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Amazon won't sell you a Chromecast, but they will sell a counterfeit

639 points by bb88 9y ago

bArray 9y ago
Does anybody know whether that device is compatible with the Chromecast app? I purchased a similar (but cheaper) knockoff from China for the simple purpose of watching videos on an older TV: https://www.banggood.com/AnyCast-M3-Plus-2_4G-Miracast-DLNA-Airplay-Display-Dongle-TV-Stick-p-1187368.html https://www.banggood.com/AnyCast-M3-Plus-2_4G-Miracast-DLNA-... On a side note, I'm still unsure about how well Micracast is supported in Linux - seems a lot of projects start and end up dying: https://askubuntu.com/questions/318298/ubuntu-as-miracast-sender-receiver https://askubuntu.com/questions/318298/ubuntu-as-miracast-se...
sschueller 9y ago
I though there are strict laws against counterfeiting? It isn't even slightly different, it has the chrome logo on it! With all the mishaps lately like sending out stones and bricks [1] instead of cameras I am worried this will carry over into other Amazon owned companies like Whole Foods. [1] https://fstoppers.com/gear/buyer-orders-6000-camera-amazon-sends-box-rocks-instead-225267 https://fstoppers.com/gear/buyer-orders-6000-camera-amazon-s...
- apotheothesomai 9y ago
  It's not straight-up counterfeiting, since they own up to not being Chromecast, but it may not survive legal action. It's a weak defense. Google may have already started legal action. The trademark infringement is certainly there. A lot depends on where it's made. Does Google have patents on the form factor in that country, either by treaties or by actually registering in the country? It can shut down the reselling by American companies at least. As for food, counterfeits are unnecessary. There are already store brands which offer mostly or entirely the same food stuffs but with a derivative name (like Miracast vs. Chromecast, or Crunchy Nuts vs. Grape Nuts) and knock-off packaging. There's also the bit where 3rd-party sellers don't exist in grocery stores.
  - apotheothesomai 9y ago
    Oh man, you removed the line about Whole Foods, bummer.
  - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
    >"It's not straight-up counterfeiting, since they own up to not being Chromecast, [...]" I'm certain it doesn't work that way in the UK. Small suppliers get _all_ their product confiscated in raids by Trading Standards when they sell knock-off Nike, or whatever. Everyone knows it's knock-off (counterfeit, branded sports wear, like trainers and tracksuits). The sellers don't get let off for admitting it's fake; sometimes they go to prison, always they have goods confiscated. http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/8034060.Counterfeit_crackdown_seizes___30_000_of_goods/ http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/8034060.Counterfe... This seems analogous to the Amazon situation. By rule of law Amazon warehouses should be shut by the police until all inventory that's counterfeit can be removed by Trading Standards. Presumably they lack resources to effectively police traders larger than market stalls.
    - GarrisonPrime 9y ago
      >By rule of law Amazon warehouses should be shut by the police until all inventory that's counterfeit can be removed by Trading Standards. And harm the economy? Fat chance. Perhaps their size isn't as massive there, but in the US Amazon is certainly "too big to fail" at this point.
      - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
        That of course is short-termism: the economy (sic) is harmed more by fake good of low quality. The problem is enough corporate financial profit benefits from it. I think if it were up to me I'd issue an ultimatum. Remove all counterfeit goods from your marketplace/supply chain or your warehouse in South Yorkshire is shutdown until the 3 people working in the local Trading Standards office can process the full inventory and confiscate counterfeit goods; that would include all goods in transit, eg by post, with an Amazon label or biking performed through Amazon. That would be lenient compared to how small "businesses" are treated. Then choose one warehouse to assess, do a raid, check compliance and act appropriately. Note, advertisement of counterfeits is non-compliance. That will definitely never happen this side of the greens getting in to power.
- DanBC 9y ago
  They say > Special note: > this isn't a Chromecast
  - yorwba 9y ago
    I don't think that makes it legal, since they are still violating the trademark.
    - Dylan16807 9y ago
      The power of a trademark is to prevent consumer confusion. If that logo's not fooling anyone, well, it's definitely not black and white.
  - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
    It's still counterfeit, a fake Rolex is still unlawful even when the seller and buyer know it's fake.
    - yjftsjthsd-h 9y ago
      Why is that? If both parties know what's going on, who is being harmed?
      - astura 9y ago
        It's trademark infringement because it has the Chromecast logo on it. If it didn't, it probably wouldn't be a problem. That's a big reason (but not the only reason) that fashion brands have their logo all over their products.
      - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
        As the sibling said, trade dress and marks are used, as is copying of the appearance - so there's torts there. There are usually wider issues of public safety that come along for the ride; tortuous malfeasants are prone to criminal actions - like goods that don't meet fire safety standards (or RF interference requirements, etc., but has the requisite marks), etc..
- sparkie 9y ago
  Most of the knock-offs come from China, and in China it's acceptable business to plagiarize, perhaps even encouraged if you're plagiarizing from non-Chinese companies. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9loDBwp5ST0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9loDBwp5ST0 They can get away with selling internationally either by selling directly from China, or just playing whack-a-mole. Often companies in the west will pop up to sell the products to domestic markets, and by the time the law comes chasing after them they've already disappeared. Usually the law isn't interested in what they are selling, but only bothers to chase after them when they don't pay their sales taxes.
olympus 9y ago
On one hand, anyone can obviously see that this is clearly ripping off the Chromecast's looks (and trademarked logo). But on the other hand, anyone who buys this thinking they are getting a Chromecast obviously didn't read the description. The first line is "special note: this isn't a Chromecast." One of the product pictures clearly shows that it can do several things but not Amazon Video or Netflix. I'm not sure I feel sorry for people that buy this. Didn't you learn that MegaBlox weren't as good as Legos when you were a kid? Also, I don't know if the description has changed in the last couple months, but the top review (2 out of 5 stars) focuses on the fact that it's not 5GHz capable, but it never claims that it can. Again, it's possible that they changed the description since the review was posted, but I can't see anything on this product that is an outright lie. This company is staying on the right side of shady behavior and not straying into criminal territory. Crappy product? Probably. Trademark infringement? Almost definitely. Counterfeit? Not quite. It's just MegaBlocks vs. Legos.
- gerardnll 9y ago
  You're blaming the victim. This is a rip off, which clearly reminds of the original, and probably 80% of buyers are searching for the real deal and my end up buying this shit.
