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16 years after a mass suicide, the webpage is still up
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- chimeracoder 13y agoFrom Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven%27s_Gate_(religious_group) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven%27s_Gate_(religious_gro... > Only one of the group's members, Rio DiAngelo/Richard Ford, did not kill himself: weeks before the suicides, in December 1996, DiAngelo agreed with Applewhite to leave the group so he could ensure future dissemination of Heaven's Gate videos and literature. This isn't surprising. The most dangerous viruses and parasites aren't the ones that kill their hosts immediately - they have to ensure their own survival first. If you view suicide cults as a meme (in Dawkin's terminology, not the Reddit usage of the word), then this makes sense.
- k3n 13y agoThat really shines a light into the mind of Applewhite, while he may have indeed been a lunatic, he knew his ideas were bullshit.
- md224 13y agoNot sure why this indicates he believed his ideas were bullshit... in my opinion, leaving material behind to spread his ideas after his own death suggests a truly held belief, not a purposeful scam.
- Myk267 13y agoIt would seem like they got people to believe that The End Was Nigh and that they should commit suicide to avoid said End (Yeah, hold on to your logic there). If he truly believed that it was the end, why would he need to stay behind to tend to other things? That seems like picking nits, though - these people clearly weren't the best and brightest in the first place.
- sanswork 13y agoI was under the impression they believed they were getting picked up by a space ship that was travelling with Hale Bop not that the end was nigh.
- SwellJoe 13y agoThe earth was being "recycled". That's why they wanted to hitch a ride on a space ship. So, yeah, end of the world is coming so kill yourself so you don't die.
- vidarh 13y agoRead their material - that does not appear to be accurate. While they did appear to believe the world would be "recycled" and potentially that this means a lot of people would/will die, the excerpts on their website does give vague descriptions of ways that people can be "protected and 'saved' from the approaching recycling". The difference would be that these people would still be "stuck" on this world, though they could "one day find them a member in the Level Above Human". Consider the similarity to the idea in christianity of the Rapture, where some christian sects expects certain sets of "true believers" to be "raptured", while the rest - believers and non-believers and sinners of all kinds alike - are "left behind", with various means of eventually being saved: The "recycling" or "spading under" of civilisation from Heavens Gate appears to be a form of the Rapture, with the possibility that many good people who have just not advanced far enough can survive, while the "true believers" are raptured. The difference being that in their version, it appears they believe in some sort of cyclic history for the earth, where there will be another opportunity at some point in the future.
- k3n 13y agoWhy would doing such require that member to leave the group?
- metric10 13y agoWhile I agree with the characterization of Heaven's Gate as a parasite or virus, I disagree that this is a means of "survival." Suicide cults are an ancient phenomenon, and a key to their success (I think) is ignorance. I hope the web page stays online. It serves as a monument to how wrong they where. Now that Heaven's Gate has run it's course, I think the biggest threat to the "virus" at this point is sunlight. And, plus, I think it's an important part of Internet history. The Internet during the '90s was an amazing transformation of society, and this site shows how old ideas embrace new means. It's fascinating from a sociological perspective.
- vidarh 13y ago> It serves as a monument to how wrong they where. Except it doesn't, for two reasons: People who are inclined to sympathise with them have no way of seeing any "failure". They left their bodies behind, sure. Wannabe believers will assume they've left with the aliens and are now happily enjoying the fruits of their belief. Secondly, cults does not work the way you'd expect them to: Failure does not diminish the belief of true believers. On the contrary, what we see time and time again is that while failure may drive away some people, for many cults failure serves as a "do or die" trigger: These people are so incredibly invested already, that they have a deep need to find a way of explaining the failure that can justify their belief to themselves, that many cults after a temporary lull experiences an increase in activity following a failure. E.g. the cult may decide the explanation for the failure of whatever event they are waiting for is that they have not been devout enough, or that more believers are needed, and redouble their efforts to bring about their goal. Now, I don't think the Heavens Gate site should be taken offline, mostly because there's plenty of worse material online, and unlike most extant cults Heavens Gate is pretty much entirely extinct, so they are not much of a danger to anyone. But don't assume a "failure" in predictions mean anything to these cults, even if a failure can be objectively proven.
