16 ms·

An email template for candidates frustrated with unresponsive employers

78 points by pauloteixeira 11y ago

rmdmachado 11y ago
Awesome! I have committed this sin myself. :(
getsat 11y ago
The reason you don't get a reply (in the US anyways) is for legal reasons. If you say anything which could be even remotely (mis)interpreted as some sort of bias, your company could lose lots of money/time and potentially go bankrupt due to a discrimination lawsuit. It's sadly safer to just not reject candidates at all. Don't hate the player, hate the game.
- gkop 11y ago
  This is merely a convenient excuse for companies behaving inconsiderately. Since many companies in the U.S. do send rejection emails, it's clearly one of any number of other reasons why some companies neglect this basic courtesy. The silver lining is, you probably don't want to work for these companies anyway :)
  - justizin 11y ago
    I have often found myself working _for_ people who had the same negative experiences at other companies, so not only do all bad hiring practices create negative reputation, they create an entire class of people who would be perfectly happy if you didn't exist at all. :)
    - gkop 11y ago
      On "Who is hiring", you can abstain from upvoting those companies where you had a negative experience (or even downvote them, if you feel that's justified).
      - Akkuma 11y ago
        I stated on the update about "Who is hiring" that there needs to be a way to track and review the interactions with these companies. Glassdoor doesn't really have a "these guys never bothered to reply to my job application" section. I just went and "reviewed" companies on "Who is hiring" as this community should try to promote those we'd recommend others try to apply and those we don't believe others should waste their time with. Eventually, we'd be left with only quality job postings.
  - vdaniuk 11y ago
    >Since many companies in the U.S. do send rejection emails Are you able to provide any kind of data backing up that claim? I am strongly in the "don't hate the player, hate the game" camp on this issue. This is NOT a basic courtesy but a business process that requires a lot of resources to be at least somewhat meaningful. How long do you think it takes to write a rejection letter that provides useful, actionable data for the potential candidate? Multiply that by 10-100 for every position. Oh, and I've seen much more nasty replies and general insults than thank yous in response to rejection letters. I would be in support of rejection letters if the process would be mandated by the hiring platform / shared culture / etc.
    - reagency 11y ago
      Facebook gives candidate feedback.
    - gkop 11y ago
      Try applying for a position at a large company with a reputation for a highly-engineered hiring process, eg. Google [0]. Rarely will you get specific feedback, but you can expect to get a notification when you are no longer under consideration. [0] At Google's scale, some candidates fall through the cracks. But their recruiting process does mandate rejection notifications. It'd be great if a Google recruiter would back me up here :)
      - thaumasiotes 11y ago
        I interviewed at Google; they said they would give me a decision at some (soon) future point, and they did. They called me during work hours to do it... but they definitely did give me an explicit rejection.
    - ghaff 11y ago
      My impression is that rejection letters are fairly common but they're almost universally in the form letter "no fit at this time. Will keep on file" vein. Maybe some companies do more personalized responses but I've never seen it and I would think it would often be difficult. As with many other things, say picking talks for conferences, you're usually not so much rejecting as you're picking some other person or thing. And, yes, there are a lot of reasons the typical HR department would have issues with brutal honesty even aside from the effort it would take.
- rbcgerard 11y ago
  A simple "you are no longer being considered for the [x] position, thank you for your application" is all most people are looking for.
  - binxbolling 11y ago
    Exactly! And modern HR tech makes rejection en masse so ridiculously easy. So if your company has an ATS that doesn't make it ridiculously easy to reject en masse with a boilerplate message, then you badly need to upgrade your ATS. (LEGO even sent me a nicely formatted, well-branded letter within 7 business days despite not even making it to the phone screen stage.)
  - burger_moon 11y ago
    Yes this is all I want. I track all my applications and what stage I'm at with each company. It makes it incredibly difficult when they can't even be bothered to send me a generic rejection email.
  - pauloteixeira 11y ago
    Exactly something so simple but so important!
- uncletaco 11y ago
  I'm pretty sure laziness would have more to do with not getting a proper rejection than the chance of triggering a lawsuit. If I'm applying to a small to medium sized business in my neck of the woods then nine times out of ten when I don't get a reply its because the hiring manager hasn't taken the time out of their week to get back to me. When I applied to a local company the hiring manager kept emailing me about how he was "swamped" or some other variation of the word busy and would get back to me in the next few days. He did that for about two weeks before calling me and finding out I had accepted an offer somewhere else. Heck when I applied to Google the recruiter (who contacted me first) took 5 months to get back to me after I sent in my CV and transcript, apologized profusely, and told me that the reason it took so long was because who ever was handling my case left abruptly without handing off the cases she was working on. I know these are anecdotal but I have an extremely hard time believing that HR managers in the US are so worried about triggering a discrimination lawsuit that they choose inaction. Very little, if anything, supports your claim. A quick search on the topic of why recruiters don't follow up with candidates reveals that the vast majority of people in the industry just have a really hard time with the hiring process. Its just plain broken. Does your company not get back to candidates because they fear a discrimination lawsuit? Someone else's? I would love to know which companies' HR teams or recruiters have discrimination lawsuits at the top of their "things I'm really scared could happen if I reply to a job seeker" list.
