12 ms·

Amazon’s new Kindle Paperwhite

131 points by herrkanin 5y ago

encryptluks2 5y ago
Is USB-C new here? I still cringe at the number of devices using older micro-USB. Those cables are probe to breaking multiple times a year.
- bredren 5y ago
  It is not. kindle enthusiasts were surprised Amazon neglected to put USV-C on their expensive flagship Kindle Oasis years ago. For what it’s worth, the variance in behavior between USB-C cables is so large I almost prefer micro at this point.
  - dotancohen 5y ago
    > For what it’s worth, the variance in behavior between > USB-C cables is so large I almost prefer micro at this point. For high-bandwidth or fast-charge devices, sure. But for an E-Ink reader that you charge overnight once per month? I highly doubt that it would be an issue.
    - thesuitonym 5y ago
      I think the problem is that this device will come with a USB-C cable that won't be good for much beside charging a Kindle, but could be plugged into something that wants higher power. USB-C's greatest asset, that it is becoming truly a universal cable, is also kind of a problem--but probably less of a problem than the one it solves.
      - bredren 5y ago
        Yes this and also many of these types of devices won’t charge from say, an Apple TB3 cable.
  - Rebelgecko 5y ago
    FWIW, my current Kindle is pickier about charging sources than any USB-C device I've ever owned. It absolutely refuses to charge via my alarm clock's USB port, which (with a USB-A to USB-C cable) will happily charge my headphones, portable battery, phones, and even my laptop (albeit very slowly)
- salamandersauce 5y ago
  In the eReader space. Kobo released their first eReader with USB C a few months ago with the Elipsa which is a 10" reader and in a bit of a different category. These are Amazon's first eReaders to have USB C too. Otherwise to get eInk and USB C you had to go with smaller players like Oynx and Boyue.
  - dr_kiszonka 5y ago
    Have you used the Elipsa? I am curious how well the stylus works for note taking.
franciscop 5y ago
Very nice to see they finally moved to USB-C. I will buy it (broke my previous paperwhite trying to hack a usb-c component into it) since that's the last piece of hardware I own that still hadn't upgraded to USB-C. It's still bonkers to me that I can charge my macbook, android and kindle with the same cable but if you are "all Apple" you need at least 3 different cables. It seems that even Apple is slowly moving over though, the holdouts used to be "Apple and Kindle" and now it's just "some Apple devices".
- auslegung 5y ago
  What are the three cables? Lightning, usb-c, and ??
  - timemct 5y ago
    I assume the third is for an Apple Watch.
    - 8ytecoder 5y ago
      Four actually - I prefer the MagSafe+Qi.
  - franciscop 5y ago
    The custom charger for the Apple Watch
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- toomuchtodo 5y ago
  Wireless charging is where it’s at, and it’s waterproof rated!
- thrower123 5y ago
  I still don't have a single USB-C device. Especially for something like a Kindle that doesn't draw any power, microUSB is fine.
atlasunshrugged 5y ago
Pumped for this, I had the most basic model for a long while but unfortunately left it on a plane and haven't been back to the US/EU to replace it. Anyone who used the previous Paperwhite version have thoughts on the tradeoffs of this versus the most basic version or an Ipad? I read a lot and might use something like an Ipad for netflix but I basically perpetually have my laptop with me anyways (just don't enjoy reading on it as I like something I can slip in my back pocket).
- maybeOneDay 5y ago
  I can only speak for myself but given the choice I would never read an ebook on a digital screen over an e-ink screen. The difference to me is night and day. I have an older paperwhite and the backlight is truly wonderful, I imagine a newer model would improve on this (I believe they have a warmth adjustment setting which I would personally adore).
- organsnyder 5y ago
  It really comes down to your usage habits and preferences. I've found that I simply can't focus on reading on a phone or tablet, since there are too many distractions.
  - atlasunshrugged 5y ago
    Yeah, I do worry that I'll get distracted by shiny objects if I don't have a dedicated device as well but haven't experimented with it so I'm not sure.
  - haliskerbas 5y ago
    The only distraction for me on an e-ink screen is the awe at how it close to paper it looks like.
- tw04 5y ago
  I’ve had the oasis for a couple years so can’t comment on this vs base. I will say I would never go back to reading on an iPad which I did a long long time ago. Waterproof is also key for me. Being able to read sitting by a pool, on a boat, or at the beach and not having to worry makes it infinitely more useful to me.
dmix 5y ago
Are page turns near instant yet? I'm on a 6yr old Paperwhite Kindle still, still have another 9yr old one that works too (these things last forever).
- toast0 5y ago
  Amazon recently sent me a (refurb) Paperwhite 4 (2018), and its page turns are much faster than my ancient Kindle Keyboards (one of which had 3g, thus the free Kindle). The new one felt like instant page turns to me and I like that the screen isn't inset, but there is something weird about the screen that I don't care for, so I went back to the Keyboard.
  - fastball 5y ago
    You might not be used to the much higher screen resolution. I would try it a bit longer, as higher resolution generally means less eye strain in the long term.
- scoopertrooper 5y ago
  They say they've improved it 20% over the last model. So presumably it's at a minimum 20% faster than the one you have. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/09/amazon-announces-new-kindle-paperwhite-lineup-with-6-8-inch-screens-usb-c/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/09/amazon-announces-new...
