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Most revenue doesn't include any of the new iPhone 12 phones - there was a miss on iPhone revenue which can be explained by people waiting for the new phone rel
by blantonl 6y ago
Most revenue doesn't include any of the new iPhone 12 phones - there was a miss on iPhone revenue which can be explained by people waiting for the new phone release.
Mac Sales absolutely crushed the number, by an almost 3B beat (9B vs 6B). That is HUGE.
Apple is going to have a phenomenal next quarter.
- MuffinFlavored 6y ago> Mac Sales absolutely crushed the number, by an almost 3B beat (9B vs 6B). That is HUGE. I'm eagerly waiting to be an early adopter on their non-Intel laptops as soon as they come out as well. I'm sure I'm not alone.
- mpweiher 6y agoParticularly if it's a fast + light + long-lasting 12" MacBook revival.
- nodesocket 6y agoI am just worried about all my developer tools (Docker, VMware Fusion, VirtualBox, brew) all breaking switching to ARM.
- f6v 6y agoThose will be ok, I’m thinking of R packages I use which build FORTRAN code on installation.
- entropicdrifter 6y agoIf they build on installation, then Apple just needs to make sure they have build tools ready. That's easy pickings compared to porting individual packages or apps.
- mh8h 6y agogcc is not supported on the Apple Silicon yet. So anything that relies on that is going to be an issue.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- easton 6y agoApple demoed Docker and Parallels at the Developer State of the Union, and has written a new Hypervisor.framework for the new Macs. I think it'll be fine (I'll be sure once VirtualBox gets working on it, with the amount of trouble they've had with the new Windows Hypervisor I hope it'll be faster).
- skrtskrt 6y agoDoes any of this mean that Docker for Mac (ARM) will be less of an insane resource hog?
- acdha 6y agoDocker for Mac isn’t on x86 so it seems likely it will continue not to be.
- KnobbleMcKnees 6y agoI thought they'd already confirmed that x86_64 virtualization won't be possible on Silicon? If so that rules out a significant number of development use cases.
- nottorp 6y agoWhat I've been able to find is that Rosetta will run 64 bit Intel apps, but that won't help the likes of Parallels. So there will be no way to run Windows/Intel in a VM? Or even Linux/Intel or older versions of Mac OS for that matter? That's bad.
- snowwrestler 6y agoWhat Apple has said is that you can't run existing x86 virtualization applications on top of Rosetta 2. So you can't take the copy of Parallels you have today and run it on Rosetta 2. Which make sense, since that would be running emulation on top of an emulation--likely to be super slow. Instead, what you will do is get a new version of x86 virtualization applications (like Parallels) that run directly on top of Apple Silicon--in other words, you use them instead of Rosetta 2, not on top of Rosetta 2. That's what easton is talking about, above.
- jack2222 6y agoI'm sure they'll tout some new "Rosetta" feature like they had for the switch from PowerPC to Intel last time
- saagarjha 6y agoThey already have–but not for virtualization, it's just for apps.
- entropicdrifter 6y agoDocker already runs fine on ARM Linux, I can't imagine porting to Apple's ARM flavor of Unix is that much harder
- saagarjha 6y agoThis isn't really how it works. I mean, it won't necessarily be difficult, but having it working on ARM Linux means very little for it working on macOS.
- larkost 6y agoI disagree. On MacOS (x86) Docker runs inside a VM; which is running Linux (since Docker needs Linux kernel features). On the forthcoming ARM version of MacOS, it will need to run a VM, running the ARM version of linux. So having Docker working on the ARM version of linux is a good portion of the work needed to get it to run on ARM MacOS. You still have to get the VM and communications setup done, but Apple has already said they have done much of that work.
- saagarjha 6y agoLinux working on ARM is not new work at all.
- entropicdrifter 6y agoBut setting up a VM to run Linux on ARM on top of MacOS on ARM is new work
- skrtskrt 6y agoIsn’t brew just ruby scripts?
- saagarjha 6y agoYes, but it builds a whole lot of software that does things like hardcode "10.x" as a macOS version number or treat "ARM Darwin" as iPhone.
- dmix 6y agoMind if I ask why? It will take quite some time for everything to be ported. And there will always be the longtail that never will be.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- OldHand2018 6y agoI've got a 2017 MBP and am planning to get rid of it before the 4 year keyboard service program ends on it. My iPad Pro has become my default mobile device, so I'd prefer to get something like a Mac Mini and am hoping they have something worth buying. The current Mac Mini is just a hard no at this point.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- jamil7 6y agoI’ll probably grab a pro machine if they announce one since I’m sitting on a 2013 macbook pro, it still goes great but I’m starting to feel compile times eat up a bit of my day. Most of what I need to work, XCode, Docker and a web browser will be available.