  - Spooky23 11y ago
    Legal/compliance is a significant part of it. That rejection letter has zero upside to the employer and offers many opportunities to screw up. If a company has: a mature HR process, people who know wtf they are doing, and give a crap, they'll do rejection letters. Most lack at least one of those things. The guy at your SMB example is some jack of all trades, and dealing your resume is a priority-2 in a sea of P1's. He doesn't have a recruiting process. Google does, but even there it's still dependent on a human making a judgement call about what to write.
    - uncletaco 11y ago
      What you said about my resume being priority-2 in a sea of P1s is spot on in my opinion. However the OP's assertion about fearing a legal reprisal on the grounds of discrimination is farfetched to me. People don't just go around trying to sue people who send them nasty rejection letter. If the candidate could afford the legal fees then they probably wouldn't be looking for a job.
- takeda 11y ago
  As other said there are plenty of companies that do notify you, personally majority of companies that I applied to do that. I noticed though that my current company sometimes does it. It typically is when you did not do too well on an interview and effectively failed (or passed with flying colors but you are an international student, and they don't want to sponsor ), but they still won't notify in case they can't find anyone better. From my observation they generally never come back to those candidates.
Akkuma 11y ago
What is ironic is I had no reply on a job posting on landing.jobs after talking directly with landing.jobs too. I was able to leave feedback directly through the site that the company was unresponsive, but landing.jobs hasn't communicated since that feedback. Update: Proof http://imgur.com/m34rFUX http://imgur.com/m34rFUX
- x5n1 11y ago
  too meta man, too meta.
  - joshka 11y ago
    Great superhero/villian name! Meta Man never solves the problem at hand. Instead he/she/it/they obliquely solve the generalized case. Meta Man Sees a mugger stealing cash from a victim, works on legislation to make BitCoin the default for all transactions.
    - notdanariely 11y ago
      You just made me spit coffee all over my keyboard, thanks for the chuckle! First, however, MetaMan will need to end the Hollywood accounting practice so better superhero movies can be made... about him!
    - jerf 11y ago
      JRPGS have had quite a few of those. "In my past, I suffered from $SOME_PAIN. It made me realize that the path to end pain was to END ALL LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE so there would be no more pain." Particularly hilarious if $SOME_PAIN fails to connect with you, so the villain from your point of view essentially leaps from "chosen last to play kickball" to "DESTROY EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE" (and on occasion "EVERYWHEN").
      - mcguire 11y ago
        You say that like it's a bad plan.
OedipusRex 11y ago
Would love to actually see someone's response to this.
Robadob 11y ago
I recall a friend ~12 months ago (in their final year of university), hearing positive news back from IBM after 6+ months of silence since their interview, by which point they had accepted a job elsewhere. I expect some companies prefer not to officially reject, so they have more applicants to potentially consider for future positions, although many may have taken jobs elsewhere by this point.
- atirip 11y ago
  I was once rejected by Spotify 6 months after i sent application in. No hard feelings, I just wonder who was that who waited that process out and got hired ;-)
  - x1798DE 11y ago
    I have no experience on the hiring side of this, but I always assumed that a lot of companies prefer not to make any clear statements until after a decision is made, since at this point it's basically zero cost to defer making a first contact with someone. It's quite possible that the person who got the job applied 2 weeks before they hired him/her, went to the top of the "interview" pile, and soared through the process. Of course, it's also possible that someone did wait in the queue - I've been interviewing for jobs since the beginning of the year, some of which had almost no lag in contact but a fairly long process (multiple phone screens, etc), others had long lag time but a quick process.
dijit 11y ago
I've hired people before, and usually when it comes time to send rejection emails it can be very hard. If someone clearly isn't right for the job, you owe it to them to mention why- I'm an engineer, I work in absolutes and "Culture fit" or something so wishy-washy doesn't roll well off my fingers. But how do you tell people that they lack basic knowledge or experience in certain areas without sounding bitchy or attacking. Even worse is the ones that interviewed well, or showed significant competence.. yet were not as strong as another candidate. I agree it's wrong to send nothing- but it can be hard to formulate a pleasant email.. especially if you've interviewed many people. (10-15 at my last employment, I was replacing myself and had limited time to document/check everything).
- intopieces 11y ago
  >But how do you tell people that they lack basic knowledge or experience in certain areas without sounding bitchy or attacking. It frustrates me that you see it this way because it means when I give direct criticism to individuals I'm expected to bring in line via performance reviews, they get upset and take it personally. It also frustrates me because I'm surrounded by people who refuse to give me direct criticism of my work for fear that I will take it personally. Meanwhile, I'm trying to develop professionally...
  - tomjen3 11y ago
    A solution to that might be some unofficial group that can critique others without having control of their job and/or code review.
- reagency 11y ago
  Don't worry about hurting their feelings. Think about helping them become a stronger candidate in the future.
- tomjen3 11y ago
