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I am not a self-made man
- 6stringmerc 10y agoArnold is quite the curiosity to me; in some ways he helped establish the myth vs. reality of "Work hard, eat your protein, lift weights, and you can be the muscle man too!" which isn't to be ignored, nor should the role of anabolic steroids in enabling the outcome seen on screen. He's grown a little more vocal recently about how massive the bodybuilding guys are now and rather distorted (possible ex: Seth Feroce), but it was his generation that helped bring in the modern era. I don't think Arnold has shied away from his past in this regard (hard to when having heart surgery more than likely linked to anabolic use), which, I guess I find refreshing.
- brandonmenc 10y ago> it was his generation that helped bring in the modern era I'd argue that Dorian Yates et al ushered in the "mass monster" era we're currently in. Steroid use in Arnold's generation was mild (a little bit of Dianabol, no PCT) and most of those guys didn't start using until they were already at an elite level.
- 6stringmerc 10y agoYeah Dorian for sure, his interviews have been really interesting as well. Dorian said basically though he was just using larger doses of Test, nothing fancy. It's not that Arnold wasn't gifted or hard working, but it's also important to keep in mind "a little bit of Dianabol" goes a long way with even basic attention to training and diet, both of which I do agree Arnold already was working with.
- brandonmenc 10y ago> "a little bit of Dianabol" goes a long way Oh yeah, for sure. "[Mike Mentzer] told us that his entire physique morphed after he started using Dianabol and Deca for the first time." From this great interview, if anyone is interested: http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/muscle-building-myths-exposed-part-1/ http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/muscle-building-myths-exposed... http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/muscle-building-myths-exposed-part-2/ http://www.ironmanmagazine.com/muscle-building-myths-exposed...
- 6stringmerc 10y agoPersonally I think some traditional PEDs are fantastic and would love for them to be more accessible. Not necessarily OTC but a lot closer. Thanks for the articles, I know Mike's name and will definitely dig in! I did the whole "get educated" before putting anything in my body, and frankly, have enjoyed what many things have done (several now banned in the US ugh). I'm kind of talking around it, but what bothers me is guys who obviously are on great designer gear - The Rock, Hugh Jackman, Marky Mark - but claim otherwise, or minimize what role actually pushing their genetic envelope via PEDs helped them pull off. Pretending otherwise doesn't sit well with me.
- brandonmenc 10y agoOne guy who owns it, is Stallone. However, that may have been the reason why Australia busted him with HGH - even though probably every fit celebrity over age forty travels with it.
- gonvaled 10y agoAs opposed to Peter Thiel ...
- brakmic 10y agoSo, this guy from Austria says Nelson Mandela is one of his idols?! Freedom, Peace, Humanity.... Let's quote Wikipedia: " On December 13, 2005, Williams was executed by lethal injection after clemency and a four-week stay of execution were both rejected by Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, amid debate over the death penalty. Williams was the second inmate in California to be executed in 2005. " https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Williams https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_Williams Usually, we call this Hypocrisy.
- blowski 10y agoI don't know the details of the case, but I do know that politicians have to make a lot of difficult decisions based on more than their own personal opinions.
- andy_ppp 10y agoCome on man, the whole piece is about having humility. The Wikipedia article says this guy was one of the leaders of the Westside Crips; I don't feel sorry for him and can see why he wasn't granted clemency. I don't agree with the death penalty but it doesn't invalidate the sentiment in the article.
- whowalrus 10y agoI do not agree with the death penalty either, but your logic seems flawed to me. I don't have to share ALL the morals/ethics/worldviews that my heroes have. Now if he came out against death penalty at some point and then reversed his stance, your accusation of hypocrisy would be accurate. Edit: I was wrong about what hypocrisy meant - please see humanrebar's reply below.
- CPLX 10y agoSome good friends and advisors, incredible hard work, Primobolan, Deca Durabolin, and Dianabol, and you're all set.
- raverbashing 10y agoSteroids are not a magical solution
- sergiotapia 10y agoCommon misconception from people who don't work out. Steroids will only allow you to work even harder to achieve the result you are gunning for. You don't go through a cycle and immediately become swole.