  - olympus 9y ago
    I'm not blaming the victim, most* of the purchasers are in on the scam- they think they can "stick it to big Google" and buy a product that they know isn't a real Chromecast and save $10 over the price of a real Chromecast. As Dave Chappelle said, "You were in on the heist, you just didn't like your cut." They thought they could get a product without paying for the R&D effort goes into making a good product. If you pay less money you can't expect to get the same thing. Situations where you get a better product for less money are pretty rare when the product is sold in large quantities- manufacturers won't give up free profit margin. If someone knowingly buys an inferior product, they don't get to complain when it isn't as good as the original. "Oh, man my $50k Hyundai Equus isn't as nice as a $70k Mercedes, I thought they'd be exactly the same." *I'll accept that a few old grandmas bought these thinking they were the real deal, but most people knew they weren't getting real Chromecasts in the first place.
NicoJuicy 9y ago
A megastore that doesnt allow a popular product in their store. That's a weird business model
- semi-extrinsic 9y ago
  Amazon is super weird if you don't live in a country where they have an official site. Half to two-thirds of the products can't be shipped to where I live, for Reasons, but I can't filter out those unshippable items. It's to the point where I have given up using it for anything but books.
  - NicoJuicy 9y ago
    Cost savings/shipping costs and Prime?
  - Y_Y 9y ago
    It's the same in Ireland (inexplicably, Amazon employs tons of people here). The solution is that several businesses have popped up to reship things from the UK. There's no legal reason you couldn't. One nice thing is that when I buy from Amazon I can compare all the EU Amazon sites for price and get the cheapest.
    - hsivonen 9y ago
      Refusing to ship EU-wide is a common UK e-commerce anti-pattern that bizarrely applies even to Amazon. Even before Brexit was a thing. It's really annoying. Well, more money to German merchants (and amazon.de). Many German merchants even provide English UI for Nordic customers these days. (Amazon.de provides hit-and-miss machine translation to English.)
  - gambiting 9y ago
    Yep, Amazon has a massive warehouse in Poland, but doesn't have a Polish website at all. The best you can do is purchase stuff off Amazon.de, but not everything ships to Poland, despite being dispatched from a warehouse in Wroclaw.
  - 9y ago
joshumax 9y ago
Amazon has a major issue with screening against knockoffs and counterfeits, and the severity of the issues surrounding this grows every day. For instance, my friend bought a camera that looked similar to the Arlo, but it contained a telnet backdoor. Another would ping a strange AliCloud VPS over UDP that appeared to contain data related to network configuration without any explanation or ability to be disabled, short of router firewall rules. As knockoff vendors get more clever at disguising their devices as the one's they're trying to copy, an increasing amount of less-technical users become ever-more at risk regarding their security and privacy.
- macspoofing 9y ago
  >Amazon has a major issue with screening against knockoffs and counterfeits Does it ever! I refuse to buy expensive electronics or equipment on Amazon after getting burned with a knockoff Bose headphones and SWISSGEAR luggage. You don't even get the benefit of cheap prices as those things were within reasonable range of their typical retail price (and with luggage the price fluctuation is always high). It's insane.
  - 0x0 9y ago
    Apparently you can even be denied Global Entry for buying from Amazon: https://www.racked.com/2018/1/8/16849298/amazon-counterfeits-global-entry-customs https://www.racked.com/2018/1/8/16849298/amazon-counterfeits...
    - PebblesHD 9y ago
      That was a very interesting read, with a few points about sharing of listings pages I hadn’t previously considered, thanks for posting it! The main point though, around being flagged for importing counterfeits is particularly concerning to me as a frequent traveller...
      - mynameisvlad 9y ago
        I'm sure they're allowed to do this since the membership agreement is incredibly strict and allows for no room for mistakes, but that doesn't mean they should be. Generally speaking, laws take into account intent and treat cases differently (or not at all) based on what the intent of the action is. It's pretty clear here that the person didn't intend to import a counterfeit bag (why pay full price for it?)
ekianjo 9y ago
The elephant in the room is rather "why does Amazon not sell Chromecasts?" - The answer is rather obvious but it's an illegitimate business practice when you are in the business of selling pretty much everything else. The Amazon line of products should sell based on their merits only, not because its competitors' are not available.
- adtac 9y ago
  We sell everything from A to Z, except maybe C.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
- macspoofing 9y ago
  >The elephant in the room is rather "why does Amazon not sell Chromecasts?" Yep. This is how you get the attention of regulators. They should ask Microsoft how fun it was to be hounded by them for a decade.
- geocar 9y ago
  > The elephant in the room is rather "why does Amazon not sell Chromecasts?" > it's an illegitimate business practice when you are in the business of selling pretty much everything else. Google is a predatory monopoly that is leveraging their existing power in search to move directly into consumer goods. Amazon is also a predatory monopoly that is leveraging their existing power in shopping logistics to move directly into consumer goods. This is tit for tat. https://www.recode.net/2017/10/12/16464132/google-target-retailers-amazon-walmart-assistant-alexa-home-echo-augmented-reality https://www.recode.net/2017/10/12/16464132/google-target-ret... https://www.pcworld.com/article/2975731/software-games/youtube-gaming-launches-today-to-challenge-twitchs-livestreaming-dominance.html https://www.pcworld.com/article/2975731/software-games/youtu... https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16371292/google-youtube-amazon-echo-show https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16371292/google-youtube-a... These companies are moving into the same market, and if they don't fight as hard as possible, they're letting their shareholders down. I don't know if it's illegal and the DOJ is asleep at the wheel, but Google isn't going to stop: They're not content with selling people's personal data and even that they're losing to ad blockers. They're getting desperate. Amazon isn't going to stop either, fuelling consumerism is their bread and butter, so they need to be in the middle of every shopping transaction. No market is out of bounds, but they're really struggling with media and product. These were big investments and Amazon is simply not very good at either, so they too are desperate. We consumers are surely the collateral damage in the meantime, but besides "voting with our wallet", what else could we do? Regulation would be likely required to even allow Google and Amazon to cooperate without violating their obligations their shareholders, but what shape would that take?
amiga-workbench 9y ago
No wonder Google keeps yanking access to their services.
- jaxondu 9y ago
  I see what appear to be fewer AWS examples using Angular, not sure if due to the ongoing YouTube-FireTV "feud". For example the latest AWS Amplify and AppSync JS libraries have proper support for React since day one, but Angular is in future plan.
