11 ms·

“We are only collecting the list of applications you have installed.”

349 points by some1else 11y ago

unclebucknasty 11y ago
"App graph". Something about that phrase makes it sound even sneakier, like an innocuous technical thing that has nothing to do with people. Nothing to see here. Just an app graph. I think I will build a social network where your profile pic is a split screen of your headshot and your exposed genitals. You will use your real name, home address, and cell phone number, and frequently upload your credit card statements. This way, we can all just get it over with already.
- kobybecker 11y ago
  Hah! That cracked me up
- A_COMPUTER 11y ago
  So basically just a frontend to Experian?
- oh_sigh 11y ago
  Yeah..how is it a graph? Isn't it just an unordered list of data points?
MereInterest 11y ago
That sounds rather scummy. Any time you are collecting information unrelated to your own application is inexcusable.
lxe 11y ago
I wonder if the Twitter app will also be removed from the Apple Store due to using "public APIs in a manner nor prescribed by Apple." Hint: it won't.
- TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
  Apple may not remove it, they'll just refuse updates.
jotux 11y ago
Apple should ban the app for this, right? http://danielamitay.com/blog/2015/5/29/shutting-down-a-500mm-requestsmonth-api http://danielamitay.com/blog/2015/5/29/shutting-down-a-500mm...
- BinaryIdiot 11y ago
  Unlikely considering they work closely with Apple on integration with Twitter. Double standard sure but I doubt Apple cares.
  - TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
    Apple's integration is independent of the Twitter app, though.
- cft 11y ago
  They are "too big to ban".
  - higherpurpose 11y ago
    It's sad how true that is. Reminds me of the early days when Apple would ban all "sexy" apps, except Playboy and such.
    - oh_sigh 11y ago
      Playboy has good articles...
- JohnTHaller 11y ago
  If Apple applied their rules evenly across publishers, they would.
- wlesieutre 11y ago
  I hope so!
- ajays 11y ago
icehawk 11y ago
"We will notify you about this feature being turned on for your account by showing a prompt letting you know that to help tailor your experience, Twitter uses the apps on your device. Until you see this prompt, this setting is turned off and we are not collecting a list of your apps. If you do not see Tailor Twitter based on my apps in your account settings, app graph collection is not occurring for your account."
RyJones 11y ago
I do not trust Twitter to do the right thing with the special level of trust Apple has granted them.
- btdollar 11y ago
  I agree. And I should have the option to refuse by removing app permissions.
- shit_parade2 11y ago
  btdollar it appears you've been hell banned. I really think this is a cruel waste of peoples time, and HN should strongly reconsider this method of moderation. EDIT: Down votes for telling someone they are hell banned? Pathetic.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - BlackJack 11y ago
    I didn't down vote, but it might be because it doesn't appear that btdollar is hell banned. I though hell ban = all their comments are dead, but it's plausible that his [dead] comments were just down voted.
  - oh_sigh 11y ago
    How would you know if someone else is hellbanned?
tacone 11y ago
Simply put: if you have to setup a help page like this, you probably shouldn't have added such feature first place.
brianstorms 11y ago
This is such bullshit. I refuse to use any app that does this kind of snooping. Twitter ought to be ashamed of itself.
staunch 11y ago
If the app checked what other apps were installed and used that data locally, no big deal. Calling home with private user data is evil.
- unclebucknasty 11y ago
  I'm trying to think of a scenario wherein an app would wholesale collect all other installed apps for local use. Querying for specific capability via the existence of an app or URL handler, maybe. But iterating all installed apps?
  - icebraining 11y ago
    Tasker (for Android) does, to let you choose one to launch automatically when something happens. But apart from automation and possibly "personal analytics", I don't remember any other use case.
JoshTriplett 11y ago
One more reason I'm glad I don't use the official Twitter app. I highly recommend Twidere.
suprgeek 11y ago
Notice how they casually slip in "..and occasionally updating". This means that Twitter now has a nice list of all apps on your Mobile via the malicious Twitter app that snoops on your phone. They get to then sell this info to advertisers so that they can tailor their "tweets" to you. And Twitter is a relatively good citizen as far as apps go. Just imagine what other apps who don't care where their next buck comes from are capable of...truly scary stuff.
- dm2 11y ago
  The worse problem is that even if you do research on the developers and owners of an app before allowing a permission that warrants a lot of trust, they can at any time be sold to a scummy company or data-mining agency who exploits the trusting user-base. This is exactly what happened to SourceForge.
stbullard 11y ago
