9 ms·

The reversible USB Type-C connector is turning heads at CES

51 points by drewjaja 12y ago

ferrari8608 12y ago
"A third benefit of Type-C is that it can deliver greater amounts of power -- up to 100 watts. That means you should be able to charge something as big as a laptop via a USB cable, as well as the phones and other small devices you can charge today." How awesome would it be to not need a dedicated power port on your laptop? In my experience with repairing laptops, that's one of the first things to break if you're keeping the thing plugged in constantly. It gets old disassembling the entire machine just to J-B Weld or solder the female end back in place. Then there's the idea that you may eventually be able to charge your other internet devices with the same cord you charge your laptop with. You get a cord with every device, so that means you'll have backups ready if your main charge cord breaks or disappears. This just seems like an all-around Good Thing.
- Alphasite_ 12y ago
  I'm a little worried that if these get made to the same standard that most usb cables are that one of these is going to kill someone.
  - dogma1138 12y ago
    That's 20V over 5amps that won't kill anything... Lenovo and some other companies already charge their laptops via USB (Normal A Type connector) on a dedicated port that connects to a 65W power adapter...
    - matmann2001 12y ago
      20V over 5A could definitely kill someone.
      - rasz_pl 12y ago
        in order to pump 5A with only 20A you would first need to liquefy someones flesh
        ars 12y ago
        You should stop posting false information. A simple wound is enough. 5A @ 20V is 4 ohm. A wound is lower than that. And you don't need 20A to kill anyway. 20V with sweaty salty skin is right at the edge of dangerous territory.
        rasz_pl 12y ago
        go ahead and stab yourself with a multimeter, your gonna read somewhere around 300-1000ohms
        DanBC 12y ago
        http://darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin1999-50.html http://darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin1999-50.html > (1999) A US Navy safety publication describes injuries incurred while doing don't's. One page described the fate of a sailor playing with a multimeter in an unauthorized manner. He was curious about the resistance level of the human body. He had a Simpson 260 multimeter, a small unit powered by a 9-volt battery. That may not seem powerful enough to be dangerous… but it can be deadly in the wrong hands. > The sailor took a probe in each hand to measure his bodily resistance from thumb to thumb. But the probes had sharp tips, and in his excitement he pressed his thumbs hard enough against the probes to break the skin. Once the salty conducting fluid known as blood was available, the current from the multimeter travelled right across the sailor's heart, disrupting the electrical regulation of his heartbeat. He died before he could record his Ohms. "It's the volts that jolt but the mills that kill" - voltage gives you the electric shock feeling but current across the heart will kill you.
        zyx321 12y ago
        It's a Darwin Award because you have to go out of your way to achieve it. When was the last time you plugged in a USB device while bleeding profusely from both hands and/or standing barefoot in a pool of your own blood? Unless you are actively, visibly bleeding, it's going take well over 50V to cause any sort of lasting harm. Not to mention that it'll almost certainly default to 5V unless both ends are plugged in to devices supporting higher voltage.
    - ars 12y ago
      You can actually kill with 20V - just stab the copper wire into the thumb of each hand. 20V is fine through skin - too much resistance, but if you push it under the skin the resistance is much lower and it can kill. You might be able to do it with sweaty skin and squeeze the wire hard. Not certain. Not likely to happen by accident though. Also it's enough to cause a burn if you put it in your mouth.
      - rasz_pl 12y ago
        no you cant, thats gonna be ~60mA of DC across your body provided you have open flesh wounds on both hands :) painful yes, but not deadly
        CamperBob2 12y ago
        60 mA is a big deal, as it's getting into the current levels that are more likely to cause fibrillation (at least for AC). But the only way 20V will push that much current through your body is through open wounds. In a worst case scenario, yes, 20V could electrocute a person. More likely, though, a crappy USB cable carrying 5A will kill people by burning their house down.
