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Mac Pro
- serf 13y agothe iTrashcan looks fantastic. iCan is super motivational, too.
- xyos 13y agoiBin
- imeidolon 13y agoYou can just see would-be entrepreneurs designing their trash can attachments right now.
- jiggy2011 13y agoWhen I clicked on that page and saw "The future of desktop computing.." and that trash can slide into view I actually thought it was supposed to be a metaphor.
- Aqueous 13y agoThey said they were abandoning skeuomorphism but they sure made the Mac Pro look like an actual waste bin.
- hornetblack 13y agoI've nicknamed it the Dustbin. As the air intake is on the bottom. It can fit on your desk... Well it will have to in order for it not to replace my vacuum cleaner.
- untog 13y agoThis page is a fantastic example of great development skills used in a way that is utterly infuriating to use. I don't want it to animate when I use my scroll wheel. I want the page to scroll. Off topic, but were this and the Air the only product announced? If so, I'm disappointed- I was hoping to pick up an updated Macbook Retina 13". Oh well.
- smackfu 13y agoYeah, I ended up using the buttons on the side. "Rotate your mouse an indeterminate amount" is not a good UI interaction.
- sigkill 13y agoI tried Firefox on Windows 8. I did not find any animation effects. However, Chrome on Windows 8 has those animations, and the applications' scroll bar is hidden. Bad UI indeed.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- skizm 13y agoJust an FYI, you can use the arrow keys (L and R) to scroll. Much easier.
- mason55 13y agoSpace bar as well
- rz2k 13y agoOther than the operating system previews, they also seem to be standardizing around 802.11ac for the airport related products.
- quchen 13y agoI had to enable JS to find out what you're talking about. The result was 200 megs of memory consumption and the realization I may be using a different kind of internet than most people when using NoScript. (I'm surprised they have a non-JS version.)
- mikeash 13y agoI imagine they designed it for trackpads, not scroll wheel mice. It works pretty well on a trackpad.
- podperson 13y agoThe design seems pretty ugly to me, but it is functional. It's essentially a wind tunnel with all the circuit boards placed against it.
- damon_c 13y agoYeah, the cylinder design seemed a little bit "what?" at first, but after seeing the airflow demo... it makes a lot more sense.
- bluthru 13y agoIt's a pure cylinder. How can a basic form be ugly? I'm pretty impressed that they didn't slap a logo on the front.
- stcredzero 13y agoA cylinder is not a Platonic solid.
- fluffyllemon 13y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platonic_solid https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platonic_solid
- cake 13y agoGood point, I haven't seen any logo. Maybe it's still in the works and will later.
- mike-cardwell 13y agoOn the animation titled "Expansion, vastly expanded" you see an apple logo on the case briefly before the animation stops. Top/center.
- adolph 13y agoJust like the good old Cube. Only the guts are in a triangle.
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- skrause 13y agoIf you can't upgrade anything easily, it's bascially just a very fast Mac Mini.
- Aqueous 13y agoMac Pro: The world's fastest trash can.
- sandipc 13y agoReminds me of the Cube. But Thunderbolt and USB3 make this much, much more versatile...
- pdknsk 13y agoApple developers don't use Pivot? Text is cut off left and right on a 1200x1920 screen.
- stox 13y agoNext up, the iSphere.
- r00fus 13y agoI think iCone has precedence.
- chacha102 13y agoYeah, but the iSphere would fit perfectly on top of the iCan.
- eumenides1 13y agoiTorus. it could fit around an iCan, hold an iSphere or iCone. And think of all the Thunderbolt devices you can plug into a donut shape! See you WWDC 2014!
- spyder 13y agoand they would look like an "i" :)
- bitwize 13y agoThey already did the iHemisphere (2nd gen iMac).
- speedyrev 13y agoThe last upgradable mac is now dead. I thought the whole idea of the pro was the ability to put in graphic and other specialty cards as needed for "Pro" use. This looks like another cute consumer PC. Maybe they'll sell it along side the HP's at Sam's Club.
- gecko 13y agoI think the idea here is that, between plentiful Firewire 2 and Thunderbolt 2, you now have enough external bandwidth that you shouldn't need internal cards. When given the choice, I prefer this route, since it means I can transport my proprietary stuff to other machines, or even use them with laptops in a pinch. That might not work for you, granted, but the amount of bandwidth available between all those ports (20 GB/s in the case of Thunderbolt 2) should be enough to cover most use-cases.
- reportingsjr 13y agoA correction: Thunderbolt 2 can go up to 20Gbits/s not 20GBytes/s. Thunderbolt uses a 4x PCI-E 2.0 connection. Things like graphics cards use 16x PCI-E 3.0 at this point which is 128Gbits/s.
- kbuck 13y agoActually, a 16x PCIe 3.0 slot can do ~128Gbit/s each way - ~256Gbit/s in total[1]. [1]: http://www.pcisig.com/news_room/faqs/pcie3.0_faq/#EQ3 http://www.pcisig.com/news_room/faqs/pcie3.0_faq/#EQ3
- marknutter 13y agoYou can't upgrade it? What are those thunderbolt 2 ports for then?
- smackfu 13y agoThe fastest PCI Express is faster than the fastest Thunderbolt 2.
- r00fus 13y ago1.0Gbps writes for the internal SSD sounds pretty good. Wonder what component provider they're using?
- Already__Taken 13y agoThat's pretty standard for the PCIe type SSD cards. I've been watching them for a while I didn't know you could boot off them but it appeard that has changed [Scan Components](http://www.scan.co.uk/shop/computer-hardware/all/hard-drives-ssd/solid-state-drives-(ssd-pcie)-64gb-2tb http://www.scan.co.uk/shop/computer-hardware/all/hard-drives...)
- warrenmiller 13y agoApple Urn
- aboutaaron 13y agoI look forward to all the R2D2 mods this will birth.
- wluu 13y agoAgreed, it does look like R2D2. It was as if Apple lured R2D2 to the dark side and released as the Mac Pro!
- jmduke 13y agoApple is doubling down on their segmentation here. They're clearly abandoning (I don't mean this in a pejorative sense) a mass appeal with this new iteration and targeting it specifically to 'actual' professionals: graphic designers, video editors, etc.
