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There is a legendary story about how Steve Jobs, upon his return to Apple, drastically cut-down the number of models that they offer. How on earth have they for

There is a legendary story about how Steve Jobs, upon his return to Apple, drastically cut-down the number of models that they offer. How on earth have they forgotten that lesson? Trying to figure out the differences between the 9.7" iPad and iPad pro is not easy, and regardless, it makes it harder to buy.

ajeet_dhaliwal 10y ago
It has got a little confusing over the years but today doesn't add any further complexity and makes things a bit better, it just replaces the iPad Air which I think was badly named to begin with and should have just been called iPad like it was before. May be because the Macbook Air looks to be going away they are getting rid of the Air name, although they just released 'AirPods'.
- mikeash 10y ago
  They also dropped the iPad mini 2, which is a nice step towards simplifying the lineup a bit. It's still overly complicated, but it's been ridiculous for years now, and this is moving in the right direction.
- emdowling 10y ago
  AirPlay, AirPrint are still in use. The Air name for Macbook and iPad lines was all about thinness. When introduced, these products had thicker predecessors. It's irrelevant now for iPad, as everything is pretty much the same thickness across all models. For Macbook Air, it is no longer the thinnest product in the line-up. However, Apple can't quite get rid of it just yet - not until they offer a sub $999 Macbook.
  - rrdharan 10y ago
    In those cases the Air refers to wirelessness rather than weight.
waderyan 10y ago
I don't disagree with the lesson, but does it always apply? When Jobs came back Apple was in a different place than it is today. To your second point, I completely agree. Regardless of the need to focus, causing confusion to consumers doesn't seem the right thing to do.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > I don't disagree with the lesson, but does it always apply? When Jobs came back Apple was in a different place than it is today. Maybe, but on the other hand there is a lot of similarity between Apple v. Microsoft/PC-cloned on desktop and Apple v. Google/Android-devices on mobile. And one similarity would seem to be that Apple is in no position to win on breadth and choice, but they may be in a position to win (at least, create a solid, profitable I market where they have little effective competition) by identifying key niches, and narrowly tailoring offerings to them. In fact, I'd argue that their path in tablets and smartphones has been pretty similar as in PCs; they developed the market ahead of everyone else with fisrly narrow offerings, a competing platform emerged where the core software was separate from hardware manufacturers offering more choice, and drew them into trying to compete on the kind of choice offered by the competition.
marvindanig 10y ago
Also there was reason why Steve Jobs was against all tablet sizes except one. At the time Apple was going after revolutionizing the education market and the 9.7" iPad1/2 fit the bill for that purpose exactly. Then came the iPad mini whose sole purpose was to increase business bottom-line… and then a few more models based on other focuses or potential uses. Meh. Moral of story: Do not destroy the initial momentum and the sense of denting the world. "To be a part of revolutionary change" is an important feeling to keep in tech industry. --- Edits: Wish I could impress upon them about the urgency to kill all models except the iPad Air (9"). Anything else will only kill/subdue the category and lead the focus away from the initial promise that the tablets held -- i.e. disrupt education.
- dmix 10y ago
  Current iPad sizes: - iPad Pro 12.9" - iPad Pro 9.7" - iPad 9.7" - iPad Mini 4 8" (edit: thanks pdpi/trymas) It really should just be iPad (9.7) or iPad Pro (12.9) should it not? Now the customer has to decide between two 9.7 models with not so obvious differences between the two? And now there are two (edit: three) different iPad pages on the sales website you have to go through. This changes the immediate conversation visiting the site for the first time between why I should get the iPad... to what's the difference and available options AND why should I get an iPad? The Macbook vs Macbook Pro distinction was more obvious because it was basically casual/school vs work. But I don't really see tablets having that work vs casual dichotomy. It's more high-end vs affordable. Which from a mental categorization perspective doesn't fit neatly into the current product line.
  - pdpi 10y ago
    Plus the iPad Mini 7.9". As a 9.7 Pro owner, the differences between the 9.7 Pro and the regular iPad are quite important. I just wish they made the comparison easier, though.
    - trymas 10y ago
      http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ I think that's pretty good comparison. Reminds me of iPhone SE - make a product from older tech, where all manufacturing is cheap and smooth as ever and sell it as cheapest option (I imagine with still veeery big markup).
squeaky-clean 10y ago
I always thought that was the iDevice's strength. With Android, you have nothing actually made by Google but by OEMs, with different names and branding that don't give any real information. Which phone is "the android"? My mom doesn't think she has an android phone, she thinks she has an LG and that Android is a different thing. People buy a low end Android phone and hate the entire ecosystem because the phone performs like crap. I have a friend who thinks the Galaxy S7 would be a crappy upgrade because they already have a "Galaxy Core Prime". When there was just the iPhone, it was really easy. It was expensive compared to other options, but you knew it was the best iPhone, and the one with a higher number was better than one with a lower number. Yet an LG G5 is better than a Samsung Galaxy S6, they are somehow both "Android", and Marshmallow is better than Jelly Bean. Now the iPhone isn't that bad, but it's not simple anymore. iPhone 7, iPhone 7Plus, iPhone 7S, iPhone 7S Plus, iPhone SE. Which is better?
- dmix 10y ago
  It's quite obvious the Pixel is the "flagship" Android Google phone. And Pixel C is the "flagship" Android tablet. The pixel is advertised everywhere as a Google phone. Who makes it doesn't really come up in their product communication much. And the 'flagship' label is literally in the title of the Pixel products on Amazon. And on the website it's called "Pixel, phone by Google". > People buy a low end Android phone and hate the entire ecosystem because the phone performs like crap. This seems like an antiquated view of Android. I don't think people see Apple as having a monopoly on luxury/quality devices anymore. And considering the heavy OS modifications made by different companies and the entire UX experience of dealing with a company (customer service, website, accessories, etc), I don't really see why it matters if your mom thinks she has a "Samsung" or an "LG". There's more to Android phones than the base OS.
  - squeaky-clean 10y ago
    For people on Hacker News, sure. But try asking your grandma what the flagship Android phone is and what the flagship Apple phone is. It is much more confusing for the average person than you'd think. > I don't really see why it matters if your mom thinks she has a "Samsung" or an "LG". Because when people ask if she has an Android she says "No." > There's more to Android phones than the base OS. I know, that's my complaint. It really adds nothing for the customer to have it be so fragmented.
drzaiusapelord 10y ago
Jobs also wanted one phone at one screen size based on some cargo-cult science about average thumb length. Apple was watching its lunch being eaten by people who would have had probably bought an iPhone but wanted the big screens Android has to offer. Thus the multiple iPhone models. He was also against the mini iPad size, which is the only iPad I'm willing to buy. I think the limited product line is an artifact of the time and place Jobs and Apple were in the early 2000s. They had endless Mac models and a underwhelming value proposition. Cutting that down to a single colorful little Mac and a single pro product and their laptop equivalents made sense. Introducing the mobile revolution one simple product at a time also made sense. Now they need to continue to make sales, so adding more products to address more niche markets is the only way forward. They've probably exhausted their "one size fits all" market at this point. Apple can't accept no or negative growth, so more niche products it is.
- revmoo 10y ago
  They could try uhh.... maybe innovating new products?
nkkollaw 10y ago