        e12e 12y ago
        Some interesting points on "low" voltage and wounds here. I wonder about child proofing (and, as you say, fireproofing!). Will most people regard these as "100 watt dangerous" or "peripheral/signal-cable safe"? Frankly, I'm worried enough about the possibility of fire due to power over ethernet (eg: hotel wifi). All that said, modern, useful, standardised dc cabling does sound convenient.
        okasaki 12y ago
        http://www.mpoweruk.com/shock.htm http://www.mpoweruk.com/shock.htm 20-50 mA - Can't breathe. Paralysis of the chest muscles. Possibly Fatal
        rasz_pl 12y ago
  - mieses 12y ago
    They are very safe. Toyota uses them for cabling around compressed hydrogen fuel tanks.
    - desdiv 12y ago
      That's very cool. Do you happen to have a picture of it?
      - mieses 12y ago
        It will be featured it the advertising photos. Frayed USB cables sparking next to compressed hydrogen. It will work a little like the subliminal death messages in the Marlborro cigarette ads, which were also very cool.
    - ars 12y ago
      That doesn't mean it's safe for a person. For hydrogen you want to avoid sparks, for a person you want to avoid current (which is delivered by having enough voltage).
- crdoconnor 12y ago
  This would also be a great way to standardize DC power delivery throughout buildings: http://www.economist.com/news/international/21588104-humble-usb-cable-part-electrical-revolution-it-will-make-power-supplies http://www.economist.com/news/international/21588104-humble-... This would allow for more efficient use of solar power and batteries. Instead of converting DC from the panel/battery to AC and then back to DC again (losing a lot of power in the process), you could run a lot of appliances directly off a DC power network with USB connectors.
  - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
    Plugging your phone or laptop into a random usb slot into a wall to charge it isn't safe from a security standpoint. Since data flows with power, it is very easy to load up some malware while charging or steal data from the device. Unless I am misunderstood about what the article is proposing. It would be a nightmare if the only way I could charge my phone was to plug it into rouge usb ports. It is a security nightmare. it isn't like this is some sort of far off concept. http://www.nbcnews.com/id/44038933/ns/technology_and_science-security/t/small-usb-devices-can-do-some-big-time-damage/ http://www.nbcnews.com/id/44038933/ns/technology_and_science...
    - tomswartz07 12y ago
      I haven't seen the specs of the Type C, but all of today's generation of USB cables can be modified to be 'power only' - Pins 1 and 4 of almost all USB cables are +5V and Gnd, respectively. It wouldn't be a stretch to get a cable with pins 2 & 3 disabled or snipped if you're that security concious. :)
      - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
        Right, you can buy them now. I just mean if it becomes required/acceptable to plug in all your devices whenever you see a usb port, we WILL start seeing malware transmitted that way. These things should be thought of ahead of time.
        12y ago
- guidedlight 12y ago
  It appears that the next MacBook Air will feature power charging via a USB Type-C port (the only other port on the laptop is a 3.5mm audio jack). http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign/?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign/?...
  - toothbrush 12y ago
    Omigod is anyone else freaked out that on the pictures the power button is where the ESC key should be? My boss has a habit of giving us Apple hardware on which i have a habit of installing Linux or whatever, but that keyboard would require some seriously ugly scripting to avoid reprogramming my muscle memory :/
    - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
      Power button definitely shouldn't be mixed into the keyboard with the other keys where its easy to hit on accident. On the other hand it probably doesn't do anything unless you hold it down.
      - toothbrush 12y ago
        If it's like the predecessors, it'll bring up the "Shutdown/Restart/Logout?" dialog on OS X, and fire the ACPI shutdown event on Linux. Of course in Linux this can be remapped (i use it to tell my laptop to suspend), but indeed, top-left is horribly stupid. Top-right i've never banged it by accident, though.
        lucaspiller 12y ago
        On OS X (recent versions) you need to hold it down to do anything. A quick tap as described does nothing.
        UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
