16 ms·

Milk that lasts for months

112 points by akandiah 10y ago

powertower 10y ago
Non-homogenized milk will also not spoil like regular milk does [though it still needs refrigeration, but it will last for 2-3 month pass its expiration date].
gambiting 10y ago
I was actually very surprised when I first moved to UK to find that milk here spoils within a few days of purchase, I was so used to UHT milk that we would normally buy several cartons of, and then it would last months(obviously only few days after opening, but we could conceivably buy a 6-month supply and just keep it in the basement for later consumption). Nowadays I found where to buy UHT milk in the UK, it gets me some weird looks from my friends but the convenience of not having to go to a store to buy fresh milk every few days is absolutely worth it.
- Avshalom 10y ago
  What are you doing with your milk? My milk isn't UHT and usually lasts weeks to a month after opening.
  - stupidcar 10y ago
    Not refrigerating it, perhaps? Unopened UHT doesn't need to be refrigerated.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - barrkel 10y ago
    You must be buying micro-filtered milk then. Fresh milk will not last weeks.
    - anfractuosity 10y ago
      Interesting, I'd never heard of that process before, sounds very clever, does it taste just like ordinary pasteurised milk? (as it sounds like they use a filter, then pasteurise)
      - barrkel 10y ago
        Yup, just like pasteurised. After a few weeks, it starts tasting a bit different - not like fresh milk going sour, just different, don't really have a word for it.
  - gambiting 10y ago
    Really? Normal, non-uht milk bought here in the UK will start smelling off and go lumpy after about a week or so in the fridge. Month after opening? I imagine it would be fully soured at that point?
    - ghaff 10y ago
      For the US, I agree as well. Maybe about 2 weeks on the outside for regular pasteurized milk and it will generally start to taste somewhat off within a week. A month? No way. ADDED: Sounds as if there's something called micro-filtered milk that I've never heard of in the US. It's certainly not a standard item.
- satori99 10y ago
  UHT milk is not popular at all in Australia, except in motel room mini-fridges. I find the taste to be almost, but not quite, entirely unlike milk. Particularly when used to make a flat white coffee. I would put up with a long walk to a shop everyday to not have to taste UHT milk :) Also, regular pasteurized milk is very cheap in Australia already. As low as $1/Lt in a supermarket as the result of some dubious market practices [0]. [0] http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-30/dairy-farmers-milk-prices/7546978 http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-30/dairy-farmers-milk-pri...
  - Johnythree 10y ago
    UHT milk is VERY popular in Australia. I much prefer it, and never buy anything else.
    - bruce_one 10y ago
      These numbers seem to imply slightly over 10%; I wouldn't call that all-caps very... http://www.dairyaustralia.com.au/Markets-and-statistics/Production-and-sales/Milk/Drinking-Milk-Sales.aspx http://www.dairyaustralia.com.au/Markets-and-statistics/Prod...
- sitharus 10y ago
  Refrigerated pasteurised milk keeps at least three weeks, normally only 3-4 days of that are gone by the time it's sold. If it only lasted days your refrigerator is failing and needs replacing.
  - gambiting 10y ago
    If I walk into tesco right now I can guarantee that their freshest milk will have a use by date of about 5-6 days from now. It should also be used within a couple days from opening - I would definitely buy a new bottle every 4-5 days. And nope, my fridge sits at a solid 2C, thank you.
    - s0rce 10y ago
      Wow, we regularly buy milk with best before dates 3-4 wks from the date of purchase. The milk doesn't travel far as there many dairy cows in Northern California.
      - adrianratnapala 10y ago
        I wonder if different definitions are at work: i.e. 5-6 days assumes you open it the moment you get it home, while 3-4 weeks assumes you drink it within a few days of opening.
        petepete 10y ago
        Also milk pasteurisation and sterilisation are on a sliding scale, different countries and producers will use different temperatures and times. It's likely that in the UK, we do 'just enough' to make it safe. Wouldn't want to ruin a cup of tea, would we?
    - beojan 10y ago
      The Tesco Pure or Cravendale milk will have a 3-4 week shelf life, and is also pasteurized rather than UHT.
    - rhino369 10y ago
- djrogers 10y ago
  A few days? Fresh milk should last a couple of weeks at least unless you're doing something horribly wrong to it...
  - sowbug 10y ago
    Whole milk lasts longer than other kinds.
- corin_ 10y ago
  Milk actually has a few places in UK's cultural history, one bit of which is very relevant to the inconvenience of buying milk regularly. Traditionally, "milk floats" (a vehicle) would be driven by "milkmen", doing early -morning deliveries of milk in glass bottles, and they would collect the previous day's empty bottles at the same time. Wiki page has photo examples of what milk floats look like: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk_float https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk_float This service is actually still available in some places. For example, I just checked my postcode with https://www.milkandmore.co.uk https://www.milkandmore.co.uk and they told me my milkman's name and that he delivers on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Saturdays. But when I was a kid, say 20 years ago, we'd get it delivered Monday to Saturday, and seeing milkmen doing their rounds was incredibly common, with many customers everywhere. Now it's a bit of a quirky thing you don't see or hear much of, mainly because most people decided that the inconvenience of picking up from a shop was outweighed by the flexibility it offered.
  - baddox 10y ago
    It's interesting that you described the concept of milkmen as specifically relevant to the U.K. In the United States, milkmen are well-established in pop culture, particularly as a quaint symbol of pre-WW2 domestic life. I would have assumed that milkmen were standard in most every developed country before refrigeration became widespread. I also would have assumed it's still common in developing countries.
    - corin_ 10y ago
      I was replying to somebody who was talking about the situation in the UK, and the knowledge I have of milkmen is from the UK - I didn't mean to imply it was necessarily unique to us.
  - ghaff 10y ago
    We had a milkman when I was growing up in the US in the 1960s although it was already something of an anachronism at that time as we went to the grocery story for other dairy perishables. (I drank a lot of milk growing up so having the scheduled delivery was probably still somewhat convenient.) The adjacent town to where I live did have a dairy farm that delivered until fairly recently but I'm not sure they do any longer. I imagine there are still milkmen in some places but I'm not aware of any.
- barrkel 10y ago
  Plain fresh milk will start to taste a bit sour after a few days and will turn after no more than a week or so; or it could turn in a day if it's left out at room temperature. What you want to get is micro-filtered milk. Cravendale is the main supplier I know of, but some of the supermarkets' own brand have micro-filtered versions, with markup. Micro-filtered milk will last a few weeks, up to a month, without curdling.
  - Dagwoodie 10y ago
    Thinking I might be lactose intolerant I tried some lactose free milk some time ago. It was the best tasting and the longest lasting Milk I ever bought. Ever since, I tend to buy exclusively lactose free because of that.
    - Broken_Hippo 10y ago
