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When you choose Windows, the computer uses you. When you choose Linux, you use the computer. Stop complaining and start switching. It should be apparent by now

When you choose Windows, the computer uses you. When you choose Linux, you use the computer. Stop complaining and start switching. It should be apparent by now that Microsoft isn't going to stop their bad behavior.

falcolas 9y ago
It's never that simple, especially for professional users and gamers. Those whose applications are only available for Windows. Sure, there are some open source alternatives, but they are only rarely as good, and even more seldom better, than their Windows counterparts.
- Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
  Gamers who bend over for the sake of their hobby are a pathetic bunch. Linux has many, many great games, and if that's not enough supplement it with a PS4 or something and you'll never be bored. Most professionals would have no problem using Linux for their needs. What applications are you suggesting aren't up to snuff?
  - unethical_ban 9y ago
    Because the XBOX and PS and Switch are totally safe, open source products that respect personal information. Linux has more gaming than it did 5-10 years ago, but if someone wants to play a game at top performance on PC, you typically need to choose Windows.
    - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
      >Linux has more gaming than it did 5-10 years ago, but if someone wants to play a game at top performance on PC, you typically need to choose Windows. You can make an argument about the size of the respective platform's game libraries, but not about their performance. Games on Linux often perform as well as or better than Windows. There's no clear trend that suggests the performance of games on Linux are worse than on Windows. And even if it were, what good is 70 FPS over 60 FPS beyond pissing contests? You're limited by your display's refresh rate anyway.
      - falcolas 9y ago
        Many people use monitors with 144hz refresh rates. And increased FPS means you can turn graphics up, or enable more sophisticated anti-aliasing solutions, without impacting absolute performance.
        Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        My point is that the difference isn't going to be enough to be meaningful. If your GPU can drive 144 FPS on your Windows install it can probably drive 144 FPS on your Linux install with the same graphics settings.
        falcolas 9y ago
        I'm just noting why it's not "just a pissing contest". You're right that performance will be similar for games which were built with cross-OS compatibility in mind. But the differences in performance do matter.
        wizbright 9y ago
        That's true, but also some companies cough Nvidia cough have drivers that aren't up to snuff with an OPEN SOURCE system. It's crazy that the software is FREE to access and really there would be no need to pay any real fees to develop better drivers for systems. AMD is one of the big players that has actually been working with the community to help support their cards.
        jwagenet 9y ago
        This is not true: If you increase your target FPS to meet a monitor refresh rate, you must turn down your AA or other graphics settings to compensate when using the same hardware. Going from a 60 Hz to 144 Hz monitor more than doubles the FPS required for Vsync, which requires double the hardware performance to take advantage of the high refresh rate.
        falcolas 9y ago
        If you have 160FPS on a 144hz monitor, you can turn things up. If you have 145FPS on a 144hz monitor, you can't. That's the only point I was trying to make there.
    - wizbright 9y ago
      Even if a game performs better on PC, whose to say it isn't optimized? Some of Vavle's own games have performed better via the Linux build compared to Windows or Mac. It's also super sketchy to not be able to see what's fully happening in one's system.
      - monochromatic 9y ago
        How do you feel about the closed BIOS and Management Engine that underlie everything?
        Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        Frustrated, and I rally against it too. My laptops run coreboot. But the difference between your closed BIOS and your closed OS is that most people actually can choose their OS, whereas fixing the BIOS problem is a much more difficult obstacle.
        deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
        mykull 9y ago
        in my case, it makes me feel double-plus un-good. which is why I go to the trouble of killing the ME on any system I can, despite the at-best trivial impact of doing so.
  - mmagin 9y ago
    Please recommend a Linux CAD program that's as easy to use and featureful as Fusion 360.
  - pjc50 9y ago
    PS4 is also a closed ecosystem, far more so than PC gaming on Windows? Inevitably people end up with a requirement for some Windows program that trips up users or administrators in the workplace. Some workplaces (e.g. mine) are fully paid-up committed Microsoft shops where everyone has MSDN.
    - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
