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Vice Ventures is investing in taboo industries that other funds won’t touch
- mtnGoat 7y agothe numbers tossed around in these articles always amuse me. I have worked extensively in the adult industry and can guarantee its no where near $97B. Print is dead, the internet and PPV in hotels and satellites bring in the bacon and it's not much.
- OkGoDoIt 7y agoDoes the adult industry include things like strip clubs, physical stuff like condoms/vibrators, or dating sites/apps? I feel like a sufficiently broad definition probably encompasses a lot of money. If we’re talking specifically pornography, then I have no idea how big it is, but it certainly seems to be in a state of flux at the moment. I would love to see some additional resources describing cash flow in that industry and where things are currently moving.
- snark42 7y ago> guarantee its no where near $97B Worldwide? What if you include brothels, strip clubs, "used" items (ie panties, gamer girl bathwater,) etc.? Here's the source for $97B, puts US at $10-12B - https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/things-are-looking-americas-porn-industry-n289431 https://www.nbcnews.com/business/business-news/things-are-lo...
- mtnGoat 7y agoYea, see I wouldn't include strip clubs, lingerie, etc. as porn, personally. But if you add that back in, plus prostitution and all sex work, $97b is attainable. I guess my view is slightly less encompassing then others'.
- Ancalagon 7y agoWhy is esports listed as a vice-venture?
- siruncledrew 7y agoI didn’t understand either why “gambling, esports” were listed separately in the article. Why would esports in general be vices in the way the other industries are. I get there are CS:Go tournies where people pretend shoot each other in a video game, but I don’t see how that is more damaging to people than sports like boxing or MMA. Idk, is there still a ‘vice’ sentiment that “video games turn kids into killers”?
- kleer001 7y agobecause it's kinda like gambling as a good portion of it can be down to chance, also "We try to keep the definition relatively broad..."
- jobigoud 7y agoAre you thinking of Fantasy Sports ? I mixed the two initially as well. I see why Fantasy Sports (assembling virtual teams of real athletes) would be there, it's purely gambling, but e-sports (competitive gaming)… it's just like any other non-physical game, like chess or scrabble or whatever.
- kleer001 7y agoThe difference is the chance involved. Chess involves no chance. Scrabble involves the chance of the tiles you get, there's still a lot of skill involved. E-sports is more like scrabble than chess.
- jungy 7y agoThis is just not true. What do you base this on? Top e-sports games such as Dota 2, CS:GO and StarCraft 2 are highly skill based games where strategy and teamwork (in the first two games) is all that matters. There are, in Dota 2, a few chance based characters you can play, but in the grand scheme of things it doesn't make "chess to scrabble". In my opinion you seem ill informed and biased.
- LyndsySimon 7y agoI’ve mentioned this before, but the firearms industry has a similar issue, caused by the same clauses. Local gun stores often pay very high fees for credit card processing relative to other retail stores - and unlike gambling and pornography, this doesn’t seem to be supported by a higher chargeback rate as best I can tell. They’ve just been “lumped in” because of the regulated nature of some of their products. I say “some of”, because things like magazines and accessories are usually included in the “prohibited goods and services” clauses, even though they are typical subject to no specific regulation at either the state or federal level. It’s honestly kind of weird to me.
- Scoundreller 7y agoI wonder if Walmart pays a higher commission on that portion of their business.
- flyingfences 7y agoNo, they're a "reputable business", i.e. large enough and well-enough established that they can't be bullied into submission.
- m-p-3 7y agoYeah, Visa tried to keep their fee high, and I believe Wal-Mart won that fight in Canada (although they won't specifically say). https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/visa-walmart-1.3923039 https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/visa-walmart-1.3923039
- soapboxrocket 7y agoWhat I find so interesting about Vice Ventures is how she has drawn a hard line on the weapons industry.
- flyingfences 7y agoIt's all politics. This organization is clearly run by a team on the "left wing" - they'll happily support what the "right wing" labels as "degenerate" but toe the line on what they consider "uncivilized". I'm disappointed but not at all surprised.
- Roritharr 7y agoI find Unknown Fund more interesting: https://www.unknown.fund/ https://www.unknown.fund/
- Lerain 7y agoAfter closing the huge sign-up popup, dismissing the Medium-App-suggestion and closing the cookie-banner I lost all interest in reading the article, which is a shame. I sometimes hate the internet. At least the HN comments were insightful, unlike my rambling. Sorry about that.
- hunterloftis 7y agoRelated to an HN article from earlier this week: you might consider trying the Brave browser. With it, I didn't experience any of that.
- buboard 7y agoit auto-closes sign-up popups and cookie prompts ?
- hunterloftis 7y agoI just checked again (on mobile). It does show the sign-in prompt (was just less obtrusive on desktop). It doesn't show app prompts or cookie prompts.
