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“Citizenfour” Awarded Oscar for Best Documentary in 2014
- gonzo 12y agoSeeing Greenwald on stage was fantastic. I wonder how much hassle he and Poitras had getting into the US.
- rtpg 12y agoprobably not nearly as much as we'd believe. Pretty much every case of border frustration that I've heard from this group of people has usually turned out somewhat founded (like when Greenwald's partner got stopped while he was actually carrying confidential documents). Then again, police harass people for no good reason all the time, so the TSA could very well have the same culture. Not a huge fan of security theater. EDIT: stand corrected, the harrassement by the DHS agents described in this is pretty horrible
- locusm 12y agoTheres plenty of articles out there about this topic. http://www.salon.com/2012/04/08/u_s_filmmaker_repeatedly_detained_at_border/ http://www.salon.com/2012/04/08/u_s_filmmaker_repeatedly_det...
- unimportant 12y agoEven as a western European foreigner who does nothing of interest to anyone, US immigration comes off as very hostile in comparison to any other country I have visited and TSA agents are basically on the same level as prison wardens (low education, low pay and enabled to power trip over anyone without a fear of repercussions).
- ekianjo 12y ago> on the same level as prison wardens (low education, low pay and enabled to power trip over anyone without a fear of repercussions). And they act the same way too, looking at you as if you were a criminal and asking you questions barking.
- SuddsMcDuff 12y agoI actually found the opposite when I visited the US for the first time last year. I was slightly nervous about encountering the TSA as I'd read some absolute horror stories online (many through Hacker News). But I've got to say, the TSA agents I encountered were incredibly friendly and helpful, even chatting and joking with my wife and I^. Of course they did break into my suit case and destroy my pad lock but hey ho, at least they left me a friendly note. Anyway I think it's important that both sides of the coin are represented here, people are more likely to write about negative experiences in general. ^We were on honeymoon in Orlando which probably accounts for the generally positive reception :)
- rtpg 12y agoA couple years back I got fast tracked for the first time through a TSA line ( France -> Chicago ). Person who was sitting next to me in the flight was just as American as I was but hey her skin was dark (4th generation Indian parents or something?) so she got pulled to the side. Based off of similar discussions I've had with other people on flights like this, a really good first approximation of the stopping time is "color of skin."
- michaelbuddy 12y agoI've been pulled to the side seems like 30% of the time and I'm just a mutt from the Midwest with some international trips in my passport. I don't take offense because it happens with so many people and so many people glide through unscathed whether pulled aside or not. it's annoying but always random enough.
- locusm 12y agoLaura Poitras talks about it in this interview with Bill Maher. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYTUJ6st2Aw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYTUJ6st2Aw
- wheels 12y agoThey're both American citizens. At the end of the day, they have to be let in. They could, potentially, be charged with a crime, but not turned away.
- grecy 12y agoWhile I understand your reasoning, keep in mind there are US citizens that are being executed without even a trial. It's fairly obvious the government can and will do whatever they want.
- NegativeK 12y agoProsecuting a journalist -- over something that has the executive branch sweating bullets -- when they're on the way to attend one of the biggest entertainment award ceremonies of the year would be like loading a revolver with a whole stick of dynamite and pretending you're just going to shoot your foot off. "TSA imprisons Oscar winners on their way to the ceremonies" isn't something Obama wants to see in every newspaper on Monday morning.
- rdtsc 12y agoAgree with your comment personally. But can see how one might have these objections: * It would be a way to make an example out of "collaborators". Presumably in the future the next Greenwald would think twice before embarking on this kind of project. * It would also be a way to prove to themselves and the rest of the world that "nobody really cares and public in general supports the Government". Regarding the last issue. There is a hidden danger in these revelations and that is despite all the talk and all the press, it seems the general public is not too interested in the topic after all. This in turn serves as a signal to the executive branch and to the NSA that they need not worry much and can even increase the intensity of their programs.
