9 ms·

A music-lover's guide to tinnitus

182 points by thirdsun 9y ago

sbuccini 9y ago
Additional reading that provided much needed (for me, at least) scientific context around the condition: http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/04/03/high-tech-hope-for-the-hard-of-hearing http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/04/03/high-tech-hope-...
glitcher 9y ago
The article links to http://www.notchtherapy.com/ http://www.notchtherapy.com/ which looks very interesting. I plan on following the steps outlined there to create a custom notch filter for my tinnitus frequency. Has anyone here played with this technique before?
- abrichr 9y ago
  Check out http://www.audionotch.com/ http://www.audionotch.com/
sparkzilla 9y ago
Somewhat ironically, tests are being conducted to use MDMA/Ecstasy as a possible cure for tinnitus. [1] http://mixmag.net/read/scientists-have-completed-trials-attempting-to-cure-tinnitus-with-mdma-news http://mixmag.net/read/scientists-have-completed-trials-atte...
probably_wrong 9y ago
> As one RA employee puts it, dance music is "not made to be played to people wearing earplugs. When you put them in it's never going to sound the same." This seems to me very similar to the reasons people give to avoid using condoms. And helmets. And smoking. I think putting hundreds of young people in a room guaranteed to give you hearing loss is madness. But then again, I was always boring.
- civilian 9y ago
  Yeah, I agree. I wish that venues and soundguys would just fucking lower the volume. I definitely avoid a lot of venues for simply this reason! I'm starting to think that people at venues ought to be able to sue venue owners for any sound that is over 85 decibels.
  - lfam 9y ago
    I'm sympathetic to your complaint, but consider that 85 dB is quieter than an unamplified symphony orchestra or the cabin of most cruising airliners.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - civilian 9y ago
      Hmmm. Yeah maybe 85db is pretty low. There is some threshold that I feel pretty confident about, but I don't know what number it actually is. Looking here: http://www.webmd.com/brain/tc/harmful-noise-levels-topic-overview http://www.webmd.com/brain/tc/harmful-noise-levels-topic-ove... I suspect it's more likely 110db. I'm also maybe grumpier because I went to a show last night and I've had weird hearing all morning. :/
      - lfam 9y ago
        Well, extended exposure to 85 dB will cause hearing loss. I think a good techno club will not be louder than 100 dB. But my point was that many environments we consider "safe", "normal", or "enjoyable" are actually dangerous to our hearing, so we have to enter them with an understanding that we are trading temporary enjoyment for long-term health.
      - tim333 9y ago
        The UK Health and Safety Executive has that you should go over an "Event LAeq of more than 107 dB or C-weighted peak sound pressure levels of more than 140 dB." Which is quite loud.
jdc0589 9y ago
as a metalhead and frequent concert-goer, this is something I am INCREDIBLY careful about. I'm one of those people that already has a hard time hearing in environments with background noise for some reason. 1. earplugs at shows or anywhere with sustained loud sound are critical. Disposable foam earplugs are a last resort. If you are a frequent concert-goer, do yourself a favor and AT LEAST get a pair of Eymotic ETY-Plugs or something similar ($13, https://www.amazon.com/ETY-Plugs-Fidelity-Earplugs-Standard-Frost/dp/B0015WJQ7A https://www.amazon.com/ETY-Plugs-Fidelity-Earplugs-Standard-...). They will fit way better, isolate more sound, and sound a TON better; you will still be able to enjoy the show, I promise. 2. If you go to shows a lot, get custom plugs made; just do it. Price will be $80-$200, including getting professional molds made by an audiologist, but it is worth it. I can not even feel mine when they are in my ears, the fit is that good (mine are from 64 Audio, they have a 20% off sale a few times a year). 3. If you spend a lot of time with headphones, be really careful about keeping the volume low. If something sounds too faint, just leave it for a few minutes; a lot of they time your ears adjust and that lower volume you thought was too faint is actually just fine or maybe even still too loud. 4. I acknowledge how ridiculous of a suggestion this is price wise, but if you spend hours a day with headphones on, consider custom molded IEMs. Yes, they are expensive as shit (anywhere from ~$250 to infinity dollars), but they will seal in your ears perfectly. This gives you much better isolation from ambient sound in your environment, so you can listen to music at MUCH lower volumes comfortably. On average, sound quality is MUCH better than the headphones/earbuds you were using before too. Do not fuck about with your hearing.
- swsieber 9y ago
  I'd like to echo point 3 - I eventually got to the point where I could listen to music on the lowest volume, because I had gotten used to the volume.
  - civilian 9y ago