        I just got a Windows laptop where the power button doesn't do anything unless you hold it. Been throwing me off.
- vidarh 12y ago
  If only they end up being more solid than current mini and micro USB female ends. It's ridiculously easy to end up bending the female port sufficiently out of shape to get poor connection with the smaller USB ports - I have several devices that will only charge with specific cables that fits slightly snugger than average. There's also an ongoing problem with cables where the male end is not deep enough / set far enough back, so again many devices won't work with all cables. Looking at pictures here [1], it looks like the housing may be just as liable to poor/cheap implementations to end up with the same issues as micro-USB. [1] http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/08/small-reversible-usb-type-c-connector-finalized/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/08/small-reversible-usb-...
  - joezydeco 12y ago
    I've had the same problem. Half the things my kids got for Christmas charge off Micro-B cables and almost all the cables and/or ports are damaged already. Yes, they're cheap chinese knockoffs, but even if they were more robost I don't hold out much hope for Mr Busy Travelling Businessman relying on this cable to run his entire laptop system.
    - lsaferite 12y ago
      I've found Micro USB connectors to be horrible in comparison to Mini connectors. I never once had a Mini cable become useless while I regularly end up tossing Micro cables. And if you are rough on your devices, like my wife, charging become an exercise in frustration where you have to move the cable juuuuust so to get a charge.
      - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
        Every single microusb cable I ever had ended up like that... what am I doing wrong?
        lsaferite 12y ago
        From my experience, if you regularly put any pressure in any direction you damage the cable or, even worse, the port.
csabia 12y ago
About time. USB + DisplayPort + Ethernet + power (- PCI Express) is wonderful.
- lsaferite 12y ago
  USB + DP + Ethernet + USB-PD? I haven't seen that mentioned. Do you have a link? Do you just mean that you could have an attached USB <-> Ethernet adapter while DP alt mode is active? I've read that DP mode is possible in conjunction with USB-PD and USB 3.1 but have seen nothing about Ethernet in particular.
  - csabia 12y ago
    In this article (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/01/usb-3-1-and-type-c-the-only-stuff-at-ces-that-everyone-is-going-to-use/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/01/usb-3-1-and-type-c-th...), they hint at the capability called "Alternate Mode". It can be used to transport any non-USB data.
xmodem 12y ago
I wonder if the increased power capacity is implemented by the device and power supply negotiating a higher voltage. 100w at 5 volts would be 20 amps, which seems a bit high.
- desdiv 12y ago
  Yep, a higher voltage is negotiated. At 100W, it's 20V: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Power http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Power
ryanobjc 12y ago
About time. The usb physical standards have sucked, and hard. Mini usb tended to break on the device side, usb3 micro usb foot print is obscene etc.
- lsaferite 12y ago
  Oddly, I never once had a failure of a Mini cable or receptacle. Micro is a horrid design though.
janus24 12y ago
In connection with this article, according to 9to5mac the next MBA should have a unique USB Type-C connector. http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign
- emeidi 12y ago
  The spelling mistake with "connectors" (plural) confused me. After looking at the linked web page, I now get what you wanted to say: The 12" MacBook Air is rumored to have ONE SINGLE USB PORT and NO other peripheral port (except a headphone jack). 9to5 claims it will be a USB Type-C port. Take with a grain of salt.
- maxerickson 12y ago
  The great thing about releasing a computer with 1 port is that when you release the next version, you can trumpet how it now has more than 1 port. I wonder if something got lost in translation there, "only usb 3" is an interesting thing to do, and "only usb 3c ports" isn't that far off from "only a usb 3c connector".
makomk 12y ago
Another benefit that this doesn't mention is that it can support DisplayPort connections at the same time as USB and charging.
- MichaelGG 12y ago
