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HashiCorp IPO today
- jakub_g 5y agoEdit: DeGiro seems to have it now.
- telotortium 5y agoi.e. Hashicorp's IPO is today
- pas 5y agoHah, no IPO bump. Does anyone know any detail about their deal with their bank? https://www.google.com/finance/quote/HCP:NASDAQ?sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiQ38rIudf0AhU057sIHbVXCfUQ_AUoAXoECAEQAw https://www.google.com/finance/quote/HCP:NASDAQ?sa=X&ved=2ah...
- bugsense 5y agoIt was a pretty bad day for growth tech stocks today. Also they were already richly valued.
- khazhoux 5y agoMy understanding is that an IPO bump is good for optics, and good for underwriters, but bad for company itself (money left on table). Is that right?
- manquer 5y agoOnly if the company is looking to really raise a lot of money in the IPO. The bump and later positive price movements benefits employees and founders a lot, therefore helps in retention and lower compensation costs for new employees etc and also investors who sell .
- loeg 5y agoHow does a bump help employees/founders? Don't they have some fixed number of shares?
- gen220 5y agoEmployees’ ISOs are computed based on the most recent 409A valuation / share price. If an employee joins with ISOs based on a $40 share price, and the market price is $35 or $15 a quarter or two later, it is bad for morale. A bump, even a small one, means everyone is “in the black”, which is good for morale. Once employees are transitioned to RSUs, it’s less of a concern, because they’re still making money, just less money. It’s a big concern for ISOs granted close to an IPO, though. This is why some companies switch to RSUs within a year or so of an expected IPO date.
- kevstev 5y agoYou are confusing ideas, unless I am misunderstanding you. Any ISO's pre-ipo will have some strike price, that is typically rooted in some valuation- the valuation per share is really just a function of the number of shares outstanding and this routinely gets adjusted right before the ipo, but the value of those ISOs or other grant types remains the exact same- its the same as reverse split where the share price doubles, or a 2 for 1 split where the share price halves but you have twice the number of shares- its financially equivalent. You are really concerned with the valuation of the company when your grants were given, and what the valuation of the company is on the open market, and in the case of ISOs really just where the valuation of your options puts you above water. The IPO price in itself has nothing to do with either of those things, aside from a very brief moment in time after the opening auction where the company is worth the IPO price * shares outstanding. The only way having an IPO go down on the first day actually hurts an employee is if they start that day or are granted stock or options at the IPO price, and I don't believe this has ever happened. Stock prices don't matter, total company value does.
- gen220 5y ago> The only way having an IPO go down on the first day actually hurts an employee is if they start that day or are granted stock or options at the IPO price. This does routinely happen, because the 409A valuation for the quarter or more prior to an IPO is usually pretty close to the IPO valuation. Anybody who joins a company during that window of time will get ISO grants with unfavorable strike prices (prices close to the IPO price). These options could be worth nothing post-IPO if there’s a slump (in contrast to RSUs, which will always have value). The difference between a company’s valuation and share price is important but irrelevant to this conversation as far as I can tell. Sorry that imprecise language on my part in my earlier comment created that distraction. Edit: To be clear, the problem is not the bump or the slump (I tend to agree that it should be irrelevant, and if anything as a shareholder you may prefer a rational slump). Rather, it's the practice of granting ISOs at a soon-to-be market strike price that is the problem. The people with unfavorable ISO strike prices should be upset due to the strike price, not any slump or bump; but if there's a slump, they usually (incorrectly, IMO) blame the slump, and so the slump gets a bad rap internally. On the flip side, although I've never been in the position to make this decision, I find it unconscionable to offer ISOs as part of a compensation package within 6 months of an anticipated IPO date.
- matwood 5y agoIn pure dollars leaving too much on the table is bad, but a nice IPO bump is free marketing for the company. A 20-30% bump means it'll lead in a bunch of news stories, and create some buzz around the company. Of course, this might be less important for a non-consumer oriented company.
- ralph84 5y agoAt their valuation 20-30% is literally billions of dollars. You can buy a lot of ads with a billion dollars.
