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What’s good career advice you wouldn’t want to have your name on?

• dmitrygr 7y ago
  Value all parts of compensation that you cannot easily sell at zero. Options? Zero. RSUs for a private company? Zero. Promises for future raises? Zero. Actually: any promises - zero. (Promises on signed paper may sometimes be worth more than zero) Always remember that the place you work at has no (and owes no) loyalty to you. Calculate accordingly.
  • rinchik 7y ago
    Important: same goes for bonuses, which are also practically promises, and are not guaranteed.
    • the_watcher 7y ago
      Some bonuses actually are contractually guaranteed. They might be variable by performance, but every company I've worked for with a bonus plan has guaranteed some bonus outside of the absolute worst performance (in which case you should be looking for a new job long before this becomes an issue)
      • vvanders 7y ago
        Hah, may I point you to the fact that MiB writers still haven't been paid royalties[1] because the movie was never "profitable"? [1] https://twitter.com/ed_solomon/status/1139031900931198976 https://twitter.com/ed_solomon/status/1139031900931198976
        • the_watcher 7y ago
          Not really sure how pointing out that Hollywood accounting exists relates at all to my noting that some bonuses are contractually guaranteed. Such as mine, which guarantees an X-Y% of base salary bonus based on my performance.
          • vvanders 7y ago
            Yes, but was the language for your performance gone over by your own lawyer? Is there a clause for when an upstream team decides to stonewall the work you've involved with? What happens when your boss transfers and the new person you report to doesn't have any history to go on? This stuff happens all the time, although mostly at the business level. Zeroing it out is a great way to make sure you aren't in financial position where you're taking a risk on things you don't 100% control.
    • southphillyman 7y ago
      Yup I value bonuses at $0 during negotiation. A few times companies have tried to low ball a counter on the base by promising an increase in bonus percentage. No thanks
  • xvector 7y ago
    I’m in this situation right now. Got my first job 17 months ago at a FAANG. Was promised compounding RSUs every year and a bonus every year. They’ve delayed the compensation by 5 months because “I joined late.” They didn’t tell me about this until I asked about 10 months in. Hell I joined this company earlier out of college than most students. 2 weeks of vacation post-college when most students were taking 2-3 months. And now they turn around and tell me my compensation is going to be 30% less than what was promised my first year? Now, 17 months later around the review cycle they are saying that our org has less money or whatever, and compensation will be lower this cycle. I’m expecting maybe a fourth of what I was promised.
    • the_watcher 7y ago
      Which FAANG company hasn't been giving you bonuses or refresher grants?
      • opportune 7y ago
        Has to be Amazon or Apple. Probably Amazon due to the skimping on RSUs and bonuses, have heard that they’re upping the PIPs lately
        • singingboyo 7y ago
          You know, it baffles me that Amazon is the only tech giant[1] that consistently sounds absolutely terrible to work at. (In my experience - YMMV) How do they keep finding engineers? [1] Well, except Intel. You don't hear about them much online, but around here the local office (not sure about others) bait-and-switches employee openings for contractor openings. They don't even pay that well, and no extra compensation either.
          • mattnewton 7y ago
            I'm sure a lot of people think the team they are joining will be different, and some of them must be right.
          • 7y ago
  • alexis_fr 7y ago
    I valued my stock options at 0, so I left after 2,5 years in a 4 year vesting. I didn’t believe the company would IPO. It did. The founders were good types, after all. Those 2,5 years are now worth 1,7m$, which after tax is about half. I do wish I had stayed the 4 years, instead of valuing them at 0.
    • dieterrams2 7y ago
      Hindsight is 20/20. It’s all about what the right decision was with the information available to you at the time, not what decision would’ve had the best outcome in retrospect.
      • Judgmentality 7y ago
        Making the right decision at the time but later finding out it was the wrong one just seems like a proclamation that it's better to be lucky than smart. I get what you're trying to say, which is finding solace knowing you did what made sense given the scenario at hand, but it ultimately says you can do the right thing and be punished and do the wrong thing and be rewarded. That said, I still agree with OP - it's good advice not to put too much stock in stock (unless it's liquid).
        • dieterrams2 7y ago
          If you play poker, you know that, for any given hand, you can make the right play but still lose. But you’ll come out net positive by repeatedly making the right play. You don’t get to play as many hands in your career as you do in a session of poker, so if you’re optimizing for income, generally speaking you should go for a job that gives you the highest guaranteed income rather than work for startups with, say, 1% odds of netting you significantly more than you would get at FAANG, for example.
          • Judgmentality 7y ago
            I agree with you - you're optimizing for the most likely scenario. My point is even if you play your cards right, you still might lose. In other words, it's better to be lucky than good.
  • undefined3840 7y ago
    Honestly this is bad advice. Sure, you shouldn’t plan your life around striking it rich but if you’re going to take a job thinking the equity comp is worthless then you are probably choosing the wrong company and/or going to negotiate poorly. Late stage growth companies that offer RSUs can be sold on secondary markets, so even though it’s not as easy to sell it is probably not worth 0 unless something is very wrong, which again is something you should assess before accepting any offer.
    • tempguy9999 7y ago
      Maybe you've had good experiences; mine are that this is excellent advice - companies are there for themselves and not (repeat: not) for you.