- imron 12y ago> "TSA imprisons Oscar winners on their way to the ceremonies" Haha, yeah, that would never happen -- oh, except for that one time when it almost did (nominee only, not the winner): http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv-movies/palestinian-oscar-nominee-detained-lax-article-1.1269059 http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv-movies/palestini...
- rst 12y agoBoth have made several appearances in the US promoting the film; Greenwald has also been on a book tour. They're probably taking care with what they try to take through customs (if anything), but simply visiting doesn't seem (for the moment at least) to be prohibitively tough.
- michaelbuddy 12y agoI gotta say, Greenwald with all the good he does shining light on things, really bothers me the way he misrepresents Sam Harris. He basically misleads people on what Sam Harris says about Islam and it worries me that Greenwald may be a little too loose with facts in other areas of his reporting.
- logn 12y agoHere is a somewhat heated and very informative 3 hour interview in which pundit Cenk Uygur talks to Sam Harris about these criticisms -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVl3BJoEoAU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVl3BJoEoAU
- michaelbuddy 12y agogood share. saw that not long ago.
- lern_too_spel 12y agoHe is absolutely loose with the facts. To this day, he doesn't know what PRISM is, unlike nearly everybody else in the press. The leaks would have been better managed by almost any other reporter.
- michaelbuddy 12y agoNice, I get downvotes for having a balanced opinion and statements that can be fact checked quite easily.
- t_7u_ol8 12y agoWe mustn't allow the clarity of truth to be muddied by facts. What are you, an NSA puppet or something?
- meowface 12y agoI attempted to research this issue, and as far as I can tell Greenwald did not misrepresent Harris' opinion. I found the full context of the following quotes by Harris, which Greenwald presented, and they mean exactly what they look like: >"We should profile Muslims, or anyone who looks like he or she could conceivably be Muslim." >"We are not at war with terrorism. We are at war with Islam." >"The erection of a mosque upon the ashes of this atrocity will also be viewed by many millions of Muslims as a victory — and as a sign that the liberal values of the West are synonymous with decadence and cowardice." >"Unless liberals realize that there are tens of millions of people in the Muslim world who are far scarier than Dick Cheney, they will be unable to protect civilization from its genuine enemies." Plus several more along those lines. I agree with both Harris and Greenwald to varying extents here, but where exactly did Greenwald mislead people on what Harris has said about Islam? One may think Harris is right or wrong and may disagree with Greenwald taking the stance that Harris is wrong, but I think Greenwald painted an accurate picture of what Harris thinks about the issue.
- param 12y agoGreenwald has said on multiple occasions that he feels very comfortable coming to the US because of its constitution and freedom of speech as an explicit granted right. He isn't going back to the UK anytime soon.
- firebones 12y agoHe seemed to flinch when she took his arm, almost as if he didn't want to be upstage.
- oskarth 12y agoSince they went to the US for the Oscars, the USG making a fuss would get them a lot of attention from the media establishment and the general public, i.e. not really desirable.
- 001sky 12y ago"For some (t)reason, the subject of this film couldn't be here tonight..."
- sneak 12y agoDid anyone else find this joke to be in incredibly poor taste?
- frewsxcv 12y agoBreaking news: Oscars host makes cheap jab at movie subject
- rdl 12y agoDidn't specify who committed the treason; Snowden, or a whole bunch of other people within the government and military industrial complex.
- acjohnson55 12y agoI'm pretty sure Snoden was the target of the joke, but that is a fair point that it could be read that way too!
- mannkind 12y agoSensitive much?
- michaelbuddy 12y agoComedy. That's how it is sometimes. I found it harsh but also a well done joke. But remember, humor is about absurdity. Neil P Harris or his writers are well aware of the absurdity of the situation. Doesn't mean they actually think he's committed treason. These people are professionals but it's not beneath them to take a potshot now and again even if it delivers with ambiguous intent.