- stormbrew 13y agoAre you suggesting the Mac Pro ever had mass appeal? This strikes me as the opposite, abandoning the 'actual' professionals in favour of a weird mass market design.
- potatolicious 13y agoI don't see how this is a mass market design. It's a bunch of Xeons cores paired with ECC RAM, stupid-fast storage, and way more GPU power than any reasonable person can use. And probably priced to match. Weird industrial design != mass market.
- rednukleus 13y agoI assume he is referring to the strange decision to make the thing so small (and beautiful) at the expense of any internal expandability. So professionals are going to have all sorts of hard drives and external graphics cards and optical drives etc hanging off this thing.
- brusch 13y agosorry if I am barking up the wrong tree.. but do you think it will be beautiful with all the breakout cables ? For me this whole thing looks like a blast from the past - my trusty C64 with everything outside the box (and there were some articles in the 64er magazine [german magazine] which showed how to build everything into a single case for the neat, "integrated" look)
- rednukleus 13y ago
- wcfields 13y agoThe cube flopped. Let's try a cylinder.
- Finbarr 13y agoI'm amused by all the disparaging comments about this new design. Every time Apple launches an incredible product it is always immediately decried. I'll wait til these are on sale before judging them.
- anonymousab 13y agoDisparaging remarks? What, do you have something against trash cans?
- anonymousab 13y agoDisparaging remarks? What, do you have something against trash cans?
- hkmurakami 13y agoThe design is reminiscent of the 20th anniversary Macintosh. https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=20th%20anniversary%20macintosh&tbs=imgo:1&biw=1269&bih=1416&sei=fim2UYf7F9HUigLm2YDQCQ https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=20th%20anniversary%...
- carlob 13y agoMore like the 20th anniversary Macintosh subwoofer. The cpu was behind and below the screen, just like an iMac.
- Samuel_Michon 13y agoWhat you’re looking at is the Bose subwoofer that came with the Spartacus, it’s not the actual computer. Interestingly enough, the subwoofer contains the computer’s power supply. http://512pixels.net/2012/12/tam/ http://512pixels.net/2012/12/tam/
- speeder 13y agoIs someone seeing something more on this page than me? I am using a the Rockmelt browser on a Mac Mini, and I am seeing only the trashcan thing... The page has some secret trick or something to have more info???
- windsurfer 13y agoI had to click a tiny arrow on the bottom. This is a great example of minimalism gone too far.
- potatolicious 13y agoDoesn't seem to work on some browsers. Not on the latest Firefox but works on Chrome and Safari.
- mike-cardwell 13y agoI'm using Firefox 21 on top of Debian Wheezy. Works fine for me.
- kevincrane 13y agoIt works on Firefox, it just delays for a long time before you can scroll, tricking you into thinking that you're just looking at a boring teaser page picture.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- rurounijones 13y agoYea that is pretty crappy. In their defence though, the page works perfectly with JS disabled if you just want the info.
- v-yadli 13y agoIf you have a scroll mouse. Scroll down. And scroll down many times to trigger the animation. It took me quite a while to realize this... =D
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- chiph 13y agoThere's no way a cat could sleep on it.
- thomaslutz 13y agoPrice would be nice.
- xrt 13y agoThe design reminds me a bit of my "sunflower" iMac, which was a really nice machine.
- programminggeek 13y agoThis is incredibly beautiful and I'm sure quite expensive, but I want one, even it makes no sense to have one. Good work Apple
- dakrisht 13y agoWorst webpage of all-time. LET ME SCROLL damn it
- KaiserPro 13y agoHurrah! GPUs sealed directly into the machine. No more keeping old macs alive with extra GPUs. (the quadro 4000 and k5000 really helped the 2009 macpro) It also appears to only have one CPU. From what the page says its only got one Memory controller, which as the "new"* Xeons have onboard memory controllers. So that seems a bit of a fail. *as in the same Xeons that have been in the HP Z620/820 for the last 8 months
- wtallis 13y agoThis Mac Pro will be using the Ivy Bridge-based Xeons, not the Sandy Bridge-based ones that are in the HP machines you refer to.
- KaiserPro 13y agoIndeed this appears to be the case. The only thing appears to be going for this mac is that it has nice disk bandwidth. The Z series workstation is going to be cheaper, and almost twice as fast+. (assuming one buys the correct fusionio card.) it also has the advantage of taking normal pci slot graphics cards, which can be upgraded later. +owing to having a second CPU
- brudgers 13y agoThe design is risky, one bad chip could ruin it.
- nvmc 13y agoAnother astronomically expensive Mac Pro. This time hermetically sealed and unupgradable. Lovely.
- marknutter 13y agoWhat's the price?
- randyrand 13y agoIt hasn't been announced, but xenon processors and PCI-E flash storage is typically much more expensive than the Core Processor line or SSD storage since they are almost exclusively marketed towards servers. That said, disregarding the Apple tax I'm sure Apple gets pretty good deals on their hardware so it is possible that it will be at similar price point as the current line (which was typically regarded as over priced and outdated anyways)
- binarycrusader 13y agoActually it appears somewhat upgradeable; the memory is seated in standard slots and is clearly user-serviceable. The SSD appears to be as well; it may require third-party kit ala OWC (One World Computing) but oh well. The only two remaining components that may or may not be are the GPU boards and the processor. The system seems serviceable enough so far. But let's wait for final specs and user guides before passing judgment.
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- rubyn00bie 13y agoAwesome. I've been wanting to play League of Legends in 4k.
- rheide 13y agoIt looks like a garbage bin.
- alan_cx 13y agoI thought it looked like a car boot mounted sub-woofer.
- glenra 13y ago"Okay, we COULD just label the ports with regular high color contrast paint. Say, white paint on a black background or black paint on a white background. But that would be TOO EASY and the panel would then really 'pop' against our otherwise monolithic clean design. Which would be distracting." "But during actual use the ports are going to be on the BACK of the device (so you won't see it) and will have random stuff plugged into some of the ports, which ALSO would disturb the pure clean lines of the thing, so who cares?" "No, no, we've got to label this thing with black labels on a black background, so it blends in." "How will people be able to see the labels?" "Easy. We'll add LED backlighting!" "How will people TURN ON the LED backlighting, without the button to do THAT destroying our perfect design?" "Simple - there's no button for it - you just move the machine to turn on the backlight!" "What if you want the backlight to STAY on for a while, longer than the default?" "Just keep shaking the machine. Or duct-tape a vibrator to it." "That's PERFECT!"
