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Quick summary, for those like me who get game sites blocked at work :) - Sublime text, then VS Code - Photoshop - Paint.net (pixel editing) - TexturePacker

Quick summary, for those like me who get game sites blocked at work :) - Sublime text, then VS Code - Photoshop - Paint.net (pixel editing) - TexturePacker (create sprite sheets) - Trello, Then Codecks (project task management) - Chrome (for devtools) - Bitbucket (git host) and SourceTree (git client GUI) - Electron/NW.js (native PC executable for HTML game) - Greenworks (Steam SDK) - Back4App/Parse (Payment, user auth) - Humblestore widget (payment processing) - Layershift (hosting node - Crowdin (translation) - CoffeeScript (programming language) - Python/Ruby (scripting languages)

lucasverra 7y ago
i can vouch for back4app, satisfied client. Parse server OSS (and b4a service) does help us in our development.
jszymborski 7y ago
It's not clear to me if they used Electron's Node backend for much more than it's File API. If that's the case, they might have been better off just using a QT webview (e.g. pywebview) for the sake of performance (which they cite as reason for moving from NW.js/Electron).
- fuzzy2 7y ago
  > pywebview Uses Edge or IE on Windows by default. Nope nope nope. :D
  - jszymborski 7y ago
    you can set it to use CEF, however
- Phillips126 7y ago
  I'm not very familiar with Qt or Qt webview but from their documentation it states: > This version of Qt WebEngine is based on Chromium version 73.0.3683, with additional security fixes from newer versions. Assuming they both have a full Chromium embed, would there have been better performance? I assume the developers are mostly JavaScript devs so their choice to use Electron/Node makes sense.
  - mister_hn 7y ago
    Qr 5.13 is based on Chrome 76-77
- IggleSniggle 7y ago
  Most folks complaint with Electron isn't that it isn't performative, but rather that it is bloated (you ship an entire browser when all you needed was eg the canvas and v8 engine).
  - seangrogg 7y ago
    In all fairness, are you aware of a tool for web developers that only ships the canvas and v8 engine? Legitimately curious, because I've tried looking in the past for similar reasons (game dev on an engine I already know) and came up empty-handed.
    - devit 7y ago
      Just setup a localhost server and open the default browser on it. Or just have a website, if you don't need privileged access to the user's machine.
      - IggleSniggle 7y ago
        Just in case you are not being facetious: totally agreed; but in the case of delivering a game on platforms that include Steam, and also for perception reasons, not really an option.
    - luismedel 7y ago
      I've always dreamed for an Ejecta[0] like solution for desktop systems. [0] https://github.com/phoboslab/Ejecta https://github.com/phoboslab/Ejecta
      - Kiro 7y ago
        I second this. Ejecta is beautiful and I really hoped the concept would catch on.
      - seangrogg 7y ago
        This would be great, if only... Realistically, I just want a canvas with some audio/input stuff in most cases (though being able to put some divs in places may be nice for rendering things like menus).
- pier25 7y ago
  QT is expensive for the indie developers. A better choice would have been to simply use WKWebView in macOS and the equivalent in .NET/UWP for Windows.
  - snazz 7y ago
    Except for then you have to deal with whatever version of embedded Internet Explorer .NET uses. Maybe the UWP solution uses Edge now, but that still isn’t wonderful compared with embedding Chromium.
    - tenryuu 7y ago
      Usually in .NET you typically get IE, not Edge. People have been using CefSharp as a replacement. A number of software I have contributed to have done this. In contrast, UWP applications do use the Edge rendering engine, and while it may or may not be possible to use CEF in these applications, you won't be able to get it certified by Microsoft, therefore no one, at least to my research, has bothered doing so. I wonder what the future brings with Edge now just being chromium based