- michaelbuddy 12y agoAlso would like to point out Snowden himself thought it was funny. Quote: "To be honest, I laughed at NPH. I don't think it was meant as a political statement, but even if it was, that's not so bad. My perspective is if you're not willing to be called a few names to help out your country, you don't care enough. "If this be treason, then let us make the most of it." [he linked this quote to Patrick Henry on wikipedia]
- antidaily 12y agoApparently that was Snowden's girlfriend to the right.
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- sneak 12y agohttps://twitter.com/sneakatdatavibe/status/569707283703144448 https://twitter.com/sneakatdatavibe/status/56970728370314444...
- jimktrains2 12y agoBecause this comment is nonsensical for not including the text: Jeffrey Paul @sneakatdatavibe A first for the #oscars: being surprised the winner was willing to enter the country to accept the award. #landofthefree
- hunt 12y agoI really enjoyed this film, I felt it was good at being inclusive for people without much technical knowledge.
- rdl 12y agoDespite having been involved in the "cypherpunks" world for two decades, I never thought crypto, security, privacy, NSA, etc. would become such a mass market issue that an Oscar-winning documentary would be created about it.
- ChuckMcM 12y agoI'm glad they won the award. And yes I thought Neil Patrick Harris' comment was more than a bit uncalled for. I also agree with rdl that it's amazing that this has become such a durable national discussion.
- hawkice 12y agoTo provide context: Neil Patrick Harris made a joke that Edward Snowden "couldn't be there for some treason". I firmly believe all puns are uncalled for in America (except by dads, who call for as many puns as possible). But sometimes we get the humor we deserve, not the humor we ask for.
- jimktrains2 12y agoWas that what he said? I didn't hear the "t". Without the "t" it's much more amusing, with it's sad because it plays on a line of thought that is sad, small, and wrong.
- rootbear 12y agoThe closed caption that I saw printed "treason" and that's what I heard. But then, they also mangled Ed Catmull's name into something like "at maul", so I don't consider it definitive.
- brute 12y agoBrief reminder that what you hear is being reinterpreted by your brain to match the things that you see. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-lN8vWm3m0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-lN8vWm3m0
- ChuckMcM 12y agoJoking about what is, or isn't treasonous, is to my way of thinking in just as much poor taste as joking about sexual orientation or race. I "get" the freedom of speech thing, there isn't any law against it, but I dislike it because the topic of encryption and privacy are things I consider important. Neil could have just as easily joked that Turing would still be around if he had been a bit more discreet about his "tastes." And I would be equally offended. So when you have people who have put their liberty and their life on the line for something they believe in, I think it is important for us to treat what they did with respect and not make jokes about it.
- sqren 12y agoGetting nominated was fantastic but very few* believed the Academy would have the guts to actually give them the Oscar. I'm very positively surprised. *Edit: I stand corrected. It was clearly not the underdog I thought it was. I never checked the bookmakers so my comments are purely from a personal perspective of what people I've talked to believed. This doesn't change the fact that I'm positively surprised :)
- jgwest 12y agoThe recent past seems like such a dark time for people who are skeptical of all this State Spycraft stuff. An award to a good film about an essentially important issue, with a little dark (or darkly sinister, take your pick) levity by Mister Oscar, and you start to feel that there is a glimmer of hope... The EFF can justifiably rant and rave and they do a good job at it. But a little nod from a general public institution seems, to me at least, to provide a special sort of boost.
- aaronbrethorst 12y ago> very few believed the Academy would have the guts to actually give them the Oscar. Citation needed
- thedz 12y agoDefinitely needs citation. From some cursory reading prior to the Oscars, CITIZENFOUR appeared to be heavily favored to win.
- michaelbuddy 12y agoPeople sometimes talk about the academy as if it's not all the people there in the audience. Like it's 20 other elitists behind closed doors trying to control our hearts and minds. The academy has its admin staff but the voting is done by the collective just like the nominations are. if it's nominated it's a potential win. The result tonight tells me how annoyed even Hollywood is with the current President on this topic.
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- jkelsey 12y agoSo, I'll ask the more cynical question -- how does this affect Ed Snowden's chances of getting a pardon and being allowed to come home?
