19 ms·

A VGA monitor may be easier to repair than you think

104 points by watchdogtimer 5y ago

glugc 5y ago
Opening Amazon and buying a new one is even easier and you end up with a more modern and therefore better product.
- mrweasel 5y ago
  I don't completely disagree. VGA should have been removed from monitors 10 years ago. Some companies still buy new monitors and hook them up via VGA. That should be prohibited by labour laws. The image quality wasn't good enough to be used for an entire work day in 2010 and it certainly isn't acceptable today. Tens years ago I argued with a previous boss that it didn't matter how cheap the monitor was, he shouldn't force anyone to use a VGA monitor and hurt their eyes when DVI was available and only slight more expensive. That being said, if you need a VGA monitor, perhaps for some retro computing or a system that only supports VGA for some reason, it's better and cheaper to just fix it, if possible.
  - silon42 5y ago
    Just like 3.5mm headphone jack. No.
  - jonathanlydall 5y ago
    I think these days that you don't really pay extra to have an HDMI port on a monitor. As HDMI is signal compatible with DVI, you can just use a passive adapter if your computer only has a DVI output. I have considered digital inputs (DVI, HDMI or DP) mandatory for any monitor I have purchased for myself since 2010 and when people ask me for advice on monitors I advise the same.
  - HPsquared 5y ago
    I think with VGA, being analog, the image quality depends on the specific hardware. I've used monitors on 1080p 60Hz using VGA cable and it's been fine. On the other hand, I've also had poor image quality (ghosting) at the same resolution with a different cable and monitor. So it is possible to have decent quality on VGA, but not guaranteed.
  - cesarb 5y ago
    > or a system that only supports VGA for some reason AFAIK, nearly all modern servers only have VGA, serial, network, and a couple of USB ports, so it's much more common than you think. Of course, most of the time you'll be configuring them through the dedicated management network interface, so the VGA and serial outputs are mostly a fallback.
- blueflow 5y ago
  "modern" does not imply "better" anymore, for at least a decade now. Think of SmartTV, microwaves, or every kind of consumer electronics in general.
  - kichimi 5y ago
    I do think you should open your mind a bit. Smart TVs are pretty terrific, I can just cast whatever I want across the room and bam, it's on the TV. Friends can come over and share the input. I can lay in bed with nothing but a remote and browse my plex library. I used to go along this line of thinking, and had a "dumb" TV for a long time. I would spend hundreds of hours trying to get a PC/xbmc/kodi setup with a remote control to be comfortable, but always required a keyboard and mouse next to the TV. In the end it was a waste of time and I wasn't enjoying my TV as an entertainment device. When I finish work, I want to sit down and just have everything work. I don't want to have to keep getting up and pressing buttons and messing around to get a myriad of supplemental devices of varying quality to work. I just want one single device, on the wall, with a remote.
    - blueflow 5y ago
      What you didn't include: the data gathering and the ads. tons of ads. I interacted with smart TVs before, but when i pay for it and it displays me ads in the UI, its an instant return. I'll have none of that shit. And don't get me started on weird bugs that i can't even fix myself. Stuff like my dad's TV randomly outputting 1-2 seconds of audio of the last selected sender /while being turned off/. Audio only, with the screen turned off. Just a few moments. Nightmare fuel when its dark and you are sleeping in the same room.
      - kichimi 5y ago
        I don't experience ads with my TV. I don't understand why this is an often repeated point. I've had three so far (due to moving countries), and never experienced this "tons and tons of ads" thing I see people complain about. It's always just been a UI and some apps. Regarding data collection, who cares? Just get a pi hole if you really care about that. Also you are describing a fault that can occur with a dumb tv. EDIT: okay. I found this https://external-preview.redd.it/DcKcaASCdFkfM-eK5pOiu6DIOZbsJ3LQfQscWqgUXpY.jpg?auto=webp&s=804ac086426873221adb4c3091190e30ee9f6984 https://external-preview.redd.it/DcKcaASCdFkfM-eK5pOiu6DIOZb... I have a samsung TV and I do not see this. Perhaps this is a region thing. I've lived in The Netherlands and the UK and not experienced this.
- G3rn0ti 5y ago
  Well, people complain about Bitcoin to kill our climate but on the other hand have no problems to buy new monitors when it's not necessary ...
jonatron 5y ago
Power supply caps fail so often that maybe they should be socketed?
- bserge 5y ago
  Why would they be? Less money for the manufacturer. Just throw the whole thing away (preferably in the garden waste bin for that extra good feeling) and buy a new one. /s
- kalium-xyz 5y ago
  Nah soldering isnt that hard an operation and sockets are expensive.
  - contravariant 5y ago
    Though it'd be nice if they made those kinds of things more easily accessible, rather than hiding it behind tons of warranty stickers and really tiny screws.
    - kalium-xyz 5y ago
      Sure, just saying that it not being socketed should not be that big a barrier to entry. If you want an awesome way of doing things look at old tektronix scopes https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/Ceramic_Strips https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/Ceramic_Strips
      - BizarroLand 5y ago
        I'm assuming that the reason why there's so much discussion about soldering techniques and practice on that page is that the tubes failed on a predicable schedule and user servicing the machine was a mandatory part of ownership, right?
        kalium-xyz 5y ago
        The tubes are socketed. Not sure if the soldering was entirely meant for the users or for specialized maintainers, might have been a mix. these things cost the price of a new car and came with similar responsibilities. The soldering techniques are to prevent bad contacts or impurities as this is sensitive measurement equipment.
wiz21c 5y ago
FTA: > it was clear what the problem was with a swollen C812 capacitor. > So no need to check anything with a multimeter or an oscilloscope, a visual inspection of the board could immediately detect the issue. I'm looking at the picture. I'm not in electronics and I can assure you it's absolutely not clear to me that this is the capacitor I'm looking for. So what should it look like ? I understand these things sometimes burn or swell but is it always visible ? And if not, what should I do to detect it ?
