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Hospital workers make masks from office supplies
- 1996 7y agoEven if it reduces the risk of contamination from a direct "cough in the face" from 100% to 95%, when facing a disease with exponential progression, every little bit helps. Perfection is the enemy of the good.
- istorical 7y agoSo many people in both national media and social media parroting the info that masks which are not perfect or not perfectly fitted are worthless, when in reality a smaller viral load (such as a partially blocked cough or a percentage of droplets being blocked) can actually lead to lower mortality.
- amiga 7y agoHopefully less people hoard masks for no good reason.
- watwut 7y agoWhich is still dumb reason to lie. Especially when state can demand that official masks go to hospitals full stop. People can make homemade masks. Here, women who have sewing machines are making them for everyone around.
- fortran77 7y agoI've been wearing a homemade mask when I go out to the grocery store. I think of it as a last line of defense if someone should cough in my direction. I know the virus is .02 microns but it's being carried in a droplet of liquid that's considerable larger and may get caught by the two layers of dish cloth with a sheet from an air filter between them. I sewed it to fit securely around my nose and mouth and it extends all the way around the sides of my face.
- Gibbon1 7y agoActual paper comparing homemade masks said they were about 70-80% as effective as a commercial N95 mask. Both are equally effective at preventing you from touching your mouth and nose.
- Darkphibre 7y agoI've been wearing gloves... more as a reminder not to touch my face and to strongly scrub them when taking off said gloves before doing anything else.
- mistermann 7y agoInteresting, I'd love to read that report if you can find the link again.
- Gibbon1 7y agoThis is it. https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/disaster-medicine-and-public-health-preparedness/article/testing-the-efficacy-of-homemade-masks-would-they-protect-in-an-influenza-pandemic/0921A05A69A9419C862FA2F35F819D55 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/disaster-medicine-an... Someone took that data and used it for this more accessible article. https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/best-materials-make-diy-face-mask-virus/ https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/best-materials-make-diy-...
- 7y ago
- outlace 7y agoAt the very least food handlers should have been wearing masks since the beginning of this. Before all the restaurants closed I didn't see any food handlers wearing masks.
- fma 7y agoIt's common in China for food handlers including waitresses) to wear masks, and or a face shield. I know China doesn't have their act together on many areas of health and sanitation. But we should adopt good practices and remove the stigma in the US that mask = bad.
- outlace 7y agoAgreed. I think hand hygiene in the west is probably better (I’ve never seen anyone use hand sanitizer in China, and saw more people leaving the restroom without washing their hands - anecdotal) but China is definitely better about respiratory precautions. And certainly China acted much quicker than most western countries have in slowing the spread. From in-law family I have in China, there also were no food or home food shortages like there are in many western countries now for unclear reasons. Unclear if there is just lack of hoarding behavior or if the stores and/or government immediately restricted panic buying.
- mathgladiator 7y agoI'm experimenting with snorkel mask and n99 filters
- crazygringo 7y agoThere are a lot of things about this pandemic that have left me depressed. But the fact that as the world's richest country, we don't even have the administrative ability to keep a national emergency stockpile of essential medical supplies like face masks to get to hospitals immediately is just... I can't even. By sheer coincidence, I happened to spend a week in Mexico City the day swine flu hit it, a decade ago. For the next several days, there were policemen everywhere distributing masks to the public. Instant response, zero shortage. I am genuinely curious what the root cause is here, if you did a "five whys" analysis. Not a knee-jerk thing, but the real answer. Is it that political squabbling has left things unfunded? Unappointed administrators have left things undone, unmaintained, or backlogged? Was it a conscious decision to decentralize and expect each hospital to be responsible for maintaining its own emergency supply? A belief that supply chains would handle it and stockpiling not needed? Is there a stockpile somewhere that isn't being released? I'm really looking forward to a newspaper exposé on this one, because it's a true scandal.
- esyir 7y agoThe US had a stockpile, but it was for bioterrorism scale and not pandemic scale.
- gojomo 7y agoWhy would "bioterrorism scale" & "pandemic scale" be different, especially if a bioterror agent was crafted to be contagious (& thus create pandemic conditions)?
- marcosdumay 7y agoJust to add, but why would a bioterror agent not be crafted to be contagious? Spread is the big differential on bioterror, and most other forms of terrorism do not require a team with members that have 2 PHDs each.
- smacktoward 7y agoA bioterrorist cell would not have the resources to craft a perfectly engineered biological weapon. They'd be more likely to have access to limited quantities of some pre-existing biological agent (like anthrax, say). So what you'd see in that scenario is attacks that cause a bunch of casualties in a few locations in one big splash, and then quickly peter out after that. It's like, what's the difference between a terrorist nuclear attack and a full-scale nuclear war? In the former scenario, you're talking a small number of low-yield devices triggered in one country; the rest of the world still stands able to provide assistance. In the latter scenario, there's nobody left to help who hasn't also been blown to ashes.