- MuffinFlavored 6y agoI use Chrome, Sublime Text, Terminal, WhatsApp, Messages, Skype, Discord, Hex Fiend, Calculator, AnyDesk, Ghidra, and Notes. What would I be waiting for port wise day 1?
- hugi 6y agoYou're not alone. My 2019 15" MacBook was damaged beyond repair just before they announced the ARM transition. I decided to wait and I've been programming on a 2012 Mac Mini for the past few months. Amazing machine considering it's age, but I'm very ready for a new one.
- samatman 6y agoI have a rule of thumb with Apple: get the fourth iteration of any new offering. I don't always apply it, admittedly: I ordered a HomePod the day they were announced. But you'd have to pay me to be part of the first wave of A series Macs. Second is a maybe, third, I'd consider it, by the fourth I'm positively looking forward to it. I'm glad there are people like you, who are willing to shake the bugs out on my behalf ;)
- steve_adams_86 6y agoI agree. Especially as a developer. Even migrating to a new version of MacOS makes me nervous, let alone new hardware architecture. I’m excited for the future, but I’ll be late to get there.
- wiredfool 6y agoI bought the first white x86 MacBook on the day it was announced, and it went pretty well. There was one design issue that needed fixed in the first year, but other than that it was a solid laptop for 5 years or more till it finally died. I would have waited, but I was extending the life of the previous tibook for a year prior. I’m not in the market for a laptop now, but I’m really curious about what’s in the pipeline. Oddly enough, My MBP is about as old as the tibook was in that transition, but it’s not feeling slow or ole enough to replace yet.
- read_if_gay_ 6y ago> My MBP is about as old as the tibook was in that transition, but it’s not feeling slow or ole enough to replace yet. I guess you can thank Intel for a decade of stagnation.
- wiredfool 6y agoI think the 2015 era MBP was also a much more durable physical design than the Titanium Powerbook g4. The keyboard is more solid, there's no paint to rub off, the panel over the dvd doesn't flex, the battery connections don't flex. Magsafe is also a better power connector than the coax plugs.
- TheRealKing 6y agoI could never become a fan of APPLE products. A selfish company that wants to have control over every aspect of the customer's digital life. If I want to develop a software, I have to be a registered developer with Apple. If I am a user, I can hardly use software developed by non-Apple-registered developers. There is now a section on my paid legally-purchased Apple Mac, over which no one has any control or access privileges, except Apple. and they are still planning to strip users of further control over their own purchased Apple device. Every step Apple has taken over the past decade has been toward isolating and stripping the rights of its customers more and more. What amazes me is how people fall for their advertisement tricks, that anyone who uses Apple products is smarter than others.
- nodesocket 6y ago> there was a miss on iPhone revenue which can be explained by people waiting for the new phone release. Agree, I think a lot of people were waiting for iPhone 12 to release.
- babesh 6y agoIt’s also possible that people use iPads and laptops more and phones less with the ongoing pandemic. I suspect that more given Samsung’s forecasts for Q4. It can be some combination of both forces.
- SllX 6y agoOne data point: my phone was demoted to a wallet to such a degree that when I did have to replace it, I opted for an SE just for Touch ID. I also purchased an iPad and offloaded a ton of functions onto that. This year’s phones look great, but there’s always next year’s models or the year after’s.
- saagarjha 6y agoTurns out that if they make computers people want to buy…they buy them!
- makecheck 6y agoActually the Mac sales aren’t that surprising to me; lousy keyboards were preventing everyone I knew (including me) from upgrading. They finally shipped something reasonable that would sell. Now if they just get rid of Touch Bar they’ll make up the rest.
- ryanSrich 6y agoApple should make the macbook pro a lot more customizable IMO. Have multiple keyboard types, add/remove touch bar, add/remove ability to upgrade RAM after purchase, customize number of ports and port types, etc. I know a lot of people (myself included) that would gladly pay for those types of upgrades.
- dzhiurgis 6y agoI’ve always said they need to separate dev from creative machines. For most devs keyboard is way more important than gpu or display color accuracy. Maybe that could be the differentiator for Apple Silicon. Keep x86 for devs who need compatibility. Creatives who need compute. Or they could just keep pushing iPad as creatives device even further...
- auggierose 6y agoI'd argue if a "dev" doesn't need more compute than a "creative", he or she is doing obsolete work.
