12 ms·

'The Expanse' Canceled at Syfy

234 points by _o_ 8y ago

grizzles 8y ago
Welp. How do we save this show? I'll join any crowdfunding platform.
- orionblastar 8y ago
  They did the same to Firefly and Farscape, cancled them too soon before they could develop the characters more and close up loose ends. I like The Expanse and I will miss it. I've been meaning to write my own scifi books to be turned into movies. The Expanse was no Star Trek or Star Wars but it had a realistic feel to it.
  - kyriakos 8y ago
    It's one of the only space based sci-fi shows with mostly realistic physics.
    - summm 8y ago
      Only at the beginning. As soon as the protomolecule shows up, all the weird stuff comes back. Like, stargates, force fields, telepathy...
      - ygra 8y ago
        Well, for something extraterrestrial that has been sent to our system billions of years ago by an advanced civilization that cannot really be understood by humans, I guess artistic license is okay. The human stuff still works with mostly realistic physics (with the Epstein drive the main exception, which is needed to actually enable the world).
        kyriakos 8y ago
        And even with the epstein drive they still show acceleration and deceleration changing at the mid point of the journey. They don't have inertial dumpers like star trek invented to work around the issue.
        akvadrako 8y ago
        What do you mean? It's not like the ships "stop" when the drive is turned off.
        Robin_Message 8y ago
        It's implied they generate gravity on the ships by burning the engines* and the engines seem to burn all the time, so you can assume for half of every trip they are accelerating towards destination and the other half they are decelerating again. Orbital mechanics seems to only apply when convenient, e.g. an orbital mirror around a moon is damaged and "falls" straight down. I don't think that is accurate, even assuming the loss of atation-keeping thrust. * Not real gravity, but you can't tell the difference between gravity and acceleration. And they also account for high-G manoveurs being difficult/deadly for humans.
        akvadrako 8y ago
        Ah, I thought he was giving an argument why the Epstein drive was unrealistic, since his tone was agreeing with the parent.
      - TeMPOraL 8y ago
        Protomolecule stuff, though a key to about 1/3 of the plot points, is pretty much the only "out there" stuff in the show. So sure, it seems to break a few laws of physics, but the whole story is about humans using realistic technology confronted with the unknown and the impossible. Beyond that, the books are pretty hard. The only one physics-bending technology used by humans is the Epstein drive, and as a drive it doesn't really violate any laws of physics (it's a fusion drive) - the unrealistic part is its absurdly good fuel efficiency.
        ojilles 8y ago
        And even that was self-aware as in they did background scenes on its development (eg not just arm wavey)
      - akvadrako 8y ago
        Force fields are plausible, but FTL (including telepathy and stargates) are what ruins it. However, it's one big exception that almost all space-based sci-fi allows.
- bantunes 8y ago
  You can try requesting Netflix have them on for season 4 https://help.netflix.com/en/titlerequest https://help.netflix.com/en/titlerequest
  - aussiegeek 8y ago
    Bit of a chance there they might, considering they have the rights to it in at least Australia
  - techterrier 8y ago
    netflix have ruled themselves out already: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iyzrs/amazon_is_our_best_option_for_a_pick_up_lobby/ https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iyzrs/amazon_i...
  - AnssiH 8y ago
    I think the problem with that is that Amazon already has the US streaming SVOD rights, which Netflix would also need. That IMO makes Amazon the more likely party to purchase the US rights that Syfy had.
  - dragonwriter 8y ago
    Amazon has the rights Netflix would want, and Netflix isn't going to subsidize a property that is a competitive advantage for Amazon in the key market (and, conversely, Amazon would rather let the property die than let Netflix have the streaming rights.) So, if SyFy isn't going to carry the load, it's probably either Amazon taking over or it dies.
- jotm 8y ago
  See how that turned out for the Browncoats. Worst case scenario, at least there's awesome source material that you can read :)
  - DanBC 8y ago
    Firefly was 2002 / 2003, which was a bit too early for the online production companies. Netflix introduced streaming in 2007, and started content production in 2012. Something like Jericho or Firefly being cancelled today is much more likely to get picked up.
- huhtenberg 8y ago
  Better casting choices would've certainly helped. The acting of several lead actors is really bad. Avasarala (the "undersecretary"), Bobbie (the "marine"), Jim Holden - they all portray characters in a way that is utterly unconvincing. Every scene with Avasarala is a scene that can't end quick enough. She looks like a bad impostor. Bobbie is miscast so severely it's on par with the "bitchy teenager" Anakin from Ep2 and Ep3. Holden's facial expression for determination is that of a man about to cry. In fact, he looks like his dog just died in most of the scenes. The story and the universe is excellent, the rest of the cast is really good, but it's not enough to balance it all out.
  - kyriakos 8y ago
    I will agree about Bobby but Avasarala is by far one of the best characters. The best casting decision obviously is Thomas Jane's character.
    - huhtenberg 8y ago
      She looks like she's in a Bollywood movie. Over the top cocky confidence that's not really justified by anything that she is conveying through acting. Jane - yes, agreed. Excellent choice. Alex, Amos, Naomi are all good too.
      - Macha 8y ago
        I've only partially watched the series so far, but I have read the books. It's a key point of Avarasala's character that she is pretty competent (and lacking patience) as shes basically portrayed as the one running the show on Earth. That said, without the monologues and the comparison to the public power in the book, I can see how that goes way too far into arrogance.
  - IkmoIkmo 8y ago
    > Holden's facial expression for determination is that of a man about to cry. In fact, he looks like his dog just died in most of the scenes. Hahahaha, this is too true. Bobbie is also terrible. But Avasarala I thought was really well cast. But in general it felt like we got straight-to-dvd type D-level actors (think about crappy movies like The Human Race) in a B+ level setting (writing, CGI, set design etc). I was really confused at first as to whether this was a serious series with a relatively big budget for science fiction, or something that evolved out of a college film project. Never really knew what to think. Like, I enjoyed Miller as a character. But I also cringe everytime I see his fedora. It feels like they do a lot of the hard things right, but somehow go out of their way to mess up some of the easy things.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Spam Amazon. They seem to be the only major player who still could pick it up, given that Netflix apparently ruled itself out. Hell, spam Bezos himself. They're cancelling the show that literally explores the world Bezos wants to create.
kyriakos 8y ago
Netflix has worldwide rights except USA. Amazon has US streaming rights. The production is done by Alcon entertainment who should either find another network or convince one of the two streaming giants to foot the bill. I don't think it's not going to continue.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Alcon said they're looking into it. The next day, the news broke that sets are being scheduled for disassembly, starting tomorrow. So I'm not sure just how honest Alcon was with that announcement, given it was only two days between those two pieces of info. The current info from people involved seems to be that Netflix is most likely out as a candidate, but Amazon still might pick it up. (All of that sourced from /r/TheExpanse, which I read regularly.)
  - kyriakos 8y ago
    That's sad to hear hope it's just a false rumour