- CPLX 10y agoI work out. That hard work is required as well is not a secret, which is why I mentioned it. Arnold is actually a somewhat inspiring figure. But clicking on the article and looking at that comical photo of him in a bath robe prompted the comment. He left out a few of the secrets of his success in the story, so I mentioned them by name.
- adrianN 10y agoSitting on your butt shooting test is twice as effective (over 10 weeks) than not shooting test and exercising for 10 weeks: http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101#t=article http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101#t=a... "Fat-free mass did not change significantly in the group assigned to placebo but no exercise (Table 4 and Figure 1Figure 1Changes from Base Line in Mean (±SE) Fat-free Mass, Triceps and Quadriceps Cross-Sectional Areas, and Muscle Strength in the Bench-Press and Squatting Exercises over the 10 Weeks of Treatment.). The men treated with testosterone but no exercise had an increase of 3.2 kg in fat-free mass, and those in the placebo-plus-exercise group had an increase of 1.9 kg. The increase in the testosterone-plus-exercise group was substantially greater (averaging 6.1 kg). The percentage of body fat did not change significantly in any group (data not shown)."
- TheAlchemist 10y agoThis guy is one of the most under-rated celebrities out there. Sure the films in which he played didn't help - I actually felt to the trap too. His autobiography is just amazing - you realize he's just extremely smart, hardworking dude that also happens to have a vision.
- ekianjo 10y agohave to agree here. Arnold is far from the guy he just pretends to be in movies.
- humanrebar 10y agoUnder-rated? How? He's a huge star in four or five different fields.
- rtpg 10y agoMany times the praise is qualified - Body Building "for dumb people" - Acting "just in dumb movies" - Governor " Just because he's an action star. He won for because of the lols" I'm not a megafan, but the more I think about him, the more I'm surprised I completed discounted how he completely dominated 3 fields. I sometimes wonder whether it's because of his accent. So many subconsciously connect strong accents with stupidity.
- TheAlchemist 10y agoIn Europe, most people don't know / remember he was a Governor. You say Arnold - they think Terminator.
- AstralStorm 10y agoGoverminator. For some reason, not remembered as a bodybuilder or Conan.
- humanrebar 10y agoI understand some of it. He did enjoy many aspects of "meathead" culture. Though "smart" people considering him dumb because he didn't signal intelligence properly is... well, probably an unexamined position.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- schappim 10y agoThat's some meticulously planned marketing by Tim Ferriss, right before his new book launch: "This essay was my foreword for the new book by Tim Ferris, Tools of Titans." Nice work!
- raverbashing 10y agoDoesn't mean it is not sincere
- whowalrus 10y agoDoesn't mean it is not marketing.
- dmschulman 10y agobut it's well done marketing, it's not in your face advertising the product, the title/article were not clickbaity, it's only until you read the footnote that you'll see it's part of tim's book. i think this is an excellent example of how guest blog marketing should be done.
- k-mcgrady 10y agoJust to note the book was launched earlier this week (the 6th I think). I'm about half way through it and would recommend it.
- ForHackernews 10y agoTim Ferris of BrainQUICKEN fame? The "I'll show you shortcuts so you don't have to work hard!" guy? Seems like an odd fit for Schwarzenegger.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- nickrivadeneira 10y agoTim Ferris has done a lot since BrainQUICKEN, including coming out with a number best selling books and putting out a great podcast. Arnold was an interviewee on the podcast, alongside tons of other greats.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- fagnerbrack 10y agoIf this was marketing, it was a very good one.
- na85 10y agoIf? Read the text in italics at the bottom.
- jstoja 10y agoTo me, this is just being humble and I don't get the negative reactions of other comments.
- markdog12 10y agoHaters gonna hate.
- hassy 10y agoGreat message, but "self-made" never meant someone who became successful with no outside help. One is self-made if their fortune wasn't inherited, that's it.
- k-mcgrady 10y agoSome people think of it in the first way.
- LukeB_UK 10y agoThe words "self-made" have an implication that you did it all yourself.
- hassy 10y agoOnly if you take everything literally. To those down-voting me: Firstly, I would invite you to consult a good dictionary. Secondly, I'd invite you to undertake a moment's reflection, which I believe should make readily apparent the utter uselessness of a word that describes not a single person that ever lived.
