22 ms·

Apple Reports Third Quarter Results

174 points by coloneltcb 8y ago

ryanx435 8y ago
there have been about a dozen new hires at my work, each of them getting a new mac book and accessories to develop on. multiply that by all of the new hires across the country and some of the lowest unemployment numbers in years and you've got a good set up for apple's hardware division to make a ton of sales last quarter. ... but unfortunately, looking at their data, it looks like I was wrong: unit sales for macs fell by 13% compared to last year, and 9% compared to last quarter. interesting. Edit: downvotes because I made a prediction before looking at the reports then acknowledged I was wrong and didn't delete my post. Cool.
- zhonwang 8y ago
  Might surprise you but the vast majority of IT units hiring people are not giving them $1500-$2000 Macbooks
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - lev99 8y ago
    You only spend $2000 on your mac books? My last one was $3,750 after shipping and taxes.
    - yalph 8y ago
      Wow!! Can you say it is absolutely worth it?
      - lev99 8y ago
        It's extortion. MacOS is the only good consumer OS built on *nix, so I'd probably pay 3x if they charged it.
        yalph 8y ago
        Haha fair enough. I too like the OS but that pricing point is way too steep for me.
  - scarface74 8y ago
    My Dell laptop that I got when I was hired cost $1500
- alaskamiller 8y ago
  Your extrapolation process is off. MacBooks as work computers being handed out is an aberration. Has been since the 80's, 90's, and 00's.
- electricslpnsld 8y ago
  Windows is still something like 88% of the corporate computer market, with macOS at around 9%, last I checked. Most companies aren't purchasing Apple hardware for their employees.
  - JumpCrisscross 8y ago
    > Windows is still something like 88% of the corporate computer market Apple's genius is in measuring market share by bottom line, not top.
  - baal80spam 8y ago
    Yeah, certainly they don't do it in Europe. I wonder how does it look in the US, I would imagine Macs are much more popular in corporations (?) and definitely startups.
    - nicoburns 8y ago
      I don't know about the rest of europe, but macs are standard (if not universal) at web agencies in the UK (often purchased by the company). I'm sure it's very different at large corporations.
- Spooky23 8y ago
  You work in an unusual place. Most of our new hires are getting ancient PCs to use as VDI thin clients.
- willio58 8y ago
  I commend you for not deleting. Stay strong!
minimaxir 8y ago
Basically the opposite of Twitter's and Facebook's results. Reporting says services revenue (App Store, Apple Care, Apple Pay, iTunes) is up 31%, despite heavy competition in those areas.
- dep_b 8y ago
  And Samsung.
- philjohn 8y ago
  Well, if you're in the Apple ecosystem, App Store is where you're going to get your apps, iTunes is where you're going to buy, versus stream music, and who else to trust to fix your iDevices than Apple themselves? So where's the competition?
  - reaperducer 8y ago
    For buying music, Amazon. It does a surprisingly good job on the Mac. For streaming, Apple is still an also-ran, even on the iPhone, and even with 40 million subs.
- cullenking 8y ago
  We have a website and mobile apps. We are watching our revenue not so slowly go from credit card based purchases with a 2.4% transaction fee, to iTunes/Google Play purchases with a 30% transaction fee. This makes a HUGE difference in overhead for a business, and is money directly funneled straight to Google and Apple's "services" divisions. I don't think this is going to change or level off anytime soon. Everyone wants their cut, now Visa gets it AND google/apple get it :(
- samfisher83 8y ago
  There is no competition in those areas. If you have an iphone you can't use google play. You can't even side load an app.
  - rickycook 8y ago
mythz 8y ago
Killed it again: - Revenue: 53.3B (17% YoY) - Net Income: 11.5B (40% YoY)
- kilo_bravo_3 8y ago
  That's impossible. Everyone keeps telling me that Apple is dying. At this rate I imagine Apple could lock the doors of all of its stores and pull the plug on its website, and it would have enough cash to pay its employees for decades.
  - maxerickson 8y ago
    Especially if they also fired all the employees. You can look up their cash and cash equivalents and get a sense of their employee costs, you don't have to guess.
  - adventured 8y ago
    Without the business, 15 years would be a fair estimate for how long the cash would last, based on modest inflation adjustments on salaries, an average $100k to $125k cost per employee (all in), and either clearing their debt or just paying interest on it perpetually. They'll probably burn $150b over ten years on employee costs, with 100,000 employees (present count). That's mostly ignoring the destruction of the stock itself, which would hit employee compensation and require higher salaries to offset.
  - baxtr 8y ago
    Apple has been said to be doomed as long as I can remember. Somehow it’s great to be underestimated continuously. But on the other hand the stock takes the toll with a low PE ratio (compared to other tech stocks)
    - ISL 8y ago
      A P/E of 17 is perfect for a great company, in my estimation.
      - 8y ago
MaysonL 8y ago
R&D spending up 26% y/y. Other revenue(watches and AirPods) up 37% y/y.
pastor_elm 8y ago
who knew emojis were so profitable
- mayneack 8y ago
  slack
ihuman 8y ago
MacStories has some nice graphical visualizations comparing this quarter's results to previous quarters. https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-q3-2018-results-533-billion-revenue-413-million-iphones-116-million-ipads-sold/ https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-q3-2018-results-533-bi...
- ChuckMcM 8y ago