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      I'm really hoping it's Fake News, but the source is (apparently) the props master of the show[0]: Quoting for Facebook-averse: > We need to act fast. The sets are coming down starting Monday with some assets being sold off to Star Trek Discovery or just scrapped. > the entire crew in Toronto is heartbroken and gutted. It’s going to be hard to wrap the show for good. We all thought it was coming back for sure. It’s an incredible show to work on. When asked for source: > I’m the Props Master on the show for the past 3 seasons. In a comment to another post[1], he said: > I work on the show. Amazon was very interested in the project and wanted to stream it. They need a show like this. Netflix is out. Don’t waste your time. Amazon is our only hope. Lobby them. Hey need to know it will have a following. Show them it does!!!! -- [0] - https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/384700638715460/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/38... [1] - https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/384886505363540/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/38...
danr4 8y ago
Such a shame if it dies. I love the realism of the show - just humans making life hard for other humans. Worth noting the producers are trying to find someone else to pick up the show [0] EDIT: There's quite the effort on the show's subreddit to rally fans to ping major players like Netflix (who've pulled out apparently) and Amazon Studios [1]. Join the fight :) [0] https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the-expanse-but-its-producers-want-to-find-it-a-new-home/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the... [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iq1a0/renewal_megathread_earthers_martians_belters_we/ https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iq1a0/renewal_...
- hexo 8y ago
  Realism? Really? Who would setup blue backlight on everything in spacecraft (i'm talking about cliche blue-orange camera; and given toxicity of blue light)? Sound in space??? Protomolecule? uh. I really tried to watch last season; 't was impossibiru :(
- ianai 8y ago
  Whelp I contributed by buying the season and emailing Jeff. Here’s hoping.
techterrier 8y ago
love this show but it seems the commercial arrangements are a total mess with just about everyone having a small piece of it somewhere such that nobody made any money off it and nobody can give it up either. So nobody gets it after syfy predictably walked away. Infuriating shame.
- bencoder 8y ago
  In the UK netflix have the rights, but for some reason it doesn't show up on the service until months after the season has finished on syfy. Meaning most of my friends who have Netflix ended up pirating it. I waited until season 2 showed up on netflix last year, but if it's being cancelled anyway I don't see much point in waiting this year.
  - _stephan 8y ago
    People obtaining the show from other sources before it is released on Netflix might be a reason for the show not doing well enough on Netflix to be worth picking up. Plus the marketing probably was only half-hearted, since Netflix doesn't own the US streaming rights.
    - XorNot 8y ago
      Netflix need to ditch the binge format streaming and support weekly releases. That would let them do same-time as US releases globally, which would mean people could engage with the online communities of these shows.
      - Xylakant 8y ago
        Netflix does support weekly releases. The latest Star Trek for example was released weekly.
        caf 8y ago
        Yes, The Good Place came out weekly on Netflix too.
laurencei 8y ago
If you check out the show on Rotten Tomatos it has a tomato rating of 90% with an average audience score of 95%. That seems really high to then cancel the show? I'm guessing the problem is it is highly loved by a small group of individuals? But given Sci-Fi in general is a wide enough demographic for many other shows - it seems strange this is not drawing in the ratings? [1] https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/the_expanse/ https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/the_expanse/
- Hendrikto 8y ago
  Have you watched it? It’s not bad... but not really good either. Much better shows were cancelled in the past.
  - laurencei 8y ago
    Yes - personally I like it. But I'm trying to be objective and note the lack of correlation between a shows percevied quality and how that does/not translate into ratings.
    - wink 8y ago
      I was missing the "wow, awesome!" effect. Only watched S1 so far and it was.. nice. solid. interesting. But it didn't spark joy or made me a fan. (Killjoys did, for example.)
      - TeMPOraL 8y ago
        S2 has more "wow, awesome" than S1, and then the few S3 episodes that aired so far beat the crap out of S2. VFX work got better and better as the show progressed.
      - laumars 8y ago
        Everyone is different but S1 of The Expanse gave me more joy than any other show I've watched in a long time. While S1 did have its fair share of space battles, it was so nice watching something that wasn't all guns and fist fights and did so without having to resort to hours of dull pseudo-emotional monologues and barely relevant flashbacks. Usually that kind of highbrow writing is reserved for "who done it" style crime dramas. It was refreshing to watch that same formula applied to the sci-fi genre given how cheesy or needlessly "emo" the genre has been of late.
ddtaylor 8y ago
it's not common to see a TV show here on HN, what's different about this show?
- kchoudhu 8y ago
  There are few hard sci fi shows on television right now -- having this cancelled is a pretty big blow to a type of entertainment that a lot people on this board take very seriously.
- kyriakos 8y ago
  Good sci-fi, set in not very distant future. Mostly accurate space physics. Definitely appealing to HN demographic.
- StevePerkins 8y ago
  50% because it is a good hard-scifi show with a lot of fans here. 50% because the distribution licensing for this show places it in a vortex at the center of traditional cable, Netflix, and Amazon. Making it an interesting case to read tea leaves and discuss the future of programming between those platforms.
oaiey 8y ago
End of season 3 is a key decision point (the expanse in the expanse :)). Stop it there or finance another 6+ seasons. I really hate it, but it is the right point in time.
- gutnor 8y ago
  And there are still the books for the people that really want to follow. The divergence from the book are not big in season 1 and 2. I have not read the rest of the series, but there is a risk of change of tone of the series from close to realistic to more fantasy space opera setting.
  - oaiey 8y ago
    They are great. And it stays realistic. They even age significantly. Holden and the crew are in their fifties in the later books. However, IMHO the tone changes. But not from realistic to fantasy but from black noir to western to horror to military style story telling.
    - avian 8y ago
      I found weird alien physics tricks in later books well beyond realism. The “spaceship speed limit” thing in particular. My memory is a bit fuzzy, but I remember it was kind of inconsistent, applying to some objects and not the others as it fit the plot.
      - TeMPOraL 8y ago
        It was consistent AFAIR, though it dropped at least once during that book. For those who haven't read (spoiler), the "spaceship speed limit" refers to a particular region of artificial space, where there was an alien object whose defense mechanisms involved capturing everything moving faster than a set limit relative to it. That limit was adjusted by the object based on perceived danger, and if you happened to cross it, you'd be slowed down without any regard to what sudden high deceleration does to you. Personally, I liked the protomolecule stuff, and my biggest complain was that there's so little of it in the books. 90% of the writing involves bog-standard real physics, and the protomolecule trickery only shows up occasionally.
archi42 8y ago
