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AI bot trolls politicians with how much time they're looking at phones
- konschubert 5y agoI'd rather have them work/chat on their phones than pretend to be interested in listening to a manuscript being read that they have read before.
- martin_a 5y ago> that they have read before I think there's a problem here...
- konschubert 5y agoWhat's the problem?
- bonestormii_ 5y agoThe problem is that our legislators famously do not write or even read the legislation that they vote on. Sometimes it's strategic and intentional that a party will try to hold a vote on some 1000+ page piece of legislation with 24 hour notice. Other times, they simply don't care to read it, so they do not. Actual lobbyists write actual legislation, in fact. And our politicians vote on them without having read it. It's a really stupid system.
- SlapperKoala 5y agoA lot of them will be messaging their staff and colleagues. Frequently they get briefings and information sent to them mid debate
- cube00 5y agoThis is a point that is often overlooked when they are accused of not working. Each politician has an office of staff behind them collating and feeding them updates. They have staff in that office monitoring the chamber feeds as well. Disconnecting from that fire hose to only focus on the current speaker would not be as effective to consume all the different sources of information coming in during proceedings.
- esseti 5y agois the sourcecode available somewhere? i would just try to undertand how this AI works.
- BuildTheRobots 5y agoI wonder how much infurance could be made of _what_ they're doing on their phones based on thumb/finger movement. Scrolling through reddit/facebook (or whatever the latest cat-picture site is,) tends to have a pretty obvious hand movement associated with it.
- anothernewdude 5y agoFrom what I've seen of various parliaments, listening to the actual speeches and so on *is* correctly a waste of time. All the important stuff happens on paper. Debates are also a useless means of forming policy.
- dalbasal 5y agoA lot of what happens in politics is theatre, always was. Sitting in chambers listening to speeches is politicians' job though, for whatever that's worth. Anyway, parliamentary stuff is theatre and this bot is participating in that theatre.
- re-al 5y agoAnd so do we, when we participate in voting - we legitimise the theater. But don't worry - we are at the end of the democratic time. We are moving/have moved into technocracy communitarianism, where all the meaningful decisions are taken by NGOs at the supra-national level. This is why we have electric car charging points, 7-8 storey building blocks with a shop downstairs, narrower roads (the future is car-less), tiny homes, being pushed off the land, etc. Mark Carney etc will be help lead the charge away from capitalism. "In his book Value(s): Building a Better World for All, Mark Carney, former governor both of the Bank of Canada and the Bank of England, claims that western society is morally rotten, and that it has been corrupted by capitalism, which has brought about a “climate emergency” that threatens life on earth. This, he claims, requires rigid controls on personal freedom, industry and corporate funding." If you're confused how the governor of 2 national banks is now rallying against capitalism, don't worry - go back to sleep. https://nationalpost.com/opinion/peter-foster-mark-carney-man-of-destiny-arises-to-revolutionize-society-it-wont-be-pleasant https://nationalpost.com/opinion/peter-foster-mark-carney-ma...
- dalbasal 5y agoI never said theatre is illegitimate, just that it's always been a big part of governance. This is true for Pharaoh Tutankhamun, King George, Boris Johnson, Xi Jinping and I can't even think of a counterexample. I'm not sure if it's good, bad or neither. In any case, if you're at a place where you're trying to squeeze the Truth About Power And Everything into a paragraph comment... IMO, the danger of thinking through "isms" is that they become more meaningless as they become more evocative. A cascade of evocative, idealistic terms definable via other evocative idealistic terms. This applies both to your comment and to Carney.
- kzrdude 5y agoI think it's something everyone can take to heart. Sitting in meetings but looking intensely at the laptop or phone.. in the long run this just feels like not being present at all, so I do my best to avoid it. Close laptops when in meetings (when you don't need them). The worst I've seen of this was in academia, everyone staring into their laptops so hard it felt like a contest.
- vnorilo 5y agoAs a past top contender, this was due to meetings being far too long and irrelevant so I usually tried to do something more productive. Private sector has its share of bullshit meetings but people are at least a bit more sensitive to the cost.
- Bojui 5y agoIn human info networks, politicians are huge hubs. They are usually the most connected people in society for very good reasons. So all joking aside about what they get caught doing on theif phone, without them on their phones day and night society would very quickly splinter into groups that have nothing in common with each other.
- jbb_hn 5y agoWould it though? We haven’t had this tech for that long. Has it made things better or worse when everything, including non-priorities, can be a distraction.
