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With the exception of the immersion circulator, I don't understand these devices. Can you help me understand? I'm an experienced cook, so (again, with the exc

With the exception of the immersion circulator, I don't understand these devices. Can you help me understand? I'm an experienced cook, so (again, with the exception of the immersion circulator) I'm not in the target market for these devices. I'm having trouble understanding the target market though. I was thinking that it was for inexperienced people who want to cook at home. When I play that scenario through my head, it doesn't completely work. Take your salmon example: getting the pan to a good temperature and cooking the fish to the ideal temperature is not easy, so I can see how an inexperienced person could easily benefit from real-time temperature feedback. What I'm having trouble figuring out though, is that after gaining experience from cooking fish a few times, what's the benefit of the real-time temperature feedback? I guess the thing I'm wrestling with is that as one becomes more experienced, the value of these smart devices seems to rapidly diminish. I don't intend this to be negative or harsh, so I hope it doesn't come across that way. I'm genuinely interested in the thinking behind this smart device trend. Hope you can share.

hipsterrific 11y ago
What people want are results now. It took me a few tries to cook any fish well. Every once in a while I screw up and I chalk it to lessons learned. The first time I made scallops I was nervous but I knew my gas range and I knew my tools, so it came out perfect (with butter though I should have made herbed butter). The first time I made buttermilk fried chicken using my sous vide they came out tender and seasoned, granted it didn't look all that pretty. Cooking takes time. It takes practice. I think the novelty of these devices wear off once people realize that their steaks are perfectly medium rare but cheaped out or they don't know how to buy a good cut of meat. The novelty will go away when they practice cooking so much they rely less on technology and more on their own skill.
0xdeadbeefbabe 11y ago
We watch cooks country sometimes. I frequently wonder how to change the recipe for our high altitude desert climate that differs from theirs. I'm never quite sure I've done it because the recipe's (especially volume based measurements) and descriptions are less precise than a smart gadget could be. I'm never quite sure the carbonara sauce is cooked or raw. This is why I'm interested, and perhaps part of the market. Cooking for me is about replicating conditions and duplicating an experiment.
rtfeldman 11y ago
I'm exactly the target market for this. I never learned how to cook meat growing up (I got by with sandwiches and salads and the like), but now as an adult I find myself in situations like the following: Last week my significant other and I decided to cook dinner together (for a change; usually we don't). We were both interested in salmon, but neither of us knew how to cook it, so we ended up doing something else. My status quo options are: (1) don't cook salmon, (2) cook salmon and most likely screw it up—hardly the best way to start an evening together, or (3) take cooking classes. An appliance that unlocks option (4) cook salmon and have it most likely turn out delicious on the first try? Yes. I will eagerly pay money for that. Even assuming over time I no longer need the device, the reality is that I'd much rather pay this one-time upfront cost than expend a bunch of time trying and failing or taking classes in order to develop a skill I'm not passionate about.
- pbreit 11y ago
  Try Blue Apron for a week. Without a "smart" pan, you'll probably be able to get pretty good results just following the easy-to-follow recipe. I'm not sure how valuable the "better" results are going to be.
  - rtfeldman 11y ago
    The thing is, "pretty good results" are competing against any number of eateries where we can get "delicious." Cooking together is fun, but scrapping or choking down a failed meal is not. I've screwed up easy recipes plenty of times in the past. The promise that I can get a good result despite my lack of skill is what's appealing.
    - mattgoyer 11y ago
      I'm overdue in writing a blog post entitled, "Blue Apron saved my marriage." Before Blue Apron I couldn't cook but Blue Apron definitely does a really good job walking you through things. You won't nail it every time but you'll definitely be close, you'll learn, and there is a good community of people making the same meal who can give you tips.
moby_click 11y ago
Ideally we could also control the cooktop and at least on older electrical models it should be possible to hook into the circuitry that the knobs are attached to. Without automatic feedback loops such devices are less convenient but still enable better understanding and communication and prevent mistakes. In the salmon example, you might perfect cooking your fish, invite a couple of friends and suddenly fail because you learned to regulate the power output for a single serving, not for a more crowded pan and don't know how to adjust because you don't even know the temperature profile of your perfect fish. Of course one can learn to cook by sound, smell, heat, touch sight and taste and I value poetic recipes but that does not diminish the value of temperature controlled gear.
lifekaizen 11y ago
I see this as two camps. One is helping people cook and get comfortable and have fun with that, and the other is based on the new food science of temperature. This is most commonly known today as sous vide and implemented with an immersion circulator. The food quality really is 10x better, for example you can keep meat proteins below the temperature they seize up and push out moisture, and the experience is something you can't go back to normal cooking from. Because the food doesn't overcook* you have an hour of flexibility, if you love cooking you can use this to try more complex sides and time it right. If you're busy, you can stay calm when your spouse is 30 minutes late. It's like when the DVR came around and you could pause live TV, and no one could go back. Cinder takes advantage of precision temperature cooking to let you do these things, and unlocks other kinds of unattended cooking. You can set onions to a caramelization temperature and walk away, yes you could replicate that yourself if you wanted to hover and stir for 30 minutes, but this is like delegating to a sous chef. *This is a slight simplification. Food will break down and turn mushy, but nearly everything has an expanded range for being done. Which means ending the tyranny of the clock.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
qq66 11y ago
If you let a device cook for you every time, you're not going to learn anything, so the device's value proposition is safe. I've been taking cars to the mechanic for 15 years and haven't learned a thing about cars while doing so, even though I could have been.