acabal 5y ago
The hardware's fine, but software-wise Kindle is still a horrible ereader. It still refuses to read epubs, the de-facto ebook format used by the rest of the world. Its native formats are terrible: mobi is an ancient, horrible proprietary binary format. If you get a nicer modern mobi but use "send to Kindle" to transfer it, Amazon inexplicably and silently removes all advanced formatting, effectively downgrading it to a mobi from 2002. azw3, its own proprietary format that competes with its other two proprietary formats (the third being kfx), is kind of a repackaged epub but more annoying to create, not open source, still lacking in many of the formatting features we expect from ebooks in 2021, and incompatible with "send to Kindle"!! The fact that Amazon has three competing proprietary ebook formats, each more terrible than the last and one of which literally can't be sent to its own devices, should be telling. Kindle software is software made by people who hate reading. If you want an ereader, get literally any other device. Don't support Amazon's disdain for the market it has a stranglehold on.
- xutopia 5y ago
  What good alternatives are there though? I failed to find anything good a few years ago when I needed an e-reader.
  - deadalus 5y ago
    Kobo is the best alternative and they provide software updates to sort out issues. It supports epub and pdf.
    - zcmack 5y ago
      i almost bought a Kobo earlier this year but talked myself back into the Kindle ecosystem just for whispersync. while i vastly prefer reading on the kindle itself, i do often find myself reading on my phone during unexpected downtime. MOBI sucks but even self-converted epub MOBI seamlessly syncs progress.
  - josefresco 5y ago
    Today on HN there's an extensive thread about Kobo readers. Here: http://devinlogan.org/e-readers.html http://devinlogan.org/e-readers.html Thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28585129 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28585129
metadata 5y ago
This is a beautiful device. I wonder how much it improves over the existing one, though. Thinking about it, usb-c cable and faster ui are valuable. Larger screen, probably not a big deal.
- trey-jones 5y ago
  I actually think the smaller bezel might make it harder to hold without accidentally turning pages or otherwise bumping the display.
  - Someone1234 5y ago
    That's one area where I feel like there has been a regression. Back when eInk ebook readers were new several had physical "flappy paddles" to flip pages, it was glorious. Now they all use touch or gesture controls, and holding the thing is not really a consideration. Unfortunately because Amazon has little to no competition in the space and offers no choice, you cannot vote with your wallet as it were.
    - kemayo 5y ago
      Amazon does have the Kindle Oasis[1] which has physical buttons for page turning, and a design with a different take on how you hold it from a regular Kindle. It's the expensive model, though, so very much "vote with your wallet" in a different sense than you meant. [1] https://www.amazon.com/All-new-Kindle-Oasis-now-with-adjustable-warm-light/dp/B07F7TLZF4 https://www.amazon.com/All-new-Kindle-Oasis-now-with-adjusta...
    - nicholassmith 5y ago
      The downside of the flip buttons was they seemed quite fragile on the two Kindles I had with them, but I much preferred that over the touchscreen tap.
josefresco 5y ago
One thing I hate about my Kindle: How it handles photos. Books have photos, even nerdy history books (like I read). Photos on the Kindle are small, difficult to enlarge/zoom and just plain terrible.
- handrous 5y ago
  E-reader UX degrades fast as you introduce more elements outside the body text. They're great for a huge percentage of what actual gets read (genre fic and "airport book" sorts of nonfiction) but the limitations show up fast when you move outside that set of content.
ruined 5y ago
you can get an old ereader at a thrift store for about six dollars. usually they don't have a screen light, but that just means i go to bed on time. they're often rootable but i don't even bother, i just side-load epubs and keep any wireless off. online services are all eol anyway. i keep around a couple at a time and give them out if someone mentions they need a thing to read. the batteries all still last forever. what's the advantage of a new device? somebody convince me.
- m0ngr31 5y ago
  I do most of my reading at night, so the backlight is a big feature add for me. If you don't need it then there isn't a lot of convincing anyone can do for you.
lordleft 5y ago
Is there any reason why Amazon doesn't license out their store (or make it accessible) to non-kindle ereaders like the kobo? I'd love to be able to read a kindle ebook on some of the other readers on the market. For a company that doesn't typically balk at making their products available on other platforms, Amazon is surprisingly locked down here.
- atlasunshrugged 5y ago
  Why would it? It wants to push its ever increasing hardware ecosystem onto people and there probably is a tendency for a user who has one device from a company to keep buying more, whether a fire tv or an alexa.
kemayo 5y ago
An apparent major increase in battery life is good to see, because the battery life on Kindles has been going downhill for a while. It doesn't help that Amazon insists on marketing them "based on a half hour of reading per day with wireless off and the light setting at 13". This doesn't align with my reading habits, so there's always a bit of subliminal disappointment at misleading-promises.
arepublicadoceu 5y ago