- dillonmckay 7y agohttps://hackaday.com/2020/02/12/hacked-protective-gear-keeps-doctor-safe-in-the-hot-zone/ https://hackaday.com/2020/02/12/hacked-protective-gear-keeps... Positive pressure DIY mask.
- dillonmckay 7y agoSo, in the US at least, at auto parts stores, it is a ‘HEPA cabin air filter’, to use as the filter for this parts list.
- jws 7y agoIt's worth noting that this is backwards in function of the surgical masks. The surgical mask which strap on over the nose and mouth are about preventing the wearer from spreading disease by catching the exhaled droplets and crud. They help for inhaling, but lots of inhaled air gets in around the edges. It's right there in the name "surgical mask", you wear it in surgeries to avoid infecting the patient. The positive pressure mask is about providing only safe air to the wearer, protecting them from others. The passive respirator I wear when sanding or working with solvents is P100 (P means tolerates oil, N means doesn't and the 100 is better than the 95 you see in N95), but it is also backwards. It protects my airways, but has an exhale valve which lets my lung leavings right out into the atmosphere, and it does nothing for my eyes.
- im3w1l 7y agoThe advice we hear is to cough into your elbow. Can it really not clear that low bar?
- _-___________-_ 7y agoIt seems literally to be designed to expel the air within the mask and replace it with external air. Which is the opposite of what most masks aim to achieve (contain droplets within the mask to prevent them from reaching others), and would seem to increase the risk to people nearby.
- wegs 7y ago
- pugworthy 7y agoHere are some articles that may help those wanting to create effective face masks... Higher level view on efficacy of different home-available materials for filter masks -> https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/best-materials-make-diy-face-mask-virus/ https://smartairfilters.com/en/blog/best-materials-make-diy-... More technical 2013 article from the "Society for Disaster Medicine and Public Health" on different material efficacy -> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AjwLMkEufJ2SSHRYyXpp3QY9jvQS7n--/view https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AjwLMkEufJ2SSHRYyXpp3QY9jvQ... Lastly some sewing patterns for masks -> https://so-sew-easy.com/face-mask-sewing-patterns https://so-sew-easy.com/face-mask-sewing-patterns
- jpindar 7y agoAlso https://www.researchgate.net/publication/258525804_Testing_the_Efficacy_of_Homemade_Masks_Would_They_Protect_in_an_Influenza_Pandemic#pf7 https://www.researchgate.net/publication/258525804_Testing_t...
- malandrew 7y agoRecommended Guidance for Extended Use and Limited Reuse of N95 Filtering Facepiece Respirators in Healthcare Settings https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/hcwcontrols/recommendedguidanceextuse.html https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/hcwcontrols/recommendedguid...
- Darkphibre 7y agoI was hoping this covered how to sanitize them (I had a couple N95s in storage that I've been reusing when out shopping. I live in Redmond/Kirkland, the initial epicenter). I've heard some hospitals are lightly bleaching, and I'm curious if my Everclear sprays would degrade the barriers. What a crazy time to be living.
- malandrew 7y agoSince alcohol helps, I suspect soaking them in 70% ethyl or isopropyl alcohol and letting them dry should work for coronavirus at least. I reckon alcohol will also do less damage to the mask than bleach. If you want to try both alcohol and bleach just don't mix alcohol and bleach at the same time as that will create chloroform. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK214356/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK214356/ edit: ignore the idea of using alcohol as it will destroy the electrostatic absorption of an N95 mask.
- malandrew 7y agoHere's a better resource: http://www.imcclinics.com/english/index.php/news/view?id=83 http://www.imcclinics.com/english/index.php/news/view?id=83 Key excerpt: "The new coronavirus is sensitive to heat. It can effectively inactivate the new coronavirus by heating for 30 minutes at 56 degrees Celsius. Therefore, the single dry heat sterilization (70 degrees Celsius heating for 30 minutes) can effectively inactivate the virus without affecting the protective function of the mask."
- Darkphibre 7y agoThank you so much!! Alcohol can cause crazing or stiffening in some plastics, so I worried about potential foams in the filters. In fact, that was covered by your article: 2. The disinfection method of spraying alcohol on the mask will destroy the electrostatic absorption of the mask, causing filtering efficiency of the mask lowering below 95%.
- tuna-piano 7y agoThe only illogical thing to me here (in the current moment, what do we do now?) is - why are administrators doing this in such a hacky way? We have a whole country with many, many ways of producing different types of products. Why isn't a proper manufacturing operation at a paper company, quilt company, halloween costume company, etc etc etc producing a big volume of hacked masks to be distributed to tons of hospitals?