  That is a pretty good visualization. One of the things that really stands out is the growth in services. One way that has personally effected me has been with music on my iPad. It has become harder and harder to have purchased music live on your iPad for playing. They have completely skewed what was their signature 'appliance app' (from the iPod of days gone by) from 'carry your music with you where ever you go' to 'portal to our pay per month music service'. Every time I upgrade IOS I worry about how much harder it will be to put my music on the device so that I can listen to it without being connected to a network or paying a monthly fee.
  - thirdsun 8y ago
    Don't worry - while the majority of users simply consume their music via streaming, local music ownership isn't going anywhere for music enthusiasts. And as long as Apple allows alternative music players on iOS I'm not worried. I recommend Cesium to anyone using a local music collection: http://www.cesium-app.com/ http://www.cesium-app.com/ It uses the same iTunes library as any other music app, including Apple's default music.app.
- Analemma_ 8y ago
  Six Colors does it better IMHO: https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/07/apple-q3-results-charts-call/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/07/apple-q3-results-charts-c...
  - irregular-john 8y ago
    Sort of. But the "Average Mac selling price (4q average)" is an abysmal chart. The first-glance takeaway is, "Wow! The average Mac price has almost quadrupled recently!" when in reality it has increased about $150, or about 12% from two years ago.
maddyboo 8y ago
I find it a bit funny that the title of the consolidated financial statements PDF [1] is "Microsoft Word - Q318 Earnings Press Release - Word.docx". I guess Apple's accountants use MS Office? 1: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/Q3FY18ConsolidatedFinancialStatements.pdf https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/Q3FY18ConsolidatedFinanc...
- selectodude 8y ago
  It's almost certainly an excel spreadsheet exported to word to touch up and then printed as PDF.
  - derefr 8y ago
    You’d think, given it was touched up by Apple designers, they’d have exported the Excel sheet to Pages instead.
    - Splines 8y ago
      Just because you're in the finance division of a bicycle company doesn't mean you can't drive a car to work.
      - derefr 8y ago
        I meant that you’d think everything that comes out of Apple—including their finance division—would go through a central design and branding department, which would apply one central toolset to all inputs, regardless of what tools the originating division used. This is certainly true in other companies that try their utmost to achieve a certain aesthetic at all times, e.g. Disney, IKEA, etc. The same companies that put their invoices, their products’ warranty cards, and probably the UX of their ERP system through their design process.
        selectodude 8y ago
        I’m not really sure what you think would look different about it if they used pages.
pastor_elm 8y ago
seals the deal. $1200 base model Iphone here we come.
- reaperducer 8y ago
  Three months after that... $1,200 base model Samsung phone. Three months after that... $1,200 base model LG phone. Three months after that... $1,200 base model no-name Chinese phones.
  - tooltalk 8y ago
    ?? Wasn't Samsung the first to produce $1000 phone last year, followed by Apple a few months later? or if you are insinuating that everyone else is merely copying Apple's pricing strategy (or anything that is Apple), or just copy, copy, copy, Apple fanois website is that way --> Appleinsider.com
HenryTheHorse 8y ago
$4.7B in iPad sales. That's 4.7 BILLION. At nearly 10% of their revenues, the going-going-gone tablet category still has some legs. Who would have thunk? /edited the numbers. I had mixed up the Mac and iPad revenue figures.
- threeseed 8y ago
  iPad sales should go through the roof later in this year. The acquisition of Texture and the upcoming refresh with iPhone X style design should drive a lot of of users to look at iPads as a magazine replacement. Especially if it comes free as part of your existing Apple Music subscription.
  - stefan_ 8y ago
    Again? Feels like all the magazines around here went through their "digital edition with these cool features" phase 4-5 years ago.
    - reaperducer 8y ago
      IIRC, it was called Zinio, and didn't work very well. Crashtastic. If Apple can do it right, something could happen here. Especially if it makes it cheap and easy for independent publishers to climb on board.
    - snuxoll 8y ago
      I explicitly bought the 12.9" iPad Pro over the 9.7" to read the replica edition of the NY Times without having tiny text :/
  - graeme 8y ago
    The upcoming release of Photoshop for ipad should help too, along with the recent release of Affinity Designer (Illustrator replacement). Now if only they would add coding to the ipad....
    - trevyn 8y ago
thecosas 8y ago
Earnings call: https://www.apple.com/investor/earnings-call/ https://www.apple.com/investor/earnings-call/
HenryTheHorse 8y ago
HN, you disappoint me. Not one of you made the "$53B in sales; still can't fix iTunes" comment. /why in God's name is iTunes still so bad?
- redial 8y ago
  Isn't it obvious? the sad state of iTunes is so irrelevant to making truckloads of money that any effort to fix it will only eat at their profits. So...No iTunes for you!
- lolsal 8y ago
  It works fine for me; maybe it's fine for most folks.
- jimmaswell 8y ago
  Because Apple hasn't been a technical leader in many years. They've established their brand as a luxury brand and their products as a status symbol; all else is secondary, including to most of the users. Almost nobody arrives at a purely rational decision to buy an Apple product in 2018 when competitor products nearly universally have a lower ratio of price to (performance/quality/screen size/serviceability/etc). Like everything else Apple does today, this strategy is also unoriginal: Harley-Davidson was a major innovator way back in the day, but nobody but a Harley fanatic in the biker community will recommend you to buy a Harley today, because they're (outdated design/inefficient/unreliable/etc); despite this, they're the most recognized brand by non-bikers and Harley fans will ride it out with Harley-Davidson to the end.