Sure, but he cut stuff like printers, cameras, and other crazy crap they used to make. Even when he was still alive they had different-sized iPods, iPads, and more. Computers have always come in different sizes: 13", 15", and 17". What is the difference between a 13" and a 15"? Does it make it harder to buy? Perhaps, but you wouldn't kill the 15" just so people don't get confused.
- steeleduncan 10y ago
  I think the point is that the difference between 13", 15" and 17" laptops is easily grasped by even the least knowledgeable customer. It takes no time to figure which product fits your needs best. The difference between the 9.7" iPad and the 9.7" iPad pro is not intuitive, at least to me. If it is not obvious how different products serve different needs, then you aren't actually expanding the market your product appeals to, you are just confusing customers.
  - jacobolus 10y ago
    The important difference is that “pro” supports the stylus, while “non-pro” does not.
    - jfoster 10y ago
      Is that really the biggest difference? Sure, a stylus might be important, but they could just make all models work with the stylus.
      - memco 10y ago
        There are several differences, which any given person might find more appealing. Pro offers: - Better processing power - Better sound (more speakers) - Better resolution cameras (about +4MP on both) - Thinner (1.4 mm) - Lighter (.04 lbs) - Higher storage capacity - Pencil & Keyboard (the ipad smart KB, bluetooth should work on both) support And possibly the non-pro does not have P3 wide color gamut support? If I was buying one for a family member I would buy the iPad, not the pro unless I specifically knew they needed one of these features—of which, the keyboard and pencil support seem most probable, cameras probably second. Personally, I have the pro with the keyboard and pencil, and I love it for most day to day use. I have not yet tried to code on it, but I am dubious that I will ever be able to rely on it as my primary/only computing device. However, for meetings, classes or speaking engagements I find it highly versatile and fits a niche my laptop never would.
cocktailpeanuts 10y ago
One of the reasons why he did that was because Apple was dying. They didn't have money and resources to support many models, and they needed to focus and do one thing right. So it was the right decision. As much as I like simplicity, if you look around there are tons of cases like this around us, and that's not because these companies are idiots who don't understand simplicity but it's because their products have reached saturation point where making it simple won't get more users. They need to expand horizontally by building variations that appeal to a wider audience. Sure it's kind of annoying, and you and I may not understand the benefits of the 9.7 inch iPad, but I am sure there are many people who understand exactly the benefits of 9.7 inch iPad vs iPad pro and will rush to buy them.
- valarauca1 10y ago
  Under Jobs during the early days they never sold many products at once. There was the old Apple II and new Apple II. Seeing as they went past 6 revisions of Apple II there was considerable churn. There was never much of a 1st party peripheral market. Like we see with iWatch. That nearly exclusively 3rd party.
  - ajross 10y ago
    > Under Jobs during the early days they never sold many products at once. Depends on how early you go. The II+ was a straightforward upgrade to the ][ that replaced it, but the IIe was sold alongside the II+ for a long time. And then it refused to disappear while they sold the IIc and then IIgs. And don't forget the not-quite-part-of-the-family Apple III! Up through the early 80's they had a clean lineup. After that there were as many as four different variants on the Apple II in the market at a time.
- sushisource 10y ago
  Wait, really? You and I being readers of Hacker News are probably in a better position than 90%+ of customers to understand the benefits of one iPad over another. If it's not clear to us... who is it clear to?
  - 10y ago
frogpelt 10y ago
Apple is not the same company and should not be expected to act like the company they were when Steve Jobs returned. Their market cap is over $700 Billion. They were never going to continue their growth by offering one phone, one tablet, and one laptop, regardless of what the purists think. Remember when Google was nothing but search?
- camus2 10y ago
  > Remember when Google was nothing but search? Google has nothing to do with Apple. Why even talk about Google as a relevant example of anything regarding consumer hardware production? they aren't.
stronglikedan 10y ago
My favorite new tactic of theirs is in their new commercials, where an actor will ask if the "iPad" can do something, and the announcer will confirm that it can, on the "iPad Pro". The one that jumps to mind is the MS Office one, but I recall at least one other feature that they advertised using the same tactic. It's pretty confusing if you don't catch the causally mentioned "Pro" bit at the very end, after they've gone through a segment on the "feature" that the "iPad" can do. I just hope it'll net them a lot of returned iPads from rightfully frustrated customers.
- aeontech 10y ago
  I think that's just because those are commercials promoting the Pro specifically, not that they are saying that those things cannot be done on non-pro models. At least, I'm not aware of any restrictions on what models of iPad's can run Office, for example, and if there were, they'd be ones imposted by app's authors, Microsoft in this case. Unless you're talking about apps specifically requiring Pencil?
  - stronglikedan 10y ago
    Maybe it's just the bait-and-switch tone of the commercials that throws me off. It does seem like Office would run on any iPad [0], and they could just be referring to the pencil. However, even the description there [0] is kind of weirdly worded to me. I just don't know enough about Apple devices I guess. > * Word is ready for iPad Pro and looks amazing on the 12.9-inch screen. Read Word documents on iPad Pro for free. To create and edit docs, you need a qualifying Office 365 subscription. Try it for free for 30 days. * The real Microsoft Word app designed for iPad, iPhone and iPod touch. [0] https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/microsoft-word/id586447913?mt=8 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/microsoft-word/id586447913?m...
joeblau 10y ago
The main thing that comes to mind for me is the Apple Pencil.
- cgh 10y ago
  Yes, exactly. The Apple Pencil is incredible, by the way. The experience is comparable in my mind to using the original iPhone for the first time. Apple should market the hell out of the 12.9" iPad Pro to artists.
  - siidooloo 10y ago
    Yes, Wacom must have realized this as the newest Cintiqs finally solved the biggest problem they always had: paralax.
internet2000 10y ago
Never thought I'd see the day where the argument against Apple is that they have too much choice.
- fiddlerwoaroof 10y ago
  That might be because satisfied people tend to be quieter about a product than dissatisfied ones.
tptacek 10y ago
iPad Pro: Take the 9.7" iPad and add: * Apple Pencil * Faster CPU, more memory, more display * UHD color gamut display (and automatic white balance adjustment) * Better cameras I think there are other differences, but those are the big ticket ones.
- mturmon 10y ago
  I'd argue that the #1 or #2 key addition that "Pro" gets you (the Pencil being the other #1 or #2) is the "Smart Connector" for the integrated keyboard (http://www.apple.com/smart-keyboard/ http://www.apple.com/smart-keyboard/). The ability to add the keyboard and the pencil illustrates the distinction Apple is trying to make between the Pro and the vanilla 9.7 -- creation vs. consumption. After all these years, they are still persistently trying to position the iPad as a creation tool. Maybe it will work.
  - chipotle_coyote 10y ago
    The list of things I absolutely can't do on an iPad is fairly small these days. (This is distinct from things that I would prefer to do on a Mac/PC, but there are things that I would prefer to do on the iPad, too.) I think Apple may need to do a better job of showing, well, more utilitarian tasks that can be done pretty easily on the iPad. Having said that, I do wonder if one of the unspoken stumbling blocks is that even if an iPad is a great portable computer in many respects, it's only a portable computer. A lot of people "dock" their laptops to get work done. (Or to write comments on Hacker News when they should be getting work done.) I love traveling with my 9.7" iPad Pro and keyboard, but even if future releases of iOS address all the nitpicks I have with it, there are times I want to be sitting at a desk in front of a big monitor. I don't see that coming to iOS any time soon.
aroman 10y ago
You've got it backwards. This update streamlines the product line, along the lines of what Steve Jobs did. There are now 3 iPads: the iPad, the iPad Pro, and the iPad Mini. The differences are as clear as they ever have been for Mac lines.
- kevindqc 10y ago
