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I'm exactly the target market for this. I never learned how to cook meat growing up (I got by with sandwiches and salads and the like), but now as an adult I fi

I'm exactly the target market for this. I never learned how to cook meat growing up (I got by with sandwiches and salads and the like), but now as an adult I find myself in situations like the following: Last week my significant other and I decided to cook dinner together (for a change; usually we don't). We were both interested in salmon, but neither of us knew how to cook it, so we ended up doing something else. My status quo options are: (1) don't cook salmon, (2) cook salmon and most likely screw it up—hardly the best way to start an evening together, or (3) take cooking classes. An appliance that unlocks option (4) cook salmon and have it most likely turn out delicious on the first try? Yes. I will eagerly pay money for that. Even assuming over time I no longer need the device, the reality is that I'd much rather pay this one-time upfront cost than expend a bunch of time trying and failing or taking classes in order to develop a skill I'm not passionate about.

pbreit 11y ago
Try Blue Apron for a week. Without a "smart" pan, you'll probably be able to get pretty good results just following the easy-to-follow recipe. I'm not sure how valuable the "better" results are going to be.
- rtfeldman 11y ago
  The thing is, "pretty good results" are competing against any number of eateries where we can get "delicious." Cooking together is fun, but scrapping or choking down a failed meal is not. I've screwed up easy recipes plenty of times in the past. The promise that I can get a good result despite my lack of skill is what's appealing.
  - mattgoyer 11y ago
    I'm overdue in writing a blog post entitled, "Blue Apron saved my marriage." Before Blue Apron I couldn't cook but Blue Apron definitely does a really good job walking you through things. You won't nail it every time but you'll definitely be close, you'll learn, and there is a good community of people making the same meal who can give you tips.
    - pbreit 11y ago
      It's been a revelation for my family. I went from reluctantly heating up stir-fry to eat on the couch to enthusiastically preparing fresh food, sit-down family dinners.
    - jkestner 11y ago
      The point that there's an instacommunity because you're all making the same recipe together is pretty awesome. Maybe broadcasting isn't dead? (See: Beats 1.)
      - pbreit 11y ago
        Yes, and they've made great use of (Facebook) commenting so that you both get input/tips by other amateurs cooking same dish and Blue Apron gets fantastic, organic-ish exposure. https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-smashed-potatoes-strawberry-rhubarb-compote https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-sma...
  - pbreit 11y ago
    OK, you'll very likely get terrific results.
lambdaelite 11y ago
I agree that option 4 would explain the attraction of these devices. I guess I remain unconvinced that, while these gadgets may claim to "unlock option 4", they will actually deliver (yet again, excepting the immersion circulator). There's a lot more to cooking than simply getting the temperature right. I'm skeptical that a magic cooking gadget is going to make someone a half-decent cook for the same reason that I don't believe a magic golf club will make me a golfer: the reason I can't hit a golf ball is because my technique is pitiful. Like I said, I'm not the target for stuff like this, but I am always on the lookout for neat gifts, which is why I'm trying to figure this stuff out. You've downplayed option 3, but you've clearly got some motivation towards cooking. If I might suggest, have you considered watching/participating in a free cooking demonstration at the supermarket? In the past I've found them to be well done, and they use stuff available at the supermarket, so that lowers one barrier. Also, cooking classes make for a great date night.
fredophile 11y ago
Have you considered option (5) look up salmon recipes and follow the directions? There are lots of sites online dedicated to hosting recipes. Some of them have decent video and pictures so you can see what they're doing. Here's a salmon recipe I tried just last week: http://www.marthastewart.com/1033633/roasted-salmon-kale-and-cabbage http://www.marthastewart.com/1033633/roasted-salmon-kale-and.... If you plan ahead and are willing to spend a few dollars you could also get a cookbook. I'd recommend How to Cook Everything and America's Test Kitchen Cooking School Cookbook. How to Cook Everything has lots of recipes and does a good job explaining cooking terms. The America's Test Kitchen book explains the reasons for why they do things a certain way and also lists common problems and their causes so you can avoid them or correct them without guesswork in the future.
- pbreit 11y ago
  A struggle I had cooking was that so many of the recipes are pretty lousy, most distressingly including no pictures. One of the things I really like about Blue Apron and Plated are how easy to follow their instructions are and the inclusion of 7 pictures (6 steps plus the finished dish). For example, here is a really tasty, easy-to-cook "go to" salmon recipe: https://dusyefwqqyfwe.cloudfront.net/public_uploads/recipe/region_schedule/static_menu/4273/recipe_card20150518-3-axd55q.pdf https://dusyefwqqyfwe.cloudfront.net/public_uploads/recipe/r... (Plated seems to have started making its recipes harder to find/access) And yummy "go to" pork and beef meals from Blue Apron: https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-smashed-potatoes-strawberry-rhubarb-compote https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-sma... https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-steaks-with-sauteed-radishes-snap-peas-and-mashed-potatoes https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-steaks-with-sauteed...
  - fredophile 11y ago
    I haven't tried Blue Apron or Plated but looking at those links the thing that appeals most to me is that it explains the timing. I tend to have trouble getting everything finished at about the same time without something being overcooked.
dragonwriter 11y ago
