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Samsung admits to posting fake user reviews on the web
- kailuowang 14y agoPhony endorsements maybe deemed as "misleading advertisement" as long as they remain trueish (They can argue that the paid reviewers did experience the product and did like it. Nothing much different from a celebrity endorsement) . Fake negative reviews on competitors are really despicable and IMO should be penalized heavily by law. In general, as a consumer, I feel sick when vendors trying to fool me by pretending to be one of us.
- msy 14y agoImagine the furore if Apple was caught doing this.
- alyx 14y agoOr Microsoft, Google, etc
- rocky1138 14y agoCompanies who are leaders in their industry do not usually need to do this. I've heard of it happening at smaller organizations or sole proprietorships (small business), but it is strange to see from a company as large as Samsung. What's important is how high up the chain this was sanctioned by. If it's a lowly manager somewhere, he/she will just get fired and this will all blow over. If it's right at the top, it's much more embarrassing.
- hkmurakami 14y agoSamsung's IP theft issues would lead me to believe that their credo is "whatever it takes to win" and this kind of behavior isn't out of line with their track record.
- kostya-kow 14y ago>Samsung's IP theft issues You mean the time when Apple tried to patent "0-length-swipe" and a shape of a box?
- threeseed 14y agoNo I don't. You know why ? Because it never happened.
- shapeofabox 14y agoI think he meant to say "rounded rectangle" not box.
- lostlogin 14y agoYes, because Apple did something bad its ok for Samsung to. What? It's a good thing most people and companies don't work like that.
- sinnerswing 14y agoWhy am I not surprised. Samsung has a history of imo unethical and questionable business practices. Samsung Inflates Galaxy Tab Sales, Gets Busted http://modmyi.com/content/360-samsung-inflates-galaxy-tab-sales-gets-busted-comments2.html http://modmyi.com/content/360-samsung-inflates-galaxy-tab-sa... Quite smooth: Samsung actually sold 1/10 of the 2 million Galaxy Tabs it claimed in 2010 http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/151854/quite-smooth-samsung-actually-sold-1-10-of-the-2-million-galaxy-tabs-it-claimed-in-2010 http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/151854/quite-smooth-samsung... Looks Like Samsung Pretty Much Lied About US Sales To The Public http://www.macgasm.net/2012/08/10/looks-like-samsung-pretty-much-lied-about-us-sales-to-the-public/ http://www.macgasm.net/2012/08/10/looks-like-samsung-pretty-... Samsung Hires 'Actors' To Pretend To Be Happy Galaxy Tab Testers? http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110325/12360313633/samsung-hires-actors-to-pretend-to-be-happy-galaxy-tab-testers.shtml http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20110325/12360313633/samsun... Samsung caught presenting actors as Galaxy Tab "consumers," fudging thinnest tablet claims http://appleinsider.com/articles/11/03/25/samsung_caught_presenting_actors_as_galaxy_tab_consumers_fudging_thinnest_tablet_claims http://appleinsider.com/articles/11/03/25/samsung_caught_pre... Here’s how Samsung flew bloggers halfway around the world, then threatened to leave them there. http://thenextweb.com/insider/2012/09/02/heres-samsung-flew-bloggers-halfway-around-world-threatened-leave/?utm_campaign=social%20media&awesm=tnw.to_a4CW&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=Spreadus http://thenextweb.com/insider/2012/09/02/heres-samsung-flew-... Samsung Caught Fudging Testimonials, and Lying about Galaxy Tab’s Thickness http://techie-buzz.com/gadgets-news/samsung-galaxy-tab-fake-testimonial-thickness.html http://techie-buzz.com/gadgets-news/samsung-galaxy-tab-fake-...
- randallu 14y agoMaybe they'll even send the top guy to jail (but later release him to run the olympics...)
