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New Macbook Pro power efficiency and time remaining
- 010a 10y agoEveryone talks about the downsides of the new MacBooks. No one talks about about how they reduced the size of the internal battery by 30%, effectively added a second screen, improved overall performance, and still kept the same battery life.
- JustSomeNobody 10y agoWait, all anyone has talked about is how they have done all that... with the exception of the "same" battery life. A lot of people feel it ... isn't the same.
- mgkimsal 10y agoor... arguably kept the 'same' battery life as previous devices, but added more battery draining 'stuff'. I had one, and returned it, partially for battery life. I'm doing a lot of development (intellij/phpstorm/virtualbox/etc). The battery life wasn't bad - at heavy use, I could get perhaps 6 hours of 'real' usage, but... It was $3700, which was a bit much for my blood given the battery shortcomings (and a few other reasons). But mostly price/performance relative to my workload. For $1200/less I got an approximately similar 2015 model with more battery, and a slightly heavier weight.
- rangibaby 10y agoApple gets bashed every time they release something, remember everyone making fun of the iPad, or even the iPhone? > reduced the size of the internal battery by 30% I'll talk about that. Keep the battery the same damn size and give us more battery life. > effectively added a second screen Plenty of people have been talking about the touch bar. > improved overall performance If it didn't do that the world would have a new source of non-coal energy, Mac fans screaming at the top of their lungs! What Apple lacks is the moment is coherency. The iPhone comes with a headset and charging cable that won't work with a Mac. When I plugged my earphones+remote into an iMac and the remote worked, that was magical. This is just silly. The Mac Pro was resurrected and promptly abandoned. iMacs are MIA. Apple stuff doesn't work with other Apple stuff. More "it just works" please.
- darkkindness 10y agoGP is raising attention to the fact that battery life hasn't decreased, not that people aren't paying attention to the other features. Sure, people talk about the smaller battery, screen, and performance increases. But it's an achievement that these were added without absolutely gutting the MacBooks' battery life.
- FireBeyond 10y agoWhat? Battery life has decreased considerably. People and tests show exactly that. I don't think there's any testing that shows that battery life is the same as in the 2015 model. Even this article: > It’s also in line with people reporting that under high load the new MBP lasts a shorter amount of time than the earlier models.
- devwastaken 10y ago*I was incorrect and noted normal macbooks, not MBP. Normal macbooks are terrible in price to performance, MBP is better, ignoring all the other things about it.
- 010a 10y agoWhen I say MacBooks... I mean the MacBook Pros. As in, what this article is talking about. Apple never reduced the size of the MB battery by 30%. Or added a second screen. Or kept performance they same (they improved performance gen-over-gen with the MB). Use your head. Apply some context.
- devwastaken 10y agoThat is correct in this case, ignoring the other issues with buying an Apple device.
- FireBeyond 10y agoLet's not call the touchbar a "second screen". Yes, it is. But it's just that - a touch bar/ status bar. Most commentary around 5th vs 6th generation is that it's pretty much identical.
- colept 10y ago> effectively added a second screen Powering a main screen versus a screen 1/15th of the size hardly qualifies as "effectively... a second screen" > improved overall performance Is it possible newer components are more optimized to draw less power for the same or more performance?
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- 40acres 10y agoAmazing news for someone who's about to pull the trigger on the non-touch bar 2016 MBP. I considered many other options but couldn't find a company with similar build quality and reputation for high quality in the mobile workstation space. My only concern was the battery, it seems to perform at a high level.
- tqkxzugoaupvwqr 10y agoDo not mistake power efficiency for long battery life. Power efficiency doesn’t mean all tasks use little power and you will always have a long battery life. Apple’s power efficiency shines in idle mode. When you put light but constant strain on the machine, e.g. with IDEs and compile-on-save, battery life goes down quickly, no matter how efficient. Choose wisely. A MacBook Pro (Mid 2014) still has roughly the same performance as a 2016 model but is much, much cheaper. I recommend you pick a used 2014 or 2015 model in good condition. Saves you a lot of money (> $1000).