  >But how do you tell people that they lack basic knowledge or experience in certain areas without sounding bitchy or attacking. We would have liked to work with you, but unfortunately we do not feel your skills in $AREA_OF_CONCERN are as strong as we require. Despite this rejection we wish you a happy job hunt and strongly encourage you to apply to $CORP in the future. If somebody was better, you say that outright. If the problem is culture fit? Well I really wouldn't write that in an email (too likely to make you come of as an ass, too likely to make you easy to sue if the person was a member of some minority).
rfrey 11y ago
Fun read! I'm having the opposite problem. I'm trying desperately to get people to apply for mobile dev positions... and of the FIVE applications I've managed to lure in, none of them replied to my phone calls or emails back. I was considering asking for an address in the application so I could go wait on applicants' doorsteps, but maybe a letter like this is a less litigable idea.
- jakejake 11y ago
  It is an employees market when it comes to developers at the moment. Developers are lured by interesting projects, flexible schedules, money, work environment, etc. so you just have to promote whatever of those you are able to offer.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- eli 11y ago
  I frankly believe there are candidates applying for jobs based on the title and maybe skimming the ad, and then waiting for a response before considering if they actually want to work there.
  - rfrey 11y ago
    You're probably right, and my responses probably could be improved. In which case I sympathize even more with job seekers who get silent rejections, and don't know what went wrong. :)
robalfonso 11y ago
While I agree that companies who go quiet are behaving poorly and would think ill of an applicant who was not responsive myself. My reaction reading the note was that its a bit long to send someone who already blew you off. I hope it makes the sender feel better, I don't think there is much else you are going to do. In this case reporting to the job site that they are unresponsive is probably better (though depending on the site and their rules it may do little as well)
jawns 11y ago
It sounds, based on the comments here, that both job seekers and employers can sometimes run into a frustrating lack of response (job seekers when they submit an application and never hear back; employers when they try to engage an applicant and never hear back). I wonder if there might be a business opportunity here. Suppose there were some way for both job applicants and employers to publicly commit themselves to offering at least a cursory reply (sort of how LinkedIn guarantees a response to each InMail, even if the response is just a boilerplate "Not interested"). If either party fails to respond within some designated timeframe, the penalty could be as simple as publicly noting the fact that they broke their commitment, which is likely to affect their trustworthiness. This would be advantageous for both parties. There might even be some decent money-making potential in being such a commitment clearinghouse. For instance, employers who participate might pay to have their jobs listed on the site, with the expectation that a "reply guaranteed" will be an effective way to bring in applicants.
- JSeymourATL 11y ago
  > I wonder if there might be a business opportunity here. There's an entire multi-billion dollar industry of executive search and staffing built on this premise. A commitment clearinghouse would threaten the existing schema of ambiguity. There are always outliers, new information, and change. There in lies the rub.
cwp 11y ago
This is funny, and probably very satisfying, but if you need to send this kind of email, you're doing it wrong. I get that other industries are different, but if you're looking for a job in the tech world, do your homework. To (a small amount of) background research on companies that would fit with your situation. Find out what the open reqs are, and who the hiring manager is for each one. Pre-screen yourself by finding a req that you're qualified for and apply specifically for that job. Write a custom cover letter for each application, even if it's just an informal 4-line email. If possible, get a warm introduction. If you do all that still don't get a quick response, move on without a second thought. You don't want to work for this company anyway.
- rbanffy 11y ago
  You can, on your introduction message or on the thank you note you send after a first interview, state you understand the hiring manager is a busy person and you will get back in touch on a specific timeframe. And then you get in touch on that specific time. If even this fails, you should fire the company - you really don't want to work there. As much as this is a fun read, unless you are applying for a job at The Onion, don't do it.
eggbrain 11y ago
My approach with TrueJob to solve this is allowing employers and job seekers to favorite or block almost anything about each other. Employers get back anonymous analytics as to how to improve their job postings, and job seekers get back anonymous analytics as to how to improve their resume. It seems to work pretty well so far, but there's a lot more to be done in the job space -- the lack of transparency and information can cause a lot of frustrations for both employers and job seekers.
peteboyd 11y ago
We are hiring right now for a new bookkeeper, actually they start Monday, so we just finalized the hiring. We regularly post ads for designers, developers and content writers too. Probably every other month I am reviewing resumes, so I have a bit of experience in responding to applicants. Typically any given job posting gets around 50 to 100 resumes depending on the category. It takes time to read through everything. We use a mix of Craiglist, Indeed, various job boards, LinkedIn and our own website postings. It has worked well for awhile now. Due to the nature of various job boards, some responses are often automated by clicking a few buttons so it is too easy to apply. With that you get candidates off topic (i.e. wrong skill set) and not putting in any effort (i.e. skipping a cover letter that we want to read). Other times, the cover letter and resume are comically sad in mistakes and grammar, so they do not warrant full attention. Our biggest gripe is that at least 50% of the applicants never follow our instructions on how to apply correctly. We put very