Cenk 9y ago
Elevation Labs wrote a post about this a couple days ago: https://www.elevationlab.com/blogs/news/amazon-is-complicit-with-counterfeit-sellers https://www.elevationlab.com/blogs/news/amazon-is-complicit-...
raverbashing 9y ago
On top of that the legitimacy of some good reviews is very suspicious But yeah I can't believe how much of a crapshow buying this kind of equipment is on Amazon Try to buy a Firestick if you're not on their "approved country" list and you can't Now this, I hope Amzn enjoys all the returns and bad publicity
- jotm 9y ago
  Amazon reviews are so easy to cheat, it's not even funny. eBay's system is still better, and they actually do more about "fake" accounts and/with counterfeit goods.
  - eddiezane 9y ago
    Pasting the link into https://www.fakespot.com https://www.fakespot.com has become standard practice for me before buying anything off Amazon.
rostigerpudel 9y ago
You gotta love the "Special Note" saying "This is not a Chromecast".
- B1FF_PSUVM 9y ago
  Yep, and the comments are hilarious - worth a look just for the comedy value.
joering2 9y ago
Amazon been in HN recently and I follow many links, learnt alot of interesting things about Mr.Bezos. To be honest, his picture now comes more like a 21st century version of Don Corleone. Sure Bezoz didnt kill anyone but I bet Don would love to know the key to his success which in case of Amazon seems to be very simple recipie: - setup website making sure everything goes legal. - grow big and fast. Hire enough people to cover 80% of your HQ town's business district - because now you hire 40,000 people in one city, those people have voting power. Congratulation! You become too big to jail - at this stage, fuck legality. Allow counterfits in an open unmonitored market. - wait for lawsuit that will come. Those Chineese knockoffs of corridor night-lights? Yeah they dont have any certification and thats why your house burned down when you were vacationing with family. - sue Bezos but make sure you know the law, at least in Seattle (40,000 workers) where judges seems to agree that he only provides platform to sell and is not responsible for content. Know that many people are rotting in jail for similar behavior, including Sill Road website owner who never dealt drugs on his own but just provide platform to do so (although arguebly he was behaving much darker than that) to any torrent or music website ever existed and died on internet. - basically at this point with such huge workforce in Seattle and owning a mouth piece to say anything he wants via Washington post, this guy is a hard core mobster, breaking rules he knows he can break and wreacking billions in process. Please - until you hire few thausands in your city, do not attempt to try what he does - you will spent lifetime in jail for counterfitting.
pritambaral 9y ago
To be fair, a Miracast device is not a Chromecast counterfeit. Miracast is older than Chromecast, and while Google's Android phones dropped Miracast support around the time Chromecast came out, Chromecast is not compatible with Miracast. In the larger picture, this whole affair is nasty and wouldn't have to have happened if everyone supported the standard: Miracast.
- esolyt 9y ago
  Miracast is a standard, not a product. There is nothing wrong with selling a Miracast device, however this particular device is blatant Chromecast rip-off, designwise.
  - pritambaral 9y ago
    Ah, I hadn't seen the visual of the product (Amazon requires JavaScript to load product images).
    - kedean 9y ago
      The product quite literally has the chrome logo slapped on the it.
      - amorphid 9y ago
        It's close. The slants in the circle swirl thing point the opposite direction.
- tacomonstrous 9y ago
  I was very excited about Miracast when I first came across it in 2012, but all the implementations were crap, and the Chromecast blew it out of the water when it came to ease of use.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > Google's Android phones dropped Miracast support around the time Chromecast came out, Miracast support was “dropped” only in that it, like Chromecast support, was provided by the Google Cast (now Google Home) app, not the base OS.
senthilnayagam 9y ago
If design counterfeit is the only complaint you have, every major android maker launched a iPhone X design knockoff at MWC Barcelona
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
Improvotter 9y ago
I'm glad that I have not come across this problem on the European Amazon stores.
packetgeek 9y ago
How is it counterfeit? It's Miracast, not Chromecast. Using your logic, Chevy's are counterfeit Fords.
- niklasrde 9y ago
  But Chevy don't put a Ford logo on front of it.
- bufferoverflow 9y ago
  Google's chrome logo.
- noselasd 9y ago
  Its name is not apparent, and it's the first item shown when you search for chromecast.
zaptheimpaler 9y ago
Its not labeled as a Chromecast, so as a consumer I wouldn't mistake it for one. Seems fair enough, not exactly counterfeiting.
- mikelward 9y ago
  It uses the Chromecast logo and design.
Parcissons 9y ago
Can you entrap a competitor? Aka, produce a counterfeit product and inform them of that status- and lawsuit them for not acting on that info. I imagine it a pretty easy solution to have a automatic first reporter bot, and have the
Grazester 9y ago
Amazon is going to stop selling nest products. http://www.businessinsider.com/amazon-wont-sell-nest-products-from-google-2018-3 http://www.businessinsider.com/amazon-wont-sell-nest-product...
benologist 9y ago
Google has a website full of garbage, knockoffs, fraud and spam too, that they make ludicrous amounts of money advertising and shield with fake customer support and email loops. It's an anomaly that these companies are allowed to keep the profit without tax or liability.
- smt88 9y ago
  Google makes a lot of money from its keyword protection racket. Many users will type, for example, "facebook" into their address bar. The browser searches Google, and whoever bought the ads will be on top. Facebook can't allow any other company to come up first, and so they pay. Many, many ad clicks work this way, and I consider it to be a dark pattern at best, but similar to fraud at worst.
  - NicoJuicy 9y ago
    Google does this too for their own products, I'm just wondering what the CPC would be internally
  - Dylan16807 9y ago
    Would you ban all ads related to brand names? I think facebook feeling the "need" to buy those ad slots is their own problem.
    - smt88 9y ago
      OK, try a company other than Facebook. What about a company with many competitors buying ads against their name? Or a small company fighting ads from counterfeiters? I'm not suggesting a solution to this. The core issue is that most ads are bad for users, and an ad business can never be truly harmless to its "product" -- the users.
      - Dylan16807 9y ago
        > OK, try a company other than Facebook. Not much difference in my mind. > The core issue is that most ads are bad for users That's true even if the ad is for "potato", though. I'm not ready to call the very concept of ads a racket, even if it's generally negative.
chapill 9y ago
Google blocks guns. Amazon blocks Chromecast. Freedom. Found a counterfeit? Report it. It's up to you, the shopper, to do that. Buyer beware, after all.
m3kw9 9y ago