- notatoad 13y agoconsidering the labels are totally unnecessary, i don't see the problem. it's not like people are going to be plugging USB cables into the thunderbolt ports or the power cable into the HDMI port by accident.
- ajdecon 13y agoSays someone who has never worked tech support.... cries (Yes, it's a workstation. Yes, I have worked with engineers who did this. Don't make life any harder for your users than you have to.)
- vacri 13y agoA USB jack can fit into an RJ45. Still, there is something of a problem in that sometimes people plug things in while the power is off, and computers are often kept tucked away in dim corners. Looking at the machine from an angle, it's not always obvious which connectors are where, especially if you're not a techy who could name ports in their sleep.
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- ansimionescu 13y agoI love watching people moan about this yet unreleased product. I think the new Mac Pro episode will resemble the iPad one - lots of "ohemgee it's like just a bigger ipod, lol, how stupid do they think we are, kthx?" reactions, when in fact this product will probably push a new paradigm shift in the way workstations are built i.e. moving away from the plastic pieces of shit ubiquitously sold now. Seriously, I dare you to look around a regular "PC customization" website e.g. [1]. Apart from Razer and maybe Alienware nobody has even tried to really innovate the workstation landscape. I remember when I was building one of my first desktops with my dad - 20 years ago. A final thought: Apple has a million flaws (mostly software and systems, grr), but they didn't get where they are for being stupid or for not understanding the market, so at least give them some fucking credit. [1] http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/view/Vortex-500-gaming-pc/ http://www.pcspecialist.co.uk/view/Vortex-500-gaming-pc/
- doktrin 13y ago> part from Razer and maybe Alienware nobody has even tried to really innovate the workstation landscape By and large this holds true, however an increasing number of manufacturers are offering pre-built slim form factor PCs. They may not be radical re-designs of the sort Apple is trying to push, but they're certainly a departure from the norm [1]. [1] http://www.falcon-nw.com/desktops/tiki http://www.falcon-nw.com/desktops/tiki
- pdog 13y agoFor those that don't remember, the biggest innovation in workstations is that we can build them out of consumer-grade PC parts.
- mojuba 13y agoCuriously, my first association was "jet engine", was amused to learn that to many it's a trash can. Am I the only one whose breath was taken away by this new design? Power desktop seriously revisited for the first time since the 80's, anyone?
- bargl 13y agoThis was my first thought. http://goo.gl/nVBNJ http://goo.gl/nVBNJ
- kryten 13y agoCertainties: 1. Use of glue somewhere which knackers any chance of repairing it. Memory, disks and that is it. 2. Proprietary fan which will get noisy after time and cost a fortune to replace. First step will be to put it on the floor so you can't hear it... leading to... 2a. Someone is going to put a half drank coffee cup in it and blow it up. 2b. Plume of hairballs every time a cat owner fires it up as it'll suck in every bit of crap off the floor (the dirtiest place in your house). 2c. Someone will whack their noggin on the desk while they're trying to plug their headphones into it. Perhaps I'm bitter because my 2010 MBP blew up spectacularly, but I'm seeing a lot of visual design over sensible engineering in Apple recently. The iMac is a sensible design over this. If only it wasn't such a bastard to get inside it. I tend to use computers for years (typing this on a 7 year old Lenovo). I'd like the opportunity not to fill up a landfill after a couple of years.
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- mark-r 13y agoUp to 3 4K displays at the same time? It seems Retina desktop monitors are on their way. I'm surprised they weren't announced at the same time.
- pseudometa 13y agoWait till the actual release date! There is not a good reason for them to announce new apple displays until they can actually be used with their hardware. Thunderbolt 2 doesn't even exist yet.
- rhizome 13y agoHe mentioned "...your favorite 3rd party displays" when introducing the 4K-ness.
- rsync 13y agoMy current mac pro has 6 displays attached, three of which are "high resolution" (2560x1600). I think that the 4k displays require 2x thunderbolt ? Or else why would there be a limitation of 3 ? So all 6 TB ports used, and no ability to add a 4th display. EDIT: well, I could add a 4th with HDMI, but it would be low resolution, and the 5th and 6th displays are impossible. Also, all 6 TB ports used up, so no further expansion is possible.
- gfosco 13y agoThunderbolt can be daisy-chained just like USB, so you're not limited to just the 6 provided ports.
- rsync 13y ago"Thunderbolt can be daisy-chained just like USB, so you're not limited to just the 6 provided ports." Ok. Still trying to understand the "3" limitation on 4k displays. If it's a bandwidth issue, you'd think the number would be 4, since there are two cards. And if it is bandwidth, then presumably 3 4k displays plugged in and ... even the empty TB ports become unusable since there is no more bandwidth available ? I just want to plug in 6 monitors and am trying to figure out how :)
- keithpeter 13y agoSo instead of a Cube we have a Cylinder. I'm sure it will look nice with a couple of large monitors and a Cintiq. The combination will still cost less than even a small company car.
- bane 13y agoThe New Mac Pro, the world's fastest trashcan introduced by the world's least usable web page. More seriously, I think it's pretty cool, I like that the design has a point, thermal management, rather than just having a weird shape to look all "designy". It's hard for me to accept that this is a pro machine though, very over integrated for that kind of role. And also, for a company that's not supposed to be focused on specs, there's a lot of specs on that page (when it works).
- kailuowang 13y agoApple needs to design a really cool sticker sign that says "No smoking ashes! This is an extremely expensive computer!"
- keithpeter 13y agoSo instead of a Cube we have a Cylinder. I'm sure it will look nice with a couple of large monitors and a Cintiq. The combination will still cost less than even a small company car.
- kailuowang 13y agoApple needs to design a really cool sticker sign that says "No smoking ashes! This is an extremely expensive computer!"
- kevincrane 13y agoIt took me embarrassingly long to figure out how that website worked. The text telling me to scroll took like 10-15 seconds to show up, so I kept exiting the page and looking at these comments to see if there was more than just a picture. Eventually I figured it out, but still had to scroll slowly and methodically through to see everything.
