6 ms·

>After all, once we're on two planets We'll never be on two planets in any meaningful way. Antarctica is a paradise compared to everywhere else, and nobody wan

>After all, once we're on two planets We'll never be on two planets in any meaningful way. Antarctica is a paradise compared to everywhere else, and nobody wants to live in Antarctica. There is no other place for us in the Solar System.

wolf550e 11y ago
Antarctica is not colonization. You are not allowed to own land or start a business on Antarctica. For human settlement on Mars to succeed, Mars must not become Antarctica. The first few missions will be government owned and the crew will be as independent as military personnel, but actual settlement will be done by people legally and economically free to colonize.
- tptacek 11y ago
  So Mars is an easier place to colonize than Antarctica because of zoning rules?
  - wolf550e 11y ago
    If technology progresses but international treaties don't change, then hundreds of years from now this will be exactly correct. Robert Zubrin is not completely insane.
pavel_lishin 11y ago
> We'll never be on two planets in any meaningful way. If we're not on two planets in any meaningful way, it only takes one big rock to be on zero planets.
- macspoofing 11y ago
  Yeah. It is an uncaring universe.
- kayoone 11y ago
  I am all for space colonization but i realize it's a fundamentally egocentric thing to wish for. It's not really what nature intended. We have eleminated many other species and at some point in time the same fate will probably await us.
  - pavel_lishin 11y ago
    Fuck what nature intended. Nature intended for me to die of starvation within weeks of being born due to a congenital disorder preventing me from digesting anything. I'd wager that nature probably didn't intend for you to have 20/20 eyesight, or to have all of your teeth, or for you to type on a magic glowing box that allows you to communicate with people halfway around the planet.
    - jqm 11y ago
      Human intentions are part of... nature.
  - rgawdzik 11y ago
    Is self-preservation egotistic? Probably. An asteroid similar to the dinosaur extinction event could hit us at anytime, with a few hours notice. You'd think the human race would learn from the dinosaurs? Imagine another asteroid hits Earth, humanity becomes extinct, and a new sentient species evolves after 200 million years. This species will dig up human and dinosaur bones. Reminds me of: "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me."
    - macspoofing 11y ago
      Maybe they'll look at our remains and say "Ah, so this is how we'll go"
  - adventured 11y ago
    Nature didn't intend anything. There's no such thing as an integrated, thinking, conscious entity called nature that intends some distant outcome. An example that makes the point: nature intends for us to spread to every habitable planet in the galaxy. Nature wants humanity to dominate. There is also no such thing as fate. Humans aren't fated to a pre-set outcome. If I step on a spider, that doesn't mean bad karma is going to have a tornado rip my house apart. If some humans cause the extinction of some species, that doesn't mean the human race is going to be wiped out.
ForHackernews 11y ago
http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2001/ast26jan_1/ http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2001/as... http://www.cnet.com/news/nasa-wants-to-build-a-floating-city-above-the-clouds-of-venus/ http://www.cnet.com/news/nasa-wants-to-build-a-floating-city...
api 11y ago
Antarctica is a terrible example. First of all, settlement of antarctica is illegal. It's all claimed and off limits by treaty. We don't know if anyone would settle it if it were open. Secondly, there is a qualitative difference between another planet and another place on this one.
prawn 11y ago
We will, it just might not happen for thousands of years. Once we have the ability to freeze our bodies in stasis to wake at intervals and check progress, time taken to travel huge distances may become meaningless. Set probe for x light years away, program the alarm for arrival. Of course, communication with anyone not travelling with you becomes a bit meaningless. Obviously a huge deal of progress to be made in terms of energy and replication, maintenance, etc. We're a bunch of stupid animals on average, but I wouldn't bet against the best of us making this sort of thing happen eventually. "Never" is a very definite thing to say!
- jqm 11y ago
  10,000 years is long time in a freezer. I throw even hamburger away after a year or so. The only way I see it happening is a multi-generational trip. Or sending some raw material with instructions and a platform to reconstruct DNA and grow out some embryos. Or we modify ourselves genetically to the point it isn't the current hominid species making the trip. Unless of course we find some sort of shortcut through space time. But it's all far fetched science fiction of course.
  - prawn 11y ago
    Your freezer isn't that cold and doesn't freeze all that quickly. Raw material sent for construction is more likely, but I do like the idea of an individual being frozen enabling them to live almost as long as they wish and travel almost any distance.
- macspoofing 11y ago
  >Once we have the ability to freeze our bodies in stasis to wake at intervals and check progress A better approach is to send self-building/self-replicating droids, with human DNA or hard-drive saved consciousness. Let AI deal with the hazards of navigating interstellar space and building up a colony before 'birthing' humans. No freezing necessary (just a waste of resources)

wolf550e 11y ago

Antarctica is not colonization. You are not allowed to own land or start a business on Antarctica. For human settlement on Mars to succeed, Mars must not become Antarctica. The first few missions will be government owned and the crew will be as independent as military personnel, but actual settlement will be done by people legally and economically free to colonize.