I would argue that retail world has counterfeits in similar fashion as online. Also if not amazon, you will find as many other big name sites and stand alone sites selling these fake things. It’s an existential problem of selling goods that no one has much solutions yet. People think it’s easy to fix, but these guys will find cracks and th solution usually has side effects and other unintended side effects that these big retailers are not willing to take. I’m sure they have something in development but they are testing the heck out of it, which I think would involve AI. Just give it sometime
discreditable 9y ago
Check out the box it comes in. It's hilariously knocked-off. https://i.imgur.com/YQRFwdf.jpg https://i.imgur.com/YQRFwdf.jpg
- radiorental 9y ago
  That is hilarious. It is somewhat strange the have the correct order of colours for the logo, but have used the google font from around 4 years ago. That, and the rest of the fonts are not the typical Chinese Times Roman(tm) The bit that caught my eye was the Just Dance channel (I assume its a twitch stream)
sabujp 9y ago
calling all google lawyercats
bitL 9y ago
Amazon is doing these two competing things right now: - opening up 3rd party marketplace to dodgy sellers from Asia shipping stuff to US (likely to counter Alibaba) - increasing false positives rate in counterfeit detection beyond reasonable levels, kicking out legitimate sellers upon mere unfounded suspicion (e.g. you just list an item, you immediately get banned without any sale and they don't easily accept a certificate proving you could sell it) So in order to counter the threat from Alibaba, they are making even the life of good but small-medium sellers a hell in sense of "guilty by default".
kull 9y ago
As much as Walmart and Jet.com have still a lot of work in front of them to make their e-commerce experience better, those two companies have a pretty involved process of approval for new (US only) sellers. This approval process slows down Jet and Walmart in terms of growing their sellers' base, but it actually may be their strongest point in the war with Amazon.
slrz 9y ago
Seems to be a solid product, according to the reviews: > So when i first received this product i thought it would be just another dongle like chrome cast. But oh boy was i wrong!!! This is such an amazing product and the video quality is extremely clear and work all around my house.
testt 9y ago
test
chiefalchemist 9y ago
Having read a good number of (at this point) 150+ comnents this gist so far seems ro be: - Lots of assorted complaints about Amazon - Very few "I'll never shop there again..." Seems to me that even when Amazon is wrong things still work out for them. Why should they change?
- kop316 9y ago
  I'll offer that I have already stopped shopping there for these very reasons. But you are right, unless you avoid it then they do have no reason to change
- yborg 9y ago
  It's become the Wal-Mart of virtual retail, with all that implies. They've driven out most of their competition, because despite the fact that their review system has been gamed to the point of uselessness, as now has their inventory commingling system, and things like their self-publishing platform being used for laundering stolen credit cards - they are unquestionably still superb at logistics. Once it gets into their shipping system, you know where it is, and when it will get to you. This is the problem I have with buying direct from a lot of manufacturers, their fulfillment process is often not very good. Ironically, Wal-Mart may finally provide Amazon with some serious competition, they seem serious about Jet. I don't know if having two mediocre retail platforms is that much better than one, but presumably they'll both try harder.
- freyir 9y ago
  I still shop there, I just wouldn’t consider buying food, electronics, toys, medical or cosmetic supplies, etc. from them at this point. Perhaps it’s still a net positive for them, especially if most customers are oblivious to their counterfeiting problems.
stevenh 9y ago
Apple's latest Magic Keyboard is an atrocious piece of garbage whose keys are so sensitive that they trigger when you breathe on them. Apparently Tim Cook thought it would be a good idea to make this the only keyboard you can buy from Apple and cancel the old model that humans could actually use. I bought one of the older ones from Amazon and now I get to worry that it's going to be a counterfeit that phones all my keystrokes home to China. Nice world we're building here.
jklinger410 9y ago
This Amazon Google trade war is the best example of why Amazon will not be immune to monopoly talks in the near future. I'm disappointed in them for choosing to not sell their competitors, it prevents me from wanting to use their services.
jacksmith21006 9y ago
Google needs to fight back against Amazon. The only way to stop a bully s bully them. Google has all the cards. It is fine if Amazon does not want to sell but banning everyone else on their market place is anti competitive.
- pavel_lishin 9y ago
  How is Amazon a bully in this scenario?
- plandis 9y ago
  Google prevents Amazon from implementing Chromecast. That is why they pulled Chromecast devices in the first place isn’t it?
jimrandomh 9y ago
Looking at the first page of search results for "Chromecast" on Amazon: Top result is a counterfeit with the Chrome logo on it. Second result is Amazon's Fire TV stick. Third result is Roku Express. 4-7 are counterfeits with logos on them that don't precisely match the Chrome logo, but are clearly designed to falsely evoke Google's brand. 8 is a generic with no Google-related logo on it. 9-11 are counterfeits with almost-but-not-quite Google logos on them. 12 is a counterfeit with the Chrome logo on it. 13-14 are accessories "for Chromecast. 15 is a counterfeit with the Chrome logo on it. Amazon correctly identifies which product category Chromecast is, and puts an add for Fire TV above the search results, indicating that they exercised some amount of direct (non-algorithmic) control over that page. I'd say Google has a pretty open-and-shut case for trademark infringement here.
mnutt 9y ago
Back when I worked at LimeWire, Google refused to sell us search ads, presumably on the grounds of "promoting IP infringement". But plenty of people had taken our open source codebase, added malware, and had no problem running Google ads as "LimeWire". So when users searched for "LimeWire" the first thing they were presented with was counterfeit ad search results for malware and there was nothing we could do about it.
unclefishbits 9y ago
Fakespot is so important if you continue to use the Amazon. If you're not buying name brand, you are likely buying a crappy product with gamed reviews. It is a nightmare on Amazon now and it pisses me off at Amazon refuses to address it.
rrjanbiah 9y ago
In Amazon India, sellers are ripped through FBA and Amazon policies: 1. When abusive buyers damage and return product, Amazon releases refund. We had one instance where one buyer was buying and returning same product for 3 times (2 times received in "customer damaged" condition) and irrespective of us escalating the issue, Amazon kept issuing refund. Also, it didn't reimburse for "customer damaged" as product was not under reimbursement category. 2. We have a strong feeling that few abusive buyers use FBA to create counterfeit absolutely free of cost. 3. Another nightmare is with Amazon seller support. Seems they are allocating good people for buyers, but seems to keep completely juniors who don't have any idea about seller concerns. 4. Their system is full of bugs. For instance, system will charge wrong fee and getting reimbursement is a tedious process. They will ask for certain details that we can't pull from seller central. 5. Even hiring dedicated account management from Amazon wouldn't help as they will only pitch and nag for ads