Same news on other site [0] was posted last night but not upvoted (I believe). Most important aspect, which is not discussed by the Hollywood reporter: The cancellation decision by Syfy is said to be linked to the nature of its agreement for the series, which only gives the cable network first-run linear rights in the U.S. That puts an extraordinary amount of emphasis on live, linear viewing, which is inherently challenging for sci-fi/genre series that tend to draw the lion’s share of their audiences from digital/streaming [0] http://deadline.com/2018/05/the-expanse-canceled-syfy-after-three-seasons-to-be-shopped-1202388026/ http://deadline.com/2018/05/the-expanse-canceled-syfy-after-...
- SideburnsOfDoom 8y ago
  Which means that it's not on Netflix UK until about 6 months later, by which time fans of hard sci-fi have either lost interest, or found other ways to watch it which are counted in nobody's revenue stream. It sucks but it's true.
- jjoonathan 8y ago
  For instance, nobody who bought it through Amazon counted towards SyFy's numbers even though they certainly counted towards the profitability of production. The people who actually finance production (not SyFy) said this: > "... given the commercial and critical success of the show, we fully plan to pursue other opportunities for this terrific and original IP ..." (emphasis mine) so to my uninformed sensibilities SyFy dropping the show seems more like a distribution hickup than an existential threat. At least I hope that's the case.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    Two days after that (i.e. last night), it turned out that sets are being scheduled for deconstruction. So it is really an existential threat at this point (if they tear down the sets, it'll add a big up-front cost for any party that would like to pick the show up in the future).
    - jjoonathan 8y ago
lchengify 8y ago
> Season two, which returned more than a year later with a significant marketing push and a solid lead-in, was down 24 percent among total viewers and averaged 457,000 total viewers. That compares more to similar returns for Syfy's inexpensive co-productions like Dark Matter and Killjoys, than to the cabler's original scripted series like The Magicians and Happy. I'm a huge fan of both The Expanse and The Magicians, but if the above quote is true I can see where they're coming from. The Magicians is a far more accessible show than The Expanse, and if I have to decide where to stick marketing dollars I'm going to go with the show with the larger audience. Also, although I love The Expanse, it is not nearly as compelling as BSG or Firefly. When BSG came out 14 years ago it was really a singular experience in terms of cable TV. I would say something like Westworld follows more in the footsteps of BSG than The Expanse. And Firefly tapped into the same energy as Guardians of the Galaxy but 15 years too early. Overall, very sad but not surprised. At least the TV show got me reading the books...
- ghaff 8y ago
  Re: accessibility Many people on sites like this probably don’t appreciate the very limited ability and desire for most people to get into shows that effectively require serial viewing, careful watching, and even reading subreddits etc. to fully grok everything going on. I like this sort of show in principle and I’ll still get back from my current trip to having to get back into who everyone is and what’s going on assuming I bother with the series now canceled. Agree about BSG and I also like Westworld even with the issues I have. Firefly was a fun romp with appealing characters. I never found it especially good SF though.
ivanhoe 8y ago
Too bad, I really enjoyed how Shohreh Aghdashloo portrayed Avasarala, she made that character so much more interesting than it was in the books originally.
- Arete31415 8y ago
  She's one of those actresses like Jeanne Moreau...she could read the phone book and I would be entranced.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    I agree. I'm very happy I picked the books up only after watching S1 - that way, my mental image of Avasarala was sourced from the books, and all the lovely lines of that character were read with Shohreh's voice in my head.
- thousandautumns 8y ago
  Really? I thought Avasarala was one of the more interesting characters in the book
  - ivanhoe 8y ago
    She is, but somehow it really came to life after I've seen Shohreh Aghdashloo character. In books there's a lot of other powerful characters Naomi, Amos, Miller, Fred Johnson, but IMHO in series Avasarala totally steals the show.
transfire 8y ago
I have given up on TV shows. I imagine many others have too. I no longer bother to watch them until I know there is a completed story. Nothing worse than watching a show and it just ends on a cliff hanger never to be resolved because the show got canceled. I don't think production companies realize how much they hurt themselves in the long run, because they are too busy looking at short-term figures.
qwerty456127 8y ago
Definitely one of the best TV series ever.
Sharlin 8y ago
I like pretty much everything else about The Expanse, but honestly, the crew of the Rocinante are just... unsympathetic. Forgettable. They could basically be killed off and I wouldn't care. Seeing that they're (intentionally) a microcosm of the system at large, with better writing their interactions could meaningfully reflect and comment on the tensions between their homeworlds, while still making me care about them as individuals and, indeed, as a crew. Crisjen Avarasala is pretty much the only interesting main character in the show.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Book crew is better, I agree. But Avasarala IMO carries the show by herself. The casting is perfect here, and I'll miss her the most.
  - glass_of_water 8y ago
    If the book crew is better, I'd hate to see what the crew on the show is like. I've only read Leviathan Wakes so far, but I found most of the characters to be really flat. I think the book suffers from the same issue as many other books in the science fiction genre: there's so much focus on developing the setting that the characters are underdeveloped and seem very generic.
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      To each their own, but I personally didn't find the book characters flat in any way. They're developed just enough for my taste. But my view is that if I wanted to read a character development story, I'd pick up just about any other genre than science fiction. A romance novel, a crime novel, a drama novel, etc. I like my sci-fi when it's about something else than usual, mundane interpersonal drama that real life is so full of already.
    - gtaylor 8y ago
      You learn a whole lot about each of them in the later books. The first book is a slower start to the series.
TeMPOraL 8y ago
I'm really pissed off about this. It was a really good show, based on a good series of books. It's very rare to see hard sci-fi in television, much less one appealing to a wide audience. Also the VFX team deserves a shout out here, as they managed to keep almost all visual effects physically accurate, including sneaking in scientific details at points you wouldn't ordinarily notice (like things heating up far behind invisible drive plume, sparks moving correctly on a spinning station or inside a maneuvering ship, etc.). From what I hear, the last hope is for Amazon to pick it up. Netflix apparently is not interested. If this show gets cancelled, this will be a huge blow to both sci-fi on TV, and efforts to keep people interested in realistic space exploration.
- oliyoung 8y ago
  You know, everything you said could've been said about Battlestar Galactica and that ended almost a decade ago ...
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    Yup, and we went a decade without a good space show. But not really everything applies. BSG - which I absolutely love - wasn't based on a series of good books, wasn't hard sci-fi, and didn't have a VFX team doing their best to stick to real physics.
  - Krasnol 8y ago
    The difference here is that the story of Expanse is rather mediocre and the acting is partially just bad. I had the feeling like I had to chew through the first season. Not sure if I should even bother with the second. VFX is not enough. At least not for TV.
    - 1stcity3rdcoast 8y ago