- Lerain 7y agoI was trying to read it on an iPhone using Safari. The mobile "experience" is way, way worse compared to that on a big screen. At least two thirds of my screen estate were blocked by popups and that's how the vast majority of (mobile) users are going to experience it as well.
- draw_down 7y agoCome on.
- eyeundersand 7y agoReader View on Firefox (CTRL + ALT + R) is a blessing!
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- grzte 7y agoSo surprising that it is a woman investing in vice. /s
- gatherhunterer 7y agoThere are well-established benefits of CBD use in some patients covering a wide variety of symptoms, but pushing skin care pseudoscience is wrong. Isolated evidence like that of anti-inflammatory effects is not the same as an extensive clinical trial. This is why we need an actual healthcare system: to allow people to see doctors rather than falling victim to the junk CBD products that this person is excited to fund.
- cwkoss 7y agoRecess's CBD sparkling water sounds kind of cool, but its $5 a can! Yikes, that's one hell of a markup. I'd try it at half the price, and might be a customer at 1/3 the price, but $30/6pk is pretty wild. Each can contains 10mg of broad spectrum hemp extract: high quality broad spectrum CBD oils are $0.80 for 10mg CBD (10mg of broad spectrum oil means the CBD content probably 5mg+/-3). Price compare with TonicVibes's 1500mg CBD (from whole plant extract) for $120 - best quality CBD oils I've found so far. Even if the other herbs are extremely high quality as well, the margins on this product are insane.
- harryaka 7y agoCBD products in general are quite expensive, for example CBD extracts are similarly priced to their THC counterparts. I assume this is in large part due to marijuana prohibition laws. Prices will hopefully come down as those laws are relaxed around the country and more players enter the market.
- derekdahmer 7y agoThere's some 50% off promos for Feals - check out the /Filmcast podcast notes. I recently ordered 2400mg for $120.
- edw 7y agoWalking around my neighborhood in NYC, I wonder how human life expectancy got beyond thirty-five years before the arrival of CBD based on the claims being made in shop windows and on sandwich boards obstructing sidewalk traffic.
- listenallyall 7y agoThis idea is about 20 years old already: VICEX https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitium_Global_Fund https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitium_Global_Fund
- mike_d 7y agoVICEX is based on "sin" stocks. Casinos, tobacco, etc. already on the public market. This is venture funding for edgy products that traditional VCs might not touch.
- listenallyall 7y agoIt's called VICE Ventures. Not EDGY Ventures. Anyway, she has 4 investments and 3 are in beverages, 1 is in video games. Pretty far from "taboo" that the parent article states in the headline. This is simply astroturf produced by a PR firm.
- siruncledrew 7y agoI think the biggest win here is the marketing for Vice after putting together this $25M fund. This is totally on-brand for them, regardless of how business-viable these investments are. Plus, it’s not Vice’s own money they are playing with (which is good for them given their profitability struggles as a parent company). My inclination is that VCs don’t particularly not-invest in successful “vice-driven companies” due to their moral compass, but rather due to the financial friction and PR risk-reward involved in doing so. I feel like the article understates the point that, given the nature of vices, if the business turns out to be doing substantial harm and a media shitstorm hits, the VCs will absolutely be dragged into the mix and publicly shamed for contributing to the problem. When Juul was going through it’s recent implosion all the cigarette giants who were investors got name-dropped. When WeWork was in the news, SoftBank’s name was being dragged right next to it. And the media was sure to tie Uber articles to Saudi money. Sure, some investments are bound to not work out for VC firms, but nobody wants to trash their firm’s legacy and reputation over blowback from the fickle beast that is public opinion on the internet and word of mouth. There is still value in these vice industries and proper federal regulations still need to be figured out for things like Cannabis companies to operate like ‘real’ businesses. Not all “vice” companies are equal and I think it will still take time to figure out to what level different types are socially acceptable and what restrictions to put in place to keep the good/bad balance in check.
- atdrummond 7y agoI don't think this is related to Vice media?
- mmahemoff 7y agoDon't think so, but it won't stop some people using it as an opportunity to claim Vice Media has a conflict of interest.
- laughinghan 7y ago> VCs will absolutely be dragged into the mix and publicly shamed for contributing to the problem In every example you gave, the investors whose names was "dragged" were already independently controversial. Juul has plenty of investors who didn't famously exacerbate and suppress public awareness of what is still the leading cause of preventable death in the US [1]. WeWork and Uber have plenty of investors who didn't famously murder and dismember any journalists. This undermines your claim that such "media shitstorms" can "trash [a] firm’s legacy and reputation". Cigarette companies and Saudi money already had trash reputations independent of Juul, WeWork, and Uber. [1] According to the CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_statistics/fact_sheets/fast_facts/index.htm https://www.cdc.gov/tobacco/data_statistics/fact_sheets/fast...
- low_common 7y agoCan someone paste the article here? There's a paywall for me.