639 points by bb88 9y ago

Does anybody know whether that device is compatible with the Chromecast app? I purchased a similar (but cheaper) knockoff from China for the simple purpose of watching videos on an older TV: https://www.banggood.com/AnyCast-M3-Plus-2_4G-Miracast-DLNA-Airplay-Display-Dongle-TV-Stick-p-1187368.html https://www.banggood.com/AnyCast-M3-Plus-2_4G-Miracast-DLNA-... On a side note, I'm still unsure about how well Micracast is supported in Linux - seems a lot of projects start and end up dying: https://askubuntu.com/questions/318298/ubuntu-as-miracast-sender-receiver https://askubuntu.com/questions/318298/ubuntu-as-miracast-se...

sschueller 9y ago

I though there are strict laws against counterfeiting? It isn't even slightly different, it has the chrome logo on it! With all the mishaps lately like sending out stones and bricks [1] instead of cameras I am worried this will carry over into other Amazon owned companies like Whole Foods. [1] https://fstoppers.com/gear/buyer-orders-6000-camera-amazon-sends-box-rocks-instead-225267 https://fstoppers.com/gear/buyer-orders-6000-camera-amazon-s...

apotheothesomai 9y ago
It's not straight-up counterfeiting, since they own up to not being Chromecast, but it may not survive legal action. It's a weak defense. Google may have already started legal action. The trademark infringement is certainly there. A lot depends on where it's made. Does Google have patents on the form factor in that country, either by treaties or by actually registering in the country? It can shut down the reselling by American companies at least. As for food, counterfeits are unnecessary. There are already store brands which offer mostly or entirely the same food stuffs but with a derivative name (like Miracast vs. Chromecast, or Crunchy Nuts vs. Grape Nuts) and knock-off packaging. There's also the bit where 3rd-party sellers don't exist in grocery stores.
- apotheothesomai 9y ago
  Oh man, you removed the line about Whole Foods, bummer.
- pbhjpbhj 9y ago
  >"It's not straight-up counterfeiting, since they own up to not being Chromecast, [...]" I'm certain it doesn't work that way in the UK. Small suppliers get _all_ their product confiscated in raids by Trading Standards when they sell knock-off Nike, or whatever. Everyone knows it's knock-off (counterfeit, branded sports wear, like trainers and tracksuits). The sellers don't get let off for admitting it's fake; sometimes they go to prison, always they have goods confiscated. http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/8034060.Counterfeit_crackdown_seizes___30_000_of_goods/ http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/8034060.Counterfe... This seems analogous to the Amazon situation. By rule of law Amazon warehouses should be shut by the police until all inventory that's counterfeit can be removed by Trading Standards. Presumably they lack resources to effectively police traders larger than market stalls.
  - GarrisonPrime 9y ago
    >By rule of law Amazon warehouses should be shut by the police until all inventory that's counterfeit can be removed by Trading Standards. And harm the economy? Fat chance. Perhaps their size isn't as massive there, but in the US Amazon is certainly "too big to fail" at this point.
    - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
      That of course is short-termism: the economy (sic) is harmed more by fake good of low quality. The problem is enough corporate financial profit benefits from it. I think if it were up to me I'd issue an ultimatum. Remove all counterfeit goods from your marketplace/supply chain or your warehouse in South Yorkshire is shutdown until the 3 people working in the local Trading Standards office can process the full inventory and confiscate counterfeit goods; that would include all goods in transit, eg by post, with an Amazon label or biking performed through Amazon. That would be lenient compared to how small "businesses" are treated. Then choose one warehouse to assess, do a raid, check compliance and act appropriately. Note, advertisement of counterfeits is non-compliance. That will definitely never happen this side of the greens getting in to power.
DanBC 9y ago
They say > Special note: > this isn't a Chromecast
- yorwba 9y ago
  I don't think that makes it legal, since they are still violating the trademark.
  - Dylan16807 9y ago
    The power of a trademark is to prevent consumer confusion. If that logo's not fooling anyone, well, it's definitely not black and white.
- pbhjpbhj 9y ago
  It's still counterfeit, a fake Rolex is still unlawful even when the seller and buyer know it's fake.
  - yjftsjthsd-h 9y ago
    Why is that? If both parties know what's going on, who is being harmed?
    - astura 9y ago
      It's trademark infringement because it has the Chromecast logo on it. If it didn't, it probably wouldn't be a problem. That's a big reason (but not the only reason) that fashion brands have their logo all over their products.
    - pbhjpbhj 9y ago
      As the sibling said, trade dress and marks are used, as is copying of the appearance - so there's torts there. There are usually wider issues of public safety that come along for the ride; tortuous malfeasants are prone to criminal actions - like goods that don't meet fire safety standards (or RF interference requirements, etc., but has the requisite marks), etc..
sparkie 9y ago
Most of the knock-offs come from China, and in China it's acceptable business to plagiarize, perhaps even encouraged if you're plagiarizing from non-Chinese companies. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9loDBwp5ST0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9loDBwp5ST0 They can get away with selling internationally either by selling directly from China, or just playing whack-a-mole. Often companies in the west will pop up to sell the products to domestic markets, and by the time the law comes chasing after them they've already disappeared. Usually the law isn't interested in what they are selling, but only bothers to chase after them when they don't pay their sales taxes.

olympus 9y ago

On one hand, anyone can obviously see that this is clearly ripping off the Chromecast's looks (and trademarked logo). But on the other hand, anyone who buys this thinking they are getting a Chromecast obviously didn't read the description. The first line is "special note: this isn't a Chromecast." One of the product pictures clearly shows that it can do several things but not Amazon Video or Netflix. I'm not sure I feel sorry for people that buy this. Didn't you learn that MegaBlox weren't as good as Legos when you were a kid? Also, I don't know if the description has changed in the last couple months, but the top review (2 out of 5 stars) focuses on the fact that it's not 5GHz capable, but it never claims that it can. Again, it's possible that they changed the description since the review was posted, but I can't see anything on this product that is an outright lie. This company is staying on the right side of shady behavior and not straying into criminal territory. Crappy product? Probably. Trademark infringement? Almost definitely. Counterfeit? Not quite. It's just MegaBlocks vs. Legos.

gerardnll 9y ago
You're blaming the victim. This is a rip off, which clearly reminds of the original, and probably 80% of buyers are searching for the real deal and my end up buying this shit.
- olympus 9y ago
  I'm not blaming the victim, most* of the purchasers are in on the scam- they think they can "stick it to big Google" and buy a product that they know isn't a real Chromecast and save $10 over the price of a real Chromecast. As Dave Chappelle said, "You were in on the heist, you just didn't like your cut." They thought they could get a product without paying for the R&D effort goes into making a good product. If you pay less money you can't expect to get the same thing. Situations where you get a better product for less money are pretty rare when the product is sold in large quantities- manufacturers won't give up free profit margin. If someone knowingly buys an inferior product, they don't get to complain when it isn't as good as the original. "Oh, man my $50k Hyundai Equus isn't as nice as a $70k Mercedes, I thought they'd be exactly the same." *I'll accept that a few old grandmas bought these thinking they were the real deal, but most people knew they weren't getting real Chromecasts in the first place.