      Agree. It just wasn’t quality television. Which is par for the course for SciFi original shows - mediocre acting, sophomoric writing, okay visuals but not enough to keep me hooked after I slogged through the first few episodes.
hawski 8y ago
That's why I prefer watching short serials like Band of Brothers or just straight series like Columbo or Star Trek. Nowadays everyone wants to grab your full attention so they produce serials. When you're finally hooked on the story thanks to the neverending thread mill of cliff hangers and further unresolved mysteries they drop the show and leave you hanging. Because numbers ain't right, they show the audience the middle finger. The audience is upset, but not enough to recognize a vicious cycle that hurt them previously many times. That's one of the reasons I don't intend to watch the new Star Trek serial. Or will watch a serial after it is naturally finished.
- deleted 8y ago
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- blensor 8y ago
  Maybe I am already too old, but a while ago I've learned that disappointment about something not being resolved is just part of life and it's better to look forward about what other things are too come than to be too upset that things don't go on as is forever. If you want a happy ending, that depends, of course, on where you stop your story. - Orson Welles
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago
  I too miss the self-contained-episode quality of TV shows. It gave viewers the ability to jump in and leave at any point in the series and still be able to follow what was going on (usually). And is it just me or do these modern serials just seem to stretch everything out to fill the season? I think that's part of what makes them un-re-watchable, because in most episodes basically nothing happens. Some shows demonstrated that you can balance long-term plot arcs with the self-contained episode format really well, and I wish more shows would do that. One that comes immediately to mind is Stargate.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    Yup. Stargate was perfect. I don't like series with fully self-contained episodes, because those tend to not have any overarching plot. But I also don't like the new trend of running as many plot points as you can in parallel, which don't get resolved for half a season. I think StarGate got the right balance (and I miss the show very much).
neals 8y ago
Netflix, do the right thing
eponeponepon 8y ago
I'm actually not too cut up about this - I really enjoy the show, but I'm also starting to get tired of series that get run into the ground long after they should have been tied off and finished. If the third season has a decent ending, I'll be happy.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  While I feel similarly in general, I don't think this was a risk in this particular case. The show is backed by the books, which have enough high-quality source material to last another 4-6 seasons. As long as they kept mostly sticking to that, I wouldn't worry about the quality.
DrBazza 8y ago
Hopefully Netflix picks this up - especially when the new series of Lost in Space is just full of idiotic decisions to line up the next absurd episode, and Altered Carbon plods along at a snails pace and uses nudity to gloss over the dull bits. The Expanse is the best sci-fi series on TV by far at the moment, especially due to it having a good plot, a sweary UN woman, and mostly obeys the laws of physics. The Siffy channel is rubbish anyway. Netfix has more sci-fi to watch.
- enraged_camel 8y ago
  Altered Carbon is excellent. It’s also a very different kind of show; more of a crime-drama that takes place in the far future than an actual sci-fi show.
  - matwood 8y ago
    Agreed on Altered Carbon. Some of the nudity is gratuitous, but most is not. I know the clone room scene was on some of the news sites, but why wouldn’t clones be naked? In a future where sleeves are changeable vessels, I would expect nudity, body image, etc... to be very different from today’s values.
    - antisthenes 8y ago
      Today's American values. The attitudes toward nudity are different even today.
  - imglorp 8y ago
    Yup, and based on decent writing (books). (Spoilers) I especially like how all the implications of the few base assertions are being explored: renting bodies to visit with dead relatives, class separation, immortality and untouchable lawlessness for the rich, on and on. Just well done.
    - Faark 8y ago
      The show actually felt quite shallow to me, like it focused entertaining over presenting a coherent world. E.g. I'd expect to see identical cheap mass produced body running around everywhere. I more fondly remember the near two decade old ghost in the shell fancies, especially for it's time. But then I don't plan to go back and may ruin my memory of it by re-watching.
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shmerl 8y ago
TL;DR: Obsolete distribution methods hamper creators. SyFy can't distribute the series through the Internet directly to viewers for some weird reason, and it prevents them from making a profit. I don't quite get why they had to sign such weird contracts to begin with.
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  > TL;DR: Obsolete distribution methods hamper creators. If by that you mean cable TV, apparently Amazon wouldn't pay for the full cost of the show (or even enough with Netflix buying non-Us streaming rights), so it wasn't for SyFy being will to pay (apparently, too much, ultimately) for the rights to distribute it via an obsolete method, it wouldn't have been produced at all. > SyFy can't distribute the series through the Internet directly to viewers for some weird reason “Amazon has purchased the exclusive rights to do that (in the US, Netflix elsewhere)” is not a particularly weird reason. The problem here isn't obsolete distribution mechanisms, it's that the sum total people are willing to pay for it is less than the people that make it are willing to accept to keep making it.
  - shmerl 8y ago
    See here: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the-expanse-but-its-producers-want-to-find-it-a-new-home/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the... > The Expanse, based on a series of popular novels by a duo of authors who write under the pen name James S.A. Corey, was critically acclaimed and beloved by fans, but it was expensive to produce, it delivered poor on-air ratings, and critically, Syfy had only first-run linear rights. In other words, the network did not have the OTT (over-the-top: streaming and other digital distribution as opposed to broadcast air) rights. For a show like The Expanse, OTT viewing is key for long-term revenue. The show was only made available on cable television or by purchasing episodes or season passes on digital storefronts like iTunes and Amazon. > is not a particularly weird reason. I'd say it is. Exclusivity harms creators and users too, who can't access the result in stores and ways that are convenient to them. In the ideal world, Alcon Entertainment would make the series and sell it in every Internet store, including their own DRM-free option :) > that the sum total people are willing to pay for it is less than the people that make it are willing to accept to keep making it. No, people are willing to pay enough, but distributors should stop hampering competition with exclusivity restrictions. No exclusivity means wider reach, which means more profit for creators to do their work.
YeGoblynQueenne 8y ago
>> That limited the upside for the cable network, making live and linear viewership imperative. I have no idea what all that means. Could someone please translate?
scanr 8y ago
I hope Netflix picks this up. I really enjoy the Expanse.
sjg007 8y ago
A spin off show based on Detective Miller would be awesome.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  I'd much prefer a spin off show based on the Investigator (not introduced in series yet, but I think about to be in E7) ;). But I would love a Miller series too. Most of all though, I'd love an Avasarala spinoff.
imagetic 8y ago
Well this sucks.
alexeiz 8y ago
'The Expanse' went from really exciting in the first season to really boring in the second season. I watched the whole first season at once, but couldn't handle a single episode of the second season.