    So, I often listen to podcasts in bed with earbuds. It's night, and it's quiet, and I've found that I actually _bottom out_-- I'm at the lowest volume setting, with the next lowest being "mute", and I wish I could lower it a few more times. I need finer control over volume. (I'm on android, if anyone has any solutions...)
derekp7 9y ago
I've started getting the ringing in the ears a few years ago. However, it gets more pronounced when I twist my neck certain ways -- and it seems to let up a bit by stretching my neck in a different direction. Seeing as how I also have periodic neck pain, I wonder if pinched nerves there are contributing to the tinnitus symptoms? Also, there are some days on the drive home from work where the tinnitus is completely gone -- but it comes back strong the next morning, especially if it feels that I didn't have a good sleeping position.
- thatswrong0 9y ago
  > but it comes back strong the next morning, especially if it feels that I didn't have a good sleeping position. If I sleep on my stomach too many days in a row, my tinnitus really flares up. I definitely think there's a neck component to it.
- jahewson 9y ago
  Tight muscles in the face, jaw, and neck, and shoulders are the most likely culprit. It's almost certainly not nerves. For me it was "forward head" posture which needed to be corrected through strengthening exercises and a careful reassessment of my desk work and driving positions. I'd highly recommend visiting a good upper cervical chiropractor.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
hfkeysrdhf 9y ago
I'd like to point out that, sadly, not all tinnitus is caused by hearing loss. My tinnitus started despite being young and having subjected myself to far fewer loud noises, including concerts, than the average person. My doctor believes that mine is likely due to a neurological issue, but that we will never know the true cause. To satisfy our own curiosity (and determine if we could attempt to treat it with steroids, which is possible during the few weeks after the onset of tinnitus induced by hearing loss), we had my hearing tested. As expected, absolutely no hearing loss. As others have said, I felt suicidal during those first few weeks. Thankfully, I've since learned to live with it.
- alva 9y ago
  > As others have said, I felt suicidal during those first few weeks. Thankfully, I've since learned to live with it. An incredibly common feeling among those who have recently got tinnitus. I felt this way to and unfortunately no matter how many times I read that people learnt to live with it, I never really took it on board. For anyone reading who has got it, it really does get better. Eventually (6 months min from what I have read) your brain starts to tune it out. Only a very, very small number of people are unfortunate enough to have it persist without some dulling. Try not to despair or panic, it almost certainly will significantly dull and fade into the background after a few months. At some point, it not being present will be normal again. Nowadays I notice a mild shadow of what it once was, maybe 4 times a year for an hour after a severe initial case.
- goeric 9y ago
  Mine was came after attempting to pop my ears during a very bad ear infection. I was trying to relieve the pressure, as I have done a lot, but because of the bad ear infection it was actually making it worse. The pain was so bad and it felt like my ear was never going to pop. Eventually, the pain subsided but at that exact same time, in place of the pain, was a ringing. My ENT said the tinnitus was most likely caused by the bad ear infection and tried to assure me that me trying to pop my ears didn't have anything to do with it, but I can't help but feel like that wasn't the case, as I made the pain so much worse. Anyways, agreed with others here that the first few months were the worst, and now it's mostly unnoticeable unless I actively think about it, drink a lot, or leave a loud environment.
amluto 9y ago
The article repeats points like this quite a few times: > I like hearing my music at loud volumes, as everyone does. I don't think this is true. A lot of people like going to the kinds of events that have loud music, but I've seen a lot of people who don't like the volume. One obvious example: most of the weddings I've been to recently turn into dance parties, and the volume creeps its way up and up. As this happens, a lot of the guests start moving farther from the speakers, off the dance floor, and eventually out of the room. Dancing: lots of fun. Ear-splitting volume: not necessarily. At my wedding, we picked a great band and kept the music at a comfortable level, and most of the guests danced the whole time and even the non-dancing guests clustered around the dance floor. I can't prove causation, but I bet the tolerable volume had a lot to do with it. So maybe the real solution is for people to start trying to figure out why the norm for concerts is to have the volume painfully loud. It's possible that guests just might enjoy them more with quieter music.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- silviogutierrez 9y ago