  - lotsofpulp 8y ago
    Apple’s ecosystem just works. I’ve used this example before, but when I needed to buy my great grandma who lives in a poor country who never learned English or went to school, a device to video chat with all her (grand)children, it was a no brained to get an iPad mini. It works every time she uses Facetime and there is no problem other than turning it off and on. Similarly, all the grandparents, uncles, aunts, they don’t want to spend time learning how to sign into various google accounts and services. They want to press a button and see their loved ones. So everyone has an iOS device. Because google couldn’t get it together and offer something that worked, and didn’t change names every two weeks. Similarly, WhatsApp took instant messaging. It just worked, sharing contacts, pictures, video is dead simple. Not to mention iOS devices last the longest by far and get security updates quickly and for a longer period of time. And the resell prices prove it. And you can quickly go to an a Apple store and get it fixed or replaced. Who cares if it’s specs are not the best, it just works for 90% of people.
codelord 8y ago
Apple is making great money selling consumer products and services. It's time Apple uses some of that money to build better hardware for developers without considering immediate profits. We need MacBook Pros that are actually designed for professionals. No touch bar, better keyboard, better CPU and GPU. Consider it an investment on your developers.
- andrestan 8y ago
  As an alternative, I personally love the keyboard of the 2018 Macbooks and I'm not sure I'm aware of dramatically better CPUs that could be put inside of them? Certainly my new 13" with the upgraded CPU is fantastic. I would like a better GPU, but I can use an external GPU if needed. The disk speed is I think literally unparalleled, the screen is fantastic, the touchpad is the best in class, the T2 chip provides great security... I quite like my upgrade from my early 2015 13".
  - apocalyptic0n3 8y ago
    They could focus on cooling, which would enable them to throttle the CPU less often. The recent firmware update helped with the throttling but it still runs extremely hot.
    - threeseed 8y ago
      There is a reason for Apple's position though. Many/most of these MacBook Pros are being used in professional work environments which expect your laptop to be silent. I've been in quite a few meetings with the fans going to 100% and it's incredibly disruptive. So whilst you have options to increase the fan speed the defaults are understandably kept quite conservative.
      - apocalyptic0n3 8y ago
        This is a fair point. At the same time, though, they have very few exits for hot air and could improve passive cooling by making the MBP slightly thicker (gasp!) and adding larger heat sinks. Alternatively, they could add first-party support for fan-profile configuration. The needs of a dev or designer or video editor do not match the needs of an accountant or an executive. The ability to easily switch between profiles to match task would be extremely useful, I think.
ArtWomb 8y ago
Cash on hand now upwards of $230B. Your average CNBC talking head would probably recommend a large acquisition soon. Names usually whispered about include: Uber, Tesla, Snap or Netflix. Or a content studio such as Comcast, Disney, or Fox. But such advice ignores the gargantuan growth that cloud services are experiencing right now. Although iCloud, iTunes, ApplePay and the AppStore are almost solely focused on consumer internet and retail. It's conceivable that $APPL would make a push to deliver more SaaS offerings. Perhaps analagous to Adobe's Creative Cloud suite for profession digital content creators.
- techbio 8y ago
  But its cloud runs on AWS and/or Azure and/or Google Cloud? https://thenextweb.com/apple/2018/02/27/apple-confirms-it-runs-icloud-on-googles-cloud/ https://thenextweb.com/apple/2018/02/27/apple-confirms-it-ru... Edit: SaaS growth has hard technical requirements and is a key qualifier in parent comment. Edit 2: Everything after "but" is the take I'm reading.
  - youre_an_idiot 8y ago
    So? What does that have anything to do with the OP? Idiot.
- 40acres 8y ago
  If I'm Apple I'm earmarking some money for AR development. ARKit is really solid and should get better w/ time. That can provide a nice launching point for developing AR glasses. If anyone can pull off tech glasses it's Apple.
  - ArtWomb 8y ago
    Not sure about the glasses. But Niantic's new state-of-the-art AR title will be massive ;) https://www.harrypotterwizardsunite.com/en/ https://www.harrypotterwizardsunite.com/en/
  - threeseed 8y ago
    Apple is spending billions (maybe even tens of billions) every year on AR/VR. Tim Cook has already said so and it's exemplified by some of their recent hires: https://variety.com/2018/digital/news/apple-cyber-paint-app-sterling-crispin-1202890174/ https://variety.com/2018/digital/news/apple-cyber-paint-app-...
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
jakobegger 8y ago
I care a lot about the Mac, and I'm not sure what to think about the fact that Mac unit sales are down again. The Mac has been growing for a long time, and they seem to have reached a plateau. I assume that's the reason why Macs have became absurdly expensive in the last few years -- when they can't grow unit sales, they need to grow revenue per unit. The result is that Apple doesn't build the computer most of their potential customers want -- a $1000 Macbook. I understand that they don't care about the $300 netbook market, but not offering a decent $1000 laptop is a bad idea. It means they are going to loose consumers and students – there are decent alternatives at that price point. Or, people like me, who just keep using their old Macbooks because the high price of the new machines isn't worth the marginally improved performance. Where does this lead us? I don't see how the Mac should grow from here, and as a Mac software developer that worries me. I want to be in a growing market, not a stagnant one. I'm probably going to be okay for the next few years, but is the Mac still going to be a worthwhile platform for a small software company in 10-15 years? I don't know.