- tomhoward 10y agoHi there, I'm sure everyone reading this knows what 'self-made' usually refers to. But they also know that Arnold is using artistic licence in pursuit of his objective, which is to convey the importance of having humility and gratitude as you seek to achieve success. The people downvoting you, I'm quite sure, are doing so because you've perhaps come over as unnecessarily pedantic, given the spirit of this message.
- GunboatDiplomat 10y agoI don't think so. Benjamin Franklin is probably the prototypical self-made man. And you would never claim that "he did it all himself." He wouldn't have claimed that either. It's clear from his Autobiography that there were many people who helped him along his path to success, but that doesn't change the fact that he was a self-made man.
- forgottenacc57 10y agoArnold comes across as a genuine sort of person. You'd have to know him personally to know if that's true, but it's certainly the way he appears.
- jokoon 10y agoWhen individualism fails, all you end up with is egoism. The problem with individualism, is that it's only some form of organized egoism. People are content when their self-interest meet with others, but when they don't the whole thing crumbles and people blame the government and don't pay their taxes, because it's not their fault anymore. Individualism is a really misleading word, because it easily is an excuse to dismiss the system entirely, pat yourself in the back, and blame all the ones who did not make it like you did. It is worse than egoism. Individualism becomes an excuse where people deserve their bad situation. Individualism literally becomes the "no excuse". You're not a star? No excuse, did not work hard enough. No job, no friends? No excuse, you have a bad personality and are weak minded. TV appearance is the established ideology of success.
- rebuilder 10y agoHere's a thought: You can't really believe in individualism and judge people at the same time, can you? You can judge yourself, but in judging others you try to make them fit into your view of what a person should be. And that hardly sounds like something befitting an individualist.
- jokoon 10y agoA competition is only worthy if it is in the mutual interest of everybody. In reality people seek achievement and success with an ego contest, and it end up in cannibalization. To me success is only fueled by jealousy and the fear of mediocrity.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- jerf 10y agoIndividualism and moral relativism are two orthogonal things. I say that with no attempt to imply anything about the rightness or wrongness of those things (at this time, anyhow); I simply am pointing out you seem to have conflated two things that are quite different.
- sidcool 10y agoAyn Rand would be intrigued to read this article.
- Pungsnigel 10y agoShe wouldn't object to any part of it.
- ericmo 10y agoArnold said he's got help from lots of people and it's very likely that most of them didn't get anything in return. Were these people adept of ethical egoism, none of them would've helped him.
- Pungsnigel 10y agoThat's a common belief about Ayn Rand, but it's not correct. As long as they enjoyed helping him, or at least wanted to help him, she would not have objected in the slightest.
- eej71 10y agoAgreed. First paragraph here captures her viewpoint. http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/charity.html http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/charity.html
- hellofunk 10y agoAll this love on here for Arnold, but whenever I think of him, I can't get out of my head his debates and interviews during his campaign for Governor. He refused to let other candidates speak their turn, constantly interrupting with lots of bombast. He was rude and inconsiderate, and then I saw him on Ellen with his wife, and she had to physically cover his mouth with her hand because of the awful stuff he was saying. His wife eventually left him. So while this is a great little article, it is just that: a crafted, written piece, well-edited and promoted. Perhaps it is sincere, but it is not the whole picture. And "humble" is not the word I'd have ever used to describe Arnold.
- k-mcgrady 10y agoI'm pretty sure most of us come across better in writing, I know I do. Personally I would argue that's a better reflection of the person than the first thing that pops into their head when they're trying to entertain on TV.
- hellofunk 10y agoI disagree. Writing is a product of time. Give enough time or influence from others and your writing can be whatever you want it be, and it can be far removed from who you actually are.
- idank 10y agoThe same can be said about speech. There's an entire industry on how to be a good speaker. It is very much an acquired skill, perhaps more difficult to master, but very similar to being well written.
- crististm 10y agoI've read just yesterday about interrupting others (while looking for missed IRQ's :) and the thing is this: It is expected of politicians and high profile figures to talk over others or they will be percieved weak. Their setup is not on polite debate but on putting up a convincing show. As Jim Rohn used to say: you must understand how things are even if you don't like the way they are.