  - colejohnson66 7y ago
    Nitpick: QT isn’t expensive if you agree to the LGPL. If you want to do your own thing, you have to pay up.
- The_rationalist 7y ago
  What about https://www.chromestatus.com/feature/6284708426022912 https://www.chromestatus.com/feature/6284708426022912 ?
- bakuninsbart 7y ago
  It is an html game, runs basically on a potato with electrical wires plugged into.
  - ben-schaaf 7y ago
    Most websites don't run well on even high end hardware. There's most certainly a performance tradeoff using a browser, especially for something as performance sensitive as a game.
    - soylentgraham 7y ago
      There's a performance trade off using the DOM. If you only draw to canvases and execute javascript, the browser becomes a very fast engine.
buboard 7y ago
They could have just used flash
- badloginagain 7y ago
  Nooooo. Flash is dead, thank god.[1] 1. https://www.rystedtcreative.com/tech-talks/flash-dead/ https://www.rystedtcreative.com/tech-talks/flash-dead/
- andai 7y ago
  I remember steam games were made in Flash a few years ago. Doesn’t it just export to HTML5 these days? Isn’t it used / couldn’t it be used to make a steam game?
  - egypturnash 7y ago
    Yes, it does. Adobe changed its name to "Animate" once they got the HTML5 export working. Dunno if it's in use for any games nowadays.
    - pjmlp 7y ago
      You can also AOT compile, so that would be another option.
- pier25 7y ago
  Even better, Haxe. The language is very familiar for AS3 devs and it transpiles to performant C++. Many games such as Papers Please have been made with Haxe. There are numerous engines/libs for game devs: http://kha.tech/ http://kha.tech/ https://www.openfl.org https://www.openfl.org https://github.com/haxenme/NME https://github.com/haxenme/NME
  - joshtynjala 7y ago
    Just to add a little more... Haxe not only transpiles to C++, but it also transpiles to JavaScript. With a Haxe codebase, can deploy a project as both a native app and on the web. Really nice for games especially.
riadd 7y ago
I added some more mentions: - Buzz! / FFmpeg - SugarJS - tween.js - hjson
sdegutis 7y ago
It still confuses and unsettles me that Paint.net started as open source and then went closed source. I mean, people already had the source. All because someone tried to fork it? It just doesn't add up.
- keithnz 7y ago
  see https://blog.getpaint.net/2007/12/04/freeware-authors-beware-of-%E2%80%9Cbackspaceware%E2%80%9D/ https://blog.getpaint.net/2007/12/04/freeware-authors-beware... Someone tried to claim it as their own by repackaging it and packaging up some plugins... He obviously got annoyed and figured he doesn't want to make it so easy to make your own version. It adds up for me, just kind of unfortunate, I'd like to think it still would've been better off open, but it's his creation and his time and effort so if that's what he wants to do, I'm ok with it.
ttty 7y ago
Some more notes from my experience: If you're serious about large scale games, you should look into typescript. I'd start away from any other language, like coffee script, Ruby... See my next point. Use node.js on the back end so you can do client side and server side validation with the same code. Another benefit is that you can also make your game single player much easier. I usually prefer to start the game multiplayer first and then do single player. Another tool useful for game is pixi.js (or phaser if you need what they provide. Pixi just does the rendering part, phaser does a lot of game related things) I'd use illustrator instead of Photoshop because you can scale your graphics without losing quality. Vectorial is better than bitmap. For state management I use redux. If you're interested here is my game https://bitplanets.com https://bitplanets.com . It's a RTS game, where you need to conquer planets. You can play with your friends and people online. Of course no need to download or register and works on mobile. (60fps if on a decent phone)