The majority of Twitter's revenue comes from mobile ads, and app install ads are a major component of that major component. Knowing what apps you do or don't have installed allows them to better target app install ads, and I imagine that's the reason for collecting this data. So, if you don't have Clash of Clans installed, they can show you a Clash of Clans ad. If do you have Clash of Clans installed, they can then prompt you to reengage with it, or suggest other apps you're likely to install on the basis of your having shown an interest in games.
deepuj 11y ago
Please leave a comment on the app store. That is the only way these companies will learn to not snoop on their users: iOS - https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/twitter/id333903271?mt=8 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/twitter/id333903271?mt=8 Android - https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.twitter.android https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.twitter.an...
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
amluto 11y ago
Why do iOS and Android give apps this data in the first place? Mobile apps will invariably abuse any trust granted to them, so platforms should just stop granting any more trust than necessary.
- WhitneyLand 11y ago
  They don't explicitly provide it. Twitter uses a form of IPC built into iOS (canOpenUrl) to find out by brute force whether or not well known apps are installed. In other words if you just submitted mynewobscureapp to the AppStore, Twitter would not be able to detect it until they added your app to their targeted list.
  - __z 11y ago
    Sounds like the technique that uses CSS to "brute force" your browser history. http://davidwalsh.name/jquery-spyjax http://davidwalsh.name/jquery-spyjax
- qzervaas 11y ago
  They don't explicitly give it. You can define your own URL schemes, e.g. hackernews://, and the OS will tell you if a handler for that URL scheme is installed.
athenot 11y ago
Ironically, currently a few entries away from this article on HN, there's this one [1] about iHasApp that has shut down due to "using public APIs in a manner not prescribed by Apple". [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9625916 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9625916
- snowwrestler 11y ago
  That article links to this Twitter support page, which is undoubtedly why someone submitted this to HN.
wintom 11y ago
Just removed the Twitter app... Sorry Twitter but no thank you.
austenallred 11y ago
"You can opt out any time...three stages deep in the settings." What a cop out. That's provided because 99% will never even know it's there. It doesn't matter if it's technically an option. When your product is used by millions of people and updates automatically, the defaults matter.
- austinhutch 11y ago
  Not only that, I followed the instructions (on iOS) and there is no "Tailor Twitter based on my apps", only "Tailor ads based on info from ad partners".
thought_alarm 11y ago
> > What is Twitter using my app graph for? > Twitter is using your app graph to help build a more tailored experience for you on Twitter. No thanks. > Some examples of how we may use your graph data include: > - Improved “who to follow” suggestions that share similar interests No. > - Adding Tweets, accounts, or other content to your timeline that we think you'll find especially interesting Good lord, no. > - Showing you more relevant promoted content. Please, no.
- djent 11y ago
  Amazing they're doing all this trying to make their service "better," yet they continuously show me a feed of content I resent.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - noonespecial 11y ago
    They didn't say it was better for you. They're likely making it better for their customers. (Hint: if you're not paying them, you are not the customer). There's a big difference between a user and a customer. Users are the raw materials used to make the product that gets delivered to customers.
  - hoopd 11y ago
    I've noticed this with other services, apparently it's difficult to distinguish between "love thing X so much you share it" and "hate thing X so much you complain about it"
    - lmm 11y ago
      A lot of people seem to enjoy complaining. If you like posting this kind of thing to your friends, what's the difference?
  - JimDabell 11y ago
    > they continuously show me a feed of content I resent. Then why do you use Twitter at all?
cageface 11y ago
I removed Twitter and Facebook from my phone because I found them too distracting. Not having them snoop on what else is on my phone is just a bonus.
- aikah 11y ago
  to be fair the web apps work well. I did the same on my mobile, no more snooping. But i had to root my phone to remove Twitter and Facebook so everybody can't do that.
benguild 11y ago
This should be opt-in not opt-out.
kumarm 11y ago
Twitter really is a terrible: Refer to first comment in link below. In the name of providing open source tools to Developers, They are collecting Contact lists of app users that has their SDK's: http://www.reddit.com/r/androiddev/comments/37hx7y/twitter_just_open_sourced_twitter_kit_and_digits/crn9ivi http://www.reddit.com/r/androiddev/comments/37hx7y/twitter_j...
zxyzzxxx 11y ago
We've designed app graph to exclude apps that appear to be especially sensitive, such as ones dealing with your health, sexual orientation, or religious beliefs. I was alarmed until I read this. It is really nice of them to choose to keep our sensitive private information private. Thanks Twitter! ( Of course I completely trust Twitter to make the right decision on which apps are considered sensitive. )
