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Google Announces Nest WiFi
- dev_dull 7y ago> You can get a two pack with one router and one point for $269 No mention of whether it supports 802.11ax. Why are WiFi devices lagging in speed advancements so much? I ended up purchasing a second hand AirPort Extreme because it’s still one of the best performing 802.11ac devices (in my anecdotal experiences of running a lot of clients)... and it’s OLD!
- kmlx 7y agohttps://www.netgear.co.uk/home/products/networking/wifi-routers/RAX80.aspx https://www.netgear.co.uk/home/products/networking/wifi-rout... works like a charm
- xd1936 7y agoHas yours gotten out of it's cage and made an attempt to escape through the window yet?
- kmlx 7y agoshould i be worried?
- izzydata 7y agoWhat is with router designs? Can we just get a clean box with as simple of antenna as possible?
- kmlx 7y agotell me about it. looks absolutely horrible
- mikeyouse 7y agoIt's not the only reason I went with Ubiquiti at my place, but it was definitely a selling point that my access points all look like this now: https://imgur.com/a/gTjUufY https://imgur.com/a/gTjUufY No blinking lights, no fighter-jet aesthetic, just fast reliable boring looking panels.
- kmlx 7y agoway too slow for my connection.
- mikeyouse 7y agoI regularly get 400mbps wireless and 1gbps wired... how fast is your connection?
- mikeyouse 7y agoFYI, this is the version I have: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1369199-REG/ubiquiti_networks_uap_ac_iw_pro_us_unifi_ac_in_wall_pro.html https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1369199-REG/ubiquiti_... And there's a new faster one available now: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1426307-REG/ubiquiti_networks_uap_iw_hd_us_unifi_ap_ac_in.html https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1426307-REG/ubiquiti_...
- spacedog11 7y ago> No mention of whether it supports 802.11ax. Even if it does support WiFi6( 802.11AX), there are no client devices that support WiFi 6 yet. EDIT: Apparently iPhone 11 pros support WiFi6 [0] [0] (https://www.cnet.com/how-to/the-iphone-11-supports-wi-fi-6-here-is-what-that-means-for-you/ https://www.cnet.com/how-to/the-iphone-11-supports-wi-fi-6-h...)
- heavymark 7y agoHuh? Don't all the millions of new iPhone Pro's sold this year support Wifi 6?
- xd1936 7y agoYup. As well as Microsoft's latest Surface devices.
- lucb1e 7y agoI got an 802.11ac access point before I got any clients. Either the chicken or the egg has to be first, and I don't replace my router together with my laptop/phone. I've had the same router for at least five years and only got a new one from the ISP because our current one didn't support IPTV. The old one is still in use elsewhere in the house as additional access point and is probably almost ten years old now. Somewhere in a router's lifespan, someone in my household will buy a new Wi-Fi client. If I need to get a new router, I might as well buy one that I don't regret and want to replace within its components' lifespan.
- krisroadruck 7y agoIt does not support ax/wifi-6 and doesn't even have a dedicated backhaul channel between APs. This is overpriced garbage with 5 year old tech. The only thing "new" about it is they crammed an assistant in it. I am extremely disappoint.
- bobbonew 7y agoWithout supporting ax/WiFi-6 I 100% agree that this is an absolute garbage purchase. I’ve been looking to upgrade over the past few months and this has seriously missed the mark.
- pathartl 7y agoMy experience with the AirPort Extreme has been terrible to say the least. Over the years I have gone through 4 of them due to some poor design with the hardware. Usually is was the fan failing which caused a massive slowdown to the point where it's not usable. I took it into the Apple Store, they couldn't find the problem, I made a big stink and they gave me a new one. That one survived for another 6 months and failed in the same way. I switched to Ubiquiti and won't look back. It's cheaper, enterprise grade hardware. If you know anything about networking, setting up the environment isn't that big of a deal, but is definitely a deterrent for some.
- sosborn 7y agoI've had two Airports in my life. One I bought in 2007 and one I bought in 2013. Not one failure.