specific steps on how to apply and want it followed (i.e. subject line, cover letter, links to portfolio, PDF resume). My take on this is if the applicant is not going to take the time to respond correctly, then we are not going to take the time to respond back. Sounds harsh, but kicking out 50 canned replies is tedious work for those who are wasting our time to review. Perhaps we could automate it somehow with scanning emails addresses in the "no" folder and sending out a batch bcc, but it is still extra work. However, before everyone jumps on us. We do respond to every applicant we interview (phone or in-person). Often we respond with a personal note that helps them out and lets them know where they stand. Sometimes we even try them out on freelance projects in the future. For every applicant that correctly fills out our application process, or at least made an effort, then we also reach out to them with a more automated message via email. I consider that the least we can do, but we do keep in short and sweet. Finally, in the future, I am going to probably put our entire application process on our website. This will automate a lot of what we do and require the applicant to fill out set fields that we need answered. Then we could send batch emails back to everyone as needed.
- binxbolling 11y ago
  Just curious, but what ATS are you using that makes sending 50 canned replies tedious?
ohitsdom 11y ago
I guess this is a joke, but all the comments so far seem to take this seriously. So let me say what is obvious to me- there are many legitimate reasons why you may have not heard back in a manner that seems timely to you. There are also bad reasons, such as disorganization and poor communication skills. But what message does an email like this send? "If you hire me, be prepared to deal with complaints about my professional behavior!" Seriously, poor communication is an everyday workplace occurrence, so if this is how you respond... And then there is general networking stuff- which is even mentioned in the email! He acknowledges he may one day be a client or partner, and yet still thinks sending this type of "cathartic" email is a good idea.
- mikecmpbll 11y ago
  I don't think it's unprofessional and I wouldn't want to work with anyone who did, so if that's the effect it has for some people, then it's self-fulfilling!
imroot 11y ago
RedHat was the worst when it came to this. In 2007, I interviewed for a professional services position within RedHat. I had a phone screen and then three or four weeks would go by, and then the recruiter would ask me for another phone screen. It eventually ended up with a stay in Chicago for an in-person...series of phone calls and one face-to-face interview. Another six months(!) went by before they called me to ask me if I would be interested in working with them and started the verbal negotiation process. Suffice to say, I turned them down (my work situation had changed and I wasn't looking to leave), but, I always remember that process and the length of time that it took to get there when I hear friends talking about applying to RedHat.
- rbanffy 11y ago
  Happened to me. By the time company A managed to get me through the second interview, I was receiving a phone call from the CEO congratulating me for my excellent interview cycle with company B. And, while I'm sure company A would be interesting, I loved my time at company B. And yes, they'll both remain anonymous.
rbanffy 11y ago
These guys: https://www.manager-tools.com/all-podcasts?field_content_domain_tid=5 https://www.manager-tools.com/all-podcasts?field_content_dom... have excellent advice for situations like these.
eli 11y ago
People I actually interview will be informed if they aren't hired, of course, but I don't generally email people I don't interview. I guess I could start adding all the email addresses of people I don't hire to a list and then sending them a generic message once a hire is made, but I'm not sure it's realistic to expect the hiring manager at a startup to respond to every single applicant. If you send me an email asking for an update or advice, I'll usually try to provide a useful answer. That said, I feel bad. If anyone has recommendations for candidate tracking software/services that would make it easier for me to make this happen, I'd be interested.
jeffool 11y ago
Isn't that the norm? My career history is journalism (producing TV news). The vast majority of jobs I apply for never reply. Not so much as an automated or form-letter "thank you". Even if they do reply, and we talk a couple of times, they stop replying when they go with someone else. Back in March, on a lark, I applied to a few tech and game companies. Five days ago one of the game companies sent me a "thank you for applying, but we went with another candidate" email. I sent her (the HR lady) a letter back thanking her for caring enough to bother. Erica is good people in my book. She's absolutely an outlier.
greggarious 11y ago
I think it also depends on how "cool" the company is. Obviously, this comment should be taken with a grain of salt since I was not selected (so I'm probably biased), but I felt like Google's hiring process was pretty haphazard. I had actually assumed I wouldn't be interviewing further when they told me about my on-site.
Corrado 11y ago
I have another suggestion. How about giving some real feedback on how a candidate performed on an interview? I realize that its almost impossible for companies to reveal what they really think of an interviewee but it would be immensely helpful for everyone involved. Was I really not qualified, or did you just not like my tie/cologne/hair? Did I know the material but am the wrong age? My whiteboard coding was great but I spilled my drink at lunch and ate with my mouth open? I realize that most (all) of these things could get a company in truly hot water (ie. age discrimination) but without some additional information a candidate can be left feeling very confused and unsure how to improve. If I'm really too old then maybe I should get out of the business. If I flubbed the algorithm part of the interview then maybe I can study up and be ready for the next company. I wish there was a way to give companies a one-time "Get out of jail Free" card and have them tell me exactly why they didn't want me to move on to the next step. :/