- gbil 5y ago
  I'm an electronic engineer by education and have worked with boards many times as a hobby only though (outside of the university) and I can tell you I do see the capacitor being swollen just from the picture, you can see the ones below are in a normal state. Many times this is very very obvious but other times not in which case you need to remove each capacitor and measure its capacitance with the relevant (cheap) equipment
- opheliate 5y ago
  As I understand it, as someone who is also not in electronics, the cross at the top of the other capacitors you can see is designed as a pressure release, it’s a deliberate weakness in the structure of the capacitor so that if it fails, that’s where it will burst. So it’s very likely that if a cap fails, that’s where any swelling will be visible. You can see the cross is distorted/swollen on the failed cap.
- tyingq 5y ago
  Sounds like trolling (it's not), but some electrolytic capacitors have a fishy smell when they've leaked.
jeroenhd 5y ago
I'm always wary if these guides. If you know what you're doing then yes, replacing a capacitor is a quick fix to give your hardware a new lease on life, but you can get seriously injured or even killed if you mishandled the open power supplies these devices often contain. This guide addresses the danger by saying you need to "wait for a while" without telling you what "a while" is (a minute? 5? an hour?) and how to spot the dangerous parts of the circuit board. Having said all that, I think a general education on how devices like these can be fixed (safely!) is something a lot educational facilities should offer. Repairing basic and often even more advanced electronics requires little more than replacement parts, a soldering iron and some practice, but people are quick to throw something out when it stops working. The assumption seems to be that things are too complex to repair these days, but in all likelihood dead devices just had some protective circuitry do its job and fail before frying the mail circuits.
- barbegal 5y ago
  IEC 60335 and IEC 62368 state that the voltage across the capacitors must be below 34 V in 1 second after the input power is removed. Modern electronics are remarkably safe and I have never heard of anyone being shocked by power supply capacitors in the last decade. Of course cheap electronics sometimes aren't standards compliant and bleed resistors can conceivably fail hence the advice to wait a bit longer if you want real piece of mind and don't mind waiting.
  - Waterluvian 5y ago
    What do bleed resistors drain towards if the ground wire has been unplugged by unplugging the monitor?
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - amelius 5y ago
      They don't bleed to ground. Even if the power-chord is disconnected, there still is a circuit between the resistor and the capacitor, and this is where the current runs.
rock_artist 5y ago
Since the days of ISA and DIMMs I've been 'fixing' things myself. I also do all sort of 'handy-man' work at home. Being 'technical' I'd still suggest evaluating things before engaging to them. Some repairs aren't worth it. this is per-basis calculation based on your capabilities, experience and time. So the important word is... MAY be easier... maybe it won't be easier than you think ;)
squarefoot 5y ago
I've repaired several TVs and monitors, LED lamps, etc. just by replacing bad capacitors, and in a few cases some diodes too, so it's worth trying especially on electronics that would otherwise be thrown away. If you see a TV/monitor going off randomly or a LED lamp starts flashing, pretty sure there are one or more defective capacitors in there. Defective capacitors are a common plague in modern electronics, and the culprit is always the capacitor: the market is literally invaded by rubbish quality capacitors, and swapping a bad quality one with another bad quality one guarantees it will fail again one day, so buy only reputable parts from reputable vendors; avoid online purchases of branded parts from unknown resellers (pretty sure that 99.999% of Nichicon or ELNA capacitors sold by any Aliexpress, Ebay, Amazon, etc. sellers are relabeled fakes); pay them more but pay them once. A web/image search for "counterfeit capacitors" works better than 1000 words. Anyway, when shopping for (hopefully genuine) electrolytic capacitors, respect also the temperature ratings. Capacitors mounted into a power supply are exposed to higher temperatures, so always choose the 105c degrees type. Capacitance is usually not critical; electrolytic capacitors accuracy can be worse than 20%, and that's not a problem because they're not required to be accurate for their job, so if you don't find the exact value, you can safely swap the part with one with slightly higher capacitance; same for the rated operating voltage which can be higher (not lower!). Low ESR rated ones are preferred; if you can, buy them instead of generic ones.
- eurasiantiger 5y ago
  Low ESR only matters for PWM filtering capacitors, such as those found in monitor backlight drivers and some switching power supplies’ secondary circuits. It is not necessary to use such capacitors on the primary side, i.e. when the large capacitor nearest to the mains input dies, just replace it with a normal electrolytic capacitor that matches or exceeds the original’s voltage rating and closely matches its capacity.
  - klodolph 5y ago
    Worse yet, sometimes the circuit won't work with a low-ESR capacitor. For example, you can't put a low-ESR capacitor on the output of an LM1117, it will oscillate.
akerr 5y ago
I did this when I was a teenager - with CRT monitors. Higher voltages and I had the fun of refocusing the tube and fixing the colour registration while it was on, reaching around the back while I looked at my test pattern. I learnt a lot about computing hardware and software on that Pentium box: 166 MMX (overclocked to 200MHz), 16MB RAM (later 64MB), running Debian and my resurrected 15” LG CRT. Oh, and a 56kbps modem.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
zbuf 5y ago
I feel old; I came here for a guide to repair a "VGA monitor" and instead got a flat panel.
- sysadmindotfail 5y ago
  I am old. I did not even open the link until you mentioned it was an LCD. I was thinking: "Why would you repair a CRT?"
  - tyingq 5y ago
    Comes up fairly often as a nostalgia thing for old Macs, Kaypros, Compaqs, arcade games, and so on.
    - ectopod 5y ago