  I agree. I love dancing, especially to live music. And I'm a musician myself. But I avoid restaurants and places with live music unless the sole purpose is dancing. They advertise live music as a feature but sadly I treat it as a negative. Maybe it's just me, but I have never been at a restaurant/bar playing live music where I've thought "this is playing at exactly the right level of volume." It's always set to 11. One louder than necessary.
- ouid 9y ago
  maybe all the people who go to live concerts are a bit deaf already.
- newuser2345 9y ago
  Inverse square law. Yuuuge speakers to reach all listeners. Maybe smaller distributed speakers?
- analog31 9y ago
dmalvarado 9y ago
I've posted this before, but it's worth mentioning as often as the topic comes up. My wife has meniere's disease, so we need to protect her hearing in all moderately loud situations, (bars, music venues, movies). In advance of SXSW one year, I bought her a pair of these: http://amzn.to/2gK8qZv http://amzn.to/2gK8qZv "Musician's earplugs", so-to-speak, they attenuate all frequencies more evenly than standard foam plugs would. In effect just turning down the volume of the world a bit, not muffling it. I don't have meniere's, but do get drained by bars and loud music. I hate to seem lame by wanting to leave a party/bar early, so I bought a pair for myself recently. They're just fantastic. Highly recommend.
- bvinc 9y ago
  I was diagnosed with MD and I figured out what was causing it. I know that MD is a giant umbrella of different causes, but there's a small chance that my story could help her. Have her check it out, along with this study. My story: https://www.reddit.com/r/Menieres/comments/5ip7eq/i_was_diagnosed_with_menieres_disease_and_later https://www.reddit.com/r/Menieres/comments/5ip7eq/i_was_diag... An interesting study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22253033 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22253033
  - dmalvarado 9y ago
    Thank you very much. I'll show this to her.
flavio81 9y ago
As a drummer && music-lover && audiophile myself, I always stress out to other people the importance to protect ones' hearing. For me, hearing is an even more important sense than vision and I think good old Ludwig van Beethoven would agree with me (and Stevie Wonder -an idol of mine- too.) I really can't understand how loud people can put the music on social gatherings like parties, weddings, etc. I do like loud (circa 90-96 dB A-weighted) music, but only if the following conditions are met: - The sound system reproduces the music with good tonal balance and very loud distortion - This loud level won't last more than 15 minutes - The music is good :) There is, at least in my country, some sort of obsession with adding music at all places. Like if music was necessary for any container with more than one human being... Wear earplugs, friends!! I use the cheap orange 3M ones, made of foam, and, while they do change the freq response of your ear, it doesn't do it on a too obnoxious way. From the article i found this: > Finally, custom-moulded "musicians'" earplugs offer high sonic precision suitable for professional use. I didn't know about this. This is great advice.
- Nexxxeh 9y ago
  Have you tried the middle ground, like the ER-20xs recommended elsewhere in this thread? I like the Ear Peace HD's, but Alpine MusicSafe Pros are great too. They're so much better than the cheap foam ones, but aren't anywhere near as expensive as the moulded professional ones.
falcolas 9y ago
Anecdata time - my tinnitus is way worse when my shoulders/upper back are tensed up. If I can get those to calm down, so does the tinnitus. The normal level is simply drowned out most of the time, but when I'm tense, I can "hear" it quite clearly and loudly. The "head thumping" thing from a few months back also grants a short reprieve from normal levels of tinnitus, but it's definitely a temporary thing. It also appears to have no triggers that relate to sound, and is not associated with abnormal hearing loss so far (I've lost more high frequencies than average for my age, but nothing between that threshold and ~25hz).
- Bakary 9y ago
  In some cases tinnitus is also linked to TMJ syndrome.
Tade0 9y ago
One thing to remember about earplugs is to not overuse them. Earplugs lock moisture inside the ear and that in turn can cause infections and/or highly increased earwax discharge.
- zzzzzzzza 9y ago
  your mileage may vary, my brother will get an ear infection after a half a day with earplugs. I can wear earplugs 4+ hours a day every day a year no problems.
ogig 9y ago
"I suddenly lost the hearing on one ear and it got replaced by a strong and permanent tinnitus. I quantify it as strong based on my talks with others with tinnitus. What worked for me was stop fighting and start loving it. Now it's a perma mantra. Some somatic malfunction that enables me to ear the hum inside of me or whatever poetry works for you. Try it maybe." Related re-post from here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13140256 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13140256
- 1001101 9y ago