78 points by pauloteixeira 11y ago

Awesome! I have committed this sin myself. :(

The reason you don't get a reply (in the US anyways) is for legal reasons. If you say anything which could be even remotely (mis)interpreted as some sort of bias, your company could lose lots of money/time and potentially go bankrupt due to a discrimination lawsuit. It's sadly safer to just not reject candidates at all. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

gkop 11y ago
This is merely a convenient excuse for companies behaving inconsiderately. Since many companies in the U.S. do send rejection emails, it's clearly one of any number of other reasons why some companies neglect this basic courtesy. The silver lining is, you probably don't want to work for these companies anyway :)
- justizin 11y ago
  I have often found myself working _for_ people who had the same negative experiences at other companies, so not only do all bad hiring practices create negative reputation, they create an entire class of people who would be perfectly happy if you didn't exist at all. :)
  - gkop 11y ago
    On "Who is hiring", you can abstain from upvoting those companies where you had a negative experience (or even downvote them, if you feel that's justified).
    - Akkuma 11y ago
      I stated on the update about "Who is hiring" that there needs to be a way to track and review the interactions with these companies. Glassdoor doesn't really have a "these guys never bothered to reply to my job application" section. I just went and "reviewed" companies on "Who is hiring" as this community should try to promote those we'd recommend others try to apply and those we don't believe others should waste their time with. Eventually, we'd be left with only quality job postings.
- vdaniuk 11y ago
  >Since many companies in the U.S. do send rejection emails Are you able to provide any kind of data backing up that claim? I am strongly in the "don't hate the player, hate the game" camp on this issue. This is NOT a basic courtesy but a business process that requires a lot of resources to be at least somewhat meaningful. How long do you think it takes to write a rejection letter that provides useful, actionable data for the potential candidate? Multiply that by 10-100 for every position. Oh, and I've seen much more nasty replies and general insults than thank yous in response to rejection letters. I would be in support of rejection letters if the process would be mandated by the hiring platform / shared culture / etc.
  - reagency 11y ago
    Facebook gives candidate feedback.
  - gkop 11y ago
    Try applying for a position at a large company with a reputation for a highly-engineered hiring process, eg. Google [0]. Rarely will you get specific feedback, but you can expect to get a notification when you are no longer under consideration. [0] At Google's scale, some candidates fall through the cracks. But their recruiting process does mandate rejection notifications. It'd be great if a Google recruiter would back me up here :)
    - thaumasiotes 11y ago
      I interviewed at Google; they said they would give me a decision at some (soon) future point, and they did. They called me during work hours to do it... but they definitely did give me an explicit rejection.
  - ghaff 11y ago
    My impression is that rejection letters are fairly common but they're almost universally in the form letter "no fit at this time. Will keep on file" vein. Maybe some companies do more personalized responses but I've never seen it and I would think it would often be difficult. As with many other things, say picking talks for conferences, you're usually not so much rejecting as you're picking some other person or thing. And, yes, there are a lot of reasons the typical HR department would have issues with brutal honesty even aside from the effort it would take.
rbcgerard 11y ago
A simple "you are no longer being considered for the [x] position, thank you for your application" is all most people are looking for.
- binxbolling 11y ago
  Exactly! And modern HR tech makes rejection en masse so ridiculously easy. So if your company has an ATS that doesn't make it ridiculously easy to reject en masse with a boilerplate message, then you badly need to upgrade your ATS. (LEGO even sent me a nicely formatted, well-branded letter within 7 business days despite not even making it to the phone screen stage.)
- burger_moon 11y ago
  Yes this is all I want. I track all my applications and what stage I'm at with each company. It makes it incredibly difficult when they can't even be bothered to send me a generic rejection email.
- pauloteixeira 11y ago
  Exactly something so simple but so important!
uncletaco 11y ago
I'm pretty sure laziness would have more to do with not getting a proper rejection than the chance of triggering a lawsuit. If I'm applying to a small to medium sized business in my neck of the woods then nine times out of ten when I don't get a reply its because the hiring manager hasn't taken the time out of their week to get back to me. When I applied to a local company the hiring manager kept emailing me about how he was "swamped" or some other variation of the word busy and would get back to me in the next few days. He did that for about two weeks before calling me and finding out I had accepted an offer somewhere else. Heck when I applied to Google the recruiter (who contacted me first) took 5 months to get back to me after I sent in my CV and transcript, apologized profusely, and told me that the reason it took so long was because who ever was handling my case left abruptly without handing off the cases she was working on. I know these are anecdotal but I have an extremely hard time believing that HR managers in the US are so worried about triggering a discrimination lawsuit that they choose inaction. Very little, if anything, supports your claim. A quick search on the topic of why recruiters don't follow up with candidates reveals that the vast majority of people in the industry just have a really hard time with the hiring process. Its just plain broken. Does your company not get back to candidates because they fear a discrimination lawsuit? Someone else's? I would love to know which companies' HR teams or recruiters have discrimination lawsuits at the top of their "things I'm really scared could happen if I reply to a job seeker" list.
- Spooky23 11y ago
  Legal/compliance is a significant part of it. That rejection letter has zero upside to the employer and offers many opportunities to screw up. If a company has: a mature HR process, people who know wtf they are doing, and give a crap, they'll do rejection letters. Most lack at least one of those things. The guy at your SMB example is some jack of all trades, and dealing your resume is a priority-2 in a sea of P1's. He doesn't have a recruiting process. Google does, but even there it's still dependent on a human making a judgement call about what to write.
  - uncletaco 11y ago
    What you said about my resume being priority-2 in a sea of P1s is spot on in my opinion. However the OP's assertion about fearing a legal reprisal on the grounds of discrimination is farfetched to me. People don't just go around trying to sue people who send them nasty rejection letter. If the candidate could afford the legal fees then they probably wouldn't be looking for a job.
takeda 11y ago
As other said there are plenty of companies that do notify you, personally majority of companies that I applied to do that. I noticed though that my current company sometimes does it. It typically is when you did not do too well on an interview and effectively failed (or passed with flying colors but you are an international student, and they don't want to sponsor ), but they still won't notify in case they can't find anyone better. From my observation they generally never come back to those candidates.