      Also, some home computer games from the 80s can be really hard to play with any extra latency so a CRT helps.
    - bityard 5y ago
      For most of the last 15 years, if you had an old CRT television or computer monitor, you had actually to pay someone just to get rid of it. Because of the lead shielding used in CRT tubes, they are considered hazardous waste. (Of course, most people were irresponsible or just didn't know any better and just chucked theirs into a dumpster.) But in the past few years, retro tech has become sufficiently popular due to certain YouTube channels that a CRT TV or monitor in good working condition can now command a worthwhile price.
  - tailspin2019 5y ago
    > I was thinking: "Why would you repair a CRT?" Same here. And I didn't think I was that old...
  - deelowe 5y ago
    Lots of older equipment require a CRT to function properly.
jonathanlydall 5y ago
I did this kind of a repair job to a couple of Samsung 23" 1080p screens back in 2012. A friend gave them away since their backlights would flicker making the monitor unusable for the first 10 or so minutes after they were turned on, after which they worked completely fine. I have little to no knowledge of electronics, but did know how to use a soldering iron. As I recall, I watched a YouTube video and was confident that if the problem was just the capacitors, then I could manage to replace them. I opened up the monitor, saw two or three capacitors which were clearly bulging and I used a soldering iron to get them off the board. I went to an electronics shop expecting that someone there would be able to advise on replacements which would work. As I recall one or more of replacements they had available on hand had a different "number" on it, but they assured me it was a higher rating and wouldn't affect use, I don't know much about electronics, but this made sense to me so I trusted it. I managed to re-solder them on and they then worked perfectly. Fast forward to today, about 9 years later, and my brother is still using both the repaired monitors. They have DVI input, 1080p resolution and VESA mounts so are actually very decent unless things like >60Hz refresh rate, higher resolution or very good colour accuracy are important to you.
- 22c 5y ago
  >they had available on hand had a different "number" on it, but they assured me it was a higher rating and wouldn't affect use It's probably the amount of farad units the capacitor is rated for. You can often use a capacitor with higher farads as long as the voltage is the same and it can be even more reliable than the original part, the only trouble is sometimes they are physically larger or taller, so you have to be careful if you're working in tight spaces.
  - foldr 5y ago
    Seems more likely that it would be the voltage rating? While it’s true that a larger capacitance would be fine in many applications, it wouldn’t always be (e.g. if the cap is part of an RC filter or if it’s used as a bypass cap). In contrast the voltage rating of a cap is just a maximum.
    - 5y ago
deleted 5y ago
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gruez 5y ago
Why is "VGA" mentioned? Does the fix only apply to monitors with a VGA interface? This looks applicable to any monitor with a internal power supply.
- ta988 5y ago
  You can do that to any monitor, even recent ones.
mikewarot 5y ago
Since the title specified a resolution, I assumed a VGA CRT with a DB15 connector. (Not an MDA, CGA or EGA) I was all set to warn you kids about the dangers of CRTs, high voltage, Xrays, and of course the implosion if you break the neck of the tube... and instead got bad capacitors on LCD displays. Regardless of what the safety standards say, you should always remove power, and short any capacitors with a screwdriver or freshly checked jumper lead, as bleeder resistors (and jumper leads) fail. LCD backlights with cold cathode fluorescents use quite a bit of voltage, so be careful, and good luck!
- jve 5y ago
  Thanks. I appreciate when someone gives safety advices as they come in handy when starting to tinker electronics. When repairing dishwasher I had to disconnect a huge capacitor... well it looked like it. Knowing what you just wrote about capacitors, it gave me shrugs and I was VERY careful handling that piece of thing. Can you give any advice on what good fume extractor for soldering does and if hobbyist that does repairs now and then should care?
  - h2odragon 5y ago
    Solder fumes aren't great for your lungs, but its not a severe health threat: you're not soldering that much. A fan blowing at you to keep smoke and fumes out of your face should be sufficient for up to a few hours a day of soldering. If others in the house complain about the smell, then work on venting outside harder.
  - mikewarot 5y ago
    A fume extractor with an activated charcoal filter grabs up the organic solvents that were used as flux to help make a good solder connection, and keep them out of your lungs. They don't cost much, but if smoke goes in, and doesn't come out, its helping, even if it isn't perfect.
- hermitdev 5y ago
  I also immediately had flash-backs to opening up an old CRT 13" TV that was going flaky (the sort of flaky where sometimes percussive maintenance worked). Being an electrical engineering student at the time, I thought I could handle it. I knew about the high voltage, I knew about the retained charged of the capacitors, etc, etc. What I wasn't prepared for was just how poorly shielded this thing was once I got it opened. I shocked myself almost immediately as I was doing basic examination. I hadn't even gotten to probing for shorts or broken connections. Thankfully, the shock wasn't bad, more startling than anything (I remember it being somewhat like brushing up against an electric fence). I was wearing a grounding strap on the arm of the hand where I got shocked. Not sure how much/if that helped any. That was enough for me to determine I wasn't qualified to work on it. I reattached the case and lived with its flakiness for a few years longer until it was replaced with an LCD.
CivBase 5y ago
Consider sharing this on repair.wiki.
bayindirh 5y ago
A had an awesome (for its time), Hyundai L90D+ monitor, and used it for ~8 years. One day it turned and stayed off, sent it to some local shop for repair, and the tech told me that he added another light control circuit and, my brightness had to be adjusted via an external control. He also said that two ICs damaged, and he cannot source any. I got pissed, found the parts, removed the other abomination and changed the damaged parts myself. The monitor came back alive for 30 seconds and then died again. It had no leaky caps, no visible damage, nothing on the board. Had to trash it. So, YMMV.