- pushrax 11y ago
  The sarcasm is strong in this one. Hopefully.
- SilvaR 11y ago
  I feel sorry for the apps that are trying hard to fit in and "appear" unsensitive. They probably still get snooped. That must really hurt their feelings.
- SixSigma 11y ago
  Use MyFitnessPal get spammed with weight loss products
WhitneyLand 11y ago
This is how they do it: https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp The read me explains that Apple does not approve of this. Twitter should back off on this. The goodwill lost is not worth what they are getting here.
nkw 11y ago
Well that took about 2 seconds to delete..
fny 11y ago
Raise your hand if you feel like this is an unwarranted breach of privacy, but you have a gmail account and heavily depend on Google services. <ashamed>Raises own hand.</ashamed> I was so trusting and willing to give away my emails to Google when I was a kid (despite being fully aware of their intentions), but now, even though privacy infringements from all these other companies disturb me, I'm still a hypocritical sheep in Google's herd. Time to make some pretty heavy changes...
- dade_ 11y ago
  It takes planning and plenty of work, but I have almost completed migration to my own domain and away from gmail. I wish I had done it sooner, everyone needs to make their own place on the net. No need to be a serf.
  - innguest 11y ago
    Are you hosting your own email server?
    - ironsides 11y ago
      and if you are rolling your own are you having any issues with spf or spam flags?
      - spc476 11y ago
        I run my own email server [1] using Postfix. I use greylisting [2][3] and it easily stops 50% of all spam. I looked into adding SPF, but decided against it as the effective rate was too low [4]. I've also recently looked at RBL [5] and while there were a few false positives (enough that I decided against immediately adding it) what it did catch was quite impressive [6]. Oddly enough, if I simply drop email addressed to my domain registration email [7] that is NOT from my registrar, then the amount of spam I receive would drop about 70%. But frankly, with the greylisting, the spam that does get through is easy enough to deal with. And I'm the only person who uses my domain for email. [1] I started in the web hosting business in '96 or '97 so this is pretty much old hat for me. [2] Definition: http://projects.puremagic.com/greylisting/ http://projects.puremagic.com/greylisting/ [3] Software I use: http://www.x-grey.com/ http://www.x-grey.com/ [4] http://boston.conman.org/2015/04/12.1 http://boston.conman.org/2015/04/12.1 [5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNSBL http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNSBL [6] http://boston.conman.org/2015/05/11.1 http://boston.conman.org/2015/05/11.1 [7] Yeah, I don't bother with the privacy settings on the domain registration.
chris_wot 11y ago
Stick this in 140 characters: "Twitter has and always will suck, as a service and as a corporation". The medium is ridiculous, I really see it as the dumbing down of our society.
chasing 11y ago
What the fuck? Is it April Fools?
coupdejarnac 11y ago
My solution is to install as few apps as possible. Go to mobile website, from browser menu select "Add to Home Screen". I get fewer features that way but fewer distractions.
- robmiller 11y ago
  > I get fewer features that way but fewer distractions. Not necessarily. I use the Facebook web app because I'm not crippled from using Messenger as I am on their main app. Who needs the notifications anyway? And seriously, why does Facebook need to be a >30 MB download? It's just a frontend pulling from an API.
jamesmcq24 11y ago
Ugh! It's such a shame companies like Twitter do this shit. I'll admit, twitter and facebook provide useful services, they really do, but it's all this sneaky invasive stuff that makes me hate it all. I know you have to make money, but this kind of behavior is going to be their downfall.
ssddEErr 11y ago
Hehe, well yeah... thanks but no thanks. I mean at least they are honest about it, but when this option exists within the app, doesn't mean that they are not using it. Maybe they are just not giving you your "tailored" information but are still grifting your data.
abalone 11y ago
How does Twitter actually do this on iOS? Is it only apps that use Twitter logins? Are they using canOpenURL (I kind of doubt it)? sysctl()?
ing33k 11y ago
stopped using their native app few months ago , hope they won't remove their mobile web app . even if they do I will just spend more time on hacker news !
mschuster91 11y ago
And while making the UX of their Android app shittier and shittier, they block popular 3rd party clients. This time on the shitlist: tweecha (https://twitter.com/tweecha_en https://twitter.com/tweecha_en). Seriously, I like Twitter but the way they keep degrading the user experience, it's no wonder people leave en masse.
FlaceBook 11y ago
It amazes me that people are still dumb enough to install apps from any of the social networks.
flurp 11y ago
I see a lot of (rightfully) upset comments but this doesn't really come as a surprise to me given that Twitter (and others like FB, GOOG, ad networks) already track websites you visit. I know there are ways of blocking that but I would have a hard time believing that many (outside of HN readers) block that type of tracking.