- neya 14y agoDude, I don't see why you need to defend Apple so seriously and in all probability, they are no different and just because they haven't got caught yet, doesn't mean you can't rule out the possibility that they aren't into this. As an example, during the Apple vs Samsung patent wars (after Samsung lost), a handful of publications were writing in support of Apple even when most of them knew that Apple was abusing the patent system to its core. Most of them looked very much like they were paid by Apple to write it. Some even went as far as saying the win for Apple is good for innovation (which obviously it is not)[1]. Another example is once an author from Techcrunch even admitted to getting compensated monetarily by Apple to write a post bashing a competitor. Apple, Samsung, LG, Sony, Panasonic, etc. are no different from each other. So let's not get religious, shall we? [1] http://gizmodo.com/5938193/apple-winning-the-patent-wars-is-great-for-innovation http://gizmodo.com/5938193/apple-winning-the-patent-wars-is-...
- rocky1138 14y agoI'm not defending Apple. I'm not a huge fan of their stuff. But, they are their market's leader and the parent post mentioned the outrage that one might see if Apple did the same as Samsung in this case.
- Steko 14y agoBrave new levels of false equivalence achieved here. One guy was caught but let's not criticize him because everyone not caught could have done the same thing!
- Samuel_Michon 14y agoGizmodo bought a stolen iPhone 4 prototype, blackmailed Apple over it, and published photos of the phone. Since then, they haven't been invited to Apple's press events. Given the history, it's silly to suggest Gizmodo is being paid by Apple to write positive stories about them. I doubt Apple would even pick up the phone if Gizmodo called them.
- kostya-kow 14y agoNot on HN, because it is full of Apple fanboys.
- RexRollman 14y agoWell, at least you are objective.
- deleted 14y ago[deleted]
- CountSessine 14y agoYou lost me at 'fanboys'.
- fuzzix 14y agoThat's handy, because that was the last word of his post.
- Steko 14y agoCompletely wrong. I challenge HN mods to reveal which articles are voting ring flagpedo'd religiously on this site.
- shapeofabox 14y agomrpogson.com/2012/08/21/apples-paid-shillconsultant-caught-out/
- _Simon 14y agoNot really the same thing. That you created an account just to say that makes me wonder if you are in fact a 'shill' yourself.
- benihana 14y agoBut they weren't. Samsung was.
- jonknee 14y agoThere's no need, they have John Gruber.
- umsm 14y agoIt's sad that samsung would do this... Is it commonplace for companies to do this?
- orangethirty 14y agoMore than you think.
- hosay123 14y agoYou decide.. https://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=infoman https://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=infoman The domain was registered one day after the HN account was registered, first post wasn't made for 14 days (aka. when the username no longer appears in green). In his defence, if he is a shill, he's not very good at it. Edit: hnsearch picked up a hellbanned post (it should appear on the front page, but it doesn't) at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5567259 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5567259 that mentions a couple more accounts
- orangethirty 14y agoGoogle has a little spammer loose on HN. Neat.
- Kylekramer 14y agoSeems much more likely to be the people behind glass-apps.org than Google.
- orangethirty 14y agoI'm not criticizing them, its neat to find something like this here. I can find it on almost any other site out there, but HN is not the place to game. Still, who knows if glass-apps.org is getting a nice check from Google. Not a bad thing, either. I know of companies whose sole reason of existence is to do this for bigger companies. Its just neat. That's all.
- jacquesm 14y ago
- lutusp 14y agoThe title is a bit misleading -- the story is not that Samsung used devious marketing methods, the story is that they were caught. Any number of companies hire shills to post phony endorsements, the trick is not to get caught. In fairness to companies like Samsung, if everyone is doing it, to stand on principle is to risk being trounced by those who don't.
- homosaur 14y agoWe are talking about Samsung here, this is the company that has pretty much ripped off every successful design in its history. I'm fairly certain they've never stood on principle for anything but a hearty office chuckle.
- andrewljohnson 14y agoThis is just xenophobia, unsubstantiated, and unfair to all the hard working employees.