So let me give my review of using kindle for the last three years. I feel like kindle have two kinds of users: - Orthodox user: only buy amazon books - Unorthodox user: sideload books because doesn’t agree with drm or any other valid reason. Ways in which amazon mess with unorthodox users: - you can only sync using mobi and now you have a completely crippled book with horrible formatting; - you have an almost good enough formatting with azw3 + calibre css kung fu but now you don’t have sync; - want to see the cover on your sideloaded book? You need to either use it offline or use calibre workaround disconnecting the usb and reconnecting after sideloading it. - Want to jailbreak your device? if you’re on the newest firmware you’re absolutely out of luck So, if you’re an unorthodox user, do yourself a favor and buy any other brand of ereader. God knows whatelse amazon will do to nudge us into their walled garden on the years to come.
- fassssst 5y ago
  Kindle also has great integration with Overdrive though. I use the Libby app on my phone to send library books to my Kindle. They get delivered directly from Amazon and it’s the same experience as if you had bought it.
  - arepublicadoceu 5y ago
    Sadly, there’s no overdrive support on my country, so I never considered this usecase. But I’m happy that it works for you!
  - bgorman 5y ago
    Rakuten eReaders also have this integration. In fact, Rakuten owned Overdrive for a while.
  - v77 5y ago
    Thanks for this, I like my Kindle but want to get library e-books onto there.
- ehutch79 5y ago
  I thought amazon stopped supporting mobi files?
dstaley 5y ago
With all these updates, I really hope Rakuten takes note and releases a true Paperwhite competitor this year. I'm leaning towards Kobo for the more open ecosystem, and the fact that you can sync books via Dropbox officially or via big standard Linux applications sideloaded onto the Kobo. However if Kobo even updates any of their readers this holiday season, I suspect they'd only update the Forma, which has a form factor more similar to the Kindle Oasis than the Paperwhite (and a price to match).
m0ngr31 5y ago
I've been using a 2nd gen Paperwhite for a long time. This might be the one I upgrade to (for the waterproofing and the warm light). I really don't like Amazon though, so it's been a hard justification. Kindle is the only thing left I use that is Amazon. I've thought about switching to Kobo, but I'm not sure it's worth it with how easy everything is on the Kindle. I run a docker container with Calibre, and I use it to send all my books to the Kindle over e-mail. I would lose that functionality on the Kobo. I'd have to go back to manually syncing which would be a pain.
- SavantIdiot 5y ago
  The only reason I needed to replace my 2nd gen paperwhite is because it fell out of my dry-sack into a river on a canoeing camping trip this summer. That thing had been backpacking to two dozen countries with me over a decade.
  - m0ngr31 5y ago
    Yeah it really has been a tank for me as well. The waterproofing would be really nice.
  - beardyw 5y ago
    I rinsed and left an old kindle to dry for a couple of weeks and it was fine.
    - SavantIdiot 5y ago
      I sent it back and got $25 credit.
- fastball 5y ago
  Calibre runs on Mac/Win/Lin, why do you run it in a Docker container?
  - m0ngr31 5y ago
    I have it running on my Unraid box with a million other docker containers and all my media. That way I don't need to worry about keeping my ebooks organized on more than one machine.
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yololol 5y ago
I'm still looking forward to an e-reader that will allow me to comfortably read academic papers. The usual two-column format on pdf is very uncomfortable on small readers. The obvious choice is to use an A4-sized reader. While I haven't tried one myself, I think that to some extent it defeats the whole purpose.
UncleOxidant 5y ago
Amazon has shrunken down the bezels on the new Paperwhite. Given that the bezels are the primary place that you generally hold a Kindle, we’ll have to see the new device in person to gauge how that change works, although generally smaller bezels are a good thing in the tech world. In my experience thin bezels are a liability in an e-reader. The thin bezel means I often accidentally touch the screen and it advances (or goes back) to another page.
wallaBBB 5y ago
I have high hopes for PineNote by PINE64. A lot more than a reader. They're promising a lot, hope they deliver. Some might not like the large size, or lack of robustness you find with dedicated ereaders like Kobos.
sundvor 5y ago
USB C and colour temperature? I gave up waiting for this and ordered the Paperwhite with a leather cover a couple of months ago on special. I had the strongest feeling I'd regret not waiting longer, and it has thus been proven correct. Have been using Kindles since the DXG, which I still have.
MerelyMortal 5y ago
My theory is that it's easier for a company to lose customers, than it is to gain customers, with product updates. Its overall dimensions are 0.3" taller and 0.3" wider than the current Paperwhite. At that size it will no longer fit in my pockets (my current one just barely fit), and thus will no longer be convenient to use, meaning it's worthless to me. I never used my Paperwhite and though, "Gee, I wish the screen was bigger." I guess I'm not their target audience. I like to read wherever I go, and that means being able to take my Kindle wherever I go. I wish Amazon kept it small, I need a new eReader and was holding out for Amazon's update, but now I am going to have to look elsewhere.
- TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