234 points by _o_ 8y ago

grizzles 8y ago

Welp. How do we save this show? I'll join any crowdfunding platform.

orionblastar 8y ago
They did the same to Firefly and Farscape, cancled them too soon before they could develop the characters more and close up loose ends. I like The Expanse and I will miss it. I've been meaning to write my own scifi books to be turned into movies. The Expanse was no Star Trek or Star Wars but it had a realistic feel to it.
- kyriakos 8y ago
  It's one of the only space based sci-fi shows with mostly realistic physics.
  - summm 8y ago
    Only at the beginning. As soon as the protomolecule shows up, all the weird stuff comes back. Like, stargates, force fields, telepathy...
    - ygra 8y ago
      Well, for something extraterrestrial that has been sent to our system billions of years ago by an advanced civilization that cannot really be understood by humans, I guess artistic license is okay. The human stuff still works with mostly realistic physics (with the Epstein drive the main exception, which is needed to actually enable the world).
      - kyriakos 8y ago
        And even with the epstein drive they still show acceleration and deceleration changing at the mid point of the journey. They don't have inertial dumpers like star trek invented to work around the issue.
        akvadrako 8y ago
        What do you mean? It's not like the ships "stop" when the drive is turned off.
        Robin_Message 8y ago
        It's implied they generate gravity on the ships by burning the engines* and the engines seem to burn all the time, so you can assume for half of every trip they are accelerating towards destination and the other half they are decelerating again. Orbital mechanics seems to only apply when convenient, e.g. an orbital mirror around a moon is damaged and "falls" straight down. I don't think that is accurate, even assuming the loss of atation-keeping thrust. * Not real gravity, but you can't tell the difference between gravity and acceleration. And they also account for high-G manoveurs being difficult/deadly for humans.
        akvadrako 8y ago
        Ah, I thought he was giving an argument why the Epstein drive was unrealistic, since his tone was agreeing with the parent.
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      Protomolecule stuff, though a key to about 1/3 of the plot points, is pretty much the only "out there" stuff in the show. So sure, it seems to break a few laws of physics, but the whole story is about humans using realistic technology confronted with the unknown and the impossible. Beyond that, the books are pretty hard. The only one physics-bending technology used by humans is the Epstein drive, and as a drive it doesn't really violate any laws of physics (it's a fusion drive) - the unrealistic part is its absurdly good fuel efficiency.
      - ojilles 8y ago
        And even that was self-aware as in they did background scenes on its development (eg not just arm wavey)
    - akvadrako 8y ago
      Force fields are plausible, but FTL (including telepathy and stargates) are what ruins it. However, it's one big exception that almost all space-based sci-fi allows.
bantunes 8y ago
You can try requesting Netflix have them on for season 4 https://help.netflix.com/en/titlerequest https://help.netflix.com/en/titlerequest
- aussiegeek 8y ago
  Bit of a chance there they might, considering they have the rights to it in at least Australia
- techterrier 8y ago
  netflix have ruled themselves out already: https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iyzrs/amazon_is_our_best_option_for_a_pick_up_lobby/ https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iyzrs/amazon_i...
- AnssiH 8y ago
  I think the problem with that is that Amazon already has the US streaming SVOD rights, which Netflix would also need. That IMO makes Amazon the more likely party to purchase the US rights that Syfy had.
- dragonwriter 8y ago
  Amazon has the rights Netflix would want, and Netflix isn't going to subsidize a property that is a competitive advantage for Amazon in the key market (and, conversely, Amazon would rather let the property die than let Netflix have the streaming rights.) So, if SyFy isn't going to carry the load, it's probably either Amazon taking over or it dies.
jotm 8y ago
See how that turned out for the Browncoats. Worst case scenario, at least there's awesome source material that you can read :)
- DanBC 8y ago
  Firefly was 2002 / 2003, which was a bit too early for the online production companies. Netflix introduced streaming in 2007, and started content production in 2012. Something like Jericho or Firefly being cancelled today is much more likely to get picked up.
huhtenberg 8y ago
Better casting choices would've certainly helped. The acting of several lead actors is really bad. Avasarala (the "undersecretary"), Bobbie (the "marine"), Jim Holden - they all portray characters in a way that is utterly unconvincing. Every scene with Avasarala is a scene that can't end quick enough. She looks like a bad impostor. Bobbie is miscast so severely it's on par with the "bitchy teenager" Anakin from Ep2 and Ep3. Holden's facial expression for determination is that of a man about to cry. In fact, he looks like his dog just died in most of the scenes. The story and the universe is excellent, the rest of the cast is really good, but it's not enough to balance it all out.
- kyriakos 8y ago
  I will agree about Bobby but Avasarala is by far one of the best characters. The best casting decision obviously is Thomas Jane's character.
  - huhtenberg 8y ago
    She looks like she's in a Bollywood movie. Over the top cocky confidence that's not really justified by anything that she is conveying through acting. Jane - yes, agreed. Excellent choice. Alex, Amos, Naomi are all good too.
    - Macha 8y ago
      I've only partially watched the series so far, but I have read the books. It's a key point of Avarasala's character that she is pretty competent (and lacking patience) as shes basically portrayed as the one running the show on Earth. That said, without the monologues and the comparison to the public power in the book, I can see how that goes way too far into arrogance.
- IkmoIkmo 8y ago
  > Holden's facial expression for determination is that of a man about to cry. In fact, he looks like his dog just died in most of the scenes. Hahahaha, this is too true. Bobbie is also terrible. But Avasarala I thought was really well cast. But in general it felt like we got straight-to-dvd type D-level actors (think about crappy movies like The Human Race) in a B+ level setting (writing, CGI, set design etc). I was really confused at first as to whether this was a serious series with a relatively big budget for science fiction, or something that evolved out of a college film project. Never really knew what to think. Like, I enjoyed Miller as a character. But I also cringe everytime I see his fedora. It feels like they do a lot of the hard things right, but somehow go out of their way to mess up some of the easy things.
TeMPOraL 8y ago
Spam Amazon. They seem to be the only major player who still could pick it up, given that Netflix apparently ruled itself out. Hell, spam Bezos himself. They're cancelling the show that literally explores the world Bezos wants to create.

kyriakos 8y ago

Netflix has worldwide rights except USA. Amazon has US streaming rights. The production is done by Alcon entertainment who should either find another network or convince one of the two streaming giants to foot the bill. I don't think it's not going to continue.