- Rastonbury 5y agoA bump means people in the market are trading their shares with each other at 20-30% higher than what the company sold to the market for, that's what it means by money on the table. It's as if they sold for below market value. An IPO pop cannot immediately be turned into cash to spend, can't pay for ads with stock
- OJFord 5y agoGP means that you can buy ads with money you don't leave on the table; that leaving it there as a PR stunt is probably not a good move.
- whimsicalism 5y agodid you say anything new that the above comment didn't?
- shortstuffsushi 5y agoCould you explain what you mean by this? From their launch at 80, they pretty quickly went up to ~90, then dropped back to 83-84, which is up a few percent for the day. What sort of bump do you expect? (Legitimately, I'm not familiar with this sort of thing)
- fragmede 5y agoThere were some companies during the original dot-com boom that immediately "popped" several hundred percent on opening day. Some of them even managed to stay there until the lockup period for employees was over, making them very rich.
- loeg 5y agoIt is relatively common for a stock to "pop" significantly more than that -- like 20+%. 80.00 offering to 85.19 close is only 6%. E.g., https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/trends-in-ipo-pops-2021-03-04 https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/trends-in-ipo-pops-2021-03-0... . One obvious problem with a pop is that it implies your stock was sold too cheaply and you could have raised more money for the same shares. However, your IPO investors love it. Direct Listings are IPO alternatives that are sometimes purported to solve IPO pops.
- morepork 5y ago6% seems a pretty good bump to me. Enough to get people interested, not so high that the company left heaps of cash on the table.
- Rastonbury 5y agoLooked decent, they priced at 72 and opened at 81, whilst the wider market tanked pretty hard, everything was red. Many saas stocks are down double digit over past week too.
- redisman 5y agoOther then cashing in equity has anyone found that a IPO has made a place better or worse for the employees? Big fan of Hashicorp products btw
- bri3d 5y agoI bet most answers to this question will conflate IPO problems with simple growth problems, and the two are hard to separate. After all, a constant drive for growth combined with accountability to a public board usually makes strong leadership and strategy challenging - it's easier IMO for public companies to fall into "we must do what is easy to hit our numbers now." On the flip side of the same coin, the ability to offer liquid equity and essentially pay employees using the company's projected growth (RSU issuance) is often financially lucrative for employees old and new and if done correctly, can attract a different group of really strong people who aren't in a place to take the startup gamble.
- throwaway1492 5y agoHopefully for their RSU awardees the leadership team doesn't hire a bunch of sales/marketing types, thereby increasing operating costs, and tank the stock price. Mostly the market expects to see continued organic growth in these types of companies. Does anyone have experience here? I've only seen it twice.
- nemo44x 5y agoBetter for your wallet, but worse for the job. The company changes. The type of people it attracts to leadership roles are not the kind of people you’d start a company with. They bring their “processes and methods” that they promise will scale the company and then they insulate themselves by hiring their friends to report to them. The culture is corrupt at this point and the technologists that built the company begin moving on to new challenges and you see an accelerating attrition. But the new leadership doesn’t mind as it removes credible threats to their questionable abilities. And they can backfill with more friends/lackies loyal to them. Within a few years post IPO the Composition of the company will have totally changed. The special place becomes a regular corporation. The hyenas will try to move on to the next Prize.
- bugsense 5y agoI think Hashicorp will enter monitoring next. Netdata would be a great fit (OSS, fat agent, huge metric granularity, deep infra and network insights)
- MetalMatze 5y agoWhat makes you think they will enter monitoring next?
- bugsense 5y agoThey have some many parts of spinning up/change the infrastructure (Terraform), connect the services (Consul), run the apps (Nomad) but not their own way to tell you how well they do. Also monitoring is quite sticky and high margin. I think it makes sense but have no special insight.