  One reason I don't use e-readers more is because I wish the screen was bigger. 10" would do, 12" would be better. Of course it doesn't have to be either/or, but I suspect a lot of older people would be very happy to have larger readers. I also suspect the margins on these readers are insane.
knaik94 5y ago
For anyone looking for a more open experience, I have had only positive things to say about the Likebook P6. It's a 6inch android powered eink ereader that is around 120-140. It only has 1gb of ram and aggressive background task sleeping so it's not going to competing with any regular tablet, but it's a lot better than kindle in my opinion. You can run the kindle android app, libby, overdrive, scibd, and my favorite app for reading Moon+ Reader. It's not going to be as simple as a Kindle but for anyone who understands what sideloading is (books or apps), I strongly recommend it. There's are larger screen p78 (7.8") and p10 (10") as well. And if you care about having stricter quality control and are willing to pay, Boox products also an option. Boox also run android. After I jailbroke my kindle keyboard and then my kobo glo hd, there's no way I could ever go back to limited reading formats. The most useful app in each situation is KoReader. KoReader runs on Android and so before you decide on a ereader, try our that software and see if it's something you want to live without. It supports "(PDF, DjVu, CBT, CBZ) and reflowable e-book formats (EPUB, FB2, Mobi, DOC, CHM, TXT)" and runs on Kindle with jailbreak, Kobo without Jailbreak, Remarkable, and android so Likebooks and Boox. And Calibre is the useful regardless od what ereader you have, it's even great for iOS. Kobo has dropbox sync and Android has a native app as well as apps like foldersync to do native syncing. If you're okay spending a little time setting things up how you like them, Kindle is the least competitive device on the market in terms of features.
denysvitali 5y ago
Guess who bought a Paperwhite 2 months ago? Anyways, despite the new model I'm still fairly happy with my purchase. I don't read a lot (in fact I bought the Kindle just to use it while on a vacation), but I have to admit that epaper in general is something I never had the need to use - until I tried the Kindle. The software still sucks though, but that will probably not change with an upgraded HW release :) As other people mentioned here, Amazon is really locking in their users on formats that are beneficial to them only - but for its price I guess that these kind of limitations are okay-ish
- culopatin 5y ago
  I got a second one that is arriving today but I paid $40 with student discount. I think at that price is not worth 100 more. The only reason I’d upgrade is that I never use the light because it’s SO DAMN BLUE. From all the colors of LEDs to choose I don’t know why they went with this one. The yellowish color should be the default for everything.
- sundvor 5y ago
  I am in exactly the same boat. I did order the new one as well though, the version with the light sensors, because I like reading at night and the current light is too blue for my liking. The extra display size is a great bonus, and can I just say Type C charging finally. I've been ok reading my Mannings books on it, and I love my selection of Prime books. Will give current device to my son.
comeonseriously 5y ago
> With the waterproof Kindle Paperwhite, you’re free to read and relax in more places—from the beach to the bath. Kindle Paperwhite is IPX8 rated to protect against accidental immersion in up to two meters of fresh water for up to 60 minutes, and up to 0.25 meters of seawater for up to 3 minutes. Learn more about waterproof features. I wish companies would start getting challenged on this. It is NOT water PROOF. It's water RESISTANT.
- fastball 5y ago
  IPX8 is practically the highest waterproof rating for consumer electronics, not exactly sure how you want them to do better. Literally no electronic device is perfectly waterproof.
georgeecollins 5y ago
As a daily kindle book reader there are two things I would like to see in a future model. The first is page turn buttons like the ones they had in the oasis. Touch screens are great, but the ones on kindles are not state of the art. And they work terribly if the device gets wet. Page turn buttons just work. Very old kindles had a headphone jack. This was also always a nice thing to have.
- kawsper 5y ago
  I upgraded from one with buttons to the Oasis and I hate it, you're never sure where to press, or if you accidentally makes a double press or press something by mistake. The tactile feedback from buttons compared to the terrible touchscreen of the Oasis was such a disappointment that it made me read less books on the Kindle platform.
damontal 5y ago
I bought an Oasis for the warm light option and it was well worth it. My use case is reading in bed and the old Paperwhite would hurt my eyes no matter what setting I used. The Oasis, with the the ability to use warm light and invert to light text on a dark background made it possible for me to read comfortably in a dark room. The problem as always is not being able to quickly navigate around a book. Not a huge problem for linear fiction but for anything else, even more complex fiction (I'm currently reading The Divine Comedy), it's really annoying when you want to jump forward and back through the text. End notes are getting better with links that open up an overlay on the page but if I want to reference a previous section of the book I have to figure out where that section is and how to get there, sometimes using the search function -- all of this means I rarely bother. I have a book light that was too bright so I wrapped a few layers of masking tape over it to make it much dimmer and warmer. I'm going to start using that with physical books I think.
yayajacky 5y ago
Would this one support using Bluetooth audio control to turn pages?