  What are you talking about? There is now 4 http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/
  - karlshea 10y ago
    The Pro is one line, there are just two screen sizes. The 9.7" Pro has the same processor as the larger pro and has compatibility with the pencil. The new 9.7" non-pro has the lower end chip and no pencil.
    - chaostheory 10y ago
      Yes it's one line, but it has two versions with big differences. I could be wrong but it's not just the screen size, it's also the screen resolution and camera resolution as well. They might as well be two different products. Everyone thought that the smaller iPad Pro was the successor to the iPad.
    - gpawl 10y ago
      It's more a band than a line if there are two available at once
    - r00fus 10y ago
      The 12.9" apparently doesn't have the same TruTone screen (at least according to Apple's own comparison chart) as the 9.7". This is not simply a size difference.
- simonh 10y ago
  Except there are two iPad Pro sizes and one of them is the same size as the new basic iPad 9.7'. And the iPad Mini is now more expensive than a basic iPad 9.7' but are slower, but only come in a large storage option. I love Apple. Read my other posts defending the iPad as a productivity device on this discussion, and defending the cleanness if the iPhone lineup, but the current iPad lineup is all over the place.
stanmancan 10y ago
This is what happens when they don't have a "product" guy running the company anymore. Steve Jobs was brilliant at coming up with new products. Every since he left all we have gotten is the Apple Watch, which one can argue he probably had a hand in. Their only option now is to start creating variations of existing product lines to keep them "fresh".
- budde 10y ago
  > Steve Jobs was brilliant at coming up with new products By my count, Jobs shepherded the following hit products (I'm giving the Apple ][ to Woz): - Macintosh (1984) - iPod (2001) - iPhone (2007) - iPad (2010) I think you're exaggerating how often Apple rolled out new product lines under Jobs. You could even argue that the iPod and iPhone overshadow the other two substantially in terms of cultural impact. > Their only option now is to start creating variations of existing product lines to keep them "fresh". Isn't this kind of what you'd expect out of a business? Refreshing and supporting their existing product lines while occasionally trying to establish new ones? The iPhone is looking more and more like a once-in-a-lifetime home run product (Ben Thompson has done a lot of good writing on this), the likes of which Apple (or anybody else, for that matter) may never be able to top. This isn't to say that Apple doesn't miss having a visionary like Jobs at the helm or that their product lineup doesn't have glaring flaws. I just think the massive success of the iPhone set expectations way too high.
  - stanmancan 10y ago
    When Jobs came back to Apple he supposedly canned hundreds of different products and got them to focus again. While he was around, that's how things remained; each product had their own place. As time goes on since his departure, the clutter is starting to come back and the lines are starting to blur. Whats the difference between the new Macbook and the Macbook Air? The iPad 9.6 vs the iPad Pro 9.6? Apple Watch Gen 1 vs Gen 2 vs Series 1 vs Series 2?
  - Chromus 10y ago
    Maybe I'm misinformed, but those seem like the "definitive" Apple products to me. They're basically the foundation of their current business, and have only been diluted since his departure.
scarface74 10y ago
There is a big difference. They were a $4 billion dollar company without the resources they have now and they were selling multiple computers with the same specs with different model numbers depending on the retailer. He also said that a mistake they made with Macs was having a price umbrella that let others come in cheaper. iPad is cheaper and doesn't support the pencil - good enough for most people - and the iPad Pro is more expensive and supports the stylus and has a faster processor. Most people understand more expensive = better. On a side note. I hate Apple stopped selling the 3rd Gen AppleTV for $59. It was "good enough" for people who mostly wanted AirPlay functionality and to stream videos using the included app. Now they have nothing that competes in the ChromeCast/Roku stick price range.
MR4D 10y ago
Agreed. I thought the best way would be differentiate on features. Pro should be: - wifi+LTE - more storage - pen and/or cover keyboard included - faster CPU - multiscreen capability (connect to mouse and monitor with "desktop" interface) for truly replacing my desktop Regular iPad should be wifi only, and not come with a pen.
- r00fus 10y ago
  It's almost that way - just that you can get the regular iPad with LTE, too. Honestly, I wish they'd instead make all the iPads "pencil" compatible.
  - PacketPaul 10y ago
    Then they would not have a reason to charge more. They need low cost and a premium option.
  - PacketPaul 10y ago
    Then they would not have a reason to charge more. They need low cost and a premium option.
sandymcmurray 10y ago
http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ to compare current models. iPad Pro 9.7 has better processor, better screen, better camera, is slightly thinner and lighter and works with Apple Pencil and Keyboard accessories. There are now just four options: big Pro, little Pro, iPad, and mini.
- spike021 10y ago
  Four options, plus all the sub-options: with cellular data or without, 3 or so different amounts of space.. With the larger iPads do some people get smaller space, even though larger display probably means more resources/larger resolution media will need to be stored on the device. Spitballing but it's quite a few options.
  - mcphage 10y ago
    They're at least independent questions. First you decide which you want, then you decide how much space, and then you decide if you want cellular.
DoodleBuggy 10y ago
The "iPad Pro" is the same iPad as it always was, the "Pro" is marketing. A member of my family was hustled into buying an iPad "Pro" from a sales rep who convinced them it can do everything and more, yet they can't perform simple file management and related email tasks on it, so they still use a Windows PC that cost 1/2 the price of the $800 iPad Pro.
methehack 10y ago
Been wondering the same thing. It's one of the my favorite stories from the Walter Isacson bio. After listening to all the product mgrs for like 3 days in all day meetings describe their 20+ hardware products, he draws a 2x2. Labels one axis "consumer/professional" the other "laptop/desktop" and says "you get four products". Clarity in product offerings means you know who you are; the inverse is also true.
- dijit27 10y ago
  I fondly remember seeing that product grid on Apple's website. And even though it isn't displayed as a grid I think the current iPad lineup fits the 2 axis concept pretty well. They still have the consumer/professional or consumption/creation axis. The Pro being the professional/creation end. And instead of laptop/desktop they have the size or portability axis. In the large professional there is the 12.9-inch iPad Pro, in the small professional there is the 9.7-inch iPad Pro. For the large consumer there is the iPad and finally the for the small consumer is the iPad mini.
njharman 10y ago
> it makes it harder to buy. I think you mean, "It makes it harder to decide to buy." A hugely important distinction and the point of having few models. (limiting decision points/places to 2nd think do I really need a new ipad)
rconti 10y ago
I am utterly confused. There was the iPad, then the Mini, then the Air, then the Pro.. and now I look at this, and 9.7" sounds fairly large ("normal" iPad size?) but the price is surprisingly cheap? No idea. closes window I've got about 6 tablets and never use any of them anyway. I hate the user experience. I see no case where I'd rather have a tablet than my phone or my 6 year old Macbook Air.
- pwthornton 10y ago
  Surfing the Internet, reading ebooks and watching videos are all things an iPad would do much better, particularly anything that would benefit from a hiDPI screen.
  - rconti 10y ago
    I do miss the high DPI screen when using my old Air, that's a good point. Though I usually don't feel my internet surfing is enhanced by holding a heavy tablet.
    - glenneroo 10y ago
      Have you considered the plethora of cases and stands available for relatively low prices? For someone with 6+ tablets, it just sounds like you buy them because they were cheap... and so that you have something to complain about.
- therealdrag0 10y ago
  Why do you have 6 of them?
  - dramamuch88 10y ago
    To justify not caring about this one.
  - rconti 10y ago
