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Why wouldn't something like this be released in America? What would the cost of this car be if it was sold in America including the changes it would need to co
by toisanji 9y ago
Why wouldn't something like this be released in America? What would the cost of this car be if it was sold in America including the changes it would need to comply with American standards? If it cost $10k, I would buy a couple of them immediately. Its perfect for city driving.
- jws 9y agoIt is already $14k, the lower price is with incentives. It is 10” smaller than a Smart car, top speed is 62mph, and it has a 90 mile range. That’s rough sell in America even before you try to make it safe enough to pass a crash test. (It might be, but I’m guessing with all the compromises they cut back on safety too.)
- r00fus 9y agoSafety costs money not just due to engineering but the testing and compliance process unique to each car model.
- icpmacdo 9y agoMaybe in China they could effectively modify a city with these and level 4 self driving. It seems like it could be a place where people would want to live.
- seanmcdirmid 9y agoI have a feeling china will be the first to adopt self driving cars for mainly for environmental and congestion concerns; they are also authoritarian enough to actually do it. So ya, this could very well happen in 10 years or so.
- JSONwebtoken 9y agoHmmm something about a tiny automotive vehicle with a top speed of 62 mph and maybe a 80ft braking distance makes me feel more comfortable with getting into one. Certainly a higher error tolerance and lower risk of fatality as compared to a 5000 lb Tesla that goes to 0-60 in 2.4 seconds and takes a football field and a half to slow down. Maybe they should just make all self-driving cars weigh 1500 lbs and top out at 45 mph. Not a big deal when they run into each other, like bumper cars.
- PaulRobinson 9y agoI don't know what the bumper cars were like where you grew up, but a crash at 45mph, or even 20mph, is not quite the same thing and considerably less enjoyable. :-)
- JSONwebtoken 9y agoI get rear ended about twice a year in LA traffic by 4500 lb SUVs going 40-50 mph. I've learned to adjust the headrest on my seat properly so my head only jerks back an inch or two and I don't get whiplash anymore. I think collisions below 40 mph are quite survivable if they're not two-way head on/overlap and the cars are below a certain weight and designed to bounce against each other. They just need to make every autonomous car on the road 1500-2000lb and install rubber bumpers. The neural net will figure it out itself after a few million real world collisions and daily commutes will gradually become less jarring and eventful.
- BoorishBears 9y agoHave you seen the crash tests on these cars? I wouldn't trust them not to permanently injure you in a collision at 20 mph.
- mikeash 9y agoA football field and a half? A Tesla's stopping distance, like most decent modern cars, is a bit over 100ft from 60MPH.
- freeone3000 9y agoBraking distance in a Tesla is shorter in practice than what they're claiming here. Sports cars, even the luxury sports-lite that Tesla ends up in, are easier to stop than the average car.
- Buge 9y agoThe US has EV incentives as well.
- JustSomeNobody 9y agoMost Americans have to drive 90 miles just to go to the grocery store and back[0]. That's why there'd be no market here. Our cities were laid out with abundant gas forever in mind. [0] Slight exaggeration.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- smt88 9y agoYou can get a used Leaf for $5-10k very easily, and it'll still have several years left on the warranty.
- adventured 9y agoCan you point to somewhere that you can buy a used Leaf for close to $7,500 with several years of warranty left?
- bri3d 9y agoI suspect OP was factoring in tax incentives - for example, in Colorado the EV tax credit can be taken the first time vehicles are registered in the state, so there's a cottage market in importing lightly used Leafs from other states which easily come in around the 10k mark to the buyer.
- twblalock 9y agoYou can get decent Nissan Leafs with under 40k miles for less than $10k cash in California right now on sites like Carfax and AutoTrader -- no tax incentives are required to get them down to that price. The depreciation is that bad. If you bought one and took it to Colorado, you'd save even more money.
- loeg 9y agoThey depreciate really fast. I'm not sure about still having years on the warranty, but fairly young EVs can be had for far less than the new price.
- joatmon-snoo 9y agohttps://www.carfax.com/Used-Nissan-Leaf_w536 https://www.carfax.com/Used-Nissan-Leaf_w536
- X86BSD 9y agoReally??? Wow, I thought about one when Nissan first hit the market with them but the price for a limited range car? No thanks but if they are that cheap I would grab one for a commuter! Are these certified nissan resales? Or just on the open market?
