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Apple MacBook Review: The Laptop of the Future Isn’t Ready for the Present

44 points by nikunjk 12y ago

newaccountfool 12y ago
Useless.
adamnicholas 12y ago
I just bought a new MBP at the same time that these came out and I couldn't think of a single reason other than "it's shiny" to even consider getting the new MacBook. The 13" MBP is still plenty light, but is a lot more powerful.
- nfoz 12y ago
  One would fit comfortably in a purse, the other would not.
  - aetherson 12y ago
    Would it? Maybe quite a large purse. But it's got a 12" screen. The purses my wife carries could not fit a 10" iPad, much less a MacBook -- and my wife isn't running with a clutch or anything.
    - nfoz 12y ago
      Aye, maybe "clutch" is what I'm thinking of. I really think that the difference between 2lbs and 3.5lbs is really what makes the difference for this use-case, as well as the smaller size.
      - aetherson 12y ago
        Clutch is actually the small purse, not the large one. My general understanding is that purses are kind of informally and loosely divided into: Clutches, which are the size of a large woman's wallet -- or a small woman's wallet for that matter. They basically can hold your keys, a credit card, your phone, and maybe some lipstick, and that's about it. Women carry clutches in places where style is more important than functionality, and they go with, like, cocktail dresses and such. Generic purses, which are maybe twice to three times the size of a clutch, and generally speaking a woman can comfortably put her wallet in there, enough make-up to handle at least an ordinary day in the office, her keys, her phone, and then at least a small amount of additional miscellany. My wife's larger purses will hold a netbook but not a notebook computer. Totes or messengers, which are typically larger than a normal purse, and might plausibly carry a standard-sized laptop. (My wife, who is small, doesn't carry any purses this size -- she'll use a cloth shopping bag if she needs to carry things this size). My sense is that they are regarded as less fashionable. You might see them referred to as "mom bags," since mothers with small children often carry larger purses than usual. Doing a bit of research for this post, I have discovered that descriptors that I thought were purely about size are also to do with other factors such as whether the purse has internal subdivisions and/or its strap or shape styles. So some people might use these terms differently.
        ChristianBundy 12y ago
        Comments like this are the reason I love Hacker News.
  - ericras 12y ago
    I don't think this necessarily needs to be downvoted. It's pretty clear the new Macbook trades usefulness for portability and style - and is partly aimed at the masses as a fashion accessory.
- MatthiasP 12y ago
  If you have to carry around your laptop in a messenger bag all day, going from 1.6kg to 0.9kg makes a huge difference.
27182818284 12y ago
For those worried by the lack of ports, check around a university or coffee shop and nobody is using multiple ports at once. They are using 1. Maybe headphones 2. Maybe charging (but usually not as battery life has increased so much) An engineer or pro-sumer might be sad they can't have 3 items plugged in at once, but I think Apple sees what I see in that weight and battery life are more important than number of ports.
- Navarr 12y ago
  My girlfriend has a fitbit dongle plugged into her macbook, and may occasionally need to plug in a mouse (i don't remember if it's bluetooth, but mouse makers hate using BT so probably not). With this in mind, she'd also want to charge and a single port is dreadful for that. She's no programmer, not even close to technically inclined. Just a normal student studying to become a teacher. A teacher would want a laptop lightweight like this, but when they need to plug in a mouse, maybe a printer? plug it into the projector, into the power because they're low on battery, possibly plug in a usb dongle for a powerpoint remote control... Well, that's a bit more than a single port (Albeit, obviously personalized for a single type of job). Multiple ports are much more important than you're giving them credit for. If it's around the end of day at that coffee shop, some of those people might be plugging their phone into their laptop, too.
  - yequalsx 12y ago
    I'm a teacher and I can't remember the last time I needed more than one port. Printing is always done over a network at my college. I haven't plugged in a printer in at least 10 years. I never liked trackpads until I used Apple's trackpad. Now the only time I use a mouse is for gaming. Once the Macbook gets more powerful I will definitely be buying one.
  - Mister_Snuggles 12y ago
    I wish Bluetooth mice would become more common. Microsoft makes Bluetooth mice and they work just fine with my MacBook Pro. I hate the idea that a single-purpose (or dual-purpose if you get a keyboard and mouse with one receiver) dongle is needed when my computer has perfectly good wireless technology already built in.
strictnein 12y ago
I just can't understand the reasoning behind only one USB Type C port.
- pacomerh 12y ago
  Well, the use case for this laptop is for portability. Why would you need a million ports if you're gonna be traveling or at the coffee shop?. The only time I use an additional port is to charge my iphone, and I could easily do that with the wall charger. This is not a work laptop
  - outworlder 12y ago
    And, if the iPhones eventually get a type-C as well (and there's a high probability), you'll be able to feed up to 100W to it, according to the specifications. Also by the specs, it could even work backwards, in theory.
  - jkubicek 12y ago
    Except for the processor speed, this could easily be my work laptop. I would prefer having only one thing to plug-in at my desk, as opposed to the power / USB hub / monitor setup that I currently have. Even with an Apple Thunderbolt monitor I would still have 2 things to plug in. At all other points in the day I'm running on battery power, so I don't need any ports.
  - thinkmassive 12y ago
    Maybe not a million, but TWO is far more reasonable than one. Here is a brief list of wired accessories likely to be used at least 2 at a time: headphones, mouse, flash drive, mobile device.