      >PS4 is also a closed ecosystem, far more so than PC gaming on Windows? Baby steps. I don't own a PS4 anyway, but I'm so tired of discussing Windows with people who whine about losing their games that I feel the need to specify an out.
      - gambiting 9y ago
        And I feel a need to point out that you behave like a jerk in this thread and well below the standard HN is known for. If you have a problem with Windows, that's fine, calling people pathetic is not.
      - emodendroket 9y ago
        "Just use Linux." "Well, maybe I would, but this program I use frequently is not available on Linux." "So? You shouldn't want to use that anyway." With a sales pitch like this I can't believe the Year of the Linux Desktop hasn't come to fruition yet.
  - Kagerjay 9y ago
    There's a huge range of applications that are only macOS or windows only that are a miles better in everyway. For instance, apple's sketch. You won't find anything like it even on Windows. For instance, windows PC. You have a ton of native autohotkey applications for writing macros, powerful 3rd party file explorers like directoryOpus, etc. You can't play video games on it, naturally gamedevelopment is a hassle as well. You can't run CAD programs, etc
    - badsectoracula 9y ago
      > You have a ton of native autohotkey applications for writing macros Note that you can do that with X11 too using tools like xbindkeys, xdotool, xnee, xrebind, wmctrl, etc.
      - emodendroket 9y ago
        Well, sure, and DirectX applications could all be written as OpenGL applications instead. But who's going to do that work?
  - Mononokay 9y ago
    Okay, Mr. Stallman.
    - CamperBob2 9y ago
      "Okay, Mr. Stallman, you've successfully forecast everything that's happened in computing over the last few years, and done so literally decades in advance, so thanks for that I guess, but please take off the tinfoil and go away now."
- bsilvereagle 9y ago
  > especially for professional users and gamers. Those whose applications are only available for Windows. I have gotten around this with a virtualized Windows installation for CAD applications. The Windows VM goes online for software activation only. With VFIO, a dedicated graphics card, and an nVME SSD I don't feel any performance degradation. The graphics card and nVME drive are passed directly to the VM. Some simple benchmarks show there is ~3% performance decline in the VM vs booting it native, but I don't "feel" it. Granted, picking VFIO compliant hardware and setting everything up is far outside the ability of the average Windows user.
  - machinesmachine 9y ago
    I'm really surprised it works at all, great job man
    - bsilvereagle 9y ago
      VFIO is the real deal - if you can find the right hardware. Unfortunately, there isn't a master list of VFIO compatible hardware (that I know of). You have to scour reddit or the Red Hat VFIO mailing lists hoping someone has posted the motherboard/processor you're interested in. Once you have hardware, there are lots of resources for pulling it off: https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/vfio.txt https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/vfio.txt https://www.redhat.com/archives/vfio-users/ https://www.redhat.com/archives/vfio-users/ https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVMF https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVM... https://www.reddit.com/r/VFIO/ https://www.reddit.com/r/VFIO/
      - walterbell 9y ago
        Lenovo, Dell or HP business (vPro) desktops will work. Dell T20/T30 is often on sale for under $500.
  - giggles_giggles 9y ago
    What hypervisor are you using to do this?
- Sir_Substance 9y ago
  >It's never that simple, especially for professional users and gamers. Those whose applications are only available for Windows. I'm both, and you're definitely wrong. 155 of my 343 steam games have direct native ports. I've just stopped playing stellaris and started playing KSP. I've been a linux gamer for the last three years and it's been a better experience, not worse. I dominate on ballistic overkill because the input lag is noticeably lower on linux. I'm also a software developer, and with the exception of dotnet development, software development is a considerably smoother and more consistant experience on linux. It grates every day to have to use windows at work, and I do half of my work inside a linux VM.
  - TomMarius 9y ago
    What about AutoCAD, Inventor, Photoshop, AfterEffects, Lightroom, ...?
    - falcolas 9y ago
      Maya, Sketchbook, Fusion, Visual Studio, DirectX, Microsoft Office, Acrobat, ... Here's one really simple example for you of why this Windows software matters to a very large community of professionals: most accounting work is both taught and done in Excel.
    - Sir_Substance 9y ago