- pasquinelli 13y agoyeah, i felt like a bit of an idiot because i couldn't figure out how to go to the next slide. then i found that i could click the dots on the right side. later, i accidentally scrolled and it took me to the next slide. i was all like, "ah, that's what they meant by scroll".
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- philip1209 13y agoThe product descriptions seem just horribly written: > Something that provides an extremely powerful argument against the status quo. > The new Mac Pro packs an unprecedented amount of power in an unthinkable amount of space. A big reason we were able to do that is the ingenious unified thermal core > Not only does it feature a state-of-the-art AMD FirePro workstation-class GPU with up to 6GB of dedicated VRAM — it features two of them. > The new Mac Pro looks unlike any other computer. Because it is unlike any other computer.
- SPSteinbeck 13y agoI thought that as well.
- keithpeter 13y agoSo instead of a Cube we have a Cylinder. I'm sure it will look nice with a couple of large monitors and a Cintiq. The combination will still cost less than even a small company car and will be able to handle most of the tasks people use workstations for!
- jroseattle 13y agoFirst thing I noticed was all the dark -- what, did someone turn off all the lights? Where's the white that has dominated Apple material for so long? But hey, give Tim Cook some credit here. This is literally the first significant product release during his tenure as CEO where the major elements of the update weren't simply screen-size or resolution. I don't have a lot of confidence this is earth-shattering, but it will be interesting to see how this is received.
- bjz_ 13y agoIndeed. Despite how the product fares, this kind of courage makes me hopeful about his leadership into the future.
- Samuel_Michon 13y agoThis product must have been in development for years. In his biography (2011), Steve Jobs said he was working on an exciting new product, I think this was it. He also said Ive had already made the designs for the new products of the next 3 years. That’s not to say that Cook has to prove himself, he’s already done that for years. However, this product has Jobs written all over it (he was mad about powerful workstations with outrageous designs). http://www.forbes.com/sites/briancaulfield/2011/10/25/steve-jobs-bio-apple-has-3-years-of-new-products-in-jonathan-ives-studio/ http://www.forbes.com/sites/briancaulfield/2011/10/25/steve-...
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- jroseattle 13y agoI can't imagine Jobs would think this was an exciting new product, given that it is really not targeted at the masses. Not to talk down about the new Mac pro, but it's largely just new form factor plus latest components. It just doesn't strike me as something Jobs would label "exciting". Jobs did probably have his hand in it at some time, though.
- Dramatize 13y agoHow well will it play the new crop of game? Battlefield 4 etc? (serious question).
- malkia 13y agoAsk EA, or the friendly folks at DICE
- fuzzywalrus 13y agoI've been using the same Mac Pro since 2008. I bought an ATI Radeon 6970 around a year or so ago and extended its life that much more. For most of my computer's life, its had a PCIe eSATA card and an external case. It works great still but its starting to show its age. I can't say I'm too excited about a computer that's relegated to an much more expensive Mac Mini. Thunderbolt 2 is nice but its a poor substitute for internal drive bays and 16x PCIe.
- bnastic 13y ago> Thunderbolt 2 is nice but its a poor substitute for internal drive bays and 16x PCIe. Why, exactly? I don't know how many lanes will be in the Thunderbolt2 (haven't checked the specs), but I have a Pegasus Thunderbolt RAID storage (4 drives), which is really fast. SSD sys drive + Thunderbolt storage = win in my books.
- mturmon 13y agoAgree (I have a Pegasus TB RAID also). Thunderbolt changes the calculus for system upgrades. Glad to see someone exploiting this.
- drawkbox 13y agoYes I love the design. But the main thing with the Mac Pro that I love is I can swap a drive, memory etc without walking through the mall to the Apple Store. I have shied away from too many iMacs for this reason (I have 2, both failed at times where I needed them now - one a drive from Seagate and one a video card which pretty much kills that beautiful screen along with it). As long as it is easy to swap memory, a drive externally, and maybe a video card then I am cool with it. Otherwise customizable computers from Apple are no longer. This definitely explains why it took a while to update the Mac Pro. A nice surprise today.
- danielcampos93 13y agoI wonder if you can use the center to play office basketball with the paper scraps. If it gets hot because of usage you may even have a fun little fire pit to use. Regardless it looks cool and it may have issues but it will be a great computer, overpriced but great.
- andre 13y agoOnly 2 things that I don't like about it: 1) price, 2) can't upgrade. Otherwise it's very impressive.
- JulianMorrison 13y agoIf Apple can save the desktop, I will thank them.
- ChuckMcM 13y agoAs a design asthetic I find it fairly interesting. By working toward a design managing the thermals in a way that allow for more heat removal while allowing it to not sound like a 747 on takeoff is good. I suspect your typical desktop machine will benefit from that kind of thinking. Also for a long time Intel was trying to push all of the expansion boards outside the case with USB, and Apple seems close to achieving this with thunderbolt. Leaving the primary chassis as the system/holder for CPU+Memory+GPU with perhaps some boot media, and putting anything else outside. I can't wait to see on in action to see how well this strategy works in practice vs in slideware.
- snuze 13y agoThunderbolt was co-developed with Intel.
- aylons 13y agoThunderbolt is actually a few PCIe 3 lanes (4 in the original incarnation) and a display port in a cable. This way, an external peripheral is not inferior to most on board alternatives in terms of throughput, and has not room for interesting things add size is no longer a constraint. I am developing my first PCIe project and must say I am still shocked on how powerful and underutilized the bus is. Hope Thunderbolt solves this - peripherals could be much powerful than today, from SSDs and USB sticks to high bandwidth data acquisition tools.
- monkmartinez 13y ago"... to high bandwidth data acquisition tools...." I see what you did there.
- koralatov 13y agoIn the ways the heat management is designed, it reminds me of the oft-maligned G4 Cube, which used the same components around the edges, airflow through the centre idea to cool the machine. The small size of the unit also reinforces the similarity for me.
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- Aardwolf 13y agoAll I see is a cylinder? I've seen a lot of Star Trek lately. It would fit in right next to other alien spacecraft against the special effect space backdrop of The Original Series.