TeMPOraL 8y ago
Alcon said they're looking into it. The next day, the news broke that sets are being scheduled for disassembly, starting tomorrow. So I'm not sure just how honest Alcon was with that announcement, given it was only two days between those two pieces of info. The current info from people involved seems to be that Netflix is most likely out as a candidate, but Amazon still might pick it up. (All of that sourced from /r/TheExpanse, which I read regularly.)
- kyriakos 8y ago
  That's sad to hear hope it's just a false rumour
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    I'm really hoping it's Fake News, but the source is (apparently) the props master of the show[0]: Quoting for Facebook-averse: > We need to act fast. The sets are coming down starting Monday with some assets being sold off to Star Trek Discovery or just scrapped. > the entire crew in Toronto is heartbroken and gutted. It’s going to be hard to wrap the show for good. We all thought it was coming back for sure. It’s an incredible show to work on. When asked for source: > I’m the Props Master on the show for the past 3 seasons. In a comment to another post[1], he said: > I work on the show. Amazon was very interested in the project and wanted to stream it. They need a show like this. Netflix is out. Don’t waste your time. Amazon is our only hope. Lobby them. Hey need to know it will have a following. Show them it does!!!! -- [0] - https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/384700638715460/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/38... [1] - https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/384886505363540/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/154567691728757/permalink/38...

danr4 8y ago

Such a shame if it dies. I love the realism of the show - just humans making life hard for other humans. Worth noting the producers are trying to find someone else to pick up the show [0] EDIT: There's quite the effort on the show's subreddit to rally fans to ping major players like Netflix (who've pulled out apparently) and Amazon Studios [1]. Join the fight :) [0] https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the-expanse-but-its-producers-want-to-find-it-a-new-home/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the... [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iq1a0/renewal_megathread_earthers_martians_belters_we/ https://www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/8iq1a0/renewal_...

hexo 8y ago
Realism? Really? Who would setup blue backlight on everything in spacecraft (i'm talking about cliche blue-orange camera; and given toxicity of blue light)? Sound in space??? Protomolecule? uh. I really tried to watch last season; 't was impossibiru :(
ianai 8y ago
Whelp I contributed by buying the season and emailing Jeff. Here’s hoping.

techterrier 8y ago

love this show but it seems the commercial arrangements are a total mess with just about everyone having a small piece of it somewhere such that nobody made any money off it and nobody can give it up either. So nobody gets it after syfy predictably walked away. Infuriating shame.

bencoder 8y ago
In the UK netflix have the rights, but for some reason it doesn't show up on the service until months after the season has finished on syfy. Meaning most of my friends who have Netflix ended up pirating it. I waited until season 2 showed up on netflix last year, but if it's being cancelled anyway I don't see much point in waiting this year.
- _stephan 8y ago
  People obtaining the show from other sources before it is released on Netflix might be a reason for the show not doing well enough on Netflix to be worth picking up. Plus the marketing probably was only half-hearted, since Netflix doesn't own the US streaming rights.
  - XorNot 8y ago
    Netflix need to ditch the binge format streaming and support weekly releases. That would let them do same-time as US releases globally, which would mean people could engage with the online communities of these shows.
    - Xylakant 8y ago
      Netflix does support weekly releases. The latest Star Trek for example was released weekly.
      - caf 8y ago
        Yes, The Good Place came out weekly on Netflix too.

laurencei 8y ago

If you check out the show on Rotten Tomatos it has a tomato rating of 90% with an average audience score of 95%. That seems really high to then cancel the show? I'm guessing the problem is it is highly loved by a small group of individuals? But given Sci-Fi in general is a wide enough demographic for many other shows - it seems strange this is not drawing in the ratings? [1] https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/the_expanse/ https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/the_expanse/

Hendrikto 8y ago
Have you watched it? It’s not bad... but not really good either. Much better shows were cancelled in the past.
- laurencei 8y ago
  Yes - personally I like it. But I'm trying to be objective and note the lack of correlation between a shows percevied quality and how that does/not translate into ratings.
  - wink 8y ago
    I was missing the "wow, awesome!" effect. Only watched S1 so far and it was.. nice. solid. interesting. But it didn't spark joy or made me a fan. (Killjoys did, for example.)
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      S2 has more "wow, awesome" than S1, and then the few S3 episodes that aired so far beat the crap out of S2. VFX work got better and better as the show progressed.
    - laumars 8y ago
      Everyone is different but S1 of The Expanse gave me more joy than any other show I've watched in a long time. While S1 did have its fair share of space battles, it was so nice watching something that wasn't all guns and fist fights and did so without having to resort to hours of dull pseudo-emotional monologues and barely relevant flashbacks. Usually that kind of highbrow writing is reserved for "who done it" style crime dramas. It was refreshing to watch that same formula applied to the sci-fi genre given how cheesy or needlessly "emo" the genre has been of late.

ddtaylor 8y ago

it's not common to see a TV show here on HN, what's different about this show?

kchoudhu 8y ago
There are few hard sci fi shows on television right now -- having this cancelled is a pretty big blow to a type of entertainment that a lot people on this board take very seriously.
kyriakos 8y ago
Good sci-fi, set in not very distant future. Mostly accurate space physics. Definitely appealing to HN demographic.
StevePerkins 8y ago
50% because it is a good hard-scifi show with a lot of fans here. 50% because the distribution licensing for this show places it in a vortex at the center of traditional cable, Netflix, and Amazon. Making it an interesting case to read tea leaves and discuss the future of programming between those platforms.

oaiey 8y ago

End of season 3 is a key decision point (the expanse in the expanse :)). Stop it there or finance another 6+ seasons. I really hate it, but it is the right point in time.

gutnor 8y ago
And there are still the books for the people that really want to follow. The divergence from the book are not big in season 1 and 2. I have not read the rest of the series, but there is a risk of change of tone of the series from close to realistic to more fantasy space opera setting.
- oaiey 8y ago
  They are great. And it stays realistic. They even age significantly. Holden and the crew are in their fifties in the later books. However, IMHO the tone changes. But not from realistic to fantasy but from black noir to western to horror to military style story telling.
  - avian 8y ago
    I found weird alien physics tricks in later books well beyond realism. The “spaceship speed limit” thing in particular. My memory is a bit fuzzy, but I remember it was kind of inconsistent, applying to some objects and not the others as it fit the plot.
    - TeMPOraL 8y ago
      It was consistent AFAIR, though it dropped at least once during that book. For those who haven't read (spoiler), the "spaceship speed limit" refers to a particular region of artificial space, where there was an alien object whose defense mechanisms involved capturing everything moving faster than a set limit relative to it. That limit was adjusted by the object based on perceived danger, and if you happened to cross it, you'd be slowed down without any regard to what sudden high deceleration does to you. Personally, I liked the protomolecule stuff, and my biggest complain was that there's so little of it in the books. 90% of the writing involves bog-standard real physics, and the protomolecule trickery only shows up occasionally.

archi42 8y ago

Same news on other site [0] was posted last night but not upvoted (I believe). Most important aspect, which is not discussed by the Hollywood reporter: The cancellation decision by Syfy is said to be linked to the nature of its agreement for the series, which only gives the cable network first-run linear rights in the U.S. That puts an extraordinary amount of emphasis on live, linear viewing, which is inherently challenging for sci-fi/genre series that tend to draw the lion’s share of their audiences from digital/streaming [0] http://deadline.com/2018/05/the-expanse-canceled-syfy-after-three-seasons-to-be-shopped-1202388026/ http://deadline.com/2018/05/the-expanse-canceled-syfy-after-...