NicoJuicy 9y ago

A megastore that doesnt allow a popular product in their store. That's a weird business model

semi-extrinsic 9y ago
Amazon is super weird if you don't live in a country where they have an official site. Half to two-thirds of the products can't be shipped to where I live, for Reasons, but I can't filter out those unshippable items. It's to the point where I have given up using it for anything but books.
- NicoJuicy 9y ago
  Cost savings/shipping costs and Prime?
- Y_Y 9y ago
  It's the same in Ireland (inexplicably, Amazon employs tons of people here). The solution is that several businesses have popped up to reship things from the UK. There's no legal reason you couldn't. One nice thing is that when I buy from Amazon I can compare all the EU Amazon sites for price and get the cheapest.
  - hsivonen 9y ago
    Refusing to ship EU-wide is a common UK e-commerce anti-pattern that bizarrely applies even to Amazon. Even before Brexit was a thing. It's really annoying. Well, more money to German merchants (and amazon.de). Many German merchants even provide English UI for Nordic customers these days. (Amazon.de provides hit-and-miss machine translation to English.)
- gambiting 9y ago
  Yep, Amazon has a massive warehouse in Poland, but doesn't have a Polish website at all. The best you can do is purchase stuff off Amazon.de, but not everything ships to Poland, despite being dispatched from a warehouse in Wroclaw.
- 9y ago

joshumax 9y ago

Amazon has a major issue with screening against knockoffs and counterfeits, and the severity of the issues surrounding this grows every day. For instance, my friend bought a camera that looked similar to the Arlo, but it contained a telnet backdoor. Another would ping a strange AliCloud VPS over UDP that appeared to contain data related to network configuration without any explanation or ability to be disabled, short of router firewall rules. As knockoff vendors get more clever at disguising their devices as the one's they're trying to copy, an increasing amount of less-technical users become ever-more at risk regarding their security and privacy.

macspoofing 9y ago
>Amazon has a major issue with screening against knockoffs and counterfeits Does it ever! I refuse to buy expensive electronics or equipment on Amazon after getting burned with a knockoff Bose headphones and SWISSGEAR luggage. You don't even get the benefit of cheap prices as those things were within reasonable range of their typical retail price (and with luggage the price fluctuation is always high). It's insane.
- 0x0 9y ago
  Apparently you can even be denied Global Entry for buying from Amazon: https://www.racked.com/2018/1/8/16849298/amazon-counterfeits-global-entry-customs https://www.racked.com/2018/1/8/16849298/amazon-counterfeits...
  - PebblesHD 9y ago
    That was a very interesting read, with a few points about sharing of listings pages I hadn’t previously considered, thanks for posting it! The main point though, around being flagged for importing counterfeits is particularly concerning to me as a frequent traveller...
    - mynameisvlad 9y ago
      I'm sure they're allowed to do this since the membership agreement is incredibly strict and allows for no room for mistakes, but that doesn't mean they should be. Generally speaking, laws take into account intent and treat cases differently (or not at all) based on what the intent of the action is. It's pretty clear here that the person didn't intend to import a counterfeit bag (why pay full price for it?)

ekianjo 9y ago

The elephant in the room is rather "why does Amazon not sell Chromecasts?" - The answer is rather obvious but it's an illegitimate business practice when you are in the business of selling pretty much everything else. The Amazon line of products should sell based on their merits only, not because its competitors' are not available.

adtac 9y ago
We sell everything from A to Z, except maybe C.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
macspoofing 9y ago
>The elephant in the room is rather "why does Amazon not sell Chromecasts?" Yep. This is how you get the attention of regulators. They should ask Microsoft how fun it was to be hounded by them for a decade.
geocar 9y ago
> The elephant in the room is rather "why does Amazon not sell Chromecasts?" > it's an illegitimate business practice when you are in the business of selling pretty much everything else. Google is a predatory monopoly that is leveraging their existing power in search to move directly into consumer goods. Amazon is also a predatory monopoly that is leveraging their existing power in shopping logistics to move directly into consumer goods. This is tit for tat. https://www.recode.net/2017/10/12/16464132/google-target-retailers-amazon-walmart-assistant-alexa-home-echo-augmented-reality https://www.recode.net/2017/10/12/16464132/google-target-ret... https://www.pcworld.com/article/2975731/software-games/youtube-gaming-launches-today-to-challenge-twitchs-livestreaming-dominance.html https://www.pcworld.com/article/2975731/software-games/youtu... https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16371292/google-youtube-amazon-echo-show https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/26/16371292/google-youtube-a... These companies are moving into the same market, and if they don't fight as hard as possible, they're letting their shareholders down. I don't know if it's illegal and the DOJ is asleep at the wheel, but Google isn't going to stop: They're not content with selling people's personal data and even that they're losing to ad blockers. They're getting desperate. Amazon isn't going to stop either, fuelling consumerism is their bread and butter, so they need to be in the middle of every shopping transaction. No market is out of bounds, but they're really struggling with media and product. These were big investments and Amazon is simply not very good at either, so they too are desperate. We consumers are surely the collateral damage in the meantime, but besides "voting with our wallet", what else could we do? Regulation would be likely required to even allow Google and Amazon to cooperate without violating their obligations their shareholders, but what shape would that take?

amiga-workbench 9y ago

No wonder Google keeps yanking access to their services.

jaxondu 9y ago
I see what appear to be fewer AWS examples using Angular, not sure if due to the ongoing YouTube-FireTV "feud". For example the latest AWS Amplify and AppSync JS libraries have proper support for React since day one, but Angular is in future plan.