    Always seems like a good idea? I've got an iPad2 that I really wanted to love, and used until it became so slow it was useless (a couple of years ago). It still sits on my kitchen counter as a plugged-in weather station, though the app crashes frequently. I've got an HP Touchpad I bought during the fire sale for $50 or whatever the going rate was. I think its got Android on it. It was less of a fun project than I expected. Mostly I realized I don't like Android. I've got a 7" Fire I bought at christmas for $30 but never use. My wife's got a 7" Nexus she got as a gift but rarely used. She's also got a Kindle she used to use occasionally. Plus an iPad Air she uses quite a bit. I'm pretty sure there's another tablet or two in there somewhere but nothing comes to mind.
dramamuch88 10y ago
Little melodramatic much? > Trying to figure out the differences between the 9.7" iPad and iPad pro is not easy... http://www.apple.com/ipad-9.7/specs/ http://www.apple.com/ipad-9.7/specs/ http://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/specs/ http://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/specs/ > ...and regardless, it makes it harder to buy. Note the "Buy" buttons on the top-right corner of those pages
austenallred 10y ago
While that's true, Apple grew to have a wide variety of products during Jobs' tenure as well. In 2007 there was the iPod Nano, Touch, Shuffle, and Classic, for example. So it may be that different times call for different strategies. Perhaps the lesson is that you should focus intensely in the beginning and ship varieties once the product has reached a certain level of maturity? I'm not in a place to say, but sometimes I wonder if we could go back in time and replay "Apple with Steve Jobs" while believing Steve Jobs to dead how often we would say, "Steve Jobs must be rolling over in his grave."
- Lockyy 10y ago
  The thing with the various iPods was that they were at least different. The three iPad lines are all fundamentally the same device with differing screen sizes.
  - djrogers 10y ago
    To most people the iPods differed by size. The iPod was biggest, the mini was smaller, and the nano was tiny. The iPad is prett much the same - you need a plain iPad? Ok, mini or 9.7"? You need a pro iPad? Ok, 9.7 or 12.9 inch? Fundamentally this new 9.7 doesn't hangs anything - the iPad Air 2 is replaced by it in the non-pro, less expensive iPad lineup.
puranjay 10y ago
Recently dropped by the local Apple store here. I was in the market for a laptop. They had about 4 different Macbook variants. Plus some older Macbook Pro models with HDD. Others with non-retina screens. A few years ago, it was pretty simple: you bought the Macbook Pro for serious work, Macbook Air for portability. Now it's just confusing. Like Dell or Lenovo.
- threeseed 10y ago
  Revisionist history. Apple was still selling the MacBook back then so it was never just two models. And they were still selling the non Retina MBP for a while as well.
- kirykl 10y ago
  Its about the same level of complexity now as it was say around 2010 Same choices too - Macbook/Macbook Air/Macbook Pro Hardest part for most buyers was determining what the spec differences would mean for them and if the price difference was worth it. Same issue now
- christoph 10y ago
  I worked out the iPad choices. Options is a of mix connectivity & size: iPad Pro (12.9") - 3 Colours x 5 Options (15) iPad Pro (9.7") - 4 Colours x 6 Options (24) iPad - 3 Colours x 4 Options (12) iPad 4 Mini - 3 Colours x 2 Options (6) That's 57 variants, clearly designed by a bean counter judging by the deliberate storage choices (i.e. no 64gb options across the whole line). 32GB seems totally pointless to me unless you are only using it for email & web browsing. Why is the mini 4 - a device that wouldn't appear to appeal to "power users" only available in 128gb? Why would anyone purchase a 12.9" iPad Pro with 32GB of storage? The iPad line is all over the place - I had re-write the above as I got confused by what base options are available. What's even more baffling is that they all come with regular USB cables which means I can't plug any of them into my new Macbook Pro.
  - jakobegger 10y ago
    The iPad mini starts at 128 so that it can have a higher starting price than the 9.7" iPad.
digi_owl 10y ago
What he did was evict anything that happened while he was not present and thus didn't have his "touch"...
ams6110 10y ago
My first question was "is that bigger or smaller than a normal iPad" (I don't own one). Spent a few minutes looking at the site to try to find out, then lost interest.
- PacketPaul 10y ago
  I own 3 and still don't know the answer. I've been wonder the same. Steve Jobs swore the iPad was the perfect size and any other size was a failure.
whazor 10y ago
Apple is now a lifestyle company. They have different iPads in different sizes in different colors. The same for iPhones, MacBooks, and watches.
mschaef 10y ago
I've wondered that too... When Jobs came back, he drew four quadrants along two axes: pro/consumer and laptop/desktop. The product line was then reduced to an offering in each quadrant. It was easy to understand what you should look at when going to shop. But there are a couple structural issues with this model that have made it hard to sustain. The first is that it can represent money left on the table.... a sort of quantization error induced by the product line. Maybe there are worthwhile markets that don't spring for the professional line, but still want something more than the basic consumer line. This creates something of a temptation to try to address those markets. The second structural issue is that the four quadrant model is based on saying no to ideas that might come from good people (or at least people entrenched in the corporate bureaucracy). Maybe doing this a few times is easy, but the more creative your organization, the more often you'll have ideas that will be difficult to fit into whatever product line strategy you've put together.
alaskamiller 10y ago
The story goes, according to my boss with her signed letter of appreciation for her 20 year service to the company, that when Steve came back to Apple the first thing he did was cut the research team. The rationale being that Apple is not in a position to do the R in R&D and instead will focus just on the D to survive. In turn he starts slashing the D that won't yield results, while focusing on the ones that will. And being that he was now single handled in charge the most he can focus on is being in the center of four quadrants, hence putting everything on the table into just four buckets: 1. Consumer 2. Professionals 3. Hardware 4. Software 1 being the thing that Steve gets. 2 being the thing that Steve wants. 3 being what Apple does best and 4 being what adds value. Now everything Apple does runs off this premise. The premise worked well enough to pump out the iBook, iMac, iPhone, to then the MacBook and MacBook Pro, to the Mac Pro, Mac mini. Then he died. In his place he passed the legacy to an operator. Because the operator's goal is two folds: keep improving things and keep making things efficient. Tim Cook delivered on the latter and he's working on the former. The clones being the ones that can take the baton and run with it. It'll be here soon enough. The next generation is starting to take shape. And there will be leaders that take the stage to lead each quadrant. PS: Square aped this strategy, that's why Jack Corsey was a favorite of Steve's. Square sells you the hardware at cost and gives the software away free, they scale by latching on to the hack of reselling you points on a merchant account.
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JohnBooty 10y ago
What? I had exactly the opposite reaction. Since this replaces the iPad Air, to me this is a return to sanity. - iPad Pro - iPad - iPad Mini This seems ideal. If you are a "Pro" you surely don't mind spending a few minutes looking up the differences of the "Pro" model to see if it's something you need. If you are not a "Pro" your choices are now, Do I want the regular one or the mini one? Previously non-pros were faced with the conceptually bizarre choice of *Do I want the air one or the mini one?" which sounds like the ramblings of a crazy person. Like... "Air" and "Mini"... what a weird choice. They both sound like super-portable models. OK. But... super-portable compared to... what, exactly? There were no "regular" models, only "variants." What were they varying from?
jpalomaki 10y ago
Steve's opinionated model was very elegant, but with that approach Apple was certainly not meeting everybody's demands. Back then it was ok to leave bunch of customers to others, as Apple still managed to find quite nice growth by for example entering to new device categories. For couple of years this has not been the case. Apple has been forced to find the growth by selling more of same to the customer base that is not growing so rapidly. I think the large number of models is simply a result of their attempt to maximize the money pouring with the current set of inventions they have at hand.
cbsmith 10y ago
Yeah, when Jobs was around, they only had the iPod, the iPod mini, the iPod nano, the iPod video...