> My status quo options are: (1) don't cook salmon, (2) cook salmon and most likely screw it up—hardly the best way to start an evening together, or (3) take cooking classes. If you have even basic cooking skills outside of salmon, you've missed several options, like "look up recipes/directions for preparing and cooking salmon" (going to cooking classes is more extreme than is necessary.) And an appliance isn't going to make you not have to do that, because while the actual application of heat is an important part of turning salmon (or anything else) into quality food (ignoring raw preparations), so is preparation, and the appliance isn't going to do that for you. And if you can look up and follow prep instructions, you can probably look up instructions that include both prep and cooking, as most recipes do.
jotux 11y ago
Why is getting it right on the first try the only acceptable outcome? If you try, fail a few times, and eventually learn it will still be dramatically cheaper than buying any of these machines. And once you learn it will become a transferable skill -- you won't be tied to only being able to prepare your food when you're home with your specialized device.
- fr0styMatt2 11y ago
  So much this. The fear of failure in cooking is a bit like the fear of failure in maths ("I'm just bad at maths") or fearing technology ("I'd never be good at computers!"). I do get it. It feels extremely wasteful to throw out a ruined meal. Many people are taught from very young that the stove is 'dangerous' and that hot pans are something to be feared. It's potentially really really embarrassing to ruin a meal for guests, etc. It's a fear of experimentation though, which is a shame. FWIW I'm a kitchen gadget nut as much as the next person - this could be a really good tool for convenience, not criticizing it at all in that way.
  - semi-extrinsic 11y ago
    On the other hand, there's nothing cooler than having friends over for dinner and being able to say "yeah, I've never tried making this before, but it turned out great". Fortune favours the bold.
pbhjpbhj 11y ago
>neither of us knew how to cook it // TBH I'd YouTube something like this - bet there is at least 1000 videos of cooking salmon. Or look it up in a recipe book. If you get a device aren't you going to look up how to use it? Well you could just look up how to use a frying pan or grill. >I'd much rather pay this one-time upfront cost than expend a bunch of time trying and failing or taking classes in order to develop a skill I'm not passionate about // Fair enough: to my mind the hardest part of cooking a meal is ensuring everything is ready at the right time and fresh and hot for serving. None of these devices appear to help with that(?). Want some boiled potatoes with that salmon then you're going to have to learn how long they take and synchronise the cooking, unless they have a saucepan version that links with the other one to boil your spuds.
- pbreit 11y ago
  > bet there is at least 1000 videos of cooking salmon That's the problem. And another reason why I like Plated and Blue Apron which narrow the noise dramatically (both offer both video how-tos and easy-to-follow recipes). https://www.youtube.com/user/ThePlated https://www.youtube.com/user/ThePlated https://www.blueapron.com/cookbook https://www.blueapron.com/cookbook
anigbrowl 11y ago
But you won't learn anything this way. Buy a copy of The Joy of Cooking, get some decent non-stick pots and pansresist the temptation to turn the heat up too high and practice. Yes, you'll have a bunch of failed meals along the way and you'll feel incompetent when that happens and you have to throw the food out and get take-out instead. This is OK. Honestly, it's not that hard. You probably have a friend who can cook, get them to teach you some stuff.
beachstartup 11y ago
i'd say learning to cook something new together is a far better use of your time than hitting buttons on a screen. i also think you seriously overestimate how difficult it is to cook salmon. it's incredibly easy. in fact, this entire comment is a bit of a stretch. hmm...
wodenokoto 11y ago
I have never even thought about salmon as being something that is difficult to cook. You put it on a pan and take it off when you want to eat it. Yes, you can do stuff that makes it better, but this approach still tastes good.
teekert 11y ago
Heat up a pan with, put oil/butter (or combi) in it. You want to test the right temperature? A breadcrumb should sizzle/produce little bubbles when thrown into the oil/butter. Butter should just start to be become brown and not bubble anymore. Put the Salmon into the hot pan, bake 2-3 minutes on each side, turn the heat down a little. It is easy to just cut one of the salmon pieces to check if the inside is done, it should seem like it is just not raw anymore. I often take the Salmon out of the pan after the short baking and eithr put it the oven (160degC for 5-10 min) or wrap it in aluminum foil and leave in on the hot induction plate where the pan was first for 5-10 min. Now that I'm writing this, I have to laugh, one has to keep more in mind than I thought at first :) Most of it is intuitive to me now I realize. I have to say that I only truly got comfortable with cooking (that is, doing it fast and having everything ready at the same time) after being unemployed for 8 months and doing all the cooking (the comfortableness took less than those 8 months). Having a nice kitchen with the desk at the proper height (and a dishwasher to prevent frustrations afterwards ;)) also helps tremendously. So, as I set out to answer how simple it is... maybe it is not. But only practice will help and experimentation is fun. Why can't you just laugh and learn from a messed up meal? I started out cooking the way I did analytical chemistry (I have a degree in biochemistry), this prevents errors in the beginning but later on you will drop the precision in favor of your own preferences. By now I can cook up nice meals in 15-30 minutes using mostly fresh things. And I like doing it. It especially feels good if your kids eat your meals. Perhaps having kids was the biggest motivation to try to vary as much as possible with fresh foods. And skipping a meal is less bad than it sounds ;)
abcd_f 11y ago
> My status quo options are (4) look things up on the Internet. From Youtube to various cooking TV series and blogs, you'd be hard pressed NOT to find a decent salmon cooking tutorial. It all really depends on whether you want to learn how to cook salmon or if you just want it come out tasty on the first try. Smart-pan is as much of an educational tool as RockBand is a guitar playing tutorial.