- ics 13y ago> The group earned revenues by offering professional website development for paying clients under the name Higher Source. Wikipedia cites this[0] article which is pretty interesting. There even seems to be what I assume is a mirror of the original site: http://www.religio.de/highersource/server/ http://www.religio.de/highersource/server/ [0]: http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19970328&slug=2531080 http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=199...
- softbuilder 13y ago>The group earned revenues by offering professional website development This is the best part of their story. Just because a person does technical work doesn't exclude them from being a moron.
- VexXtreme 13y ago> Just because a person does technical work doesn't exclude them from being a moron. True that. I see it all the time. Though in practice, the most technically brilliant people are unlikely to be morons. It's usually the average and underachieving ones, IME.
- icebraining 13y agoPaul Frampton is hardly an underachiever, but he's still under house arrest in Argentina for drug smuggling. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/10/magazine/the-professor-the-bikini-model-and-the-suitcase-full-of-trouble.html http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/10/magazine/the-professor-the...
- tommorris 13y agoCult membership isn't just for "morons". There have been very intelligent people who, because of perfectly human errors in judgement have found themselves inside cult organisations. Look at Scientology and lots of other cults like it. The people in it aren't stupid. Brainwashed, perhaps. There are many tricks both seemingly logical/cognitive and emotional that people can be taken in by. The emotional side is important: these people show affection to people who join them, and they often target people who are at uncertain points in their lives. Cult-style groups have often gone after college students precisely because they are at a point in their life where they are unsure about their future and potentially emotionally volatile. There's a lot of people out there who are living unhappy lives, who find themselves alienated from society, who have a strong but unfulfilled desire to join together in a community with others, who lack self-confidence or enough self-belief to push back. Cults aren't just stupid people making stupid decisions: sometimes joining a cult is a decision made by an intelligent, educated person in a moment of weakness. And the way the thing is set up makes it not seem cultish when they are joining. Scientology don't tell you about Lord Xenu on day one. They lure you in with promises of making you a better person: reducing your stress and anxiety, helping you with addictions to drugs, tobacco, alcohol etc., helping you succeed in business or education or whatever, helping you have a better relationship with your partner or family. Out of that menu, there's something everyone will want. Those are all the same things advertisers lure people in with. Falling for that kind of pitch doesn't make you stupid, it makes you human.
- aaron695 13y agoI think you've missed the point on a lot of stuff here. Viruses and parasites gain nothing from killing their host, hence most don't. Heavens Gate has a very very small following today, so no it's not a meme by any means, it's failed to spread at all. The religious memes aren't herded towards a path. There are millions of religions created and through evolution some succeed while most of them fail.
- sejje 13y agoI watched a really interesting TED talk last night about this: http://www.ted.com/talks/paul_ewald_asks_can_we_domesticate_germs.html http://www.ted.com/talks/paul_ewald_asks_can_we_domesticate_...
- Matt_Cutts 13y agoAnd the page still has hidden text at the bottom of the page. Truth be told, this is one of my favorite examples of hidden text, because it shows that people don't always use spam techniques for making money. I haven't had much luck contacting the maintainer of that page to ask them to remove the hidden text.
- ruttiger 13y agoWhy are you trying to contact them to remove the hidden text?
- ateevchopra 13y agomaybe to improve their SEO.
- patdennis 13y agoFrom his HN bio: >I'm the head of the webspam team at Google.
- bound008 13y agoIt's a joke
- calvinlough 13y agoI love how Yoda makes it into the list.
- aaron695 13y ago
- foxhop 13y agoIt isn't going to be online much longer. Domain Name: HEAVENSGATE.COM Creation Date: 1997-12-18 05:00:00Z Registrar Registration Expiration Date: 2013-12-17 05:00:00Z
- nkuttler 13y agoServer: Microsoft-IIS/7.5 X-Powered-By: ASP.NET X-Powered-By-Plesk: PleskWin Does 7.5 still get security support?
- dan1234 13y agoAbsolutely. IIS 7.5 is included in Windows Server 2008 R2, which will be supported until at least 2015 (2020 for extended support)
- bcl 13y agoHosting is by hostgator 192.185.7.203 203.7.185.192.in-addr.arpa. 3600 IN PTR pss010a.win.hostgator.com.
- BorisMelnik 13y agowelp, may as well scan for open ports and look for vulnerabilities
- code_duck 13y agoOn a large commercial shared host... Okay. I have a client who is hosted on hostgator, if you find any issues let please let us know!