    • adrianpike 7y ago
      Strong disagree - you absolutely need to factor in liquidity effort alongside vesting schedule and face value for equity comp, and in general for most non-public companies that liquidity capability is zero. - RSU's that I can only dump on a secondary market are worth a fraction of their face value. - Grants in a company that'll never have a liquidity event are worth a fraction of their face value. - Options in a public company are definitely worthwhile, but I shouldn't be negotiating their face value one-to-one with cash. It's possible you've had a great outcome liquidating some equity from a private company, in which case I'm super stoked for you and that's a great outcome - but it's not the norm.
      • undefined3840 7y ago
        Yes, which is why you should be negotiating for more RSUs to compensate for the additional risk and illiquidity. My point is that if you join a startup thinking your equity is and will forever be worthless, then why do you care if you get 10 or 10000 shares? To not care is bad advice for anyone joining a company that has a path toward IPO or acquisition. And if you don’t think a startup has any path then why are you joining a company that is offering you equity comp in the first place?
    • nostrademons 7y ago
  • jdright 7y ago
    This. Seriously, if you're young or new to the domain and is reading and may get yourself justifying things, STOP. This is the best advice you'll ever have.
  • watno382 7y ago
    Cool, I have $1500 to wire for free. Do you want it? You just agree I'm now the owner of everything you mentioned. (All your stock options etc). No other obligation on your part. $1500 for free. What's your email? Oh wait. Turns out you aren't going to agree with what I just proposed as you don't actually value them at $0 hence not interested in trading $0 for $1500. Basically you're full of shit. (Lying.) If you weren't lying you would take me (or anyone) up on that offer - but obviously it's not true. For comparison if I happened to have a scratch off ticket I found on the ground that wasn't scratched off yet, I'd be thrilled to instantly trade it for $1500 to anyone, since I value it lower than the time it would take to scratch off. (I personally wouldn't spend 24/7 scratching off and trying to interpret/redeem tickets, even if I had a free supply.) So you see it is easy to see if you're lying or not.
    • dmitrygr 7y ago
      You can have all the options i still own on startups i worked at for $1500 email is me@dmitry.gr Let me know when you want the wire transfer info
    • soVeryTired 7y ago
      This is such a wierd response. Like, you can disagree without calling the GP a liar. He's not literally saying they're valued at zero. He's saying you shouldn't let RSUs (which are not wealth, but contractual promises of future wealth) or options (which are lottery tickets) affect your career decisions. If the difference between vesting vs. not vesting is a month or two, stick around. But most of the time you shouldn't take promises of future wealth in lieu of hard cash. Read between the lines. You don't need to take everything literally.
  • yohannparis 7y ago
    Also, everything is negotiable! Can't negotiate the salary, negotiate on more vacations, transportation/lunch compensation, and window office, an office, laptop of your choice, etc.
• nostrademons 7y ago
  It's interesting that nearly all of these pieces of advice are fairly non-controversial. What's the point of posting stuff anonymously if it's the same stuff that most people would be happy to attach their name to?
  • rc-1140 7y ago
    I agree. I was expecting something sort of like the good Blind posts, but I guess these are controversial because... one said "fuck"? Another said that people put too much emphasis on career advice, which is probably controversial for the site/community the article is from?
  • ummonk 7y ago
    Right, I saw basically nothing there that would be controversial.
  • CM30 7y ago
    Yeah, that tends to be the case when it comes to these things. Unpopular opinions posted on sites like Reddit are never really that unpopular, underrated sources/sites/channels are never really that underrated or unknown, and controversial articles and lists are never all that controversial. As for why that's the case... well most people/sites don't want to become a social pariah, most underrated creators are by definition unpopular enough most haven't heard of them and truly unpopular opinions are unpopular enough that they're unlikely to get posted. Still, when I heard 'career advice you wouldn't want your name associated with', I was thinking it'd be something like the stuff in that James Damore memo or what not. Or something inspired by Machiavelli's The Prince.
  • robertwiblin 7y ago
    Hi Nostrademos — I was involved in this project. We asked a lot of questions and the answers to some others were quite a bit more controversial (we're going to release a new question each week or thereabouts). But one thing we learned in the process was that seriously successful people doing their thing feel pretty gagged. It's not worth it for them to write even things that seem uncontroversial to you or me, because someone out there might hate it, or misinterpret it, and start creating problems for them.
• Erudite_Genius 7y ago
  Never see a job as a career. The ONLY PATH for wealth is to work for yourself by starting and building your own business. Make no mistake... You are always building a business, and if you're not building YOURS, you are building THEIRS.
  • RandomBacon 7y ago
    It's not the "only" path, but it is a better path than most. You're right about everything else though.
  • romwell 7y ago
    Why wouldn't you put your name on it?
  • JMTQp8lwXL 7y ago
    A lot of people become industry insiders by building other people's businesses. Then, when they can't overcome the inefficiencies, they leave and start their own business. This is the story of Zoom, and others. Building someone's else's business, as a launchpad for your own, isn't a bad idea.
• impendia 7y ago
  > When you’re in college... Your time is less valuable This really jumped out at me. As a college student, I've never had so many opportunities available to me at once -- nor so little maturity with which to take advantage of them. That said, I certainly agree with taking care of low-level health problems, the sooner the better.
  • dev_dull 7y ago
    Mobility but no means, versus means but no mobility. Most people find later in life that they actually had more means then they realized.
    • PaulOlteanu 7y ago
      So what things should someone in university atm look to do to ensure they're maximizing their means
      • Scoutmaster 7y ago
        Be seen. Volunteer for on-campus events that are organized by the university (find the person running something, and ask them directly if there's anything you can do to help them). Always ask "Is there anything else I can do to help" after completing a task. Always be the first to start volunteering (show up early) and the last person to stop volunteering (stay late). If you're a person of good character and genuine spirit, people will notice and talk about you. People will ask your help with bigger things. Repeat.