      I have considered the same thing. I've never really liked milk. Chocolate milk was always worse - it tasted like someone mixed something rotten with a chocolate flavor. I always think milk smells like it has gone off. I've never had an upset stomach or other gastric symptoms from dairy like my sister, who is lactose intolerant. I always kinda figured I wasn't. Then I tried some lactose free chocolate milk, with no sugar added. I think this was the first time I've actually enjoyed milk. I still do not drink milk often, but now I will actually drink it.
- VLM 10y ago
  I don't drink much milk so I mostly keep the little packages around for occasional baking and other recipes. Something missed in the article is package inflation has not caught up to UHT like it has for most every other product in the supermarket, a cup sized package continues to hold exactly 1 cup or 8 oz like it has for a couple decades. Most processed foods in the supermarket have dramatically shrunk over time making UHT something of a novelty.
- rhaps0dy 10y ago
  The first bottle of milk I bought in the UK got spoilt without me even opening it. I left it outside the fridge, not realising that you can only do that with UHT.
corin_ 10y ago
There's a very noticeable difference in taste between pasteurised and UHT milk, and anecdotally, based on discussing with multiple friends over the years, people who are used to pasteurised think UHT tastes worse, people who are used to UHT don't notice the difference, or notice but don't mind either way. Personally, as a Brit (pasteurised is the norm) who has lived in France and Belgium, I'd always choose pasteurised. To drink on its own, UHT is significantly not nice to my tastebuds. With breakfast cereal its OK but still worse. A small amount in coffee and I don't notice the difference. In Paris, finding pasteurised was pretty easy to do - although shops gave much more shelf space to UHT, I rarely struggled to find fresh milk. In Belgium on the other hand... near where I was living in a city, only one of 4 chain supermarkets and none of the cornershops sold non-UHT milk. It's quite possible that if I spent <x amount of time> drinking lots and lots of UHT milk eventually my preference might change. I'm not planning on trying, though.
- noonespecial 10y ago
  Counteranecdotally, I spent most of my young years in Germany drinking uht, and coming to America for university I found regular milk "sour" in comparison
  - corin_ 10y ago
    All of my anecdotes on the matter are EU (possibly all BE/FR, not sure) vs UK, so it's possible UK and US pasteurised milk tastes different (I've had many lattes in America but can't remember ever drinking straight milk or over cereal there..) Or it's possible my sample size was too small. Would be curious to know how many people feel which way, but somehow doubt there's any good data sets for that!
  - adrianratnapala 10y ago
    Maybe you were leaving it for too long before drinking it... That said, I had a colleague who was mad keen on getting absolutely the perfect traditional milk. This meant the proper kind of high-speed machine had to do the shaking. But it also, apparently, meant using old milk. He would actually ask servers whether the milk fresh, and walk out if they said "yes".
altano 10y ago
I don't find pasteurization to make as much of a difference as other things like fat content. Whole milk is sooo much better than skim milk, for example. I love milk and since moving to California I haven't been able to find anything nearly as good as what we had in Boston. There was this brand High Lawn Farms that had tangibly better milk. You could even notice the difference when used in small amounts in tea/coffee, which is probably why every single local coffee shop used it. Someone should figure out what they are doing differently.
- mastazi 10y ago
  Are you comparing untreated vs pasteurized milk, or pasteurized vs. UHT? The article is mainly about the latter.
  - ghaff 10y ago
    A commercial producer like the one listed is still selling pasteurized product. I do like to buy from a couple of small local producers when it's convenient but I'm not sure I could identify in a blind test. The availability of raw milk varies by state and is often only available for purchase on the farm that produces it or otherwise outside of normal retail channels.
  - altano 10y ago
    I'm just speaking to my experience with all different kinds of milk. I don't think I've ever had completely unpasteurized milk (is that legal in the US?), so every other kind.
- njk510 10y ago
  Looks like they have only Jersey cows that make milk with higher fat content and also primarily with A2 beta casein. There is a brand here in California called Saint Benoit creamery which you can find at Whole Foods.
- jordanthoms 10y ago
  One of the nice things being back in New Zealand is the quality of the milk here - maybe it's just because I grew up drinking it, but it tastes vastly better to me. It has a much fuller flavour than anything I found in California - could be because all the cows here are grass-fed? UHT is available here but for most people it's emergency use only.
ProfessorLayton 10y ago
Heh, I keep a box of single serve UHT milk cartons in my fridge just for making coffee on the weekends, and the occasional recepie. It's a little pricey at about $1.10/8oz carton, but at my consumption rate I'd be throwing away most of the 1/2 gallon jug anyway, which typically costs more per oz than a full gallon. I don't find it as good as non-UHT milk, but it's definitely worth the convenience of always having milk when I need it.
- mackey 10y ago
  I do the same thing, but still end up with extra at the end of the weekend. When traveling in Europe I noticed a lot of places have small tablespoon servings of UHT milk in little cartons. I wish we had something like that here, but all I can I find are stuff like "mini moos" which are too heavy.
senectus1 10y ago
We drink the Lactose free stuff, that stores for months in the cupboard. Oddly it seems to taste nicer than fresh milk.
drivingmenuts 10y ago
Apropos link: http://cnqzu.com/library/Anarchy%20Folder/Fiction/Stephenson,_Neal/Stephenson,_Neal_-_Cryptonomicon/Neal%20Stephenson%20-%20Cryptonomicon%20v2%20(HTML,%20Fully%20Proofed)/slide58.html http://cnqzu.com/library/Anarchy%20Folder/Fiction/Stephenson... I remember reading that some years ago and wondering if it was like condensed milk (which would probably be pretty awful on Captain Crunch cereal). Now, I think the cereal might be the key thing to hide the flavor of UHT milk.
- Broken_Hippo 10y ago
  I don't like milk, but will eat in cereal - though I won't drink any leftover milk in the bowl. It isn't just that cereal changes the taste of the milk, but the way you smell it is different. In a glass, you have a concentrated smelling tube you put to your mouth, and cereal you have a dribble on the spoon. You simply can't smell or taste as much of it.
dghughes 10y ago
This would be great for the Canadian north where food is incredibly expensive due to the cost of shipping and storage. For example a 2 liter bottle of orange juice is $30, 4 liters of milk $10. the UHT milk could bring that cost down if it can be stored in bulk for long periods of time.
- 9q 10y ago
  > 2 liter bottle of orange juice is $30 Are you serious about this? 2 liters is 30 USD? I'm not sure if you're joking or being serious.
  - peterwwillis 10y ago
    In Nunavut, it's closer to $38 (but sometimes as low as $26). Food prices in Northern Canada are basically more ridiculous than Norway. However, Walmart Canada has 1L "value brand" orange juice for as low as $1. So don't assume the price is the same everywhere. And also consider that OJ prices fluctuate daily on the commodities exchange (as much as 19% just in the past 3 months) and there are many tiers of OJ, from concentrate at as low as $1 per liter, to as much as $10 for super-premium brands.
  - mattkrause 10y ago
    Sounds about right. I paid $4.50 for a warm (12 oz) can of Shasta root beer in Koliganek, AK. Keep in mind that these prices are for very small, very remote towns where everything is flown in (or driven over the ice in winter), not downtown Montreal or Anchorage.