- ams6110 13y agoClearly not the server to which would originally have been deployed. Someone is actively maintaining it.
- workbench 13y ago
- deweerdt 13y agoThis article from 2012 offers some background on the page: http://lasvegas.cbslocal.com/2012/05/02/heavens-gate-website-still-active/ http://lasvegas.cbslocal.com/2012/05/02/heavens-gate-website...
- adamnemecek 13y agoThe wiki page of the sect links to this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alien_abduction_insurance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alien_abduction_insurance
- werner34 13y agoI clicked on that link as well and was astonished
- gotrecruit 13y agoby what? that there are people who are stupid like that, or that enterprising individuals or companies would capitalize on their stupidity? i feel like both of those things are well documented in humanity by now...
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- STRiDEX 13y agoInteresting that the G in gate from the top image is the green bay packers logo from the NFL.
- dsl 13y agoI have bad news for you if you think the packers game up with the idea of a stylized G.
- chris_wot 13y agoTheir stance on suicide: http://www.heavensgate.com/misc/letter.htm http://www.heavensgate.com/misc/letter.htm
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- maaku 13y agoWell, were you expecting someone to take it down?
- Timmmmbob 13y agoI was expecting nobody to pay for hosting! Websites don't run on magic.
- danso 13y agoHow sadly amusing is it that this website can be maintained in its original state 16 years after its owners died, yet publishing companies today routinely fail to protect heir still-alive brands. Case in point: Michelin Guides http://www.constructaquote.com/business-insurance-blog/index.php/2013/02/michelin-guides-fury-michel-guides-website/#.UpFRXrK9KK0 http://www.constructaquote.com/business-insurance-blog/index...
- atmosx 13y agoWas Einstein who said that quote about the universe and human stupidity, trying to describe infinity? Cantor would argue though that some infinities are bigger than others..
- dobbsbob 13y agoTheir indoctrination vids are a must watch for craziness: http://youtu.be/AqSZhwu1Rwo http://youtu.be/AqSZhwu1Rwo Check out that thousand yard stare. This guy reminds me of that insane space cult leader from Star Trek TOS. Apparently this cult was full of ST fans, including wearing "away team" gear while they killed themselves.
- mariodiana 13y agoI remember hearing this at the time, but it's mentioned on her Wikipedia page as well. The brother of Nichelle Nicholas ("Uhura," as I'm sure you know) was a member of the cult and took part in the mass suicide. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nichelle_Nichols#Personal_life http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nichelle_Nichols#Personal_life
- mambodog 13y agoI saw these videos recently as part of Captain Murphy's Duality[1]. Almost seems like something from a movie; it's hard to believe this really happened. [1] http://vimeo.com/53603603 http://vimeo.com/53603603
- aryeh_hoffman 13y agoIf you look carefully, he also appears to literally have a "forked tongue"
- nsxwolf 13y agoI haven't looked at this in 16 years, but I remembered verbatim one of the links and got a little chill waiting to see it again as I scrolled down: "Our position against suicide".
- mortyseinfeld 13y agoAnd very Geocities looking.
- ksrm 13y ago>Computer technology enables everyone from Madison Avenue executives to Government agencies to keep a record of your every move, and "flags" are thrown up any time you don't fit their pre-conceived mold of what a good citizen should be. Our right to travel and remain nomadic is rapidly being restricted. We often travel light on spur-of-the-moment instructions, however we can no longer take an airline flight on short notice without harassment. Anyone who purchases a ticket with cash without advance reservations and does not have a load of baggage to check will likely be subjected to baggage searches, interrogation, and suspicion. Even when they can find nothing whatsoever that is questionable, authorities have at times reluctantly let our members proceed, convinced that they are indeed guilty of some crime but too clever to be caught. Police presence at border crossings have increased to the point that you feel you are in a war zone. About right.
- chias 13y agoWow... <font size="6"><font color="#ff0000">stuff</font color></font size>
- InclinedPlane 13y agoThat was the norm back then. Just be glad the closing tags are present and in the correct order. Those were dark times.
- fyolnish 13y agoAren't attributes in closing tags meaningless?
- code_duck 13y agoI've been working with an awful shopping cart product with template 'tags' that produce HTML containing <center> and many other unsemantic abominations. You also see <font> tags still come up on stack overflow... Old tutorials will never die, it seems.