  Yeah, I've got it bad. 25 years of techno/D&B with 1MW (really) sound systems in enclosed spaces. Ear protection sometimes. Ruptured an eardrum once. I was surprised to read about some of the really negative reactions to it. Mostly, it's like white noise to me and I'm able to ignore it, but whenever it's bothering me, I think back to some of the good times I had getting it :)
conception 9y ago
I've always had tinnitus since I was a child and just thought the world was like that. A trick popped up on Reddit to temporarily, and perhaps for some with regular application, cures it for a short time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yDCox-qKbk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yDCox-qKbk Thump the back of your head like that with your ears covered well about 40 times and enjoy the silence.
- thisone 9y ago
  I've had ringing as long as i can remember. My mother's description, she has it too, when a doctor told her it wasn't normal always stuck with me 'oh i just liked hearing the pretty music' Thankfully that's what it's always been to me. The ringing is the meaning of silence and the notes are not at odds with each other. When I realised that other people didn't hear the ringing when it was silent, I was a fair bit shocked.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- dvtv75 9y ago
  > I've always had tinnitus since I was a child and just thought the world was like that. I'm exactly the same, although I do know what caused it for me. My mother's then-boyfriend was an abusive piece of crap who used to haul me around by my ears whenever he felt angry. Sometimes he would throw me head first into the wall by pulling my ears hard in that direction, then use the back of my head for subsequent blows, so it could be neurological rather than an audiological phenomenon. (You'd think she would've put a stop to that, but you would be wrong - she stayed with him for a few more years.) Normally the ringing would stop after a few hours, but I remember the day that it never stopped. I got so used to it that I tuned it out and completely forgot that the world was ever silent.
topher6345 9y ago
My first year of music school, I was fortunate enough to be exposed to the research of Dr. Marshall Chasin - an audiologist in Toronto. His research on hearing loss, in particular hearing loss of musicians, deserves wide exposure for anyone considering making a career out of using their ears. From one of his publications I use the following as a rule of thumb: 80db * 40hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 83db * 20hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 86db * 10hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 91db * 5hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 94db * 2.5hrs/week = permanent hearing damage Further reading from Dr. Chasin: http://www.marshallchasinassociates.ca/hearing_articles.htm http://www.marshallchasinassociates.ca/hearing_articles.htm
- alok-g 9y ago
  How to I map db to the volume on a smartphone?
  - tim333 9y ago
    There are apps. I just tried "Decibel Meter" by Xiangyi Liu on my iphone. Free. Seems to work. Update - just tried it. 90-100db on the tube (Victoria line), 102 when they make announcements, 60db in the park, 25 in my room.
poikniok 9y ago
Does anybody know what the dB level of macbook speakers playing at max volume is? I am curious to know if playing music at max volume through them while sitting about 2-3 feet away from them can damage hearing.
- tim333 9y ago
  Probably depends on the model. Maybe try downloading a phone app and testing it. I don't think my 11.6" Air makes enough sound to do damage at 2'. Using the Earpods at max I notice some increased tinnitus though.
tim333 9y ago
You know one of the smartphone makers could prevent a lot of tinnitus by having software that detects if you've been exposed to a lot of 100db+ and pops up a warning suggesting taking it easy or using earplugs. People often don't figure there's a problem until it's too late and you've got tinnitus which you can't really fix.
tim333 9y ago
>Remember: the tinnitus might have started in the ear, but it lives in the brain. I'm not sure that's true in most cases. There's a NIH paper where they looked at 151 cases where the auditory nerve was cut and "Complete relief of tinnitus was achieved in 101 patients." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7671835 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7671835 Not that you'd really want that as a treatment.
magnetic 9y ago
I've had severe Tinnitus for over a year due to a degenerative disease damaging my hearing and causing hearing loss. It's been hell, and it still is. It's unlikely to get better with time since the disease is known to make progress and worsen things. No wonder suicide ideation is so high among T sufferers: http://journals.lww.com/thehearingjournal/Fulltext/2016/07000/Suicidal_Ideation_Among_Patients_with_Chronic.6.aspx http://journals.lww.com/thehearingjournal/Fulltext/2016/0700...
ZeusNuts 9y ago
Buy earplugs with a small case you keep on your keychain and take everywhere. The best earplugs are the ones you use!