131 points by herrkanin 5y ago

Is USB-C new here? I still cringe at the number of devices using older micro-USB. Those cables are probe to breaking multiple times a year.

bredren 5y ago
It is not. kindle enthusiasts were surprised Amazon neglected to put USV-C on their expensive flagship Kindle Oasis years ago. For what it’s worth, the variance in behavior between USB-C cables is so large I almost prefer micro at this point.
- dotancohen 5y ago
  > For what it’s worth, the variance in behavior between > USB-C cables is so large I almost prefer micro at this point. For high-bandwidth or fast-charge devices, sure. But for an E-Ink reader that you charge overnight once per month? I highly doubt that it would be an issue.
  - thesuitonym 5y ago
    I think the problem is that this device will come with a USB-C cable that won't be good for much beside charging a Kindle, but could be plugged into something that wants higher power. USB-C's greatest asset, that it is becoming truly a universal cable, is also kind of a problem--but probably less of a problem than the one it solves.
    - bredren 5y ago
      Yes this and also many of these types of devices won’t charge from say, an Apple TB3 cable.
- Rebelgecko 5y ago
  FWIW, my current Kindle is pickier about charging sources than any USB-C device I've ever owned. It absolutely refuses to charge via my alarm clock's USB port, which (with a USB-A to USB-C cable) will happily charge my headphones, portable battery, phones, and even my laptop (albeit very slowly)
salamandersauce 5y ago
In the eReader space. Kobo released their first eReader with USB C a few months ago with the Elipsa which is a 10" reader and in a bit of a different category. These are Amazon's first eReaders to have USB C too. Otherwise to get eInk and USB C you had to go with smaller players like Oynx and Boyue.
- dr_kiszonka 5y ago
  Have you used the Elipsa? I am curious how well the stylus works for note taking.

franciscop 5y ago

Very nice to see they finally moved to USB-C. I will buy it (broke my previous paperwhite trying to hack a usb-c component into it) since that's the last piece of hardware I own that still hadn't upgraded to USB-C. It's still bonkers to me that I can charge my macbook, android and kindle with the same cable but if you are "all Apple" you need at least 3 different cables. It seems that even Apple is slowly moving over though, the holdouts used to be "Apple and Kindle" and now it's just "some Apple devices".

auslegung 5y ago
What are the three cables? Lightning, usb-c, and ??
- timemct 5y ago
  I assume the third is for an Apple Watch.
  - 8ytecoder 5y ago
    Four actually - I prefer the MagSafe+Qi.
- franciscop 5y ago
  The custom charger for the Apple Watch
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toomuchtodo 5y ago
Wireless charging is where it’s at, and it’s waterproof rated!
thrower123 5y ago
I still don't have a single USB-C device. Especially for something like a Kindle that doesn't draw any power, microUSB is fine.

atlasunshrugged 5y ago

Pumped for this, I had the most basic model for a long while but unfortunately left it on a plane and haven't been back to the US/EU to replace it. Anyone who used the previous Paperwhite version have thoughts on the tradeoffs of this versus the most basic version or an Ipad? I read a lot and might use something like an Ipad for netflix but I basically perpetually have my laptop with me anyways (just don't enjoy reading on it as I like something I can slip in my back pocket).

maybeOneDay 5y ago
I can only speak for myself but given the choice I would never read an ebook on a digital screen over an e-ink screen. The difference to me is night and day. I have an older paperwhite and the backlight is truly wonderful, I imagine a newer model would improve on this (I believe they have a warmth adjustment setting which I would personally adore).
organsnyder 5y ago
It really comes down to your usage habits and preferences. I've found that I simply can't focus on reading on a phone or tablet, since there are too many distractions.
- atlasunshrugged 5y ago
  Yeah, I do worry that I'll get distracted by shiny objects if I don't have a dedicated device as well but haven't experimented with it so I'm not sure.
- haliskerbas 5y ago
  The only distraction for me on an e-ink screen is the awe at how it close to paper it looks like.
tw04 5y ago
I’ve had the oasis for a couple years so can’t comment on this vs base. I will say I would never go back to reading on an iPad which I did a long long time ago. Waterproof is also key for me. Being able to read sitting by a pool, on a boat, or at the beach and not having to worry makes it infinitely more useful to me.

dmix 5y ago

Are page turns near instant yet? I'm on a 6yr old Paperwhite Kindle still, still have another 9yr old one that works too (these things last forever).

toast0 5y ago
Amazon recently sent me a (refurb) Paperwhite 4 (2018), and its page turns are much faster than my ancient Kindle Keyboards (one of which had 3g, thus the free Kindle). The new one felt like instant page turns to me and I like that the screen isn't inset, but there is something weird about the screen that I don't care for, so I went back to the Keyboard.
- fastball 5y ago
  You might not be used to the much higher screen resolution. I would try it a bit longer, as higher resolution generally means less eye strain in the long term.
scoopertrooper 5y ago
They say they've improved it 20% over the last model. So presumably it's at a minimum 20% faster than the one you have. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/09/amazon-announces-new-kindle-paperwhite-lineup-with-6-8-inch-screens-usb-c/ https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/09/amazon-announces-new...