adwn 11y ago
Upon reading this, this is the first thing that came to my mind: https://i.imgur.com/WiOMq.jpg https://i.imgur.com/WiOMq.jpg Now, how do we get people to pay for the services they use? Is that even desirable for us, the consumers?
panjaro 11y ago
What the F* is wrong these big money makers?
hellbanTHIS 11y ago
It's hilarious how these guys have spent billions looking for the lost city of targeted advertising and all they've done is invent new ways of scaring away customers. How about telling us what's on sale at nearby grocery or hardware stores?
overgard 11y ago
> If you’re not interested in a tailored experience you can adjust your preferences at any time I don't mean to nitpick language, but does this sound incredibly condescending to anyone else? They might as well have written "If you're a paranoid loser I guess you can have the shitty experience where we don't try to ham-fistedly guess at your interests" The funny thing is I think if they just didn't speak in idiotic PR-speak people probably wouldn't care. Sometimes I'm more annoyed that companies aren't just direct. The direct case isn't even that bad: "Hey, so we have to sell ads to make our business work and feed our families. It's better for you and the advertiser if we can try to give you ads that you might like so we can waste less of your time and the advertisers bandwidth. There's nothing in it for us to mess with your important private info, and a world of legal and PR downside. We're just asking to take a peek at your interests so we can guess at what you might like." You'd still be justified in saying "nope", but at least you'd feel like you were treated like not an idiot.
- userbinator 11y ago
  It sounds like pretty typical obfuscatory doublespeak to me. "tailored" really means "targeted" and "experience" is a word used so often that it has lost almost all meaning. The other words that evoke an almost visceral reaction of disgust for me are "offers" and "deals".
  - FlaceBook 11y ago
    It's a disruptive synergistic cloud experience!
    - TheOtherHobbes 11y ago
      You mean it's a disruptive synergistic cloud experience offer! There seems to be some kind of institutional mental illness that forces corps to think of users as exploitable prey who can be herded down a value-extracting marketing funnel, and not as people who want a service. It's disturbingly common, IME.
      - 11y ago
venomsnake 11y ago
Geee thanks twitter ... you can learn nothing for me from the fact that I have grindr installed /sarcasm
ciokan 11y ago
Android user? Just go to settings > applications and count how many times 'Google' appears in there. Twitter is a small child
Aoyagi 11y ago
Just out of curiosity, is there even something else in the "other" part of the Twitter client's settings, or is that just a typical obfuscation?
Rainymood 11y ago
I hate how this is opt-out instead of opt-in. I can see why they want to do this but it just feels kind of icky or something.
droithomme 11y ago
Only? I don't want Twitter to collect a list of applications I have installed. That is none of their business, massively violates my privacy, is an illegal practice in many countries, and constitutes a unique fingerprint.
ricardobeat 11y ago
I am using the latest iOS version and the setting to disable this is nowhere to find. This is fucked up.
frontsideair 11y ago
It's been said, but really, it should be opt-in rather than opt-out. If you really need this, just ask. If I'm feeling particularly nice that day, I might even allow it, but when I discover their mischief after they've done it, there's no way I'll be okay with it. If there's one good thing, they remove the data they've collected from you if you opt-out. (But it'll be already fed to the machine learning system, I guess.)
chippy 11y ago
Questions about using an older version. I no longer update my mobile apps. Twitter state: "On versions of Twitter for iOS before 6.19.1, the Tailor Twitter based on my apps setting may not display correctly. If you are impacted by this issue, please upgrade to the latest version of Twitter for iOS." Does this mean that it is disabled for those old versions? Does it mean that they will do it but users will not be able to disable it? Does it imply that the old apps are already sending this data to them? Or is it a ploy to get people to upgrade, and not upgrading could also be a way to remain more private?
endymi0n 11y ago
Ihasapp (2011): https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp/blob/master/README.md https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp/blob/master/README.m... Discussion here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8671080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8671080 Fun fact: Lots of major analytics SDKs read out your app list in this way (Android is even simpler). Your app list is already known to lots of 3rd parties if you have downloaded any of about 80% of the top 100 apps in the last 4 years.
brettcvz 11y ago
I would say it's safe to assume many, many apps do this. For anyone looking to tailor ads/recommendations to their users, the opportunity to peek at all the apps you have installed is too tempting to resist.

