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People don’t realize how big of a threat LLMs are to marketplaces like Amazon, because down the line people will just be talking to AI agents to help them find

People don’t realize how big of a threat LLMs are to marketplaces like Amazon, because down the line people will just be talking to AI agents to help them find products, check out, do all of these things. So you’re probably like, why can’t I just use ChatGPT to do that? And you can, but ChatGPT is trying to become the new Amazon. They are trying to vet stores that can check out through ChatGPT officially, and so you’re just trading one master for another. It’s why I’m building an open-source, decentralized, interoperable marketplace. It’s powered by agentic commerce and we include a list of vetted stores but you can bring your own.

johndhi 11d ago
Sounds cool. Needs network effects of lots of highly rated stores to succeed, I think.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  Yes but users can build adapters and bring their own stores.
varispeed 11d ago
Why it would be a threat? Unless Amazon is manipulating the marketplace for the customer to buy a product different from what they want. In that case such practice surely should attract a look from regulators?
- peri-cl 11d ago
  Tricking customers into buying things they otherwise wouldn't is the core concept of adtech. If you insulate humans from the manipulative dark patterns (though agent intermediaries), it's possible for them to spend less, spend more efficiently, optimize out information-asymmetries that are profit centers for entities like Amazon. Of course Amazon will fight this.
  - chadgpt5 11d ago
    Realistically the agents will inject their own dark patterns. Whoever owns the glass owns the revenue stream, for they have the ultimate power to replace anyone else's revenue stream with their own. Some TVs detect ad spots in video content and overlay ads that pay the TV manufacturer instead.
    - peri-cl 11d ago
      Right. Agents in the hands of consumers (truly under their control) empowers them; agents in the hands of retailers does quite the opposite.
  - varispeed 11d ago
    This is equivalent of Amazon setting up a maze in a physical store and then complaining someone is selling the maps.
- cush 11d ago
  > Amazon is manipulating the marketplace for the customer to buy a product different from what they want There is no expectation or regulation that a store is supposed to only show customers what they want. A retailer is going to sell you the items you're willing to buy based on what they think will help them drive the most profits. Imagine for a moment you're a store that sells millions of different products. Now, imagine a customer walks into your store, and as per some government regulation "you're expected only to show the customers who walk into your store products that they want". It's a fairly ridiculous expectation.
  - pbhjpbhj 11d ago
    Also Amazon actively prevent you finding what you want, their search and filter get worse every time I use it.
- jmspring 11d ago
  Amazon has generally been a shadow of itself. Fakes and less than reputable options. An opensource / legit sourced marketplace could be useful.
DaveFr 11d ago
I don't want "vetted" stores. I don't care if it's open-source or decentralized or interoperable (though, fine I guess if it is). What I actually want is stores that are scraped, preferably adversarially. When Amazon, Walmart et. al. try to shut you down, I will know you have something worth using.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  You can use our vetted stores but add your own, it’s not restricted.
truncate 11d ago
I've mixed opinions on that. For example, there are products like Google Shopping or Google Travel etc. They show up bunch of stores where you can buy a flight ticket or a particular product from. However, in the end most people just end up buying it from top 2-3 marketplaces anyway, not because its cheaper, but also because they can trust it, it arrives in 2 days, and you can easily return it if you don't want. So if I'm going to most likely buy something from Amazon anyway, why not just use Amazon web page. They've had one click buy button for ages.
- Marsymars 11d ago
  > However, in the end most people just end up buying it from top 2-3 marketplaces anyway, not because its cheaper, but also because they can trust it, it arrives in 2 days, and you can easily return it if you don't want. I've got enough complaints about the amazon customer and user experience that I'm not going to list them here, but returns are so easy. I click the button, and then I don't need to print off a shipping label or even package the item back up, I just drop it off at the convenience store by my house, they scan a QR code on my phone, and take the bare item from me.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  Yes Amazon’s power is very difficult to overcome. The hope with my marketplace is that stores will offer cheaper prices since we are interfacing with them directly and they are not paying Amazon a cut. Also, Amazon Prime is affordable now, but it will get more and more expensive. They have a large distribution network but most of their drivers are contractors. Amazon also is not as powerful in non-Western countries. They still rely on many different websites depending on need.