  - baddox 12y ago
    Still, why not two USB-C ports, like some of the recent comparable Windows laptop designs?
- yequalsx 12y ago
  I can't remember the last time I had more than one port in use. With battery life as good as it is in modern laptops one port is all I need. I like that there is no fan in Macbook and it is thin and highly portable. By the time my Retina Macbook Pro dies I think the Macbook will have a powerful enough processor and enough ram for my needs. At that time I will get a Macbook. I like that there is only one port and that I don't have to fiddle with getting the connector the right side up to plug it into the port. My only concern regarding the Macbook is the new touchpad. Does it allow click and hold for copying/pasting text? This wasn't clear to me from the videos I've seen. I'm guessing that these will replace the Macbook Air in a couple of years.
adminprof 12y ago
The most disappointing thing to be is they used a lower quality 480p webcam. So many people use Skype or Google Hangouts that a high resolution webcam is a must.
sterl 12y ago
Charging and mouse for me. I suppose I can use a wireless mouse but all the ones I've tried that don't have a usb dongle seem so jumpy. Bluetooth doesn't seem ready for that frequency yet.
- EC1 12y ago
  I agree on the mouse part, but I've found an external trackpad works fantastically well.
- Mister_Snuggles 12y ago
  What sort of issues do you notice? I've been using Bluetooth mice for a long time and have never experienced any jumpiness. Currently I'm using a Microsoft mouse, but I used a Logitech one before (they seem to have given up on Bluetooth though). Neither has given me any issues on my MacBook Pro.
  - TheLoneWolfling 12y ago
    I know, it's frustrating. I want a Bluetooth version of Logitech's M570.
- pat2man 12y ago
  I've been using bluetooth mice for years. No issues.
- yellowapple 12y ago
  If the world could standardize on Logitech's wireless keyboard/mouse stuff, I'd be pretty happy. I've pretty much stuck to Logitech exclusively lately for my mice (I'm particularly fond of the M570, having been a fan of the similar Trackman Wheel), and I have several K570s (one Mac model for work, plus a couple others, including one in my living room for me to control an entertainment-center PC from my couch / coffee table). I've found Logitech's implementation to - for whatever reason - be the best implementation of wireless peripheral communication I've ever encountered. No problems, no jumpiness, no nothing. It can't be that hard to build the equivalent to their dongle directly into, say, a laptop or tablet, can it?
serve_yay 12y ago
I agree that it looks somewhat underpowered currently. Worth remembering that this was also the case with the Macbook Air when it launched.
- MBCook 12y ago
  I don't find that too surprising but the battery life being so below what Apple says and other models is very odd.
  - higherpurpose 12y ago
    Overheating. Intel is lying about what is necessary to keep Core-M at 5W TDP. The vast majority of Core-M devices out there will overheat because of that, which means they'll throttle and kill the battery faster, too.
    - epmatsw 12y ago
      Why would throttling kill the battery faster? If anything, wouldn't that extend battery life?
outworlder 12y ago
"No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame." Edit: added quotes.
- diminoten 12y ago
  No wireless? It's got a wireless network card...
  - Pxtl 12y ago
    That's a reference to CmdrTaco's review of the original iPod.
    - diminoten 12y ago
      Oh! Second time in as many days that's been a reference I've missed. The specs on the MacBook look marginally worse than the Macbook Air, though. Just confusing to me, why I'd buy this one and not the Air...
      - tstrimple 12y ago
        Pixels.
higherpurpose 12y ago
Core-M/Broadwell-Y is a dud, just like all previous Y-series chips before it. Intel is trying too hard to get the ultra-low power. And because of that it ends up with chips that are less powerful than what is needed for mainstream tasks, as well as too expensive (even compared to a Core i5). You're much better off with a 15W Core i5 than a 5W Core-M, no matter the scenario - with one possible exception: if you really, really want a $1,000 slim "tablet". But you better not want it for something like Photoshop or anything heavy like that. Just for other mobile tasks that you could just as well use your $500 iPad for.
- Synaesthesia 12y ago
  Of course it's not a heavy lifter. It's actually faster than my Macbook Air 2011, which holds up pretty well for my usage. Compared to an iPad, with 8gb RAM and a much faster CPU, as well as a full OS, it's really much more powerful.
pbreit 12y ago
I welcome the port situation (Apple has rarely been wrong on this front). But the battery life and performance sound like concerns.
jonathankoren 12y ago
The lack of ports don't bother me. Yet another cable incompatible cable bothers me. Yet another dongle bothers me. Lack of magsafe is really bothers me. Magsafe was a step forward. Why go back?
ucha 12y ago
I care a lot about battery life benchmarks because, well, that's what a laptop is for: not being constantly plugged. I'm always disappointed when I see "with all the laptops set to comparable brightness (around 75 percent)" instead of all laptops set to the same luminance. It's like comparing mileage for cars while pressing the accelerator pedal at 75%.
- npunt 12y ago
  +1. Masterful. TIL. Totally breezed by that line and didn't think about the difference. My pet peeve in reviews is related - color comparisons sound like people talking about wine (colors are rich and come off the screen and the like). Lots of reviews say this about phones or notebooks that have ridiculously awful DeltaE / calibration.
ja27 12y ago
Where can I plug in my ADB keyboard and SCSI drives?
davidy123 12y ago
I'm considering getting the Macbook 2015 as a travel complement to my 15.6" i5 Thinkpad, which runs Ubuntu. I need to do a bit of Apple testing so it would fulfill two uses. But would it be too frustrating for occasional Web-focused software dev? I generally have Chrome loaded with a few tabs, a terminal or two, a database, and the Atom editor, working with a Node stack. I've never really used a Mac before so it's not clear how much overhead the OS has and how it will perform with this CPU.