- hindsightbias 8y ago
  If half the devs clinging to their 2012-13 rMBP with missing keys and wire-exposed MagSafe cables would just get with the program and upgrade, sales would go thru the roof.
  - iainmerrick 8y ago
    Build a decent laptop and they'll soon come around.
- runwerks 8y ago
  Keep in mind that this doesn't include the 'back to school' season...
  - weliketocode 8y ago
    I could be very wrong here, but I'm not so sure Apple's customers want the $1000 macbook. Many mac users (and perhaps apple users in general) are the type of people willing to pay up for the top-of-the-line, latest-and-great, spare-no-expense tech gadget. I've seen this with companies giving their developers the maxed out mac + mac accessories. I've seen this with individuals who view their mac laptop as the biggest most important usage of their time. Where have you seen apple struggle because they were being undercut by competitors?
willwagner 8y ago
I believe around $199 a share is when AAPL would become the first company ever to have a market cap of $1T. It could happen tomorrow. For reference, the first $1B market cap company was US Steel in 1901.
- bufferoverflow 8y ago
  Well, if you inflation-adjust, there probably were $1 trillion companies.
  - jonknee 8y ago
    There have been several. Saudi Aramco is one right now (and has been for some time), but it's not publicly traded. http://www.visualcapitalist.com/most-valuable-companies-all-time/ http://www.visualcapitalist.com/most-valuable-companies-all-...
- techbio 8y ago
  FYI: 6% per year
- Bahamut 8y ago
  I think it's supposed to be $203.48: https://business.financialpost.com/investing/apple-needs-an-8-6-rally-to-reach-1-trillion-milestone https://business.financialpost.com/investing/apple-needs-an-... (found via google search).
- megy 8y ago
  The first publicly traded company to have a market cap of $1T.
  - coolwhhip 8y ago
    Don’t companies need to be publicly traded to have nonzero market cap by definition?
onetimemanytime 8y ago
Major congrats to them and to the late Jobs. I'd be in the Ballmer category... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qycUOENFIBs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qycUOENFIBs Making telcos "subsidize" it, must be right there with the "pay just the minimum on your credit card" business wise. Brilliant.
williesleg 8y ago
The only ones buying Macs are those stuck in the ecosystem. Not good, Timmy Cook.
mark_l_watson 8y ago
Great conversation thread here. I will add my bit: I have been an Apple customer since buying serial number 72 of the Apple II (and worked writing software for 45+ years). I love the iPad. I use Mac laptops for programming at work and my personal projects, but, I use my iPad for SSHing to my servers, reading, audio books, watch movies, research material for new books and technologies I want to learn, take online courses, write, etc. Yes, laptops are great for writing code, but much of my thinking time is done with an iPad. When I retire, I can imagine just using a remote VPS for recreational coding with whatever can get decent screen space and a keyboard for a few SSH shells, and everything else could be an iPad.
- deepaksurti 8y ago
  Can you recommend apps you use for SSH'ing to the servers? What do you use to write? I have just started with the Apple Pencil and love it, use Notability. Any recommendations here will help.
  - jiqiren 8y ago
    http://www.blink.sh http://www.blink.sh <- so far the best terminal. Includes mosh support so you can sleep your iPad, switch between LTE/Wifi, etc - then later continue your terminal without interruption.
    - evgen 8y ago
      IMHO the absolute best thing about Blink is that it lets you use caps lock as control. Since doing this remapping on my laptop it is now a part of my muscle memory but no bluetooth keyboards support this in hardware and iOS does not support it in software; Blink manages to support this in the app and it makes my SSH sessions and remote editing so much easier.
    - mark_l_watson 8y ago
      Thanks, I will try Blink
  - mark_l_watson 8y ago
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
Tomminn 8y ago
Anyone else notice that after hours trading puts em a few mill shy of a trillion?
diminish 8y ago
iPhone Market share (~11%) and unit sales of iPhones are flat compared to last year on a no-growth market. Service and Mac sales seem to be dependent on iPhone sales. Quarter by quarter Apple turns into a one trick pony where most income depends on the success of their smartphone market share of ~15 +- 4%. If there were a novel approach to smartphones/mobile computing - Apple/iPhone would look a lot like RIM/Blackberry in 2010/2011 where sales and revenues (services) skyrocketed yet analysts were warning us. Yet there's to tech rising to kill smartphones. So Apple is safe for some years ahead. Welcome to trillion+ valuation AAPL.
- ksec 8y ago
  >Welcome to trillion+ valuation AAPL. The word welcome as if someone already has a trillion cap and welcome them. But in fact no one has done it, and even if they did by real dollar and for a short moment; There were one or two companies that touches the trillion market cap for a few hours / days and came back down. Apple may be the first one to truly worth it.
  - diminish 8y ago
    Aren't there non public oil giants who're worth more? Like Saudi Aramco?
vivan 8y ago
The iPhone is a beast and a market leader - that is known, and shown in these results. The Mac however is in decline - Apple seem to have abandoned it in favour of their cash cow (as many on here have complained) and these results just further prove it.