- supercommand 7y agoUbiquiti is not enterprise grade anything. Especially not the last 3 years or so when it’s been a buggy software mess of outdated dependencies.
- Al-Khwarizmi 7y agoTrue. I need mesh WiFi for my home because it's very long, and I have been waiting for like two years for mesh devices with 802.11ax to come out, as I want the best possible speed and coverage and don't want to spend hundreds of euros in devices that will be obsolete in a few years. And at the moment, nothing seems to have been released, just announcements for the future... At the end I may run out of patience and just look for something second hand.
- jdmulloy 7y agoIt's overly expensive, but Netgear does have an AX Orbi system. https://www.netgear.com/orbi/rbk852.aspx https://www.netgear.com/orbi/rbk852.aspx
- scarface74 7y agoWhat’s the maximum speed people are getting in the real world with 802.11ax? I have gigabit internet up/down with an 802.11ac router and I’m getting 420-440 u/d right under the router from both my iPhone and my laptops with 802.11ac. I get 930 u/d wired.
- dev_dull 7y agoSame exact as your metrics.
- themagician 7y agoax is mostly about efficiency, not speed. While it has a much higher peak data throughput that’s often not realized anyway, so somewhat irrelevant. ax really doesn’t do much for most home networks. In a small network, 802.11n will provide all the throughput necessary to stream most things at 4K. And few people even have a connection faster than ac allows. ax provides faster speeds for highly congested networks, as well as better battery life for phones. That’s mostly what it’s about. It’s unlikely you’d see a difference between ac or ax on a small home network.
- dev_dull 7y agoI think it’s safe to say the HN crowd is a little different than most. For me personally I have gigabit and work from home periodically. I’ll regularly saturate my wireless.
- untog 7y agoSo does this mean my Google Wifi router isn’t getting any new updates, or...?
- hwbehrens 7y agoExtrapolating from the 3-year update guarantee Google offers for the Pixel line, and the October 2016 launch date of Google WiFi... I don't think you should get your hopes up, sadly.
- wmf 7y agoOnHub still gets updates because it runs the Google Wifi firmware. If we're lucky all three products will continue to be updated.
- kemayo 7y agoIsn't it getting incredibly slow updates anyway? I mean, examining the release notes[1] suggests that there's not been an update since June, and there was a 1 year gap between the last two updates. So: Google behaving according to form, really. [1]: https://support.google.com/wifi/answer/9378012?hl=en&ref_topic=6246512 https://support.google.com/wifi/answer/9378012?hl=en&ref_top...
- devicetray0 7y agoI bet they're just going to EOL it. It's been pointed out here by several Xooglers that Google engineers tend to focus only on launching new products in order to get promoted. This looks like it was built by a different group (Nest) within google.
- jumpingmice 7y agoI'm not seeing the 1-year gap? I'm pretty sure where it says "January 2018" is a typo, was actually 2019.
- kemayo 7y agoHm, you're right, that does seem to be a typo. I'll downgrade to "six month gap".
- tyingq 7y ago"The Nest Wifi point also has a speaker with the Google Assistant" Ahh. I see.
- ve55 7y agoI thought it was funny they said "has a speaker with the Google Assistant" rather than "has a microphone listening to you for Google Assistant"
- dmix 7y agoJust in case you didn’t have enough Google surveillance in your house, turn your router into a marginally useful weather app slash microphone.
- mav3rick 7y agoYou can disable the microphone via a Hardware button.
- tehabe 7y agoI would rather have a button to remove it. but you can't have everything.
- bdowling 7y agoIf the microphone isn’t removable, you’re just using the wrong tools.
- NikolaeVarius 7y agoA hardware button that presumably uses software to toggle the mic versus literally unplugging a cable to the mic.
- Arelius 7y agoI know that during the design of the original Pixel laptop, things like physically powering down and disabling the camera, rather than doing it in firmware was important to the team at Google. I wonder if they have maintained that vigilance.
- spacedog11 7y agoHow is this different than the already existing Wifi Mesh devices?
- uniformlyrandom 7y agoThis probably replaces wifi mesh devices - eventually, or pretty soon, depending on some exec's ambition.