Cenk 9y ago

Elevation Labs wrote a post about this a couple days ago: https://www.elevationlab.com/blogs/news/amazon-is-complicit-with-counterfeit-sellers https://www.elevationlab.com/blogs/news/amazon-is-complicit-...

raverbashing 9y ago

On top of that the legitimacy of some good reviews is very suspicious But yeah I can't believe how much of a crapshow buying this kind of equipment is on Amazon Try to buy a Firestick if you're not on their "approved country" list and you can't Now this, I hope Amzn enjoys all the returns and bad publicity

jotm 9y ago
Amazon reviews are so easy to cheat, it's not even funny. eBay's system is still better, and they actually do more about "fake" accounts and/with counterfeit goods.
- eddiezane 9y ago
  Pasting the link into https://www.fakespot.com https://www.fakespot.com has become standard practice for me before buying anything off Amazon.

rostigerpudel 9y ago

You gotta love the "Special Note" saying "This is not a Chromecast".

B1FF_PSUVM 9y ago
Yep, and the comments are hilarious - worth a look just for the comedy value.

joering2 9y ago

Amazon been in HN recently and I follow many links, learnt alot of interesting things about Mr.Bezos. To be honest, his picture now comes more like a 21st century version of Don Corleone. Sure Bezoz didnt kill anyone but I bet Don would love to know the key to his success which in case of Amazon seems to be very simple recipie: - setup website making sure everything goes legal. - grow big and fast. Hire enough people to cover 80% of your HQ town's business district - because now you hire 40,000 people in one city, those people have voting power. Congratulation! You become too big to jail - at this stage, fuck legality. Allow counterfits in an open unmonitored market. - wait for lawsuit that will come. Those Chineese knockoffs of corridor night-lights? Yeah they dont have any certification and thats why your house burned down when you were vacationing with family. - sue Bezos but make sure you know the law, at least in Seattle (40,000 workers) where judges seems to agree that he only provides platform to sell and is not responsible for content. Know that many people are rotting in jail for similar behavior, including Sill Road website owner who never dealt drugs on his own but just provide platform to do so (although arguebly he was behaving much darker than that) to any torrent or music website ever existed and died on internet. - basically at this point with such huge workforce in Seattle and owning a mouth piece to say anything he wants via Washington post, this guy is a hard core mobster, breaking rules he knows he can break and wreacking billions in process. Please - until you hire few thausands in your city, do not attempt to try what he does - you will spent lifetime in jail for counterfitting.

pritambaral 9y ago

To be fair, a Miracast device is not a Chromecast counterfeit. Miracast is older than Chromecast, and while Google's Android phones dropped Miracast support around the time Chromecast came out, Chromecast is not compatible with Miracast. In the larger picture, this whole affair is nasty and wouldn't have to have happened if everyone supported the standard: Miracast.

esolyt 9y ago
Miracast is a standard, not a product. There is nothing wrong with selling a Miracast device, however this particular device is blatant Chromecast rip-off, designwise.
- pritambaral 9y ago
  Ah, I hadn't seen the visual of the product (Amazon requires JavaScript to load product images).
  - kedean 9y ago
    The product quite literally has the chrome logo slapped on the it.
    - amorphid 9y ago
      It's close. The slants in the circle swirl thing point the opposite direction.
tacomonstrous 9y ago
I was very excited about Miracast when I first came across it in 2012, but all the implementations were crap, and the Chromecast blew it out of the water when it came to ease of use.
dragonwriter 9y ago
> Google's Android phones dropped Miracast support around the time Chromecast came out, Miracast support was “dropped” only in that it, like Chromecast support, was provided by the Google Cast (now Google Home) app, not the base OS.

senthilnayagam 9y ago

If design counterfeit is the only complaint you have, every major android maker launched a iPhone X design knockoff at MWC Barcelona

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

Improvotter 9y ago

I'm glad that I have not come across this problem on the European Amazon stores.

packetgeek 9y ago

How is it counterfeit? It's Miracast, not Chromecast. Using your logic, Chevy's are counterfeit Fords.

niklasrde 9y ago
But Chevy don't put a Ford logo on front of it.
bufferoverflow 9y ago
Google's chrome logo.
noselasd 9y ago
Its name is not apparent, and it's the first item shown when you search for chromecast.

zaptheimpaler 9y ago

Its not labeled as a Chromecast, so as a consumer I wouldn't mistake it for one. Seems fair enough, not exactly counterfeiting.

mikelward 9y ago
It uses the Chromecast logo and design.

Parcissons 9y ago

Can you entrap a competitor? Aka, produce a counterfeit product and inform them of that status- and lawsuit them for not acting on that info. I imagine it a pretty easy solution to have a automatic first reporter bot, and have the

Grazester 9y ago

Amazon is going to stop selling nest products. http://www.businessinsider.com/amazon-wont-sell-nest-products-from-google-2018-3 http://www.businessinsider.com/amazon-wont-sell-nest-product...

benologist 9y ago

Google has a website full of garbage, knockoffs, fraud and spam too, that they make ludicrous amounts of money advertising and shield with fake customer support and email loops. It's an anomaly that these companies are allowed to keep the profit without tax or liability.

smt88 9y ago
Google makes a lot of money from its keyword protection racket. Many users will type, for example, "facebook" into their address bar. The browser searches Google, and whoever bought the ads will be on top. Facebook can't allow any other company to come up first, and so they pay. Many, many ad clicks work this way, and I consider it to be a dark pattern at best, but similar to fraud at worst.
- NicoJuicy 9y ago
  Google does this too for their own products, I'm just wondering what the CPC would be internally
- Dylan16807 9y ago
  Would you ban all ads related to brand names? I think facebook feeling the "need" to buy those ad slots is their own problem.
  - smt88 9y ago
    OK, try a company other than Facebook. What about a company with many competitors buying ads against their name? Or a small company fighting ads from counterfeiters? I'm not suggesting a solution to this. The core issue is that most ads are bad for users, and an ad business can never be truly harmless to its "product" -- the users.
    - Dylan16807 9y ago
      > OK, try a company other than Facebook. Not much difference in my mind. > The core issue is that most ads are bad for users That's true even if the ad is for "potato", though. I'm not ready to call the very concept of ads a racket, even if it's generally negative.

chapill 9y ago

Google blocks guns. Amazon blocks Chromecast. Freedom. Found a counterfeit? Report it. It's up to you, the shopper, to do that. Buyer beware, after all.

