightly different. It can be extremely variable from person to person. Not just SSRIs. I had a very bad experience with Mucinex D (or DM?) about 12 years ago, the first time I tried it. I can only imagine it was what clinical depression is like. For two days (until I stopped taking because I was so scared) I lost all interest in my life. I wasn't interested in my young children, ow my wife, or watching anything on TV I usually like, or playing a game. I was questioning my work life choices as well because nothing at work held the slightest interest. I would go home, do what was required of me, then sit in bed and stare at the wall until I went to bed. That is, to this day, one of the scariest experiences in my life. I've since heard of one or two other people that had similar experiences with it.
- aos 5y ago
  Mucinex DM has dextromethorphan[0] which can act as a non-selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor. [0]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dextromethorphan https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dextromethorphan see section on dependence and withdrawal
  - kbenson 5y ago
    Well, that makes sense then. Thanks for the additional info. Honestly have been kinda scared of the whole class of medication that affects mood since this experience, but I've been lucky enough to not feel the need for medication nor been prescribed any of that sort, so haven't had to make that choice.

Findecanor 5y ago

I've used SSRIs a long time ago with therapy, and without a few years ago. In my opinion, SSRIs should only be used as a tool to help make the patient more receptive to therapy. It should never ever be used a substitute for therapy. I too have noticed that without someone to help keeping your behaviour in check, some undesirable (but not necessarily dark) personality traits could take over. Not to mention that someone needs to be there to check on you during the first weeks of use when the drug actually causes a deeper depression before it starts mellowing your feelings. BTW. My second SSRI use also left me with permanently dry eyes and nose: me needing eye drops and to avoid dusty, dry environments for the rest of my life.

sjtindell 5y ago
I loosely agree. I feel SSRIs should be used in cases where someone feels so down they cannot function. Once they are functional enough for therapy and other support, they may want to consider carefully stopping.

treeman79 5y ago

Had similar. Was suffering from clots and doctors decided it was anxiety. I stopped caring about anything. Saw a love one injured. I felt nothing at all. Someone whom I was normally very protective. Never took another pill.

selectodude 5y ago

As a contra-point to this (I feel like these sorts of threads bring out everybody who ever had negative experiences with xyz drug and that can be very harmful to those with mood disorders): The only reason I'm still alive is due to SSRIs, they have definitely taken away some of the highs of life but they also took away the incessant thoughts of suicide. They have side effects. They suck and the idea of being physically and mentally addicted to a mood stabilizer is a huge bummer. But I know that the people around me (and you) want us around, even if it's not 100 percent of who we really are. If your meds are working for you, messing around with them because you want to "hack" your brain isn't necessarily the best course of action. Be smart.

loceng 5y ago
Did you try or were offered anything else before trying medications?
- selectodude 5y ago
  Yes, >1yr of talk therapy.
  - loceng 5y ago
    Thanks. Was it same person who also prescribed the medication?
    - selectodude 5y ago
      No, I continued to decline and created a plan to end my life. I told my psychologist and she referred me to a psychiatrist to begin a concurrent pharmaceutical treatment to go along with talk therapy.
      - xkbarkar 5y ago
        Good to hear the meds are working for you. Clinical depression is life threatening and no joke to walk around with untreated. Whatever that treatment might be.

loceng 5y ago

Have you ever researched or tried MDMA? It's "single use" vs. daily and habit/dependency forming. MAPS.org did clinical trials, MDMA-assisted psychotherapy for veterans with treatment resistant PTSD, to great success.