  According to Wikipedia, alt modes include DisplayPort, MHL, PCI Express, and Ethernet. I really hope USB doesn't make the terrible mistake of exposing an insecure protocol like PCIe over a "public" port. With FireWire, I could just destroy the port physically since I didn't use it. But if USB gets the Apple treatment of giving DMA access to anyone that can get a peripheral connected to your machine -- well, that'd suck.
  - techrat 12y ago
    After the recent publishing of how Apple Macbook Pros with Thunderbolt ports can be bootkitted ... Yeah, knowing that USB 3.1/C can provide PCIeX/DMA access to the system is a touch worrying.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
organsnyder 12y ago
I'm incredibly excited for the possibilities of this connector. Imagine a laptop that has a bunch of USB Type-C ports—and nothing else. Plugging a (universal!) charger into any of them charges the laptop at a rate of up to 100 watts. Displays are connected via DisplayPort-over-USB, etc. In fact, the display could actually be the charger as well (or, if you have a desktop, the display could be powered from the PC). A single USB Type-C cable could run an all-encompassing, manufacturer-agnostic docking solution. Phones would also feature the same connector, so a laptop charger could also charge a phone, with no adapter needed. I'm really looking forward to having a single connector for virtually all of my devices (excluding special situations, such as water-resistant devices) within the next few years.
- StuffMaster 12y ago
  Unless they changed the protocol, USB will always be undesirable for transporting video and network data. Not that you can't, but thunderbolt is much better suited.
benbristow 12y ago
MiniUSB was far better than MicroUSB. I can't count how many MicroUSB devices I've somehow broke (maybe it's just me). Always the tongue that seems to snap. Thankfully wireless charging is now becoming more and more popular. USB Type-C still has a tongue whereas Apple's new connector port does not; and Apple's is still reversible. Shame they patented it.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- lsaferite 12y ago
  I'm with you here. I hate micro and loved Mini. I've bought and tossed more Micro cables than I can count. And if you are rough on the device you widen the port just a fraction and get crappy connections that you have to wiggle to get working. Also, the Apple connector style is far nicer and it is indeed a shame it's patented and limited to Apple devices.
tomkinstinch 12y ago
Having designed some analog electronics, it continues to amaze me that cheap USB cables costing on the order of pennies are capable of carrying GHz-rate signals over a couple conductors, despite not being coaxial. There are so many opportunities for loss and noise, it is incredible it works at all. And it works well. Imagine if we had to use a double(or triple)-shielded coaxial cable with BNC connectors to connect our monitors and high data rate devices. The USB spec is amazing. USB-C finally brings decent usability to the connectors.
lsaferite 12y ago
I haven't been able to find anything saying how many wires are in the cable, does anyone here know and have a reference? Is it the full 24 wires mapped end-to-end or are some of the connectors mapped to a single wire? Like, the 4 USB 2.0 connectors, I imagine it makes little sense to have 4 physical wires there, right? Yet they obviously have the SuperSpeed lanes wired separately because they can run DP alt mode on one side of the connector and USB 3.1 on the other. I'd love to see something discussing this and it could affect the longer term viability of the physical connector spec. EDIT: Honestly, I'd love it if the spec said they must have 24 wires AND that balanced pairs would be twisted pairs. As long as the connector is durable I'm willing to pay more for a good cable designed to that spec.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
  - lsaferite 12y ago
    From the official spec the max wires is 18 + shield. Also, from all my reading, USB 3.1 + DP Alt run at the same time. USB 3.1 only needs 2 of the 4 lanes. http://www.usb.org/developers/docs/ http://www.usb.org/developers/docs/
    - lsaferite 12y ago
      Reading the spec a little more, during Alt mode negotiation TX1n/TX1p, TX2n/TX2p, RX1n/RX1p, RX2n/RX2p, and SBU1/SBU2 are all available for reconfiguration. That's 4 balanced pairs + 2 wires. Additionally, if the connection is a direct-connect, like a docking station, then 3 additional pins become available: B5, B6, and B7. So, a dedicated docking station could have Power + USB 2.0 + 13 pins (4 balanced pairs + 5 extra) or Power + USB 2.0 + USB 3.1 + 9 pins (2 balanced pairs + 5 extra)