        • merpnderp 7y ago
          If you do this, you'll quickly get snatched up into some professor's research project and forced into grad school, like it or not. There you'll be forced to get your PhD and spend your life doing well paid research in something you're terribly interested in. Awful.
      • impendia 7y ago
        I think the answer will differ wildly for different people. What I wish I had done: - Pay at least a little attention to nutrition. - Be more willing to do things by myself; there were certain activities, for which I had a vague impression you were supposed to wait until other people invited you to go with them. - Be less afraid of upsetting professors and other authority figures. (And I say this as someone who is a professor now!) - Try less hard to weasel my way into the "in" crowd. (And by "less hard" I don't mean "not at all"; these efforts were worthwhile to some extent.) Conversely, there were all sorts of interesting people who weren't "popular"; try to make friends with them, or even ask them out on dates. - Somehow found a way to relax more, although that is always much easier said than done.
• dev_dull 7y ago
  > * Gain the trust of people who have a lot of influence. One big benefit of working with such people is that you can learn a lot; another is that if you do good work, they come to respect and trust you — and that can be crucial in getting the best jobs.* Best advice in that article. Find the people who are clearly the thought leaders and ask them to mentor you.
  • alexpotato 7y ago
    +1 I've read multiple accounts of successful people having essentially this story and it's really stuck with me: I went into a meeting with my mentor. During the meeting, a lot was said by different folks. After the meeting, my mentor asked me: "What happened in the re?" I proceeded to give him a rough outline of what was said. They responded: "That's what was SAID. Here is what actually happened: Person A said they were ready but they are clearly not b/c $X. Person B said they had $Y but that's not true because we already know $Z". END OF STORY This kind of guidance is priceless because it saves you potentially years of trial and error trying to learn how to read between the lines.
• ggm 7y ago
  Have the courage to stand up for what you believe in, even if it terminates your employment status. I'm only unkeen to have my name on this, because I haven't done it, and I wish several times in the past, I had. I respect the person who did this early in his career in one ISP immensely: it was stunning to watch somebody say "you're full of shit" to the new CEO, and walk out. (he was btw, full of shit)
  • stencil25 7y ago
    How is that beneficial to someone's career though? Sure, it shows one's morals and standards, but how does that boost one's career?
    • whiddershins 7y ago
      Well, among other things it can mean you end up in a situation that more closely aligns with your morals. This has a number of predictable benefits.
      • stencil25 7y ago
        That's assuming that your input affects the current situation. Sure, if you leave the company and go somewhere else, then you're potentially going to find your moral environment. But, there are better ways to find these environments, versus job hopping. Without leaving, how often will your conflicts affect your situation? Would like to hear more about the predicted benefits.
      • alexis_fr 7y ago
        ...by force. Although I’m sure Edward Snowden feels good ethically, I’m also sure he has material issues that make him regret (that’s the goal of his ennemies, after all). Similarly, a middle manager who has to downsize houses because he stopped working on weapons for example, it could be even harder for him because he won’t even get famous for it. I should know, I’ve made one of those choices in another area.
    • sterkekoffie 7y ago
• maxk42 7y ago
  Unless required by law in your profession: Don't go to college.
  • freedomben 7y ago
    I don't know if this is serious or not, but really these days learning to code and engineer software without college is extremely doable, and you can be ready to work in under a year (faster with boot camps and such, but the cost there may not be worth it). I know many, many highly successful developers that didn't go to school at all. They taught themselves to code and built something cool, then started working. By the time most people leave school with a mountain of debt, they are making 20 to 30k more than entry-level engineer would make. You really don't need college anymore.
  • ThrowawayR2 7y ago
    > Unless required by law in your profession: Don't go to college. Good advice if you don't actually like your profession and don't mind spending your career at the middle to bottom rungs of your profession. That's not necessarily a slam, the average is where most people are. If you want a career doing fun and interesting things, even going to college isn't by itself enough; you have to master the things you learn there so that they're second nature. But, trust me, it's worth it both professionally and financially.
  • romwell 7y ago
    Yeah right, because colleges exist only as trade schools and don't give people who go there any other benefits. And they are useless even as trade schools, no mater how complex the trade might be. That is why all the science and engineering * conferences are teeming with people whose education ended at high school. * as in "making actual things" engineering
  • non-entity 7y ago
    This ended up doing more damage to my career than it did good.
• nostromo 7y ago
  Someone should actually write the article that goes with this headline -- it'd be super interesting.
• adrianpike 7y ago
  "HR does not operate with your interests at heart, do not talk to them." -- Anonymous
  • clinta 7y ago
    Be smart enough to determine if your interests align with the company's interests before talking to HR. Sometimes they do.
    • protomyth 7y ago
      Yeah, HR is a dangerous tool. Know the rules and intent before using. Frankly, if you are to the point where HR is even in the conversation, then you really need to have a large financial incentive to stay around. The reward better be worth the risk.
    • jmpman 7y ago
      HR is not in your interest. They are only looking out for the company. They will protect illegal actions by the company if you are raising issues. See how Wells Fargo HR was complicit in their recent scandals.