jnovek 5y ago
Psychedelics seem very promising for the treatment of PTSD at some point down the line, but it’s not even close to studied enough. E.g. a recent promising study in Nature was 90 participants. Taking street MDMA is not the same as being administered MDMA in a clinical setting as an aid to talk therapy. I am enthusiastic about the advancement of research in this area and frustrated that it was delayed for so long due to political reasons, but please keep in mind that people with mood disorders or trauma can be desperate and may not make the best choices for themselves on their own.
- loceng 5y ago
  Are you familiar with the Maps.org study and results? 100 participants with 17.5 years average of treatment resistant PTSD. The placebo at the end of 1 year: 80% had no improvement, 20% some [expected], the group who did just 2-3 sessions with therapeutic dose of MDMA (100-120mg) at the end of 1 year: 80% no longer qualified for PTSD diagnostic, 20% had some or no improvement; MAPS released/published their 69 page guide for therapists - the two main important components being varied music selection (with more specific definition/explanation given), and an empathetic listener - someone present who will actually fully listen and respond whole-heartedly if the client needs to share something. Your final sentence also rings true for any remedy including SSRIs which many people have been harmed by, likewise your pointing out to this research not advancing due to political reasons - including system and regulatory capture - can be applied to existing treatments that were approved but perhaps should not have been; the conspiracy hypothesis that's becoming mainstream is that things like MDMA, psychedelics et al, were suppressed by for-profit industrial complexes via "the war on drugs" because pharma's patented daily-use recurring business model products couldn't compete with the very cheap to make, administer "2-3 times per year" chemicals that don't have anything close to the same "side" effect profile. You can see how this regulatory capture still has a hold in Canada for the alcohol industry, where alcohol's a known carcinogen, and as a society we put warnings on tobacco products but no such warnings on alcohol - and this isn't the only incongruence in Canadian policy/culture.

aantix 5y ago

Have you tried any supplements? SSRIs aren’t the only promising solution.

tablespoon 5y ago
> Have you tried any supplements? > SSRIs aren’t the only promising solution. I don't think it's very helpful to vaguely bring up "supplements" like that. There are so many, and they range from being harmful, to being placebos, to being actually helpful. Plus there's a huge amount of utter quackery around them. Do you have any specific "promising" ones in mind?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- Aldrynt 5y ago

throwaway2331 5y ago

The assortment of medication available for depression is laughable. Even for other neurological disorders, they're so unselective and "broad spectrum," affecting numerous other systems, that it turns into an absurdity: how are we this far behind? Wasn't modern medicine supposed to equal better living? It's like zero thought has been put into quality of life by practitioners, so long as their metrics are met E.g. "x, y, z attributes on the ABC scale went down. Looks like you're in remission!" "But doctor, my dick doesn't work, I've gained 40lbs, and everything feels flat." "We can prescribe a stimulant for appetite suppression, a vasodilator for the libido... but the 'flat' is all in your head. I'm going to write you a recommendation to a psychologist so they can talk to you about it." Absolute ninnies. I understand what you mean about engaging in out-of-personality behaviors, lack of moral code, and the nausea and panic that accompanies the memories of "who you were" on a certain medication (they do go away, with time. And they lose their emotional impact once you accept that it was due to medication, and rationalize it away). They warn you that there might be personality changes, and you'll feel different, but I don't think they understand the absolute gravity of what that means. Even pharmacists go on their soapbox every time you ask for a different brand (because X brand doesn't feel the same, and the FDA has issued numerous warnings about quality control): "the only thing different about brand name medication is the marketing. They're all bio-equivalent and it's all in your head." Fuck off. This isn't even addressing that it's likely most of the "anti-depressive" effect is placebo in SSRIs and the like. "Oh I feel very different now from this medication. That means it's strong, and effective, and I should be getting better now"; it's in the same vein as chiropractic, except with more woo-woo and theatre ("modern medicine!!!"). There are better substances that can be used off-label/aren't "copyrighted" that actually solve emotional issues by (properly) regulating neurotransmitters and genomic expression to achieve pro-humanist results, instead of soulless pro-metrics and "quantitative" results. But they're not being marketed, because the current batch of psychoactive chemicals is riding on decades of marketing and "works" (see: generates outsized profits). In my opinion, almost all of these have been a net-negative on society. Opiates, benzos, "anti-psychotics," "anti-depressives," and the like: they're all shit. There are better chemical (and lifestyle solutions) to these problems, but right now the medical complex has a hard-fought monopoly on health treatment; so anything that would usurp power from them is a no-no (a la "fuck pro-consumer, I'm getting mine").

johnchristopher 5y ago

> My moral code was compromised because I no longer felt the guilt and shame that normally inhibits unscrupulous behavior. Hope I am not out of bond but I think this demonstrates why a moral code also has to be an intellectual thing and not just an instinct thing.