ajeet_dhaliwal 10y ago

It has got a little confusing over the years but today doesn't add any further complexity and makes things a bit better, it just replaces the iPad Air which I think was badly named to begin with and should have just been called iPad like it was before. May be because the Macbook Air looks to be going away they are getting rid of the Air name, although they just released 'AirPods'.

mikeash 10y ago
They also dropped the iPad mini 2, which is a nice step towards simplifying the lineup a bit. It's still overly complicated, but it's been ridiculous for years now, and this is moving in the right direction.
emdowling 10y ago
AirPlay, AirPrint are still in use. The Air name for Macbook and iPad lines was all about thinness. When introduced, these products had thicker predecessors. It's irrelevant now for iPad, as everything is pretty much the same thickness across all models. For Macbook Air, it is no longer the thinnest product in the line-up. However, Apple can't quite get rid of it just yet - not until they offer a sub $999 Macbook.
- rrdharan 10y ago
  In those cases the Air refers to wirelessness rather than weight.

waderyan 10y ago

I don't disagree with the lesson, but does it always apply? When Jobs came back Apple was in a different place than it is today. To your second point, I completely agree. Regardless of the need to focus, causing confusion to consumers doesn't seem the right thing to do.

dragonwriter 10y ago
> I don't disagree with the lesson, but does it always apply? When Jobs came back Apple was in a different place than it is today. Maybe, but on the other hand there is a lot of similarity between Apple v. Microsoft/PC-cloned on desktop and Apple v. Google/Android-devices on mobile. And one similarity would seem to be that Apple is in no position to win on breadth and choice, but they may be in a position to win (at least, create a solid, profitable I market where they have little effective competition) by identifying key niches, and narrowly tailoring offerings to them. In fact, I'd argue that their path in tablets and smartphones has been pretty similar as in PCs; they developed the market ahead of everyone else with fisrly narrow offerings, a competing platform emerged where the core software was separate from hardware manufacturers offering more choice, and drew them into trying to compete on the kind of choice offered by the competition.

marvindanig 10y ago

Also there was reason why Steve Jobs was against all tablet sizes except one. At the time Apple was going after revolutionizing the education market and the 9.7" iPad1/2 fit the bill for that purpose exactly. Then came the iPad mini whose sole purpose was to increase business bottom-line… and then a few more models based on other focuses or potential uses. Meh. Moral of story: Do not destroy the initial momentum and the sense of denting the world. "To be a part of revolutionary change" is an important feeling to keep in tech industry. --- Edits: Wish I could impress upon them about the urgency to kill all models except the iPad Air (9"). Anything else will only kill/subdue the category and lead the focus away from the initial promise that the tablets held -- i.e. disrupt education.

dmix 10y ago
Current iPad sizes: - iPad Pro 12.9" - iPad Pro 9.7" - iPad 9.7" - iPad Mini 4 8" (edit: thanks pdpi/trymas) It really should just be iPad (9.7) or iPad Pro (12.9) should it not? Now the customer has to decide between two 9.7 models with not so obvious differences between the two? And now there are two (edit: three) different iPad pages on the sales website you have to go through. This changes the immediate conversation visiting the site for the first time between why I should get the iPad... to what's the difference and available options AND why should I get an iPad? The Macbook vs Macbook Pro distinction was more obvious because it was basically casual/school vs work. But I don't really see tablets having that work vs casual dichotomy. It's more high-end vs affordable. Which from a mental categorization perspective doesn't fit neatly into the current product line.
- pdpi 10y ago
  Plus the iPad Mini 7.9". As a 9.7 Pro owner, the differences between the 9.7 Pro and the regular iPad are quite important. I just wish they made the comparison easier, though.
  - trymas 10y ago
    http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ I think that's pretty good comparison. Reminds me of iPhone SE - make a product from older tech, where all manufacturing is cheap and smooth as ever and sell it as cheapest option (I imagine with still veeery big markup).

squeaky-clean 10y ago

I always thought that was the iDevice's strength. With Android, you have nothing actually made by Google but by OEMs, with different names and branding that don't give any real information. Which phone is "the android"? My mom doesn't think she has an android phone, she thinks she has an LG and that Android is a different thing. People buy a low end Android phone and hate the entire ecosystem because the phone performs like crap. I have a friend who thinks the Galaxy S7 would be a crappy upgrade because they already have a "Galaxy Core Prime". When there was just the iPhone, it was really easy. It was expensive compared to other options, but you knew it was the best iPhone, and the one with a higher number was better than one with a lower number. Yet an LG G5 is better than a Samsung Galaxy S6, they are somehow both "Android", and Marshmallow is better than Jelly Bean. Now the iPhone isn't that bad, but it's not simple anymore. iPhone 7, iPhone 7Plus, iPhone 7S, iPhone 7S Plus, iPhone SE. Which is better?

dmix 10y ago
It's quite obvious the Pixel is the "flagship" Android Google phone. And Pixel C is the "flagship" Android tablet. The pixel is advertised everywhere as a Google phone. Who makes it doesn't really come up in their product communication much. And the 'flagship' label is literally in the title of the Pixel products on Amazon. And on the website it's called "Pixel, phone by Google". > People buy a low end Android phone and hate the entire ecosystem because the phone performs like crap. This seems like an antiquated view of Android. I don't think people see Apple as having a monopoly on luxury/quality devices anymore. And considering the heavy OS modifications made by different companies and the entire UX experience of dealing with a company (customer service, website, accessories, etc), I don't really see why it matters if your mom thinks she has a "Samsung" or an "LG". There's more to Android phones than the base OS.
- squeaky-clean 10y ago
  For people on Hacker News, sure. But try asking your grandma what the flagship Android phone is and what the flagship Apple phone is. It is much more confusing for the average person than you'd think. > I don't really see why it matters if your mom thinks she has a "Samsung" or an "LG". Because when people ask if she has an Android she says "No." > There's more to Android phones than the base OS. I know, that's my complaint. It really adds nothing for the customer to have it be so fragmented.

drzaiusapelord 10y ago

Jobs also wanted one phone at one screen size based on some cargo-cult science about average thumb length. Apple was watching its lunch being eaten by people who would have had probably bought an iPhone but wanted the big screens Android has to offer. Thus the multiple iPhone models. He was also against the mini iPad size, which is the only iPad I'm willing to buy. I think the limited product line is an artifact of the time and place Jobs and Apple were in the early 2000s. They had endless Mac models and a underwhelming value proposition. Cutting that down to a single colorful little Mac and a single pro product and their laptop equivalents made sense. Introducing the mobile revolution one simple product at a time also made sense. Now they need to continue to make sales, so adding more products to address more niche markets is the only way forward. They've probably exhausted their "one size fits all" market at this point. Apple can't accept no or negative growth, so more niche products it is.

revmoo 10y ago
They could try uhh.... maybe innovating new products?

nkkollaw 10y ago

Sure, but he cut stuff like printers, cameras, and other crazy crap they used to make. Even when he was still alive they had different-sized iPods, iPads, and more. Computers have always come in different sizes: 13", 15", and 17". What is the difference between a 13" and a 15"? Does it make it harder to buy? Perhaps, but you wouldn't kill the 15" just so people don't get confused.