174 points by coloneltcb 8y ago

there have been about a dozen new hires at my work, each of them getting a new mac book and accessories to develop on. multiply that by all of the new hires across the country and some of the lowest unemployment numbers in years and you've got a good set up for apple's hardware division to make a ton of sales last quarter. ... but unfortunately, looking at their data, it looks like I was wrong: unit sales for macs fell by 13% compared to last year, and 9% compared to last quarter. interesting. Edit: downvotes because I made a prediction before looking at the reports then acknowledged I was wrong and didn't delete my post. Cool.

zhonwang 8y ago
Might surprise you but the vast majority of IT units hiring people are not giving them $1500-$2000 Macbooks
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- lev99 8y ago
  You only spend $2000 on your mac books? My last one was $3,750 after shipping and taxes.
  - yalph 8y ago
    Wow!! Can you say it is absolutely worth it?
    - lev99 8y ago
      It's extortion. MacOS is the only good consumer OS built on *nix, so I'd probably pay 3x if they charged it.
      - yalph 8y ago
        Haha fair enough. I too like the OS but that pricing point is way too steep for me.
- scarface74 8y ago
  My Dell laptop that I got when I was hired cost $1500
alaskamiller 8y ago
Your extrapolation process is off. MacBooks as work computers being handed out is an aberration. Has been since the 80's, 90's, and 00's.
electricslpnsld 8y ago
Windows is still something like 88% of the corporate computer market, with macOS at around 9%, last I checked. Most companies aren't purchasing Apple hardware for their employees.
- JumpCrisscross 8y ago
  > Windows is still something like 88% of the corporate computer market Apple's genius is in measuring market share by bottom line, not top.
- baal80spam 8y ago
  Yeah, certainly they don't do it in Europe. I wonder how does it look in the US, I would imagine Macs are much more popular in corporations (?) and definitely startups.
  - nicoburns 8y ago
    I don't know about the rest of europe, but macs are standard (if not universal) at web agencies in the UK (often purchased by the company). I'm sure it's very different at large corporations.
Spooky23 8y ago
You work in an unusual place. Most of our new hires are getting ancient PCs to use as VDI thin clients.
willio58 8y ago
I commend you for not deleting. Stay strong!

minimaxir 8y ago

Basically the opposite of Twitter's and Facebook's results. Reporting says services revenue (App Store, Apple Care, Apple Pay, iTunes) is up 31%, despite heavy competition in those areas.

dep_b 8y ago
And Samsung.
philjohn 8y ago
Well, if you're in the Apple ecosystem, App Store is where you're going to get your apps, iTunes is where you're going to buy, versus stream music, and who else to trust to fix your iDevices than Apple themselves? So where's the competition?
- reaperducer 8y ago
  For buying music, Amazon. It does a surprisingly good job on the Mac. For streaming, Apple is still an also-ran, even on the iPhone, and even with 40 million subs.
cullenking 8y ago
We have a website and mobile apps. We are watching our revenue not so slowly go from credit card based purchases with a 2.4% transaction fee, to iTunes/Google Play purchases with a 30% transaction fee. This makes a HUGE difference in overhead for a business, and is money directly funneled straight to Google and Apple's "services" divisions. I don't think this is going to change or level off anytime soon. Everyone wants their cut, now Visa gets it AND google/apple get it :(
samfisher83 8y ago
There is no competition in those areas. If you have an iphone you can't use google play. You can't even side load an app.
- rickycook 8y ago

mythz 8y ago

Killed it again: - Revenue: 53.3B (17% YoY) - Net Income: 11.5B (40% YoY)

kilo_bravo_3 8y ago
That's impossible. Everyone keeps telling me that Apple is dying. At this rate I imagine Apple could lock the doors of all of its stores and pull the plug on its website, and it would have enough cash to pay its employees for decades.
- maxerickson 8y ago
  Especially if they also fired all the employees. You can look up their cash and cash equivalents and get a sense of their employee costs, you don't have to guess.
- adventured 8y ago
  Without the business, 15 years would be a fair estimate for how long the cash would last, based on modest inflation adjustments on salaries, an average $100k to $125k cost per employee (all in), and either clearing their debt or just paying interest on it perpetually. They'll probably burn $150b over ten years on employee costs, with 100,000 employees (present count). That's mostly ignoring the destruction of the stock itself, which would hit employee compensation and require higher salaries to offset.
- baxtr 8y ago
  Apple has been said to be doomed as long as I can remember. Somehow it’s great to be underestimated continuously. But on the other hand the stock takes the toll with a low PE ratio (compared to other tech stocks)
  - ISL 8y ago
    A P/E of 17 is perfect for a great company, in my estimation.
    - 8y ago

MaysonL 8y ago

R&D spending up 26% y/y. Other revenue(watches and AirPods) up 37% y/y.

pastor_elm 8y ago

who knew emojis were so profitable

mayneack 8y ago
slack

ihuman 8y ago

MacStories has some nice graphical visualizations comparing this quarter's results to previous quarters. https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-q3-2018-results-533-billion-revenue-413-million-iphones-116-million-ipads-sold/ https://www.macstories.net/news/apple-q3-2018-results-533-bi...