      Autocad/inventor->OpenScad/FreeCad Photoshop->Gimp or just run it with wine Lightroom->Darktable Here's a few other pretty awesome art tools you might want to know about BTW: Krita Blender Inkscape If we're doing "what abouts" though, what about: freely interchangable desktop layouts native docker support a user-friendly terminal an os kernel that is designed to be malware resistant Like seriously buddy, the GUI desktop is now ~40 years old and windows /still/ can't support uninstalling the default desktop and installing your own. Custom launchers are one of the most downloaded android app categories, don't try to tell me people don't want it. But hey, at least windows finally got multiple desktops by cribbing the idea from linux after two decades of unsuccessfully trying to tell their customers that it wasn't really that good a feature. If the best you can say about your operating system is "adobe supports it", which is what it seems like you're saying, then oh dear. Like, I get it, photoshop is pretty darn good. But for realsies, we're in a thread where the title post is about microsoft installing random crap on your computer without permission. This is the same company that is showing ads on your lock screen and start bar[1], has been formally chastised by national governments for it's handling of telemetry[2], autoinstalled updates that bricked peoples laptops[3] and then autoinstalled other updates that put other peoples computers in reboot loops[4]. They're gonna keep doing this stuff. For goodness sake, they incentivised peoples "upgrades" from windows 7 by installing nagware with a deliberately malicious UI[5], and attempting to directly cause professional conflict for sysadmins with stability concerns[6]. You're part of an eternal beta of questionable QA control at the hands of a company that has a documented history of behaving unethically. Do they have to send someone round to your house to kill and eat your cat in front of you before you decide you could maybe dig deep and stoop to learning gimp? [1]https://www.pcworld.com/article/3039827/windows/7-ways-windows-10-pushes-ads-at-you-and-how-to-stop-them.html https://www.pcworld.com/article/3039827/windows/7-ways-windo... [2]http://www.zdnet.com/article/french-authorities-serve-notice-to-microsoft-for-windows-10-privacy-failings/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/french-authorities-serve-notice... [3]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/08/25/windows-10-anniversary-update-keeps-breaking-pcs/ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/08/25/windows-10-... [4]http://news.softpedia.com/news/windows-10-fall-creators-update-bug-blocks-the-install-on-some-pcs-518214.shtml http://news.softpedia.com/news/windows-10-fall-creators-upda... [5]https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/229040-microsofts-latest-trick-clicking-x-to-dismiss-windows-10-upgrade-doesnt-stop-upgrade-process https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/229040-microsofts-latest... [6]https://www.windowschimp.com/admins-angered-new-windows-10-upgrade-push/ https://www.windowschimp.com/admins-angered-new-windows-10-u...
- makecheck 9y ago
  Yes “but” how do expect open alternatives to become better? Contribute to a project (with a very low bar for “contribute”, anything from “file a bug” to “fix the documentation” to “make artwork”). Yes, some big companies also push Linux forward but individuals who want good alternatives can do something to make those alternatives happen.
  - falcolas 9y ago
    An open source project for external customers (i.e. us) operated by a bunch of unpaid volunteers will never really be able to compete with an application with paid developers, invested users, and the supporting departments. I'm not saying that open source projects can't get better, that they can't be good, but they will never be as good. For a corollary: https://twitter.com/patio11/status/936629310785437696 https://twitter.com/patio11/status/936629310785437696
    - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
      >I'm not saying that open source projects can't get better, that they can't be good, but they will never be as good. Hah, this is rich. Many open source products are far better than their proprietary alternatives, especially developer oriented products (which is natural considering that developers tend to use open source and tend to improve their own tools).
      - emodendroket 9y ago
        On the other hand, when it comes to categories like games, video game console emulators, office productivity applications, document publishing, etc., the open-source alternatives are generally way worse.
        Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        >games See pretty much every other reply in this thread for my take on this >video game console emulators Wrong, most emulators are open source, support Linux, and work great. >office productivity applications "way worse" is a bit harsh for describing LibreOffice. It works quite well in my experience. >document publishing I don't know what this is supposed to be. LaTeX is pretty good, though.
HenryBemis 9y ago
Sorry Sir_Cmpwn, but that's happening with W10. Windows 8.1 with the 'Windows Firewall Control", classicshell, a strong HOSTS file (someonewhocares.org), and a Firefox with NoScript/ublock/adblock+/etc and you got your privacy control in order. I do agree with the Linux argument you are making, but you cannot swerve 50% of the global Windows users into Linux. It still doesn't have the best UI reputation (although it gets the job done).
- Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
  You can't simultaneously talk about 50% of global Windows users and their struggles with UI and assume they have the foggiest idea how to set up a strong HOSTS file and a carefully secured Firefox installation. How about they just don't use a hostile OS? If you're defending yourself from your own operating system, you've chosen the wrong damn operating system. Also, I don't want to hear the UI argument when KDE Plasma exists. I bet 90% or better of Windows users would be comfortable on Plasma.
