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"The entire codebase was stored in a database, only accessible via a client Mark maintained, with no version control nor lock controls meaning if we both had a

"The entire codebase was stored in a database, only accessible via a client Mark maintained, with no version control nor lock controls meaning if we both had a file open we could overwrite one another's files and undo work. There was no pre-production environment. Meaning changes were supposedly deployed untested or made straight on production. I was told I could not touch the backend, although they were working on getting access to this via Mark. Although it was taking time because Mark was more busy with his Bitcoin cafe. They said that despite all this, it was still a decent place to work because there was literally no pressure to perform. " Just wow.

agumonkey 11y ago
I'm under the impression that MtGox had some actual real life impact, how many important systems are twisted beasts like this.
- Redoubts 11y ago
  Depends. How many times does a Magic the Gathering Online Exchange attempt to become a real financial institution?
  - ontoillogical 11y ago
    From what I understand it was never a magic the gathering exchange. The original author reused an old domain for the bitcoin exchange afaik.
    - gohrt 11y ago
      That doesn't make the business look any more professionally managed.
- waterlesscloud 11y ago
  Many, many more than anyone will admit.
  - agumonkey 11y ago
    I feel the urge to crawl through wikileaks all of a sudden.
- barce 11y ago
  Ya, MtGox had people's savings in it. I really feel sorry for them and hope Mark's arrest and trial give them some justice even though they won't be made financially whole again. http://www.dailydot.com/business/bitcoin-crash-i-lost-everything-mt-gox/ http://www.dailydot.com/business/bitcoin-crash-i-lost-everyt...
adamnemecek 11y ago
The thing I don't get is why anyone would use their own 'code storage'. This isn't laziness, it would take much less time to setup git.
- StavrosK 11y ago
  Because it's easier to make things than it is to learn things.
  - hga 11y ago
    This is the guy who wrote his own SSH server in PHP: https://web.archive.org/web/20140226001727/http://blog.magicaltux.net/2010/06/27/php-can-do-anything-what-about-some-ssh/ https://web.archive.org/web/20140226001727/http://blog.magic... We don't know that server was used in production, but it's consistent with the complete anarchy we hear prevailed at Mt. Gox, yet again.
- lordnacho 11y ago
  If you knew that git existed, yes. Quite often people who are incompetent do not know how easily their problems could be fixed.
- nsajko 11y ago
  Out of habit, maybe? Edit: and ignorance
- q3k 11y ago
  I think it's a phase most programmers go through - I jokingly call it “code graphomania”. You make up some sort of overengineered project, then keep implementing it even though there might exist better alternatives. You'd experiment with various language features, try to cram in some wild design decisions that have no basis in real life patterns, etc. It's hard to explain concisely, but I do observe this in other hackers a lot. And I think Karpeles was going through that phase at this time. I vividly remember seeing his blogposts on reimplementing an SSH server in PHP, just to show that it's doable. I wouldn't be surprised to see that code and other similar terribad ideas running in production.
im3w1l 11y ago
Imagine what an SQL injection could do to that...
- jonknee 11y ago
  Indeed: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnw8pt https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_b... > Someone brute forced Jed's account (as told to me by Mark). > I was there about 3 days before it happened, and I received 3 emails about an SQL injection vulnerability (which Mark ignored/thought unworthy).
joshstrange 11y ago
Can you please provide a link/source to this? I can't find the AMA'er saying this and a google of parts of what you said only link back to this HN post. Edit: Ok so it WAS in that thread just not something that the only "verified" person said. I'm inclined to believe it's true however it hasn't been confirmed and posting it here in quotes like that given the title (indicating the person running the AMA said this) is misleading at best.
- alexholehouse 11y ago
  http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnyhxb http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_ba...
- kroger 11y ago
  https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnyhxb https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_b...
- mintplant 11y ago
  https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnyhxb https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_b...
nadams 11y ago
> The entire codebase was stored in a database Even if this didn't happen at Mt. Gox I'm sure it's happened in other places. I've heard of people storing the queries that they were going to send to the database in a database row.
- rjbwork 11y ago
  When you've got a hammer, everything looks like a nail...
- jodrellblank 11y ago
  SCID - Source Code In Database; http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?SourceCodeInDatabase http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?SourceCodeInDatabase
- morgante 11y ago
  > I've heard of people storing the queries that they were going to send to the database in a database row. In fairness, that's not all that different from prepared statements...

agumonkey 11y ago

I'm under the impression that MtGox had some actual real life impact, how many important systems are twisted beasts like this.