ChuckMcM 8y ago
That is a pretty good visualization. One of the things that really stands out is the growth in services. One way that has personally effected me has been with music on my iPad. It has become harder and harder to have purchased music live on your iPad for playing. They have completely skewed what was their signature 'appliance app' (from the iPod of days gone by) from 'carry your music with you where ever you go' to 'portal to our pay per month music service'. Every time I upgrade IOS I worry about how much harder it will be to put my music on the device so that I can listen to it without being connected to a network or paying a monthly fee.
- thirdsun 8y ago
  Don't worry - while the majority of users simply consume their music via streaming, local music ownership isn't going anywhere for music enthusiasts. And as long as Apple allows alternative music players on iOS I'm not worried. I recommend Cesium to anyone using a local music collection: http://www.cesium-app.com/ http://www.cesium-app.com/ It uses the same iTunes library as any other music app, including Apple's default music.app.
Analemma_ 8y ago
Six Colors does it better IMHO: https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/07/apple-q3-results-charts-call/ https://sixcolors.com/post/2018/07/apple-q3-results-charts-c...
- irregular-john 8y ago
  Sort of. But the "Average Mac selling price (4q average)" is an abysmal chart. The first-glance takeaway is, "Wow! The average Mac price has almost quadrupled recently!" when in reality it has increased about $150, or about 12% from two years ago.

maddyboo 8y ago

I find it a bit funny that the title of the consolidated financial statements PDF [1] is "Microsoft Word - Q318 Earnings Press Release - Word.docx". I guess Apple's accountants use MS Office? 1: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/Q3FY18ConsolidatedFinancialStatements.pdf https://www.apple.com/newsroom/pdfs/Q3FY18ConsolidatedFinanc...

selectodude 8y ago
It's almost certainly an excel spreadsheet exported to word to touch up and then printed as PDF.
- derefr 8y ago
  You’d think, given it was touched up by Apple designers, they’d have exported the Excel sheet to Pages instead.
  - Splines 8y ago
    Just because you're in the finance division of a bicycle company doesn't mean you can't drive a car to work.
    - derefr 8y ago
      I meant that you’d think everything that comes out of Apple—including their finance division—would go through a central design and branding department, which would apply one central toolset to all inputs, regardless of what tools the originating division used. This is certainly true in other companies that try their utmost to achieve a certain aesthetic at all times, e.g. Disney, IKEA, etc. The same companies that put their invoices, their products’ warranty cards, and probably the UX of their ERP system through their design process.
      - selectodude 8y ago
        I’m not really sure what you think would look different about it if they used pages.

pastor_elm 8y ago

seals the deal. $1200 base model Iphone here we come.

reaperducer 8y ago
Three months after that... $1,200 base model Samsung phone. Three months after that... $1,200 base model LG phone. Three months after that... $1,200 base model no-name Chinese phones.
- tooltalk 8y ago
  ?? Wasn't Samsung the first to produce $1000 phone last year, followed by Apple a few months later? or if you are insinuating that everyone else is merely copying Apple's pricing strategy (or anything that is Apple), or just copy, copy, copy, Apple fanois website is that way --> Appleinsider.com

HenryTheHorse 8y ago

$4.7B in iPad sales. That's 4.7 BILLION. At nearly 10% of their revenues, the going-going-gone tablet category still has some legs. Who would have thunk? /edited the numbers. I had mixed up the Mac and iPad revenue figures.

threeseed 8y ago
iPad sales should go through the roof later in this year. The acquisition of Texture and the upcoming refresh with iPhone X style design should drive a lot of of users to look at iPads as a magazine replacement. Especially if it comes free as part of your existing Apple Music subscription.
- stefan_ 8y ago
  Again? Feels like all the magazines around here went through their "digital edition with these cool features" phase 4-5 years ago.
  - reaperducer 8y ago
    IIRC, it was called Zinio, and didn't work very well. Crashtastic. If Apple can do it right, something could happen here. Especially if it makes it cheap and easy for independent publishers to climb on board.
  - snuxoll 8y ago
    I explicitly bought the 12.9" iPad Pro over the 9.7" to read the replica edition of the NY Times without having tiny text :/
- graeme 8y ago
  The upcoming release of Photoshop for ipad should help too, along with the recent release of Affinity Designer (Illustrator replacement). Now if only they would add coding to the ipad....
  - trevyn 8y ago

thecosas 8y ago

Earnings call: https://www.apple.com/investor/earnings-call/ https://www.apple.com/investor/earnings-call/

HenryTheHorse 8y ago

HN, you disappoint me. Not one of you made the "$53B in sales; still can't fix iTunes" comment. /why in God's name is iTunes still so bad?