    - dhbx9 10y ago
      Unfortunately true for Singapore as well even though it's not remote. Alcohol tax means a 12oz can goes for around 5 bucks as well.
      - inferiorhuman 10y ago
        Root beer (well, Shasta at least) is a sugary soft-drink (non-alcoholic). I think I paid about S$12 for a pint of actual beer at some pizza place in Clarke Quay. Don't think they tax the sugary stuff as much (if at all?), but they'll certainly shame you out of them (hello TAF).
blahedo 10y ago
About fifteen years ago, I had a housemate who was from Italy, and she thought the milk I bought (standard US whole milk) was gross and, she said, "tastes like cheese". I had already been exposed to shelf-stable milk on a previous trip to Europe, so we soon figured out that was the source of the issue, but reading this article suggests she may have been exceptionally perceptive with the cheese comment.
donw 10y ago
I didn't discover UHT milk until I moved to Germany, and went to the supermarket. It seems that every culture has its own grocery taxonomy, so I had to ask an employee where I could find the milk. She pointed me towards the milk aisle, and I was amazed that none of it was refrigerated. Sure, you can buy fresh milk in Germany, but it seems that UHT is considered more the "standard". I have to say, I preferred the taste to either American or Japanese milk, and fell in love with the convenience of being able to keep a case of the stuff in my pantry.
- lysium 10y ago
  This must have been a long time ago. In my local super market it is harder to find UHT milk than fresh milk in the fridge. Which by the way has a two week shelve life because it is highly filtered.
  - rndgermandude 10y ago
    Agreed. I usually groceries shop in one of three stores, and in only one I'd even know where the UHT milk aisle even is, and that's just because it happens to be next to the eggs. The refrigerated milk aisles (pasteurized and ESL) are very prominently featured in all those stores. I am also surprised that the wiki article linked elsewhere gives 66+% UHT consumption in Germany. They might be lumping together refrigerated Extended Shelf Life milk with 2-4 weeks shelve life (heated more than pasteurized milk and also usually filtered, but less so than UHT) and UHT milk in that statistic, but those are not really comparable in taste (and storage, obviously) at all.
- w-m 10y ago
  Milk usually isn't hard to find: just go to the back of the store, as far away from the entrance as possible. Works often and in many countries.
  - crypto5 10y ago
    Planet Money's story about why is that: http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/07/23/334076398/episode-555-why-is-the-milk-in-the-back-of-the-store http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/07/23/334076398/episo...
dsacco 10y ago
This is interesting to me because one of my favorite weird hobbies is going to my grocery store, taking a photo of the milk with the farthest date, and sending it to my friends as a sort of game. I shop at Stew Leonard's most of the time (locations in NY and CT). The milk I buy there is organic and lasts a hell of a long time compared to the milk I frequently see in other supermarkets. The current record I've seen is a gallon of milk with an expiration date 63 days from the day I saw it. I'd say the median is maybe...50 ish days (I shop on Sundays, when I think they've likely restocked). I regularly buy three gallons at a time, and to this day I find it to be the most fun and humorous part of shopping at the grocery store. This milk has literally never gone bad for me and it tastes delicious. After reading this article, I'm really interested in knowing whether or not it's heat-treated! I have always assumed it lasts so long because Stew Leonard's owns their own farms relatively close to the grocery stores.
- matt_wulfeck 10y ago
  I think it's required to be heat treated to be sold in the US. I like to check the dates too! I always get a little kick from pulling a gallon from the back that has a few extra days left in the expiry label.
- cauterized 10y ago
  I've had a similar experience. I think the organics companies just clean their equipment/tanks better or something. Regular milk with an expiration date 3 weeks in the future often turns sour within 3 days of opening, despite refrigeration. Whereas organic milk with the same expiration date, from the same shelf in the same store, will last a week and a half. And there's really nothing inherent about organic milk that should make it last longer.
  - CamelCaseName 10y ago
    Regular milk with an expiration date 3 weeks in the future often turns sour within 3 days of opening, despite refrigeration. Wait, what? Are you not refrigerating your milk? This is unusual.
chomp 10y ago
You can't make mozzarella with UHT milk. One nice thing about regular pasteurized milk is that it forms curds easier and has higher yield. I love going to the store and buying a gallon to turn to fresh mozz.
dkarapetyan 10y ago
And honey lasts forever.
cschneid 10y ago
My local store just started carrying small (1 pint) UHT milk. We don't use milk in our house, except as an ingredient in other things, so a pint at a time is perfect, and now it has a 6+ month shelf life, so there's less planning and feel-bads when it goes sour.
sauronlord 10y ago
Drink milk? What are you... a baby cow? This piece was likely inspired by the milk lobby... sales must be sagging.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
pmontra 10y ago
Pasteurized and UHT have about the same shelf space in Italy with the former tasting much better than the latter to me. I buy UHT only for the first breakfast when I come back from a vacation. Full fat milk tastes better than reduced fat, which is watery in comparison. However micro filtered milk become common in the last years. It lasts one or two weeks and tastes as pasteurized. It's the one I buy. The advantage of UHT is that it doesn't need a refrigerator so it's what I buy on vacation, when I don't have a fridge or where I don't trust the fridges of the sellers.
d--b 10y ago
Weird that they don't talk about micro-filtered milk. It removes bacteria through filtration, tastes like regular milk, has a long shelf life and stays good for a good week in your fridge...
- matt_wulfeck 10y ago
  If it tastes like regular milk (assuming you mean the pasteurized milk we drink in the US/Australia/NZ) what are the advantages over it? I regularly keep milk in my fridge much longer than a week.
  - mathw 10y ago
    I've started buying microfiltered milk (am in the UK) because I've always had trouble with milk going off before I can use it all when buying ordinary pasteurised milk, but the microfiltered milk stays fresh plenty long enough to use it all up. On the bottle the stuff I buy say it's good for 7 days in the fridge after opening. Experience so far bears this out, whereas normal milk manages about 4 for me. It's entirely possible my fridge sucks, but I have checked the temperature and the milk comes out of the fridge at about 2C, so...
- srrr 10y ago
  In fact most of the fresh milk sold in Germany is microflitrated. It is really hard to find old school pasteurized fresh milk nowadays in a normal supermarked. The microflitrated milk is named "Frischmilch - länger haltbar" (fresh milk - long life). Milk that is only pasteurized is named "Frischmilch - traditionell hergestellt" (fresh milk - traditionally crafted).
matt_wulfeck 10y ago
This was a really fun comments section to read. It's really interesting to see how much variation there is in the international milk market!
- aembleton 10y ago
  Yep, I've only had pasteurised in the UK and Ireland and those two taste the same. If I'm every in the US I'll have to try the milk and see if it tastes different.
garyclarke27 10y ago
British / Irish pasteurised milk tastes so much fresher than pasteurised milk in other countries, must be our abundant green grass, British Beef is also the best in the world. UHT milk is horrible. Filtered fresh milk is the answer, needs refrigeration but lasts for 5 times longer than non-filtered.