    • owenmarshall 7y ago
      That’s a dangerous thing to try. We like to think we are smart but even the lowest level HR person knows things that aren’t even on our radar. Ever had a complaint made against you? Possibly - maybe it was quietly filed away. Ever wonder if people are paying attention to when you come into the office? They are. I went through an outsourcing at my last job and for nine+ months the only people that knew it was coming was executive leadership, the CIO, and his HR staff. HR is risky because they have hidden information in spades. The interests you think align might not after all.
  • reureu 7y ago
    But the legal system expects that you go to HR and that they act appropriately when you report certain things. So, I'm not sure the "do not talk to them" is always correct. Scenario A: your job sucks, and you don't see a future there. Your boss constantly undermines you, doesn't give you credit, gives you a workload harder than any reasonable employee could work. Scenario B: your company is doing something illegal, and you pointed that out to your manager. Your manager started undermining you, not giving you credit, uninviting you to meetings about your work. Now your job sucks and you don't see a future there. In Scenario A, you should just leave. HR isn't going to fix the problem, they're just going to throw their hands up, tell you to work through it with your manager, and then quietly label you as a difficult employee. You're probably on a track to be laid off or PIP'd in the next cycle, so might as well either learn to shut up and take it, or get out. Scenario B, you should absolutely tell HR. HR won't do anything, or they'll make your life worse. But that's exactly what you need to have happen to build a case. Depending on the severity of the situation (i.e., how pervasive and illegal the activities are), HR's inactions could be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars to you.
• hitekker 7y ago
  Non-controversial, manufactured advice that pretends to be insightful.
• reaperducer 7y ago
  Make friends with people who have keys. Janitors, secretaries, maintenance guys. Win the trust of people who are trusted with the keys to the company. You never know when you might need a favor.
  • blaser-waffle 7y ago
    My grandfather said something to the effect of: "the 'real' work happens on the golf course and in the secretary pool".
• deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
• mnm1 7y ago
  Work is irrelevant beyond a paycheck. Don't stress out over anything if it doesn't involve you getting fired. Work as little as possible. Get as much done as you can working as little as possible as long as it doesn't stress you out. Never lose sleep over work. Never work unpaid overtime unless you'll lose your job over it. Never care if your bosses are angry or unhappy as long as it doesn't affect you having a job. Don't let their emotions affect yours. Nothing is important enough at work to go out of your way for. There are others along this line I'd advice. Obviously this doesn't apply if you are a doctor but for most jobs it does.
  • algaeontoast 7y ago
    This. I never understood why people at a startup I worked at (even after it was acquired by a FAANG) gave a shit what happened after hours. There was an ops guy actually trying to slack people at 3am. At one point they tried to contact me again on the weekend, my boss decided she'd ask why I didn't seek "ownership of the problem" (one of the god awful basically fascist "workplace principles" of said FAANG). My response was basically, I don't work for a startup, it was the weekend, I don't work on weekends. I left about three weeks later, my boss also accidentally sent me a PIP offer minutes before I was going to send in my 2 weeks notice. Got a bonus $20k for leaving a shit company ;)
    • croh 7y ago
      Agree. I tried to tell boss hire more people if you want 99.99 % uptime. But he complained about money. Then I quit.
  • kinderczekolada 7y ago
    What other advice do you have?
    • mnm1 7y ago
      One I forgot but also in one of the other comments: take your time doing tasks and always look busy. Never rush to complete projects unless doing so gets you political points. Keeping a slow pace of work while looking like working a lot is key. Make many small commits and push them up either all at the end of the day or periodically throughout. Prepare work for a few days ahead if possible and push it up incrementally. Know how to do the minimum to not get fired while still looking very productive. Milk it for all it's worth. Note, most jobs don't start this way but many end up this way, mainly because your employer doesn't value you. They don't give you proper raises or other compensation to show appreciation. When you can't increase your total compensation, increase your hourly compensation with the above tactic till your per hour rate skyrockets. Best achieved while working remotely. It's also important to not be loyal and always remember that the extra effort will never be rewarded. That said, there are rare, occasional exceptions. Very rare. Finally, remember, it's hard to get fired at most places. You really have to push your bosses to do it, especially once you've been there for awhile. Take advantage of that. This is all a game, so play it. And speaking of games, have fun whenever you can doing non-work stuff. Or start a business on the side if that's your thing with all the extra time.
• NotAnEconomist 7y ago
  Know where the skeletons are buried. Punch back, especially upwards. Know an analyst at the investment bank with the largest holding in your company.
• humble_engineer 7y ago
  If you find yourself alone around a woman you work with, leave the room, building, or do whatever you can to not be alone with them.
  • scarejunba 7y ago
    I'd say the opposite. Exploitation of this sort is vanishingly rare. It isn't worth optimizing for. Instead, be incredibly normal with everyone, girls and boys alike. Maybe you like their clothes, or you wonder how their vacation was, or you just want to share this new restaurant you like. If you're likable, people literally will not believe you could do bad things. If, for some reason, a cosmic ray hits the universe's RNG for you and you somehow encounter the exploitative femme fatale who's setting you up for a fake sexual assault suit, all the other women will back you up anyway because even though they're attractive, you were always professionally nice to them, and it wasn't even out of a sense of insecurity because you could casually make small talk like you were comfortable. You'll absolutely kill the case. And more importantly, in the happy path, you'll encounter a lot of people who you can work with productively.
    • humble_engineer 7y ago
      " If you're likable, people literally will not believe you could do bad things." This is based around if you are attractive.
• jdauriemma 7y ago
  It's actually very useful to try to visualize the social relationships that underpin the people you work with every day. Make a diagram and identify people who are supportive, people who are forthright, people who are untrustworthy, people who are obstacles, who are their friends, who are their adversaries, etc. Update it from time to time. When you want to push an agenda, you'll have a better understanding of the political context and can plan accordingly.
