6 ms·

I assume the WHO relies on local census & medical data to generate these statistics (the Reuters piece doesn't have a citation on ths) so I'd take this data wit

by drcode 8y ago

I assume the WHO relies on local census & medical data to generate these statistics (the Reuters piece doesn't have a citation on ths) so I'd take this data with a grain of salt until we hear more details about the methodology.

adventured 8y ago
I agree. Although, it also wouldn't be terribly surprising for China to pass the US on this metric. When you look at the obesity numbers: US 36%, New Zealand 31%, Canada 29%, Australia 29%, UK 28%, Israel 26%, Ireland 25% Thailand 10%, Indonesia 7%, China 6%, Philippines 6%, South Korea, 5%, Vietnam 2% Vietnam's life expectancy will overtake the US in the next 10-15 years as well most likely (they're about three years behind). In most cases if you prevent people from starving or suffering serious malnutrition, provide a basic level of healthcare & sanitation, and have single digit obesity levels, you'll almost automatically see 75-80 year life expectancies. South Korea's life expectancy went from 65 years, to 82 years currently, from just 1980 to 2015. They passed the US around 2003. South Korea's GDP per capita was $14,000 at that time, versus $40,000 for the US. One would expect China to have no problem replicating that. It's a small wonder life expectancies in the developed, high obesity countries are as high as they are. The US is no doubt expending hundreds of billions of dollars extra per year on healthcare as a consequence of its obesity level (cancer, disability, diabetes, etc).
- lallysingh 8y ago
  Oh and the absurd costs of healthcare in the US
- ams6110 8y ago
  Obesity seems to be a side effect of prosperity, so China will probably be next.
  - seanmcdirmid 8y ago
    小胖子 is already part of Chinese vocabulary, it is already happening in the cities, though nowhere near on an American scale.
  - saiya-jin 8y ago
    French or Swiss or nordic countries are prosperous long term, yet none of these issues apply. It really isn't as simple as -> prosperity -> obesity.
  - coldtea 8y ago
    Tell that to the Nordic countries.... Or to Californians...
- dv_dt 8y ago
  It's not just obesity that drives poor US life expectancy performance. Mexico's life expectancy is projected to rise meet the US life expectancy by 2030, and they're a nation with a fairly high obesity percentage. https://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/22/us-life-expectancy-is-low-and-is-now-projected-to-be-on-par-with-mexico-by-2030.html https://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/22/us-life-expectancy-is-low-an... We have to acknowledge that the lack of Universal Healthcare in the US is a big driver of our poor life expectancy showing.
  - adventured 8y ago
    Without question. The US for example had a higher life expectancy than New Zealand during the 1980s, then the US began to trail off and fall behind. Now it's ~2.7 years behind New Zealand. The US was also ahead of the UK as recently as 1983. What changed? A few big things. Healthcare in the US became wildly expensive after the 1980s, following an extreme cost increase far beyond inflation, whereas before it was not far out of line vs other developed nations (eg share of GDP spent on healthcare; today it's commonly 2x the next closest nations on cost). And obesity exploded dramatically higher after the early to mid 1980s. Diets overloaded with sugar, carbs, high fructose corn syrup in everything, drive thrus as a routine, etc. I do believe universal healthcare would have prevented that life expectancy gap from opening up between the US and the UK, Canada, New Zealand and Australia. Based on the expectancy increase path the US was on as recently as the early 1980s, it should be at 82-83 years now, rather than 78.x.