- rdl 13y agoI'm a big fan of everything except less RAM capacity. Getting the disks out of the case makes a lot of sense -- 4 drives was never enough to be meaningful. A boot SSD and a big 8+ drive external RAID on TB2 seems a lot better (ideally with an SSD or more RAM to cache), and/or NAS/SAN. Curious where it will be priced; if it's $1999 or less for a usable base config, it could be a default. Mini never really made a lot of sense as a desktop. It's depressing leaving an rMBP docked all the time.
- ericd 13y agoUnfortunately, I think the CAD cards and Xeons might make it impossible to price at that level, unless the base config is severely pared down.
- rdl 13y agoOne low-end xeon (and one ati) is pretty low end. Xeons are not that much of a premium at the lower levels. ECC RAM is worth it to me. (the question is where the low end is vs. Mac Mini; I'd consider a low end one as a HT box vs. a Mac Mini, even)
- ericd 13y agoIt sounds like people have them pegged as FirePro W9000s, which retail for >$1500, but that's probably the top option, with the lowest end being a much wimpier card. So you may be right. (Also, I didn't realize they had ditched the dual-CPU approach, though that was probably a good decision)
- snorkel 13y agoWhoever buys one of these promise us you will pose an Obi Wan doll behind it flipping off the tractor beam switch.
- alinspired 13y agoThe race to get the first donut-shaped accessory is on! And If I ever would want a non-customizable computer I'd get an macbook air
- xer0x 13y agoNo one is talking about the HTML on that page?! Seriously, what kind of geeks are you... ;)
- smegel 13y ago"no computer has been built this way before" Well technically water cooling provides a common thermal core.
- squidsoup 13y agoThe more I look at this design, the more I think it's absolutely brilliant. Increasingly we're seeing fantastically small form factors for mid-ranged desktop computers like the Intel NUC and the Mac Mini, yet high end workstations are still stuck in massive, ugly ATX towers. This seems to elegantly solve the problem of squeezing components that tend to run very hot, into a relatively small space. The shared heat sync and cooling pipe is really clever.
- kayoone 13y agothat is because most people using high end workstations dont care about how it looks or how big it is.
- squidsoup 13y agoWhile only some people may care about the size or design of their workstation, I suspect that nearly everyone cares about how noisy it is. The design of the Mac Pro should make it relatively quiet I would wager.
- yoster 13y agoPersonally, I have been waiting a very long time for this. PC users need not read this. I love this company as they have revolutionized many things. Just the App Store alone gives me enough reason to be loyal forever. iOS... just beautiful. The Mac Pro... mind blown..
- antirez 13y agoI don't even care if it will be really great or not in the practice at the moment (even if I hope it will be great), but it is so reassuring and warm to see somebody trying new things...
- jongraehl 13y agoNice design. I hope it's quiet (is the bottom air intake really sufficient?) Will it accommodate any standard parts (PCIe cards?) other than memory/drives? Is the "one fan" concept patented?
- Lexarius 13y agoThey're going with external expansion options. There are enclosures you can buy for PCIe cards to plug them in to the Thunderbolt ports if you need to.
- mbell 13y agoPersonally I couldn't care less about the design, it would be sitting behind several large screens anyway and the thermal ideas sound interesting.... That said.... 4 ram slots???? Really? 12 cores, 2 GPUs and I get 32GB of ram? Maybe 64GB if 16GB dimms in standard sizes become a thing? That kills it completely in my book.
- marknutter 13y agoThat does kill it.. for everyone who requires more than 64GB of RAM..
- grecy 13y ago128GB with 32GB DIMMS. Also, it's possible there is some amount soldered on the board.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- bingaling 13y agoWhy not 32gb dimms? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226390 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226...
- sil3ntmac 13y agoMy first reaction was, oh wow looks just like the NeXT cube, that's kinda a cool tribute to Jobs. Then my second reaction was, oh man, it will sorta look like I have a trash bin on my desk. I wish they had made the dimensions a little different. I think this will be the "flop" model where they work out hardware kinks and the next one will be prettier/sleeker, so I'll hold out til then.
- btown 13y agoCopywriting and product-debate aside, that's some pretty impressive frontend presentation. From what I can tell from the minified JS, they're using Require.JS for code organization, their own jQuery-like utility toolkit they call Apple Core, fully pre-rendered text everywhere, and javascript that plays and pauses two copies of the HTML5 video, one backwards and one forwards, shuffling their opacities for seamless transitions. Interestingly, they don't need separate videos for each transition, because the video is streamed rather than pre-buffered in its entirety. Not that Apple really cares about its bandwidth costs here, but it's an interesting strategy. The minified JS: http://images.apple.com/v/mac-pro/home/a/scripts/macpro.release.min.js http://images.apple.com/v/mac-pro/home/a/scripts/macpro.rele... And the raw video (download and play in QuickTime): http://movies.apple.com/media/us/mac-pro/2013/96614028-695e-478a-8db8-0ad1c7b42925/video/macpro_main_desktop.mp4 http://movies.apple.com/media/us/mac-pro/2013/96614028-695e-...
- spydum 13y agoI was surprised how bad it works in landscape orientation on their own ipad devices.. Alignment is wrong, scrolling is not smooth.. Overall, just bad. I could understand if I was browsing from an android platform..
- OSWJimlo 13y agoWhat the hell is wrong with you? The 'if it were android' bit just shows how completely Apple has made us expect the web to not be open. The whole fucking point of web standards is that it doesn't matter what you browse from - if they were conformed to. But no, apple violates them every which way (and gets praised for not being the shittastic company it is to boot) and fucktards like you just accept that 'sure, apple doesn't have to write standards-complient code which will work on competing devices'. People like you are directly responsible for the horrible state of the web. Every time you make a comment like this you undermine the openness of the web and further catapult us towards the dictator-state where Apple creates concentration camps for open-source software developers and, eventually, users. Do you use any open source software? SInce you have an ipad, probably not. You probably shouldn't even be on this website considering it's "hacker news", not "hipster fuckhead who has a shiny but useless tablet that leads to the fall of all hackers news". People like you are the reason I'm considering leaving this site.