  • alexpotato 7y ago
    I've seen the most basic version of this as a chart with two axes: Axis 1: How much political influence does this person have? Axis 2: How easy are they to influence? Some key points: - Axis 2 is from your perspective - It's good to keep in mind that the chart might look different for other people As an example: you might find it easy to influence person B who only has mid-level influence. However, Person B might be able to influence someone you have no chance of influencing. You can also add other dimensions such as "What does each person value e.g. money/influence/respect" etc
• chasd00 7y ago
  In large businesses there are channels of money flowing through the organization like blood vessels, some small, some unbelievably big. Find one and plugin a straw. If it goes dry, take off, and find another. (this is basically the ugly side of consulting)
• CommieBobDole 7y ago
  Chaos is opportunity: If you want to learn a lot of things and gain a lot of responsibility quickly, work in an organization or area where the roles and processes are poorly defined. You'll be given responsibility for anything you take on and don't screw up, and you can use that experience to either move up in the organization or move to another organization that's maybe a little less chaotic.
  • thepaulstella 7y ago
    +1 Chaos is a ladder.
• deleted 7y ago
  [deleted]
• munherty 7y ago
  This fell short, I was looking for something edgy. For example: It pay$ to change jobs early in ones career. If you stay longer than 2 years out of some missplaced loyalty youll miss out of some quick dollars. Tons of caveats but in general it works. Now caveat it seems to peak around your 5 or 6th switch. Source: All my mates and I have switched at the cadence and weve averaged a 15% increase in salary
  • opportune 7y ago
    I agree, switching often is kind of a self correcting phenomenon - if you are always switching to places that pay significantly more, once switching often starts to hurt you, you will just stay at your current place until you’ve been there long enough for it to not hurt you. However, in terms of leveling/promotions, I think this stops pretty early. And it’s also possible to end up somewhere like Netflix where there may not be a place paying better for your experience/level. In particular it seems you need to grind out more than 2 years to get promoted to a managerial position or for any n>4, go from Ln to Ln+1 (except for maybe at a fast growing startup). So once you have 5 years experience you might be able to keep getting pay increases, unless you’re already near the top of market, but probably won’t get title promotions
• 2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
  Be female. The pendulum is swinging back and overcompensating. At my workplace women are given opportunities and preferential treatment that men are not. And I work in defense software.
  • gota 7y ago
    I assume you're being downvoted not because what you said os controversial - it is in the spirit of the topic - but because it is not advice at all. Its just misogyny. "Women - make a point of branding yourselves in linkedin, communication, personal branding to leverage the advantages that are being offered, use the overcompensating in treatment of women to your advantage" - still stupid, less overtly misogynistic, at least posted in the format of an advice
    • 2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
      How is it misogyny? Do you work where I work? I feel weird even saying it because it does feel misogynistic but it matches my actual experience at my current job.
      • tomhoward 7y ago
        It's not "career advice" - i.e., something people can contemplate and act on to improve their career. It's just inflammatory social commentary.
        • 2OEH8eoCRo0 7y ago
          You are right about that. It was a bit tongue-in-cheek but it's obviously very poor advice.
• anonadvice2 7y ago
  Get an Adderall or Vyvanse prescription. There are plenty of doctors who will prescribe it without grilling you too hard for a legitimate ADHD diagnosis.
  • id_21150930 7y ago
    Concerta is great as well. The extended release can give you 16+ hours. ...Also great for weight loss, appearances matter.
  • breakerbox 7y ago
    This is worth other people chiming in on.
    • Balgair 7y ago
      Adderall prescriptions are perfectly fine if you need them to treat ADHD or narcolepsy, but it is an amphetamine and should be treated soberly as such. Though addiction with proper medical supervision is known to be low, in recreational and non-therapeutic usage, addiction is significant [0]. Amphetamine addiction is known to not be the most pleasant experience. Withdrawal and relapse cycles are also not very pleasant. I'd not advise lying to your MDs in order to try to get Adderall. If you feel that your job requires you to fake ADHD or narcolepsy in order to do good work, it's time to find another job. Money will not buy your health back, it will not buy years of your life back, and is not worth a chance (small as it is) at an amphetamine addiction. Honestly, good sleep, exercise, and eating right are the ways to help you get an edge on the competition. Mostly because no one ever does it. Granted, I take a few cups of coffee in the morning to get going too, so I suppose I am a bit of a hypocrite here. :P It's not rocket science, faking a disease to score amphetamines is a poor decision. [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adderall https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adderall https://www.addictions.com/meth/ https://www.addictions.com/meth/
• mdorazio 7y ago
  Article comments and comments in this thread seem to miss the point of the title entirely. Here's some actual advice I don't want my name on, but seems pretty effective based on working at a lot of different Big Cos: - Always go for prestige over purpose. Have a choice between a shiny project with very little actual impact to the company and a behind the scenes project that will actually make lives better for employees and customers? Go for the shiny project. It will look better on your resume and to executive teams, and will get you promoted faster. - Learn the art of looking busy and practice it often. If you look busy all the time, people will assume you're productive and also not give you a bunch of extra work for no extra compensation. - Play politics. A lot. Especially throwing other people under the bus. The key is to align your politics with the right power players in your org. You'll get promoted faster, get more bonuses, and be able to get away with more things in general. - Get the scoop on what's actually going on at executive levels by making friends with the office managers/personal assistants. You'll get an early notification of problems coming up, people to avoid, opportunities to take advantage of, etc. - Loyalty is for chumps. Play the game for yourself. If you get a better offer somewhere else, take it. If your boss is an asshole or putting a glass ceiling over you, leave. If you need time off, take it. If your team isn't being effective, throw them under the bus and move on.