- Laforet 5y ago
  The board had probably developed a short somewhere because one of those tiny ceramic SMD capacitors had failed which is very hard to tell just by looking at it. Or the PCB substrate may have degraded, allowing two traces to come into contact but this is less likely. The tech probably figured out that this was happening but was unable or unwilling to isolate the issue.
  - bayindirh 5y ago
    > The tech probably figured out that this was happening but was unable or unwilling to isolate the issue. I suspect. It was just a run of the mill repair shop. If he had found it, it would have warned me when I told him about my future intentions.
mdip 5y ago
I think more than a few of us are familiar with the mess of bad capacitors that made their way into products throughout the early 00s. I still see this from time to time, but I remember the first time I encountered it -- I had purchased a $200 SageTV Media Streamer (v1) and it failed a few months out of warranty. I replaced it with a v2 and put the v1 in the basement. Then Google bought SageTV[0] and they stopped producing software/products. Meanwhile, I wanted another TV hooked up. Taking apart the device revealed capacitors that -- even though I had been unfamiliar with the issues -- were obviously bad -- one had leaked all over itself, others were bulging. I hit up ebay, repaired that, and thought about the growing pile of unreliable/broken hardware in a room that I had been putting off salvaging. That weekend, I repaired about ten LCD monitors -- caps in the PSU all around, one old plasma TV, 5 ATX power supplies and two NetGear 1Gbps switches. EVERY single one had varying degrees of damage. All but one power supply was functional again. [0] The product was a TiVo for PCs and was among the best. Google purchased them as an acqui-hire and -- I think -- used portions of the software in their STBs for Fiber. They later released the code open source.
- spookthesunset 5y ago
  > Then Google bought SageTV[0] and they stopped producing software/products. Man I remember when that happened. I was happy for the SageTV devs but I knew that was the end of a great run. SageTV was our DVR for years... It was such a cool product!
kleiba 5y ago
How do you find a broken capacitor on a board? The article says it was clear that the cap was "swollen" but how do I know what a swollen cap looks like? And what if it's broken but not swollen?
- 101_101 5y ago
  you look for a short and try to isolate the section. there are lot of videos on youtube. try eevblog and old rossmann videos. electronic repair school is also good. edit: you will be able to tell a swollen cap, but if you are not sure you should definitely learn the basics first. large caps can store a charge and can hurt you.
- ta988 5y ago
  look at the other capacitors. the top is really flat. you can even spot those that start to fail because light will reflect slightly differently on top of them.
- Fradow 5y ago
  It's very noticeable when you pay attention and compare it to the others. There are generally a lot of capacitors there, and only one or two will be swollen (the top part is supposed to be flat or even slightly curved inward, if it's curved upward, it's bad). Really, if it even looks slightly out of place, change it, capacitors are dirt cheap. I'm not sure it can be broken without being swollen, or at least that's not a frequent failure mode. Having repaired a few displays just like that, I can say it's really easy provided you are able to open the display and solder on a basic level, which anyone can learn in an afternoon. On the other hand, not all display will be that easily repaired. Sometimes, you cannot easily identify any swollen capacitors, or there is a burn mark somewhere else, or something else that you cannot identify (and thus order a replacement for). In those cases, unfortunately it generally doesn't make sense to bring it to a shop to be repaired by pros.
goda90 5y ago
I've got several broken electronics that I'd love to try to repair someday, but they don't have any screws and they are obscure enough to not have any tear-down guides to tell me if a heat gun would help. Cutting them open could just leave them unappealing to use, and thus I wasted my time.
- bluGill 5y ago
  I like working on things that are broken: you break it such that you can't get it back together again, who cares, it was broken anyway. What I worry about are things that work but need maintenance - mess up the oil change an a good car and you destroy the car... In short, get in there are see what happens. Sometimes you will destroy something, but right now it is landfill material so you didn't lose anything. sometimes it is an easy fix.
squarefoot 5y ago
Tangentially related: many VGA monitors can be given a new life by driving their panel using cheap ready made controllers. Search for "hdmi controller board" on Ebay, Aliexpress etc. Some are programmed in advance and the seller must be given the exact name of the panel they will work with before purchasing, while others are sold ready to be programmed. Some can also drive large TV screens. Here are some links that might turn out useful. http://www.elecrealm.com/down/class/ http://www.elecrealm.com/down/class/ http://www.mattmillman.com/info/lcd/rovatools/ http://www.mattmillman.com/info/lcd/rovatools/ https://github.com/ghent360/RTD-2660-Programmer/ https://github.com/ghent360/RTD-2660-Programmer/ https://sites.google.com/site/lcd4hobby/home https://sites.google.com/site/lcd4hobby/home http://openrtd2662.ru/ http://openrtd2662.ru/ https://www.codeforge.com/article/258602 https://www.codeforge.com/article/258602 https://www.panelook.com/index.php https://www.panelook.com/index.php http://lcdtech.info/en/ http://lcdtech.info/en/
meemo 5y ago
I just had a newish (but out-of-warranty) LG 4k monitor go bad on me. The picture went mostly dark, with a few streaks of white. I figured how to take off the back panel, but then got them stuck removing the EM shield covering the main board. I got all of the screws off, but then it wouldn't come off.
knolan 5y ago
I’ve don’t similar fixes over the years soldering replacements for dead components and changing the CCCL in a laptop. I was surprised by how simple and spacious the boards in these displays are, easy for an oaf like me to replace components on. Just find where the magic smoke came from and order a replacement part for pennies.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