o10449366 5y ago
I agree and for me it is, but what I learned from that experience is how powerful and influential our emotional state is. It really made me feel like a psychopath at times because I would understand how I "should" feel or do in a given situation, but without a strong emotional signal it felt like it didn't matter what choices I made.
- kzrdude 5y ago
  I think you learned something really profound (you could use it to understand others or why people even accept acting without conscience sometimes), thank you for sharing, too. Tangentially related - I had the experience - from being in a depression - of empathizing more with people down on their luck, people who are chronically grumpy or unlikable etc, or maybe those that are afraid of unknown people. I'm not sure how to explain it, but it made me see different sides of the human experience and I got out alive.
sneak 5y ago
Morals are about as far from instinct as one can get. They're also entirely subjective, fwiw.
- skissane 5y ago
  Morals are (at least in part) based on generalising instinct. Most people would be instinctively repelled and outraged if they saw an adult torturing a child – morality is not that instinctive feeling itself, but when we reflect upon that feeling intellectually, especially when in doing so we universalise it, moving from "I am repelled and outraged by this, so I won't do it and do I what I can to stop others from doing it" to "everyone ought to be repelled and outraged by this, therefore nobody ought to do it and everybody ought to do what they can to stop others from doing it", that's when we've turned instinct into morality. Is morality "entirely subjective"? When someone says, "Torturing children is immoral", do you really want to reply "That's entirely subjective". The very reply itself seems morally compromised, even immoral. A good philosophical argument for the objectivity of morality is the "companions in the guilt" argument. Most people accept the objectivity of rationality, even those who deny the objectivity of morality. And yet, when we examine the two in detail, we can find a great many similarities between rationality and morality – morality says "don't do X", where X might be torturing a child, rationality says "don't believe X", where X might be the QAnon conspiracy theory; morality values states of affairs positively or negatively (moral vs immoral), rationality does the same (rational vs irrational) – in light of these similarities, how is it not special pleading to affirm the objectivity of one yet deny it of the other? To justify treating them differently, you'd need to give a good reason for doing so – but rarely is any reason given at all, and I don't think any of them are good. Rationally, we must either affirm the objectivity of morality or deny the objectivity of rationality. I think, to affirm the objectivity of morality is the better horn to take – we might even conclude it is the more rational one, if we believe that rationality itself requires belief in its own rationality. Hence, morality is objective.

meiji163 5y ago

ikiris 5y ago
I hear insulin is the same way. Eventually they still die, and OMG IF THEY STOP THEY DIE TOO. /sigh. please stop this, you're contributing to the stigma both in terms of mental health, and that lifesaving medication is somehow an addition.
- mitchdoogle 5y ago
  The person you're replying to has multiple sources to defend their comment. It's not a big secret that antidepressants are overprescribed and extremely easy to obtain. Sure, they have their uses and may be life saving to some, but their use should also be questioned from time to time.
  - PragmaticPulp 5y ago
    > The person you're replying to has multiple sources to defend their comment. Click their first citation. It’s a study that shows that people who discontinue their antidepressants are more likely to relapse than people who continue taking them. It also says that relapse is more likely if the person was depressed for longer before receiving treatment (e.g. excessively delaying treatment made relapse more likely) It doesn’t support their wild anti-psychiatry rant at all. Don’t be fooled by off the wall comments that try to overload you with a list of citations that they know most people won’t read.
  - hellbannedguy 5y ago
- nradov 5y ago
  Insulin is a bad example. Research has shown that many type-2 diabetics no longer need exogenous insulin after they make the correct lifestyle changes. https://www.sciencealert.com/science-proves-diet-can-send-type-2-diabetes-into-remission-and-there-s-more-than-one-option https://www.sciencealert.com/science-proves-diet-can-send-ty...

andrei_says_ 5y ago

I would like to recommend a lecture by George Lakoff - The Neuroscience of Language and Thought https://youtu.be/JJP-rkilz40 https://youtu.be/JJP-rkilz40 Within the first 10 minutes he speaks of the fact that rational thought as we see it simply does not exist. All our choices are based on the ability to distinguish a preference and that ability is based on emotion. It would only make sense that medication impairing our emotions would also impair our choice making.