pbreit 11y ago

Try Blue Apron for a week. Without a "smart" pan, you'll probably be able to get pretty good results just following the easy-to-follow recipe. I'm not sure how valuable the "better" results are going to be.

rtfeldman 11y ago
The thing is, "pretty good results" are competing against any number of eateries where we can get "delicious." Cooking together is fun, but scrapping or choking down a failed meal is not. I've screwed up easy recipes plenty of times in the past. The promise that I can get a good result despite my lack of skill is what's appealing.
- mattgoyer 11y ago
  I'm overdue in writing a blog post entitled, "Blue Apron saved my marriage." Before Blue Apron I couldn't cook but Blue Apron definitely does a really good job walking you through things. You won't nail it every time but you'll definitely be close, you'll learn, and there is a good community of people making the same meal who can give you tips.
  - pbreit 11y ago
    It's been a revelation for my family. I went from reluctantly heating up stir-fry to eat on the couch to enthusiastically preparing fresh food, sit-down family dinners.
  - jkestner 11y ago
    The point that there's an instacommunity because you're all making the same recipe together is pretty awesome. Maybe broadcasting isn't dead? (See: Beats 1.)
    - pbreit 11y ago
      Yes, and they've made great use of (Facebook) commenting so that you both get input/tips by other amateurs cooking same dish and Blue Apron gets fantastic, organic-ish exposure. https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-smashed-potatoes-strawberry-rhubarb-compote https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-sma...
- pbreit 11y ago
  OK, you'll very likely get terrific results.