  • jansan 7y ago
    I will print this out for my teenage sons and make them learn this.
    • scotth 7y ago
      Ugh, please don't.
    • pmoriarty 7y ago
      How sad. But not at all surprising that someone would eagerly jump on trying to advance their career by such unethical means.
      • deleted 7y ago
        [deleted]
• breakerbox 7y ago
  When I was an intern at an Aerospace org, I had a mentor that was the head of engineering of several smaller companies at once emphasize one point - Always align yourself positively with people 2-3 levels of leadership above you. That is, if necessary, skirt around your direct report(s) if you have something to bring to the table for higher up people. It is how you move up faster, but of course, strains your short term relationship with your direct report. Haven’t had the chance to try it yet, but maybe others can chime in?
  • exolymph 7y ago
    Build those relationships in advance, and only go around your manager if you absolutely have to and are reasonably confident that higher-ups will side with you. They will be useful regardless. Best option when you have a frustrating manager, although not always feasible: Quit and work somewhere else with better management.
  • friendlybus 7y ago
    Yes it works. My direct report's boss was a nightmare to deal with. His areas of influence were always producing problems. All the staff routinely agreed the problems were to be coming from one place. He had tried to get me fired at one point. My reports to three levels above me were an agreed, small but positive influence in removing the problematic leadership. I ended up leaving later on for different reasons.
• id_21150930 7y ago
  The following is (very?) controversial advice. Depending on your situation, it may be bad advice. There are too many downsides to list, so please use your best judgement. Before voting or commenting please remember this HN guideline: >Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith ...and for what it's worth, I absolutely wouldn't want to work with the person I'm describing below. 1. Lie strategically. When looking for a job/project, lie about what you know, what you've done, who you know, what you can do for the company, etc. Many times you are never actually called on to prove these things. If you are sure you'll be called on to prove them, still lie, but study them as much as possible beforehand. 2. Do what matters for the people the matters. Figure out what metrics count. Ignore or give away everything else. Who controls your next promotion? Who could potentially refer you to your next job? These are the people you need to please before anyone else. If you have time to please people who won't advance your career, don't. Look for ways to improve your relations with those who matter -- or ask them to introduce you to others like them. 3. Extract value from everything you do. Look at every opportunity you would normally pass on and figure out how you can use it to your advance. Maybe you can refer someone, maybe you can take it on and subcontract it out. Never pass up any opportunity without first asking how you can extract value from it. 4. Everything is negotiable. Your severance package? Negotiable. Your working space? Negotiable. Figure out what matters to the people who you interact with and use those levers to push for your desires. The threat of a lawsuit, or an actual lawsuit, can be used in negotiation, even if the lawsuit would be unfounded. 5. Take as much data with you as you can. When employed, you have access to an incredible amount of valuable data, resources, and tools. Take full advance of these while employed, but also remember that you will move on from your position at some point. Back up whatever you can without being noticed. Who knows what can come in handy in the future. --- Caveats: Most of this is unethical. Some of it is illegal. Understand your risk tolerance. Understand your environment. Doing any of these can, and likely will, burn bridges. Many industries are tightly knit. People talk. Be smart.
  • id_21150930 7y ago
    Apologies for the formatting, it seems new accounts cannot edit their posts.
• id_21150930 7y ago
  There is nothing here that I wouldn't mind attaching my name to. So here is my (very?) controversial advice. Depending on your situation, it may be bad advice. There are too many downsides to list, so please use your best judgement. Before voting or commenting please remember this HN guideline: >Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith ...and for what it's worth, I absolutely wouldn't want to work with the person I'm describing below. --- 1. Lie strategically. When looking for a job/project, lie about what you know, what you've done, who you know, what you can do for the company, etc. Many times you are never actually called on to prove these things. If you are sure you'll be called on to prove them, still lie, but study them as much as possible beforehand. --- 2. Do what matters for the people the matters. Figure out what metrics count. Ignore or give away everything else. Who controls your next promotion? Who could potentially refer you to your next job? These are the people you need to please before anyone else. If you have time to please people who won't advance your career, don't. Look for ways to improve your relations with those who matter -- or ask them to introduce you to others like them. --- 3. Extract value from everything you do. Look at every opportunity you would normally pass on and figure out how you can use it to your advance. Maybe you can refer someone, maybe you can take it on and subcontract it out. Never pass up any opportunity without first asking how you can extract value from it. --- 4. Everything is negotiable. Your severance package? Negotiable. Your working space? Negotiable. Figure out what matters to the people who you interact with and use those levers to push for your desires. The threat of a lawsuit, or an actual lawsuit, can be used in negotiation, even if the lawsuit would be unfounded. --- 5. Take as much data with you as you can. When employed, you have access to an incredible amount of valuable data, resources, and tools. Take full advance of these while employed, but also remember that you will move on from your position at some point. Back up whatever you can without being noticed. Who knows what can come in handy in the future. --- Caveats: Most of this is unethical. Some of it is illegal. Understand your risk tolerance. Understand your environment. Doing any of these can, and likely will, burn bridges. Many industries are tightly knit. People talk. Be smart.