- collypops 13y agoI look forward to Apple literally rolling them out in the near future
- wasulahewa 13y agoFlash would have been the better option for the animation ;)
- rsync 13y agoI love this new device. I suspect I will buy one. But it doesn't solve my "need a new mac pro" problem. Right now my 2009 octo mac pro, with six displays attached, plays three roles: - it is my high end desktop workstation, with three primary high resolution (2560x1600) displays. - it is my HTPC, with one of the six monitors strung into another room entirely. - it is my office NAS, with four internal 3TB disks So, three roles all rolled into one device. This is possible because I can expand it internally with 3.5" disks and pcie cards. In fact, my 3x gt120 cards only take up 3 of the 4 slots. To duplicate this, I think I need to: a) add an external disk enclosure b) drive my fourth display via HDMI c) pray that 3x 4k displays leaves can coexist with 2x 2560x1600 displays as secondary displays, which seems unlikely d) pray that the disk array doesn't cannibalize enough thunderbolt bandwidth to interfere with the displays e) another external box for cd ripping and general optical disk usage ... and all the while, with a single physical CPU, and no ability to ever upgrade the graphics cards. Granted, my needs must not be complicated if I can live with gt120s in 2013, but it was nice to know I could upgrade. Oh, and I have upgraded my SSD boot device three times in the 4.5 years I've owned this system. That was nice. So again, I actually really like this device - I think it is a very, very cool computer. But as a discriminating mac pro user who pushed the form factor to the limits, it is not at all what I need.
- specialist 13y ago> But it doesn't solve my "need a new mac pro" problem. Yes! Totally yes! I held off buying a MBP just so mine would be one generation better than my coworkers'. I just know there's a MBP in the pipeline, because the inventory has been allowed to dry up. Why wasn't a new model announced?
- seanp2k2 13y agoProbably a minor refresh for Haswell. I wouldn't expect too much. Pure speculation, but maybe they had some integration difficulties and didn't want to commit to a specific timeline, or they couldn't release it /right now/ like the MBA so they wanted to hold off to fill out their fall event. There are a ton of other things that could have held it back; perhaps Intel isn't ramped up enough on volume production of the quad-core Haswells and they didn't want to just update the dual-cores first.
- lowlevel 13y agoI love it too... I will probably also buy one. :/ So much for cutting back on my tech spending. grumblesmurf
- redler 13y agoThe design is obviously polarizing and leaves many questions unanswered. But one surprising and promising development is that Cook said this would be a platform for "the next ten years." In the face of fears that Apple would abandon the "pro market", this is one of the most explicit forward-looking statements they've made in some time. [minor edit for intent]
- drivingmenuts 13y agoIt's light on RAM slots and monitor connections. Four ram slots? That maxes out at 64 Gig of RAM. What happened to the old 128 Gig? Sorry, dropping $999 ea. on a single monitor, much less multiple monitors, is just stupid. The difference at the screen between a Thunderbolt display and a display costing half as much isn't enough to warrant the extra cost. The former machine had a visually distinct box with tons of space inside for the video card of your choice and you could stuff drives in it for days, without relying on expensive external boxes that sucked up slots on the power strip. It's probably the right design for someone, but not for people who want a serious workstation and not an art statement.
- woobar 13y agoIt has 6 Thunderbolt/Display Port (i.e. any display with $10 cable adapter) connections. How much more do you need?
- bingaling 13y agoIt should support 32GB dimms, so 128GB.
- jfb 13y agoI like the equivalence between "a machine I'm not going to buy but must be just so" and "serious workstation".
- dman 13y agoWhat is the height of this workstation ? I hope apple is not messing with the cardinal rule of making workstations tall enough that you can rest your legs on them when you lean back on the chair.
- Fomite 13y agoTaking a look at the site and the walk around, it eases most of my problems, but not all of them: - The RAM looks accessible enough that it can be changed/modified with ease. - That's true for the built-in drive as well, it looks like one of the "blade" type SSDs that comes in the rMBP. Even if its a slightly different form factor, I've got faith OWC will come up with solutions. Will be slightly miffed about losing a "No SSD, give me the cheapest mechanical drive" purchasing option, but there it is. - My real concern is the GPUs. With the new thermal profile and the walk around, those really don't look like off the shelf parts. I'm pretty sure you can't easily swap them. I'd prefer an nVidia option generally, and more importantly the FirePros will likely be optimized for graphics work, and terrible for gaming (yes, I do sometimes game on my Mac Pro) and not optimized for scientific computing, which would be my other use case. It's just enough to make me like the new Mac Pro, but also hesitate because of the GPU.
- binarycrusader 13y agoThat's my only real complaint (without seeing the price) at the moment: the GPUs. I really want/need an nVidia option.
- Fomite 13y agoThat's where I'm at now. A FirePro is a graphic design GPU. I don't want a graphic design GPU. That's not what I do. I certainly don't want to pay for two of them. And at the prices the Mac Pro will go for, we're also talking about comparable systems with a Titan in them. I'd much prefer that GPU, except Apple's going with a bespoke design by the looks of it.
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- hcarvalhoalves 13y agoFlash storage on a PCI-ex bus? Nice. I wonder which GPUs they are cramming there. The design is fantastic. I guess it has only one big fan on the top sucking the heat of everything, should be silent. Now brace yourselves for the price...
- jpalomaki 13y agoThis concept reminds me of the old Silicon Graphics workstations. Some 15 years ago they were something I would dream of having on my desk. SGI was the symbol of performance and graphics and the computers looked very different from everything else. Maybe this is also a tribute to Steve Jobs and NeXT. Think Different.
- beedogs 13y agoUgly as shit. Completely useless for expansion. People will defend its ugliness and lack of expandability.
- hcarvalhoalves 13y agoNot liking the design... It looks like they were peer pressured to make something bland, and now iOS looks too much apart from Mac OS. Throws away all learnability.