182 points by thirdsun 9y ago

Additional reading that provided much needed (for me, at least) scientific context around the condition: http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/04/03/high-tech-hope-for-the-hard-of-hearing http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/04/03/high-tech-hope-...

glitcher 9y ago

The article links to http://www.notchtherapy.com/ http://www.notchtherapy.com/ which looks very interesting. I plan on following the steps outlined there to create a custom notch filter for my tinnitus frequency. Has anyone here played with this technique before?

abrichr 9y ago
Check out http://www.audionotch.com/ http://www.audionotch.com/

sparkzilla 9y ago

Somewhat ironically, tests are being conducted to use MDMA/Ecstasy as a possible cure for tinnitus. [1] http://mixmag.net/read/scientists-have-completed-trials-attempting-to-cure-tinnitus-with-mdma-news http://mixmag.net/read/scientists-have-completed-trials-atte...

probably_wrong 9y ago

> As one RA employee puts it, dance music is "not made to be played to people wearing earplugs. When you put them in it's never going to sound the same." This seems to me very similar to the reasons people give to avoid using condoms. And helmets. And smoking. I think putting hundreds of young people in a room guaranteed to give you hearing loss is madness. But then again, I was always boring.

civilian 9y ago
Yeah, I agree. I wish that venues and soundguys would just fucking lower the volume. I definitely avoid a lot of venues for simply this reason! I'm starting to think that people at venues ought to be able to sue venue owners for any sound that is over 85 decibels.
- lfam 9y ago
  I'm sympathetic to your complaint, but consider that 85 dB is quieter than an unamplified symphony orchestra or the cabin of most cruising airliners.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - civilian 9y ago
    Hmmm. Yeah maybe 85db is pretty low. There is some threshold that I feel pretty confident about, but I don't know what number it actually is. Looking here: http://www.webmd.com/brain/tc/harmful-noise-levels-topic-overview http://www.webmd.com/brain/tc/harmful-noise-levels-topic-ove... I suspect it's more likely 110db. I'm also maybe grumpier because I went to a show last night and I've had weird hearing all morning. :/
    - lfam 9y ago
      Well, extended exposure to 85 dB will cause hearing loss. I think a good techno club will not be louder than 100 dB. But my point was that many environments we consider "safe", "normal", or "enjoyable" are actually dangerous to our hearing, so we have to enter them with an understanding that we are trading temporary enjoyment for long-term health.
    - tim333 9y ago
      The UK Health and Safety Executive has that you should go over an "Event LAeq of more than 107 dB or C-weighted peak sound pressure levels of more than 140 dB." Which is quite loud.

jdc0589 9y ago

as a metalhead and frequent concert-goer, this is something I am INCREDIBLY careful about. I'm one of those people that already has a hard time hearing in environments with background noise for some reason. 1. earplugs at shows or anywhere with sustained loud sound are critical. Disposable foam earplugs are a last resort. If you are a frequent concert-goer, do yourself a favor and AT LEAST get a pair of Eymotic ETY-Plugs or something similar ($13, https://www.amazon.com/ETY-Plugs-Fidelity-Earplugs-Standard-Frost/dp/B0015WJQ7A https://www.amazon.com/ETY-Plugs-Fidelity-Earplugs-Standard-...). They will fit way better, isolate more sound, and sound a TON better; you will still be able to enjoy the show, I promise. 2. If you go to shows a lot, get custom plugs made; just do it. Price will be $80-$200, including getting professional molds made by an audiologist, but it is worth it. I can not even feel mine when they are in my ears, the fit is that good (mine are from 64 Audio, they have a 20% off sale a few times a year). 3. If you spend a lot of time with headphones, be really careful about keeping the volume low. If something sounds too faint, just leave it for a few minutes; a lot of they time your ears adjust and that lower volume you thought was too faint is actually just fine or maybe even still too loud. 4. I acknowledge how ridiculous of a suggestion this is price wise, but if you spend hours a day with headphones on, consider custom molded IEMs. Yes, they are expensive as shit (anywhere from ~$250 to infinity dollars), but they will seal in your ears perfectly. This gives you much better isolation from ambient sound in your environment, so you can listen to music at MUCH lower volumes comfortably. On average, sound quality is MUCH better than the headphones/earbuds you were using before too. Do not fuck about with your hearing.