acabal 5y ago

The hardware's fine, but software-wise Kindle is still a horrible ereader. It still refuses to read epubs, the de-facto ebook format used by the rest of the world. Its native formats are terrible: mobi is an ancient, horrible proprietary binary format. If you get a nicer modern mobi but use "send to Kindle" to transfer it, Amazon inexplicably and silently removes all advanced formatting, effectively downgrading it to a mobi from 2002. azw3, its own proprietary format that competes with its other two proprietary formats (the third being kfx), is kind of a repackaged epub but more annoying to create, not open source, still lacking in many of the formatting features we expect from ebooks in 2021, and incompatible with "send to Kindle"!! The fact that Amazon has three competing proprietary ebook formats, each more terrible than the last and one of which literally can't be sent to its own devices, should be telling. Kindle software is software made by people who hate reading. If you want an ereader, get literally any other device. Don't support Amazon's disdain for the market it has a stranglehold on.

xutopia 5y ago
What good alternatives are there though? I failed to find anything good a few years ago when I needed an e-reader.
- deadalus 5y ago
  Kobo is the best alternative and they provide software updates to sort out issues. It supports epub and pdf.
  - zcmack 5y ago
    i almost bought a Kobo earlier this year but talked myself back into the Kindle ecosystem just for whispersync. while i vastly prefer reading on the kindle itself, i do often find myself reading on my phone during unexpected downtime. MOBI sucks but even self-converted epub MOBI seamlessly syncs progress.
- josefresco 5y ago
  Today on HN there's an extensive thread about Kobo readers. Here: http://devinlogan.org/e-readers.html http://devinlogan.org/e-readers.html Thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28585129 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28585129

metadata 5y ago

This is a beautiful device. I wonder how much it improves over the existing one, though. Thinking about it, usb-c cable and faster ui are valuable. Larger screen, probably not a big deal.

trey-jones 5y ago
I actually think the smaller bezel might make it harder to hold without accidentally turning pages or otherwise bumping the display.
- Someone1234 5y ago
  That's one area where I feel like there has been a regression. Back when eInk ebook readers were new several had physical "flappy paddles" to flip pages, it was glorious. Now they all use touch or gesture controls, and holding the thing is not really a consideration. Unfortunately because Amazon has little to no competition in the space and offers no choice, you cannot vote with your wallet as it were.
  - kemayo 5y ago
    Amazon does have the Kindle Oasis[1] which has physical buttons for page turning, and a design with a different take on how you hold it from a regular Kindle. It's the expensive model, though, so very much "vote with your wallet" in a different sense than you meant. [1] https://www.amazon.com/All-new-Kindle-Oasis-now-with-adjustable-warm-light/dp/B07F7TLZF4 https://www.amazon.com/All-new-Kindle-Oasis-now-with-adjusta...
  - nicholassmith 5y ago
    The downside of the flip buttons was they seemed quite fragile on the two Kindles I had with them, but I much preferred that over the touchscreen tap.

josefresco 5y ago

One thing I hate about my Kindle: How it handles photos. Books have photos, even nerdy history books (like I read). Photos on the Kindle are small, difficult to enlarge/zoom and just plain terrible.

handrous 5y ago
E-reader UX degrades fast as you introduce more elements outside the body text. They're great for a huge percentage of what actual gets read (genre fic and "airport book" sorts of nonfiction) but the limitations show up fast when you move outside that set of content.

ruined 5y ago

you can get an old ereader at a thrift store for about six dollars. usually they don't have a screen light, but that just means i go to bed on time. they're often rootable but i don't even bother, i just side-load epubs and keep any wireless off. online services are all eol anyway. i keep around a couple at a time and give them out if someone mentions they need a thing to read. the batteries all still last forever. what's the advantage of a new device? somebody convince me.

m0ngr31 5y ago
I do most of my reading at night, so the backlight is a big feature add for me. If you don't need it then there isn't a lot of convincing anyone can do for you.

lordleft 5y ago

Is there any reason why Amazon doesn't license out their store (or make it accessible) to non-kindle ereaders like the kobo? I'd love to be able to read a kindle ebook on some of the other readers on the market. For a company that doesn't typically balk at making their products available on other platforms, Amazon is surprisingly locked down here.

atlasunshrugged 5y ago
Why would it? It wants to push its ever increasing hardware ecosystem onto people and there probably is a tendency for a user who has one device from a company to keep buying more, whether a fire tv or an alexa.

kemayo 5y ago

An apparent major increase in battery life is good to see, because the battery life on Kindles has been going downhill for a while. It doesn't help that Amazon insists on marketing them "based on a half hour of reading per day with wireless off and the light setting at 13". This doesn't align with my reading habits, so there's always a bit of subliminal disappointment at misleading-promises.