• tclancy 7y ago
  If the company's one way of making it to the next payroll/ funding round is to fire you, they will. Don't be more loyal to the company than they are to you. Learn to be a mercenary when it comes to salary talks in reviews.
• breakerbox 7y ago
  Not controversial IMO, but useful. Most companies are stuck in the dark ages, despite what you think after browsing HN. A lot of money to be made in consulting if you can market yourself well.
  • non-entity 7y ago
    But aren't they stuck in the dark ages because they don't want to pay to get out of it (seeming as tech is just a cost center)?
• emanreus 7y ago
  Feel free to run over people, there's no shortage of them. Women are dead weight, don't hire them. Think what's useful, not what's good or bad, true or false. Always ask yourself what's in it for me.
  • kwizzt 7y ago
    Care to explain more about the "women are dead weight part"?
  • orn688 7y ago
    Not sure if this is trolling or what, but either way, can someone with more karma please flag this?
• jmpman 7y ago
  Don’t take a job unless you know what job you plan to take afterwards.
  • Sammi 7y ago
    Yes. Every job is a stepping stone to the next one. Plan where you're heading. What jobs do you need on your CV to get that job that you really want?
• jmpman 7y ago
  Determine who the most savvy executives are in your line of business. When they start jumping to other opportunities, it’s time to sharpen your resume.
• heelix 7y ago
  Use the foulest language you can in passwords. Makes it unlikely it will get shared.
• insickness 7y ago
  - When trying to decide on a new career direction, go onto career websites such as Indeed.com and look up what is the highest paying and most desirable. For example, whenever I go for a certification, I do a search for it on Indeed. I look at how many hits come up, how much it pays, etc. - Dress just a little bit nicer/more formal than everyone else in your workplace. People who don't know you will assume you are more important than you are and people who do know you will unconsciously associate you with upper management and you'll be more likely to get promoted. Management promotes people they "see" as management material. If you look the part, they're more likely to see you that way. - Take audio recordings of your meetings with your coworkers and boss. Use the recordings to take notes that you may have missed at the meetings. Particularly in a new position, going back and listening helps to pick up what people emphasize. - If people can see your computer screen, do all your non-work bullshit on your phone, where people can't see. Keep only work stuff on your computer screen and you will look productive. - Don't ever tell anyone at work anything personal that could be even slightly controversial, including political beliefs. People like to talk shit and if they have something on you, it will get spread around most workplaces. Gossip is cache for people and they'll use whatever they have to make themselves more likable.
  • knaik94 7y ago
    Questions about the audio recording, have you ever had pushback from others? Is it a ask for forgiveness not permission situation? How transparent have you been day to day, for example is it visible during meetings or in your pocket? And do you keep a specific audio recorder/use only work phone or have you recorded on personal devices like your non-work phone?
    • insickness 7y ago
      I hit record on my personal phone before I go into the meeting, then turn the screen off and put my phone on the table at the meeting. A lot of people put their phone on the table at meetings.
      • whycombagator 7y ago
• Ill_ban_myself 7y ago
  Move jobs after a year or so for more money regardless of whether you like your employer. Circumstances change. Your salary stays with you long after that great manager has moved on.
• danzig13 7y ago
  Lost causes exist. If you’re in one, run.
• throwaway6890 7y ago
  Consider your choice of field carefully. I loved programming and yet doing it for a living and climbing the ladder made me start hating it. IMHO the tech field is overrun with young, bright, energetic people, most of whom are dreamers with their own private techno-utopian fantasies who secretly harbor the belief they'll be multi-millionaires or billionaires in a few short years. Dreamers are mostly innocent but there are lots of cutthroat assholes and psychopaths (as there are in many fields). The blood (money) in the water attracts some seriously disturbed people. Greed is everywhere, and in many forms. Do something you love that doesn't require you to compromise your morals. I wish I had been a musician. I wish I had focused on finding the right mate instead of so many nights programming, even though it brought me some fame and some money. I'm a little fucked up because I chose tech over loving the right person, and they are gone now.
  • lapaz17 7y ago
    Did you decide how to find this mate?
  • croh 7y ago
    So true. Actually early days of programming are good when you enjoy it. But once you decide to work for money, it becomes shit. This applies for everything. Real problem is money. Programmer makes lifestyle-changing-money in early days which keep them in constant fear to lose. As long as you're disconnected from money and doing your shit without bothering about others, everything works well. This is the reason I keep telling myself life is long. Try as many things as possible. Don't fear to start again as there ain't such thing as security. But alas my stupid mind... still seeks security over bewilderment.
    • blub 7y ago
      The quantity of money plays a decisive role in an industry's transformation into a cutthroat, toxic environment. SWE is now already there, but it used to be much more relaxed when there weren't so many billions floating around. Start-ups and the out of control VC money are one of the worst things that happened to this industry.
• croh 7y ago
  1. Get a disease something like migraine/sinus where quick medical treatment not possible and symptoms not visible. If you tell people that you need urgent leave to attend some function, they feel like cheated. Instead use this disease and take leaves you want. They feel compassionate. 2. Always show your in hurry to manager. You can do this by running with laptop when meeting colleague for chit-chat.