SideburnsOfDoom 8y ago
Which means that it's not on Netflix UK until about 6 months later, by which time fans of hard sci-fi have either lost interest, or found other ways to watch it which are counted in nobody's revenue stream. It sucks but it's true.
jjoonathan 8y ago
For instance, nobody who bought it through Amazon counted towards SyFy's numbers even though they certainly counted towards the profitability of production. The people who actually finance production (not SyFy) said this: > "... given the commercial and critical success of the show, we fully plan to pursue other opportunities for this terrific and original IP ..." (emphasis mine) so to my uninformed sensibilities SyFy dropping the show seems more like a distribution hickup than an existential threat. At least I hope that's the case.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Two days after that (i.e. last night), it turned out that sets are being scheduled for deconstruction. So it is really an existential threat at this point (if they tear down the sets, it'll add a big up-front cost for any party that would like to pick the show up in the future).
  - jjoonathan 8y ago

lchengify 8y ago

> Season two, which returned more than a year later with a significant marketing push and a solid lead-in, was down 24 percent among total viewers and averaged 457,000 total viewers. That compares more to similar returns for Syfy's inexpensive co-productions like Dark Matter and Killjoys, than to the cabler's original scripted series like The Magicians and Happy. I'm a huge fan of both The Expanse and The Magicians, but if the above quote is true I can see where they're coming from. The Magicians is a far more accessible show than The Expanse, and if I have to decide where to stick marketing dollars I'm going to go with the show with the larger audience. Also, although I love The Expanse, it is not nearly as compelling as BSG or Firefly. When BSG came out 14 years ago it was really a singular experience in terms of cable TV. I would say something like Westworld follows more in the footsteps of BSG than The Expanse. And Firefly tapped into the same energy as Guardians of the Galaxy but 15 years too early. Overall, very sad but not surprised. At least the TV show got me reading the books...

ghaff 8y ago
Re: accessibility Many people on sites like this probably don’t appreciate the very limited ability and desire for most people to get into shows that effectively require serial viewing, careful watching, and even reading subreddits etc. to fully grok everything going on. I like this sort of show in principle and I’ll still get back from my current trip to having to get back into who everyone is and what’s going on assuming I bother with the series now canceled. Agree about BSG and I also like Westworld even with the issues I have. Firefly was a fun romp with appealing characters. I never found it especially good SF though.

ivanhoe 8y ago

Too bad, I really enjoyed how Shohreh Aghdashloo portrayed Avasarala, she made that character so much more interesting than it was in the books originally.

Arete31415 8y ago
She's one of those actresses like Jeanne Moreau...she could read the phone book and I would be entranced.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  I agree. I'm very happy I picked the books up only after watching S1 - that way, my mental image of Avasarala was sourced from the books, and all the lovely lines of that character were read with Shohreh's voice in my head.
thousandautumns 8y ago
Really? I thought Avasarala was one of the more interesting characters in the book
- ivanhoe 8y ago
  She is, but somehow it really came to life after I've seen Shohreh Aghdashloo character. In books there's a lot of other powerful characters Naomi, Amos, Miller, Fred Johnson, but IMHO in series Avasarala totally steals the show.

transfire 8y ago

I have given up on TV shows. I imagine many others have too. I no longer bother to watch them until I know there is a completed story. Nothing worse than watching a show and it just ends on a cliff hanger never to be resolved because the show got canceled. I don't think production companies realize how much they hurt themselves in the long run, because they are too busy looking at short-term figures.

qwerty456127 8y ago

Definitely one of the best TV series ever.

Sharlin 8y ago

I like pretty much everything else about The Expanse, but honestly, the crew of the Rocinante are just... unsympathetic. Forgettable. They could basically be killed off and I wouldn't care. Seeing that they're (intentionally) a microcosm of the system at large, with better writing their interactions could meaningfully reflect and comment on the tensions between their homeworlds, while still making me care about them as individuals and, indeed, as a crew. Crisjen Avarasala is pretty much the only interesting main character in the show.

TeMPOraL 8y ago
Book crew is better, I agree. But Avasarala IMO carries the show by herself. The casting is perfect here, and I'll miss her the most.
- glass_of_water 8y ago
  If the book crew is better, I'd hate to see what the crew on the show is like. I've only read Leviathan Wakes so far, but I found most of the characters to be really flat. I think the book suffers from the same issue as many other books in the science fiction genre: there's so much focus on developing the setting that the characters are underdeveloped and seem very generic.
  - TeMPOraL 8y ago
    To each their own, but I personally didn't find the book characters flat in any way. They're developed just enough for my taste. But my view is that if I wanted to read a character development story, I'd pick up just about any other genre than science fiction. A romance novel, a crime novel, a drama novel, etc. I like my sci-fi when it's about something else than usual, mundane interpersonal drama that real life is so full of already.
  - gtaylor 8y ago
    You learn a whole lot about each of them in the later books. The first book is a slower start to the series.

TeMPOraL 8y ago

I'm really pissed off about this. It was a really good show, based on a good series of books. It's very rare to see hard sci-fi in television, much less one appealing to a wide audience. Also the VFX team deserves a shout out here, as they managed to keep almost all visual effects physically accurate, including sneaking in scientific details at points you wouldn't ordinarily notice (like things heating up far behind invisible drive plume, sparks moving correctly on a spinning station or inside a maneuvering ship, etc.). From what I hear, the last hope is for Amazon to pick it up. Netflix apparently is not interested. If this show gets cancelled, this will be a huge blow to both sci-fi on TV, and efforts to keep people interested in realistic space exploration.

oliyoung 8y ago
You know, everything you said could've been said about Battlestar Galactica and that ended almost a decade ago ...
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Yup, and we went a decade without a good space show. But not really everything applies. BSG - which I absolutely love - wasn't based on a series of good books, wasn't hard sci-fi, and didn't have a VFX team doing their best to stick to real physics.
- Krasnol 8y ago
  The difference here is that the story of Expanse is rather mediocre and the acting is partially just bad. I had the feeling like I had to chew through the first season. Not sure if I should even bother with the second. VFX is not enough. At least not for TV.
  - 1stcity3rdcoast 8y ago
    Agree. It just wasn’t quality television. Which is par for the course for SciFi original shows - mediocre acting, sophomoric writing, okay visuals but not enough to keep me hooked after I slogged through the first few episodes.

hawski 8y ago

That's why I prefer watching short serials like Band of Brothers or just straight series like Columbo or Star Trek. Nowadays everyone wants to grab your full attention so they produce serials. When you're finally hooked on the story thanks to the neverending thread mill of cliff hangers and further unresolved mysteries they drop the show and leave you hanging. Because numbers ain't right, they show the audience the middle finger. The audience is upset, but not enough to recognize a vicious cycle that hurt them previously many times. That's one of the reasons I don't intend to watch the new Star Trek serial. Or will watch a serial after it is naturally finished.