swsieber 9y ago
I'd like to echo point 3 - I eventually got to the point where I could listen to music on the lowest volume, because I had gotten used to the volume.
- civilian 9y ago
  So, I often listen to podcasts in bed with earbuds. It's night, and it's quiet, and I've found that I actually _bottom out_-- I'm at the lowest volume setting, with the next lowest being "mute", and I wish I could lower it a few more times. I need finer control over volume. (I'm on android, if anyone has any solutions...)

derekp7 9y ago

I've started getting the ringing in the ears a few years ago. However, it gets more pronounced when I twist my neck certain ways -- and it seems to let up a bit by stretching my neck in a different direction. Seeing as how I also have periodic neck pain, I wonder if pinched nerves there are contributing to the tinnitus symptoms? Also, there are some days on the drive home from work where the tinnitus is completely gone -- but it comes back strong the next morning, especially if it feels that I didn't have a good sleeping position.

thatswrong0 9y ago
> but it comes back strong the next morning, especially if it feels that I didn't have a good sleeping position. If I sleep on my stomach too many days in a row, my tinnitus really flares up. I definitely think there's a neck component to it.
jahewson 9y ago
Tight muscles in the face, jaw, and neck, and shoulders are the most likely culprit. It's almost certainly not nerves. For me it was "forward head" posture which needed to be corrected through strengthening exercises and a careful reassessment of my desk work and driving positions. I'd highly recommend visiting a good upper cervical chiropractor.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

hfkeysrdhf 9y ago

I'd like to point out that, sadly, not all tinnitus is caused by hearing loss. My tinnitus started despite being young and having subjected myself to far fewer loud noises, including concerts, than the average person. My doctor believes that mine is likely due to a neurological issue, but that we will never know the true cause. To satisfy our own curiosity (and determine if we could attempt to treat it with steroids, which is possible during the few weeks after the onset of tinnitus induced by hearing loss), we had my hearing tested. As expected, absolutely no hearing loss. As others have said, I felt suicidal during those first few weeks. Thankfully, I've since learned to live with it.

alva 9y ago
> As others have said, I felt suicidal during those first few weeks. Thankfully, I've since learned to live with it. An incredibly common feeling among those who have recently got tinnitus. I felt this way to and unfortunately no matter how many times I read that people learnt to live with it, I never really took it on board. For anyone reading who has got it, it really does get better. Eventually (6 months min from what I have read) your brain starts to tune it out. Only a very, very small number of people are unfortunate enough to have it persist without some dulling. Try not to despair or panic, it almost certainly will significantly dull and fade into the background after a few months. At some point, it not being present will be normal again. Nowadays I notice a mild shadow of what it once was, maybe 4 times a year for an hour after a severe initial case.
goeric 9y ago
Mine was came after attempting to pop my ears during a very bad ear infection. I was trying to relieve the pressure, as I have done a lot, but because of the bad ear infection it was actually making it worse. The pain was so bad and it felt like my ear was never going to pop. Eventually, the pain subsided but at that exact same time, in place of the pain, was a ringing. My ENT said the tinnitus was most likely caused by the bad ear infection and tried to assure me that me trying to pop my ears didn't have anything to do with it, but I can't help but feel like that wasn't the case, as I made the pain so much worse. Anyways, agreed with others here that the first few months were the worst, and now it's mostly unnoticeable unless I actively think about it, drink a lot, or leave a loud environment.

amluto 9y ago

The article repeats points like this quite a few times: > I like hearing my music at loud volumes, as everyone does. I don't think this is true. A lot of people like going to the kinds of events that have loud music, but I've seen a lot of people who don't like the volume. One obvious example: most of the weddings I've been to recently turn into dance parties, and the volume creeps its way up and up. As this happens, a lot of the guests start moving farther from the speakers, off the dance floor, and eventually out of the room. Dancing: lots of fun. Ear-splitting volume: not necessarily. At my wedding, we picked a great band and kept the music at a comfortable level, and most of the guests danced the whole time and even the non-dancing guests clustered around the dance floor. I can't prove causation, but I bet the tolerable volume had a lot to do with it. So maybe the real solution is for people to start trying to figure out why the norm for concerts is to have the volume painfully loud. It's possible that guests just might enjoy them more with quieter music.

deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
silviogutierrez 9y ago
I agree. I love dancing, especially to live music. And I'm a musician myself. But I avoid restaurants and places with live music unless the sole purpose is dancing. They advertise live music as a feature but sadly I treat it as a negative. Maybe it's just me, but I have never been at a restaurant/bar playing live music where I've thought "this is playing at exactly the right level of volume." It's always set to 11. One louder than necessary.
ouid 9y ago
maybe all the people who go to live concerts are a bit deaf already.
newuser2345 9y ago
Inverse square law. Yuuuge speakers to reach all listeners. Maybe smaller distributed speakers?
analog31 9y ago

dmalvarado 9y ago

I've posted this before, but it's worth mentioning as often as the topic comes up. My wife has meniere's disease, so we need to protect her hearing in all moderately loud situations, (bars, music venues, movies). In advance of SXSW one year, I bought her a pair of these: http://amzn.to/2gK8qZv http://amzn.to/2gK8qZv "Musician's earplugs", so-to-speak, they attenuate all frequencies more evenly than standard foam plugs would. In effect just turning down the volume of the world a bit, not muffling it. I don't have meniere's, but do get drained by bars and loud music. I hate to seem lame by wanting to leave a party/bar early, so I bought a pair for myself recently. They're just fantastic. Highly recommend.

bvinc 9y ago
I was diagnosed with MD and I figured out what was causing it. I know that MD is a giant umbrella of different causes, but there's a small chance that my story could help her. Have her check it out, along with this study. My story: https://www.reddit.com/r/Menieres/comments/5ip7eq/i_was_diagnosed_with_menieres_disease_and_later https://www.reddit.com/r/Menieres/comments/5ip7eq/i_was_diag... An interesting study: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22253033 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22253033
- dmalvarado 9y ago
  Thank you very much. I'll show this to her.

flavio81 9y ago

As a drummer && music-lover && audiophile myself, I always stress out to other people the importance to protect ones' hearing. For me, hearing is an even more important sense than vision and I think good old Ludwig van Beethoven would agree with me (and Stevie Wonder -an idol of mine- too.) I really can't understand how loud people can put the music on social gatherings like parties, weddings, etc. I do like loud (circa 90-96 dB A-weighted) music, but only if the following conditions are met: - The sound system reproduces the music with good tonal balance and very loud distortion - This loud level won't last more than 15 minutes - The music is good :) There is, at least in my country, some sort of obsession with adding music at all places. Like if music was necessary for any container with more than one human being... Wear earplugs, friends!! I use the cheap orange 3M ones, made of foam, and, while they do change the freq response of your ear, it doesn't do it on a too obnoxious way. From the article i found this: > Finally, custom-moulded "musicians'" earplugs offer high sonic precision suitable for professional use. I didn't know about this. This is great advice.

Nexxxeh 9y ago
Have you tried the middle ground, like the ER-20xs recommended elsewhere in this thread? I like the Ear Peace HD's, but Alpine MusicSafe Pros are great too. They're so much better than the cheap foam ones, but aren't anywhere near as expensive as the moulded professional ones.

falcolas 9y ago

Anecdata time - my tinnitus is way worse when my shoulders/upper back are tensed up. If I can get those to calm down, so does the tinnitus. The normal level is simply drowned out most of the time, but when I'm tense, I can "hear" it quite clearly and loudly. The "head thumping" thing from a few months back also grants a short reprieve from normal levels of tinnitus, but it's definitely a temporary thing. It also appears to have no triggers that relate to sound, and is not associated with abnormal hearing loss so far (I've lost more high frequencies than average for my age, but nothing between that threshold and ~25hz).

Bakary 9y ago
In some cases tinnitus is also linked to TMJ syndrome.

Tade0 9y ago

One thing to remember about earplugs is to not overuse them. Earplugs lock moisture inside the ear and that in turn can cause infections and/or highly increased earwax discharge.

zzzzzzzza 9y ago
your mileage may vary, my brother will get an ear infection after a half a day with earplugs. I can wear earplugs 4+ hours a day every day a year no problems.

ogig 9y ago

"I suddenly lost the hearing on one ear and it got replaced by a strong and permanent tinnitus. I quantify it as strong based on my talks with others with tinnitus. What worked for me was stop fighting and start loving it. Now it's a perma mantra. Some somatic malfunction that enables me to ear the hum inside of me or whatever poetry works for you. Try it maybe." Related re-post from here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13140256 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13140256