104 points by watchdogtimer 5y ago

glugc 5y ago

Opening Amazon and buying a new one is even easier and you end up with a more modern and therefore better product.

mrweasel 5y ago
I don't completely disagree. VGA should have been removed from monitors 10 years ago. Some companies still buy new monitors and hook them up via VGA. That should be prohibited by labour laws. The image quality wasn't good enough to be used for an entire work day in 2010 and it certainly isn't acceptable today. Tens years ago I argued with a previous boss that it didn't matter how cheap the monitor was, he shouldn't force anyone to use a VGA monitor and hurt their eyes when DVI was available and only slight more expensive. That being said, if you need a VGA monitor, perhaps for some retro computing or a system that only supports VGA for some reason, it's better and cheaper to just fix it, if possible.
- silon42 5y ago
  Just like 3.5mm headphone jack. No.
- jonathanlydall 5y ago
  I think these days that you don't really pay extra to have an HDMI port on a monitor. As HDMI is signal compatible with DVI, you can just use a passive adapter if your computer only has a DVI output. I have considered digital inputs (DVI, HDMI or DP) mandatory for any monitor I have purchased for myself since 2010 and when people ask me for advice on monitors I advise the same.
- HPsquared 5y ago
  I think with VGA, being analog, the image quality depends on the specific hardware. I've used monitors on 1080p 60Hz using VGA cable and it's been fine. On the other hand, I've also had poor image quality (ghosting) at the same resolution with a different cable and monitor. So it is possible to have decent quality on VGA, but not guaranteed.
- cesarb 5y ago
  > or a system that only supports VGA for some reason AFAIK, nearly all modern servers only have VGA, serial, network, and a couple of USB ports, so it's much more common than you think. Of course, most of the time you'll be configuring them through the dedicated management network interface, so the VGA and serial outputs are mostly a fallback.
blueflow 5y ago
"modern" does not imply "better" anymore, for at least a decade now. Think of SmartTV, microwaves, or every kind of consumer electronics in general.
- kichimi 5y ago
  I do think you should open your mind a bit. Smart TVs are pretty terrific, I can just cast whatever I want across the room and bam, it's on the TV. Friends can come over and share the input. I can lay in bed with nothing but a remote and browse my plex library. I used to go along this line of thinking, and had a "dumb" TV for a long time. I would spend hundreds of hours trying to get a PC/xbmc/kodi setup with a remote control to be comfortable, but always required a keyboard and mouse next to the TV. In the end it was a waste of time and I wasn't enjoying my TV as an entertainment device. When I finish work, I want to sit down and just have everything work. I don't want to have to keep getting up and pressing buttons and messing around to get a myriad of supplemental devices of varying quality to work. I just want one single device, on the wall, with a remote.
  - blueflow 5y ago
    What you didn't include: the data gathering and the ads. tons of ads. I interacted with smart TVs before, but when i pay for it and it displays me ads in the UI, its an instant return. I'll have none of that shit. And don't get me started on weird bugs that i can't even fix myself. Stuff like my dad's TV randomly outputting 1-2 seconds of audio of the last selected sender /while being turned off/. Audio only, with the screen turned off. Just a few moments. Nightmare fuel when its dark and you are sleeping in the same room.
    - kichimi 5y ago
      I don't experience ads with my TV. I don't understand why this is an often repeated point. I've had three so far (due to moving countries), and never experienced this "tons and tons of ads" thing I see people complain about. It's always just been a UI and some apps. Regarding data collection, who cares? Just get a pi hole if you really care about that. Also you are describing a fault that can occur with a dumb tv. EDIT: okay. I found this https://external-preview.redd.it/DcKcaASCdFkfM-eK5pOiu6DIOZbsJ3LQfQscWqgUXpY.jpg?auto=webp&s=804ac086426873221adb4c3091190e30ee9f6984 https://external-preview.redd.it/DcKcaASCdFkfM-eK5pOiu6DIOZb... I have a samsung TV and I do not see this. Perhaps this is a region thing. I've lived in The Netherlands and the UK and not experienced this.
G3rn0ti 5y ago
Well, people complain about Bitcoin to kill our climate but on the other hand have no problems to buy new monitors when it's not necessary ...

jonatron 5y ago

Power supply caps fail so often that maybe they should be socketed?

bserge 5y ago
Why would they be? Less money for the manufacturer. Just throw the whole thing away (preferably in the garden waste bin for that extra good feeling) and buy a new one. /s
kalium-xyz 5y ago
Nah soldering isnt that hard an operation and sockets are expensive.
- contravariant 5y ago
  Though it'd be nice if they made those kinds of things more easily accessible, rather than hiding it behind tons of warranty stickers and really tiny screws.
  - kalium-xyz 5y ago
    Sure, just saying that it not being socketed should not be that big a barrier to entry. If you want an awesome way of doing things look at old tektronix scopes https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/Ceramic_Strips https://w140.com/tekwiki/wiki/Ceramic_Strips
    - BizarroLand 5y ago
      I'm assuming that the reason why there's so much discussion about soldering techniques and practice on that page is that the tubes failed on a predicable schedule and user servicing the machine was a mandatory part of ownership, right?
      - kalium-xyz 5y ago
        The tubes are socketed. Not sure if the soldering was entirely meant for the users or for specialized maintainers, might have been a mix. these things cost the price of a new car and came with similar responsibilities. The soldering techniques are to prevent bad contacts or impurities as this is sensitive measurement equipment.