  - blibble 9y ago
    > If you're defending yourself from your own operating system, you've chosen the wrong damn operating system. this is exactly 100% dead on the money prior to Windows 10 Microsoft was at worst known for producing unreliable mediocre quality software, but they were trustworthy (at least for the end user) Windows 10 changed everything, at the point you're fighting the company that made the OS to not spy on you, not show you ads, not reboot against your will and not reinstall random crapware you previously removed: it's time to switch
- Bl4ckb0ne 9y ago
  Plasma is basically windows 10 UI, and Cinnamon is windows 7 UI.
- TPPOW0020 9y ago
  As a professional who gets work done with Linux, I disagree. Lots of desktop environments (KDE, XFCE, Cinnamon) offer a UI is just as polished as mac or windows. Lack of suitable software can be a dealbreaker for some professions. There aren't many professional video editing suites, for example. But in companies I've worked at, most workers only need a browser and an office suite to do their jobs. Linux would work for them. I think the real obstacle is training. You have a workforce that's already used to the way windows works. It's easier to hire IT people with windows experience than it is with Linux. Users know how to do their tasks in Microsoft office, and even though Libre office is similar, they might have to learn a few new things.
Sohcahtoa82 9y ago
I'd switch to Linux in the blink of an eye if I didn't have to worry about my games working. WINE is great and all, but it's still not 100% compatible.
- Bl4ckb0ne 9y ago
  How about contributing to make things better
  - da_chicken 9y ago
    Not every user is capable of being a developer for every application they want to use.
    - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
      Then donate however many thousands of dollars you were going to spend on Autodesk/etc licenses to Blender, Krita, Gimp, etc. Blender and Krita are competitive with their commercial counterparts and Gimp is getting there.
      - Alupis 9y ago
        I'm a very strong advocate of Open Source Software, and all things Linux as well. I've used Gimp, Inkscape, and others... but sometimes you just need to get work done, and the closed source proprietary application is what you need, I'm sorry to say. Donating thousands of dollars to Gimp today isn't going to put it on par with Photoshop today... I wish it would. Maybe it could be in a few years... but I need to get work done right now. Sometimes you do need a commercial interest behind something to drive it's progress. That doesn't mean it has to be closed and proprietary, but they often are, sadly.
        Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        Time moves inexorably forward. Donate today and "a few years" will come.
youseecomrade 9y ago
The majority of people who could use Linux exclusively (only need a browser, don't need Office compatibility, nothing fancy) buy a "just works" Windows laptop or tablet and I bet 99% of them don't even know what Linux is. Even then you get some weird cases like banking software not working on Linux and they ask you to install Windows again. And kids wants to play what their friends are playing, it's hard to break the cycle. Oh you want to play PUBG? Too bad. Some games you might even be able to make it work with some baby sitting but it will drain all your energy and you are not getting paid for the job. If you want Linux to have a chance it needs to play the long game and that won't ever happen. Everything I own except my gaming PC is Linux but it's not even worth trying to convert others. I find pretty immature to suggest "if your job demands Windows, just quit", "just spend 20 hours trying to make this thing that just works in Windows", "you don't need AAA games". I say immature because I was doing this shit a few years ago and I still cringe about it. In my experience trying to teach people about the importance of privacy is mostly futile. What worked was, and I only did this to a close family friend, to show him what I could learn about him just by showing what was stored in AppData and many other folders. Some thumbnails will be forever ingrained in my mind.
- thomastjeffery 9y ago
  I'm getting sick of this dichotomy. It's trivial to install both. Keep windows 10 on a partition big enough for your games/Netflix/etc., and use Debian/Archlinux/NixOS/whatever for everything else.
  - emodendroket 9y ago
    Trivial to install both but a real hassle to actually use both.
    - juliangoldsmith 9y ago
      Not really. You reboot your computer, and press a key to pick which one you want.
Feniks 9y ago
Or you can just say "FUCK it" get Enterprise LTSB, spend a few hours tweaking it and never have to worry about anything for 5 years. Yes you're breaking the law but when did that stop anyone?
stagger87 9y ago
I'll switch when all my customers switch.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
emodendroket 9y ago
Thanks for the advice. I will just ask everyone who wrote the software I use to port it.