- albertzeyer 7y agoI also wondered about that. From the blog post: * "making it even better" * "includes the Google Assistant" (I guess this means its Google Wifi + Google Home combined?) * "Nest Wifi is more powerful than Google Wifi, delivering up to two times the speed and up to 25 percent better coverage." I'm a bit wondering why it has the "Nest" name tag.
- krisroadruck 7y agoThe 2X speed increase is just coming from better MU-MIMO adoption, moving to 4x4 on 5G from 2x2. This is pretty old tech. 4x4 MU-MIMO has been available for several years now (since 2016).
- rainyMammoth 7y agoDon't buy a Wifi router from Google. We all know that they are incentivized to collect data from you
- shadowgovt 7y agoAlternatively, do, and go in with eyes open on the fact it might collect data from you.
- dewey 7y agoI think the more worrying aspect is that they probably deprecate it in a few years and you don't get any firmware updates any more.
- uniformlyrandom 7y agoEvery single router vendor does this. It is an issue, but it is not a google issue.
- prepend 7y agoI had an ASUS N66U for over five years. It was released in 2011 [0] and I got rid of it last year for a mesh system. But looking at Asus’ support page, it still gets firmware updates [1] with the most recent in June. Most reputable vendors put out firmware updates for a long time. Routers should not be disposable consumer devices, I think. I have this belief both from a security standpoint (frequent updates are important) but also as someone who supports quite a few family members. Switching out routers over the phone is not easy for an 80 year old. [0] https://wikidevi.com/wiki/ASUS_RT-N66U https://wikidevi.com/wiki/ASUS_RT-N66U [1] https://www.asus.com/us/Networking/RTN66U/HelpDesk_BIOS/ https://www.asus.com/us/Networking/RTN66U/HelpDesk_BIOS/
- dewey 7y agoApple released an update for the deprecated AirPort from 2013 just in May this year. https://www.macrumors.com/2019/05/30/airport-base-station-firmware-7-9-1/ https://www.macrumors.com/2019/05/30/airport-base-station-fi...
- dannyw 7y agoI like my routers dumb and without a speaker and microphone.
- zrail 7y agoPersonally I like my routers smart and in a rack in the basement. Agreed on the lack of speaker and microphone though.
- jcadam 7y agoYea, I don't like all-in-one Router/Switch/WAP/Gateway devices anymore either. All of those functions are separate devices at my house. Now the only one of those things that's a PITA to replace is the Router.
- deleted 7y ago[deleted]
- blablaz 7y agoDoes it mean when Google bans your account, you will lose your wifi as well?
- hysan 7y agoOr if they decide that they don't recognize you anymore that you're forever locked out of your account?
- atomi 7y agoLike God forbid you lose your password and their AI refuses to authenticate you. The Google borg-like organization seems to lack any semblance of humanity.
- hysan 7y agoIt can be worse than that. You don't even need to lose your password. You just have to not login for a long time. For me, I made a one off account using my personal email/domain years ago. I think it might have been for a shared link or something. Google required phone numbers so I gave it one. Haven't logged in since and no longer have that phone number. I got a shared link to an interview assignment during my recent job search, but much to my surprise, Google wouldn't let me login! Password hadn't changed (I use a password manager). However, Google's AI thinks I'm not me. I can answer everything but the phone txt during their recovery process; I even have the original activation email archived so I know the exact date I made the account. I even dusted off my old old old laptop to try using a "recognized device". No luck. All I get are warning emails from Google saying, "Don't worry! We stopped an unrecognized login attempt!" I asked for access to be given to another email, but I guess I took too long in trying to dig up old hardware and trusting that Google's recovery process was sane. I got rejected.
- fjabre 7y agoI detest the fact that Google bought Nest. Now I have the pleasure of logging into a convoluted Google UX instead of the familiar Nest UX. And here we have another intrusion of Google into our home. It's clear Google has no respect for anyone's privacy and is now a part of the problem.
- ljcn 7y agoWhy did you migrate? I was given the option to but haven't (yet, nor been forced to).