m3kw9 9y ago

I would argue that retail world has counterfeits in similar fashion as online. Also if not amazon, you will find as many other big name sites and stand alone sites selling these fake things. It’s an existential problem of selling goods that no one has much solutions yet. People think it’s easy to fix, but these guys will find cracks and th solution usually has side effects and other unintended side effects that these big retailers are not willing to take. I’m sure they have something in development but they are testing the heck out of it, which I think would involve AI. Just give it sometime

discreditable 9y ago

Check out the box it comes in. It's hilariously knocked-off. https://i.imgur.com/YQRFwdf.jpg https://i.imgur.com/YQRFwdf.jpg

radiorental 9y ago
That is hilarious. It is somewhat strange the have the correct order of colours for the logo, but have used the google font from around 4 years ago. That, and the rest of the fonts are not the typical Chinese Times Roman(tm) The bit that caught my eye was the Just Dance channel (I assume its a twitch stream)

sabujp 9y ago

calling all google lawyercats

bitL 9y ago

Amazon is doing these two competing things right now: - opening up 3rd party marketplace to dodgy sellers from Asia shipping stuff to US (likely to counter Alibaba) - increasing false positives rate in counterfeit detection beyond reasonable levels, kicking out legitimate sellers upon mere unfounded suspicion (e.g. you just list an item, you immediately get banned without any sale and they don't easily accept a certificate proving you could sell it) So in order to counter the threat from Alibaba, they are making even the life of good but small-medium sellers a hell in sense of "guilty by default".

kull 9y ago

As much as Walmart and Jet.com have still a lot of work in front of them to make their e-commerce experience better, those two companies have a pretty involved process of approval for new (US only) sellers. This approval process slows down Jet and Walmart in terms of growing their sellers' base, but it actually may be their strongest point in the war with Amazon.

slrz 9y ago

Seems to be a solid product, according to the reviews: > So when i first received this product i thought it would be just another dongle like chrome cast. But oh boy was i wrong!!! This is such an amazing product and the video quality is extremely clear and work all around my house.

testt 9y ago

test

chiefalchemist 9y ago

Having read a good number of (at this point) 150+ comnents this gist so far seems ro be: - Lots of assorted complaints about Amazon - Very few "I'll never shop there again..." Seems to me that even when Amazon is wrong things still work out for them. Why should they change?

kop316 9y ago
I'll offer that I have already stopped shopping there for these very reasons. But you are right, unless you avoid it then they do have no reason to change
yborg 9y ago
It's become the Wal-Mart of virtual retail, with all that implies. They've driven out most of their competition, because despite the fact that their review system has been gamed to the point of uselessness, as now has their inventory commingling system, and things like their self-publishing platform being used for laundering stolen credit cards - they are unquestionably still superb at logistics. Once it gets into their shipping system, you know where it is, and when it will get to you. This is the problem I have with buying direct from a lot of manufacturers, their fulfillment process is often not very good. Ironically, Wal-Mart may finally provide Amazon with some serious competition, they seem serious about Jet. I don't know if having two mediocre retail platforms is that much better than one, but presumably they'll both try harder.
freyir 9y ago
I still shop there, I just wouldn’t consider buying food, electronics, toys, medical or cosmetic supplies, etc. from them at this point. Perhaps it’s still a net positive for them, especially if most customers are oblivious to their counterfeiting problems.

stevenh 9y ago

Apple's latest Magic Keyboard is an atrocious piece of garbage whose keys are so sensitive that they trigger when you breathe on them. Apparently Tim Cook thought it would be a good idea to make this the only keyboard you can buy from Apple and cancel the old model that humans could actually use. I bought one of the older ones from Amazon and now I get to worry that it's going to be a counterfeit that phones all my keystrokes home to China. Nice world we're building here.

jklinger410 9y ago

This Amazon Google trade war is the best example of why Amazon will not be immune to monopoly talks in the near future. I'm disappointed in them for choosing to not sell their competitors, it prevents me from wanting to use their services.

jacksmith21006 9y ago

Google needs to fight back against Amazon. The only way to stop a bully s bully them. Google has all the cards. It is fine if Amazon does not want to sell but banning everyone else on their market place is anti competitive.

pavel_lishin 9y ago
How is Amazon a bully in this scenario?
plandis 9y ago
Google prevents Amazon from implementing Chromecast. That is why they pulled Chromecast devices in the first place isn’t it?

jimrandomh 9y ago

Looking at the first page of search results for "Chromecast" on Amazon: Top result is a counterfeit with the Chrome logo on it. Second result is Amazon's Fire TV stick. Third result is Roku Express. 4-7 are counterfeits with logos on them that don't precisely match the Chrome logo, but are clearly designed to falsely evoke Google's brand. 8 is a generic with no Google-related logo on it. 9-11 are counterfeits with almost-but-not-quite Google logos on them. 12 is a counterfeit with the Chrome logo on it. 13-14 are accessories "for Chromecast. 15 is a counterfeit with the Chrome logo on it. Amazon correctly identifies which product category Chromecast is, and puts an add for Fire TV above the search results, indicating that they exercised some amount of direct (non-algorithmic) control over that page. I'd say Google has a pretty open-and-shut case for trademark infringement here.

mnutt 9y ago

Back when I worked at LimeWire, Google refused to sell us search ads, presumably on the grounds of "promoting IP infringement". But plenty of people had taken our open source codebase, added malware, and had no problem running Google ads as "LimeWire". So when users searched for "LimeWire" the first thing they were presented with was counterfeit ad search results for malware and there was nothing we could do about it.

unclefishbits 9y ago

Fakespot is so important if you continue to use the Amazon. If you're not buying name brand, you are likely buying a crappy product with gamed reviews. It is a nightmare on Amazon now and it pisses me off at Amazon refuses to address it.

rrjanbiah 9y ago

In Amazon India, sellers are ripped through FBA and Amazon policies: 1. When abusive buyers damage and return product, Amazon releases refund. We had one instance where one buyer was buying and returning same product for 3 times (2 times received in "customer damaged" condition) and irrespective of us escalating the issue, Amazon kept issuing refund. Also, it didn't reimburse for "customer damaged" as product was not under reimbursement category. 2. We have a strong feeling that few abusive buyers use FBA to create counterfeit absolutely free of cost. 3. Another nightmare is with Amazon seller support. Seems they are allocating good people for buyers, but seems to keep completely juniors who don't have any idea about seller concerns. 4. Their system is full of bugs. For instance, system will charge wrong fee and getting reimbursement is a tedious process. They will ask for certain details that we can't pull from seller central. 5. Even hiring dedicated account management from Amazon wouldn't help as they will only pitch and nag for ads