- dombili 12y agoHe's not getting a pardon anytime soon (which is a shame), but in the long run, I don't see how this hurts.
- acjohnson55 12y agoI wouldn't be so sure. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see a pardon as Obama's leaving office.
- TwoBit 12y agoI would be very surprised. Think about how much of what Snowden revealed reflected poorly on the Obama administration.
- dagw 12y agoI guess it really comes down to who has the last say. If it's Obama personally then I can see it happening. Being willing to pardon someone who has done you harm because it's the right thing to do is great way to build a nice legacy, especially since you're retiring anyway and it's no longer your problem.
- ekianjo 12y agoHave you ever seen movies changing anything in the political world?
- wwweston 12y agohttp://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_After http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Day_After This movie was a catalyst in national conversation about nuclear proliferation, and there's evidence that its impact included President Reagan. It was also broadcast on prime time in an era when that meant a greater number of simultaneous viewers, of course.
- euske 12y agoThis is great. Now, how can I get to see this movie here in Tokyo? It doesn't look like any screening is planned in Japan, and most people here don't seem to care the issue.
- giodamelio 12y agoYou are probably going to have to pirate it. Despite it's importance, I haven't seen it becoming very popular even in the US. It is mostly playing alternative movie theaters, and not that often.
- michaelbuddy 12y agoOscar bump should call up some courage of theaters to be screening it more. You never know with indie films, and documentaries especially are on no predictable timeline for distribution.
- jtgeibel 12y agoIt will be playing on HBO in the US Monday night. I for one am looking forward to seeing it, and will probably show it to friends via HBO Go. However, I have no idea if HBO will be showing it internationally.
- unimportant 12y agoAverage joe doesn't read wired or the new york times and if he has heard about any of the leaks, he probably thinks "I have nothing to hide so no big deal - USA number one!". Cinema chains probably don't want to piss off big gov either and the owners are usually politically involved too.
- unimportant 12y agoKickass.to but maybe some arthouse cinema will show it (there probably is little interest in this though as Japanese people think very insular).
- ekianjo 12y ago> most people here don't seem to care the issue. People here are too busy sharing their lives' private details on unencrypted LINE services.
- curiously 12y agoso where can I download this because there's no way to watch it or buy it.
- wmt 12y agoYou can watch it in a movie theater. http://www.moviefone.com/movie/citizenfour/20058402/showtimes?mileValue=Unlimited&amenities=&selectedShowDate=&extended=true http://www.moviefone.com/movie/citizenfour/20058402/showtime... HBO is also showing it, http://www.hbo.com/documentaries/citizenfour http://www.hbo.com/documentaries/citizenfour, but if you just want to watch it without paying anything for it, there should be illegal copies available through torrens.
- newaccountfool 12y agoYou can watch it for free, legally. They have released the film to the public. http://ergot.yfkm.eu/Citizenfour-HD.mp4 http://ergot.yfkm.eu/Citizenfour-HD.mp4
- deleted 12y ago[deleted]
- bainsfather 12y agoDo you have a link to a more 'official' announcement of this, please?
- justinv 12y agoEntered in as public record as part of a lawsuit: https://twitter.com/Cryptomeorg/status/566616227582582785 https://twitter.com/Cryptomeorg/status/566616227582582785
- mariodiana 12y agoExcellent! Because I would hate to pay a nominal sum to people risking their liberty, and perhaps even their very lives, to spread the word about government abuses that threaten the future of not merely the 300-plus million people living in this country but people from around the world, too. Can we get more of this?
- justcommenting 12y agoI was half expecting a Snowden acceptance speech via robot[0][1] [0] http://www.wired.com/2014/06/inside-edward-snowdens-life-as-a-robot/ http://www.wired.com/2014/06/inside-edward-snowdens-life-as-... [1] https://twitter.com/robotsnowden https://twitter.com/robotsnowden
- saalweachter 12y agoFollowed by the robot being arrested, err, indefinitely detained?