redial 8y ago
Isn't it obvious? the sad state of iTunes is so irrelevant to making truckloads of money that any effort to fix it will only eat at their profits. So...No iTunes for you!
lolsal 8y ago
It works fine for me; maybe it's fine for most folks.
jimmaswell 8y ago
Because Apple hasn't been a technical leader in many years. They've established their brand as a luxury brand and their products as a status symbol; all else is secondary, including to most of the users. Almost nobody arrives at a purely rational decision to buy an Apple product in 2018 when competitor products nearly universally have a lower ratio of price to (performance/quality/screen size/serviceability/etc). Like everything else Apple does today, this strategy is also unoriginal: Harley-Davidson was a major innovator way back in the day, but nobody but a Harley fanatic in the biker community will recommend you to buy a Harley today, because they're (outdated design/inefficient/unreliable/etc); despite this, they're the most recognized brand by non-bikers and Harley fans will ride it out with Harley-Davidson to the end.
- lotsofpulp 8y ago
  Apple’s ecosystem just works. I’ve used this example before, but when I needed to buy my great grandma who lives in a poor country who never learned English or went to school, a device to video chat with all her (grand)children, it was a no brained to get an iPad mini. It works every time she uses Facetime and there is no problem other than turning it off and on. Similarly, all the grandparents, uncles, aunts, they don’t want to spend time learning how to sign into various google accounts and services. They want to press a button and see their loved ones. So everyone has an iOS device. Because google couldn’t get it together and offer something that worked, and didn’t change names every two weeks. Similarly, WhatsApp took instant messaging. It just worked, sharing contacts, pictures, video is dead simple. Not to mention iOS devices last the longest by far and get security updates quickly and for a longer period of time. And the resell prices prove it. And you can quickly go to an a Apple store and get it fixed or replaced. Who cares if it’s specs are not the best, it just works for 90% of people.

codelord 8y ago

Apple is making great money selling consumer products and services. It's time Apple uses some of that money to build better hardware for developers without considering immediate profits. We need MacBook Pros that are actually designed for professionals. No touch bar, better keyboard, better CPU and GPU. Consider it an investment on your developers.

andrestan 8y ago
As an alternative, I personally love the keyboard of the 2018 Macbooks and I'm not sure I'm aware of dramatically better CPUs that could be put inside of them? Certainly my new 13" with the upgraded CPU is fantastic. I would like a better GPU, but I can use an external GPU if needed. The disk speed is I think literally unparalleled, the screen is fantastic, the touchpad is the best in class, the T2 chip provides great security... I quite like my upgrade from my early 2015 13".
- apocalyptic0n3 8y ago
  They could focus on cooling, which would enable them to throttle the CPU less often. The recent firmware update helped with the throttling but it still runs extremely hot.
  - threeseed 8y ago
    There is a reason for Apple's position though. Many/most of these MacBook Pros are being used in professional work environments which expect your laptop to be silent. I've been in quite a few meetings with the fans going to 100% and it's incredibly disruptive. So whilst you have options to increase the fan speed the defaults are understandably kept quite conservative.
    - apocalyptic0n3 8y ago
      This is a fair point. At the same time, though, they have very few exits for hot air and could improve passive cooling by making the MBP slightly thicker (gasp!) and adding larger heat sinks. Alternatively, they could add first-party support for fan-profile configuration. The needs of a dev or designer or video editor do not match the needs of an accountant or an executive. The ability to easily switch between profiles to match task would be extremely useful, I think.

ArtWomb 8y ago

Cash on hand now upwards of $230B. Your average CNBC talking head would probably recommend a large acquisition soon. Names usually whispered about include: Uber, Tesla, Snap or Netflix. Or a content studio such as Comcast, Disney, or Fox. But such advice ignores the gargantuan growth that cloud services are experiencing right now. Although iCloud, iTunes, ApplePay and the AppStore are almost solely focused on consumer internet and retail. It's conceivable that $APPL would make a push to deliver more SaaS offerings. Perhaps analagous to Adobe's Creative Cloud suite for profession digital content creators.

techbio 8y ago
But its cloud runs on AWS and/or Azure and/or Google Cloud? https://thenextweb.com/apple/2018/02/27/apple-confirms-it-runs-icloud-on-googles-cloud/ https://thenextweb.com/apple/2018/02/27/apple-confirms-it-ru... Edit: SaaS growth has hard technical requirements and is a key qualifier in parent comment. Edit 2: Everything after "but" is the take I'm reading.
- youre_an_idiot 8y ago
  So? What does that have anything to do with the OP? Idiot.
40acres 8y ago
If I'm Apple I'm earmarking some money for AR development. ARKit is really solid and should get better w/ time. That can provide a nice launching point for developing AR glasses. If anyone can pull off tech glasses it's Apple.
- ArtWomb 8y ago
  Not sure about the glasses. But Niantic's new state-of-the-art AR title will be massive ;) https://www.harrypotterwizardsunite.com/en/ https://www.harrypotterwizardsunite.com/en/
- threeseed 8y ago
  Apple is spending billions (maybe even tens of billions) every year on AR/VR. Tim Cook has already said so and it's exemplified by some of their recent hires: https://variety.com/2018/digital/news/apple-cyber-paint-app-sterling-crispin-1202890174/ https://variety.com/2018/digital/news/apple-cyber-paint-app-...