- fjabre 7y agoWas forced to when I wanted to add their cloud monitoring service. The payment system is now Google's.
- atonse 7y agoI have stubbornly not migrated. I expressly advise people who value their privacy to not to get NEST now for this reason. EcoBee is a great HomeKit-aware thermostat and you don't need to sign up to their account to use it (although it'll keep nagging you to, it's not required).
- toomuchtodo 7y agoI sold all of my Nest thermostats and moved to Ecobee.
- cbolton 7y agoAny device like this is an intrusion in the user's home (that the users agrees to), and it seems to me that Google is one of the companies that has the most respect for users' privacy. Yes they collect a lot of data, but 1) that's exactly what allows them to provide the services that their users want, 2) they are very transparent about it (see My Activity), and 3) they seem to take security more seriously than the competition.
- gnicholas 7y agoI am less likely to buy a Nest-branded device, now that it's owned by Google. Similarly, I won't buy a Ring device, now that it's owned by Amazon. Sadly, I'm sure folks with leanings like these are the tiny minority of customers, so the market probably won't feel the impact of this preference. I do my best to support the companies that respect privacy, and I make sure my own startup's products give our customers the privacy that I would want for myself. I wish there was a certification or something, sort of like b-corp, that could indicate that a product doesn't gather any personal data (as opposed to just being GDPR-compliant, which allows collection but imposes various processing/deletion requirements).
- prepend 7y agoI don’t think I’d ever add a box to my home network that sniffed all traffic and sent it to Google, even if they paid me. Even if it had the functions of a Star Trek replicator. I’m worried enough now that my Nest is doing bad things, but I can set that up on its own network that only it has access to. Giving Google such access to my home network is scary.
- beaner 7y agoAnyone know why they changed it so that you now need a router + repeater, rather than every point being a router and repeater like Google Wifi was? That was much simpler - all units interchangeable. Cost reduction maybe?
- TrueDuality 7y agoMost likely it was cost reduction to meet competitors. The router needs to do more work handing packets than just store and forward (which is basically all the mesh nodes have to do with packets). The D-Link Covr series and the Amplifi are probably the best direct competitors for this. Neither require a cloud subscription to work either. Both have "tri-band" which basically just means they actually have a dedicated radio to use as a backhaul (which this doesn't). The Covr is ~$200 for 2 units and Amplifi is about ~$340 for three units so this is more expensive already than either of what I think of as its direct competitors. The only "feature" that this has the others don't is Google Assistant and in my book the lack of it is a win. I've personally used the Covr mesh nodes and they're pretty solid and easy to use.
- tbyehl 7y agoAmpliFi does not have dedicated backhaul.
- csryan-15 7y agoits me! hahahahahahahaha
- martin-adams 7y agoI don't really have a lot of trust with Google to deliver a great consumer product in this area. I switched from Alexa to Google Home and just because I'm a GSuite customer, I have lost the ability to access my calendar or set reminders. It's like they just wanted to tick a few boxes to show a cool concept, then forgot to make a well rounded product out of it.
- disgruntledphd2 7y agoHonestly, I often get the impression that no Google PM's actually use their products. They look nice, but never work effectively.
- erid 7y agoEven on the development side, I got that impression with the first version of Angular, they created the framework but rarely used it on their development.
- jayd16 7y agoUsing GSuite accounts for their consumer product is always really consistent. Consistently bad...
- ehsankia 7y agoThat's GSuite is at the core a product for enterprise/education, and also has much stricter data policies. Unfortunately, a lot of people use it to turn their domain name into a Gmail inbox. Google should really spin that into a separate product.
- martin-adams 7y agoThis is exactly it. It’s a mix of a consumer product with business product. Here’s the funny thing though. Security isn’t the real reason why the Google Home can’t access the calendar. You’d think Google Home talking to Google servers would be more secure than Alexa being able to read my calendar with no problem.
- andruby 7y agoI wonder how long untill they pull the plug and people are left with a brick that isn't updated. For that price, have a look at Ubiquity's Unifi line (and Amplifi). Great router, great AP's, frequent firmware upgrades and no privacy concerns.