- agentgt 10y agoAs a child of the very early 80's besides my father Arnold was one of my role models growing up. Given that I'm not at all a bodybuilder and prefer academic things I have generally avoided admitting that but the 80s were a different time. In college I tried explaining my liking for Arnold and so many superficial things would come up that I would quickly dismiss the topic. Many individuals are truly impressive if you take a deep holistic perspective of their accomplishment and who they are as person even with faults (on the other hand there are many that probably deserve less praise). Yeah Arnold has been a sexist and I don't agree on his political stances but many of the greats I'm sure have some serious character flaws (e.g. Isaac Newton, Edison and Jobs were not exactly saints).
- gdulli 10y agoCalling a man who repeatedly groped and humiliated women publicly just a "sexist" is the reason the behavior still exists.
- agentgt 10y agoWhat would you like me to call it or him? Believe me I know his behavior was most likely inappropriate I'm just not sure what label should be applied. If you think I misrepresented the labeling of him I might agree with it some more research (which is difficult). If I offended you by not taking a more severe label I apologize. I'm not often very descriptive. Most of the founding fathers of the country were exceptionally devious (rapeist and extremely sexist) but we rarely apply labels to them. We probably should.
- bluedino 10y agoHow does the bill burr joke go? Move to a country where you can barely speak their language, become a millionaire, win their bodybuilding competitions for 5 years, become the biggest movie star, marry into their royalty, and then become governor of their largest state. That's what Arnold did
- khuey 10y agohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldIwEG9xQ-M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldIwEG9xQ-M
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- andrewclunn 10y ago"To make apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe." - Carl Sagan
- uhtred 10y agoCalling it an essay is a bit far fetched.
- eludwig 10y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indra's_net https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indra's_net
- koliber 10y agoExcellent way to illustrate an important concept. Keep in mind that what he is effectively saying is that not one person on this planet is self-made. Anyone who lives to an age to be able to express such sentiment is already indebted to their parents. They are indebted to anyone who has lent a help raising them. They are indebted to the society that provided the infrastructure that got them to where they are. People need to take the cards that they are dealt. You can't change the past. You must be humble and thankful and not let your ego get the best of you. That being said, the term "self-made" does have a meaning. It does not literally mean that someone is responsible for every piece of success. There is literally not one such person. Unfortunately, some people do take it to mean that. Pity and educate them. The meaning it has is that they worked hard to take them from where they started to where they are. It describes the relative effort they exerted to advance. There is always help and luck involved along the way. Most of the time though, external help and luck will not be enough to arrive at success. Hard work is required. Arnold is a self-made man. He did work hard to get where he is. I am happy he wrote this article to express gratitude for all those that helped him get there. The world would be a better place if more successful people realized that.
- raverbashing 10y ago> The meaning it has is that they worked hard to take them from where they started to where they are. It describes the relative effort they exerted to advance. There is always help and luck involved along the way. Most of the time though, external help and luck will not be enough to arrive at success. Hard work is required. This is a good description, and I agree with the paragraph below. The issue is how you compare with people who had the same opportunities (and which in the case of Arnold, were few, but he made the best he could of them, also had a lot of luck). Arnold did go to ballet classes, his competitors did not. Legend says he also did some unethical things to his competitors (like leading them to dead-ends, things like that - some of it might have been in jest)
- Evgeny 10y agoLegend says he also did some unethical things to his competitors He himself mentions some of this on Tim Ferriss' podcast: http://fourhourworkweek.com/arnold-schwarzenegger-transcript/ http://fourhourworkweek.com/arnold-schwarzenegger-transcript... By the time I came to America and started competing over here, it was very clear when I said to someone, “Let me ask you something, do you have any knee injuries or something like that?” Then they would look at me and say, “No, why? No. I have no knee injury at all. No, my knees feel great.” And they say, “Why are you asking?” I said, “Well because your thighs look a little slimmer to me. I thought maybe you can’t squat or maybe there’s some problem with leg extension.” ... People are vulnerable about those things. Naturally now when you have a competition, you use all this. ... It throws people off in an unbelievable way. Tim: And they get defensive. Arnold: They walk away like this didn’t bother them at all, but then you can see, you watch them as they walk around the pump up room, and when you warm up for the competition, and you can see them kind of thinking to themselves, kind of them going to the mirror and checking it out secretly and all that stuff.