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jakobegger 8y ago

I care a lot about the Mac, and I'm not sure what to think about the fact that Mac unit sales are down again. The Mac has been growing for a long time, and they seem to have reached a plateau. I assume that's the reason why Macs have became absurdly expensive in the last few years -- when they can't grow unit sales, they need to grow revenue per unit. The result is that Apple doesn't build the computer most of their potential customers want -- a $1000 Macbook. I understand that they don't care about the $300 netbook market, but not offering a decent $1000 laptop is a bad idea. It means they are going to loose consumers and students – there are decent alternatives at that price point. Or, people like me, who just keep using their old Macbooks because the high price of the new machines isn't worth the marginally improved performance. Where does this lead us? I don't see how the Mac should grow from here, and as a Mac software developer that worries me. I want to be in a growing market, not a stagnant one. I'm probably going to be okay for the next few years, but is the Mac still going to be a worthwhile platform for a small software company in 10-15 years? I don't know.

hindsightbias 8y ago
If half the devs clinging to their 2012-13 rMBP with missing keys and wire-exposed MagSafe cables would just get with the program and upgrade, sales would go thru the roof.
- iainmerrick 8y ago
  Build a decent laptop and they'll soon come around.
runwerks 8y ago
Keep in mind that this doesn't include the 'back to school' season...
- weliketocode 8y ago
  I could be very wrong here, but I'm not so sure Apple's customers want the $1000 macbook. Many mac users (and perhaps apple users in general) are the type of people willing to pay up for the top-of-the-line, latest-and-great, spare-no-expense tech gadget. I've seen this with companies giving their developers the maxed out mac + mac accessories. I've seen this with individuals who view their mac laptop as the biggest most important usage of their time. Where have you seen apple struggle because they were being undercut by competitors?

willwagner 8y ago

I believe around $199 a share is when AAPL would become the first company ever to have a market cap of $1T. It could happen tomorrow. For reference, the first $1B market cap company was US Steel in 1901.

bufferoverflow 8y ago
Well, if you inflation-adjust, there probably were $1 trillion companies.
- jonknee 8y ago
  There have been several. Saudi Aramco is one right now (and has been for some time), but it's not publicly traded. http://www.visualcapitalist.com/most-valuable-companies-all-time/ http://www.visualcapitalist.com/most-valuable-companies-all-...
techbio 8y ago
FYI: 6% per year
Bahamut 8y ago
I think it's supposed to be $203.48: https://business.financialpost.com/investing/apple-needs-an-8-6-rally-to-reach-1-trillion-milestone https://business.financialpost.com/investing/apple-needs-an-... (found via google search).
megy 8y ago
The first publicly traded company to have a market cap of $1T.
- coolwhhip 8y ago
  Don’t companies need to be publicly traded to have nonzero market cap by definition?

onetimemanytime 8y ago

Major congrats to them and to the late Jobs. I'd be in the Ballmer category... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qycUOENFIBs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qycUOENFIBs Making telcos "subsidize" it, must be right there with the "pay just the minimum on your credit card" business wise. Brilliant.

williesleg 8y ago

The only ones buying Macs are those stuck in the ecosystem. Not good, Timmy Cook.

mark_l_watson 8y ago

Great conversation thread here. I will add my bit: I have been an Apple customer since buying serial number 72 of the Apple II (and worked writing software for 45+ years). I love the iPad. I use Mac laptops for programming at work and my personal projects, but, I use my iPad for SSHing to my servers, reading, audio books, watch movies, research material for new books and technologies I want to learn, take online courses, write, etc. Yes, laptops are great for writing code, but much of my thinking time is done with an iPad. When I retire, I can imagine just using a remote VPS for recreational coding with whatever can get decent screen space and a keyboard for a few SSH shells, and everything else could be an iPad.

deepaksurti 8y ago
Can you recommend apps you use for SSH'ing to the servers? What do you use to write? I have just started with the Apple Pencil and love it, use Notability. Any recommendations here will help.
- jiqiren 8y ago
  http://www.blink.sh http://www.blink.sh <- so far the best terminal. Includes mosh support so you can sleep your iPad, switch between LTE/Wifi, etc - then later continue your terminal without interruption.
  - evgen 8y ago
    IMHO the absolute best thing about Blink is that it lets you use caps lock as control. Since doing this remapping on my laptop it is now a part of my muscle memory but no bluetooth keyboards support this in hardware and iOS does not support it in software; Blink manages to support this in the app and it makes my SSH sessions and remote editing so much easier.
  - mark_l_watson 8y ago
    Thanks, I will try Blink
- mark_l_watson 8y ago

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Tomminn 8y ago

Anyone else notice that after hours trading puts em a few mill shy of a trillion?

diminish 8y ago

iPhone Market share (~11%) and unit sales of iPhones are flat compared to last year on a no-growth market. Service and Mac sales seem to be dependent on iPhone sales. Quarter by quarter Apple turns into a one trick pony where most income depends on the success of their smartphone market share of ~15 +- 4%. If there were a novel approach to smartphones/mobile computing - Apple/iPhone would look a lot like RIM/Blackberry in 2010/2011 where sales and revenues (services) skyrocketed yet analysts were warning us. Yet there's to tech rising to kill smartphones. So Apple is safe for some years ahead. Welcome to trillion+ valuation AAPL.

ksec 8y ago
>Welcome to trillion+ valuation AAPL. The word welcome as if someone already has a trillion cap and welcome them. But in fact no one has done it, and even if they did by real dollar and for a short moment; There were one or two companies that touches the trillion market cap for a few hours / days and came back down. Apple may be the first one to truly worth it.
- diminish 8y ago
  Aren't there non public oil giants who're worth more? Like Saudi Aramco?

vivan 8y ago

The iPhone is a beast and a market leader - that is known, and shown in these results. The Mac however is in decline - Apple seem to have abandoned it in favour of their cash cow (as many on here have complained) and these results just further prove it.