- Neliquat 10y ago
  You really need to travel more if you think this. British beef is some of the worst (unless boiling) due to the fat/collegen ratio.
bootload 10y ago
Pasteurised, UHT but no mention of powdered or condensed milk.
philmander 10y ago
There's quite a big different between 72°c and 140°c. Would 105° produce a semi-long lasting milk that doesn't taste quite as different (bad) as UHT? Also, are there any other downsides to UHT besides taste? Are more nutrients lost?
skc 10y ago
I'm embarrassed that I never looked into the difference between the two. I've always bought fresh milk on the assumption that it was healthier and purer than the long life stuff, especially because the long life milk tastes a tad sweeter and creamier to me (so it must be bad for me, right?)
projectorlochsa 10y ago
Another milk that lasts months is soy milk. Nutritionally superior and cruelty free!
- kingrolo 10y ago
  I'll just piggy back this comment to add that there's a whole world of milk alternatives too if you're worried about the ethics and don't like soy. I'm not keen on soy but use coconut milk. Others I know prefer almond milk or oat milk. Probably took about 3 weeks to get used to but now I definitely prefer it.
  - projectorlochsa 10y ago
    http://www.perfectdayfoods.com/ http://www.perfectdayfoods.com/ There's also milk made with casein protein and all the goodies from original cow milk, but without the cows. Also has a fairly long shelf life.
    - kingrolo 10y ago
      Wow, I'd never heard of that. Looks really interesting!
    - Broken_Hippo 10y ago
      I didn't know this existed. I have a weird fascination with replacement foods - not so much of the nutrition shake variety, but things just like this. I don't mind drinking cows milk, but if I saw this in the store I'd have to try it. Thanks muchly.
- exprA 10y ago
  And phytoestrogens for that nice warped hormonal balance... No thanks.
  - projectorlochsa 10y ago
    Clinical studies show no effects of soy protein or isoflavones on reproductive hormones in men: results of a meta-analysis. http://www.fertstert.org/article/S0015-0282(09)00966-2/fulltext http://www.fertstert.org/article/S0015-0282(09)00966-2/fullt... Good thing we've got science to reinforce our claims. Not to mention the fact that you're drinking milk from a lactating female filled with animal estrogen yet you worry about plant estrogen.
raimue 10y ago
A few years ago, super markets in Germany (and I guess also in other European countries) switched from selling pasteurized milk to ESL milk (Extended Shelf Life). It has actually became quite hard to find any non-ESL milk in grocery stores. ESL milk last for 2-3 weeks in the fridge, but it has not been heated to the same degree as UHT milk. Therefore it still tastes better, but not the same as pasteurized milk.
ccozan 10y ago
After I moved to rural Germany, I was happy to find out that the local farmers will sell you milk. Since then I only drink that really fresh milk, milked in the same day. The first 4 cm of the bottle are just cream. Is incredibly tasty and you can make any kind of cheese or Yoghurt with it - you need the right bacteria, of course. Another interesting bit: I used to cook it and then drink it. Not doing this anymore. Some people say is not healthy, but I can really see the cows from where is coming. There is no place where it might be contaminated. And also it resists about a week in the fridge, after that it transforms into a nice refreshing fermented milk drink.
bad_user 10y ago
In my mind edible substances that last a long time are free of nutrients and high in calories, most of the time anyway. I never buy UHT milk and try buying fresh, locally produced milk whenever I can find it. I never buy low fat milk either. The difference in taste between fresh milk and these replacements is actually huge. I also don't get people buying the low fat variety either. If you're concerned about fat or cholesterol, it's better to drink less, high-quality milk, instead of milk-like liquids enriched with powdered milk, pork fat and dyes (the exact composition of these replacements varies by country, but it's always processed to the point that you can no longer classify it as being milk).
- test1235 10y ago
  What's low fat milk? Is that the same as skimmed/semi skimmed?
  - Broken_Hippo 10y ago
    Yup - usually it is the semi-skimmed milk instead of the fully skimmed milk.
- Broken_Hippo 10y ago
  I generally don't like milk. The taste makes me gag a little bit and it nearly always smells like it is going sour, even when it clearly isn't. It isn't for lack of trying, and there are differences. Lactose-free milk is better than normal. Low-fat milk tastes better than whole milk, yet skim milk tastes like I put water in a glass that had milk in it without rinsing. For me, there is no real concern about the calories - I use cream occasionally in cooking, after all, and use butter.
- noja 10y ago
  > I also don't get people buying the low fat variety either. Ask the people. I'm one of them. It tastes nicer.
  - jhbadger 10y ago
    Yeah. Whole milk makes me gag. It's like drinking grease.
sargun 10y ago
Does anyone irradiate milk? I don't think the Mallard reaction would be present -- although, the milk proteinase would remain, but traditional pasteurization would be effective as an interim solution to deal with the unwanted enzymes. It seems like this is a low-hanging startup that might actually benefit from Trump's America.
davegardner 10y ago
You can certainly use UHT milk to make cheeses that don't contain rennet such as paneer, ricotta, and quark. Some argue that you can't make good quality versions of these cheeses with UHT milk. From personal experience, I've made quark with UHT milk and it seemed pretty good quality to me. I do get excellent results making yoghurt with UHT milk. It's also a simpler process as there is no need to heat the milk first before adding the starter.
cedex12 10y ago
Slightly off-topic, but how far are we from producing artificial milk? It would seem like a relatively easy thing to do (at least compared to meat), and with high payoff (vegetarian diet without the ethical and ecological problems of animal dairy).
- Synaesthesia 10y ago
  There's really nice artificial milk for sale - soy milk
  - rydl 10y ago
    ...also milk from rice, almond, oat...
    - mathw 10y ago
      Are any of these nutritionally equivalent to cow's milk? Or human milk? Or some kind of adult-biased version of human milk? Oh wait, yeah. Soylent, Huel, Mana, 100%Food etc. etc. etc. are effectively "artificial milk for adult humans", at least in their liquid forms rather than the ones who sell packaged meal bars as well.
      - NikolaeVarius 10y ago
        Why does it matter? Milk nutritionally is simple to replace. It's sugar water with fat and some assorted vitamins. It doesn't have anything that isn't easily replaceable.
    - contergan 10y ago
      None of those taste anything like real milk.
- pherq 10y ago
  We've had it for 2000 years, give or take...
- levthedev 10y ago
NanoWar 10y ago
So I go out and order a nice coffee from expensive beans, grinded & brewed with love -- only to see that they put UHT milk in it instead of fresh milk ... that spoils it for me!
phantarch 10y ago
Anecdotally, I almost exclusively buy Fair Life milk nowadays which usually has a very comfortable shelf life of 2-3 months. No discernible taste differences. They claim that they've got a cold-filtration process which is what allows for their milk to last so long. Doesn't sound the same as the UHT discussed in the article, I'd be curious to know what they exactly do. (https://fairlife.com/our-process/ https://fairlife.com/our-process/)
huherto 10y ago
This is probably what we call tetrapak milk in Mexico. You buy them in the supermarket and they last for months. I was surprised not find it in the US. It is very convenient. I don't think it tastes different than regular refrigerated milk.

