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Chinese Social Media Site Reverses Gay Content Ban After Uproar
- tomcooks 9y agoThat's what happens when you use a centralized service, especially if it's state approved.
- aplummer 9y agoIs it though? Does it happen in a centralised system in any democratic country? I feel you are letting them off the hook in a sense, centralisation != censorship, often it seems with western services the centralised system providers fight against censorship.
- darpa_escapee 9y agoYes. Listings are removed from Google, Bing etc all of the time. Recently, a subreddit dedicated to sharing beer was removed from Reddit. Youtube recently banned certain gun-related videos [1] on its platform. [1] http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43500714 http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43500714
- aplummer 9y agoI don’t know how you can link to an article about banning killing machine video content as a comparison to banning gay content with a straight face. This is an example of YouTube taking positive social responsibility which is fantastic. And no, “positive” is not subjective in this case at at all.
- bfuller 9y agoYou asked for an example, then moved goalposts once given one.
- darpa_escapee 9y ago> I don’t know how you can link to an article about banning killing machine video content as a comparison to banning gay content with a straight face. Many Americans value their first and second amendment rights. PS I'm gay. Google, Twitter and friends also censor Islamic fundamentalist content and discussion, along with other subversives. Subreddits about drug use are removed often. Talking about using drugs isn't a crime.
- tomcooks 9y agoCentralization is not censorship, but censorship necessarily requires centralization. Also I would like to have one (1) example of "western services" (you mean non chinese?) centralized service that fights censorship.
- KKKKkkkk1 9y agoIt's heartening to see that the Chinese public will not stand for homophobia. Countries that look to China as a model (looking at you Russia) should take note.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- seanmcdirmid 9y agoI don’t think Russia sees China as a model.
- ihsw2 9y agoIs there a way to oppose homophobia while still upholding family values (eg: eschew promiscuity and instead take one partner for life)?
- ethbro 9y agoGeneralizing the gay club scene to all gay people is like generalizing Panama City Spring Break to all straight people.
- ihsw2 9y agoTo be quite honest, it is accurate. Show me a homosexual that decries promiscuous lifestyles and drug use and I will show you a unicorn. Show me a person that advocates for gay rights while decrying promiscuity and I will show you ten unicorns.
- ethbro 9y agoI can count 5 of my friends in the former category, and 6 in the latter, just off the top of my head. Do you have many gay friends?
- ShowMeUnicorns 9y agoHey, just made an account to say I'm one of those, and I have several gay friends who are in the same ship. Gay men being promiscuous is just a shitty stereotype that's as baseless as it is persistent How about you take a look at any of the studies that have debunked it? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1783788 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1783788
- rulermorg 9y agoMan Chinese government is like Hitler Germany + Big Brother from 1984 + Norsefire party from V for Vendetta. I'm so glad I don't live in China.
- est 9y agoWestern media intends to portrait "china" as one single top-down entity, but as a matter of fact it's not. There are thousands of bureaucratic federal or local government branches can start an Internet crackdown. The whole "anti-gay" nonscence might came from a office clerk smashing his head for April KPI campaigns and baidu'd for random shit to block and passed through the chain of command. That's it.
- PhasmaFelis 9y agoThat doesn't really make it better.
- darawk 9y agoIn fact i'd say it makes it worse.
- est 9y agoAnother fun fact: censorship is a business in China. Profitable, lucrative, serious business. Every branch of government want its own little kill-switch button. e.g. 舆情系统. Lobbyist plays a key roll in all this.
- dlwdlw 9y agoIsn't it the robustness of distributed power rather than the benign dictatorship that turns ugly due to too much centralized power during leadership changes?
- jamesrcole 9y ago> Western media intends to portrait "china" as one single top-down entity, but as a matter of fact it's not. Are you saying this article does that? I don't see anything in it that does. Can you quote me anything in it that does? > There are thousands of bureaucratic federal or local government branches can start an Internet crackdown. You seem to be wanting to imply that this precludes the existence of attempts that come from a higher level.
- JumpCrisscross 9y ago> Even People’s Daily, a state-run newspaper, published an article online that included veiled criticism of Weibo’s announcement. The article said that being gay or bisexual was “not a disease,” but it added that gay people needed to “take on their own social responsibilities while advocating their rights.” I think this [1] is the People's Daily article referenced. If so, the quoted language has been scrubbed. [1] http://en.people.cn/n3/2018/0416/c90000-9449771.html http://en.people.cn/n3/2018/0416/c90000-9449771.html
- h8liu 9y ago[1] says it is from Global Times (which is like a sidekick of People's Daily) People's Daily [2]. Not sure if it has an English translation. [2] https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/DvQGVmHrgn_yfVCg-2xYAA https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/DvQGVmHrgn_yfVCg-2xYAA
- westiseast 9y agoI was in Fujian, China, two weeks ago and did a Bing web/image search for ‘gay men’ (unrelated to any of this news). Zero results returned, and a standard note about violent and sexually explicit content being censored. Thought that was odd.
