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Alright AI maximalists, what's the estimated token budget to remove the Google dependency? GrapheneOS has the bootable AOSP and will have Google-alternative de
by largbae 15d ago
Alright AI maximalists, what's the estimated token budget to remove the Google dependency?
GrapheneOS has the bootable AOSP and will have Google-alternative device support.
We probably need an equivalent to Play Services, app signing/porting/publishing tools.
With these in hand could we talk Valve into providing the scalable alternative to the play store?
- z3ratul163071 15d agoexactly
- IshKebab 15d agoA lot. But I don't think you can do it with just tokens. Android without the Play store and Google Play Services is just not very useful (in the West anyway).
- mitxela 15d agoWhich is why Grapheme runs them in a sandbox. You can too.
- alightsoul 15d agoThe token budget isn't to remove Google it's to create drivers for individual phone hardware, which phone and chip manufacturers keep closed source. Also it would be used to find exploits to unlock permanently locked bootloaders
- MrDrMcCoy 15d agoGrapheneOS won't be interested in other hardware support, since the only devices that meet their hardware security standards are Pixels and the upcoming Motorola phone.
- the_real_cher 15d agoWhat's the token budget to build a new phone OS?
- layer8 14d agoIt doesn’t really matter if most app providers won’t be porting their apps to the new phone OS.
- aesh2Xa1 15d agoGrapheneOS accepts donations and, to my knowledge, they spend it in hiring full time engineers. They have replacement portions for Play Services already (attestation, an app store, and location), but it'd be interesting if they also offered something for push notifications. If you have it to give you can spend your budget on a donation and fund the effort directly.
- ninjasmosa 15d agoI believe GrapheneOS talked about hosting their own unifiedpush server and baking it into the OS not long ago
- throe939r 15d agoBuy HarmonyOS device. No google jumk, android compatible os, fdroid works, years of security updates from maker, and 40% lower price. As a personal device it works pretty well. For ssh terminal and reading markdown, it has by far best display.
- zb3 15d agoHarmonyOS kernel (HongMeng) is not only closed source but also encrypted. Those devices do not allow you to unlock the bootloader or install apps not signed by them (albeit I don't know how that works for emulator apps, a signed Android emulator could possibly allow arbitrary apks). Huawei made a big mistake by not fully open sourcing HarmonyOS, you can't flash OpenHarmony so it doesn't count.
- fwip 15d agoThat's Huawei's Android fork, right? Is it available on devices outside of China? I'm not seeing an obvious place to buy a device running it.
- palata 15d agoI think it started like this, but it no longer is the case. I feel like Huawei missed a gigantic opportunity there: forking AOSP may have gotten them traction. I would totally buy a Huawei device if it could run GrapheneOS, and I wouldn't mind if GrapheneOS was based on Huawei's fork rather than Google's.
- cecexacjrgec 15d agoIf only Graphene had a better marketing team. It pains me to say this but it is the absolute truth: the public does not know Graphene and does not care about Graphene. Even it’s name is absolutely awful. This is like the Linux distro hell: “you should use BingaBoingoKonohaOS_v34 or Peppermint_Cinn4monR0ll with the OutOfThisWorld DE, but steer clear of the Pancake package manager, use openMsPacMan with GrassFaceWhazzit frontend instead.” How is anyone (as in not us, the tech nerds) supposed to reason about this? Things will keep as is for as long as they keep making these OSs FOR the tech nerds. Downvote me all you want. You know it’s true. An OS made for nerds and by nerds will never reach mainstream and will not, ever, move the needle anywhere. Tech is no longer a hobbyist’s game.
- jraph 15d agoWhat's particularly bad about the names of Graphene, Mint and Cinnamon? Especially compared to Android and iOS!!
- cecexacjrgec 14d agoOn their own? Nothing. But Graphene doesn’t mean anything to the general public. People aren’t buying “an iOS device”, they are buying iPhones. People aren’t buying “an Android phone”, they are buying “a Samsung/Galaxy” or a “Pixel”. Mind you, when I say people, I mean the general population. Not those actually interested in these subjects. My point is: people don’t care about these specifics, people care about having a frictionless experience (or as close to frictionless as possible). Having to explain what Graphene even is is friction enough for most people to not even bother listening to your explanation.
- jraph 14d ago> People aren’t buying “an iOS device”, they are buying iPhone Well, they kinda do. Apps are available on Android and iOS. They are not "available on Android, iPhone, iPad and Apple watch". iOS is actually used and recognized by the general public.
- nextaccountic 14d agoThe trouble is that banking apps will not work if you degoogle your phone. GrapheneOS was an attempt to make this sort of thing work, in a phone OS more secure than stock Android But to be honest, many banking apps randomly stop working with GrapheneOS anyway. So if you see this... https://privsec.dev/posts/android/banking-applications-compatibility-with-grapheneos/ https://privsec.dev/posts/android/banking-applications-compa... https://github.com/PrivSec-dev/banking-apps-compat-report https://github.com/PrivSec-dev/banking-apps-compat-report And check the issues, it's unpredictable whether a bank will continue to work with GrapheneOS So.. if you accept GrapheneOS might not be reliable for this use case, and decide have two phones (one just for banking stuff, another for.. using), then degoogling is fine. Only thing is that the banking device probably needs to be a phone (or tablet I guess), I don't think you can emulate a real device good enough for it to work on something like Waydroid
- Godsend69 14d ago[dead]
- gonight 14d agoMy bank can support my phone or accept that I'm going to come waste their time in person, I'm not backing down here.
- samus 14d agoMany banks nowadays charge higher fees for teller service.
- sgc 14d agoI went in to cash a check at a bank a few years ago and they made a huge show of it, taking over half an hour and various employees for a couple hundred dollars. They will absolutely win if they want to. A large organization can easily create more friction than an individual can bear.
- 14d ago
- crossroadsguy 14d agoThe answer to this is - the real world comes knocking. Govt, banking, investment, grocery, transport, even some mainstream social/communication apps, all stop working - yeah, kinda cold turkey. And if your, or someone else's, answer to them is: ".. well then don't use those apps.. or maybe in mobile or desktop browser.. " (this is usually the tone on those "privacy" guide forums), then yeah it will work and can be done in hours theoretically, or days max :)
- spydum 14d agoI think you could actually look at this via the OPPOSITE lense: OpenSource was good for companies before, because they got free code/bugfix/labor, which would have been expensive to produce themselves. Now with LLM and agentic factories pumping out bugfixes/code, does the equation on opensource still look attractive to a for-profit company? Why give away that sweet source code?
- Andrex 14d agoAI is definitely going to cause a chilling effect for (human-written) code. Why connect with other young nerds to make something cool when an AI can make it for you? Why share code if you've never sought out shared code yourself? Further contribution to the trend of humans becoming more capable but less social.