wiz21c 5y ago

FTA: > it was clear what the problem was with a swollen C812 capacitor. > So no need to check anything with a multimeter or an oscilloscope, a visual inspection of the board could immediately detect the issue. I'm looking at the picture. I'm not in electronics and I can assure you it's absolutely not clear to me that this is the capacitor I'm looking for. So what should it look like ? I understand these things sometimes burn or swell but is it always visible ? And if not, what should I do to detect it ?

gbil 5y ago
I'm an electronic engineer by education and have worked with boards many times as a hobby only though (outside of the university) and I can tell you I do see the capacitor being swollen just from the picture, you can see the ones below are in a normal state. Many times this is very very obvious but other times not in which case you need to remove each capacitor and measure its capacitance with the relevant (cheap) equipment
opheliate 5y ago
As I understand it, as someone who is also not in electronics, the cross at the top of the other capacitors you can see is designed as a pressure release, it’s a deliberate weakness in the structure of the capacitor so that if it fails, that’s where it will burst. So it’s very likely that if a cap fails, that’s where any swelling will be visible. You can see the cross is distorted/swollen on the failed cap.
tyingq 5y ago
Sounds like trolling (it's not), but some electrolytic capacitors have a fishy smell when they've leaked.

jeroenhd 5y ago

I'm always wary if these guides. If you know what you're doing then yes, replacing a capacitor is a quick fix to give your hardware a new lease on life, but you can get seriously injured or even killed if you mishandled the open power supplies these devices often contain. This guide addresses the danger by saying you need to "wait for a while" without telling you what "a while" is (a minute? 5? an hour?) and how to spot the dangerous parts of the circuit board. Having said all that, I think a general education on how devices like these can be fixed (safely!) is something a lot educational facilities should offer. Repairing basic and often even more advanced electronics requires little more than replacement parts, a soldering iron and some practice, but people are quick to throw something out when it stops working. The assumption seems to be that things are too complex to repair these days, but in all likelihood dead devices just had some protective circuitry do its job and fail before frying the mail circuits.

barbegal 5y ago
IEC 60335 and IEC 62368 state that the voltage across the capacitors must be below 34 V in 1 second after the input power is removed. Modern electronics are remarkably safe and I have never heard of anyone being shocked by power supply capacitors in the last decade. Of course cheap electronics sometimes aren't standards compliant and bleed resistors can conceivably fail hence the advice to wait a bit longer if you want real piece of mind and don't mind waiting.
- Waterluvian 5y ago
  What do bleed resistors drain towards if the ground wire has been unplugged by unplugging the monitor?
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  - amelius 5y ago
    They don't bleed to ground. Even if the power-chord is disconnected, there still is a circuit between the resistor and the capacitor, and this is where the current runs.

rock_artist 5y ago

Since the days of ISA and DIMMs I've been 'fixing' things myself. I also do all sort of 'handy-man' work at home. Being 'technical' I'd still suggest evaluating things before engaging to them. Some repairs aren't worth it. this is per-basis calculation based on your capabilities, experience and time. So the important word is... MAY be easier... maybe it won't be easier than you think ;)

squarefoot 5y ago

I've repaired several TVs and monitors, LED lamps, etc. just by replacing bad capacitors, and in a few cases some diodes too, so it's worth trying especially on electronics that would otherwise be thrown away. If you see a TV/monitor going off randomly or a LED lamp starts flashing, pretty sure there are one or more defective capacitors in there. Defective capacitors are a common plague in modern electronics, and the culprit is always the capacitor: the market is literally invaded by rubbish quality capacitors, and swapping a bad quality one with another bad quality one guarantees it will fail again one day, so buy only reputable parts from reputable vendors; avoid online purchases of branded parts from unknown resellers (pretty sure that 99.999% of Nichicon or ELNA capacitors sold by any Aliexpress, Ebay, Amazon, etc. sellers are relabeled fakes); pay them more but pay them once. A web/image search for "counterfeit capacitors" works better than 1000 words. Anyway, when shopping for (hopefully genuine) electrolytic capacitors, respect also the temperature ratings. Capacitors mounted into a power supply are exposed to higher temperatures, so always choose the 105c degrees type. Capacitance is usually not critical; electrolytic capacitors accuracy can be worse than 20%, and that's not a problem because they're not required to be accurate for their job, so if you don't find the exact value, you can safely swap the part with one with slightly higher capacitance; same for the rated operating voltage which can be higher (not lower!). Low ESR rated ones are preferred; if you can, buy them instead of generic ones.

eurasiantiger 5y ago
Low ESR only matters for PWM filtering capacitors, such as those found in monitor backlight drivers and some switching power supplies’ secondary circuits. It is not necessary to use such capacitors on the primary side, i.e. when the large capacitor nearest to the mains input dies, just replace it with a normal electrolytic capacitor that matches or exceeds the original’s voltage rating and closely matches its capacity.
- klodolph 5y ago
  Worse yet, sometimes the circuit won't work with a low-ESR capacitor. For example, you can't put a low-ESR capacitor on the output of an LM1117, it will oscillate.

akerr 5y ago

I did this when I was a teenager - with CRT monitors. Higher voltages and I had the fun of refocusing the tube and fixing the colour registration while it was on, reaching around the back while I looked at my test pattern. I learnt a lot about computing hardware and software on that Pentium box: 166 MMX (overclocked to 200MHz), 16MB RAM (later 64MB), running Debian and my resurrected 15” LG CRT. Oh, and a 56kbps modem.