44 points by nikunjk 12y ago

Useless.

I just bought a new MBP at the same time that these came out and I couldn't think of a single reason other than "it's shiny" to even consider getting the new MacBook. The 13" MBP is still plenty light, but is a lot more powerful.

nfoz 12y ago
One would fit comfortably in a purse, the other would not.
- aetherson 12y ago
  Would it? Maybe quite a large purse. But it's got a 12" screen. The purses my wife carries could not fit a 10" iPad, much less a MacBook -- and my wife isn't running with a clutch or anything.
  - nfoz 12y ago
    Aye, maybe "clutch" is what I'm thinking of. I really think that the difference between 2lbs and 3.5lbs is really what makes the difference for this use-case, as well as the smaller size.
    - aetherson 12y ago
      Clutch is actually the small purse, not the large one. My general understanding is that purses are kind of informally and loosely divided into: Clutches, which are the size of a large woman's wallet -- or a small woman's wallet for that matter. They basically can hold your keys, a credit card, your phone, and maybe some lipstick, and that's about it. Women carry clutches in places where style is more important than functionality, and they go with, like, cocktail dresses and such. Generic purses, which are maybe twice to three times the size of a clutch, and generally speaking a woman can comfortably put her wallet in there, enough make-up to handle at least an ordinary day in the office, her keys, her phone, and then at least a small amount of additional miscellany. My wife's larger purses will hold a netbook but not a notebook computer. Totes or messengers, which are typically larger than a normal purse, and might plausibly carry a standard-sized laptop. (My wife, who is small, doesn't carry any purses this size -- she'll use a cloth shopping bag if she needs to carry things this size). My sense is that they are regarded as less fashionable. You might see them referred to as "mom bags," since mothers with small children often carry larger purses than usual. Doing a bit of research for this post, I have discovered that descriptors that I thought were purely about size are also to do with other factors such as whether the purse has internal subdivisions and/or its strap or shape styles. So some people might use these terms differently.
      - ChristianBundy 12y ago
        Comments like this are the reason I love Hacker News.
- ericras 12y ago
  I don't think this necessarily needs to be downvoted. It's pretty clear the new Macbook trades usefulness for portability and style - and is partly aimed at the masses as a fashion accessory.
MatthiasP 12y ago
If you have to carry around your laptop in a messenger bag all day, going from 1.6kg to 0.9kg makes a huge difference.