- hiven 7y agoSure this will last long.
- ssully 7y agoI got a single Google WiFi router (home is small enough to not need the mesh) last year to pretty terrible results. I mainly got it for more frequent firmware updates, and easy administration via their phone app (easier to use then my Netgear Nighthawk; i.e. can show my wife how to use it). Everything worked great with it for the first few months, but then I started getting severe speed drops - specifically I was seeing download rates of 20MBps or less, when I should be getting 350MBps or less. I did all of their recommended troubleshooting (reset router, reset modem, restore to factory settings and reupdate the firmware, move router away from potential sources of interference, etc) and could not solve the issue. I still had my Nighthawk and ended up spending an afternoon testing the two, and the Google WiFi router would consistently drop speeds, while the Nighthawk stayed rock solid. I ended up just sticking with my Nighthawk and throwing my Google Wifi in a drawer. I was outside their return window, and honestly just had no desire to try and go through Google's customer service (or finding out if it even exists for their WiFi devices). Long story short, it was the worst experience I've ever had with a router and I would hesitate to ever try their WiFi devices again.
- josefresco 7y agoI have a Nighthawk and think the mobile app is pretty simple/useful. I'm curious, what was it the Google offering had that the Netgear didn't offer / do well?
- lbotos 7y agofor me when I got google wifi, it was: - Mesh - "Simple" objects (They blend in to my house) - "Security"
- lbotos 7y agoYa know, I'm literally experiencing this right now and It's befuddling. For the past week or so, I've been using fast.com and only from my Macbook Pro do I see the speed drop. My phone on wifi only will maintain 200Mbps++ I'm really mad because it's been seamless until now.
- 7y ago
- meddlin 7y agoHaha, no. Just no.
- Brajeshwar 7y agoHow does a Google's WiFi compares to the likes of AmpliFi[1]? 1. https://amplifi.com https://amplifi.com
- gnicholas 7y ago> Many routers are ugly, which means they get hidden in a closet or cabinet, where the signal is blocked and can be reduced by up to 50 percent. I never understood why the Apple HomePod didn't have a network-extender functionality. I'm sure it has the necessary hardware, and it would have helped justify the high price. I'm glad to see others are putting these features (smart speaker + wifi extender) together!
- yalogin 7y agoHaving to login using a google account is pretty unsettling to me. What happens when I lose access to the account? Also they now have a verified identity to all my data from my router. I know they will have that anyway given my Gmail sends them the ip, they just have a detailed view of all urls I use and every site I go to and how long i spend there. I bought one and it worked fine but in a few weeks I just couldn’t use it because of this unsettling feeling. Ended up throwing it in the drawer. May be should have returned it instead, oh well.
- acejam 7y agoMany of these features appear very similar to Eero[1]. It's a clear battle against Eero/Amazon for market share. If you're looking for simple rock-solid mesh WiFi, Eero is what you want. [1] https://eero.com https://eero.com
- ProZsolt 7y agoAll the new products use barrel jack for power which is a step backward form USB-C or even from USB MiniB (Home Mini).
- foobarbazetc 7y agoMissed opportunity to put out a WiFi 6 device. Would love one without the microphone, too.
- Urgo 7y agoI've been using the old Google Wifi system for several years now and its been decent.. with two big caveats 1) I hate the mobile only interface. It's nice to have one, but no desktop interface (unless I run an emulator) is really annoying when trying to manage and monitor the network. 2) You need to have a s-H-s type topology where each satellite connects directly to the main unit. Thankfully most areas of my house are hardwired so I can plug them in, but there are some areas that don't have good coverage that I'd love to chain another satellite to, but its too far for it to reach the hub over wifi (no cable is run), and it doesn't support branching off of another satellite. For the new system it looks like their solution to #1 is to put the controls into an even worse app... For item #2, anyone know if it will support s-s-s-s-H chaining? On a related note.. I actually got into a support chat with them once asking about that and their support rep said it didn't work because my cable modem had nat enabled and if I turned that off it'd work great facepalm. After a lengthy discussion he thanked me for teaching him about networking.