- chias 13y agonothing wrong with font tags per se (well back then, anyway)... more a matter of what appears to be a complete lack of understanding of the difference between a tag and an attribute. The page is a wealth of HTML abominations and bad quotation mark placement: alt="To Access Our Book: "Heaven's Gate" and so on
- enko 13y agoThis is a fascinating, well-written account, a decade after the events: http://www.laweekly.com/2007-03-22/news/heaven-s-gate-the-sequel/full/ http://www.laweekly.com/2007-03-22/news/heaven-s-gate-the-se...
- heavensgate 13y agoRight after the mass suicide we took over DNS for heavensgate.com. We pointed it at aolsucks.org until their t1 melted. https://web.archive.org/web/19990429131245/http://www.aolsucks.org/hacked.html https://web.archive.org/web/19990429131245/http://www.aolsuc... We took control of DNS for two weeks. http://linbsd.org/geek.mp3 http://linbsd.org/geek.mp3 details the rest of the fun we had from snafu.org. The person who did the hack put himself as technical contact... Glad we got away with it...
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- BorisMelnik 13y agolol @ meta keywords <meta name="keywords" content="Heaven's Gate, Heaven's Gate, Heaven's Gate, Heaven's Gate, Heaven's Gate, Heaven's Gate, ufo, ufo, ufo, ufo, ufo, ufo, space alien, space alien, space alien, space alien, space alien, space alien, extraterrestrial, extraterrestrial, extraterrestrial, extraterrestrial, extraterrestrial, extraterrestrial, millennium, millennium, millennium, millennium, millennium, millennium, millennium, misinformation, misinformation, misinformation, misinformation, misinformation, misinformation, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, freedom, second coming, second coming, second coming, second coming, second coming, second coming, angels, angels, angels, angels, angels, angels, end times, end times, end times, end times, end times, end times, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, God, God, God, God, God, God">
- InclinedPlane 13y agoI remember watching the "Hale-Bopp object" fiasco unfold in real time. It's really quite surreal to think about. A person takes a completely innocent picture and it contains a perfectly typical example of CCD bleeding from a background star. And yet in the hands of someone filled with ignorance and a willingness toward self-delusion they are able to convince themselves that it is in fact a picture of an alien space ship trailing the comet. And many other people fall into the same delusion despite many people trying to correct their misperceptions. And then other folks who have been stewing in their own brand of delusion mix this new delusion with their own eventually leading to mass suicide. It makes you think about the importance of critical reasoning skills.
- workbench 13y agoCheck out any UFO nut site and you'll see hundred page threads of people over analysing jpeg and mpg compression marks.
- shubhamjain 13y agoA town in my state had a similar case where a family of 5 including 3 children committed suicide ( 3 survivors) by consuming poison [1]. Motive? Apparently, they wished to meet Lord Shiva after their death. They even made a video of it where each one was very delighted before the act. In India, lunacy in name of religion is not uncommon but I was deeply disappointed by the kind of foolishness that prevails in my country even with fairly educated people. However, it is surprising how such an incident could happen in US in name of some Sci-Fi Heaven-Earth bullshit. [1]: http://ibnlive.in.com/news/rajasthan-5-of-a-family-commit-suicide-believing-they-will-meet-god/381854-3-239.html http://ibnlive.in.com/news/rajasthan-5-of-a-family-commit-su...
- joshstrange 13y ago"Lunacy in the name of religion" Umm... That's par for the course....
- girvo 13y agoA tautology, as far as I'm concerned.
- inanov 13y agoReligiousTolerance.org states that: 'A couple of the surviving members of the group who did not "leave" have been maintaining their web site at http://www.heavensgate.com' http://www.heavensgate.com' (http://j.mp/1cKc0KA http://j.mp/1cKc0KA)
- FrankenPC 13y agoOf course I had to contact the Kingdom of Heaven admin to see if they made it to the comet: rep@heavensgate.com. I wonder if their nads were waiting for them?
- elwell 13y ago<font size=+1> i didn't know you could do that!
- elwell 13y agohttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHz9it70TdI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHz9it70TdI
- testsheep 13y agoWhat if it was real and they are gods now.
- foobar388383 13y agoAt the time, the site was hosted by Spacestar Communications (now defunct). Now, it's hosted by Cyrus One. I wonder who maintains it.
- axelfreeman 13y agoThere is a full documentary on youtube about "heavensgate". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBTLThA0wOw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBTLThA0wOw