27182818284 12y ago

For those worried by the lack of ports, check around a university or coffee shop and nobody is using multiple ports at once. They are using 1. Maybe headphones 2. Maybe charging (but usually not as battery life has increased so much) An engineer or pro-sumer might be sad they can't have 3 items plugged in at once, but I think Apple sees what I see in that weight and battery life are more important than number of ports.

Navarr 12y ago
My girlfriend has a fitbit dongle plugged into her macbook, and may occasionally need to plug in a mouse (i don't remember if it's bluetooth, but mouse makers hate using BT so probably not). With this in mind, she'd also want to charge and a single port is dreadful for that. She's no programmer, not even close to technically inclined. Just a normal student studying to become a teacher. A teacher would want a laptop lightweight like this, but when they need to plug in a mouse, maybe a printer? plug it into the projector, into the power because they're low on battery, possibly plug in a usb dongle for a powerpoint remote control... Well, that's a bit more than a single port (Albeit, obviously personalized for a single type of job). Multiple ports are much more important than you're giving them credit for. If it's around the end of day at that coffee shop, some of those people might be plugging their phone into their laptop, too.
- yequalsx 12y ago
  I'm a teacher and I can't remember the last time I needed more than one port. Printing is always done over a network at my college. I haven't plugged in a printer in at least 10 years. I never liked trackpads until I used Apple's trackpad. Now the only time I use a mouse is for gaming. Once the Macbook gets more powerful I will definitely be buying one.
- Mister_Snuggles 12y ago
  I wish Bluetooth mice would become more common. Microsoft makes Bluetooth mice and they work just fine with my MacBook Pro. I hate the idea that a single-purpose (or dual-purpose if you get a keyboard and mouse with one receiver) dongle is needed when my computer has perfectly good wireless technology already built in.

strictnein 12y ago

I just can't understand the reasoning behind only one USB Type C port.

pacomerh 12y ago
Well, the use case for this laptop is for portability. Why would you need a million ports if you're gonna be traveling or at the coffee shop?. The only time I use an additional port is to charge my iphone, and I could easily do that with the wall charger. This is not a work laptop
- outworlder 12y ago
  And, if the iPhones eventually get a type-C as well (and there's a high probability), you'll be able to feed up to 100W to it, according to the specifications. Also by the specs, it could even work backwards, in theory.
- jkubicek 12y ago
  Except for the processor speed, this could easily be my work laptop. I would prefer having only one thing to plug-in at my desk, as opposed to the power / USB hub / monitor setup that I currently have. Even with an Apple Thunderbolt monitor I would still have 2 things to plug in. At all other points in the day I'm running on battery power, so I don't need any ports.
- thinkmassive 12y ago
  Maybe not a million, but TWO is far more reasonable than one. Here is a brief list of wired accessories likely to be used at least 2 at a time: headphones, mouse, flash drive, mobile device.
- baddox 12y ago
  Still, why not two USB-C ports, like some of the recent comparable Windows laptop designs?
yequalsx 12y ago
I can't remember the last time I had more than one port in use. With battery life as good as it is in modern laptops one port is all I need. I like that there is no fan in Macbook and it is thin and highly portable. By the time my Retina Macbook Pro dies I think the Macbook will have a powerful enough processor and enough ram for my needs. At that time I will get a Macbook. I like that there is only one port and that I don't have to fiddle with getting the connector the right side up to plug it into the port. My only concern regarding the Macbook is the new touchpad. Does it allow click and hold for copying/pasting text? This wasn't clear to me from the videos I've seen. I'm guessing that these will replace the Macbook Air in a couple of years.

adminprof 12y ago

The most disappointing thing to be is they used a lower quality 480p webcam. So many people use Skype or Google Hangouts that a high resolution webcam is a must.

sterl 12y ago

Charging and mouse for me. I suppose I can use a wireless mouse but all the ones I've tried that don't have a usb dongle seem so jumpy. Bluetooth doesn't seem ready for that frequency yet.