falcolas 9y ago

It's never that simple, especially for professional users and gamers. Those whose applications are only available for Windows. Sure, there are some open source alternatives, but they are only rarely as good, and even more seldom better, than their Windows counterparts.

Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
Gamers who bend over for the sake of their hobby are a pathetic bunch. Linux has many, many great games, and if that's not enough supplement it with a PS4 or something and you'll never be bored. Most professionals would have no problem using Linux for their needs. What applications are you suggesting aren't up to snuff?
- unethical_ban 9y ago
  Because the XBOX and PS and Switch are totally safe, open source products that respect personal information. Linux has more gaming than it did 5-10 years ago, but if someone wants to play a game at top performance on PC, you typically need to choose Windows.
  - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
    >Linux has more gaming than it did 5-10 years ago, but if someone wants to play a game at top performance on PC, you typically need to choose Windows. You can make an argument about the size of the respective platform's game libraries, but not about their performance. Games on Linux often perform as well as or better than Windows. There's no clear trend that suggests the performance of games on Linux are worse than on Windows. And even if it were, what good is 70 FPS over 60 FPS beyond pissing contests? You're limited by your display's refresh rate anyway.
    - falcolas 9y ago
      Many people use monitors with 144hz refresh rates. And increased FPS means you can turn graphics up, or enable more sophisticated anti-aliasing solutions, without impacting absolute performance.
      - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        My point is that the difference isn't going to be enough to be meaningful. If your GPU can drive 144 FPS on your Windows install it can probably drive 144 FPS on your Linux install with the same graphics settings.
        falcolas 9y ago
        I'm just noting why it's not "just a pissing contest". You're right that performance will be similar for games which were built with cross-OS compatibility in mind. But the differences in performance do matter.
      - wizbright 9y ago
        That's true, but also some companies cough Nvidia cough have drivers that aren't up to snuff with an OPEN SOURCE system. It's crazy that the software is FREE to access and really there would be no need to pay any real fees to develop better drivers for systems. AMD is one of the big players that has actually been working with the community to help support their cards.
      - jwagenet 9y ago
        This is not true: If you increase your target FPS to meet a monitor refresh rate, you must turn down your AA or other graphics settings to compensate when using the same hardware. Going from a 60 Hz to 144 Hz monitor more than doubles the FPS required for Vsync, which requires double the hardware performance to take advantage of the high refresh rate.
        falcolas 9y ago
        If you have 160FPS on a 144hz monitor, you can turn things up. If you have 145FPS on a 144hz monitor, you can't. That's the only point I was trying to make there.
  - wizbright 9y ago
    Even if a game performs better on PC, whose to say it isn't optimized? Some of Vavle's own games have performed better via the Linux build compared to Windows or Mac. It's also super sketchy to not be able to see what's fully happening in one's system.
    - monochromatic 9y ago
      How do you feel about the closed BIOS and Management Engine that underlie everything?
      - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        Frustrated, and I rally against it too. My laptops run coreboot. But the difference between your closed BIOS and your closed OS is that most people actually can choose their OS, whereas fixing the BIOS problem is a much more difficult obstacle.
      - deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
      - mykull 9y ago
        in my case, it makes me feel double-plus un-good. which is why I go to the trouble of killing the ME on any system I can, despite the at-best trivial impact of doing so.
- mmagin 9y ago
  Please recommend a Linux CAD program that's as easy to use and featureful as Fusion 360.
- pjc50 9y ago
  PS4 is also a closed ecosystem, far more so than PC gaming on Windows? Inevitably people end up with a requirement for some Windows program that trips up users or administrators in the workplace. Some workplaces (e.g. mine) are fully paid-up committed Microsoft shops where everyone has MSDN.
  - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
    >PS4 is also a closed ecosystem, far more so than PC gaming on Windows? Baby steps. I don't own a PS4 anyway, but I'm so tired of discussing Windows with people who whine about losing their games that I feel the need to specify an out.