- konceptz 10y agoVery happy to hear that idle is better. Very unhappy to hear that usage is worse. I would prefer not to think about my usage patterns and just sit back knowing my new laptop (2016 mbp) is always better than my old (2015 mbp) one in all cases.
- astrodust 10y agoThe first generation "Retina" machines were not without their drawbacks either, but those were ironed out quickly enough. If you update every single year you'll be intimately aware of these problems. If, like most, you're on a 3-5 year cycle it's largely irrelevant. People used to buy cars every two to three years as well, but now it's common to retain them for a lot longer unless you're leasing.
- tqkxzugoaupvwqr 10y agoIf you are on a 3–5 year cycle it is relevant because you would be stuck with it for 3–5 years. Unless you like the hassle of migrating to your new MacBook Pro, test it for a week, and then return it. If you are unlucky, you can’t migrate back because the newly upgraded macOS, iTunes library or Photos library is not compatible with your old macOS, iTunes library or Photos library. So you won’t be able to migrate back or open your libraries.
- astrodust 10y agoYou have 14 days to decide you don't like it and take it back, no penalty, which is nice. Plus if you're on a 3-5 year cycle skipping a year is no big deal. It's also unlikely you're OS locked on a 3-year old machine. My 2012 MacBook Pro still runs current versions of macOS.
- matt4077 10y agoThe article defines "usage" as "high load". That could still mean that any fixed workload is handled better on the new MBP than the old version. I'm pretty sure that the new CPUs are more efficient – in terms of power/workload – than the previous generation. That would mean the new MBP is <= 25% worse for a given workload. Maybe somebody knows the numbers for the CPUs, but previous generations improved efficiency by 10-30%.
- patryn20 10y agoBased on my (admittedly unusual) workloads, the effective charge time of the 2016 is awful. I already only get 4-5 hours out of a 2014 MBP. I bought a 2016 and only managed 3 1/2 hours. Maybe they've improved that with some software fixes, but it's still a non starter. So I returned it. I know I'm not a typical user, but I get much better battery life (with lower productivity) out of my windows laptop. Which was not the case when I switched to Macs years back.
- greglindahl 10y agoI get a pretty good runtime out of my 12" MB, and, I found that the tools Apple provides to diagnose power usage were pretty god. Every time I see a complaint like this I always wonder what the cause is...
- patryn20 10y agoMy particular crime? Heavy VM use with multiple concurrent OSes and server processes.
- greglindahl 10y agoHuh. I develop on a beefy server, and give everyone who works with me beefy servers, too.
- patryn20 10y agoI'm often highly mobile with unreliable connectivity (think back country Alaska/Washington/Missouri/etc). Remoting is not a reliable option while traveling. Now when I'm working from home, I have other workstations I can connect to. And if the connectivity on the road is decent, I do have equipment I can connect to. However I generally find my most productive workflow is all local. Which is why I was doubly disappointed by the lack of upgrades to 7th gen i7 and 32GB of RAM. The battery life loss under load was just the straw that broke the camel's back.
- 10y ago
- rasz_pl 10y agoIts very efficient _at doing NOTHING_. Start using CPU and its 1 hour max.
- umanwizard 10y agoThe overwhelming majority of the time, most users' CPUs are idle. Idle drain matters.
- rasz_pl 10y agoMacbook Pro used to be for Power Users, not 'most users'. Power users do not drop $3K on a laptop to let it sit idle, they compile stuff, run multiple VMs, convert videos etc.
- baobrain 10y agoI will attribute this to Intel's advances and focus in low power processors, not much credit goes to Apple in my mind. The Macbook pro 2014 used Haswell processors which are notably more power hungry on idle than Broadwell and its successor Skylake, as Intel really focused on power draw with Broadwell.