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- fma 7y agoI've asked this question every single day. Even w/o government intervention, a competent CEO would say "Hey there's a huge global demand for my product, and it'll likely be a domestic demand. Lets crank out these health products". The US closed and withdrew all their employees from the US Consulate in Wuhan on Jan 26th. Can't say we didn't know it was serious. Masks shortage have been known for a while. The tinfoil hat in my says because the US wants this to spread. I have no other logical explanation.
- hn23 7y agoWhat you say is an argument from ignorance...but anyway: you should not imply intent if incompetence works as well. And the latter is strong in.the current US government;)
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- nopinsight 7y agoEvery country that can should ramp up their mask production to the maximum. There will be a global shortage for (likely 6-12+) months to come. They can make and save the handsome profit to retrofit their factories to manufacture other things later.
- zeckalpha 7y agoI wonder about moving from disposable to cleanable masks/shields. Not sure if that would help this specific situation, though.
- GreaterFool 7y agoWhy are all the masks single use? Why can't we make reusable masks that can be disinfected by UV light? Structurally those masks are pretty solid. I can easily wear a single surgical masks for quite some time. But would need some way to disinfect it! EDIT: if everyone wore masks, like in Japan (where I live), then it would limit the spread. If you're in early stages of the infection and you have no idea, but you war a mask then you're less likely to infect other people. AFAICT Japan isn't doing anything radical to stop the spread and yet the virus is not spreading much. At best Japan asks infected people to stay at home. No lock downs or quarantines. Bars, cafes, gyms and theaters are all open. Life goes on. What's the magic? Almost universal use of masks is the only reason I can think of because I haven't seen any other measures in the society. Yes, they closed schools but they usually close schools to some degree due to influenza.
- krtkush 7y ago> AFAICT Japan isn't doing anything radical to stop the spread and yet the virus is not spreading much. At best Japan asks infected people to stay at home. No lock downs or quarantines. Bars, cafes, gyms and theaters are all open. Life goes on. Reports are that they are not testing enough. We can't tell who is doing it the right way. We'll only know few months down the line.
- hcknwscommenter 7y agoThe data comes in a couple of weeks down the line, not months. If you are not testing enough (they are), then your death rate is exponential 14 days lagged. Japan is clearly doing a good job.
- gvjddbnvdrbv 7y ago28 days lagged. 5-14 day incubation period. 5-7 day low symptom period. 5-14 days to death.
- hcknwscommenter 7y ago
- mischa_u 7y agoAs for doing fit testing at home, using cigarette smoke might be helpful: "... it was found that tobacco smoke as it comes from a cigarette is an extremely concentrated aerosol with a relatively stable distribution of sizes ranging from 0.1 to 1.0 micron, peaked between 0.2 and 0.25 micron." Source: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0095852260900374 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0095852260...
- pugworthy 7y agoHere is a CDC article about making a respirator mask with t-shirt cloth. Towards the end it states... “We showed that a hand-fashioned mask can provide a good fit and a measurable level of protection from a challenge aerosol.” https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/12/6/pdfs/05-1468.pdf https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/12/6/pdfs/05-1468.pdf
- nico_h 7y agoWas there any follow up on this study on using salt to inactivate virus on masks? I can’t seem to repost the study discussed here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22232633 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22232633
- m0zg 7y agoHow is it possible that our hospitals have crapped out 2 weeks into the ordeal with fewer than 10K patients? We are spending 3.6 _trillion_ dollars on this shit _per year_. Those masks should be available by the metric ton and sewn with gold thread at this price.
- dragonwriter 7y ago> How is it possible that our hospitals have crapped out 2 weeks into the ordeal with fewer than 10K patients? Because hospital and ICU maximum capacity is something less than double average daily caseload, so it's easily overwhelmed by a local surge.
- m0zg 7y agoMove ventilators to where they're needed then, maybe? Move patients elsewhere? Just a thought. It can't be that the formidable US healthcare system is incapable of handling 9500 cases nationwide, no matter the severity.
- dragonwriter 7y agoOne projection has, even with “flattening the curve” with three months of fairly strict restrictions, peak caseload in the US at 8× total existing capacity. Moving stuff around lets you change which locality is the first to be overwhelmed, but doesn't change much else. > It can't be that the formidable US healthcare system The US healthcare system is notably fragile, not formidable.
- m0zg 7y ago> The US healthcare system is notably fragile, not formidable. Citation needed. I've seen numbers that suggest the US has 2.5x ICU beds per capita compared to European average. It also costs 3.6 _trillion_ dollars a year. Surely at least some of this money contributes to it being less "fragile"?
- 7y ago