- theodric 6y agoYeah who needs functional base system libraries when you could be working on MACHINE LEARNING instead Grow up
- auggierose 6y agoA computer is for computing. If you don't have demanding computations to run, you are most likely waisting the potential of your machine(s), and not pushing your art to the limit. If you don't do that, you are obsolete. Who said anything about MACHINE LEARNING?
- lotsofpulp 6y agoNot to mention the boost they will get from Apple One subscriptions. The $30 plan is almost a no brainer for families if they're already paying for iCloud and music.
- cwhiz 6y agoIndeed. My family pays $15 for Music and $10 for 2TB iCloud. For $5 more we will get Fitness, Arcade, News+, and TV+. I bet their service revenue will see quite a boost from Apple One.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- minimaxir 6y agoThe new 27" iMacs have been in relatively low stock as well online and from resellers. The features there + uncertain concerns about Apple Silicon for iMacs pushed me to get one and I've been very happy with it.
- steve_adams_86 6y agoI used to have one years ago and it was a real joy to use. They’re pretty incredible machines. Unfortunately I’m not much of a desktop person... although oddly, I’d like to be. I find it hard to give up portability for my main machine though. I’ve sat and ogled the newer iMacs for sure though, and I’m looking forward to seeing where the line goes.
- mgkimsal 6y agoSimilar here, but... considering new iMac in next few months, because the covid stuff has meant... I'm not nearly as mobile as I used to be. 2019 MBP will keep me going for mobility needs in the next couple years, but a desktop will give me somewhat better processing speeds for some tasks (some video, some data crunching).
- vondur 6y agoThere is a 4-5 week order time for custom iMacs at the moment.
- minimaxir 6y agoIn the case of the 27" iMac, it's weird. When I BTO the highest-end SKU (https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/imac/27-inch-3.8ghz-8-core-processor-with-turbo-boost-up-to-5.0ghz-512gb# https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/imac/27-inch-3.8ghz-8-cor...) w/ the 5700XT GPU (a recommended upgrade), the order time actually decreases by 10 days.
- vondur 6y agoThis was a 27" iMac, but not the high end model like yours. Wonder what parts are causing the delays?
- totalZero 6y agoMac sales offer lower margin than iPhone sales, as I understand. 9B in mac sales does not translate to the same amount of profit as 9B in iPhone sales would be. China sales were down quite a bit (28.8% QoQ). That drew my attention because China is supposedly a growth market for Apple.
- sgerenser 6y agoMacs might have lower margin on a percentage basis but the average selling price is probably 2-3x the iPhone ASP. So the profit for unit is almost certainly higher.
- totalZero 6y agoSure. However, Apple reports revenue in terms of dollars sold, not units sold. I don't see how profit per unit is relevant when you're reading a 10Q. You can look at HPQ's PC margin (and adjust based on how much extra % premium you think Apple charges versus HPQ) to get a rough idea of the margins for Macs. The point is, people are looking at this revenue number as a beat, but in reality it would be a far better situation to have missed on Mac revenue and beat on iPhone revenue, due to the differences in margin.
- sgerenser 6y agoYou’re right, I read it too fast as 9M units not 9B in revenue. I’m sure Apples margins on Macs are much higher than the rest of the PC industry but they’re almost certainly making less margin on them than on iPhones. That being said, I don’t think missing on iPhones for this quarter that includes the time period right before a major release is particularly damning. If they miss NEXT quarter that would be a big problem.
- ksec 6y agoI think it is a combination of Work from Home, ARM Transition people wanting at least one more x86 MacBook / iMac and possibly Mac Pro from Studio so everyone could put off the ARM transition with Pro Tools for as long as possible. But 50% increase in Mac is quite something. The problem with these sales figure is that Apple thinks their Mac are doing great and their customer loves it. ( There are lot of people forced / locked into buying it and use it but dont loves it ) Let wait and see if Apple release a new Mac customer satisfaction number after discontinuing in the past quarters.
- thomdoenas 6y agoI anticipate the in the next quarter report which should include the iphone 12 sales, we should see a continued trend of lower sales. Primarily because it seems they had a lot of constraint in manufacturing and distribution with these models. There has been super strong demand early on with all the carrier incentives but once people saw the distribution delays that went out almost a month, I think that demand quickly died down as people wait for faster arrival times and more option diversity (iphone 12 mini models come to market). This is all speculation and I am using my own experience here to determine this but I don’t think the coming results are going to be as aggressive within the next quarter or so as distribution for the phones continue to be limited with rising cases and manufacturing capacity also potentially being limited
- ksec 6y agoNo idea why you think there is a constraint or distribution problem. The reality is both iPhone 12 and Pro are doing exceptionally well in most if not all market. ( May be not Europe )