- mikestew 14y agoIt may be hyperbole (probably not every design is a clone of something else), but a strong argument can be made that a number of designs, from the Blackjack to recent devices, are pretty good copies of something made by another company. Err, wait, I didn't get the subtle astroturfing joke, did I?
- guptaneil 14y agoWhat does xenophobia have to do with it? We don't know where homosaur is from. Even in the US, there are many beloved foreign corporations, such as Nintendo. I don't think anybody discounts Samsung for being Korean, or even cares. Likewise, I doubt many people support Apple just because its American. Regarding unsubstantiated, they have been openly accused and even found guilty in multiple courts across different countries. It's an ongoing case and you may disagree with the rulings, in which case "unsubstantiated" is not the word you're looking for. As for being unfair to hard working employees, that is definitely true. Unfortunately for those employees, their executives' actions have brought their hard work into question. Any comments regarding a company are generally a reflection on the company's leadership, not any individual employee.
- rhizome 14y agoMarketing-fraud.
- tosseraccount 14y agoNo one is shocked to hear that astro turfing is going on on the internet. A few too many "English Major style" reviews and it's pretty obvious.
- hkmurakami 14y agoThat reminds me of how the genuine reviews on Yelp are of the terse, "This place sucks. Their dish XYZ was terrible, service took $NN." style that look spammy and get removed by their spam algorithm.
- wging 14y ago>perhaps the bigger issue here is this: if Samsung has been using these tactics against HTC, are they also engaged in similar marketing techniques with other rivals? The even bigger issue is, who else is doing this more intelligently than Samsung?
- austenallred 14y agoEventually all you have to do is mimic human behavior closely enough and it's untraceable. Sometimes that's expensive, but it's always doable.
- wging 14y agoIt didn't sound to me like this is an automated system. Just humans pretending to be who they're not.
- Destitute 14y agoYep, FTC doesn't like that. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2009/10/endortest.shtm http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2009/10/endortest.shtm
- Pxtl 14y agoThis. I love Samsung hardware, but the company seems critically unable to think big. They have no apparent direction or higher thinking, they just make solidly good devices and throw gobs of money at marketing. It's bizarre - in spite of their devices and a reputation for quality gear, they still act like a cheap Korean knock-off company instead of a market leader. It's no surprise that when they try to do evil, they do it in a clumsy and public manner.
- batiudrami 14y agoSamsung are one of the biggest and most diversified companies in the world (did you know they are the world's biggest ship builder? Or that they offer life insurance?). I don't have difficulty imagining a lack of organisation and direction in management when they have so many arms doing so many different things.
- sigzero 14y agoSamsucks again...
- viseztrance 14y agoI hope they get sued for this, but I don't believe it's a conspiracy. Rather, just a case of someone trying too hard to meet certain sale expectations and hold on to a bonus.
- r00fus 14y agoSo was it a few bad actors, or just the few that got caught?
- tonyedgecombe 14y agoThese things always go back to the top, it's cultural.
- coldtea 14y agoThat's the way conspiracies work. What did you expect, aliens?
- viseztrance 14y agoSamsung is a big company, I meant it's someone in their Taiwan branch rather than their Korea hq.
- D9u 14y agoSort of like how Reddit used a bunch of sockpuppet accounts to spark interest in their site?
- desslock 14y agoI suspect this isn't the first instance they've done this. Looking closer at Anti-Apple/ Pro-Samsung Google+ posts reveal some questionable user profiles.
- uxp 14y agoI really liked Google+, up until #BoycottApple came around. Really hard to follow any technology news without getting inundated with nonsensical rants against every breath Steve Jobs or Tim Cook took and takes, respectfully.
- TazeTSchnitzel 14y agoGreat, now I have to prove I'm not a "Samsung shill" before being positive about Samsung products.
- lutusp 14y agoNot really. Most readers look at a person's entire posting history before making that kind of claim. And most people who post phony reviews, post too many of them to escape attention.
- lostlogin 14y agoI'm not sure that people look at posting history even here, where posting is generally considered and careful.