349 points by some1else 11y ago

"App graph". Something about that phrase makes it sound even sneakier, like an innocuous technical thing that has nothing to do with people. Nothing to see here. Just an app graph. I think I will build a social network where your profile pic is a split screen of your headshot and your exposed genitals. You will use your real name, home address, and cell phone number, and frequently upload your credit card statements. This way, we can all just get it over with already.

kobybecker 11y ago
Hah! That cracked me up
A_COMPUTER 11y ago
So basically just a frontend to Experian?
oh_sigh 11y ago
Yeah..how is it a graph? Isn't it just an unordered list of data points?

MereInterest 11y ago

That sounds rather scummy. Any time you are collecting information unrelated to your own application is inexcusable.

lxe 11y ago

I wonder if the Twitter app will also be removed from the Apple Store due to using "public APIs in a manner nor prescribed by Apple." Hint: it won't.

TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
Apple may not remove it, they'll just refuse updates.

jotux 11y ago

Apple should ban the app for this, right? http://danielamitay.com/blog/2015/5/29/shutting-down-a-500mm-requestsmonth-api http://danielamitay.com/blog/2015/5/29/shutting-down-a-500mm...

BinaryIdiot 11y ago
Unlikely considering they work closely with Apple on integration with Twitter. Double standard sure but I doubt Apple cares.
- TazeTSchnitzel 11y ago
  Apple's integration is independent of the Twitter app, though.
cft 11y ago
They are "too big to ban".
- higherpurpose 11y ago
  It's sad how true that is. Reminds me of the early days when Apple would ban all "sexy" apps, except Playboy and such.
  - oh_sigh 11y ago
    Playboy has good articles...
JohnTHaller 11y ago
If Apple applied their rules evenly across publishers, they would.
wlesieutre 11y ago
I hope so!
ajays 11y ago

icehawk 11y ago

"We will notify you about this feature being turned on for your account by showing a prompt letting you know that to help tailor your experience, Twitter uses the apps on your device. Until you see this prompt, this setting is turned off and we are not collecting a list of your apps. If you do not see Tailor Twitter based on my apps in your account settings, app graph collection is not occurring for your account."

RyJones 11y ago

I do not trust Twitter to do the right thing with the special level of trust Apple has granted them.

btdollar 11y ago
I agree. And I should have the option to refuse by removing app permissions.
shit_parade2 11y ago
btdollar it appears you've been hell banned. I really think this is a cruel waste of peoples time, and HN should strongly reconsider this method of moderation. EDIT: Down votes for telling someone they are hell banned? Pathetic.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- BlackJack 11y ago
  I didn't down vote, but it might be because it doesn't appear that btdollar is hell banned. I though hell ban = all their comments are dead, but it's plausible that his [dead] comments were just down voted.
- oh_sigh 11y ago
  How would you know if someone else is hellbanned?

tacone 11y ago

Simply put: if you have to setup a help page like this, you probably shouldn't have added such feature first place.

brianstorms 11y ago

This is such bullshit. I refuse to use any app that does this kind of snooping. Twitter ought to be ashamed of itself.

staunch 11y ago

If the app checked what other apps were installed and used that data locally, no big deal. Calling home with private user data is evil.

unclebucknasty 11y ago
I'm trying to think of a scenario wherein an app would wholesale collect all other installed apps for local use. Querying for specific capability via the existence of an app or URL handler, maybe. But iterating all installed apps?
- icebraining 11y ago
  Tasker (for Android) does, to let you choose one to launch automatically when something happens. But apart from automation and possibly "personal analytics", I don't remember any other use case.

JoshTriplett 11y ago

One more reason I'm glad I don't use the official Twitter app. I highly recommend Twidere.

suprgeek 11y ago

Notice how they casually slip in "..and occasionally updating". This means that Twitter now has a nice list of all apps on your Mobile via the malicious Twitter app that snoops on your phone. They get to then sell this info to advertisers so that they can tailor their "tweets" to you. And Twitter is a relatively good citizen as far as apps go. Just imagine what other apps who don't care where their next buck comes from are capable of...truly scary stuff.

dm2 11y ago
The worse problem is that even if you do research on the developers and owners of an app before allowing a permission that warrants a lot of trust, they can at any time be sold to a scummy company or data-mining agency who exploits the trusting user-base. This is exactly what happened to SourceForge.

stbullard 11y ago

The majority of Twitter's revenue comes from mobile ads, and app install ads are a major component of that major component. Knowing what apps you do or don't have installed allows them to better target app install ads, and I imagine that's the reason for collecting this data. So, if you don't have Clash of Clans installed, they can show you a Clash of Clans ad. If do you have Clash of Clans installed, they can then prompt you to reengage with it, or suggest other apps you're likely to install on the basis of your having shown an interest in games.

deepuj 11y ago

Please leave a comment on the app store. That is the only way these companies will learn to not snoop on their users: iOS - https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/twitter/id333903271?mt=8 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/twitter/id333903271?mt=8 Android - https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.twitter.android https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.twitter.an...