• scarejunba 7y ago
  Here, mid to big company ULPT. I'll never let my name be next to this: - Get a reputation as a guy who wears everything on his sleeve. You fucked up? You're going to say "I fucked up. Give me a chance to fix it. Thanks for your help so far. If you can find the time, I'd appreciate if you could also help me with Y". Likewise "this is fucking retarded" if you see something fucking retarded. Use the word 'fuck'. People love "straight talkers" and people especially love the kind who swear because they see them as honest people. Don't use it in an angry manner, more in an obvious bemusement at the state of the world. It's fucking retarded that some machine has a locale different from the rest and we forgot to specify the character encoding for bytes to string so that machine misinterprets UTF-8. No individual is fucking retarded. You're not pointing fingers at anyone but the universe for this having happened. Then you fix it. Rarely, but at crucial moments, exploit this with lies. - Always try to punch above your weight. Your organization is in shambles. The new product isn't taking off, your boss is leaving, your boss's boss is leaving. You're asked to take over your boss's responsibilities. No one else wants this. They can't guarantee success. Take it. Take your boss's boss's job if he's gone. If they're hesitant, use words like 'interim' and 'acting'. People suck at firing and you can always Marissa Mayer your way through ("the patient was dying; it's a wonder I kept them alive this long"). This is all opportunity. - When you do the extra thing, make it visible. Someone fucked up and your site is dropping a fifth of traffic. You were planning on taking it easy that weekend: drop some acid, go with your friends to listen to Lane 8, maybe go home with a girl you met there. Don't do it. Instead fix the site but make it visible. Tell your boss, "I'm going to take a couple of days off. Last weekend really finished me off.". Make sure you make everyone look good, updates all the time on company Slack. "Oh shit, turns out our health check didn't detect this condition for one of our five servers. That's what it was!" See, no blame, "we" made the mistake. Then put in a protective layer around that. Improve the health check and take the server out. Now go have some fun. Do this early and you'll get a reputation as a hero. Live off of it. - Always be bold. Make strong assertions. Then back them up. If you're convinced of the opposite of your original assertions, correct it as soon as possible. Go back to the guys you told the wrong thing to, uncorrect them clearly. "Guys, I fucked up. There's an edge case where JSON isn't valid YAML and we hit it". No one is making a decision on a particular engineering problem and the meeting is drawing to a close? Use the words "All right, looks like we don't have much time here but I think it'll be useful to leave with a default option just so we can scope future discussions. How about we consider X our default". No one's even going to fight you on that. If they do, they're forcing indecision. - Make others look good. They made a mistake? No, we did. Sometimes maybe it was even you who failed to spot the mistake. Together, you all made something nice? No, they made something nice. They'll be obligated to say "Yeah, I only did X, you did all the Y". Accept that with grace. - Be likable. Dress nicely. Be friendly. Be unassailable, for instance: Curmudgeonly coworker makes a disparaging remark about your code? If it's right, don't silently eat it with a "Addressed comments". Hit them with the "Thanks for the detailed review. Made the changes requested. By the way, also found article X that describes a general principle for this". Positively framed. You retain your dignity and portray security (irrespective of how insecure you are). In software, people adore "plucky guy who learns" because they imagine that he'll be good at the asymptote. Exploit it. - Stick your neck out in low-risk situations. Some dude in Sales wants a quick feature and the cost is going to be felt by an engineer far in the future? Do it, even if you have to do extra hours. Then coast on your reputation as a doer. Someone else will pay the price. You can double down by "I don't think we should generally do it, but if it will really help I can do it but it'll take me some work. I need you to not go tell all the other sales guys that I did this, though". They'll tell the other sales guys that you do things but not what. Perfect. Now in their heads those guys think you made magic.
• dagw 7y ago
  A slacker who can kiss butt and play politics will almost always beat a hard worker who can't when it comes to most metrics that matter, like salary, work life balance, lack of stress at work etc.
• Traubenfuchs 7y ago
  tl;dr - express dark triad behaviour This thread leaves me in despair.
• s3nnyy 7y ago
  Most programmers invest a lot of time in coding and related activities (learn the newest framework) but this thread is again a proof that most neglect all other aspects of their career (e.g., regular salary negotiations). I worked as a programmer for several years and now I run a tech recruitment consultancy (coderfit.com). Programmers come to me daily with various problems. I am writing up all the individual solutions that lead to more money in a book. It covers career growth, interviewing, job search, and salary negotiation; please have a look here: “Coderfit: Make more money as a programmer”: https://gumroad.com/l/cdrft https://gumroad.com/l/cdrft
• strictnein 7y ago
  Trying to answer the question as written: 1. When people discuss politics at work, it is far, far better to say nothing than to say anything that goes against the prevailing politics of your company. 2. There is never a circumstance where you should question any program designed to help groups that your company has deemed are underrepresented, no matter how unfair you feel it is that those same opportunities aren't available more broadly. Not only are these efforts frequently highlighted publicly, they are often lead by VPs with buy-in all the way up the executive chain. There is zero upside here. The correct approach is to talk to your leader about how you could incorporate similar training/learning into your career plan.
• ulisesrmzroche 7y ago
  Sell hard drugs at work! (Jk jk!)
• pkalinowski 7y ago
  If you don’t know something, say „I don’t know, but I’ll check”. Find the answer/solution and share it publicly. People will notice your knowledge and remember thing you know. It will open doors later.
• the_resistence 7y ago
  A great lesson to learn as early as possible. Your boss may be good in a very niche space but a horrible, demented human being and functional alcoholic. Get away from him/her as quickly as possible. You will lose years of productive growth trying to "solve" them for the good of the business and relationship.
• twirlock 7y ago
  Wow, here's one: Simply doing your job well, without proliferating bullshit, reduces cognitive load when some asshole who really took The 48 Laws of Power to heart decides to come be a fraud in your vicinity.