- proland 14y agoI wonder if this is related to the myriad of "NO SD CARD, NO REPLACEABLE BATTERY, NO BUY" type user comments that littered positive reviews for the HTC One.
- CrazedGeek 14y agoI made one of those comments (although worded a bit better). I certainly wasn't paid :(
- polshaw 14y agoThey could well have been responsible for some of them, but there are certainly a lot of us who feel that way reasonably strongly.
- batiudrami 14y agoI doubt it. People who like those features are typically very vocal about them (especially since they're dying out).
- kaffiene 14y agoAs a New Zealander, quite frankly I have to say that Americans sound like a bunch of racists to me whenever they discuss Samsung vs Apple.
- victorology 14y agoSamsung has been doing this for a while in their home market of South Korea. I've heard tales of Samsung hiring 1,000 temporary employees with the sole task of blogging or commenting on blogs/social networks about their products.
- debt 14y agoit's interesting to note that doing this is illegal; i had no idea. it's also important to note that it's possible to determine whether an entity is engaged in the practice: http://www.technologyreview.com/news/428222/statistics-unmask-phony-online-reviews/ http://www.technologyreview.com/news/428222/statistics-unmas...
- fpgeek 14y agoI just can't get over how mind-bogglingly stupid this was. Even having decided to use dirty tricks to strengthen their overall marketing effort... What possessed them to try to go after HTC in Taiwan of all places? As HTC's stronghold, Taiwan is simultaneously the country where: 1. This sort of campaign is least likely to be effective. 2. Samsung is most likely to be caught. 3. Local regulators are most likely to be sympathetic to HTC's complaints. I mean I understand that people generally overestimate their chances of success and underestimate the chance of being caught, but this is ridiculous.
- marcosdumay 14y agoEtiher there are some stupid people making local policy at Samsung Taiwan, or in the places with less chances of getting caught they got away with it.
- DigitalSea 14y agoI don't doubt this isn't an activity that most companies engage in, some more than others. There are probably a lot smarter companies who have yet to be caught and might not ever be caught. Some act surprised, but in this day and age of anyone being able to taint or inflate the reputation or a product, brand, location or business you can't really expect anything less.
- yoster 14y agoHm, when reading articles about Apple or Samsung, I tend to read the comments as well on Yahoo!. I notice within the first couple of hours, the comments are all pretty much Apple bashing. There are hundreds of comments in support of Samsung with tons of flaming going on. Reading this, it all makes sense.
- lostlogin 14y agoReading the comments is not something I ever do anymore, except here and on Asymco. It makes you feel cleaner somehow.
- burkeen 14y agoThey all do this.
- deleted 14y ago[deleted]
- acd 14y agoOne word to describe Samsungs actions Unethical. This reminds me somehow of when Apple was fixing the reception bars to show more coverage than there actually were on the iPhones.
- Samuel_Michon 14y agoIt was the other way around: Apple fixed the reception indicator to reflect coverage more accurately. “We were stunned to find that the formula we use to calculate how many bars of signal strength to display is totally wrong. Our formula, in many instances, mistakenly displays 2 more bars than it should for a given signal strength. [...] To fix this, we are adopting AT&T’s recently recommended formula for calculating how many bars to display for a given signal strength. The real signal strength remains the same, but the iPhone’s bars will report it far more accurately, providing users a much better indication of the reception they will get in a given area. We are also making bars 1, 2 and 3 a bit taller so they will be easier to see. We will issue a free software update within a few weeks that incorporates the corrected formula. Since this mistake has been present since the original iPhone, this software update will also be available for the iPhone 3GS and iPhone 3G.” http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2010/07/02Letter-from-Apple-Regarding-iPhone-4.html http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2010/07/02Letter-from-Apple-...
- niklas_a 14y ago..in taiwan against HTC
- saturdaysaint 14y agoMuch of their fluffy positive press in the last few months has the scent of astroturf, too.