lucasverra 7y ago

i can vouch for back4app, satisfied client. Parse server OSS (and b4a service) does help us in our development.

jszymborski 7y ago

It's not clear to me if they used Electron's Node backend for much more than it's File API. If that's the case, they might have been better off just using a QT webview (e.g. pywebview) for the sake of performance (which they cite as reason for moving from NW.js/Electron).

fuzzy2 7y ago
> pywebview Uses Edge or IE on Windows by default. Nope nope nope. :D
- jszymborski 7y ago
  you can set it to use CEF, however
Phillips126 7y ago
I'm not very familiar with Qt or Qt webview but from their documentation it states: > This version of Qt WebEngine is based on Chromium version 73.0.3683, with additional security fixes from newer versions. Assuming they both have a full Chromium embed, would there have been better performance? I assume the developers are mostly JavaScript devs so their choice to use Electron/Node makes sense.
- mister_hn 7y ago
  Qr 5.13 is based on Chrome 76-77
IggleSniggle 7y ago
Most folks complaint with Electron isn't that it isn't performative, but rather that it is bloated (you ship an entire browser when all you needed was eg the canvas and v8 engine).
- seangrogg 7y ago
  In all fairness, are you aware of a tool for web developers that only ships the canvas and v8 engine? Legitimately curious, because I've tried looking in the past for similar reasons (game dev on an engine I already know) and came up empty-handed.
  - devit 7y ago
    Just setup a localhost server and open the default browser on it. Or just have a website, if you don't need privileged access to the user's machine.
    - IggleSniggle 7y ago
      Just in case you are not being facetious: totally agreed; but in the case of delivering a game on platforms that include Steam, and also for perception reasons, not really an option.
  - luismedel 7y ago
    I've always dreamed for an Ejecta[0] like solution for desktop systems. [0] https://github.com/phoboslab/Ejecta https://github.com/phoboslab/Ejecta
    - Kiro 7y ago
      I second this. Ejecta is beautiful and I really hoped the concept would catch on.
    - seangrogg 7y ago
      This would be great, if only... Realistically, I just want a canvas with some audio/input stuff in most cases (though being able to put some divs in places may be nice for rendering things like menus).
pier25 7y ago
QT is expensive for the indie developers. A better choice would have been to simply use WKWebView in macOS and the equivalent in .NET/UWP for Windows.
- snazz 7y ago
  Except for then you have to deal with whatever version of embedded Internet Explorer .NET uses. Maybe the UWP solution uses Edge now, but that still isn’t wonderful compared with embedding Chromium.
  - tenryuu 7y ago
    Usually in .NET you typically get IE, not Edge. People have been using CefSharp as a replacement. A number of software I have contributed to have done this. In contrast, UWP applications do use the Edge rendering engine, and while it may or may not be possible to use CEF in these applications, you won't be able to get it certified by Microsoft, therefore no one, at least to my research, has bothered doing so. I wonder what the future brings with Edge now just being chromium based
- colejohnson66 7y ago
  Nitpick: QT isn’t expensive if you agree to the LGPL. If you want to do your own thing, you have to pay up.
The_rationalist 7y ago
What about https://www.chromestatus.com/feature/6284708426022912 https://www.chromestatus.com/feature/6284708426022912 ?
bakuninsbart 7y ago
It is an html game, runs basically on a potato with electrical wires plugged into.
- ben-schaaf 7y ago
  Most websites don't run well on even high end hardware. There's most certainly a performance tradeoff using a browser, especially for something as performance sensitive as a game.
  - soylentgraham 7y ago
    There's a performance trade off using the DOM. If you only draw to canvases and execute javascript, the browser becomes a very fast engine.

buboard 7y ago

They could have just used flash

badloginagain 7y ago
Nooooo. Flash is dead, thank god.[1] 1. https://www.rystedtcreative.com/tech-talks/flash-dead/ https://www.rystedtcreative.com/tech-talks/flash-dead/
andai 7y ago
I remember steam games were made in Flash a few years ago. Doesn’t it just export to HTML5 these days? Isn’t it used / couldn’t it be used to make a steam game?
- egypturnash 7y ago
  Yes, it does. Adobe changed its name to "Animate" once they got the HTML5 export working. Dunno if it's in use for any games nowadays.
  - pjmlp 7y ago
    You can also AOT compile, so that would be another option.
pier25 7y ago
Even better, Haxe. The language is very familiar for AS3 devs and it transpiles to performant C++. Many games such as Papers Please have been made with Haxe. There are numerous engines/libs for game devs: http://kha.tech/ http://kha.tech/ https://www.openfl.org https://www.openfl.org https://github.com/haxenme/NME https://github.com/haxenme/NME
- joshtynjala 7y ago
  Just to add a little more... Haxe not only transpiles to C++, but it also transpiles to JavaScript. With a Haxe codebase, can deploy a project as both a native app and on the web. Really nice for games especially.

riadd 7y ago

I added some more mentions: - Buzz! / FFmpeg - SugarJS - tween.js - hjson

sdegutis 7y ago

It still confuses and unsettles me that Paint.net started as open source and then went closed source. I mean, people already had the source. All because someone tried to fork it? It just doesn't add up.

keithnz 7y ago
see https://blog.getpaint.net/2007/12/04/freeware-authors-beware-of-%E2%80%9Cbackspaceware%E2%80%9D/ https://blog.getpaint.net/2007/12/04/freeware-authors-beware... Someone tried to claim it as their own by repackaging it and packaging up some plugins... He obviously got annoyed and figured he doesn't want to make it so easy to make your own version. It adds up for me, just kind of unfortunate, I'd like to think it still would've been better off open, but it's his creation and his time and effort so if that's what he wants to do, I'm ok with it.

ttty 7y ago

Some more notes from my experience: If you're serious about large scale games, you should look into typescript. I'd start away from any other language, like coffee script, Ruby... See my next point. Use node.js on the back end so you can do client side and server side validation with the same code. Another benefit is that you can also make your game single player much easier. I usually prefer to start the game multiplayer first and then do single player. Another tool useful for game is pixi.js (or phaser if you need what they provide. Pixi just does the rendering part, phaser does a lot of game related things) I'd use illustrator instead of Photoshop because you can scale your graphics without losing quality. Vectorial is better than bitmap. For state management I use redux. If you're interested here is my game https://bitplanets.com https://bitplanets.com . It's a RTS game, where you need to conquer planets. You can play with your friends and people online. Of course no need to download or register and works on mobile. (60fps if on a decent phone)