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zbuf 5y ago

I feel old; I came here for a guide to repair a "VGA monitor" and instead got a flat panel.

sysadmindotfail 5y ago
I am old. I did not even open the link until you mentioned it was an LCD. I was thinking: "Why would you repair a CRT?"
- tyingq 5y ago
  Comes up fairly often as a nostalgia thing for old Macs, Kaypros, Compaqs, arcade games, and so on.
  - ectopod 5y ago
    Also, some home computer games from the 80s can be really hard to play with any extra latency so a CRT helps.
  - bityard 5y ago
    For most of the last 15 years, if you had an old CRT television or computer monitor, you had actually to pay someone just to get rid of it. Because of the lead shielding used in CRT tubes, they are considered hazardous waste. (Of course, most people were irresponsible or just didn't know any better and just chucked theirs into a dumpster.) But in the past few years, retro tech has become sufficiently popular due to certain YouTube channels that a CRT TV or monitor in good working condition can now command a worthwhile price.
- tailspin2019 5y ago
  > I was thinking: "Why would you repair a CRT?" Same here. And I didn't think I was that old...
- deelowe 5y ago
  Lots of older equipment require a CRT to function properly.

jonathanlydall 5y ago

I did this kind of a repair job to a couple of Samsung 23" 1080p screens back in 2012. A friend gave them away since their backlights would flicker making the monitor unusable for the first 10 or so minutes after they were turned on, after which they worked completely fine. I have little to no knowledge of electronics, but did know how to use a soldering iron. As I recall, I watched a YouTube video and was confident that if the problem was just the capacitors, then I could manage to replace them. I opened up the monitor, saw two or three capacitors which were clearly bulging and I used a soldering iron to get them off the board. I went to an electronics shop expecting that someone there would be able to advise on replacements which would work. As I recall one or more of replacements they had available on hand had a different "number" on it, but they assured me it was a higher rating and wouldn't affect use, I don't know much about electronics, but this made sense to me so I trusted it. I managed to re-solder them on and they then worked perfectly. Fast forward to today, about 9 years later, and my brother is still using both the repaired monitors. They have DVI input, 1080p resolution and VESA mounts so are actually very decent unless things like >60Hz refresh rate, higher resolution or very good colour accuracy are important to you.

22c 5y ago
>they had available on hand had a different "number" on it, but they assured me it was a higher rating and wouldn't affect use It's probably the amount of farad units the capacitor is rated for. You can often use a capacitor with higher farads as long as the voltage is the same and it can be even more reliable than the original part, the only trouble is sometimes they are physically larger or taller, so you have to be careful if you're working in tight spaces.
- foldr 5y ago
  Seems more likely that it would be the voltage rating? While it’s true that a larger capacitance would be fine in many applications, it wouldn’t always be (e.g. if the cap is part of an RC filter or if it’s used as a bypass cap). In contrast the voltage rating of a cap is just a maximum.
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gruez 5y ago

Why is "VGA" mentioned? Does the fix only apply to monitors with a VGA interface? This looks applicable to any monitor with a internal power supply.

ta988 5y ago
You can do that to any monitor, even recent ones.

mikewarot 5y ago

Since the title specified a resolution, I assumed a VGA CRT with a DB15 connector. (Not an MDA, CGA or EGA) I was all set to warn you kids about the dangers of CRTs, high voltage, Xrays, and of course the implosion if you break the neck of the tube... and instead got bad capacitors on LCD displays. Regardless of what the safety standards say, you should always remove power, and short any capacitors with a screwdriver or freshly checked jumper lead, as bleeder resistors (and jumper leads) fail. LCD backlights with cold cathode fluorescents use quite a bit of voltage, so be careful, and good luck!

jve 5y ago
Thanks. I appreciate when someone gives safety advices as they come in handy when starting to tinker electronics. When repairing dishwasher I had to disconnect a huge capacitor... well it looked like it. Knowing what you just wrote about capacitors, it gave me shrugs and I was VERY careful handling that piece of thing. Can you give any advice on what good fume extractor for soldering does and if hobbyist that does repairs now and then should care?
- h2odragon 5y ago
  Solder fumes aren't great for your lungs, but its not a severe health threat: you're not soldering that much. A fan blowing at you to keep smoke and fumes out of your face should be sufficient for up to a few hours a day of soldering. If others in the house complain about the smell, then work on venting outside harder.
- mikewarot 5y ago
  A fume extractor with an activated charcoal filter grabs up the organic solvents that were used as flux to help make a good solder connection, and keep them out of your lungs. They don't cost much, but if smoke goes in, and doesn't come out, its helping, even if it isn't perfect.
hermitdev 5y ago
I also immediately had flash-backs to opening up an old CRT 13" TV that was going flaky (the sort of flaky where sometimes percussive maintenance worked). Being an electrical engineering student at the time, I thought I could handle it. I knew about the high voltage, I knew about the retained charged of the capacitors, etc, etc. What I wasn't prepared for was just how poorly shielded this thing was once I got it opened. I shocked myself almost immediately as I was doing basic examination. I hadn't even gotten to probing for shorts or broken connections. Thankfully, the shock wasn't bad, more startling than anything (I remember it being somewhat like brushing up against an electric fence). I was wearing a grounding strap on the arm of the hand where I got shocked. Not sure how much/if that helped any. That was enough for me to determine I wasn't qualified to work on it. I reattached the case and lived with its flakiness for a few years longer until it was replaced with an LCD.

CivBase 5y ago

Consider sharing this on repair.wiki.

bayindirh 5y ago

A had an awesome (for its time), Hyundai L90D+ monitor, and used it for ~8 years. One day it turned and stayed off, sent it to some local shop for repair, and the tech told me that he added another light control circuit and, my brightness had to be adjusted via an external control. He also said that two ICs damaged, and he cannot source any. I got pissed, found the parts, removed the other abomination and changed the damaged parts myself. The monitor came back alive for 30 seconds and then died again. It had no leaky caps, no visible damage, nothing on the board. Had to trash it. So, YMMV.