Enginerrrd 5y ago
Not only that, but if meditation has taught me anything, it's that your "conscious rational thought" isn't really conscious. ...like, basically at all. The decisions are getting made unconsciously and then kicked up to your conscious attention, already made.
- mirekrusin 5y ago
  There is a proof for this - when you're dreaming and hear some noise that wakes you up, in many cases the plot of your dream in last second or so will be constructed around that sound - in other words, your brain would have to know the future if it was all realtime, it leaks out faking reality perception.
- mistermann 5y ago
  For additional insight, try floating this idea when the topic of discussion is something other than psychology. Better, test it on a variety of demographics (education level, etc) and see if you detect substantial differences in reaction.
  - Enginerrrd 5y ago
    This seems leading enough that I'm curious if you have more to add on the subject? In general, I've found this idea was quite natural to me, but always seems quite foreign to others except those with a background in neurology, meditation, sometimes physics, and Buddhist circles. People seem especially hostile to this when you start talking about the criminal justice system.

rjh29 5y ago

Anecdotally I had the same response. I found they helped anxiety a lot, but did not help depression as I just felt even more disconnected and apathetic to things. What helped me was switching away from a first-line SSRI and onto something a bit more niche: Mirtazapine. It's definitely worth trying a variety of SSRIs because everyone is different and it's really common for the first one or two that you try to not work well. I agree that ultimately therapy/coping strategies are the right cure, medicine is a way to bootstrap otherwise incapable people into persuing exercise, therapy, social stuff etc. If you can achieve that without the help of meds, more power to you!

tamaharbor 5y ago
Does the Mirtazapine make you sleepy all the time?
- LASR 5y ago
  Not OP, but to answer your question: no, not all the time. If you take it before bedtime, it sedates you in a deep sleep. But 3-4 hours later, if you wake up, it would be like you didn’t take anything. You may even have trouble going back to sleep if you wake up early. Of course all this varies greatly for every individual.
xedrac 5y ago
Mirtazapine worked wonders for me... for about 2 weeks. After that it seemed to have no effect at all, except for extreme constipation.

SavantIdiot 5y ago

Sounds like anomie. What did your therapist say about this? Different anti-depressants have different effects. Not sure what you were on, but if it was an SSRI, perhaps a tricyclic would have been better, or vice versa. The symptoms you explain are why it is important to pair therapy with antidepressents. I'm very surprised your therapist did not alter your scrip.

o10449366 5y ago
They did. If it's prescribable as a medication to treat anxiety or depression in the United States, I've tried it. I try and keep a very open mind, so even when many medications didn't work, I continued to try new ones and combinations with sufficient trial periods, but in the end what worked best for me (at that point in my life) was just not taking anything at all. I'm not saying medication is not effective - it was extremely effective for me in different phases of my life and probably saved me from suicide, however in my adult life I found the emotional blunting and apathy that came with not just SSRIs but DSRIs and other classes of medications to be extremely concerning.

999900000999 5y ago

Lost Connections is a very good book on the topic. Read it, the author points out in countries where people don't have 3k a month for pysc meds, somehow they aren't all miserably depressed. One story is really sweat, a poor farmer is helped by his community after being left unable to work. In the west we'd say file for SSI and get some SOMA. The entire mental health industry is focused on extracting as much from vulnerable people as possible. Unless you have a spare 1200$ to 1600$ a month laying around you won't be able to afford therapy anyway...

sorethescore 5y ago

This is why antidepressants should only be used during periods of crisis when a person is at risk; in my opinion, for no longer than 3-6 months at most, after which they should be tapered off and transitioned to a more sustainable long term treatment modality.

tsol 5y ago

My experience was the opposite. In fact, after taking medication to fix it I later stopped because of this naturalistic fallacy. I knew it was bunting some of my emotions and I figured whatever the drugs are doing I can do with lifestyle changes. 10 years later, a daily habit of exercise and cold showers, a variety of daily natural supplements like turmeric and magnesium, and a career later.. I was no different. I'd wonder why everything felt so hard for me, why I was so stressed out all the time. And how it could be that no one else seemed to be horrified by the existential realities of life. At the same time I wanted to participate in life so I could help change things for the better-- but damn every morning was a new battle. And then I decided to start the same medication again, and boom. About a year later and I feel normal. It's amazing. I'm like.. is this how people feel all the time? You guys just wake up and don't dread the day? Lol it's almost funny now. They blunt my emotions.. but turns out i was hyper sensitive to everything. In an awful , stressful way. I still have white hair from that period of life. Sometimes, medication is the answer. I had a perfectly fine life on paper yet couldn't be happy. My theory is this was because of some adverse childhood events I experienced, that seemed to change something in me. Thank God for modern medicine. And I learned sometimes the best advice is don't listen to others-- only you know what's best for you. People are complicated and therapy doesn't always work.