- Alex3917 10y agoI love the new 2016 MBP, and after using it think most of the purported issues are BS. That said, there is one very real issue that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere: because of how thin they are, many of the minor issues that could previously be fixed in the Apple Store now require sending it out. I had an intermittently working key on my keyboard and took it in for something I assumed would take half an hour to fix. They told me they needed to mail it in and it would be 4 - 6 days, probably 4. It's now going on day 13. Fortunately my last one was old enough that it had zero resale value, but for anyone thinking of upgrading I'd highly recommend keeping a backup.
- monkmartinez 10y agoYou love your new computer that has been in the shop for 13 days? May I ask, when did you buy it?
- Alex3917 10y agoIt came in early December, and I dropped it off Feb 2nd. So just a few days outside the 40 day RMA window, though had it failed earlier I'd probably still have opted for them to repair it.
- HalfwayToDice 10y agoI thought that was strange too.
- marpstar 10y agoI've had the same intermittent key issue on my keyboard since I got it. Opened a support ticket with Apple days after I received it but still haven't send it in. Joel Spolsky had the same issue[1], TWICE [2]. If there's anything wrong with these machines, it's the keyboard, not the things everyone who doesn't even own one thinks it is. [1]: https://twitter.com/spolsky/status/815245283818733569 https://twitter.com/spolsky/status/815245283818733569 [2]: https://twitter.com/spolsky/status/815245490010787840 https://twitter.com/spolsky/status/815245490010787840
- 10y ago
- camillomiller 10y agoI think a lot of people are talking about the new MBP as if they had one. It's 2017 and a too many power users still base their opinion simply on specs divination -- that is, theoretical musings about this and that component will perform. Especially with Apple, it should be clear that the whole thing is much more complicated than a 1+1 based on a spec list.
- fastball 10y agoI think that's been clear to anyone without their head in the sand for a while now. It's the same with iOS vs. Android. Early Android proponents did nothing but talk up the specs and the "customizability". The reality is, iPhones have always had such great hardware/software integration that they made using touch screens feel like you were interacting with the UI physically. You press a button, the phone almost immediately responded. A lot of this was the use of capacitive touch screen, but there was a lot more to it. It took years for Android to get close to this point, and I honestly think Apple still does it better. Why do I need 4GB of RAM on my phone, when 1GB runs every app I want it to and gives me a lag free experience in the rest of the OS?
- mconzen 10y agoHave had one since November and this mirrors my experience. YMMV, but I find that the 2016 MBP charges quite a bit faster than the 2015. For me, I prefer the faster charging over the slight increase in overall battery life, with the added bonuses of the '16 using a standard charging cable. Anyone with a newer Android phone (and soon, airport shops and convenience stores nationwide) can hook you up with a spare MBP charger in a pinch. External USB-C batteries are also easily available and add as much portable charging capacity as you want to buy. Anyone serious about needing to travel with their laptop will probably find it easier to keep a '16 MBP charged than before.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- dperfect 10y ago> Reducing mA (power draw) rather than increasing mAh (power storage) is the most effective way to increase battery life, which would go a long way to explain manufacturers’ obsession with thinness (which, in electrical terms often directly translates efficiency (i.e., smallness)) in their devices rather than just giving us something that endures. I think it goes the other way; the manufacturers' obsession with thinness (for mostly aesthetic reasons) goes a long way to explain why they're focusing on reducing power draw. It's great that they are reducing power draw, but by making everything thinner (usually translating into decreased power storage), those gains in efficiency are largely cancelled out when it comes to battery life in real-world usage. When creating these things, the designers, engineers, and marketing people obviously have some kind of target battery life in mind, and it seems as though the target is always "about the same battery life as the last generation," whereas there's no end to the number of compromises and engineering efforts that go toward cutting 1 mm off one dimension. And of course, the tech bloggers all go nuts about how thin the newest generation is compared to the last, and people buy computers based on their recommendations. Aren't these things thin enough already, at least for professionals? Why not go for some truly earth-shattering battery life on one of these laptops? Do people really care more about that 1 mm than they do about potentially hours of additional battery life?