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

amluto 11y ago

Why do iOS and Android give apps this data in the first place? Mobile apps will invariably abuse any trust granted to them, so platforms should just stop granting any more trust than necessary.

WhitneyLand 11y ago
They don't explicitly provide it. Twitter uses a form of IPC built into iOS (canOpenUrl) to find out by brute force whether or not well known apps are installed. In other words if you just submitted mynewobscureapp to the AppStore, Twitter would not be able to detect it until they added your app to their targeted list.
- __z 11y ago
  Sounds like the technique that uses CSS to "brute force" your browser history. http://davidwalsh.name/jquery-spyjax http://davidwalsh.name/jquery-spyjax
qzervaas 11y ago
They don't explicitly give it. You can define your own URL schemes, e.g. hackernews://, and the OS will tell you if a handler for that URL scheme is installed.

athenot 11y ago

Ironically, currently a few entries away from this article on HN, there's this one [1] about iHasApp that has shut down due to "using public APIs in a manner not prescribed by Apple". [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9625916 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9625916

snowwrestler 11y ago
That article links to this Twitter support page, which is undoubtedly why someone submitted this to HN.

wintom 11y ago

Just removed the Twitter app... Sorry Twitter but no thank you.

austenallred 11y ago

"You can opt out any time...three stages deep in the settings." What a cop out. That's provided because 99% will never even know it's there. It doesn't matter if it's technically an option. When your product is used by millions of people and updates automatically, the defaults matter.

austinhutch 11y ago
Not only that, I followed the instructions (on iOS) and there is no "Tailor Twitter based on my apps", only "Tailor ads based on info from ad partners".

thought_alarm 11y ago

> > What is Twitter using my app graph for? > Twitter is using your app graph to help build a more tailored experience for you on Twitter. No thanks. > Some examples of how we may use your graph data include: > - Improved “who to follow” suggestions that share similar interests No. > - Adding Tweets, accounts, or other content to your timeline that we think you'll find especially interesting Good lord, no. > - Showing you more relevant promoted content. Please, no.

djent 11y ago
Amazing they're doing all this trying to make their service "better," yet they continuously show me a feed of content I resent.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- noonespecial 11y ago
  They didn't say it was better for you. They're likely making it better for their customers. (Hint: if you're not paying them, you are not the customer). There's a big difference between a user and a customer. Users are the raw materials used to make the product that gets delivered to customers.
- hoopd 11y ago
  I've noticed this with other services, apparently it's difficult to distinguish between "love thing X so much you share it" and "hate thing X so much you complain about it"
  - lmm 11y ago
    A lot of people seem to enjoy complaining. If you like posting this kind of thing to your friends, what's the difference?
- JimDabell 11y ago
  > they continuously show me a feed of content I resent. Then why do you use Twitter at all?

cageface 11y ago

I removed Twitter and Facebook from my phone because I found them too distracting. Not having them snoop on what else is on my phone is just a bonus.

aikah 11y ago
to be fair the web apps work well. I did the same on my mobile, no more snooping. But i had to root my phone to remove Twitter and Facebook so everybody can't do that.

benguild 11y ago

This should be opt-in not opt-out.

kumarm 11y ago

Twitter really is a terrible: Refer to first comment in link below. In the name of providing open source tools to Developers, They are collecting Contact lists of app users that has their SDK's: http://www.reddit.com/r/androiddev/comments/37hx7y/twitter_just_open_sourced_twitter_kit_and_digits/crn9ivi http://www.reddit.com/r/androiddev/comments/37hx7y/twitter_j...

zxyzzxxx 11y ago

We've designed app graph to exclude apps that appear to be especially sensitive, such as ones dealing with your health, sexual orientation, or religious beliefs. I was alarmed until I read this. It is really nice of them to choose to keep our sensitive private information private. Thanks Twitter! ( Of course I completely trust Twitter to make the right decision on which apps are considered sensitive. )

pushrax 11y ago
The sarcasm is strong in this one. Hopefully.
SilvaR 11y ago
I feel sorry for the apps that are trying hard to fit in and "appear" unsensitive. They probably still get snooped. That must really hurt their feelings.
SixSigma 11y ago
Use MyFitnessPal get spammed with weight loss products