hipsterrific 11y ago

What people want are results now. It took me a few tries to cook any fish well. Every once in a while I screw up and I chalk it to lessons learned. The first time I made scallops I was nervous but I knew my gas range and I knew my tools, so it came out perfect (with butter though I should have made herbed butter). The first time I made buttermilk fried chicken using my sous vide they came out tender and seasoned, granted it didn't look all that pretty. Cooking takes time. It takes practice. I think the novelty of these devices wear off once people realize that their steaks are perfectly medium rare but cheaped out or they don't know how to buy a good cut of meat. The novelty will go away when they practice cooking so much they rely less on technology and more on their own skill.

0xdeadbeefbabe 11y ago

We watch cooks country sometimes. I frequently wonder how to change the recipe for our high altitude desert climate that differs from theirs. I'm never quite sure I've done it because the recipe's (especially volume based measurements) and descriptions are less precise than a smart gadget could be. I'm never quite sure the carbonara sauce is cooked or raw. This is why I'm interested, and perhaps part of the market. Cooking for me is about replicating conditions and duplicating an experiment.

rtfeldman 11y ago

I'm exactly the target market for this. I never learned how to cook meat growing up (I got by with sandwiches and salads and the like), but now as an adult I find myself in situations like the following: Last week my significant other and I decided to cook dinner together (for a change; usually we don't). We were both interested in salmon, but neither of us knew how to cook it, so we ended up doing something else. My status quo options are: (1) don't cook salmon, (2) cook salmon and most likely screw it up—hardly the best way to start an evening together, or (3) take cooking classes. An appliance that unlocks option (4) cook salmon and have it most likely turn out delicious on the first try? Yes. I will eagerly pay money for that. Even assuming over time I no longer need the device, the reality is that I'd much rather pay this one-time upfront cost than expend a bunch of time trying and failing or taking classes in order to develop a skill I'm not passionate about.

pbreit 11y ago
Try Blue Apron for a week. Without a "smart" pan, you'll probably be able to get pretty good results just following the easy-to-follow recipe. I'm not sure how valuable the "better" results are going to be.
- rtfeldman 11y ago
  The thing is, "pretty good results" are competing against any number of eateries where we can get "delicious." Cooking together is fun, but scrapping or choking down a failed meal is not. I've screwed up easy recipes plenty of times in the past. The promise that I can get a good result despite my lack of skill is what's appealing.
  - mattgoyer 11y ago
    I'm overdue in writing a blog post entitled, "Blue Apron saved my marriage." Before Blue Apron I couldn't cook but Blue Apron definitely does a really good job walking you through things. You won't nail it every time but you'll definitely be close, you'll learn, and there is a good community of people making the same meal who can give you tips.

moby_click 11y ago

Ideally we could also control the cooktop and at least on older electrical models it should be possible to hook into the circuitry that the knobs are attached to. Without automatic feedback loops such devices are less convenient but still enable better understanding and communication and prevent mistakes. In the salmon example, you might perfect cooking your fish, invite a couple of friends and suddenly fail because you learned to regulate the power output for a single serving, not for a more crowded pan and don't know how to adjust because you don't even know the temperature profile of your perfect fish. Of course one can learn to cook by sound, smell, heat, touch sight and taste and I value poetic recipes but that does not diminish the value of temperature controlled gear.

lifekaizen 11y ago

I see this as two camps. One is helping people cook and get comfortable and have fun with that, and the other is based on the new food science of temperature. This is most commonly known today as sous vide and implemented with an immersion circulator. The food quality really is 10x better, for example you can keep meat proteins below the temperature they seize up and push out moisture, and the experience is something you can't go back to normal cooking from. Because the food doesn't overcook* you have an hour of flexibility, if you love cooking you can use this to try more complex sides and time it right. If you're busy, you can stay calm when your spouse is 30 minutes late. It's like when the DVR came around and you could pause live TV, and no one could go back. Cinder takes advantage of precision temperature cooking to let you do these things, and unlocks other kinds of unattended cooking. You can set onions to a caramelization temperature and walk away, yes you could replicate that yourself if you wanted to hover and stir for 30 minutes, but this is like delegating to a sous chef. *This is a slight simplification. Food will break down and turn mushy, but nearly everything has an expanded range for being done. Which means ending the tyranny of the clock.

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

qq66 11y ago

If you let a device cook for you every time, you're not going to learn anything, so the device's value proposition is safe. I've been taking cars to the mechanic for 15 years and haven't learned a thing about cars while doing so, even though I could have been.