thelittleone 5y ago
> My theory is this was because of some adverse childhood events I experienced, that seemed to change something in me. Have you considered some sort of regression therapy such as hypnotherapy or if more adventurous, plant medicine? I sat next to a pretty senior FBI guy on a domestic US flight once. He was a hypnotherapist who claimed that in almost all cases they were able to use hypnosis to get information about what happened even if the conscious person was completely unable to recall any details. In most shamanic traditions, a lot of work is devoted to bringing up and purging out past trauma. Examples include plant vapor baths to sweat things out, purgatives to release emotional trauma (often present in the stomach / belly) and plant medicines such as ayahuasca that act as both a purgative and help form new perspectives of past experiences.
- twofornone 5y ago

laurent92 5y ago

For me, serotonin blockers just made me asexual. It was a flat organ even when activated. It also defeats the purpose of taking antidepressants to enter a more positive spiral with girls… But it is also very frightening as a man.

heavyset_go 5y ago
Ironically, it is actually serotonin blockers that can help with SSRI sexual side-effects. Activation of 5HT2C via SSRIs is what is hypothesized to be responsible for those specific side-effects, and blocking 5HT2C can help alleviate them.

heavyset_go 5y ago

That truthfully sounds like symptoms of hypomania, which can be exacerbated by antidepressants. If that's the case, then antidepressants alone were not a good choice for you, because they are meant to only treat depression.

throw0101a 5y ago

> I will be extremely hesitant to take antidepressants and anti-anxiety medications ever again after my last experience with them. For me, the medications helped by tempering all of my feelings - I no longer felt sad or anxious, instead I just felt mellow and apathetic about everything. For some folks this is actually roughly the ailment that they suffer from: > Anhedonia is a diverse array of deficits in hedonic function, including reduced motivation or ability to experience pleasure.[1] While earlier definitions emphasized the inability to experience pleasure, anhedonia is currently used by researchers to refer to reduced motivation, reduced anticipatory pleasure (wanting), reduced consummatory pleasure (liking), and deficits in reinforcement learning.[2][3][4] * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anhedonia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anhedonia

neuro_image2 5y ago

I strongly encourage anyone reading this to watch Dr Ben Sessa's lecture on using MDMA to treat addiction and trauma. https://youtu.be/11u7iX4j1tA https://youtu.be/11u7iX4j1tA The reality is, SSRIs and other pharmaceuticals that have been used to treat common psychiatric illnesses (anxiety/depression) have dismal outcomes and fail the vast majority of patients that they have been given to. Fortunately, there is a growing body of evidence that MDMA and psychedelic assisted therapy could revolutionize the treatment of mental health disorders. Unfortunately, for the last 50 years, governments, industry and the military industrial complex (together with the MSM) have spread lies and scaremongering to block the therapeutic use of these life-changing therapies. Here is another video for anyone wanting to know more about the topic: (Lecture by Prof. David Nutt: The New Psychedelic Revolution) https://youtu.be/1JjzVcfei60 https://youtu.be/1JjzVcfei60 I'm optimistic that the next few decades will bring about better approaches to these massively underserved (and largely exploited and discarded) people. References: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01336-3 https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01336-3 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09540261.2021.1919062 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09540261.2021.1...

copperx 5y ago

Regarding lying, I actually brought this up in my last therapy session because an SSRI gave me the opposite effect. Taking sertraline greatly reduced my ability (or rather, willingness) to lie. My psychiatrist attributed it to my improved self-confidence while on the drug. I'm not totally convinced. I do feel greater confidence indeed, but it seems like I'm less worried about what others think of me. It feels like there's not too much to gain from lying. I have taken other SSRIs before, but it is puzzling how each one has its own particular behavioral effects even though they all are increasing serotonin.