WhitneyLand 11y ago

This is how they do it: https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp The read me explains that Apple does not approve of this. Twitter should back off on this. The goodwill lost is not worth what they are getting here.

nkw 11y ago

Well that took about 2 seconds to delete..

fny 11y ago

Raise your hand if you feel like this is an unwarranted breach of privacy, but you have a gmail account and heavily depend on Google services. <ashamed>Raises own hand.</ashamed> I was so trusting and willing to give away my emails to Google when I was a kid (despite being fully aware of their intentions), but now, even though privacy infringements from all these other companies disturb me, I'm still a hypocritical sheep in Google's herd. Time to make some pretty heavy changes...

dade_ 11y ago
It takes planning and plenty of work, but I have almost completed migration to my own domain and away from gmail. I wish I had done it sooner, everyone needs to make their own place on the net. No need to be a serf.
- innguest 11y ago
  Are you hosting your own email server?
  - ironsides 11y ago
    and if you are rolling your own are you having any issues with spf or spam flags?
    - spc476 11y ago
      I run my own email server [1] using Postfix. I use greylisting [2][3] and it easily stops 50% of all spam. I looked into adding SPF, but decided against it as the effective rate was too low [4]. I've also recently looked at RBL [5] and while there were a few false positives (enough that I decided against immediately adding it) what it did catch was quite impressive [6]. Oddly enough, if I simply drop email addressed to my domain registration email [7] that is NOT from my registrar, then the amount of spam I receive would drop about 70%. But frankly, with the greylisting, the spam that does get through is easy enough to deal with. And I'm the only person who uses my domain for email. [1] I started in the web hosting business in '96 or '97 so this is pretty much old hat for me. [2] Definition: http://projects.puremagic.com/greylisting/ http://projects.puremagic.com/greylisting/ [3] Software I use: http://www.x-grey.com/ http://www.x-grey.com/ [4] http://boston.conman.org/2015/04/12.1 http://boston.conman.org/2015/04/12.1 [5] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNSBL http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNSBL [6] http://boston.conman.org/2015/05/11.1 http://boston.conman.org/2015/05/11.1 [7] Yeah, I don't bother with the privacy settings on the domain registration.

chris_wot 11y ago

Stick this in 140 characters: "Twitter has and always will suck, as a service and as a corporation". The medium is ridiculous, I really see it as the dumbing down of our society.

chasing 11y ago

What the fuck? Is it April Fools?

coupdejarnac 11y ago

My solution is to install as few apps as possible. Go to mobile website, from browser menu select "Add to Home Screen". I get fewer features that way but fewer distractions.

robmiller 11y ago
> I get fewer features that way but fewer distractions. Not necessarily. I use the Facebook web app because I'm not crippled from using Messenger as I am on their main app. Who needs the notifications anyway? And seriously, why does Facebook need to be a >30 MB download? It's just a frontend pulling from an API.

jamesmcq24 11y ago

Ugh! It's such a shame companies like Twitter do this shit. I'll admit, twitter and facebook provide useful services, they really do, but it's all this sneaky invasive stuff that makes me hate it all. I know you have to make money, but this kind of behavior is going to be their downfall.

ssddEErr 11y ago

Hehe, well yeah... thanks but no thanks. I mean at least they are honest about it, but when this option exists within the app, doesn't mean that they are not using it. Maybe they are just not giving you your "tailored" information but are still grifting your data.

abalone 11y ago

How does Twitter actually do this on iOS? Is it only apps that use Twitter logins? Are they using canOpenURL (I kind of doubt it)? sysctl()?

ing33k 11y ago

stopped using their native app few months ago , hope they won't remove their mobile web app . even if they do I will just spend more time on hacker news !

mschuster91 11y ago

And while making the UX of their Android app shittier and shittier, they block popular 3rd party clients. This time on the shitlist: tweecha (https://twitter.com/tweecha_en https://twitter.com/tweecha_en). Seriously, I like Twitter but the way they keep degrading the user experience, it's no wonder people leave en masse.