lambdaelite 11y ago

I agree that option 4 would explain the attraction of these devices. I guess I remain unconvinced that, while these gadgets may claim to "unlock option 4", they will actually deliver (yet again, excepting the immersion circulator). There's a lot more to cooking than simply getting the temperature right. I'm skeptical that a magic cooking gadget is going to make someone a half-decent cook for the same reason that I don't believe a magic golf club will make me a golfer: the reason I can't hit a golf ball is because my technique is pitiful. Like I said, I'm not the target for stuff like this, but I am always on the lookout for neat gifts, which is why I'm trying to figure this stuff out. You've downplayed option 3, but you've clearly got some motivation towards cooking. If I might suggest, have you considered watching/participating in a free cooking demonstration at the supermarket? In the past I've found them to be well done, and they use stuff available at the supermarket, so that lowers one barrier. Also, cooking classes make for a great date night.

fredophile 11y ago

Have you considered option (5) look up salmon recipes and follow the directions? There are lots of sites online dedicated to hosting recipes. Some of them have decent video and pictures so you can see what they're doing. Here's a salmon recipe I tried just last week: http://www.marthastewart.com/1033633/roasted-salmon-kale-and-cabbage http://www.marthastewart.com/1033633/roasted-salmon-kale-and.... If you plan ahead and are willing to spend a few dollars you could also get a cookbook. I'd recommend How to Cook Everything and America's Test Kitchen Cooking School Cookbook. How to Cook Everything has lots of recipes and does a good job explaining cooking terms. The America's Test Kitchen book explains the reasons for why they do things a certain way and also lists common problems and their causes so you can avoid them or correct them without guesswork in the future.

pbreit 11y ago
A struggle I had cooking was that so many of the recipes are pretty lousy, most distressingly including no pictures. One of the things I really like about Blue Apron and Plated are how easy to follow their instructions are and the inclusion of 7 pictures (6 steps plus the finished dish). For example, here is a really tasty, easy-to-cook "go to" salmon recipe: https://dusyefwqqyfwe.cloudfront.net/public_uploads/recipe/region_schedule/static_menu/4273/recipe_card20150518-3-axd55q.pdf https://dusyefwqqyfwe.cloudfront.net/public_uploads/recipe/r... (Plated seems to have started making its recipes harder to find/access) And yummy "go to" pork and beef meals from Blue Apron: https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-smashed-potatoes-strawberry-rhubarb-compote https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-pork-roast-with-sma... https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-steaks-with-sauteed-radishes-snap-peas-and-mashed-potatoes https://www.blueapron.com/recipes/seared-steaks-with-sauteed...
- fredophile 11y ago
  I haven't tried Blue Apron or Plated but looking at those links the thing that appeals most to me is that it explains the timing. I tend to have trouble getting everything finished at about the same time without something being overcooked.

dragonwriter 11y ago

> My status quo options are: (1) don't cook salmon, (2) cook salmon and most likely screw it up—hardly the best way to start an evening together, or (3) take cooking classes. If you have even basic cooking skills outside of salmon, you've missed several options, like "look up recipes/directions for preparing and cooking salmon" (going to cooking classes is more extreme than is necessary.) And an appliance isn't going to make you not have to do that, because while the actual application of heat is an important part of turning salmon (or anything else) into quality food (ignoring raw preparations), so is preparation, and the appliance isn't going to do that for you. And if you can look up and follow prep instructions, you can probably look up instructions that include both prep and cooking, as most recipes do.

jotux 11y ago

Why is getting it right on the first try the only acceptable outcome? If you try, fail a few times, and eventually learn it will still be dramatically cheaper than buying any of these machines. And once you learn it will become a transferable skill -- you won't be tied to only being able to prepare your food when you're home with your specialized device.

fr0styMatt2 11y ago
So much this. The fear of failure in cooking is a bit like the fear of failure in maths ("I'm just bad at maths") or fearing technology ("I'd never be good at computers!"). I do get it. It feels extremely wasteful to throw out a ruined meal. Many people are taught from very young that the stove is 'dangerous' and that hot pans are something to be feared. It's potentially really really embarrassing to ruin a meal for guests, etc. It's a fear of experimentation though, which is a shame. FWIW I'm a kitchen gadget nut as much as the next person - this could be a really good tool for convenience, not criticizing it at all in that way.
- semi-extrinsic 11y ago
  On the other hand, there's nothing cooler than having friends over for dinner and being able to say "yeah, I've never tried making this before, but it turned out great". Fortune favours the bold.