112 points by akandiah 10y ago

Non-homogenized milk will also not spoil like regular milk does [though it still needs refrigeration, but it will last for 2-3 month pass its expiration date].

gambiting 10y ago

I was actually very surprised when I first moved to UK to find that milk here spoils within a few days of purchase, I was so used to UHT milk that we would normally buy several cartons of, and then it would last months(obviously only few days after opening, but we could conceivably buy a 6-month supply and just keep it in the basement for later consumption). Nowadays I found where to buy UHT milk in the UK, it gets me some weird looks from my friends but the convenience of not having to go to a store to buy fresh milk every few days is absolutely worth it.

Avshalom 10y ago
What are you doing with your milk? My milk isn't UHT and usually lasts weeks to a month after opening.
- stupidcar 10y ago
  Not refrigerating it, perhaps? Unopened UHT doesn't need to be refrigerated.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- barrkel 10y ago
  You must be buying micro-filtered milk then. Fresh milk will not last weeks.
  - anfractuosity 10y ago
    Interesting, I'd never heard of that process before, sounds very clever, does it taste just like ordinary pasteurised milk? (as it sounds like they use a filter, then pasteurise)
    - barrkel 10y ago
      Yup, just like pasteurised. After a few weeks, it starts tasting a bit different - not like fresh milk going sour, just different, don't really have a word for it.
- gambiting 10y ago
  Really? Normal, non-uht milk bought here in the UK will start smelling off and go lumpy after about a week or so in the fridge. Month after opening? I imagine it would be fully soured at that point?
  - ghaff 10y ago
    For the US, I agree as well. Maybe about 2 weeks on the outside for regular pasteurized milk and it will generally start to taste somewhat off within a week. A month? No way. ADDED: Sounds as if there's something called micro-filtered milk that I've never heard of in the US. It's certainly not a standard item.
satori99 10y ago
UHT milk is not popular at all in Australia, except in motel room mini-fridges. I find the taste to be almost, but not quite, entirely unlike milk. Particularly when used to make a flat white coffee. I would put up with a long walk to a shop everyday to not have to taste UHT milk :) Also, regular pasteurized milk is very cheap in Australia already. As low as $1/Lt in a supermarket as the result of some dubious market practices [0]. [0] http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-30/dairy-farmers-milk-prices/7546978 http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-30/dairy-farmers-milk-pri...
- Johnythree 10y ago
  UHT milk is VERY popular in Australia. I much prefer it, and never buy anything else.
  - bruce_one 10y ago
    These numbers seem to imply slightly over 10%; I wouldn't call that all-caps very... http://www.dairyaustralia.com.au/Markets-and-statistics/Production-and-sales/Milk/Drinking-Milk-Sales.aspx http://www.dairyaustralia.com.au/Markets-and-statistics/Prod...
sitharus 10y ago
Refrigerated pasteurised milk keeps at least three weeks, normally only 3-4 days of that are gone by the time it's sold. If it only lasted days your refrigerator is failing and needs replacing.
- gambiting 10y ago
  If I walk into tesco right now I can guarantee that their freshest milk will have a use by date of about 5-6 days from now. It should also be used within a couple days from opening - I would definitely buy a new bottle every 4-5 days. And nope, my fridge sits at a solid 2C, thank you.
  - s0rce 10y ago
    Wow, we regularly buy milk with best before dates 3-4 wks from the date of purchase. The milk doesn't travel far as there many dairy cows in Northern California.
    - adrianratnapala 10y ago
      I wonder if different definitions are at work: i.e. 5-6 days assumes you open it the moment you get it home, while 3-4 weeks assumes you drink it within a few days of opening.
      - petepete 10y ago
        Also milk pasteurisation and sterilisation are on a sliding scale, different countries and producers will use different temperatures and times. It's likely that in the UK, we do 'just enough' to make it safe. Wouldn't want to ruin a cup of tea, would we?
  - beojan 10y ago
    The Tesco Pure or Cravendale milk will have a 3-4 week shelf life, and is also pasteurized rather than UHT.
  - rhino369 10y ago
djrogers 10y ago
A few days? Fresh milk should last a couple of weeks at least unless you're doing something horribly wrong to it...
- sowbug 10y ago
  Whole milk lasts longer than other kinds.
corin_ 10y ago
Milk actually has a few places in UK's cultural history, one bit of which is very relevant to the inconvenience of buying milk regularly. Traditionally, "milk floats" (a vehicle) would be driven by "milkmen", doing early -morning deliveries of milk in glass bottles, and they would collect the previous day's empty bottles at the same time. Wiki page has photo examples of what milk floats look like: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk_float https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milk_float This service is actually still available in some places. For example, I just checked my postcode with https://www.milkandmore.co.uk https://www.milkandmore.co.uk and they told me my milkman's name and that he delivers on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Saturdays. But when I was a kid, say 20 years ago, we'd get it delivered Monday to Saturday, and seeing milkmen doing their rounds was incredibly common, with many customers everywhere. Now it's a bit of a quirky thing you don't see or hear much of, mainly because most people decided that the inconvenience of picking up from a shop was outweighed by the flexibility it offered.
- baddox 10y ago
  It's interesting that you described the concept of milkmen as specifically relevant to the U.K. In the United States, milkmen are well-established in pop culture, particularly as a quaint symbol of pre-WW2 domestic life. I would have assumed that milkmen were standard in most every developed country before refrigeration became widespread. I also would have assumed it's still common in developing countries.
  - corin_ 10y ago
    I was replying to somebody who was talking about the situation in the UK, and the knowledge I have of milkmen is from the UK - I didn't mean to imply it was necessarily unique to us.
- ghaff 10y ago
  We had a milkman when I was growing up in the US in the 1960s although it was already something of an anachronism at that time as we went to the grocery story for other dairy perishables. (I drank a lot of milk growing up so having the scheduled delivery was probably still somewhat convenient.) The adjacent town to where I live did have a dairy farm that delivered until fairly recently but I'm not sure they do any longer. I imagine there are still milkmen in some places but I'm not aware of any.
barrkel 10y ago
Plain fresh milk will start to taste a bit sour after a few days and will turn after no more than a week or so; or it could turn in a day if it's left out at room temperature. What you want to get is micro-filtered milk. Cravendale is the main supplier I know of, but some of the supermarkets' own brand have micro-filtered versions, with markup. Micro-filtered milk will last a few weeks, up to a month, without curdling.
- Dagwoodie 10y ago
  Thinking I might be lactose intolerant I tried some lactose free milk some time ago. It was the best tasting and the longest lasting Milk I ever bought. Ever since, I tend to buy exclusively lactose free because of that.
  - Broken_Hippo 10y ago
    I have considered the same thing. I've never really liked milk. Chocolate milk was always worse - it tasted like someone mixed something rotten with a chocolate flavor. I always think milk smells like it has gone off. I've never had an upset stomach or other gastric symptoms from dairy like my sister, who is lactose intolerant. I always kinda figured I wasn't. Then I tried some lactose free chocolate milk, with no sugar added. I think this was the first time I've actually enjoyed milk. I still do not drink milk often, but now I will actually drink it.
VLM 10y ago
I don't drink much milk so I mostly keep the little packages around for occasional baking and other recipes. Something missed in the article is package inflation has not caught up to UHT like it has for most every other product in the supermarket, a cup sized package continues to hold exactly 1 cup or 8 oz like it has for a couple decades. Most processed foods in the supermarket have dramatically shrunk over time making UHT something of a novelty.
rhaps0dy 10y ago
The first bottle of milk I bought in the UK got spoilt without me even opening it. I left it outside the fridge, not realising that you can only do that with UHT.