1001101 9y ago
Yeah, I've got it bad. 25 years of techno/D&B with 1MW (really) sound systems in enclosed spaces. Ear protection sometimes. Ruptured an eardrum once. I was surprised to read about some of the really negative reactions to it. Mostly, it's like white noise to me and I'm able to ignore it, but whenever it's bothering me, I think back to some of the good times I had getting it :)

conception 9y ago

I've always had tinnitus since I was a child and just thought the world was like that. A trick popped up on Reddit to temporarily, and perhaps for some with regular application, cures it for a short time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yDCox-qKbk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yDCox-qKbk Thump the back of your head like that with your ears covered well about 40 times and enjoy the silence.

thisone 9y ago
I've had ringing as long as i can remember. My mother's description, she has it too, when a doctor told her it wasn't normal always stuck with me 'oh i just liked hearing the pretty music' Thankfully that's what it's always been to me. The ringing is the meaning of silence and the notes are not at odds with each other. When I realised that other people didn't hear the ringing when it was silent, I was a fair bit shocked.
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dvtv75 9y ago
> I've always had tinnitus since I was a child and just thought the world was like that. I'm exactly the same, although I do know what caused it for me. My mother's then-boyfriend was an abusive piece of crap who used to haul me around by my ears whenever he felt angry. Sometimes he would throw me head first into the wall by pulling my ears hard in that direction, then use the back of my head for subsequent blows, so it could be neurological rather than an audiological phenomenon. (You'd think she would've put a stop to that, but you would be wrong - she stayed with him for a few more years.) Normally the ringing would stop after a few hours, but I remember the day that it never stopped. I got so used to it that I tuned it out and completely forgot that the world was ever silent.

topher6345 9y ago

My first year of music school, I was fortunate enough to be exposed to the research of Dr. Marshall Chasin - an audiologist in Toronto. His research on hearing loss, in particular hearing loss of musicians, deserves wide exposure for anyone considering making a career out of using their ears. From one of his publications I use the following as a rule of thumb: 80db * 40hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 83db * 20hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 86db * 10hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 91db * 5hrs/week = permanent hearing damage 94db * 2.5hrs/week = permanent hearing damage Further reading from Dr. Chasin: http://www.marshallchasinassociates.ca/hearing_articles.htm http://www.marshallchasinassociates.ca/hearing_articles.htm

alok-g 9y ago
How to I map db to the volume on a smartphone?
- tim333 9y ago
  There are apps. I just tried "Decibel Meter" by Xiangyi Liu on my iphone. Free. Seems to work. Update - just tried it. 90-100db on the tube (Victoria line), 102 when they make announcements, 60db in the park, 25 in my room.

poikniok 9y ago

Does anybody know what the dB level of macbook speakers playing at max volume is? I am curious to know if playing music at max volume through them while sitting about 2-3 feet away from them can damage hearing.

tim333 9y ago
Probably depends on the model. Maybe try downloading a phone app and testing it. I don't think my 11.6" Air makes enough sound to do damage at 2'. Using the Earpods at max I notice some increased tinnitus though.

tim333 9y ago

You know one of the smartphone makers could prevent a lot of tinnitus by having software that detects if you've been exposed to a lot of 100db+ and pops up a warning suggesting taking it easy or using earplugs. People often don't figure there's a problem until it's too late and you've got tinnitus which you can't really fix.

tim333 9y ago

>Remember: the tinnitus might have started in the ear, but it lives in the brain. I'm not sure that's true in most cases. There's a NIH paper where they looked at 151 cases where the auditory nerve was cut and "Complete relief of tinnitus was achieved in 101 patients." https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7671835 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7671835 Not that you'd really want that as a treatment.

magnetic 9y ago

I've had severe Tinnitus for over a year due to a degenerative disease damaging my hearing and causing hearing loss. It's been hell, and it still is. It's unlikely to get better with time since the disease is known to make progress and worsen things. No wonder suicide ideation is so high among T sufferers: http://journals.lww.com/thehearingjournal/Fulltext/2016/07000/Suicidal_Ideation_Among_Patients_with_Chronic.6.aspx http://journals.lww.com/thehearingjournal/Fulltext/2016/0700...

ZeusNuts 9y ago

Buy earplugs with a small case you keep on your keychain and take everywhere. The best earplugs are the ones you use!