    - gambiting 9y ago
      And I feel a need to point out that you behave like a jerk in this thread and well below the standard HN is known for. If you have a problem with Windows, that's fine, calling people pathetic is not.
    - emodendroket 9y ago
      "Just use Linux." "Well, maybe I would, but this program I use frequently is not available on Linux." "So? You shouldn't want to use that anyway." With a sales pitch like this I can't believe the Year of the Linux Desktop hasn't come to fruition yet.
- Kagerjay 9y ago
  There's a huge range of applications that are only macOS or windows only that are a miles better in everyway. For instance, apple's sketch. You won't find anything like it even on Windows. For instance, windows PC. You have a ton of native autohotkey applications for writing macros, powerful 3rd party file explorers like directoryOpus, etc. You can't play video games on it, naturally gamedevelopment is a hassle as well. You can't run CAD programs, etc
  - badsectoracula 9y ago
    > You have a ton of native autohotkey applications for writing macros Note that you can do that with X11 too using tools like xbindkeys, xdotool, xnee, xrebind, wmctrl, etc.
    - emodendroket 9y ago
      Well, sure, and DirectX applications could all be written as OpenGL applications instead. But who's going to do that work?
- Mononokay 9y ago
  Okay, Mr. Stallman.
  - CamperBob2 9y ago
    "Okay, Mr. Stallman, you've successfully forecast everything that's happened in computing over the last few years, and done so literally decades in advance, so thanks for that I guess, but please take off the tinfoil and go away now."
bsilvereagle 9y ago
> especially for professional users and gamers. Those whose applications are only available for Windows. I have gotten around this with a virtualized Windows installation for CAD applications. The Windows VM goes online for software activation only. With VFIO, a dedicated graphics card, and an nVME SSD I don't feel any performance degradation. The graphics card and nVME drive are passed directly to the VM. Some simple benchmarks show there is ~3% performance decline in the VM vs booting it native, but I don't "feel" it. Granted, picking VFIO compliant hardware and setting everything up is far outside the ability of the average Windows user.
- machinesmachine 9y ago
  I'm really surprised it works at all, great job man
  - bsilvereagle 9y ago
    VFIO is the real deal - if you can find the right hardware. Unfortunately, there isn't a master list of VFIO compatible hardware (that I know of). You have to scour reddit or the Red Hat VFIO mailing lists hoping someone has posted the motherboard/processor you're interested in. Once you have hardware, there are lots of resources for pulling it off: https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/vfio.txt https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/vfio.txt https://www.redhat.com/archives/vfio-users/ https://www.redhat.com/archives/vfio-users/ https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVMF https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVM... https://www.reddit.com/r/VFIO/ https://www.reddit.com/r/VFIO/
    - walterbell 9y ago
      Lenovo, Dell or HP business (vPro) desktops will work. Dell T20/T30 is often on sale for under $500.
- giggles_giggles 9y ago
  What hypervisor are you using to do this?
Sir_Substance 9y ago
>It's never that simple, especially for professional users and gamers. Those whose applications are only available for Windows. I'm both, and you're definitely wrong. 155 of my 343 steam games have direct native ports. I've just stopped playing stellaris and started playing KSP. I've been a linux gamer for the last three years and it's been a better experience, not worse. I dominate on ballistic overkill because the input lag is noticeably lower on linux. I'm also a software developer, and with the exception of dotnet development, software development is a considerably smoother and more consistant experience on linux. It grates every day to have to use windows at work, and I do half of my work inside a linux VM.
- TomMarius 9y ago
  What about AutoCAD, Inventor, Photoshop, AfterEffects, Lightroom, ...?
  - falcolas 9y ago
    Maya, Sketchbook, Fusion, Visual Studio, DirectX, Microsoft Office, Acrobat, ... Here's one really simple example for you of why this Windows software matters to a very large community of professionals: most accounting work is both taught and done in Excel.
  - Sir_Substance 9y ago