51 points by drewjaja 12y ago

"A third benefit of Type-C is that it can deliver greater amounts of power -- up to 100 watts. That means you should be able to charge something as big as a laptop via a USB cable, as well as the phones and other small devices you can charge today." How awesome would it be to not need a dedicated power port on your laptop? In my experience with repairing laptops, that's one of the first things to break if you're keeping the thing plugged in constantly. It gets old disassembling the entire machine just to J-B Weld or solder the female end back in place. Then there's the idea that you may eventually be able to charge your other internet devices with the same cord you charge your laptop with. You get a cord with every device, so that means you'll have backups ready if your main charge cord breaks or disappears. This just seems like an all-around Good Thing.

Alphasite_ 12y ago
I'm a little worried that if these get made to the same standard that most usb cables are that one of these is going to kill someone.
- dogma1138 12y ago
  That's 20V over 5amps that won't kill anything... Lenovo and some other companies already charge their laptops via USB (Normal A Type connector) on a dedicated port that connects to a 65W power adapter...
  - matmann2001 12y ago
    20V over 5A could definitely kill someone.
    - rasz_pl 12y ago
      in order to pump 5A with only 20A you would first need to liquefy someones flesh
      - ars 12y ago
        You should stop posting false information. A simple wound is enough. 5A @ 20V is 4 ohm. A wound is lower than that. And you don't need 20A to kill anyway. 20V with sweaty salty skin is right at the edge of dangerous territory.
        rasz_pl 12y ago
        go ahead and stab yourself with a multimeter, your gonna read somewhere around 300-1000ohms
        DanBC 12y ago
        http://darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin1999-50.html http://darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin1999-50.html > (1999) A US Navy safety publication describes injuries incurred while doing don't's. One page described the fate of a sailor playing with a multimeter in an unauthorized manner. He was curious about the resistance level of the human body. He had a Simpson 260 multimeter, a small unit powered by a 9-volt battery. That may not seem powerful enough to be dangerous… but it can be deadly in the wrong hands. > The sailor took a probe in each hand to measure his bodily resistance from thumb to thumb. But the probes had sharp tips, and in his excitement he pressed his thumbs hard enough against the probes to break the skin. Once the salty conducting fluid known as blood was available, the current from the multimeter travelled right across the sailor's heart, disrupting the electrical regulation of his heartbeat. He died before he could record his Ohms. "It's the volts that jolt but the mills that kill" - voltage gives you the electric shock feeling but current across the heart will kill you.
        zyx321 12y ago
        It's a Darwin Award because you have to go out of your way to achieve it. When was the last time you plugged in a USB device while bleeding profusely from both hands and/or standing barefoot in a pool of your own blood? Unless you are actively, visibly bleeding, it's going take well over 50V to cause any sort of lasting harm. Not to mention that it'll almost certainly default to 5V unless both ends are plugged in to devices supporting higher voltage.
  - ars 12y ago
    You can actually kill with 20V - just stab the copper wire into the thumb of each hand. 20V is fine through skin - too much resistance, but if you push it under the skin the resistance is much lower and it can kill. You might be able to do it with sweaty skin and squeeze the wire hard. Not certain. Not likely to happen by accident though. Also it's enough to cause a burn if you put it in your mouth.
    - rasz_pl 12y ago
      no you cant, thats gonna be ~60mA of DC across your body provided you have open flesh wounds on both hands :) painful yes, but not deadly
      - CamperBob2 12y ago
        60 mA is a big deal, as it's getting into the current levels that are more likely to cause fibrillation (at least for AC). But the only way 20V will push that much current through your body is through open wounds. In a worst case scenario, yes, 20V could electrocute a person. More likely, though, a crappy USB cable carrying 5A will kill people by burning their house down.
        e12e 12y ago
        Some interesting points on "low" voltage and wounds here. I wonder about child proofing (and, as you say, fireproofing!). Will most people regard these as "100 watt dangerous" or "peripheral/signal-cable safe"? Frankly, I'm worried enough about the possibility of fire due to power over ethernet (eg: hotel wifi). All that said, modern, useful, standardised dc cabling does sound convenient.
      - okasaki 12y ago
        http://www.mpoweruk.com/shock.htm http://www.mpoweruk.com/shock.htm 20-50 mA - Can't breathe. Paralysis of the chest muscles. Possibly Fatal
        rasz_pl 12y ago
- mieses 12y ago
  They are very safe. Toyota uses them for cabling around compressed hydrogen fuel tanks.
  - desdiv 12y ago
    That's very cool. Do you happen to have a picture of it?
    - mieses 12y ago
      It will be featured it the advertising photos. Frayed USB cables sparking next to compressed hydrogen. It will work a little like the subliminal death messages in the Marlborro cigarette ads, which were also very cool.