- danr4 10y agoSlightly off the main topic - has Tim Ferriss actually created something of value that didn't exist before? It seems everything he is about is telling about how other people create value.
- toyg 10y agoThat's the literal definition of "media worker", I guess.
- graeme 10y agoWhat other single book has everything the four hour workweek has? His original business was a supplement product called brainquicken. He doesn't talk much about the specifics of that product. But, in the four hour workweek, most of his examples were from the backend of that business. That book was literally a lifechanger for me, and led to me leaving law school to create an automated business in the style of the ones he wrote about. His current venture, podcasts, is mostly about showing how others have created value. But that in itself is a thing of value - it's not that easy to get a bunch of influential people to talk candidly to the public.
- gtirloni 10y agoI learned about many things from Tim Ferris, so he created value for me. My math teacher didn't invent any theories. He didn't write any books. Yet, I learned math from him. Can we say he didn't create anything of value?
- jonmb 10y agoIs a well-curated collection of useful knowledge from other valuable people not valuable in of itself?
- syassami 10y agoi'm usually cynical about things like this, but there is a value in the aggregation itself imo.
- josscrowcroft 10y agoIn 2008, his book "The Four Hour Workweek" helped me change absolutely everything in my life, and really to start living at all. Even if most of its contents could be found elsewhere, the book is something of value that didn't exist before. I've since moved on from where that book is coming from (as has he, from the sounds of things), but I still listen to the audio from time to time for inspiration and to reconnect with my 2008-self.
- known 10y ago"If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants" --Isaac Newton
- acomar 10y agoYou know what's funny about that quote? It was actually intended as a clever dig about Robert Hooke's height[0]. Newton and Hooke had a longstanding feud and this was another shot in that war. The quote itself is much older with the oldest known attribution from John of Salisbury, but it's possibly older still. [0] http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/history/q0162b.shtml http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/history/q0162b.shtml
- M1ntos123 10y agoThis my friends is kind of what socialism (in a very general sense) is mostly about. The sense that when you are sick there is a society that protects you and helps you get back to work. When you have a child and your expenses grow the state might provide you a small chunk of money, to help. Sorry for bringing up politics but I felt some kind of resonance with some social ideas that influences so much of the society (here in the Nordics). No single person is self-made, we are all in this boat together and so on.
- known 10y agoMachiavellianism (willingness to manipulate and deceive others), Narcissism (egotism and self-obsession), Psychopathy (the lack of remorse and empathy), Sadism (pleasure in the suffering of others);
- mshenfield 10y agoA subset of the "self-made" myth is that of the "self-taught". There are very few people (like the great lost mathematician Srinivasa Ramanujan) who discover the things they know off of first principles, intuition, and curiosity.
- lordnacho 10y agoDoesn't self-taught normally mean you didn't attend classes at some institution?
- throwaway729 10y agoYes, which is an equally stupid false dichotomy. All of the best programmers are I know are both self-taught programmers (in the sense that they learned how to program prior to attending any classes about programming), and also college-educated computer scientists.
- user837387 10y agoNow imagine Trump. He will claim the complete opposite Arnold is claiming. He would in all seriousness claim that he had it even tougher than Arnold or that had he been in Arnold's situation he would have done even better. The worst thing is that we elected such a narcissist POS even when we knew all of this.
- jdimov10 10y agoNo matter how many of my accounts you block, every two months or so the comments on HN are just more than I can bear... Fucking communists. Almost everyone on HN is a fucking communist. You read an inspired piece like this and all you get out of it is "Yea, comrade! Society made you who you are. Don't ever forget that. Good boy." Fucking communists.
- iagooar 10y agoUsing the topic, how is it that Tim Ferriss has such a huge following / impact? To me he lives in a fairy tale world, his pieces of advice are usually laughable and unrealistic. Basically, all he seems to do is so disconnected from real life. Or am I missing something?