steeleduncan 10y ago
I think the point is that the difference between 13", 15" and 17" laptops is easily grasped by even the least knowledgeable customer. It takes no time to figure which product fits your needs best. The difference between the 9.7" iPad and the 9.7" iPad pro is not intuitive, at least to me. If it is not obvious how different products serve different needs, then you aren't actually expanding the market your product appeals to, you are just confusing customers.
- jacobolus 10y ago
  The important difference is that “pro” supports the stylus, while “non-pro” does not.
  - jfoster 10y ago
    Is that really the biggest difference? Sure, a stylus might be important, but they could just make all models work with the stylus.
    - memco 10y ago
      There are several differences, which any given person might find more appealing. Pro offers: - Better processing power - Better sound (more speakers) - Better resolution cameras (about +4MP on both) - Thinner (1.4 mm) - Lighter (.04 lbs) - Higher storage capacity - Pencil & Keyboard (the ipad smart KB, bluetooth should work on both) support And possibly the non-pro does not have P3 wide color gamut support? If I was buying one for a family member I would buy the iPad, not the pro unless I specifically knew they needed one of these features—of which, the keyboard and pencil support seem most probable, cameras probably second. Personally, I have the pro with the keyboard and pencil, and I love it for most day to day use. I have not yet tried to code on it, but I am dubious that I will ever be able to rely on it as my primary/only computing device. However, for meetings, classes or speaking engagements I find it highly versatile and fits a niche my laptop never would.

cocktailpeanuts 10y ago

One of the reasons why he did that was because Apple was dying. They didn't have money and resources to support many models, and they needed to focus and do one thing right. So it was the right decision. As much as I like simplicity, if you look around there are tons of cases like this around us, and that's not because these companies are idiots who don't understand simplicity but it's because their products have reached saturation point where making it simple won't get more users. They need to expand horizontally by building variations that appeal to a wider audience. Sure it's kind of annoying, and you and I may not understand the benefits of the 9.7 inch iPad, but I am sure there are many people who understand exactly the benefits of 9.7 inch iPad vs iPad pro and will rush to buy them.

valarauca1 10y ago
Under Jobs during the early days they never sold many products at once. There was the old Apple II and new Apple II. Seeing as they went past 6 revisions of Apple II there was considerable churn. There was never much of a 1st party peripheral market. Like we see with iWatch. That nearly exclusively 3rd party.
- ajross 10y ago
  > Under Jobs during the early days they never sold many products at once. Depends on how early you go. The II+ was a straightforward upgrade to the ][ that replaced it, but the IIe was sold alongside the II+ for a long time. And then it refused to disappear while they sold the IIc and then IIgs. And don't forget the not-quite-part-of-the-family Apple III! Up through the early 80's they had a clean lineup. After that there were as many as four different variants on the Apple II in the market at a time.
sushisource 10y ago
Wait, really? You and I being readers of Hacker News are probably in a better position than 90%+ of customers to understand the benefits of one iPad over another. If it's not clear to us... who is it clear to?
- 10y ago

frogpelt 10y ago

Apple is not the same company and should not be expected to act like the company they were when Steve Jobs returned. Their market cap is over $700 Billion. They were never going to continue their growth by offering one phone, one tablet, and one laptop, regardless of what the purists think. Remember when Google was nothing but search?

camus2 10y ago
> Remember when Google was nothing but search? Google has nothing to do with Apple. Why even talk about Google as a relevant example of anything regarding consumer hardware production? they aren't.

stronglikedan 10y ago

My favorite new tactic of theirs is in their new commercials, where an actor will ask if the "iPad" can do something, and the announcer will confirm that it can, on the "iPad Pro". The one that jumps to mind is the MS Office one, but I recall at least one other feature that they advertised using the same tactic. It's pretty confusing if you don't catch the causally mentioned "Pro" bit at the very end, after they've gone through a segment on the "feature" that the "iPad" can do. I just hope it'll net them a lot of returned iPads from rightfully frustrated customers.

aeontech 10y ago
I think that's just because those are commercials promoting the Pro specifically, not that they are saying that those things cannot be done on non-pro models. At least, I'm not aware of any restrictions on what models of iPad's can run Office, for example, and if there were, they'd be ones imposted by app's authors, Microsoft in this case. Unless you're talking about apps specifically requiring Pencil?
- stronglikedan 10y ago
  Maybe it's just the bait-and-switch tone of the commercials that throws me off. It does seem like Office would run on any iPad [0], and they could just be referring to the pencil. However, even the description there [0] is kind of weirdly worded to me. I just don't know enough about Apple devices I guess. > * Word is ready for iPad Pro and looks amazing on the 12.9-inch screen. Read Word documents on iPad Pro for free. To create and edit docs, you need a qualifying Office 365 subscription. Try it for free for 30 days. * The real Microsoft Word app designed for iPad, iPhone and iPod touch. [0] https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/microsoft-word/id586447913?mt=8 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/microsoft-word/id586447913?m...

joeblau 10y ago

The main thing that comes to mind for me is the Apple Pencil.

cgh 10y ago
Yes, exactly. The Apple Pencil is incredible, by the way. The experience is comparable in my mind to using the original iPhone for the first time. Apple should market the hell out of the 12.9" iPad Pro to artists.
- siidooloo 10y ago
  Yes, Wacom must have realized this as the newest Cintiqs finally solved the biggest problem they always had: paralax.

internet2000 10y ago

Never thought I'd see the day where the argument against Apple is that they have too much choice.

fiddlerwoaroof 10y ago
That might be because satisfied people tend to be quieter about a product than dissatisfied ones.

tptacek 10y ago

iPad Pro: Take the 9.7" iPad and add: * Apple Pencil * Faster CPU, more memory, more display * UHD color gamut display (and automatic white balance adjustment) * Better cameras I think there are other differences, but those are the big ticket ones.

mturmon 10y ago
I'd argue that the #1 or #2 key addition that "Pro" gets you (the Pencil being the other #1 or #2) is the "Smart Connector" for the integrated keyboard (http://www.apple.com/smart-keyboard/ http://www.apple.com/smart-keyboard/). The ability to add the keyboard and the pencil illustrates the distinction Apple is trying to make between the Pro and the vanilla 9.7 -- creation vs. consumption. After all these years, they are still persistently trying to position the iPad as a creation tool. Maybe it will work.
- chipotle_coyote 10y ago
  The list of things I absolutely can't do on an iPad is fairly small these days. (This is distinct from things that I would prefer to do on a Mac/PC, but there are things that I would prefer to do on the iPad, too.) I think Apple may need to do a better job of showing, well, more utilitarian tasks that can be done pretty easily on the iPad. Having said that, I do wonder if one of the unspoken stumbling blocks is that even if an iPad is a great portable computer in many respects, it's only a portable computer. A lot of people "dock" their laptops to get work done. (Or to write comments on Hacker News when they should be getting work done.) I love traveling with my 9.7" iPad Pro and keyboard, but even if future releases of iOS address all the nitpicks I have with it, there are times I want to be sitting at a desk in front of a big monitor. I don't see that coming to iOS any time soon.

aroman 10y ago

You've got it backwards. This update streamlines the product line, along the lines of what Steve Jobs did. There are now 3 iPads: the iPad, the iPad Pro, and the iPad Mini. The differences are as clear as they ever have been for Mac lines.