- MrFoof 9y agoSeveral manufacturers have very cheap cars available in other markets. Renault immediately comes to mind with the model year 2016 Kwid that is sold in emerging markets. One of the things you may find unpalatable is how they hold up in crash tests. That is, they don't or they don't do it very well. At those price points, safety is truly optional. Let's compare the Renault Kwid that was tested in March 2016, and a newer Renault Kwid III with a driver-side airbag that was tested a month later. * Renault Kwid I: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3Xiw-xP3HA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a3Xiw-xP3HA * Renault Kwid III: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi1LgUrd5fI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi1LgUrd5fI The newer Kwid certainly didn't have _complete structural cabin failure_, but forces experienced and expected injuries still resulted in 0-stars for front occupants. You get what you pay for. Here's an Indian news story (cheap car safety was a hot button issue in 2016) that included an interim revision of the Kwid (the Kwid II, amongst other current cars failing crash tests) which fared better structurally, but had the driver basically eat the steering wheel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qqbQZBmxyE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qqbQZBmxyE Renault isn't some scrappy upstart either -- they know how to engineer very safe cars, but they (as does sister company Nissan, as well as Hyundai and VW) sometimes make some pretty sketchy stuff for emerging markets.
- Reason077 9y agoChina-NCAP is now broadly comparable with Euro-NCAP when it comes to crash safety. So new vehicle models coming to market in China should have similar levels of structural safety to US and European-market models. There is no comparison with markets like India and Brazil, which have far weaker crash safety standards.
- MrFoof 9y agoThis is because of highly publicized failures in past years, and it similarly being brought to the forefront by the Chinese media earlier this decade. I suspect by 2020 cars like the Renault Kwid will mostly be a thing of the past in India as well, and poor vehicle safety is also becoming an increasingly contentious issue in Brazil.
- evan_ 9y agoA company local to me has raised $20M and sold thousnds of preorders on the promise of a $12,000 electric: https://www.arcimoto.com https://www.arcimoto.com Not yet shipping, of course...
- skrebbel 9y ago> If it cost $10k, I would buy a couple of them immediately. Totally off topic, but I keep being surprised by how ridiculously rich the average HN'er appears to be. You talk about buying cars like they're Mars bars. :-)
- agumonkey 9y agoFrom outside the US it seems crazy, but considering Tesla says 35K is accessible price, 5K is barely nothing. Probably the cost of old used cars.
- falsedan 9y agoIn the states? $5k would get you a great used car, a 5 year old mid-range sedan with <100k miles Or you could buy 2-3 20 year old Civics/Camrys, use one as the primary and cannibalise parts from the others to keep it going
- 24gttghh 9y agoEasier said than done! I can't imagine trying to find three of the same old car and expect each one to have the same critical parts that aren't already rusted out/failed. Where I am in the NE, road-salt destroys everything. To add to that, $5K might work in southern states, but I haven't had much luck finding something relatively new for $5K that didn't have serious rust issues as well.
- dsfyu404ed 9y agoEventually you'll figure out that trying to inform a group of mostly (or at least they're the largest minority if they're not the majority) Californians about things like corrosion, winter, potholes, etc is a very lost cause... Source: BTDT
- 24gttghh 9y agoWell SF is surrounded by salt water, so I would think that must have a corrosive effect when it rolls in on the fog.
- tomelders 9y agoSafety standards, or lack thereof. Which raises the question; is it OK to manufacture and sell a vehicle that you know doesn't meet critical safety standards that you would expect in the vehicle you drive, just because the country you're selling in doesn't care?
- ghaff 9y agoMostly yes? Safety systems aren't a binary thing. One of my vehicles is a 20 year old car that I'd be pretty sure doesn't have all the safety systems required in a new car being sold today. That doesn't mean it's unsafe.
- tomelders 9y agoBut you're not mass producing that car and selling it to people knowing full well that statistically, a portion of your customers will be involved an a traffic incident that the vehicle is not capeable of withstanding, because you cheated out on the safety features.
- tpudlik 9y agoThis depends on what the alternative is. For people who can't afford an American sticker price for a car, the choice is between a less safe (but cheaper) car and the near-suicidal experience of riding a motorbike. Selling "unsafe" cars may actually save lives.
- tomelders 9y agohmmmm, good point. But if i was a car designer, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable compromising on safety features that I know are possible.
- jokoon 9y agoFirst guess is regulations. A chinese car might not be so safe, or durable.
- nhumrich 9y agoThis car would probably never pass safety standards in the US.