EC1 12y ago
I agree on the mouse part, but I've found an external trackpad works fantastically well.
Mister_Snuggles 12y ago
What sort of issues do you notice? I've been using Bluetooth mice for a long time and have never experienced any jumpiness. Currently I'm using a Microsoft mouse, but I used a Logitech one before (they seem to have given up on Bluetooth though). Neither has given me any issues on my MacBook Pro.
- TheLoneWolfling 12y ago
  I know, it's frustrating. I want a Bluetooth version of Logitech's M570.
pat2man 12y ago
I've been using bluetooth mice for years. No issues.
yellowapple 12y ago
If the world could standardize on Logitech's wireless keyboard/mouse stuff, I'd be pretty happy. I've pretty much stuck to Logitech exclusively lately for my mice (I'm particularly fond of the M570, having been a fan of the similar Trackman Wheel), and I have several K570s (one Mac model for work, plus a couple others, including one in my living room for me to control an entertainment-center PC from my couch / coffee table). I've found Logitech's implementation to - for whatever reason - be the best implementation of wireless peripheral communication I've ever encountered. No problems, no jumpiness, no nothing. It can't be that hard to build the equivalent to their dongle directly into, say, a laptop or tablet, can it?

serve_yay 12y ago

I agree that it looks somewhat underpowered currently. Worth remembering that this was also the case with the Macbook Air when it launched.

MBCook 12y ago
I don't find that too surprising but the battery life being so below what Apple says and other models is very odd.
- higherpurpose 12y ago
  Overheating. Intel is lying about what is necessary to keep Core-M at 5W TDP. The vast majority of Core-M devices out there will overheat because of that, which means they'll throttle and kill the battery faster, too.
  - epmatsw 12y ago
    Why would throttling kill the battery faster? If anything, wouldn't that extend battery life?

outworlder 12y ago

"No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame." Edit: added quotes.

diminoten 12y ago
No wireless? It's got a wireless network card...
- Pxtl 12y ago
  That's a reference to CmdrTaco's review of the original iPod.
  - diminoten 12y ago
    Oh! Second time in as many days that's been a reference I've missed. The specs on the MacBook look marginally worse than the Macbook Air, though. Just confusing to me, why I'd buy this one and not the Air...
    - tstrimple 12y ago
      Pixels.

higherpurpose 12y ago

Core-M/Broadwell-Y is a dud, just like all previous Y-series chips before it. Intel is trying too hard to get the ultra-low power. And because of that it ends up with chips that are less powerful than what is needed for mainstream tasks, as well as too expensive (even compared to a Core i5). You're much better off with a 15W Core i5 than a 5W Core-M, no matter the scenario - with one possible exception: if you really, really want a $1,000 slim "tablet". But you better not want it for something like Photoshop or anything heavy like that. Just for other mobile tasks that you could just as well use your $500 iPad for.

Synaesthesia 12y ago
Of course it's not a heavy lifter. It's actually faster than my Macbook Air 2011, which holds up pretty well for my usage. Compared to an iPad, with 8gb RAM and a much faster CPU, as well as a full OS, it's really much more powerful.

pbreit 12y ago

I welcome the port situation (Apple has rarely been wrong on this front). But the battery life and performance sound like concerns.

jonathankoren 12y ago

The lack of ports don't bother me. Yet another cable incompatible cable bothers me. Yet another dongle bothers me. Lack of magsafe is really bothers me. Magsafe was a step forward. Why go back?

ucha 12y ago

I care a lot about battery life benchmarks because, well, that's what a laptop is for: not being constantly plugged. I'm always disappointed when I see "with all the laptops set to comparable brightness (around 75 percent)" instead of all laptops set to the same luminance. It's like comparing mileage for cars while pressing the accelerator pedal at 75%.

npunt 12y ago
+1. Masterful. TIL. Totally breezed by that line and didn't think about the difference. My pet peeve in reviews is related - color comparisons sound like people talking about wine (colors are rich and come off the screen and the like). Lots of reviews say this about phones or notebooks that have ridiculously awful DeltaE / calibration.

ja27 12y ago

Where can I plug in my ADB keyboard and SCSI drives?

davidy123 12y ago

I'm considering getting the Macbook 2015 as a travel complement to my 15.6" i5 Thinkpad, which runs Ubuntu. I need to do a bit of Apple testing so it would fulfill two uses. But would it be too frustrating for occasional Web-focused software dev? I generally have Chrome loaded with a few tabs, a terminal or two, a database, and the Atom editor, working with a Node stack. I've never really used a Mac before so it's not clear how much overhead the OS has and how it will perform with this CPU.