  - ars 12y ago
    That doesn't mean it's safe for a person. For hydrogen you want to avoid sparks, for a person you want to avoid current (which is delivered by having enough voltage).
crdoconnor 12y ago
This would also be a great way to standardize DC power delivery throughout buildings: http://www.economist.com/news/international/21588104-humble-usb-cable-part-electrical-revolution-it-will-make-power-supplies http://www.economist.com/news/international/21588104-humble-... This would allow for more efficient use of solar power and batteries. Instead of converting DC from the panel/battery to AC and then back to DC again (losing a lot of power in the process), you could run a lot of appliances directly off a DC power network with USB connectors.
- UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
  Plugging your phone or laptop into a random usb slot into a wall to charge it isn't safe from a security standpoint. Since data flows with power, it is very easy to load up some malware while charging or steal data from the device. Unless I am misunderstood about what the article is proposing. It would be a nightmare if the only way I could charge my phone was to plug it into rouge usb ports. It is a security nightmare. it isn't like this is some sort of far off concept. http://www.nbcnews.com/id/44038933/ns/technology_and_science-security/t/small-usb-devices-can-do-some-big-time-damage/ http://www.nbcnews.com/id/44038933/ns/technology_and_science...
  - tomswartz07 12y ago
    I haven't seen the specs of the Type C, but all of today's generation of USB cables can be modified to be 'power only' - Pins 1 and 4 of almost all USB cables are +5V and Gnd, respectively. It wouldn't be a stretch to get a cable with pins 2 & 3 disabled or snipped if you're that security concious. :)
    - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
      Right, you can buy them now. I just mean if it becomes required/acceptable to plug in all your devices whenever you see a usb port, we WILL start seeing malware transmitted that way. These things should be thought of ahead of time.
      - 12y ago
guidedlight 12y ago
It appears that the next MacBook Air will feature power charging via a USB Type-C port (the only other port on the laptop is a 3.5mm audio jack). http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign/?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign/?...
- toothbrush 12y ago
  Omigod is anyone else freaked out that on the pictures the power button is where the ESC key should be? My boss has a habit of giving us Apple hardware on which i have a habit of installing Linux or whatever, but that keyboard would require some seriously ugly scripting to avoid reprogramming my muscle memory :/
  - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
    Power button definitely shouldn't be mixed into the keyboard with the other keys where its easy to hit on accident. On the other hand it probably doesn't do anything unless you hold it down.
    - toothbrush 12y ago
      If it's like the predecessors, it'll bring up the "Shutdown/Restart/Logout?" dialog on OS X, and fire the ACPI shutdown event on Linux. Of course in Linux this can be remapped (i use it to tell my laptop to suspend), but indeed, top-left is horribly stupid. Top-right i've never banged it by accident, though.
      - lucaspiller 12y ago
        On OS X (recent versions) you need to hold it down to do anything. A quick tap as described does nothing.
      - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
        I just got a Windows laptop where the power button doesn't do anything unless you hold it. Been throwing me off.
vidarh 12y ago
If only they end up being more solid than current mini and micro USB female ends. It's ridiculously easy to end up bending the female port sufficiently out of shape to get poor connection with the smaller USB ports - I have several devices that will only charge with specific cables that fits slightly snugger than average. There's also an ongoing problem with cables where the male end is not deep enough / set far enough back, so again many devices won't work with all cables. Looking at pictures here [1], it looks like the housing may be just as liable to poor/cheap implementations to end up with the same issues as micro-USB. [1] http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/08/small-reversible-usb-type-c-connector-finalized/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/08/small-reversible-usb-...
- joezydeco 12y ago
  I've had the same problem. Half the things my kids got for Christmas charge off Micro-B cables and almost all the cables and/or ports are damaged already. Yes, they're cheap chinese knockoffs, but even if they were more robost I don't hold out much hope for Mr Busy Travelling Businessman relying on this cable to run his entire laptop system.
  - lsaferite 12y ago
    I've found Micro USB connectors to be horrible in comparison to Mini connectors. I never once had a Mini cable become useless while I regularly end up tossing Micro cables. And if you are rough on your devices, like my wife, charging become an exercise in frustration where you have to move the cable juuuuust so to get a charge.
    - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
      Every single microusb cable I ever had ended up like that... what am I doing wrong?
      - lsaferite 12y ago
        From my experience, if you regularly put any pressure in any direction you damage the cable or, even worse, the port.