kevindqc 10y ago
What are you talking about? There is now 4 http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/
- karlshea 10y ago
  The Pro is one line, there are just two screen sizes. The 9.7" Pro has the same processor as the larger pro and has compatibility with the pencil. The new 9.7" non-pro has the lower end chip and no pencil.
  - chaostheory 10y ago
    Yes it's one line, but it has two versions with big differences. I could be wrong but it's not just the screen size, it's also the screen resolution and camera resolution as well. They might as well be two different products. Everyone thought that the smaller iPad Pro was the successor to the iPad.
  - gpawl 10y ago
    It's more a band than a line if there are two available at once
  - r00fus 10y ago
    The 12.9" apparently doesn't have the same TruTone screen (at least according to Apple's own comparison chart) as the 9.7". This is not simply a size difference.
simonh 10y ago
Except there are two iPad Pro sizes and one of them is the same size as the new basic iPad 9.7'. And the iPad Mini is now more expensive than a basic iPad 9.7' but are slower, but only come in a large storage option. I love Apple. Read my other posts defending the iPad as a productivity device on this discussion, and defending the cleanness if the iPhone lineup, but the current iPad lineup is all over the place.

stanmancan 10y ago

This is what happens when they don't have a "product" guy running the company anymore. Steve Jobs was brilliant at coming up with new products. Every since he left all we have gotten is the Apple Watch, which one can argue he probably had a hand in. Their only option now is to start creating variations of existing product lines to keep them "fresh".

budde 10y ago
> Steve Jobs was brilliant at coming up with new products By my count, Jobs shepherded the following hit products (I'm giving the Apple ][ to Woz): - Macintosh (1984) - iPod (2001) - iPhone (2007) - iPad (2010) I think you're exaggerating how often Apple rolled out new product lines under Jobs. You could even argue that the iPod and iPhone overshadow the other two substantially in terms of cultural impact. > Their only option now is to start creating variations of existing product lines to keep them "fresh". Isn't this kind of what you'd expect out of a business? Refreshing and supporting their existing product lines while occasionally trying to establish new ones? The iPhone is looking more and more like a once-in-a-lifetime home run product (Ben Thompson has done a lot of good writing on this), the likes of which Apple (or anybody else, for that matter) may never be able to top. This isn't to say that Apple doesn't miss having a visionary like Jobs at the helm or that their product lineup doesn't have glaring flaws. I just think the massive success of the iPhone set expectations way too high.
- stanmancan 10y ago
  When Jobs came back to Apple he supposedly canned hundreds of different products and got them to focus again. While he was around, that's how things remained; each product had their own place. As time goes on since his departure, the clutter is starting to come back and the lines are starting to blur. Whats the difference between the new Macbook and the Macbook Air? The iPad 9.6 vs the iPad Pro 9.6? Apple Watch Gen 1 vs Gen 2 vs Series 1 vs Series 2?
- Chromus 10y ago
  Maybe I'm misinformed, but those seem like the "definitive" Apple products to me. They're basically the foundation of their current business, and have only been diluted since his departure.

scarface74 10y ago

There is a big difference. They were a $4 billion dollar company without the resources they have now and they were selling multiple computers with the same specs with different model numbers depending on the retailer. He also said that a mistake they made with Macs was having a price umbrella that let others come in cheaper. iPad is cheaper and doesn't support the pencil - good enough for most people - and the iPad Pro is more expensive and supports the stylus and has a faster processor. Most people understand more expensive = better. On a side note. I hate Apple stopped selling the 3rd Gen AppleTV for $59. It was "good enough" for people who mostly wanted AirPlay functionality and to stream videos using the included app. Now they have nothing that competes in the ChromeCast/Roku stick price range.

MR4D 10y ago

Agreed. I thought the best way would be differentiate on features. Pro should be: - wifi+LTE - more storage - pen and/or cover keyboard included - faster CPU - multiscreen capability (connect to mouse and monitor with "desktop" interface) for truly replacing my desktop Regular iPad should be wifi only, and not come with a pen.

r00fus 10y ago
It's almost that way - just that you can get the regular iPad with LTE, too. Honestly, I wish they'd instead make all the iPads "pencil" compatible.
- PacketPaul 10y ago
  Then they would not have a reason to charge more. They need low cost and a premium option.
- PacketPaul 10y ago
  Then they would not have a reason to charge more. They need low cost and a premium option.

sandymcmurray 10y ago

http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ http://www.apple.com/ipad/compare/ to compare current models. iPad Pro 9.7 has better processor, better screen, better camera, is slightly thinner and lighter and works with Apple Pencil and Keyboard accessories. There are now just four options: big Pro, little Pro, iPad, and mini.

spike021 10y ago
Four options, plus all the sub-options: with cellular data or without, 3 or so different amounts of space.. With the larger iPads do some people get smaller space, even though larger display probably means more resources/larger resolution media will need to be stored on the device. Spitballing but it's quite a few options.
- mcphage 10y ago
  They're at least independent questions. First you decide which you want, then you decide how much space, and then you decide if you want cellular.

DoodleBuggy 10y ago

The "iPad Pro" is the same iPad as it always was, the "Pro" is marketing. A member of my family was hustled into buying an iPad "Pro" from a sales rep who convinced them it can do everything and more, yet they can't perform simple file management and related email tasks on it, so they still use a Windows PC that cost 1/2 the price of the $800 iPad Pro.

methehack 10y ago

Been wondering the same thing. It's one of the my favorite stories from the Walter Isacson bio. After listening to all the product mgrs for like 3 days in all day meetings describe their 20+ hardware products, he draws a 2x2. Labels one axis "consumer/professional" the other "laptop/desktop" and says "you get four products". Clarity in product offerings means you know who you are; the inverse is also true.

dijit27 10y ago
I fondly remember seeing that product grid on Apple's website. And even though it isn't displayed as a grid I think the current iPad lineup fits the 2 axis concept pretty well. They still have the consumer/professional or consumption/creation axis. The Pro being the professional/creation end. And instead of laptop/desktop they have the size or portability axis. In the large professional there is the 12.9-inch iPad Pro, in the small professional there is the 9.7-inch iPad Pro. For the large consumer there is the iPad and finally the for the small consumer is the iPad mini.

njharman 10y ago

> it makes it harder to buy. I think you mean, "It makes it harder to decide to buy." A hugely important distinction and the point of having few models. (limiting decision points/places to 2nd think do I really need a new ipad)

rconti 10y ago

I am utterly confused. There was the iPad, then the Mini, then the Air, then the Pro.. and now I look at this, and 9.7" sounds fairly large ("normal" iPad size?) but the price is surprisingly cheap? No idea. closes window I've got about 6 tablets and never use any of them anyway. I hate the user experience. I see no case where I'd rather have a tablet than my phone or my 6 year old Macbook Air.

pwthornton 10y ago
Surfing the Internet, reading ebooks and watching videos are all things an iPad would do much better, particularly anything that would benefit from a hiDPI screen.
- rconti 10y ago
  I do miss the high DPI screen when using my old Air, that's a good point. Though I usually don't feel my internet surfing is enhanced by holding a heavy tablet.
  - glenneroo 10y ago
    Have you considered the plethora of cases and stands available for relatively low prices? For someone with 6+ tablets, it just sounds like you buy them because they were cheap... and so that you have something to complain about.
therealdrag0 10y ago
Why do you have 6 of them?
- dramamuch88 10y ago
  To justify not caring about this one.
- rconti 10y ago
  Always seems like a good idea? I've got an iPad2 that I really wanted to love, and used until it became so slow it was useless (a couple of years ago). It still sits on my kitchen counter as a plugged-in weather station, though the app crashes frequently. I've got an HP Touchpad I bought during the fire sale for $50 or whatever the going rate was. I think its got Android on it. It was less of a fun project than I expected. Mostly I realized I don't like Android. I've got a 7" Fire I bought at christmas for $30 but never use. My wife's got a 7" Nexus she got as a gift but rarely used. She's also got a Kindle she used to use occasionally. Plus an iPad Air she uses quite a bit. I'm pretty sure there's another tablet or two in there somewhere but nothing comes to mind.