corin_ 10y ago

There's a very noticeable difference in taste between pasteurised and UHT milk, and anecdotally, based on discussing with multiple friends over the years, people who are used to pasteurised think UHT tastes worse, people who are used to UHT don't notice the difference, or notice but don't mind either way. Personally, as a Brit (pasteurised is the norm) who has lived in France and Belgium, I'd always choose pasteurised. To drink on its own, UHT is significantly not nice to my tastebuds. With breakfast cereal its OK but still worse. A small amount in coffee and I don't notice the difference. In Paris, finding pasteurised was pretty easy to do - although shops gave much more shelf space to UHT, I rarely struggled to find fresh milk. In Belgium on the other hand... near where I was living in a city, only one of 4 chain supermarkets and none of the cornershops sold non-UHT milk. It's quite possible that if I spent <x amount of time> drinking lots and lots of UHT milk eventually my preference might change. I'm not planning on trying, though.

noonespecial 10y ago
Counteranecdotally, I spent most of my young years in Germany drinking uht, and coming to America for university I found regular milk "sour" in comparison
- corin_ 10y ago
  All of my anecdotes on the matter are EU (possibly all BE/FR, not sure) vs UK, so it's possible UK and US pasteurised milk tastes different (I've had many lattes in America but can't remember ever drinking straight milk or over cereal there..) Or it's possible my sample size was too small. Would be curious to know how many people feel which way, but somehow doubt there's any good data sets for that!
- adrianratnapala 10y ago
  Maybe you were leaving it for too long before drinking it... That said, I had a colleague who was mad keen on getting absolutely the perfect traditional milk. This meant the proper kind of high-speed machine had to do the shaking. But it also, apparently, meant using old milk. He would actually ask servers whether the milk fresh, and walk out if they said "yes".

altano 10y ago

I don't find pasteurization to make as much of a difference as other things like fat content. Whole milk is sooo much better than skim milk, for example. I love milk and since moving to California I haven't been able to find anything nearly as good as what we had in Boston. There was this brand High Lawn Farms that had tangibly better milk. You could even notice the difference when used in small amounts in tea/coffee, which is probably why every single local coffee shop used it. Someone should figure out what they are doing differently.

mastazi 10y ago
Are you comparing untreated vs pasteurized milk, or pasteurized vs. UHT? The article is mainly about the latter.
- ghaff 10y ago
  A commercial producer like the one listed is still selling pasteurized product. I do like to buy from a couple of small local producers when it's convenient but I'm not sure I could identify in a blind test. The availability of raw milk varies by state and is often only available for purchase on the farm that produces it or otherwise outside of normal retail channels.
- altano 10y ago
  I'm just speaking to my experience with all different kinds of milk. I don't think I've ever had completely unpasteurized milk (is that legal in the US?), so every other kind.
njk510 10y ago
Looks like they have only Jersey cows that make milk with higher fat content and also primarily with A2 beta casein. There is a brand here in California called Saint Benoit creamery which you can find at Whole Foods.
jordanthoms 10y ago
One of the nice things being back in New Zealand is the quality of the milk here - maybe it's just because I grew up drinking it, but it tastes vastly better to me. It has a much fuller flavour than anything I found in California - could be because all the cows here are grass-fed? UHT is available here but for most people it's emergency use only.

ProfessorLayton 10y ago

Heh, I keep a box of single serve UHT milk cartons in my fridge just for making coffee on the weekends, and the occasional recepie. It's a little pricey at about $1.10/8oz carton, but at my consumption rate I'd be throwing away most of the 1/2 gallon jug anyway, which typically costs more per oz than a full gallon. I don't find it as good as non-UHT milk, but it's definitely worth the convenience of always having milk when I need it.

mackey 10y ago
I do the same thing, but still end up with extra at the end of the weekend. When traveling in Europe I noticed a lot of places have small tablespoon servings of UHT milk in little cartons. I wish we had something like that here, but all I can I find are stuff like "mini moos" which are too heavy.

senectus1 10y ago

We drink the Lactose free stuff, that stores for months in the cupboard. Oddly it seems to taste nicer than fresh milk.

drivingmenuts 10y ago

Apropos link: http://cnqzu.com/library/Anarchy%20Folder/Fiction/Stephenson,_Neal/Stephenson,_Neal_-_Cryptonomicon/Neal%20Stephenson%20-%20Cryptonomicon%20v2%20(HTML,%20Fully%20Proofed)/slide58.html http://cnqzu.com/library/Anarchy%20Folder/Fiction/Stephenson... I remember reading that some years ago and wondering if it was like condensed milk (which would probably be pretty awful on Captain Crunch cereal). Now, I think the cereal might be the key thing to hide the flavor of UHT milk.

Broken_Hippo 10y ago
I don't like milk, but will eat in cereal - though I won't drink any leftover milk in the bowl. It isn't just that cereal changes the taste of the milk, but the way you smell it is different. In a glass, you have a concentrated smelling tube you put to your mouth, and cereal you have a dribble on the spoon. You simply can't smell or taste as much of it.

dghughes 10y ago

This would be great for the Canadian north where food is incredibly expensive due to the cost of shipping and storage. For example a 2 liter bottle of orange juice is $30, 4 liters of milk $10. the UHT milk could bring that cost down if it can be stored in bulk for long periods of time.