- ars 9y agoDid you try to search for "straight men"? If there is no sexual content in the photo, what would be the difference in a picture of a gay or straight man? They would look the same. By specifying sexual orientation you are by definition requesting sexual content.
- jamesrcole 9y agoThere's a difference between the very literal definition of "sexual content" that you mention and the notion of "sexually explicit content" that the person you're replying to mentioned.
- bfuller 9y agoOr it could bring up pictures of Tim Cook, Anderson Cooper, or any other gay men.
- Latty 9y agoThat's like saying if I search for "chef" I am asking for pictures of food. The two things may be strongly linked, but that doesn't mean that one requires the other.
- emiliobumachar 9y agoTwo men holding hands would, in my opinion, qualify as a depiction of presumably gay men, while being free of sexual content. (though it's culture-dependent. I heard that in some Arab countries it's common for straight men to hold hands between friends)
- konart 9y ago>Two men holding hands In many countries this is not considered gay. (Saudi Arabia comes to mind)
- mattliu 9y agoWhere in the article does it say that Weibo is backing down? All it seems to say is "backlash happened".
- dang 9y agoAgreed. We changed the title to that of the actual article. Submitted title was "China's Weibo backs down from censoring gay content following backlash". Submitters: rewriting titles like that is a violation of the site guidelines. If the facts have changed since the article was written, you can explain that by posting a comment about it to the thread, or by finding a more up-to-date article and submitting that. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- PakG1 9y agoSee my other reply, there are articles that explicitly say that it actually happened. See other reply for links. Perhaps change the link instead?
- dang 9y agoOk, we've changed the URL from https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/15/world/asia/china-gay-ban-sina-weibo-.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/15/world/asia/china-gay-ban-.... Thanks!
- PakG1 9y agoHeh, the article actually really didn't say it. I was thinking maybe you just didn't read it carefully. Here are articles that explicitly say it. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/16/world/asia/china-weibo-gay.html https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/16/world/asia/china-weibo-ga... https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/16/china-weibo-bans-homosexual-content-protest https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/16/china-weibo-ba...
- h8liu 9y agorelated discussion: https://www.quora.com/What-is-your-opinion-on-the-recent-Chinese-ban-of-gay-contents-on-major-social-media https://www.quora.com/What-is-your-opinion-on-the-recent-Chi...
- bezosisevil 9y agoI thought people on HN weren’t supposed to change the headlines? The NYT headline is completely different and contains nothing saying that Weibo was backing down. Is HN just another fake China apologist now when it comes to changing headlines?
- dang 9y agoWe've changed the title. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16855849 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16855849. On another note: a username of the form "recognizable_person_is_evil" crosses into personal attack, which isn't allowed on HN. You may not owe better to billionaires, but you owe better to this community than to break its rules with every post. So I've banned this account. Account renaming, which we'll have soon, would be a more elegant solution, but it's not ready yet.
- rectangletangle 9y agoIncidents like this are starting to make me feel that software engineers should have a code of ethics, similar to the Hippocratic Oath. So technologies aren't abused to marginalize individuals/groups.
- mc32 9y agoNot to put a damper on things, but it's not like the Hippocratic oath means anything as attested by[1]. It's only good if people heed it, otherwise it's meaningless. [1]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_Gong_practitioners_in_China https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_harvesting_from_Falun_...
- rectangletangle 9y agoAlthough the Hippocratic oath has no teeth, or real enforcement. Hopefully popularizing a code of ethics, helps move the needle toward a better direction.
- ihsw2 9y agoHow do you reconcile a code of ethics with progressive supremacists that assert dominance is necessary for society to move forward?
- lokopodium 9y agoNuclear weapons simulations, drone AI, smart bombs - all good. But don't you dare abuse a marginalized group!
- jamesrcole 9y ago> Nuclear weapons simulations, drone AI, smart bombs - all good. Why are you assuming people's positions on those topics? I've seen people bring them up.
- lokopodium 9y ago
- jstewartmobile 9y agoCensor criticism of the regime? Meh. Censor muscle daddies and slash fic? To the streets!
- alex_hitchins 9y agoI'm sure more people would protest the former if doing so didn't have the repercussions it has.