Redoubts 11y ago
Depends. How many times does a Magic the Gathering Online Exchange attempt to become a real financial institution?
- ontoillogical 11y ago
  From what I understand it was never a magic the gathering exchange. The original author reused an old domain for the bitcoin exchange afaik.
  - gohrt 11y ago
    That doesn't make the business look any more professionally managed.
waterlesscloud 11y ago
Many, many more than anyone will admit.
- agumonkey 11y ago
  I feel the urge to crawl through wikileaks all of a sudden.
barce 11y ago
Ya, MtGox had people's savings in it. I really feel sorry for them and hope Mark's arrest and trial give them some justice even though they won't be made financially whole again. http://www.dailydot.com/business/bitcoin-crash-i-lost-everything-mt-gox/ http://www.dailydot.com/business/bitcoin-crash-i-lost-everyt...

adamnemecek 11y ago

The thing I don't get is why anyone would use their own 'code storage'. This isn't laziness, it would take much less time to setup git.

StavrosK 11y ago
Because it's easier to make things than it is to learn things.
- hga 11y ago
  This is the guy who wrote his own SSH server in PHP: https://web.archive.org/web/20140226001727/http://blog.magicaltux.net/2010/06/27/php-can-do-anything-what-about-some-ssh/ https://web.archive.org/web/20140226001727/http://blog.magic... We don't know that server was used in production, but it's consistent with the complete anarchy we hear prevailed at Mt. Gox, yet again.
lordnacho 11y ago
If you knew that git existed, yes. Quite often people who are incompetent do not know how easily their problems could be fixed.
nsajko 11y ago
Out of habit, maybe? Edit: and ignorance
q3k 11y ago
I think it's a phase most programmers go through - I jokingly call it “code graphomania”. You make up some sort of overengineered project, then keep implementing it even though there might exist better alternatives. You'd experiment with various language features, try to cram in some wild design decisions that have no basis in real life patterns, etc. It's hard to explain concisely, but I do observe this in other hackers a lot. And I think Karpeles was going through that phase at this time. I vividly remember seeing his blogposts on reimplementing an SSH server in PHP, just to show that it's doable. I wouldn't be surprised to see that code and other similar terribad ideas running in production.

im3w1l 11y ago

Imagine what an SQL injection could do to that...

jonknee 11y ago
Indeed: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnw8pt https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_b... > Someone brute forced Jed's account (as told to me by Mark). > I was there about 3 days before it happened, and I received 3 emails about an SQL injection vulnerability (which Mark ignored/thought unworthy).

joshstrange 11y ago

Can you please provide a link/source to this? I can't find the AMA'er saying this and a google of parts of what you said only link back to this HN post. Edit: Ok so it WAS in that thread just not something that the only "verified" person said. I'm inclined to believe it's true however it hasn't been confirmed and posting it here in quotes like that given the title (indicating the person running the AMA said this) is misleading at best.

alexholehouse 11y ago
http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnyhxb http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_ba...
kroger 11y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnyhxb https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_b...
mintplant 11y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_barr_aka_adam_turner_the_first_mtgox/ctnyhxb https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3fe92x/im_ashley_b...

nadams 11y ago

> The entire codebase was stored in a database Even if this didn't happen at Mt. Gox I'm sure it's happened in other places. I've heard of people storing the queries that they were going to send to the database in a database row.

rjbwork 11y ago
When you've got a hammer, everything looks like a nail...
jodrellblank 11y ago
SCID - Source Code In Database; http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?SourceCodeInDatabase http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?SourceCodeInDatabase
morgante 11y ago
> I've heard of people storing the queries that they were going to send to the database in a database row. In fairness, that's not all that different from prepared statements...