    - indemnity 8y ago
      I also found it interesting to see what the insurance companies predicted my lifespan will be given I was born in 1980, don’t smoke, am fit & live in New Zealand. Apparently the actuaries reckon I’ll make it to 91 and wife to 94.
  - ardent_uno 8y ago
    So Mexico has better healthcare for the average person than the US? Hardly. As mentioned elsewhere, overdoses are significantly impacting average lifespan figures.
- sonnyblarney 8y ago
  "When you look at the obesity numbers" ... Unfortunately, theses 'lifespan' measurements have a lot to do with violent crime, car accidents, suicides, war deaths etc. - i.e. things that aren't so much about health than otherwise. It's why average lifespan isn't necessarily a very good measure of health outcomes. I think US is down due to overdoses, which is a kind of health issues, but not necessarily a regular measure of diet and quality of regular medicine, it's an epidemic.
  - acou_nPlusOne_t 8y ago
    A epidemic, that without quarantine, is contained to the US only.
    - sonnyblarney 8y ago
      It's in Vancouver. And many other places.
  - seanmcdirmid 8y ago
    Heart disease is the biggest killer by far in the USA.
  - jewelry 8y ago
    legalization of weed is the worst decision IMO that not only affects the healthy life span but also intoxicate the next gen.
    - imjustsaying 8y ago
      how does cannabis affect healthy life span?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- jk2323 8y ago
  Well, Asians are a different race but they also eat more rice than wheat http://healthcorrelator.blogspot.com/2010/09/china-study-ii-wheat-flour-rice-and.html http://healthcorrelator.blogspot.com/2010/09/china-study-ii-...
phyzome 8y ago
Given the terrible state of US healthcare and social support infrastructure, I don't find this hard to believe at all.
- CryptoPunk 8y ago
  And China spends very little on healthcare, especially through its public sector: http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/Briefing-Note-CHINA-2014.pdf http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/Briefing-Note-CHINA-2... So other factors are probably responsible.
  - dis-sys 8y ago
    doctors in the west get paid top $, while Chinese dentists/doctors are getting paid much lower, e.g. far lower than PHP programmers.to give you a quick example: it costs up to $1,000-$2,000 to remove a bad wisdom tooth in Sydney, it is $20-30 in the biggest dentist hospital in Shanghai.
    - CryptoPunk 8y ago
      If you click the link you'll see that China has fewer doctors and nurses per capita: >>With 1.6 physicians per 1000 population in 2012, China had much fewer doctors per capita than the OECD average (3.2 physicians). The number of nurses per capita in China (1.8 nurses per 1000 population in 2012) is also much lower than the OECD average (8.8 nurses). As for the affordability of dental services, would you say that's an argument for deregulation and lowering of mandatory quality standards?
      - dis-sys 8y ago
        > China has fewer doctors and nurses per capita That explains why the public spending on healthcare is less - less doctors/nurses per capita, together with far less pay for doctors/nurses. the 1.6 doctors per 1000 population vs 3.2 in OECD countries is not a surprise, Chinese doctors have for decades been forced to work much longer hours. > As for the affordability of dental services, would you say that's an argument for deregulation and lowering of mandatory quality standards? It is the complete opposite - the cost is so low because they got over-regulated. The mind set of the government is that "dental issues are usually not life threatening, it thus shouldn't be expensive", all charges by public hospitals are exclusively set by the Price Bureau (Yes, there is Price Bureau!) and dental costs are just stupidly low.