- cyberpunk 5y agoI'm not so sure. There's very little wrong with prometheus or influx + Grafana. We're about due another iteration of logging stuff now we've all gone graylog->splunk->elk->Loki though. (And they all suck)
- PanosJee 5y agoThe thing with Netdata is you don't make compromises on number of metrics and Cardinality as the data stay with the node. Netdata.cloud can aggregate on the fly without storing. Check it out
- rad_gruchalski 5y agoI’d love to see their managed platform on premise.
- roffo 5y agoprometheus is amazing though, would be hard to pull me off that
- NotSammyHagar 5y agoTheir symbol is hcp instead of hash, what a shame.
- snarf21 5y agoWell, it is kind of a hash of their name, no?
- jlmorton 5y agoCollides with Hearst Consolidated Publications. Algorithm reduces entropy quite a bit, not very strong
- digianarchist 5y agoTheir SaaS product range is called HCP https://www.hashicorp.com/cloud-platform https://www.hashicorp.com/cloud-platform
- thinkmassive 5y agoI would have preferred HCL
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- cyberpunk 5y agoI don't know a single person who prefers HCL over literally anything else, but still, it's a happy day for them so I won't air my entitled little complaints and instead say: thank you hashicorp! You made life as a cloud infra beard better for a while, and I wish you all success going onwards.
- yjftsjthsd-h 5y agoI like HCL vs JSON for Packer, mostly by virtue of supporting comments.
- 5y ago
- altdataseller 5y agoDon’t understand why anyone would need their cloud products. Who needs Terraform or Nomad or Vault as a service?
- manigandham 5y agoSame reason companies also buy cloud infrastructure and platforms as a service; to offload the deployment and operations.
- kache_ 5y agoLarge tech companies that are paying hashicorp oodles of money, who get first class support from a really great team.
- bigmattystyles 5y agoI assume this is sarcasm? If not - portability comes to mind.
- hpoe 5y agoI can tell where I work it came down to a simple question of having to maintain, control, update, publish and develop TF modules vs just buying the dang thing and not having to worry about it.
- Suchos 5y agoAt my company, they don't want to deploy OSS Vault on prem. Apparently we need the enterprise edition, because it is easier for our operations team.
- cyberpunk 5y agoHaving used vault quite a lot, I'm not really sold on it. Do you see any value in this tool? I've done the whole sidecar mess, middle of the night three keys unlock like we're arming a nuclear weapon and everything, and most of the time it's just been a total faff and imo security theatre vs actual security. End of the day, the secrets are being written to a .properties file or /proc/<pid>/env somewhere anyway and can be read by whomever has the permissions or the shellcode to do so..
- sytse 5y agoCongratulations Mitchell, Armon, Dave, and everyone else at Hashicorp. We made a blog post to celebrate https://about.gitlab.com/blog/2021/12/09/congratulations-to-hashicorp/ https://about.gitlab.com/blog/2021/12/09/congratulations-to-...
- outside1234 5y ago"please buy us with the money!"
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- 0des 5y agoStarting to see this a lot, and it makes all the words of encouragement feel fake, because it is always using words like "we" and linking back to their own stuff. It comes off as hollow. nerds: stop bringing your own cake to other people's birthday parties.
- lflux 5y agoMaybe with this IPO they can finally start reviewing terraform PRs again
- 988747 5y agoI doubt it. IPO will be the end of it - original investors will cash out, and the company will be left to slow death.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- jakub_g 5y agoQuestion to EU folks: do you see HCP at your stock broker? Out of curiosity, I checked the two stock brokers I have accounts with (Revolut and DeGiro), and it's not there yet. Do you know what EU (or French) brokers have the Nasdaq companies on the day of IPO?
- dddw 5y agoNot on bux zero
- yawnxyz 5y agoI just checked and found it on Schwab so bought a couple of share. Seems to work
- drexlspivey 5y agoTrading 212 and Interactive Brokers have it
- wirelesspotat 5y agoHCP is on Freetrade in the UK
- random123450987 5y agoBourseDirect has stocks at IPO
- michelb 5y agoI'm in the NL and I use Interactive Brokers, and it was available.
- politelemon 5y agoHargreaves Lansdown: Not seeing it.