- cableshaft 10y agoIt's made up advice that doesn't sound quite as fake as the other made up advice and he talks like a not quite perfect human unlike most of the other self help people out there (who might as well be replaced with a company chatbot for as authentic as they sound), so he can be successful and wow, if he's successful from doing what he says, maybe I can too! Nevermind the way he gets a 4 hour workweek he espouses is by giving self-help advice, not working for a corporate office that demands your butt in a chair 40+ hours a week. I do actually like the guy myself, despite me saying this, but I haven't found too much of his advice practical for my situation.
- jonnathanson 10y ago"To me he lives in a fairy tale world" That's exactly why he's so popular. He's selling a dream: you, too, can live in the fairytale world if you buy my book and do X, Y, Z. It's a classic escapism/wish-fulfillment narrative. Nevermind that 99% of Ferris's readers will never put his ideas into practice the way Ferris espouses they should; the mere act of reading his books provides some emotional support.
- Taylor_OD 10y agoHis core audience is well off (100K+ a year) 20-30 year old white males/females in America. He sells a dream that seems incredibly obtainable (almost even owed) to that audience. I'm saying this as someone who owns the TF books and listens to the podcast and falls into his target audience.
- kharms 10y agoI'm a fan of his interviews, especially once I filter out the advice-heavy (usually athletic) ones. Good example: http://fourhourworkweek.com/2016/03/11/the-interview-master-cal-fussman-and-the-power-of-listening/ http://fourhourworkweek.com/2016/03/11/the-interview-master-...
- state_less 10y agoSuppose any rich man wakes up in the Amazon jungle with nothing to his name, no clothes and no money. He may in fact be the richest man on earth, but in the jungle it doesn't matter. Society is their wealth. It's even the source of their language and ability to express themselves. In the past, Athenians realized this idea. They realized that Athens is what gave wealth any meaning at all. Literally the word wealth and also the supernatural amounts of wealth that some individuals accrued. It's through this lens that we should consider a wholistic approach. Let Athens first take care of itself, then reward those who helped her grow better and stronger. Don't let a few wealthy athenians confuse you and say, because I'm wealthy, I get to make decisions legally and in the clear that enrich me and hurt Athens. No, we should not allow Athenian wealth be destroyed for the sake of a few Athenians! Personally I count opportunity cost too, so all this time that wealth is being siphoned off into a few hands is creating a different future that we might otherwise have. What if we didn't siphon a trillion dollars into an expensive war in Iraq? What if my friend had not died on the battlefield? That stain still hasn't quite come out of our fabric yet.
- infinite8s 10y agoAthens was built by slavery, so not the best example of full equality for all.
- dgellow 10y agoYou judge something from 2k+ years in the past with our current set of values.
- kazinator 10y agoOur current set of values: wearing a five dollar T shirt and cheap sneakers ... made by slaves in a sweatshop somewhere.
- dsacco 10y agoThis is not a case of someone casting contemporary normative values on an ancient culture in judgement. The parent made a correct positive claim; ancient cultures, including Athens, typically had vastly more inequality than is present today. It doesn't matter whether or not inequality had a different flavor of cultural sophistication or acceptance attached to it at the time. It remains that the culture is not a good example of equality.
- ant6n 10y agoNon-facebook link: https://toolsoftitans.com/foreword/#main https://toolsoftitans.com/foreword/#main
- ceejay 10y agoAs far as my experience tells me, it is hard to become truly successful in life. Where the history books will take note of what you became and what you accomplished. It boggles my mind that even with such great odds there are so many who actively work to prevent it, or work to cripple the ecosystems that are supposed to exist to enable people to become what they want to become and accomplish what they want to accomplish.
- raheemm 10y agoTim Ferris, the master marketer.
- notadoc 10y agoNobody is.
- milansuk 10y agoOf course He is not a self-made man, he will be make by Skynet and travel back in time.
- Torgo 10y agoArnold might not be a self-made man, but he took what he was given, and did a million times more with it than I would have. And that counts for something.
- qplex 10y agoI don't especially like his values when it comes to "bigger is better". Don't get me wrong, it's good to be healthy and have muscle mass, but extreme bodybuilding is like burning rubber on a parking lot and never going anywhere with it. Fuel and food is quite precious, at least on the scale of our spaceship earth.