- grecy 13y agoSome pictures coming out are extremely interesting. This one seems to show the the "CPU board" with the single CPU, and RAM on each side... OK http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/processor.jpg http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/proces... This one shows the two "GPU cards" - notice the one on the right has a white connector, bottom middle, which is for the SSD. Otherwise, they are almost identical (I see slightly different components at the top) http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/graphics.jpg http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/graphi... And this one shows the "GPU Card", now with an SSD in that connector.... http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/storage.jpg http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/storag... Finally this one shows the three "cards", presumably with the power supply at the very bottom. http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/thermal.jpg http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/therma... I think the big question here is how are the three "cards" joined together? If they're using some kind of connector, I imagine that makes them "replaceable" if not "upgradable". It also hints at the possibility of getting just one GPU card. I wonder if one could have 2xCPU cards and 1xGPU card? Interesting
- augustl 13y agoThat's interesting! Perhaps one of the future cards will be a Xeon Phi 50 core x86.
- seltzered_ 13y agoAnd "there's a bus for that" if you want anything else. (referring to thunderbolt 2.0)
- Sealy 13y ago-I think the big question here is how are the three "cards" joined together? These days PCIx (and similar) extender cables are used commonly on server builds. I wouldn't be surprised if apple used some sort of equivalent ribbon to connect the graphics cards.
- davydka 13y agoDid apple finally make a responsive web page? I'm on my phone so I can't test how it looks on a desktop.
- assholesRppl2 13y agoHow has nobody mentioned its size? I freaked out when I guesstimated 6.6 inches in diameter and 9.9 inches in height. Size doesn't matter, but that's some astounding cramwork.
- Fomite 13y agoI actually think this is a "Pro" machine - just the definition of "Pro" has narrowed to someone who does visual design work (FirePros instead of a more general purpose/off-the-shelf solution that can be swapped out for something specialized) and has large enough storage needs that they've probably got an external drive enclosure or NAS already (only the SSD for internal storage). Unfortunately, that narrower version doesn't fit me. But since "Scientists" weren't mentioned in the litany of users of the Mac Pro, and apple.com/science is a 404 page now (which was better than the Leopard-era page that came before it talking about the innovative Workgroup Cluster), I suppose I shouldn't be surprised.
- mahyarm 13y agoIt will be very frustrating if they don't make a dual coy socket version. If you do iOS development and large compiled code bases, a mac pro is the best you have. Hackintoshes waste your time in other ways.
- mixmastamyk 13y agoThis reminds me of Steve a bit... like the Next Cube 2013. Must be why it is black.
- ChikkaChiChi 13y agofor a thousand bucks I would buy a new desk and monitor to make it the center piece of my new study in my house. instead Apple will want at least five thousand and expect it to be a business class workstation. make this the Mac mini, you sell a gazillion.
- nwenzel 13y agoWould be interesting to see more GPU equipped machines designed for data processing instead of just processing graphics. ("just" not to minimize the value/importance of design, photography, and art, but "just" in that there's more to GPUs that design, photography, and art.) Form + function for matrix multiplication. Though totally unrelated to the Mac Pro (other than it being a knockoff of MacBook Air) Dell has made an interesting push for data crunchers. Their recent-ish re-launch of an Ubuntu machine [0] that enables you to simulate and then push your environment up to the cloud is an interesting, if fairly niche product. Could the Mac Pro, with it's specific audience, the Dell XPS, and maybe even the RasberryPi, be the beginning of a much more specialized desk/laptop computing movement in the face of iPads (errr... tablets) eating the general purpose, internet surfing computer market? [0] http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/xps-13-linux/pd http://www.dell.com/us/business/p/xps-13-linux/pd
- noonespecial 13y agoThe thing I really like about my old Mac Pro is that I could crack it open and stick a couple old graphics cards in there and go crazy with media. I had 5 screens including a TV and a Wacom digitizer connected to mine. This is a total miss for me.
- lettergram 13y agoI like machines like I like my women, able to touch them all over. Mac pro - still proprietary, no thanks
- ScottBurson 13y agoThey go on and on about the memory bandwidth, but never mention what is to me the important number: the memory capacity. Anyone know?
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- wmf 13y ago128 very expensive GB.
- mehwoot 13y agoIt's totally tubular. The new OS is called mavericks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mavericks_(location) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mavericks_(location) ). Did apple suddenly become a bunch of surfers?
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- duncan_bayne 13y agoIt's disturbing to see so many people drooling over this hardware. Granted, it's tasty-looking, but: - http://www.defectivebydesign.org/apple http://www.defectivebydesign.org/apple - http://www.ifixit.com/blog/2011/01/20/apples-diabolical-plan-to-screw-your-iphone/ http://www.ifixit.com/blog/2011/01/20/apples-diabolical-plan... - http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2337939,00.asp http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2337939,00.asp Give some thought to the above before buying an Apple device, please.
- kevinpet 13y agoDo you really think HN readers are so uninformed that they are not aware of the tradeoffs in Apple hardware? They are tradeoffs, not evil conspiracies.
- codex 13y agoThese are critiques of Apple's other products and software, but none of them apply to this specific hardware. Are there specific criticisms of this Mac Pro hardware?
- duncan_bayne 13y agoThese are critiques of Apple. In buying a Mac Pro, you're lending financial support to a company that does the things spelled out in those articles.
- oblique63 13y agoI don't know why you're getting downvoted, this is an objective trend that you're pointing out and it's a legitimate basis to use for predicting the style of any future Apple device. A company's product launches aren't discrete probabilistic events like tosses of a coin -- they tend to follow patterns... [Edit]: Man, I didn't even say I supported/cared about this manufacturing aspect (hint: I don't) and I'm already getting downvoted... Considering all the controversial things I've said on this site that hadn't earned me a negative score before, this doesn't exactly shed a positive light on Apple proponents. It's OK to not care about a certain aspect/political issue, but the guy's argument was a sound one, at least give him/her that much.
- inovator 13y agoThe design looks so familiar, and it has been bugging me the whole day. Finally, I found it! The new Mac Pro designs reminded me of this DLINK Wireless Router http://thegadgetclub.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/d-link-cloud-router-2500.jpg http://thegadgetclub.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/d-link-c...
- frozenport 13y agoWithout expandability this product is for hipsters and the aesthete. If I am paying thousands of dollars for a computer I refuse to compromise on core functionality.
- sanjiallblue 13y agoInteresting design aesthetic. This still doesn't justify the price and Apple's going to be taking a hit now that so much of the entertainment industry has turned away from Final Cut.