dramamuch88 10y ago

Little melodramatic much? > Trying to figure out the differences between the 9.7" iPad and iPad pro is not easy... http://www.apple.com/ipad-9.7/specs/ http://www.apple.com/ipad-9.7/specs/ http://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/specs/ http://www.apple.com/ipad-pro/specs/ > ...and regardless, it makes it harder to buy. Note the "Buy" buttons on the top-right corner of those pages

austenallred 10y ago

While that's true, Apple grew to have a wide variety of products during Jobs' tenure as well. In 2007 there was the iPod Nano, Touch, Shuffle, and Classic, for example. So it may be that different times call for different strategies. Perhaps the lesson is that you should focus intensely in the beginning and ship varieties once the product has reached a certain level of maturity? I'm not in a place to say, but sometimes I wonder if we could go back in time and replay "Apple with Steve Jobs" while believing Steve Jobs to dead how often we would say, "Steve Jobs must be rolling over in his grave."

Lockyy 10y ago
The thing with the various iPods was that they were at least different. The three iPad lines are all fundamentally the same device with differing screen sizes.
- djrogers 10y ago
  To most people the iPods differed by size. The iPod was biggest, the mini was smaller, and the nano was tiny. The iPad is prett much the same - you need a plain iPad? Ok, mini or 9.7"? You need a pro iPad? Ok, 9.7 or 12.9 inch? Fundamentally this new 9.7 doesn't hangs anything - the iPad Air 2 is replaced by it in the non-pro, less expensive iPad lineup.

puranjay 10y ago

Recently dropped by the local Apple store here. I was in the market for a laptop. They had about 4 different Macbook variants. Plus some older Macbook Pro models with HDD. Others with non-retina screens. A few years ago, it was pretty simple: you bought the Macbook Pro for serious work, Macbook Air for portability. Now it's just confusing. Like Dell or Lenovo.

threeseed 10y ago
Revisionist history. Apple was still selling the MacBook back then so it was never just two models. And they were still selling the non Retina MBP for a while as well.
kirykl 10y ago
Its about the same level of complexity now as it was say around 2010 Same choices too - Macbook/Macbook Air/Macbook Pro Hardest part for most buyers was determining what the spec differences would mean for them and if the price difference was worth it. Same issue now
christoph 10y ago
I worked out the iPad choices. Options is a of mix connectivity & size: iPad Pro (12.9") - 3 Colours x 5 Options (15) iPad Pro (9.7") - 4 Colours x 6 Options (24) iPad - 3 Colours x 4 Options (12) iPad 4 Mini - 3 Colours x 2 Options (6) That's 57 variants, clearly designed by a bean counter judging by the deliberate storage choices (i.e. no 64gb options across the whole line). 32GB seems totally pointless to me unless you are only using it for email & web browsing. Why is the mini 4 - a device that wouldn't appear to appeal to "power users" only available in 128gb? Why would anyone purchase a 12.9" iPad Pro with 32GB of storage? The iPad line is all over the place - I had re-write the above as I got confused by what base options are available. What's even more baffling is that they all come with regular USB cables which means I can't plug any of them into my new Macbook Pro.
- jakobegger 10y ago
  The iPad mini starts at 128 so that it can have a higher starting price than the 9.7" iPad.

digi_owl 10y ago

What he did was evict anything that happened while he was not present and thus didn't have his "touch"...

ams6110 10y ago

My first question was "is that bigger or smaller than a normal iPad" (I don't own one). Spent a few minutes looking at the site to try to find out, then lost interest.

PacketPaul 10y ago
I own 3 and still don't know the answer. I've been wonder the same. Steve Jobs swore the iPad was the perfect size and any other size was a failure.

whazor 10y ago

Apple is now a lifestyle company. They have different iPads in different sizes in different colors. The same for iPhones, MacBooks, and watches.

mschaef 10y ago

I've wondered that too... When Jobs came back, he drew four quadrants along two axes: pro/consumer and laptop/desktop. The product line was then reduced to an offering in each quadrant. It was easy to understand what you should look at when going to shop. But there are a couple structural issues with this model that have made it hard to sustain. The first is that it can represent money left on the table.... a sort of quantization error induced by the product line. Maybe there are worthwhile markets that don't spring for the professional line, but still want something more than the basic consumer line. This creates something of a temptation to try to address those markets. The second structural issue is that the four quadrant model is based on saying no to ideas that might come from good people (or at least people entrenched in the corporate bureaucracy). Maybe doing this a few times is easy, but the more creative your organization, the more often you'll have ideas that will be difficult to fit into whatever product line strategy you've put together.

alaskamiller 10y ago

The story goes, according to my boss with her signed letter of appreciation for her 20 year service to the company, that when Steve came back to Apple the first thing he did was cut the research team. The rationale being that Apple is not in a position to do the R in R&D and instead will focus just on the D to survive. In turn he starts slashing the D that won't yield results, while focusing on the ones that will. And being that he was now single handled in charge the most he can focus on is being in the center of four quadrants, hence putting everything on the table into just four buckets: 1. Consumer 2. Professionals 3. Hardware 4. Software 1 being the thing that Steve gets. 2 being the thing that Steve wants. 3 being what Apple does best and 4 being what adds value. Now everything Apple does runs off this premise. The premise worked well enough to pump out the iBook, iMac, iPhone, to then the MacBook and MacBook Pro, to the Mac Pro, Mac mini. Then he died. In his place he passed the legacy to an operator. Because the operator's goal is two folds: keep improving things and keep making things efficient. Tim Cook delivered on the latter and he's working on the former. The clones being the ones that can take the baton and run with it. It'll be here soon enough. The next generation is starting to take shape. And there will be leaders that take the stage to lead each quadrant. PS: Square aped this strategy, that's why Jack Corsey was a favorite of Steve's. Square sells you the hardware at cost and gives the software away free, they scale by latching on to the hack of reselling you points on a merchant account.

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JohnBooty 10y ago

What? I had exactly the opposite reaction. Since this replaces the iPad Air, to me this is a return to sanity. - iPad Pro - iPad - iPad Mini This seems ideal. If you are a "Pro" you surely don't mind spending a few minutes looking up the differences of the "Pro" model to see if it's something you need. If you are not a "Pro" your choices are now, Do I want the regular one or the mini one? Previously non-pros were faced with the conceptually bizarre choice of *Do I want the air one or the mini one?" which sounds like the ramblings of a crazy person. Like... "Air" and "Mini"... what a weird choice. They both sound like super-portable models. OK. But... super-portable compared to... what, exactly? There were no "regular" models, only "variants." What were they varying from?

jpalomaki 10y ago

Steve's opinionated model was very elegant, but with that approach Apple was certainly not meeting everybody's demands. Back then it was ok to leave bunch of customers to others, as Apple still managed to find quite nice growth by for example entering to new device categories. For couple of years this has not been the case. Apple has been forced to find the growth by selling more of same to the customer base that is not growing so rapidly. I think the large number of models is simply a result of their attempt to maximize the money pouring with the current set of inventions they have at hand.

cbsmith 10y ago

Yeah, when Jobs was around, they only had the iPod, the iPod mini, the iPod nano, the iPod video...