- seivan 12y agoI'm disgusted with Glenn Greenwalds jihadi-apoligism. It wasn't 'west' that forced Muslims to kidnap 5000 Yezidis to price tag them and sell them. Gang-rapign 12 year olds and disposing of them when they got pregnant. It happened 2014 and it happened 300 years before USA existed. Obviously we don't have a #Yezidilivesmatter, hell we don't even have a #Shialivesmatter despise thousands of them getting butchered in Pakistan.
- seivan 12y agoGetting brigaded by left-wing extremists probably painting me as a racist unknown to them of my Shia kurd background. The same people getting butchered by ISIS, same ISIS (and their apologists) who constantly retweet Glenn on Twitter. Islamic Arab imperialism is never spoken of. Just the evil 'west'. 12 year sold as ISIS slave, she didn't know what rape meant only that she woke up bleeding http://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/yazidi-women-sold-by-isis-tell-chilling-tales-of-slave-auction-399059523552 http://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/yazidi-women-sold-... One ‘slave' tried to kill herself 7 times. Some of the girls isis rapes & enslaves are 8. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/10/isis-women-angelina-jolie_n_6653862.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/02/10/isis-women-angelina... Yazidi girls, aged 12 & 19, bought & sold, raped & beaten for months by their ISIS captors http://www.nbcnews.com/watch/nbc-news/yazidi-woman-isis-captors-called-us-their-property-398807107908 http://www.nbcnews.com/watch/nbc-news/yazidi-woman-isis-capt... ISIS militants prefer the young female "slaves," according to those who made it out. http://www.amnestyusa.org/research/reports/escape-from-hell-torture-sexual-slavery-in-islamic-state-captivity-in-iraq http://www.amnestyusa.org/research/reports/escape-from-hell-... Syria activists claim that kidnapped Yazidi women are frequently victimized with non-consensual, brutalizing rape: http://www.raqqa-sl.com/en/?p=589 http://www.raqqa-sl.com/en/?p=589 Kurdish Yezidi girls speak of how ISIS raped & sold girls as young as 10 years; youtube.com/watch?v=pFB882…
- worklogin 12y agoPerhaps you're downvoted because there is no context to this, and it's not related to the subject.
- cellover 12y agoI have uploaded the movie to my server, direct download, high speed: http://www.pilgrimbreak.com/citizenfour-hd-high-speed-download/ http://www.pilgrimbreak.com/citizenfour-hd-high-speed-downlo...
- bainsfather 12y agoDo you have a link to some 'official' source saying that the movie is free? (I'd like to copy it, but only with the creators' permission).
- corford 12y agohttps://twitter.com/Cryptomeorg/status/566616227582582785 https://twitter.com/Cryptomeorg/status/566616227582582785 Is that good enough (taken from further up in this thread)?
- bainsfather 12y agoI don't know, is it? Myself, I was hoping for something more definitive. Does it being presented as evidence in a US court mean I can freely copy it, including if I am outside the US? If the creators were freely releasing the film, then I would have expected them to say so in some public announcement.
- matthewmcg 12y agoOnly the film's copyright holder can release it into the public domain. They must do so by an overt act or statement that indicates the work is no longer subject to copyright. Merely submitting copies of the work to a court as part of a lawsuit doesn't do this as there is no statement that copyright is relinquished. Quite the opposite--copies of the film still bear a copyright notice.
- corford 12y agoMaybe take the middle road? Grab a copy now if you can't wait and buy it later when it comes out on DVD/Blueray. Fortunately it's being aired here in the UK on Channel 4 tomorrow so I haven't got this dilemma.
- bmoresbest55 12y agoI do not know how any of the other films even had a chance. This was the clear winner.
- harkyns_castle 12y agoHopefully some of the numbnuts in the US will get up and vote about it. Hopefully some of the numbnuts in the AU will get up and vote about it. Hopefully some of the numbnuts in the NZ will get up and vote about it. (Kia Kaha) Yes I understand its a downvote post. Just wondering what will change this hellish situation.