- viraptor 5y ago> without them on their phones day and night society would very quickly splinter into groups that have nothing in common with each other Yes, I remember the the total societal divide we experienced in early 2000s and before. /s
- FredPret 5y agoI assume they would have had (and maybe still have) teams of staffers answering and making calls and knocking on doors
- netizen-936824 5y agoOh, so these politicians are all doing outreach on their phones? THAT is what you think they're distracted by? Seriously?
- re-al 5y agoAnd that's a good thing.
- tester34 5y agoHope it doesn't evolve into AI bot trolls programmers with how much time they're looking on HN
- shakna 5y ago> AI bot trolls programmers with how much time they're looking on HN That's what noprocrast, maxvisit and minaway are for, isn't it?
- tester34 5y agoThat assumes that the user wants to avoid HN in order to have healthly relationship with it Also anyone who's been doing something with web dev can probably workaround this with just 5 clicks
- danuker 5y ago> can probably workaround this with just 5 clicks It's actually implemented back-end, you can't cheat.
- intricatedetail 5y ago"I am running tests"
- vitabenes 5y agoHah, I submitted it yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27745584 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27745584
- lolc 5y agoSo what will happen is that some politician's husband will die in an accident and the bot will call out the politician on Twitter right when she reads about it on her phone. Then the makers of that funny bot will apologize and promise not to do something stupid like this again. A year after that a new crop of students will invent another way to troll politicians.
- Ensorceled 5y agoThe bot actually tracks time distracted, so in your bizarre hypothetical example, the attentive politician who pulls out their phone because of an emergency call and then rushes to the hospital to be at their husbands bedside would still have a positive ranking and no apology would be required.
- lolc 5y agoYou see, the problem is judging people from appearances. Because the next crop of students would create a bot that tweets that she left the session early.
- chris_wot 5y agoSee, this I don’t understand. Before the age of mobile phones, an usher would appear by the politician’s side and inform them of urgent messages. I don’t quite understand the need for phones in parliament.
- pbhjpbhj 5y agoInteresting to compare this with the story about Tencent using AI and a webcam to catch children computer playing games illegally (outside of allowed time). At least one person argued that people have sufficient agency to monitor their own behaviour; it's intrusive and over-steps boundaries ... I'm not saying those responses are wrong, just that it makes an interesting comparison.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- ludamad 5y agoThere's a key difference here in that these people agreed to be in the public sphere. Taken to the extreme though, I can see this affecting who wishes to go into politics
- alkonaut 5y agoEven though it’s probably a lot of wasted time (they read proposals ahead etc), I think it’s a good idea to ban phones entirely in parliamentary chambers. The opposition should be granted the attention. People watching should see people debating or listening, not sleeping or looking at their phones. If this creates a problem for those in the chamber then perhaps the solution is shortening the sessions and removing redundant sessions like reading proposals that everyone could read beforehand, and instead focus on efficient debate and voting.
- buran77 5y agoPoliticians could be treated like students: below a certain attendance rate or failed pop quiz they "fail the class". Lack of attendance or lack of understanding of the discussion they vote on greatly undermines the already narrow interpretation of democracy we do have. It means that not only are "the people" in no way in power, most don't even have a representative in any reasonable interpretation. They are physically not in the room to contribute to the decision, or don't understand their own choice. A very small minority of representatives gets to decide for a large majority of people they don't representnt.
- dylan604 5y ago"We the people" has been replaced by "We the lobbyists" or extending to "We the corporations".
- sundvor 5y agoNot sure why you're getting down voted, that's how it works in Australia. Just look at how we're still embracing coal, and introducing mileage tax of EVs to repel their takeup. There's a big network of old chummies and political donations from big fossil behind that.
- brutusborn 5y agoWhat's the mileage tax you mention?
- chadlavi 5y agoI would guess some of them are doing actual work on their phones while sitting around pretending to listen to something they already read and some of them are goofing off. Just being on their phone isn't enough to determine that they're not working.
- ape4 5y agoYes in the past they might be reading reports on paper
- dylan604 5y agoI think you are being overly kind to them, which you would think their postions would afford them. However, I live in the real world and believe that they are not doing what you are suggesting. I'm personally more inclined to believe they are scrolling social media. They are humans, and we have all become accustomed to pulling out that device the split second we become bored. If the person speaking is in the opposition party, then you're also probably doing it as a bit of show to say you don't care anything about their ideas. We all do this without thinking about it, but I wouldn't put it past this being done on purpose. Maybe I'm too pessimistic, but I no longer think politicians deserve the benefit of the doubt and one should always be wondering what the ulterior motives of any of their actions are.