Akkuma 11y ago

What is ironic is I had no reply on a job posting on landing.jobs after talking directly with landing.jobs too. I was able to leave feedback directly through the site that the company was unresponsive, but landing.jobs hasn't communicated since that feedback. Update: Proof http://imgur.com/m34rFUX http://imgur.com/m34rFUX

x5n1 11y ago
too meta man, too meta.
- joshka 11y ago
  Great superhero/villian name! Meta Man never solves the problem at hand. Instead he/she/it/they obliquely solve the generalized case. Meta Man Sees a mugger stealing cash from a victim, works on legislation to make BitCoin the default for all transactions.
  - notdanariely 11y ago
    You just made me spit coffee all over my keyboard, thanks for the chuckle! First, however, MetaMan will need to end the Hollywood accounting practice so better superhero movies can be made... about him!
  - jerf 11y ago
    JRPGS have had quite a few of those. "In my past, I suffered from $SOME_PAIN. It made me realize that the path to end pain was to END ALL LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE so there would be no more pain." Particularly hilarious if $SOME_PAIN fails to connect with you, so the villain from your point of view essentially leaps from "chosen last to play kickball" to "DESTROY EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE" (and on occasion "EVERYWHEN").
    - mcguire 11y ago
      You say that like it's a bad plan.

OedipusRex 11y ago

Would love to actually see someone's response to this.

Robadob 11y ago

I recall a friend ~12 months ago (in their final year of university), hearing positive news back from IBM after 6+ months of silence since their interview, by which point they had accepted a job elsewhere. I expect some companies prefer not to officially reject, so they have more applicants to potentially consider for future positions, although many may have taken jobs elsewhere by this point.

atirip 11y ago
I was once rejected by Spotify 6 months after i sent application in. No hard feelings, I just wonder who was that who waited that process out and got hired ;-)
- x1798DE 11y ago
  I have no experience on the hiring side of this, but I always assumed that a lot of companies prefer not to make any clear statements until after a decision is made, since at this point it's basically zero cost to defer making a first contact with someone. It's quite possible that the person who got the job applied 2 weeks before they hired him/her, went to the top of the "interview" pile, and soared through the process. Of course, it's also possible that someone did wait in the queue - I've been interviewing for jobs since the beginning of the year, some of which had almost no lag in contact but a fairly long process (multiple phone screens, etc), others had long lag time but a quick process.

dijit 11y ago

I've hired people before, and usually when it comes time to send rejection emails it can be very hard. If someone clearly isn't right for the job, you owe it to them to mention why- I'm an engineer, I work in absolutes and "Culture fit" or something so wishy-washy doesn't roll well off my fingers. But how do you tell people that they lack basic knowledge or experience in certain areas without sounding bitchy or attacking. Even worse is the ones that interviewed well, or showed significant competence.. yet were not as strong as another candidate. I agree it's wrong to send nothing- but it can be hard to formulate a pleasant email.. especially if you've interviewed many people. (10-15 at my last employment, I was replacing myself and had limited time to document/check everything).

intopieces 11y ago
>But how do you tell people that they lack basic knowledge or experience in certain areas without sounding bitchy or attacking. It frustrates me that you see it this way because it means when I give direct criticism to individuals I'm expected to bring in line via performance reviews, they get upset and take it personally. It also frustrates me because I'm surrounded by people who refuse to give me direct criticism of my work for fear that I will take it personally. Meanwhile, I'm trying to develop professionally...
- tomjen3 11y ago
  A solution to that might be some unofficial group that can critique others without having control of their job and/or code review.
reagency 11y ago
Don't worry about hurting their feelings. Think about helping them become a stronger candidate in the future.
tomjen3 11y ago
>But how do you tell people that they lack basic knowledge or experience in certain areas without sounding bitchy or attacking. We would have liked to work with you, but unfortunately we do not feel your skills in $AREA_OF_CONCERN are as strong as we require. Despite this rejection we wish you a happy job hunt and strongly encourage you to apply to $CORP in the future. If somebody was better, you say that outright. If the problem is culture fit? Well I really wouldn't write that in an email (too likely to make you come of as an ass, too likely to make you easy to sue if the person was a member of some minority).