    Autocad/inventor->OpenScad/FreeCad Photoshop->Gimp or just run it with wine Lightroom->Darktable Here's a few other pretty awesome art tools you might want to know about BTW: Krita Blender Inkscape If we're doing "what abouts" though, what about: freely interchangable desktop layouts native docker support a user-friendly terminal an os kernel that is designed to be malware resistant Like seriously buddy, the GUI desktop is now ~40 years old and windows /still/ can't support uninstalling the default desktop and installing your own. Custom launchers are one of the most downloaded android app categories, don't try to tell me people don't want it. But hey, at least windows finally got multiple desktops by cribbing the idea from linux after two decades of unsuccessfully trying to tell their customers that it wasn't really that good a feature. If the best you can say about your operating system is "adobe supports it", which is what it seems like you're saying, then oh dear. Like, I get it, photoshop is pretty darn good. But for realsies, we're in a thread where the title post is about microsoft installing random crap on your computer without permission. This is the same company that is showing ads on your lock screen and start bar[1], has been formally chastised by national governments for it's handling of telemetry[2], autoinstalled updates that bricked peoples laptops[3] and then autoinstalled other updates that put other peoples computers in reboot loops[4]. They're gonna keep doing this stuff. For goodness sake, they incentivised peoples "upgrades" from windows 7 by installing nagware with a deliberately malicious UI[5], and attempting to directly cause professional conflict for sysadmins with stability concerns[6]. You're part of an eternal beta of questionable QA control at the hands of a company that has a documented history of behaving unethically. Do they have to send someone round to your house to kill and eat your cat in front of you before you decide you could maybe dig deep and stoop to learning gimp? [1]https://www.pcworld.com/article/3039827/windows/7-ways-windows-10-pushes-ads-at-you-and-how-to-stop-them.html https://www.pcworld.com/article/3039827/windows/7-ways-windo... [2]http://www.zdnet.com/article/french-authorities-serve-notice-to-microsoft-for-windows-10-privacy-failings/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/french-authorities-serve-notice... [3]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/08/25/windows-10-anniversary-update-keeps-breaking-pcs/ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/08/25/windows-10-... [4]http://news.softpedia.com/news/windows-10-fall-creators-update-bug-blocks-the-install-on-some-pcs-518214.shtml http://news.softpedia.com/news/windows-10-fall-creators-upda... [5]https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/229040-microsofts-latest-trick-clicking-x-to-dismiss-windows-10-upgrade-doesnt-stop-upgrade-process https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/229040-microsofts-latest... [6]https://www.windowschimp.com/admins-angered-new-windows-10-upgrade-push/ https://www.windowschimp.com/admins-angered-new-windows-10-u...
makecheck 9y ago
Yes “but” how do expect open alternatives to become better? Contribute to a project (with a very low bar for “contribute”, anything from “file a bug” to “fix the documentation” to “make artwork”). Yes, some big companies also push Linux forward but individuals who want good alternatives can do something to make those alternatives happen.
- falcolas 9y ago
  An open source project for external customers (i.e. us) operated by a bunch of unpaid volunteers will never really be able to compete with an application with paid developers, invested users, and the supporting departments. I'm not saying that open source projects can't get better, that they can't be good, but they will never be as good. For a corollary: https://twitter.com/patio11/status/936629310785437696 https://twitter.com/patio11/status/936629310785437696
  - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
    >I'm not saying that open source projects can't get better, that they can't be good, but they will never be as good. Hah, this is rich. Many open source products are far better than their proprietary alternatives, especially developer oriented products (which is natural considering that developers tend to use open source and tend to improve their own tools).
    - emodendroket 9y ago
      On the other hand, when it comes to categories like games, video game console emulators, office productivity applications, document publishing, etc., the open-source alternatives are generally way worse.
      - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        >games See pretty much every other reply in this thread for my take on this >video game console emulators Wrong, most emulators are open source, support Linux, and work great. >office productivity applications "way worse" is a bit harsh for describing LibreOffice. It works quite well in my experience. >document publishing I don't know what this is supposed to be. LaTeX is pretty good, though.