9q 10y ago
> 2 liter bottle of orange juice is $30 Are you serious about this? 2 liters is 30 USD? I'm not sure if you're joking or being serious.
- peterwwillis 10y ago
  In Nunavut, it's closer to $38 (but sometimes as low as $26). Food prices in Northern Canada are basically more ridiculous than Norway. However, Walmart Canada has 1L "value brand" orange juice for as low as $1. So don't assume the price is the same everywhere. And also consider that OJ prices fluctuate daily on the commodities exchange (as much as 19% just in the past 3 months) and there are many tiers of OJ, from concentrate at as low as $1 per liter, to as much as $10 for super-premium brands.
- mattkrause 10y ago
  Sounds about right. I paid $4.50 for a warm (12 oz) can of Shasta root beer in Koliganek, AK. Keep in mind that these prices are for very small, very remote towns where everything is flown in (or driven over the ice in winter), not downtown Montreal or Anchorage.
  - dhbx9 10y ago
    Unfortunately true for Singapore as well even though it's not remote. Alcohol tax means a 12oz can goes for around 5 bucks as well.
    - inferiorhuman 10y ago
      Root beer (well, Shasta at least) is a sugary soft-drink (non-alcoholic). I think I paid about S$12 for a pint of actual beer at some pizza place in Clarke Quay. Don't think they tax the sugary stuff as much (if at all?), but they'll certainly shame you out of them (hello TAF).

blahedo 10y ago

About fifteen years ago, I had a housemate who was from Italy, and she thought the milk I bought (standard US whole milk) was gross and, she said, "tastes like cheese". I had already been exposed to shelf-stable milk on a previous trip to Europe, so we soon figured out that was the source of the issue, but reading this article suggests she may have been exceptionally perceptive with the cheese comment.

donw 10y ago

I didn't discover UHT milk until I moved to Germany, and went to the supermarket. It seems that every culture has its own grocery taxonomy, so I had to ask an employee where I could find the milk. She pointed me towards the milk aisle, and I was amazed that none of it was refrigerated. Sure, you can buy fresh milk in Germany, but it seems that UHT is considered more the "standard". I have to say, I preferred the taste to either American or Japanese milk, and fell in love with the convenience of being able to keep a case of the stuff in my pantry.

lysium 10y ago
This must have been a long time ago. In my local super market it is harder to find UHT milk than fresh milk in the fridge. Which by the way has a two week shelve life because it is highly filtered.
- rndgermandude 10y ago
  Agreed. I usually groceries shop in one of three stores, and in only one I'd even know where the UHT milk aisle even is, and that's just because it happens to be next to the eggs. The refrigerated milk aisles (pasteurized and ESL) are very prominently featured in all those stores. I am also surprised that the wiki article linked elsewhere gives 66+% UHT consumption in Germany. They might be lumping together refrigerated Extended Shelf Life milk with 2-4 weeks shelve life (heated more than pasteurized milk and also usually filtered, but less so than UHT) and UHT milk in that statistic, but those are not really comparable in taste (and storage, obviously) at all.
w-m 10y ago
Milk usually isn't hard to find: just go to the back of the store, as far away from the entrance as possible. Works often and in many countries.
- crypto5 10y ago
  Planet Money's story about why is that: http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/07/23/334076398/episode-555-why-is-the-milk-in-the-back-of-the-store http://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/07/23/334076398/episo...

dsacco 10y ago

This is interesting to me because one of my favorite weird hobbies is going to my grocery store, taking a photo of the milk with the farthest date, and sending it to my friends as a sort of game. I shop at Stew Leonard's most of the time (locations in NY and CT). The milk I buy there is organic and lasts a hell of a long time compared to the milk I frequently see in other supermarkets. The current record I've seen is a gallon of milk with an expiration date 63 days from the day I saw it. I'd say the median is maybe...50 ish days (I shop on Sundays, when I think they've likely restocked). I regularly buy three gallons at a time, and to this day I find it to be the most fun and humorous part of shopping at the grocery store. This milk has literally never gone bad for me and it tastes delicious. After reading this article, I'm really interested in knowing whether or not it's heat-treated! I have always assumed it lasts so long because Stew Leonard's owns their own farms relatively close to the grocery stores.

matt_wulfeck 10y ago
I think it's required to be heat treated to be sold in the US. I like to check the dates too! I always get a little kick from pulling a gallon from the back that has a few extra days left in the expiry label.
cauterized 10y ago
I've had a similar experience. I think the organics companies just clean their equipment/tanks better or something. Regular milk with an expiration date 3 weeks in the future often turns sour within 3 days of opening, despite refrigeration. Whereas organic milk with the same expiration date, from the same shelf in the same store, will last a week and a half. And there's really nothing inherent about organic milk that should make it last longer.
- CamelCaseName 10y ago
  Regular milk with an expiration date 3 weeks in the future often turns sour within 3 days of opening, despite refrigeration. Wait, what? Are you not refrigerating your milk? This is unusual.

chomp 10y ago

You can't make mozzarella with UHT milk. One nice thing about regular pasteurized milk is that it forms curds easier and has higher yield. I love going to the store and buying a gallon to turn to fresh mozz.

dkarapetyan 10y ago

And honey lasts forever.

cschneid 10y ago

My local store just started carrying small (1 pint) UHT milk. We don't use milk in our house, except as an ingredient in other things, so a pint at a time is perfect, and now it has a 6+ month shelf life, so there's less planning and feel-bads when it goes sour.

sauronlord 10y ago

Drink milk? What are you... a baby cow? This piece was likely inspired by the milk lobby... sales must be sagging.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

pmontra 10y ago

Pasteurized and UHT have about the same shelf space in Italy with the former tasting much better than the latter to me. I buy UHT only for the first breakfast when I come back from a vacation. Full fat milk tastes better than reduced fat, which is watery in comparison. However micro filtered milk become common in the last years. It lasts one or two weeks and tastes as pasteurized. It's the one I buy. The advantage of UHT is that it doesn't need a refrigerator so it's what I buy on vacation, when I don't have a fridge or where I don't trust the fridges of the sellers.

d--b 10y ago

Weird that they don't talk about micro-filtered milk. It removes bacteria through filtration, tastes like regular milk, has a long shelf life and stays good for a good week in your fridge...

matt_wulfeck 10y ago
If it tastes like regular milk (assuming you mean the pasteurized milk we drink in the US/Australia/NZ) what are the advantages over it? I regularly keep milk in my fridge much longer than a week.
- mathw 10y ago
  I've started buying microfiltered milk (am in the UK) because I've always had trouble with milk going off before I can use it all when buying ordinary pasteurised milk, but the microfiltered milk stays fresh plenty long enough to use it all up. On the bottle the stuff I buy say it's good for 7 days in the fridge after opening. Experience so far bears this out, whereas normal milk manages about 4 for me. It's entirely possible my fridge sucks, but I have checked the temperature and the milk comes out of the fridge at about 2C, so...
srrr 10y ago
In fact most of the fresh milk sold in Germany is microflitrated. It is really hard to find old school pasteurized fresh milk nowadays in a normal supermarked. The microflitrated milk is named "Frischmilch - länger haltbar" (fresh milk - long life). Milk that is only pasteurized is named "Frischmilch - traditionell hergestellt" (fresh milk - traditionally crafted).

matt_wulfeck 10y ago

This was a really fun comments section to read. It's really interesting to see how much variation there is in the international milk market!

aembleton 10y ago
Yep, I've only had pasteurised in the UK and Ireland and those two taste the same. If I'm every in the US I'll have to try the milk and see if it tastes different.

garyclarke27 10y ago

British / Irish pasteurised milk tastes so much fresher than pasteurised milk in other countries, must be our abundant green grass, British Beef is also the best in the world. UHT milk is horrible. Filtered fresh milk is the answer, needs refrigeration but lasts for 5 times longer than non-filtered.