- saurik 5y agoExactly: as a politician myself, it is extremely common for me to be frantically adjusting the notes on my phone for what I intend to say based on what I am hearing other people say and what I am finding online or quickly fact checking with my various connections. (And also: I am more than capable of zoning out without a phone, thank you very much ;P.)
- 6510 5y agoLive in the moment, one thing at a time. You should be listening. The logic is simple, when it is your turn to speak people should also listen. Currently they are frantically adjusting their talking points in stead. What does it even matter what anyone says at that point? Or even more hilarious: At the moment the only media attention these politicians get is about their excessive phone use. What they are going to say when it is their turn to talk I have no idea.
- nurgasemetey 5y agoIt is technical solution to social problem.
- CharlesW 5y agoGiven that this is HN, I can't tell if you're praising or condemning it.
- bpodgursky 5y agoI disagree. That's like calling Fentanyl a social problem. Both are a problem caused by new sophisticated technology which exploit biological human flaws.
- rishav_sharan 5y agoDear Mashable, reminding elected public servants of their accountability is not "trolling"
- tverbeure 5y agoIt is trolling. And while I understand the motives of the artist who created it, I hate the conclusions that are being made, that somehow this is related to accountability. Anyone who has ever visited a plenary session of parliament (as I have as part of school trips) knows that they are unbelievably boring. 99% of the time, they aren’t about cutting edge law making that will propel society into the next century, but about routine declarations or posturing where a politician wants to promote the local industry. It is IMO completely acceptable for attendees to just be there and do something else, while waiting for a topic that interests them. This is no different than zoning out during some group meetings where you don’t really care and don’t need to know about most of the topics, but you still are present in case your input is required.
- ghostDancer 5y agoThey are being paid to work with our money, if you do the same in your work you get fired. Some of them don't even go, also they should show more respect to the others. But maybe you think they are special and should have privileges.
- tverbeure 5y agoI’m on my laptop or phone during meetings all the time. So are my colleagues. I don’t get fired because everybody understands that some meetings don’t require active participation from everybody at all times, yet attendance can be useful to intervene when necessary. (I explained as much in my original message.) That said, I understand your concern if your definition of work for an elected official seems to be “staring aimlessly at a podium during a plenary session.” And before you say: “they should actively participate!” Good luck doing that in a session with 200+ participants. Law making is done in smaller sessions and committees. The plenary session is a formality. In this particular case, chances are that they were filming during “het vragenuurtje”, the Q&A where Flemish members of parliament can get answers from ministers to submitted questions. It’s completely normal for one member to sit at attention while their question get answered while others sit and wait for their turn, and do something else. After all, that member may have an interest in the lack of highway signalization to his village, while other members don’t care. (Yes, Flanders is small enough for these kind of things to be brought up in parlement.) I totally understand that this doesn’t fit the standard narrative of the lazy politician who doesn’t work for my money, and for that I’m sorry.
- myfavoritedog 5y agoNow pretend that you were publicly judged and shamed for having your web browser open during work hours. Were you on stackoverflow, looking for a solution to a work problem? Were you just goofing off, looking at YouTube videos? Who knows, right?
- garyfirestorm 5y agoAI bot holds politicians accountable - there I fixed the title for you
- jpoesen 5y agoTL;DR: This project is not so much about political transparency as it is about the erosion of individual privacy due to the proliferation of government surveillance cameras and AI-driven data analysis. What most people seem to overlook: Dries Depoorter is an artist/activist interested in the intersection of privacy, artificial intelligence, surveillance & social media. Flemish cities are installing surveillance cameras and ANPR cameras everywhere, and they're quickly doubling back on their promise that they'll only be used for tracking serious (organised) crime. Already there have been attempts to use the cameras to enforce lockdown related curfew rules and to surveil streets that have been vandalised with spray paint.
- ameasure 5y agoImagine if we invented a device that gave people access to all the information in the world and then made fun of them for using it.
- blhack 5y agoI started following some of my local politicians on twitter. It’s incredibly embarrassing how much time these people are spending on social media.
- irrational 5y agoI hope they don’t start doing this in work meetings.
- b0rsuk 5y agoIn Polish Sejm (the "lower" but actually more important house of parliament), there are a few restaurants and they sell alcohol. So a deputy can just step outside, have a few alcoholic drinks, and vote. People in other professions would be fired on disciplinary grounds.
- 762236 5y agoIt isn't surprising to see so many poor postures while using the phone. You want your spine in a neutral position, not with the head bent forward. Thus raise the phone in front of your face, allowing the spine to be in a neutral position. Or bend at the hips to lean forward while maintaining a neutral spine (which is hard to do at a desk).