tptacek 11y ago
So Mars is an easier place to colonize than Antarctica because of zoning rules?
- wolf550e 11y ago
  If technology progresses but international treaties don't change, then hundreds of years from now this will be exactly correct. Robert Zubrin is not completely insane.

pavel_lishin 11y ago

> We'll never be on two planets in any meaningful way. If we're not on two planets in any meaningful way, it only takes one big rock to be on zero planets.

macspoofing 11y ago
Yeah. It is an uncaring universe.
kayoone 11y ago
I am all for space colonization but i realize it's a fundamentally egocentric thing to wish for. It's not really what nature intended. We have eleminated many other species and at some point in time the same fate will probably await us.
- pavel_lishin 11y ago
  Fuck what nature intended. Nature intended for me to die of starvation within weeks of being born due to a congenital disorder preventing me from digesting anything. I'd wager that nature probably didn't intend for you to have 20/20 eyesight, or to have all of your teeth, or for you to type on a magic glowing box that allows you to communicate with people halfway around the planet.
  - jqm 11y ago
    Human intentions are part of... nature.
- rgawdzik 11y ago
  Is self-preservation egotistic? Probably. An asteroid similar to the dinosaur extinction event could hit us at anytime, with a few hours notice. You'd think the human race would learn from the dinosaurs? Imagine another asteroid hits Earth, humanity becomes extinct, and a new sentient species evolves after 200 million years. This species will dig up human and dinosaur bones. Reminds me of: "Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me."
  - macspoofing 11y ago
    Maybe they'll look at our remains and say "Ah, so this is how we'll go"
- adventured 11y ago
  Nature didn't intend anything. There's no such thing as an integrated, thinking, conscious entity called nature that intends some distant outcome. An example that makes the point: nature intends for us to spread to every habitable planet in the galaxy. Nature wants humanity to dominate. There is also no such thing as fate. Humans aren't fated to a pre-set outcome. If I step on a spider, that doesn't mean bad karma is going to have a tornado rip my house apart. If some humans cause the extinction of some species, that doesn't mean the human race is going to be wiped out.

ForHackernews 11y ago

http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2001/ast26jan_1/ http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2001/as... http://www.cnet.com/news/nasa-wants-to-build-a-floating-city-above-the-clouds-of-venus/ http://www.cnet.com/news/nasa-wants-to-build-a-floating-city...

api 11y ago

Antarctica is a terrible example. First of all, settlement of antarctica is illegal. It's all claimed and off limits by treaty. We don't know if anyone would settle it if it were open. Secondly, there is a qualitative difference between another planet and another place on this one.

prawn 11y ago

We will, it just might not happen for thousands of years. Once we have the ability to freeze our bodies in stasis to wake at intervals and check progress, time taken to travel huge distances may become meaningless. Set probe for x light years away, program the alarm for arrival. Of course, communication with anyone not travelling with you becomes a bit meaningless. Obviously a huge deal of progress to be made in terms of energy and replication, maintenance, etc. We're a bunch of stupid animals on average, but I wouldn't bet against the best of us making this sort of thing happen eventually. "Never" is a very definite thing to say!

jqm 11y ago
10,000 years is long time in a freezer. I throw even hamburger away after a year or so. The only way I see it happening is a multi-generational trip. Or sending some raw material with instructions and a platform to reconstruct DNA and grow out some embryos. Or we modify ourselves genetically to the point it isn't the current hominid species making the trip. Unless of course we find some sort of shortcut through space time. But it's all far fetched science fiction of course.
- prawn 11y ago
  Your freezer isn't that cold and doesn't freeze all that quickly. Raw material sent for construction is more likely, but I do like the idea of an individual being frozen enabling them to live almost as long as they wish and travel almost any distance.
macspoofing 11y ago
>Once we have the ability to freeze our bodies in stasis to wake at intervals and check progress A better approach is to send self-building/self-replicating droids, with human DNA or hard-drive saved consciousness. Let AI deal with the hazards of navigating interstellar space and building up a colony before 'birthing' humans. No freezing necessary (just a waste of resources)