Laforet 5y ago
The board had probably developed a short somewhere because one of those tiny ceramic SMD capacitors had failed which is very hard to tell just by looking at it. Or the PCB substrate may have degraded, allowing two traces to come into contact but this is less likely. The tech probably figured out that this was happening but was unable or unwilling to isolate the issue.
- bayindirh 5y ago
  > The tech probably figured out that this was happening but was unable or unwilling to isolate the issue. I suspect. It was just a run of the mill repair shop. If he had found it, it would have warned me when I told him about my future intentions.

mdip 5y ago

I think more than a few of us are familiar with the mess of bad capacitors that made their way into products throughout the early 00s. I still see this from time to time, but I remember the first time I encountered it -- I had purchased a $200 SageTV Media Streamer (v1) and it failed a few months out of warranty. I replaced it with a v2 and put the v1 in the basement. Then Google bought SageTV[0] and they stopped producing software/products. Meanwhile, I wanted another TV hooked up. Taking apart the device revealed capacitors that -- even though I had been unfamiliar with the issues -- were obviously bad -- one had leaked all over itself, others were bulging. I hit up ebay, repaired that, and thought about the growing pile of unreliable/broken hardware in a room that I had been putting off salvaging. That weekend, I repaired about ten LCD monitors -- caps in the PSU all around, one old plasma TV, 5 ATX power supplies and two NetGear 1Gbps switches. EVERY single one had varying degrees of damage. All but one power supply was functional again. [0] The product was a TiVo for PCs and was among the best. Google purchased them as an acqui-hire and -- I think -- used portions of the software in their STBs for Fiber. They later released the code open source.

spookthesunset 5y ago
> Then Google bought SageTV[0] and they stopped producing software/products. Man I remember when that happened. I was happy for the SageTV devs but I knew that was the end of a great run. SageTV was our DVR for years... It was such a cool product!

kleiba 5y ago

How do you find a broken capacitor on a board? The article says it was clear that the cap was "swollen" but how do I know what a swollen cap looks like? And what if it's broken but not swollen?

101_101 5y ago
you look for a short and try to isolate the section. there are lot of videos on youtube. try eevblog and old rossmann videos. electronic repair school is also good. edit: you will be able to tell a swollen cap, but if you are not sure you should definitely learn the basics first. large caps can store a charge and can hurt you.
ta988 5y ago
look at the other capacitors. the top is really flat. you can even spot those that start to fail because light will reflect slightly differently on top of them.
Fradow 5y ago
It's very noticeable when you pay attention and compare it to the others. There are generally a lot of capacitors there, and only one or two will be swollen (the top part is supposed to be flat or even slightly curved inward, if it's curved upward, it's bad). Really, if it even looks slightly out of place, change it, capacitors are dirt cheap. I'm not sure it can be broken without being swollen, or at least that's not a frequent failure mode. Having repaired a few displays just like that, I can say it's really easy provided you are able to open the display and solder on a basic level, which anyone can learn in an afternoon. On the other hand, not all display will be that easily repaired. Sometimes, you cannot easily identify any swollen capacitors, or there is a burn mark somewhere else, or something else that you cannot identify (and thus order a replacement for). In those cases, unfortunately it generally doesn't make sense to bring it to a shop to be repaired by pros.

goda90 5y ago

I've got several broken electronics that I'd love to try to repair someday, but they don't have any screws and they are obscure enough to not have any tear-down guides to tell me if a heat gun would help. Cutting them open could just leave them unappealing to use, and thus I wasted my time.

bluGill 5y ago
I like working on things that are broken: you break it such that you can't get it back together again, who cares, it was broken anyway. What I worry about are things that work but need maintenance - mess up the oil change an a good car and you destroy the car... In short, get in there are see what happens. Sometimes you will destroy something, but right now it is landfill material so you didn't lose anything. sometimes it is an easy fix.

squarefoot 5y ago

Tangentially related: many VGA monitors can be given a new life by driving their panel using cheap ready made controllers. Search for "hdmi controller board" on Ebay, Aliexpress etc. Some are programmed in advance and the seller must be given the exact name of the panel they will work with before purchasing, while others are sold ready to be programmed. Some can also drive large TV screens. Here are some links that might turn out useful. http://www.elecrealm.com/down/class/ http://www.elecrealm.com/down/class/ http://www.mattmillman.com/info/lcd/rovatools/ http://www.mattmillman.com/info/lcd/rovatools/ https://github.com/ghent360/RTD-2660-Programmer/ https://github.com/ghent360/RTD-2660-Programmer/ https://sites.google.com/site/lcd4hobby/home https://sites.google.com/site/lcd4hobby/home http://openrtd2662.ru/ http://openrtd2662.ru/ https://www.codeforge.com/article/258602 https://www.codeforge.com/article/258602 https://www.panelook.com/index.php https://www.panelook.com/index.php http://lcdtech.info/en/ http://lcdtech.info/en/

meemo 5y ago

I just had a newish (but out-of-warranty) LG 4k monitor go bad on me. The picture went mostly dark, with a few streaks of white. I figured how to take off the back panel, but then got them stuck removing the EM shield covering the main board. I got all of the screws off, but then it wouldn't come off.

knolan 5y ago

I’ve don’t similar fixes over the years soldering replacements for dead components and changing the CCCL in a laptop. I was surprised by how simple and spacious the boards in these displays are, easy for an oaf like me to replace components on. Just find where the magic smoke came from and order a replacement part for pennies.

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