csabia 12y ago

About time. USB + DisplayPort + Ethernet + power (- PCI Express) is wonderful.

lsaferite 12y ago
USB + DP + Ethernet + USB-PD? I haven't seen that mentioned. Do you have a link? Do you just mean that you could have an attached USB <-> Ethernet adapter while DP alt mode is active? I've read that DP mode is possible in conjunction with USB-PD and USB 3.1 but have seen nothing about Ethernet in particular.
- csabia 12y ago
  In this article (http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/01/usb-3-1-and-type-c-the-only-stuff-at-ces-that-everyone-is-going-to-use/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015/01/usb-3-1-and-type-c-th...), they hint at the capability called "Alternate Mode". It can be used to transport any non-USB data.

xmodem 12y ago

I wonder if the increased power capacity is implemented by the device and power supply negotiating a higher voltage. 100w at 5 volts would be 20 amps, which seems a bit high.

desdiv 12y ago
Yep, a higher voltage is negotiated. At 100W, it's 20V: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Power http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Power

ryanobjc 12y ago

About time. The usb physical standards have sucked, and hard. Mini usb tended to break on the device side, usb3 micro usb foot print is obscene etc.

lsaferite 12y ago
Oddly, I never once had a failure of a Mini cable or receptacle. Micro is a horrid design though.

janus24 12y ago

In connection with this article, according to 9to5mac the next MBA should have a unique USB Type-C connector. http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign http://9to5mac.com/2015/01/06/macbook-air-12-inch-redesign

emeidi 12y ago
The spelling mistake with "connectors" (plural) confused me. After looking at the linked web page, I now get what you wanted to say: The 12" MacBook Air is rumored to have ONE SINGLE USB PORT and NO other peripheral port (except a headphone jack). 9to5 claims it will be a USB Type-C port. Take with a grain of salt.
maxerickson 12y ago
The great thing about releasing a computer with 1 port is that when you release the next version, you can trumpet how it now has more than 1 port. I wonder if something got lost in translation there, "only usb 3" is an interesting thing to do, and "only usb 3c ports" isn't that far off from "only a usb 3c connector".

makomk 12y ago

Another benefit that this doesn't mention is that it can support DisplayPort connections at the same time as USB and charging.