pbhjpbhj 11y ago

>neither of us knew how to cook it // TBH I'd YouTube something like this - bet there is at least 1000 videos of cooking salmon. Or look it up in a recipe book. If you get a device aren't you going to look up how to use it? Well you could just look up how to use a frying pan or grill. >I'd much rather pay this one-time upfront cost than expend a bunch of time trying and failing or taking classes in order to develop a skill I'm not passionate about // Fair enough: to my mind the hardest part of cooking a meal is ensuring everything is ready at the right time and fresh and hot for serving. None of these devices appear to help with that(?). Want some boiled potatoes with that salmon then you're going to have to learn how long they take and synchronise the cooking, unless they have a saucepan version that links with the other one to boil your spuds.

pbreit 11y ago
> bet there is at least 1000 videos of cooking salmon That's the problem. And another reason why I like Plated and Blue Apron which narrow the noise dramatically (both offer both video how-tos and easy-to-follow recipes). https://www.youtube.com/user/ThePlated https://www.youtube.com/user/ThePlated https://www.blueapron.com/cookbook https://www.blueapron.com/cookbook

anigbrowl 11y ago

But you won't learn anything this way. Buy a copy of The Joy of Cooking, get some decent non-stick pots and pansresist the temptation to turn the heat up too high and practice. Yes, you'll have a bunch of failed meals along the way and you'll feel incompetent when that happens and you have to throw the food out and get take-out instead. This is OK. Honestly, it's not that hard. You probably have a friend who can cook, get them to teach you some stuff.

beachstartup 11y ago

i'd say learning to cook something new together is a far better use of your time than hitting buttons on a screen. i also think you seriously overestimate how difficult it is to cook salmon. it's incredibly easy. in fact, this entire comment is a bit of a stretch. hmm...

wodenokoto 11y ago

I have never even thought about salmon as being something that is difficult to cook. You put it on a pan and take it off when you want to eat it. Yes, you can do stuff that makes it better, but this approach still tastes good.

teekert 11y ago

Heat up a pan with, put oil/butter (or combi) in it. You want to test the right temperature? A breadcrumb should sizzle/produce little bubbles when thrown into the oil/butter. Butter should just start to be become brown and not bubble anymore. Put the Salmon into the hot pan, bake 2-3 minutes on each side, turn the heat down a little. It is easy to just cut one of the salmon pieces to check if the inside is done, it should seem like it is just not raw anymore. I often take the Salmon out of the pan after the short baking and eithr put it the oven (160degC for 5-10 min) or wrap it in aluminum foil and leave in on the hot induction plate where the pan was first for 5-10 min. Now that I'm writing this, I have to laugh, one has to keep more in mind than I thought at first :) Most of it is intuitive to me now I realize. I have to say that I only truly got comfortable with cooking (that is, doing it fast and having everything ready at the same time) after being unemployed for 8 months and doing all the cooking (the comfortableness took less than those 8 months). Having a nice kitchen with the desk at the proper height (and a dishwasher to prevent frustrations afterwards ;)) also helps tremendously. So, as I set out to answer how simple it is... maybe it is not. But only practice will help and experimentation is fun. Why can't you just laugh and learn from a messed up meal? I started out cooking the way I did analytical chemistry (I have a degree in biochemistry), this prevents errors in the beginning but later on you will drop the precision in favor of your own preferences. By now I can cook up nice meals in 15-30 minutes using mostly fresh things. And I like doing it. It especially feels good if your kids eat your meals. Perhaps having kids was the biggest motivation to try to vary as much as possible with fresh foods. And skipping a meal is less bad than it sounds ;)

abcd_f 11y ago

> My status quo options are (4) look things up on the Internet. From Youtube to various cooking TV series and blogs, you'd be hard pressed NOT to find a decent salmon cooking tutorial. It all really depends on whether you want to learn how to cook salmon or if you just want it come out tasty on the first try. Smart-pan is as much of an educational tool as RockBand is a guitar playing tutorial.