rfrey 11y ago

Fun read! I'm having the opposite problem. I'm trying desperately to get people to apply for mobile dev positions... and of the FIVE applications I've managed to lure in, none of them replied to my phone calls or emails back. I was considering asking for an address in the application so I could go wait on applicants' doorsteps, but maybe a letter like this is a less litigable idea.

jakejake 11y ago
It is an employees market when it comes to developers at the moment. Developers are lured by interesting projects, flexible schedules, money, work environment, etc. so you just have to promote whatever of those you are able to offer.
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eli 11y ago
I frankly believe there are candidates applying for jobs based on the title and maybe skimming the ad, and then waiting for a response before considering if they actually want to work there.
- rfrey 11y ago
  You're probably right, and my responses probably could be improved. In which case I sympathize even more with job seekers who get silent rejections, and don't know what went wrong. :)

robalfonso 11y ago

While I agree that companies who go quiet are behaving poorly and would think ill of an applicant who was not responsive myself. My reaction reading the note was that its a bit long to send someone who already blew you off. I hope it makes the sender feel better, I don't think there is much else you are going to do. In this case reporting to the job site that they are unresponsive is probably better (though depending on the site and their rules it may do little as well)

jawns 11y ago

It sounds, based on the comments here, that both job seekers and employers can sometimes run into a frustrating lack of response (job seekers when they submit an application and never hear back; employers when they try to engage an applicant and never hear back). I wonder if there might be a business opportunity here. Suppose there were some way for both job applicants and employers to publicly commit themselves to offering at least a cursory reply (sort of how LinkedIn guarantees a response to each InMail, even if the response is just a boilerplate "Not interested"). If either party fails to respond within some designated timeframe, the penalty could be as simple as publicly noting the fact that they broke their commitment, which is likely to affect their trustworthiness. This would be advantageous for both parties. There might even be some decent money-making potential in being such a commitment clearinghouse. For instance, employers who participate might pay to have their jobs listed on the site, with the expectation that a "reply guaranteed" will be an effective way to bring in applicants.

JSeymourATL 11y ago
> I wonder if there might be a business opportunity here. There's an entire multi-billion dollar industry of executive search and staffing built on this premise. A commitment clearinghouse would threaten the existing schema of ambiguity. There are always outliers, new information, and change. There in lies the rub.

cwp 11y ago

This is funny, and probably very satisfying, but if you need to send this kind of email, you're doing it wrong. I get that other industries are different, but if you're looking for a job in the tech world, do your homework. To (a small amount of) background research on companies that would fit with your situation. Find out what the open reqs are, and who the hiring manager is for each one. Pre-screen yourself by finding a req that you're qualified for and apply specifically for that job. Write a custom cover letter for each application, even if it's just an informal 4-line email. If possible, get a warm introduction. If you do all that still don't get a quick response, move on without a second thought. You don't want to work for this company anyway.

rbanffy 11y ago
You can, on your introduction message or on the thank you note you send after a first interview, state you understand the hiring manager is a busy person and you will get back in touch on a specific timeframe. And then you get in touch on that specific time. If even this fails, you should fire the company - you really don't want to work there. As much as this is a fun read, unless you are applying for a job at The Onion, don't do it.

eggbrain 11y ago

My approach with TrueJob to solve this is allowing employers and job seekers to favorite or block almost anything about each other. Employers get back anonymous analytics as to how to improve their job postings, and job seekers get back anonymous analytics as to how to improve their resume. It seems to work pretty well so far, but there's a lot more to be done in the job space -- the lack of transparency and information can cause a lot of frustrations for both employers and job seekers.