HenryBemis 9y ago

Sorry Sir_Cmpwn, but that's happening with W10. Windows 8.1 with the 'Windows Firewall Control", classicshell, a strong HOSTS file (someonewhocares.org), and a Firefox with NoScript/ublock/adblock+/etc and you got your privacy control in order. I do agree with the Linux argument you are making, but you cannot swerve 50% of the global Windows users into Linux. It still doesn't have the best UI reputation (although it gets the job done).

Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
You can't simultaneously talk about 50% of global Windows users and their struggles with UI and assume they have the foggiest idea how to set up a strong HOSTS file and a carefully secured Firefox installation. How about they just don't use a hostile OS? If you're defending yourself from your own operating system, you've chosen the wrong damn operating system. Also, I don't want to hear the UI argument when KDE Plasma exists. I bet 90% or better of Windows users would be comfortable on Plasma.
- blibble 9y ago
  > If you're defending yourself from your own operating system, you've chosen the wrong damn operating system. this is exactly 100% dead on the money prior to Windows 10 Microsoft was at worst known for producing unreliable mediocre quality software, but they were trustworthy (at least for the end user) Windows 10 changed everything, at the point you're fighting the company that made the OS to not spy on you, not show you ads, not reboot against your will and not reinstall random crapware you previously removed: it's time to switch
Bl4ckb0ne 9y ago
Plasma is basically windows 10 UI, and Cinnamon is windows 7 UI.
TPPOW0020 9y ago
As a professional who gets work done with Linux, I disagree. Lots of desktop environments (KDE, XFCE, Cinnamon) offer a UI is just as polished as mac or windows. Lack of suitable software can be a dealbreaker for some professions. There aren't many professional video editing suites, for example. But in companies I've worked at, most workers only need a browser and an office suite to do their jobs. Linux would work for them. I think the real obstacle is training. You have a workforce that's already used to the way windows works. It's easier to hire IT people with windows experience than it is with Linux. Users know how to do their tasks in Microsoft office, and even though Libre office is similar, they might have to learn a few new things.

Sohcahtoa82 9y ago

I'd switch to Linux in the blink of an eye if I didn't have to worry about my games working. WINE is great and all, but it's still not 100% compatible.

Bl4ckb0ne 9y ago
How about contributing to make things better
- da_chicken 9y ago
  Not every user is capable of being a developer for every application they want to use.
  - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
    Then donate however many thousands of dollars you were going to spend on Autodesk/etc licenses to Blender, Krita, Gimp, etc. Blender and Krita are competitive with their commercial counterparts and Gimp is getting there.
    - Alupis 9y ago
      I'm a very strong advocate of Open Source Software, and all things Linux as well. I've used Gimp, Inkscape, and others... but sometimes you just need to get work done, and the closed source proprietary application is what you need, I'm sorry to say. Donating thousands of dollars to Gimp today isn't going to put it on par with Photoshop today... I wish it would. Maybe it could be in a few years... but I need to get work done right now. Sometimes you do need a commercial interest behind something to drive it's progress. That doesn't mean it has to be closed and proprietary, but they often are, sadly.
      - Sir_Cmpwn 9y ago
        Time moves inexorably forward. Donate today and "a few years" will come.

youseecomrade 9y ago

The majority of people who could use Linux exclusively (only need a browser, don't need Office compatibility, nothing fancy) buy a "just works" Windows laptop or tablet and I bet 99% of them don't even know what Linux is. Even then you get some weird cases like banking software not working on Linux and they ask you to install Windows again. And kids wants to play what their friends are playing, it's hard to break the cycle. Oh you want to play PUBG? Too bad. Some games you might even be able to make it work with some baby sitting but it will drain all your energy and you are not getting paid for the job. If you want Linux to have a chance it needs to play the long game and that won't ever happen. Everything I own except my gaming PC is Linux but it's not even worth trying to convert others. I find pretty immature to suggest "if your job demands Windows, just quit", "just spend 20 hours trying to make this thing that just works in Windows", "you don't need AAA games". I say immature because I was doing this shit a few years ago and I still cringe about it. In my experience trying to teach people about the importance of privacy is mostly futile. What worked was, and I only did this to a close family friend, to show him what I could learn about him just by showing what was stored in AppData and many other folders. Some thumbnails will be forever ingrained in my mind.

thomastjeffery 9y ago
I'm getting sick of this dichotomy. It's trivial to install both. Keep windows 10 on a partition big enough for your games/Netflix/etc., and use Debian/Archlinux/NixOS/whatever for everything else.
- emodendroket 9y ago
  Trivial to install both but a real hassle to actually use both.
  - juliangoldsmith 9y ago
    Not really. You reboot your computer, and press a key to pick which one you want.

Feniks 9y ago

Or you can just say "FUCK it" get Enterprise LTSB, spend a few hours tweaking it and never have to worry about anything for 5 years. Yes you're breaking the law but when did that stop anyone?

stagger87 9y ago

I'll switch when all my customers switch.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

emodendroket 9y ago

Thanks for the advice. I will just ask everyone who wrote the software I use to port it.