arepublicadoceu 5y ago

So let me give my review of using kindle for the last three years. I feel like kindle have two kinds of users: - Orthodox user: only buy amazon books - Unorthodox user: sideload books because doesn’t agree with drm or any other valid reason. Ways in which amazon mess with unorthodox users: - you can only sync using mobi and now you have a completely crippled book with horrible formatting; - you have an almost good enough formatting with azw3 + calibre css kung fu but now you don’t have sync; - want to see the cover on your sideloaded book? You need to either use it offline or use calibre workaround disconnecting the usb and reconnecting after sideloading it. - Want to jailbreak your device? if you’re on the newest firmware you’re absolutely out of luck So, if you’re an unorthodox user, do yourself a favor and buy any other brand of ereader. God knows whatelse amazon will do to nudge us into their walled garden on the years to come.

fassssst 5y ago
Kindle also has great integration with Overdrive though. I use the Libby app on my phone to send library books to my Kindle. They get delivered directly from Amazon and it’s the same experience as if you had bought it.
- arepublicadoceu 5y ago
  Sadly, there’s no overdrive support on my country, so I never considered this usecase. But I’m happy that it works for you!
- bgorman 5y ago
  Rakuten eReaders also have this integration. In fact, Rakuten owned Overdrive for a while.
- v77 5y ago
  Thanks for this, I like my Kindle but want to get library e-books onto there.
ehutch79 5y ago
I thought amazon stopped supporting mobi files?

dstaley 5y ago

With all these updates, I really hope Rakuten takes note and releases a true Paperwhite competitor this year. I'm leaning towards Kobo for the more open ecosystem, and the fact that you can sync books via Dropbox officially or via big standard Linux applications sideloaded onto the Kobo. However if Kobo even updates any of their readers this holiday season, I suspect they'd only update the Forma, which has a form factor more similar to the Kindle Oasis than the Paperwhite (and a price to match).

m0ngr31 5y ago

I've been using a 2nd gen Paperwhite for a long time. This might be the one I upgrade to (for the waterproofing and the warm light). I really don't like Amazon though, so it's been a hard justification. Kindle is the only thing left I use that is Amazon. I've thought about switching to Kobo, but I'm not sure it's worth it with how easy everything is on the Kindle. I run a docker container with Calibre, and I use it to send all my books to the Kindle over e-mail. I would lose that functionality on the Kobo. I'd have to go back to manually syncing which would be a pain.

SavantIdiot 5y ago
The only reason I needed to replace my 2nd gen paperwhite is because it fell out of my dry-sack into a river on a canoeing camping trip this summer. That thing had been backpacking to two dozen countries with me over a decade.
- m0ngr31 5y ago
  Yeah it really has been a tank for me as well. The waterproofing would be really nice.
- beardyw 5y ago
  I rinsed and left an old kindle to dry for a couple of weeks and it was fine.
  - SavantIdiot 5y ago
    I sent it back and got $25 credit.
fastball 5y ago
Calibre runs on Mac/Win/Lin, why do you run it in a Docker container?
- m0ngr31 5y ago
  I have it running on my Unraid box with a million other docker containers and all my media. That way I don't need to worry about keeping my ebooks organized on more than one machine.

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yololol 5y ago

I'm still looking forward to an e-reader that will allow me to comfortably read academic papers. The usual two-column format on pdf is very uncomfortable on small readers. The obvious choice is to use an A4-sized reader. While I haven't tried one myself, I think that to some extent it defeats the whole purpose.

UncleOxidant 5y ago

Amazon has shrunken down the bezels on the new Paperwhite. Given that the bezels are the primary place that you generally hold a Kindle, we’ll have to see the new device in person to gauge how that change works, although generally smaller bezels are a good thing in the tech world. In my experience thin bezels are a liability in an e-reader. The thin bezel means I often accidentally touch the screen and it advances (or goes back) to another page.

wallaBBB 5y ago

I have high hopes for PineNote by PINE64. A lot more than a reader. They're promising a lot, hope they deliver. Some might not like the large size, or lack of robustness you find with dedicated ereaders like Kobos.

sundvor 5y ago

USB C and colour temperature? I gave up waiting for this and ordered the Paperwhite with a leather cover a couple of months ago on special. I had the strongest feeling I'd regret not waiting longer, and it has thus been proven correct. Have been using Kindles since the DXG, which I still have.

MerelyMortal 5y ago

My theory is that it's easier for a company to lose customers, than it is to gain customers, with product updates. Its overall dimensions are 0.3" taller and 0.3" wider than the current Paperwhite. At that size it will no longer fit in my pockets (my current one just barely fit), and thus will no longer be convenient to use, meaning it's worthless to me. I never used my Paperwhite and though, "Gee, I wish the screen was bigger." I guess I'm not their target audience. I like to read wherever I go, and that means being able to take my Kindle wherever I go. I wish Amazon kept it small, I need a new eReader and was holding out for Amazon's update, but now I am going to have to look elsewhere.