by drcode 8y ago

adventured 8y ago

I agree. Although, it also wouldn't be terribly surprising for China to pass the US on this metric. When you look at the obesity numbers: US 36%, New Zealand 31%, Canada 29%, Australia 29%, UK 28%, Israel 26%, Ireland 25% Thailand 10%, Indonesia 7%, China 6%, Philippines 6%, South Korea, 5%, Vietnam 2% Vietnam's life expectancy will overtake the US in the next 10-15 years as well most likely (they're about three years behind). In most cases if you prevent people from starving or suffering serious malnutrition, provide a basic level of healthcare & sanitation, and have single digit obesity levels, you'll almost automatically see 75-80 year life expectancies. South Korea's life expectancy went from 65 years, to 82 years currently, from just 1980 to 2015. They passed the US around 2003. South Korea's GDP per capita was $14,000 at that time, versus $40,000 for the US. One would expect China to have no problem replicating that. It's a small wonder life expectancies in the developed, high obesity countries are as high as they are. The US is no doubt expending hundreds of billions of dollars extra per year on healthcare as a consequence of its obesity level (cancer, disability, diabetes, etc).

lallysingh 8y ago
Oh and the absurd costs of healthcare in the US
ams6110 8y ago
Obesity seems to be a side effect of prosperity, so China will probably be next.
- seanmcdirmid 8y ago
  小胖子 is already part of Chinese vocabulary, it is already happening in the cities, though nowhere near on an American scale.
- saiya-jin 8y ago
  French or Swiss or nordic countries are prosperous long term, yet none of these issues apply. It really isn't as simple as -> prosperity -> obesity.
- coldtea 8y ago
  Tell that to the Nordic countries.... Or to Californians...
dv_dt 8y ago
It's not just obesity that drives poor US life expectancy performance. Mexico's life expectancy is projected to rise meet the US life expectancy by 2030, and they're a nation with a fairly high obesity percentage. https://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/22/us-life-expectancy-is-low-and-is-now-projected-to-be-on-par-with-mexico-by-2030.html https://www.cnbc.com/2017/02/22/us-life-expectancy-is-low-an... We have to acknowledge that the lack of Universal Healthcare in the US is a big driver of our poor life expectancy showing.
- adventured 8y ago
  Without question. The US for example had a higher life expectancy than New Zealand during the 1980s, then the US began to trail off and fall behind. Now it's ~2.7 years behind New Zealand. The US was also ahead of the UK as recently as 1983. What changed? A few big things. Healthcare in the US became wildly expensive after the 1980s, following an extreme cost increase far beyond inflation, whereas before it was not far out of line vs other developed nations (eg share of GDP spent on healthcare; today it's commonly 2x the next closest nations on cost). And obesity exploded dramatically higher after the early to mid 1980s. Diets overloaded with sugar, carbs, high fructose corn syrup in everything, drive thrus as a routine, etc. I do believe universal healthcare would have prevented that life expectancy gap from opening up between the US and the UK, Canada, New Zealand and Australia. Based on the expectancy increase path the US was on as recently as the early 1980s, it should be at 82-83 years now, rather than 78.x.
  - indemnity 8y ago
    I also found it interesting to see what the insurance companies predicted my lifespan will be given I was born in 1980, don’t smoke, am fit & live in New Zealand. Apparently the actuaries reckon I’ll make it to 91 and wife to 94.
- ardent_uno 8y ago
  So Mexico has better healthcare for the average person than the US? Hardly. As mentioned elsewhere, overdoses are significantly impacting average lifespan figures.
sonnyblarney 8y ago
"When you look at the obesity numbers" ... Unfortunately, theses 'lifespan' measurements have a lot to do with violent crime, car accidents, suicides, war deaths etc. - i.e. things that aren't so much about health than otherwise. It's why average lifespan isn't necessarily a very good measure of health outcomes. I think US is down due to overdoses, which is a kind of health issues, but not necessarily a regular measure of diet and quality of regular medicine, it's an epidemic.
- acou_nPlusOne_t 8y ago
  A epidemic, that without quarantine, is contained to the US only.
  - sonnyblarney 8y ago
    It's in Vancouver. And many other places.
- seanmcdirmid 8y ago
  Heart disease is the biggest killer by far in the USA.
- jewelry 8y ago
  legalization of weed is the worst decision IMO that not only affects the healthy life span but also intoxicate the next gen.
  - imjustsaying 8y ago
    how does cannabis affect healthy life span?
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
jk2323 8y ago
Well, Asians are a different race but they also eat more rice than wheat http://healthcorrelator.blogspot.com/2010/09/china-study-ii-wheat-flour-rice-and.html http://healthcorrelator.blogspot.com/2010/09/china-study-ii-...

phyzome 8y ago

Given the terrible state of US healthcare and social support infrastructure, I don't find this hard to believe at all.

CryptoPunk 8y ago
And China spends very little on healthcare, especially through its public sector: http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/Briefing-Note-CHINA-2014.pdf http://www.oecd.org/els/health-systems/Briefing-Note-CHINA-2... So other factors are probably responsible.
- dis-sys 8y ago
  doctors in the west get paid top $, while Chinese dentists/doctors are getting paid much lower, e.g. far lower than PHP programmers.to give you a quick example: it costs up to $1,000-$2,000 to remove a bad wisdom tooth in Sydney, it is $20-30 in the biggest dentist hospital in Shanghai.
  - CryptoPunk 8y ago
    If you click the link you'll see that China has fewer doctors and nurses per capita: >>With 1.6 physicians per 1000 population in 2012, China had much fewer doctors per capita than the OECD average (3.2 physicians). The number of nurses per capita in China (1.8 nurses per 1000 population in 2012) is also much lower than the OECD average (8.8 nurses). As for the affordability of dental services, would you say that's an argument for deregulation and lowering of mandatory quality standards?
    - dis-sys 8y ago
      > China has fewer doctors and nurses per capita That explains why the public spending on healthcare is less - less doctors/nurses per capita, together with far less pay for doctors/nurses. the 1.6 doctors per 1000 population vs 3.2 in OECD countries is not a surprise, Chinese doctors have for decades been forced to work much longer hours. > As for the affordability of dental services, would you say that's an argument for deregulation and lowering of mandatory quality standards? It is the complete opposite - the cost is so low because they got over-regulated. The mind set of the government is that "dental issues are usually not life threatening, it thus shouldn't be expensive", all charges by public hospitals are exclusively set by the Price Bureau (Yes, there is Price Bureau!) and dental costs are just stupidly low.