FlaceBook 11y ago

It amazes me that people are still dumb enough to install apps from any of the social networks.

flurp 11y ago

I see a lot of (rightfully) upset comments but this doesn't really come as a surprise to me given that Twitter (and others like FB, GOOG, ad networks) already track websites you visit. I know there are ways of blocking that but I would have a hard time believing that many (outside of HN readers) block that type of tracking.

adwn 11y ago

Upon reading this, this is the first thing that came to my mind: https://i.imgur.com/WiOMq.jpg https://i.imgur.com/WiOMq.jpg Now, how do we get people to pay for the services they use? Is that even desirable for us, the consumers?

panjaro 11y ago

What the F* is wrong these big money makers?

hellbanTHIS 11y ago

It's hilarious how these guys have spent billions looking for the lost city of targeted advertising and all they've done is invent new ways of scaring away customers. How about telling us what's on sale at nearby grocery or hardware stores?

overgard 11y ago

> If you’re not interested in a tailored experience you can adjust your preferences at any time I don't mean to nitpick language, but does this sound incredibly condescending to anyone else? They might as well have written "If you're a paranoid loser I guess you can have the shitty experience where we don't try to ham-fistedly guess at your interests" The funny thing is I think if they just didn't speak in idiotic PR-speak people probably wouldn't care. Sometimes I'm more annoyed that companies aren't just direct. The direct case isn't even that bad: "Hey, so we have to sell ads to make our business work and feed our families. It's better for you and the advertiser if we can try to give you ads that you might like so we can waste less of your time and the advertisers bandwidth. There's nothing in it for us to mess with your important private info, and a world of legal and PR downside. We're just asking to take a peek at your interests so we can guess at what you might like." You'd still be justified in saying "nope", but at least you'd feel like you were treated like not an idiot.

userbinator 11y ago
It sounds like pretty typical obfuscatory doublespeak to me. "tailored" really means "targeted" and "experience" is a word used so often that it has lost almost all meaning. The other words that evoke an almost visceral reaction of disgust for me are "offers" and "deals".
- FlaceBook 11y ago
  It's a disruptive synergistic cloud experience!
  - TheOtherHobbes 11y ago
    You mean it's a disruptive synergistic cloud experience offer! There seems to be some kind of institutional mental illness that forces corps to think of users as exploitable prey who can be herded down a value-extracting marketing funnel, and not as people who want a service. It's disturbingly common, IME.
    - 11y ago

venomsnake 11y ago

Geee thanks twitter ... you can learn nothing for me from the fact that I have grindr installed /sarcasm

ciokan 11y ago

Android user? Just go to settings > applications and count how many times 'Google' appears in there. Twitter is a small child

Aoyagi 11y ago

Just out of curiosity, is there even something else in the "other" part of the Twitter client's settings, or is that just a typical obfuscation?

Rainymood 11y ago

I hate how this is opt-out instead of opt-in. I can see why they want to do this but it just feels kind of icky or something.

droithomme 11y ago

Only? I don't want Twitter to collect a list of applications I have installed. That is none of their business, massively violates my privacy, is an illegal practice in many countries, and constitutes a unique fingerprint.

ricardobeat 11y ago

I am using the latest iOS version and the setting to disable this is nowhere to find. This is fucked up.

frontsideair 11y ago

It's been said, but really, it should be opt-in rather than opt-out. If you really need this, just ask. If I'm feeling particularly nice that day, I might even allow it, but when I discover their mischief after they've done it, there's no way I'll be okay with it. If there's one good thing, they remove the data they've collected from you if you opt-out. (But it'll be already fed to the machine learning system, I guess.)

chippy 11y ago

Questions about using an older version. I no longer update my mobile apps. Twitter state: "On versions of Twitter for iOS before 6.19.1, the Tailor Twitter based on my apps setting may not display correctly. If you are impacted by this issue, please upgrade to the latest version of Twitter for iOS." Does this mean that it is disabled for those old versions? Does it mean that they will do it but users will not be able to disable it? Does it imply that the old apps are already sending this data to them? Or is it a ploy to get people to upgrade, and not upgrading could also be a way to remain more private?

endymi0n 11y ago

Ihasapp (2011): https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp/blob/master/README.md https://github.com/danielamitay/iHasApp/blob/master/README.m... Discussion here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8671080 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8671080 Fun fact: Lots of major analytics SDKs read out your app list in this way (Android is even simpler). Your app list is already known to lots of 3rd parties if you have downloaded any of about 80% of the top 100 apps in the last 4 years.

brettcvz 11y ago

I would say it's safe to assume many, many apps do this. For anyone looking to tailor ads/recommendations to their users, the opportunity to peek at all the apps you have installed is too tempting to resist.