TheOtherHobbes 5y ago
One reason I don't use e-readers more is because I wish the screen was bigger. 10" would do, 12" would be better. Of course it doesn't have to be either/or, but I suspect a lot of older people would be very happy to have larger readers. I also suspect the margins on these readers are insane.

knaik94 5y ago

For anyone looking for a more open experience, I have had only positive things to say about the Likebook P6. It's a 6inch android powered eink ereader that is around 120-140. It only has 1gb of ram and aggressive background task sleeping so it's not going to competing with any regular tablet, but it's a lot better than kindle in my opinion. You can run the kindle android app, libby, overdrive, scibd, and my favorite app for reading Moon+ Reader. It's not going to be as simple as a Kindle but for anyone who understands what sideloading is (books or apps), I strongly recommend it. There's are larger screen p78 (7.8") and p10 (10") as well. And if you care about having stricter quality control and are willing to pay, Boox products also an option. Boox also run android. After I jailbroke my kindle keyboard and then my kobo glo hd, there's no way I could ever go back to limited reading formats. The most useful app in each situation is KoReader. KoReader runs on Android and so before you decide on a ereader, try our that software and see if it's something you want to live without. It supports "(PDF, DjVu, CBT, CBZ) and reflowable e-book formats (EPUB, FB2, Mobi, DOC, CHM, TXT)" and runs on Kindle with jailbreak, Kobo without Jailbreak, Remarkable, and android so Likebooks and Boox. And Calibre is the useful regardless od what ereader you have, it's even great for iOS. Kobo has dropbox sync and Android has a native app as well as apps like foldersync to do native syncing. If you're okay spending a little time setting things up how you like them, Kindle is the least competitive device on the market in terms of features.

denysvitali 5y ago

Guess who bought a Paperwhite 2 months ago? Anyways, despite the new model I'm still fairly happy with my purchase. I don't read a lot (in fact I bought the Kindle just to use it while on a vacation), but I have to admit that epaper in general is something I never had the need to use - until I tried the Kindle. The software still sucks though, but that will probably not change with an upgraded HW release :) As other people mentioned here, Amazon is really locking in their users on formats that are beneficial to them only - but for its price I guess that these kind of limitations are okay-ish

culopatin 5y ago
I got a second one that is arriving today but I paid $40 with student discount. I think at that price is not worth 100 more. The only reason I’d upgrade is that I never use the light because it’s SO DAMN BLUE. From all the colors of LEDs to choose I don’t know why they went with this one. The yellowish color should be the default for everything.
sundvor 5y ago
I am in exactly the same boat. I did order the new one as well though, the version with the light sensors, because I like reading at night and the current light is too blue for my liking. The extra display size is a great bonus, and can I just say Type C charging finally. I've been ok reading my Mannings books on it, and I love my selection of Prime books. Will give current device to my son.

comeonseriously 5y ago

> With the waterproof Kindle Paperwhite, you’re free to read and relax in more places—from the beach to the bath. Kindle Paperwhite is IPX8 rated to protect against accidental immersion in up to two meters of fresh water for up to 60 minutes, and up to 0.25 meters of seawater for up to 3 minutes. Learn more about waterproof features. I wish companies would start getting challenged on this. It is NOT water PROOF. It's water RESISTANT.

fastball 5y ago
IPX8 is practically the highest waterproof rating for consumer electronics, not exactly sure how you want them to do better. Literally no electronic device is perfectly waterproof.

georgeecollins 5y ago

As a daily kindle book reader there are two things I would like to see in a future model. The first is page turn buttons like the ones they had in the oasis. Touch screens are great, but the ones on kindles are not state of the art. And they work terribly if the device gets wet. Page turn buttons just work. Very old kindles had a headphone jack. This was also always a nice thing to have.

kawsper 5y ago
I upgraded from one with buttons to the Oasis and I hate it, you're never sure where to press, or if you accidentally makes a double press or press something by mistake. The tactile feedback from buttons compared to the terrible touchscreen of the Oasis was such a disappointment that it made me read less books on the Kindle platform.

damontal 5y ago

I bought an Oasis for the warm light option and it was well worth it. My use case is reading in bed and the old Paperwhite would hurt my eyes no matter what setting I used. The Oasis, with the the ability to use warm light and invert to light text on a dark background made it possible for me to read comfortably in a dark room. The problem as always is not being able to quickly navigate around a book. Not a huge problem for linear fiction but for anything else, even more complex fiction (I'm currently reading The Divine Comedy), it's really annoying when you want to jump forward and back through the text. End notes are getting better with links that open up an overlay on the page but if I want to reference a previous section of the book I have to figure out where that section is and how to get there, sometimes using the search function -- all of this means I rarely bother. I have a book light that was too bright so I wrapped a few layers of masking tape over it to make it much dimmer and warmer. I'm going to start using that with physical books I think.

yayajacky 5y ago

Would this one support using Bluetooth audio control to turn pages?