- M_Grey 10y agoThen, irony of ironies, people put their ultra-thin devices in cases to protect them, carry multiple batteries for them, or external charging bricks, and my favorite... the oversized extended battery. Throws hands up in air
- tru3n0rth 10y agoIs that really a bad thing, though? It seems like it gives the consumer a choice between having an ultra-lightweight device, or compromising on that front in favor of more battery life and protection.
- jhobag 10y agoExactly. People that do tasks more intensive than watch youtube videos and work on spreadsheets don't need any more battery life so thinness is a priority for regular laptops. People doing intense work use t h i c c laptops
- graiz 10y agoI suspect that 'BatteryTimeRemaining.c' is used in both iOS and OSX builds. It seems unlikely that a MacBook would have an extra battery pack.
- duskwuff 10y agoIf it's plugged into a UPS (silly, but possible), it sort of does!
- chatterbeak 10y agoI got a new MBP (with touch bar) last month. Didn't have the same experience. Back to using this Lenovo Yoga with Windows 10.
- camdenlock 10y agoWhen I bring my 2016 MBP into the office, it runs out of battery near the end of the day, and I have to plug it in for those final 2 or 3 hours. Very satisfied. My colleague with a new Surface Book has been shaking his fist at me, wishing he hadn't listened to the FUD and left the Applesphere. Apparently he gets frustratingly bad battery life on his SB. (To be fair, though, the SB's display ejection hardware is just plain cool...) We're programmers, BTW, writing server-side software mainly using Go, running several ancillary services locally on our dev machines using Docker to ease the development process. I'm thoroughly pleased with my 2016 MBP's battery life considering these workloads.
- izym 10y agoWhat do you mean by "considering these workloads"? It sounds like a fairly light workload.
- camdenlock 10y agoCompiling codebases, bringing services up/down in Docker containers, testing client-server workflows, etc. These activities, especially when repeated throughout the day, can be quite computationally-expensive, taking a significant toll on the machine's resources. These aren't light workloads, they are fairly heavy.
- krzyk 10y agoI'm wondering, why don't you run your MBP plugged in all the time? I assume you just sit with it somewhere. Also I'm wondering why you use Mac or Surface to programm server side stuff? Wouldn't a Linux on a cheaper/more powerful laptop be better for such work?
- bostand 10y agoAldo, doesn't docker on mac and Windows use an expensive linux virtualization layer? I think OP would get much better battery time if he used a proper Linux machine.
- pawadu 10y ago
- var_chris 10y agoI ordered the 2016 MBP w/touchbar and had it completely die within 2 weeks. Just came back from lunch and it wouldn't power on. I don't think this has been as widespread of an issue as low battery performance. It was a bummer because I have been using macs for quite a while and really like to develop on them but now I am having doubts on getting another one. Would probably prefer a MacPro if they ever updated them.
- gnou 10y agoOne of my friend had the same problem, took him several weeks to deal with it, this might be a quality control issue.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- berryg 10y agoI have an older MBP. Hunting down processes and especially tabs in Safari or Chrome that cause the CPU to spike and to drain the batteries becomes a daily routine. A routine I don't like. Is there a program that watches excessive CPU usage and battery drain over time, warns me and points me directly to the possible culprit and advices me to take action. For example to close a specific tab in Safari. I would even let the program automatically close Safari tabs for certain websites. The goal would be to optimise battery usage in the most user friendly way.
- tomsthumb 10y agofor chrome, The Great Suspender does an alright job if you have a lot of sprawl and an internet connection stays available.
- holografix 10y agoCant wait for the new round of MBPs. This one just seems like a catastrophe... I can deal with the butterfly keyboard, anemic CPUs, and USB-c and even the outrageous price. Just not all as a package!