peteboyd 11y ago

We are hiring right now for a new bookkeeper, actually they start Monday, so we just finalized the hiring. We regularly post ads for designers, developers and content writers too. Probably every other month I am reviewing resumes, so I have a bit of experience in responding to applicants. Typically any given job posting gets around 50 to 100 resumes depending on the category. It takes time to read through everything. We use a mix of Craiglist, Indeed, various job boards, LinkedIn and our own website postings. It has worked well for awhile now. Due to the nature of various job boards, some responses are often automated by clicking a few buttons so it is too easy to apply. With that you get candidates off topic (i.e. wrong skill set) and not putting in any effort (i.e. skipping a cover letter that we want to read). Other times, the cover letter and resume are comically sad in mistakes and grammar, so they do not warrant full attention. Our biggest gripe is that at least 50% of the applicants never follow our instructions on how to apply correctly. We put very specific steps on how to apply and want it followed (i.e. subject line, cover letter, links to portfolio, PDF resume). My take on this is if the applicant is not going to take the time to respond correctly, then we are not going to take the time to respond back. Sounds harsh, but kicking out 50 canned replies is tedious work for those who are wasting our time to review. Perhaps we could automate it somehow with scanning emails addresses in the "no" folder and sending out a batch bcc, but it is still extra work. However, before everyone jumps on us. We do respond to every applicant we interview (phone or in-person). Often we respond with a personal note that helps them out and lets them know where they stand. Sometimes we even try them out on freelance projects in the future. For every applicant that correctly fills out our application process, or at least made an effort, then we also reach out to them with a more automated message via email. I consider that the least we can do, but we do keep in short and sweet. Finally, in the future, I am going to probably put our entire application process on our website. This will automate a lot of what we do and require the applicant to fill out set fields that we need answered. Then we could send batch emails back to everyone as needed.

binxbolling 11y ago
Just curious, but what ATS are you using that makes sending 50 canned replies tedious?

ohitsdom 11y ago

I guess this is a joke, but all the comments so far seem to take this seriously. So let me say what is obvious to me- there are many legitimate reasons why you may have not heard back in a manner that seems timely to you. There are also bad reasons, such as disorganization and poor communication skills. But what message does an email like this send? "If you hire me, be prepared to deal with complaints about my professional behavior!" Seriously, poor communication is an everyday workplace occurrence, so if this is how you respond... And then there is general networking stuff- which is even mentioned in the email! He acknowledges he may one day be a client or partner, and yet still thinks sending this type of "cathartic" email is a good idea.

mikecmpbll 11y ago
I don't think it's unprofessional and I wouldn't want to work with anyone who did, so if that's the effect it has for some people, then it's self-fulfilling!

imroot 11y ago

RedHat was the worst when it came to this. In 2007, I interviewed for a professional services position within RedHat. I had a phone screen and then three or four weeks would go by, and then the recruiter would ask me for another phone screen. It eventually ended up with a stay in Chicago for an in-person...series of phone calls and one face-to-face interview. Another six months(!) went by before they called me to ask me if I would be interested in working with them and started the verbal negotiation process. Suffice to say, I turned them down (my work situation had changed and I wasn't looking to leave), but, I always remember that process and the length of time that it took to get there when I hear friends talking about applying to RedHat.

rbanffy 11y ago
Happened to me. By the time company A managed to get me through the second interview, I was receiving a phone call from the CEO congratulating me for my excellent interview cycle with company B. And, while I'm sure company A would be interesting, I loved my time at company B. And yes, they'll both remain anonymous.

rbanffy 11y ago

These guys: https://www.manager-tools.com/all-podcasts?field_content_domain_tid=5 https://www.manager-tools.com/all-podcasts?field_content_dom... have excellent advice for situations like these.

eli 11y ago

People I actually interview will be informed if they aren't hired, of course, but I don't generally email people I don't interview. I guess I could start adding all the email addresses of people I don't hire to a list and then sending them a generic message once a hire is made, but I'm not sure it's realistic to expect the hiring manager at a startup to respond to every single applicant. If you send me an email asking for an update or advice, I'll usually try to provide a useful answer. That said, I feel bad. If anyone has recommendations for candidate tracking software/services that would make it easier for me to make this happen, I'd be interested.

jeffool 11y ago

Isn't that the norm? My career history is journalism (producing TV news). The vast majority of jobs I apply for never reply. Not so much as an automated or form-letter "thank you". Even if they do reply, and we talk a couple of times, they stop replying when they go with someone else. Back in March, on a lark, I applied to a few tech and game companies. Five days ago one of the game companies sent me a "thank you for applying, but we went with another candidate" email. I sent her (the HR lady) a letter back thanking her for caring enough to bother. Erica is good people in my book. She's absolutely an outlier.

greggarious 11y ago

I think it also depends on how "cool" the company is. Obviously, this comment should be taken with a grain of salt since I was not selected (so I'm probably biased), but I felt like Google's hiring process was pretty haphazard. I had actually assumed I wouldn't be interviewing further when they told me about my on-site.

Corrado 11y ago

I have another suggestion. How about giving some real feedback on how a candidate performed on an interview? I realize that its almost impossible for companies to reveal what they really think of an interviewee but it would be immensely helpful for everyone involved. Was I really not qualified, or did you just not like my tie/cologne/hair? Did I know the material but am the wrong age? My whiteboard coding was great but I spilled my drink at lunch and ate with my mouth open? I realize that most (all) of these things could get a company in truly hot water (ie. age discrimination) but without some additional information a candidate can be left feeling very confused and unsure how to improve. If I'm really too old then maybe I should get out of the business. If I flubbed the algorithm part of the interview then maybe I can study up and be ready for the next company. I wish there was a way to give companies a one-time "Get out of jail Free" card and have them tell me exactly why they didn't want me to move on to the next step. :/