- tikkabhuna 5y agoI've put a request in for it: https://www.hl.co.uk/help/dealing/share-dealing/investing-in-shares/what-do-i-do-if-i-cant-find-a-stock-on-the-platform https://www.hl.co.uk/help/dealing/share-dealing/investing-in... No idea the likelihood of them actually adding it though.
- nodesocket 5y agoThank you Mitchell and Armon. I essentially built my DevOps consulting company off the back of Packer and Terraform. I’ll be a long term $HCP shareholder.
- nunez 5y agoYou and a bunch of other founders!
- benjaminwootton 5y agoHi Carlos! Yes we were one of them. Hashicorp was a big part of our success (https://Contino.io https://Contino.io). Hashicorp were nice to work with. Congrats guys.
- Lamad123 5y agoI'd buy a few if they were 5 or even 30 dollars.
- andy_ppp 5y agoYes I think they'll do quite well, might be worth investing.
- 28uwedj 5y agonot at their current valuation.
- rvz 5y agoExactly. The pre-IPO investors and employees will sell some of their shares now to take their profits in as retail now buys HCP at these prices, at a time of lots of uncertainty and 'fear' in the markets as of 9 Dec 2021. [0] I'm expecting it to rise due to retail investor hype. I would avoid it for now at these prices at this time. We'll see after this period of uncertainty and after the lockup period expiring in 180 days after the IPO. [0] https://money.cnn.com/data/fear-and-greed/ https://money.cnn.com/data/fear-and-greed/
- rileymat2 5y agoCan someone explain the revenue declines in 2019? https://www.google.com/finance/quote/HCP:NASDAQ https://www.google.com/finance/quote/HCP:NASDAQ Or is this a Google Fiance Bug?
- shawabawa3 5y ago99% sure those metrics are wrong
- poopypoopington 5y agoDamn Google makes Fiance now??
- taf2 5y agoThanks HashiCorp... it's nice to write lines like this less often: ``` sudo dd if=/dev/zero of=/tmpswap bs=4096 count=1M && sudo chmod 0600 /tmpswap && sudo chown root:root /tmpswap && sudo mkswap /tmpswap && sudo swapon /tmpswap ```
- yjftsjthsd-h 5y agoI'm not following; what does HashiCorp have to do with needing a swap file?
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- dandigangi 5y agoDefinitely going to be buying up shares. Love their products and see Vault/TF (among the other products) growing their role in cloud/security.
- jtdev 5y agoCan’t I just use Vault and TF free though? I don’t even think they require licensing at some gross revenue threshold… just monetizing through their TF Cloud, which is not compelling.
- davewritescode 5y agoHonestly I’m kinda not a huge fan of Hashicorp these days. They’re super late to managed services and they’re incredibly expensive.
- makeitdouble 5y agoThis could read as you being frustrated they're smaller than Amazon
- 1cvmask 5y agoWhat do you mean by incredibly expensive and compared to?
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- Animats 5y agoSo they sell orchestration tools for managing server farms, right?
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- atlgator 5y agoDon't buy at IPO. Buy after the lockup expires.
- stevofolife 5y agoHow do one check this?
- hkmurakami 5y agotypically 6 months / 180 days.
- 55555 5y agoProbably in the S1
- flanbiscuit 5y agoLooks like 180 days Page 63 https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1720671/000119312521319849/d205906ds1.htm https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1720671/000119312521... "We and all of our directors, officers, and holders of approximately % of our outstanding stock and equity securities are subject to lock-up agreements with the underwriters that restrict their ability to transfer such shares of stock and such securities, including any hedging transactions, during the period ending on the date that is 180 days after the date of this prospectus, as further described in the section titled “Shares Eligible for Future Sale.”
- _blz2 5y agoIts usually 6 months. But there may be an alternative 'limited' lock up triggered earlier if the stock price is above a certain level continuously for a certain period of time.
- financetechbro 5y ago424B4 (final prospectus) under the section “shares eligible for future sale”, there will be a lockup section.
- 5y ago