Neliquat 10y ago
You really need to travel more if you think this. British beef is some of the worst (unless boiling) due to the fat/collegen ratio.

bootload 10y ago

Pasteurised, UHT but no mention of powdered or condensed milk.

philmander 10y ago

There's quite a big different between 72°c and 140°c. Would 105° produce a semi-long lasting milk that doesn't taste quite as different (bad) as UHT? Also, are there any other downsides to UHT besides taste? Are more nutrients lost?

skc 10y ago

I'm embarrassed that I never looked into the difference between the two. I've always bought fresh milk on the assumption that it was healthier and purer than the long life stuff, especially because the long life milk tastes a tad sweeter and creamier to me (so it must be bad for me, right?)

projectorlochsa 10y ago

Another milk that lasts months is soy milk. Nutritionally superior and cruelty free!

kingrolo 10y ago
I'll just piggy back this comment to add that there's a whole world of milk alternatives too if you're worried about the ethics and don't like soy. I'm not keen on soy but use coconut milk. Others I know prefer almond milk or oat milk. Probably took about 3 weeks to get used to but now I definitely prefer it.
- projectorlochsa 10y ago
  http://www.perfectdayfoods.com/ http://www.perfectdayfoods.com/ There's also milk made with casein protein and all the goodies from original cow milk, but without the cows. Also has a fairly long shelf life.
  - kingrolo 10y ago
    Wow, I'd never heard of that. Looks really interesting!
  - Broken_Hippo 10y ago
    I didn't know this existed. I have a weird fascination with replacement foods - not so much of the nutrition shake variety, but things just like this. I don't mind drinking cows milk, but if I saw this in the store I'd have to try it. Thanks muchly.
exprA 10y ago
And phytoestrogens for that nice warped hormonal balance... No thanks.
- projectorlochsa 10y ago
  Clinical studies show no effects of soy protein or isoflavones on reproductive hormones in men: results of a meta-analysis. http://www.fertstert.org/article/S0015-0282(09)00966-2/fulltext http://www.fertstert.org/article/S0015-0282(09)00966-2/fullt... Good thing we've got science to reinforce our claims. Not to mention the fact that you're drinking milk from a lactating female filled with animal estrogen yet you worry about plant estrogen.

raimue 10y ago

A few years ago, super markets in Germany (and I guess also in other European countries) switched from selling pasteurized milk to ESL milk (Extended Shelf Life). It has actually became quite hard to find any non-ESL milk in grocery stores. ESL milk last for 2-3 weeks in the fridge, but it has not been heated to the same degree as UHT milk. Therefore it still tastes better, but not the same as pasteurized milk.

ccozan 10y ago

After I moved to rural Germany, I was happy to find out that the local farmers will sell you milk. Since then I only drink that really fresh milk, milked in the same day. The first 4 cm of the bottle are just cream. Is incredibly tasty and you can make any kind of cheese or Yoghurt with it - you need the right bacteria, of course. Another interesting bit: I used to cook it and then drink it. Not doing this anymore. Some people say is not healthy, but I can really see the cows from where is coming. There is no place where it might be contaminated. And also it resists about a week in the fridge, after that it transforms into a nice refreshing fermented milk drink.

bad_user 10y ago

In my mind edible substances that last a long time are free of nutrients and high in calories, most of the time anyway. I never buy UHT milk and try buying fresh, locally produced milk whenever I can find it. I never buy low fat milk either. The difference in taste between fresh milk and these replacements is actually huge. I also don't get people buying the low fat variety either. If you're concerned about fat or cholesterol, it's better to drink less, high-quality milk, instead of milk-like liquids enriched with powdered milk, pork fat and dyes (the exact composition of these replacements varies by country, but it's always processed to the point that you can no longer classify it as being milk).

test1235 10y ago
What's low fat milk? Is that the same as skimmed/semi skimmed?
- Broken_Hippo 10y ago
  Yup - usually it is the semi-skimmed milk instead of the fully skimmed milk.
Broken_Hippo 10y ago
I generally don't like milk. The taste makes me gag a little bit and it nearly always smells like it is going sour, even when it clearly isn't. It isn't for lack of trying, and there are differences. Lactose-free milk is better than normal. Low-fat milk tastes better than whole milk, yet skim milk tastes like I put water in a glass that had milk in it without rinsing. For me, there is no real concern about the calories - I use cream occasionally in cooking, after all, and use butter.
noja 10y ago
> I also don't get people buying the low fat variety either. Ask the people. I'm one of them. It tastes nicer.
- jhbadger 10y ago
  Yeah. Whole milk makes me gag. It's like drinking grease.

sargun 10y ago

Does anyone irradiate milk? I don't think the Mallard reaction would be present -- although, the milk proteinase would remain, but traditional pasteurization would be effective as an interim solution to deal with the unwanted enzymes. It seems like this is a low-hanging startup that might actually benefit from Trump's America.

davegardner 10y ago

You can certainly use UHT milk to make cheeses that don't contain rennet such as paneer, ricotta, and quark. Some argue that you can't make good quality versions of these cheeses with UHT milk. From personal experience, I've made quark with UHT milk and it seemed pretty good quality to me. I do get excellent results making yoghurt with UHT milk. It's also a simpler process as there is no need to heat the milk first before adding the starter.

cedex12 10y ago

Slightly off-topic, but how far are we from producing artificial milk? It would seem like a relatively easy thing to do (at least compared to meat), and with high payoff (vegetarian diet without the ethical and ecological problems of animal dairy).

Synaesthesia 10y ago
There's really nice artificial milk for sale - soy milk
- rydl 10y ago
  ...also milk from rice, almond, oat...
  - mathw 10y ago
    Are any of these nutritionally equivalent to cow's milk? Or human milk? Or some kind of adult-biased version of human milk? Oh wait, yeah. Soylent, Huel, Mana, 100%Food etc. etc. etc. are effectively "artificial milk for adult humans", at least in their liquid forms rather than the ones who sell packaged meal bars as well.
    - NikolaeVarius 10y ago
      Why does it matter? Milk nutritionally is simple to replace. It's sugar water with fat and some assorted vitamins. It doesn't have anything that isn't easily replaceable.
  - contergan 10y ago
    None of those taste anything like real milk.
pherq 10y ago
We've had it for 2000 years, give or take...
levthedev 10y ago

NanoWar 10y ago

So I go out and order a nice coffee from expensive beans, grinded & brewed with love -- only to see that they put UHT milk in it instead of fresh milk ... that spoils it for me!

phantarch 10y ago

Anecdotally, I almost exclusively buy Fair Life milk nowadays which usually has a very comfortable shelf life of 2-3 months. No discernible taste differences. They claim that they've got a cold-filtration process which is what allows for their milk to last so long. Doesn't sound the same as the UHT discussed in the article, I'd be curious to know what they exactly do. (https://fairlife.com/our-process/ https://fairlife.com/our-process/)

huherto 10y ago

This is probably what we call tetrapak milk in Mexico. You buy them in the supermarket and they last for months. I was surprised not find it in the US. It is very convenient. I don't think it tastes different than regular refrigerated milk.