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blensor 8y ago
Maybe I am already too old, but a while ago I've learned that disappointment about something not being resolved is just part of life and it's better to look forward about what other things are too come than to be too upset that things don't go on as is forever. If you want a happy ending, that depends, of course, on where you stop your story. - Orson Welles
AnIdiotOnTheNet 8y ago
I too miss the self-contained-episode quality of TV shows. It gave viewers the ability to jump in and leave at any point in the series and still be able to follow what was going on (usually). And is it just me or do these modern serials just seem to stretch everything out to fill the season? I think that's part of what makes them un-re-watchable, because in most episodes basically nothing happens. Some shows demonstrated that you can balance long-term plot arcs with the self-contained episode format really well, and I wish more shows would do that. One that comes immediately to mind is Stargate.
- TeMPOraL 8y ago
  Yup. Stargate was perfect. I don't like series with fully self-contained episodes, because those tend to not have any overarching plot. But I also don't like the new trend of running as many plot points as you can in parallel, which don't get resolved for half a season. I think StarGate got the right balance (and I miss the show very much).

neals 8y ago

Netflix, do the right thing

eponeponepon 8y ago

I'm actually not too cut up about this - I really enjoy the show, but I'm also starting to get tired of series that get run into the ground long after they should have been tied off and finished. If the third season has a decent ending, I'll be happy.

TeMPOraL 8y ago
While I feel similarly in general, I don't think this was a risk in this particular case. The show is backed by the books, which have enough high-quality source material to last another 4-6 seasons. As long as they kept mostly sticking to that, I wouldn't worry about the quality.

DrBazza 8y ago

Hopefully Netflix picks this up - especially when the new series of Lost in Space is just full of idiotic decisions to line up the next absurd episode, and Altered Carbon plods along at a snails pace and uses nudity to gloss over the dull bits. The Expanse is the best sci-fi series on TV by far at the moment, especially due to it having a good plot, a sweary UN woman, and mostly obeys the laws of physics. The Siffy channel is rubbish anyway. Netfix has more sci-fi to watch.

enraged_camel 8y ago
Altered Carbon is excellent. It’s also a very different kind of show; more of a crime-drama that takes place in the far future than an actual sci-fi show.
- matwood 8y ago
  Agreed on Altered Carbon. Some of the nudity is gratuitous, but most is not. I know the clone room scene was on some of the news sites, but why wouldn’t clones be naked? In a future where sleeves are changeable vessels, I would expect nudity, body image, etc... to be very different from today’s values.
  - antisthenes 8y ago
    Today's American values. The attitudes toward nudity are different even today.
- imglorp 8y ago
  Yup, and based on decent writing (books). (Spoilers) I especially like how all the implications of the few base assertions are being explored: renting bodies to visit with dead relatives, class separation, immortality and untouchable lawlessness for the rich, on and on. Just well done.
  - Faark 8y ago
    The show actually felt quite shallow to me, like it focused entertaining over presenting a coherent world. E.g. I'd expect to see identical cheap mass produced body running around everywhere. I more fondly remember the near two decade old ghost in the shell fancies, especially for it's time. But then I don't plan to go back and may ruin my memory of it by re-watching.

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shmerl 8y ago

TL;DR: Obsolete distribution methods hamper creators. SyFy can't distribute the series through the Internet directly to viewers for some weird reason, and it prevents them from making a profit. I don't quite get why they had to sign such weird contracts to begin with.

dragonwriter 8y ago
> TL;DR: Obsolete distribution methods hamper creators. If by that you mean cable TV, apparently Amazon wouldn't pay for the full cost of the show (or even enough with Netflix buying non-Us streaming rights), so it wasn't for SyFy being will to pay (apparently, too much, ultimately) for the rights to distribute it via an obsolete method, it wouldn't have been produced at all. > SyFy can't distribute the series through the Internet directly to viewers for some weird reason “Amazon has purchased the exclusive rights to do that (in the US, Netflix elsewhere)” is not a particularly weird reason. The problem here isn't obsolete distribution mechanisms, it's that the sum total people are willing to pay for it is less than the people that make it are willing to accept to keep making it.
- shmerl 8y ago
  See here: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the-expanse-but-its-producers-want-to-find-it-a-new-home/ https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2018/05/syfy-has-canceled-the... > The Expanse, based on a series of popular novels by a duo of authors who write under the pen name James S.A. Corey, was critically acclaimed and beloved by fans, but it was expensive to produce, it delivered poor on-air ratings, and critically, Syfy had only first-run linear rights. In other words, the network did not have the OTT (over-the-top: streaming and other digital distribution as opposed to broadcast air) rights. For a show like The Expanse, OTT viewing is key for long-term revenue. The show was only made available on cable television or by purchasing episodes or season passes on digital storefronts like iTunes and Amazon. > is not a particularly weird reason. I'd say it is. Exclusivity harms creators and users too, who can't access the result in stores and ways that are convenient to them. In the ideal world, Alcon Entertainment would make the series and sell it in every Internet store, including their own DRM-free option :) > that the sum total people are willing to pay for it is less than the people that make it are willing to accept to keep making it. No, people are willing to pay enough, but distributors should stop hampering competition with exclusivity restrictions. No exclusivity means wider reach, which means more profit for creators to do their work.

YeGoblynQueenne 8y ago

>> That limited the upside for the cable network, making live and linear viewership imperative. I have no idea what all that means. Could someone please translate?

scanr 8y ago

I hope Netflix picks this up. I really enjoy the Expanse.

sjg007 8y ago

A spin off show based on Detective Miller would be awesome.

TeMPOraL 8y ago
I'd much prefer a spin off show based on the Investigator (not introduced in series yet, but I think about to be in E7) ;). But I would love a Miller series too. Most of all though, I'd love an Avasarala spinoff.

imagetic 8y ago

Well this sucks.

alexeiz 8y ago

'The Expanse' went from really exciting in the first season to really boring in the second season. I watched the whole first season at once, but couldn't handle a single episode of the second season.