MichaelGG 12y ago
According to Wikipedia, alt modes include DisplayPort, MHL, PCI Express, and Ethernet. I really hope USB doesn't make the terrible mistake of exposing an insecure protocol like PCIe over a "public" port. With FireWire, I could just destroy the port physically since I didn't use it. But if USB gets the Apple treatment of giving DMA access to anyone that can get a peripheral connected to your machine -- well, that'd suck.
- techrat 12y ago
  After the recent publishing of how Apple Macbook Pros with Thunderbolt ports can be bootkitted ... Yeah, knowing that USB 3.1/C can provide PCIeX/DMA access to the system is a touch worrying.

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organsnyder 12y ago

I'm incredibly excited for the possibilities of this connector. Imagine a laptop that has a bunch of USB Type-C ports—and nothing else. Plugging a (universal!) charger into any of them charges the laptop at a rate of up to 100 watts. Displays are connected via DisplayPort-over-USB, etc. In fact, the display could actually be the charger as well (or, if you have a desktop, the display could be powered from the PC). A single USB Type-C cable could run an all-encompassing, manufacturer-agnostic docking solution. Phones would also feature the same connector, so a laptop charger could also charge a phone, with no adapter needed. I'm really looking forward to having a single connector for virtually all of my devices (excluding special situations, such as water-resistant devices) within the next few years.

StuffMaster 12y ago
Unless they changed the protocol, USB will always be undesirable for transporting video and network data. Not that you can't, but thunderbolt is much better suited.

benbristow 12y ago

MiniUSB was far better than MicroUSB. I can't count how many MicroUSB devices I've somehow broke (maybe it's just me). Always the tongue that seems to snap. Thankfully wireless charging is now becoming more and more popular. USB Type-C still has a tongue whereas Apple's new connector port does not; and Apple's is still reversible. Shame they patented it.

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lsaferite 12y ago
I'm with you here. I hate micro and loved Mini. I've bought and tossed more Micro cables than I can count. And if you are rough on the device you widen the port just a fraction and get crappy connections that you have to wiggle to get working. Also, the Apple connector style is far nicer and it is indeed a shame it's patented and limited to Apple devices.

tomkinstinch 12y ago

Having designed some analog electronics, it continues to amaze me that cheap USB cables costing on the order of pennies are capable of carrying GHz-rate signals over a couple conductors, despite not being coaxial. There are so many opportunities for loss and noise, it is incredible it works at all. And it works well. Imagine if we had to use a double(or triple)-shielded coaxial cable with BNC connectors to connect our monitors and high data rate devices. The USB spec is amazing. USB-C finally brings decent usability to the connectors.

lsaferite 12y ago

I haven't been able to find anything saying how many wires are in the cable, does anyone here know and have a reference? Is it the full 24 wires mapped end-to-end or are some of the connectors mapped to a single wire? Like, the 4 USB 2.0 connectors, I imagine it makes little sense to have 4 physical wires there, right? Yet they obviously have the SuperSpeed lanes wired separately because they can run DP alt mode on one side of the connector and USB 3.1 on the other. I'd love to see something discussing this and it could affect the longer term viability of the physical connector spec. EDIT: Honestly, I'd love it if the spec said they must have 24 wires AND that balanced pairs would be twisted pairs. As long as the connector is durable I'm willing to pay more for a good cable designed to that spec.

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- lsaferite 12y ago
  From the official spec the max wires is 18 + shield. Also, from all my reading, USB 3.1 + DP Alt run at the same time. USB 3.1 only needs 2 of the 4 lanes. http://www.usb.org/developers/docs/ http://www.usb.org/developers/docs/
  - lsaferite 12y ago
    Reading the spec a little more, during Alt mode negotiation TX1n/TX1p, TX2n/TX2p, RX1n/RX1p, RX2n/RX2p, and SBU1/SBU2 are all available for reconfiguration. That's 4 balanced pairs + 2 wires. Additionally, if the connection is a direct-connect, like a docking station, then 3 additional pins become available: B5, B6, and B7. So, a dedicated docking station could have Power + USB 2.0 + 13 pins (4 balanced pairs + 5 extra) or Power + USB 2.0 + USB 3.1 + 9 pins (2 balanced pairs + 5 extra)