- joeblau 13y agoFor the home user, this is fine, but one thing Apple forgot about (And they usually do) is the enterprise customer. If you're looking to replace your current setup of Mac Pros with these, how would you go about mounting these things in a rack?
- ajays 13y agoNot to fork the discussion, but: I'm thinking of putting together a new (Linux) PC for my needs (which are mainly number-crunching, photo processing, etc.). How much of the tech in this Mac Pro is available today to build one? I'm not sure I've seen any PCIe SSDs, for example. How about Thunderbolt 2?
- ccera 13y agoPCIe SSDs are available from a number of vendors. Fusion-IO is probably the most well-known.
- CoolGuySteve 13y agoJust a couple months ago, we built a similarly specced 1TB SSD raid using an expensive controller and 4 256 GB drives for a multipass batch processing job that we do. It gets about 1GB/sec read and write performance and cost about $1k altogether. A controller that can max out the PCI bus is about $300 alone. The major benefit we found is that the higher random access speeds allow us to multiplex our jobs without completely thrashing the old RAID array that we replaced. But it sucks that there are no PCI solutions for what we needed. OCZ had a couple cards but they were out of date and enterprise priced. I think what we really need is some kind of slot for internal flash the same way DIMMs are slotted, maybe even have the controller and flash chips physically separated for more fine grained upgrades or have the SSD controller embedded in the motherboard chipset. The weird 9.5mm enclosure and sata cables that SSDs currently use is some kind awkward weening phase off of spinning platters that needs to go away. Even single SSDs are starting to saturate SATA3 and the SATA specs aren't keeping up. Hopefully a new trend in workstations that look like the Mac Pro will come along the same way that many "Ultrabooks" look vaguely like MacBook Airs. At which point we'll hopefully get more sensible SSD and interconnect management.
- veidr 13y agoAs usual, the HN headline is misleading: it should read "Mac Mini Pro". Oh wait, what?
- carterschonwald 13y agoI'm pretty bummed about the new Mac Pro, I really want / need my dev work station purchase this summer to have a Haswell generation CPU, plus NVidia Cuda support. Which this seems to lack. (context, I'm doing a lot of Dev work on high peformance numerical algorithms, and the fewer machines i need to test all the different substrates, the better.)
- wisty 13y agoOK, so it's not a Mac Pro. It's a Mac Mini Pro. As long as it's not too expensive, it's exactly what a lot of prosumers might want (especially those who want to ditch their laptops for iPads and iPhones, and maybe a MBA for the road- a lot of people's MacBook Pros live on their desks). I can't see a serious video editor wanting one, but they're all jumping ship to get cheaper Wintel workstations (and at some point, studios will move the heavy lifting to some kind of local big-iron server). I can see developers who want a slightly better machine buying it, and rich people, and photographers, and so on. If Thunderbolt expansions bring down the costs of upgrades (compared to buying the upgrades with Apple - not everyone likes to open their chassis) then it might be quite attractive.
- look_lookatme 13y ago"I can't see a serious video editor wanting one, but they're all jumping ship to get cheaper Wintel workstations" Is this actually the case? I don't know anything about that segment of the computing industry, but I just assumed that FCP was the industry standard.
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- kayoone 13y agoDont know how much of this is true but i have recently seen this video which talks a bit about it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TyswmRCdl8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TyswmRCdl8
- pavlov 13y agoFCP was never the only solution in the pro video editing market. Avid has been the traditional choice since the mid-'90s, but FCP was encroaching. Unfortunately the botched introduction of FCP X sent Apple back a decade in this market. FCP X was too different from 7, and it didn't even support many of the workflows that pros needed. Since users had to learn new software anyway, a lot of editors went to Avid or Adobe (Premiere is quite good nowadays).
- tmandarano 13y agoThis is so awesome. Wow. Amazing design.
- sgt 13y agoDue to the shape of it, the power contained within its walls... Yes, I'd be very tempted to set the hostname to 'zpm'.
- josteink 13y agoCorrect me if I'm wrong, but is that a "pro" computer with no wired ethernet? Who on earth would discard stable gigabit internet for some flaky wifi with substantially lower performance? Edit: Corrected as requested. Thanks.
- adamt 13y agoIf you scroll 'down' to the bit about expansion it says it has gigabit Ethernet.
- josteink 13y agoI was looking at the IO bit, and due to the new horrible black on black labels, I was unable to see that there were actual ethernet ports there. Completely unrelated ofcourse, but that's pretty telling about the black on black + led thingie they've gone for. It's not something to be taken too far. Edit: I have my monitors in portrait mode. Setting a window to span several monitors and work in "landscape-mode", I can see ethernet is mentioned. On a portrait screen it falls outside the visible area of the viewport and there are no scrollbars. Edit 2: By resizing the window, I see that the width of the viewport is adjusted based on the height of the visible viewport (w = 2*h). So on a portrait type display (tall) the width of everything is adjusted to be even bigger. This pushes most of the content (apart from the black tube) outside the visible viewport and off the screen. Basically, this page was designed to only ever work in landscape and break doubly in portrait. And hence most of the details on the page were simply not available.
- maguay 13y agoIt does have wired ethernet, at least according to the presentation I believe.
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- snom380 13y agoIt has two Gb ethernet ports (and you can easily add more through the 6 20Gb Thunderbolt 2 ports.
- groundCode 13y agoIs it me or does that look like something out of Tron?
- munimkazia 13y agoIf it is a cylinder, won't it be easier to roll off a surface and fall down?
- a1a 13y agoI really don't care about the product itself, but I am always glad when Apple releases something new. It's really interesting to study the release process. It's truly impressive being able to create such hype around a release. Funny enough, many Apple fan-boys are basically fanatics. The rational thing to do is of course to work against the corporations, in order to force them into improving and lowering the prices. But somehow Apple has managed to create a "personal army" of fan-boys, blindly defending their every move. On a related note: I am really surprised they are going desktop, has not the last five years been about replacing it?
- izietto 13y agoThe new Mac Pro: approved by Dart Fener :P
- spitfire 13y agoFinally, I have a replacement for my NeXT Cube! They've clearly studied their core markets - Graphics and viz work. I'm in line to buy one.
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- Inetgate 13y agoThis edged design inspired many Japanese users as below: http://togetter.com/li/516991 http://togetter.com/li/516991