- amluto 10y agoWhy is it reasonable to make claims about the current draw going down without discussing voltage? There are only two useful figures here: power drawn from the battery (probably mW) and time the battery would last at idle. The current is meaningless unless you know that the voltage (current voltage, not nominal voltage) of the batteries on the systems being compared are the same. Given that battery voltage changes during a discharge cycle, this is far from a given even the batteries are completely identical. If Apple really wanted to halve battery current, they could just change the cell configuration to double the voltage. Bingo!, except the laptop won't actually run any longer on a charge.
- konstruktors 10y agoIt's 76Wh in 2016 vs 99Wh in 2015 -- a 24% smaller battery. To have the same battery time, it must draw 24% less current than it did with the 2015 model. Secondly, we should always compare watts instead of amps unless we know the batteries have the exact same voltages. For example, for a battery life of 18h it must draw 4.2W on average (76Wh/18h). I don't think that's possible because only the 2016 MacBook uses that little power -- 4.1W (41Wh/10h).
- kogepathic 10y agoLet's compare the numbers quoted by the author: 619mA * 11.1V = 6.87W 430mA * 11.1V = 4.77W So it's the difference of about 2 watts between the 2015 MBP and the 2016 MBP, or roughly 30% less consumption. > I’m impressed that the new MBP will happily sit at a 500 mA power draw for long stretches of time. It's virtually useless to tell people the amount of current something is using without also mentioning the voltage. I don't know why the author is discussing this in terms of current instead of watts. 5W isn't overly impressive for a laptop. My 2012 Dell (admittedly without retina display, but with 5 year old components) idles in Linux at ~7W with the brightness at 50%. If you close the lid to turn off the display, this will drop to 5W. So, 5 years, a HDPI display, and Apple is down to 5W. Anyone with a Dell XPS 13 or XPS 15 who can comment on power consumption? I'm not overly impressed by this number from Apple, it seems par for the course for Intel hardware over the past few years. The biggest problem for laptop battery life is Windows. My Dell came with Windows 7 and I wouldn't get 3 hours on the 6 cell battery (65Wh). I installed Linux on it and now I can get 6-7 hours comfortably. Maybe Windows 10 has improved this somewhat, but Windows 7 is terribad for laptop battery life.
- herghost 10y agoWith mine, on the plus side I am getting about 14 hours a day of work - that's connected to WiFi, using a Citrix VDE for about 9 hours, along with local office suite, email, browsing, iTunes, etc. On the negative side, if I'm playing Civ 5 whilst plugged in the battery is still discharging - albeit very slowly. I'm not sure what would happen if it actually got to zero. I assume it would switch off, despite being plugged in?
- lucaspiller 10y agoWhy is the power draw measured in milliamps, wouldn't watts be more appropriate? The voltage of the battery drops as it discharges, so 500mA when it's fully charged isn't the same as 500mA when it's nearly empty. Unless that is taken after the voltage has been regulated, but in that case again why are we measuring the capacity in amp-hours instead of watt-hours?
- dbg31415 10y agoUntil you steam a video or play a game, like Civilization or XCom (from 2012). Then the battery just dies at a near 1% per minute rate. "Great battery! ... until you actually go to do something that uses power." I did a side by side test and the battery on my new MBP lasts the same as my 2013 MBP for streaming conference calls -- under 2 hours for both. (I had them call each other with cameras aimed at each other while both streaming Netflix.)
- ciaranm 10y agoHave you updated the OS? I found battery to be a problem on my 15" until 10.12.3, wherein it's much improved.
- losvedir 10y agoInteresting, and nice to hear a little good news for once about the new MBP's, heh. I actually am thinking about upgrading my old MBA, and have considered the non-touchbar MBP. At this point, though, I'm not sure if I should be waiting for Kaby Lake. Does anyone have stats on how much that should improve performance or battery life? It's likely the next revision of MBP, maybe later this year (?), will support the newer processors, right?
- tim333 10y agoThe suggested Battery Guru app is cool - running it now on my Air. Just found charging the phone increases the draw from 450 mA to 1200 roughly https://macdaddy.io/mac-battery-guru/ https://macdaddy.io/mac-battery-guru/