Shakahs 11d ago
This was Google's big announcement at their last I/O conference: That Google would become the agent handling all forms of commerce on behalf of the average person worldwide.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  It’s because LLMs are a threat to Google Shopping too. But as a consumer, why would I want another middleman?
ericd 11d ago
Nice, have a github repo? This is something I've thought about trying to build, seems like the future.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  https://github.com/openshiporg/marketplace https://github.com/openshiporg/marketplace
leviathant 11d ago
The funny thing to me is that, for years, Shopify has been trying to position their Shop app as an Amazon alternative, but just can't get the traction. Shopify and Amazon are two very different business models - but man, Tobi and Harley want that money! ChatGPT comes along, and suddenly it has a real shot at the global customer capture that Shopify could never manage, so they jump in bed, and release a series of garbage collaborations, some of which got rolled back (Shop on ChatGPT, but you can only have one item in your cart, lulz), and some of which just keep mutating. Shopify fumbled pretty badly, and it was wild to watch the entire industry go from "You'll be buying through the LLMs this year" to "So, let's talk about AEO, GEO, and discovery..." like nothing happened. None of the AI companies seem to have their heads screwed on straight about ecommerce, except potentially Google. The payment processors are sniffing around, too, since at the end of all the discovery, that order needs an easy means of processing payment. I think your open-source, decentralized, interoperable marketplace is a noble effort, but you're up against multi-billion-dollar business interests who are looking to capture revenue from processing, and have dozens, if not hundreds of people on the case not only from a development standpoint, but from a business and marketing standpoint. Maybe you've got a team like that under you, too. Best of luck. I've thought from the start that the strongest possibilities for ChatGPT to monetize boil down to advertising (so many ethical problems), and becoming a marketplace that finally dislodges Amazon. But that is a VERY tall mountain to climb.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  Exactly, Shopify can become a new Amazon with Shop but then you’re just trading Amazon for Shopify. It’s why I’m building open-source SaaS for every vertical and that’s what powers the marketplace. You can read the ethos to learn more[0] 0. https://marketplace.openship.org/ethos https://marketplace.openship.org/ethos
hmokiguess 11d ago
Amazon is not just the frontend. There is a whole supply chain side of it with warehouses, distributors, couriers, etc. Inventory and stock readiness, shipping, and other things will continue to be bottlenecks for consumerism at scale.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  3PLs and warehouse distribution channels have gotten better and are cheaper than using FBA shipping outside Amazon. Did you know the biggest sellers on Amazon normally have their own website and in fact, orders from Amazon flow directly into their OMS (order management system). Amazon is simply a sales channel. Also Amazon has a stronghold in western countries but much less so in gulf states, South Asia, and Africa.
  - lotsofpulp 11d ago
    Amazon's biggest feature is free returns. I would not buy even a quarter of the stuff on Amazon if I was not confident that I could easily return it.
    - theturtletalks 11d ago
      But even that is being enshittified. You have to pay for some returns now. And people have been putting defective to get free shipping returns and Amazon has just started a fee for returning items for the wrong reason.
      - lotsofpulp 11d ago
        I only buy the stuff that says free returns (for any reason) up front.
  - linkregister 11d ago
    Can you give some more information for buyers who want to route orders directly to sellers instead of via Amazon? Right now the only benefit for using Amazon is a unified shopping interface and free shipping using Prime.
kelvinjps10 11d ago
Isn't the value on same day delivery? Returns, warehouses, drivers, customer support all of that? How chatgpt is going to help with that?.
- theturtletalks 11d ago
  Before I could build this decentralized marketplace, I had to build open-source SaaS that the sellers use. All of that is handled by that platform. The chat simply interfaces with the API just like the built in storefront does. The marketplace is also built in a way that you can add a Shopify adapter, BigCommerce, custom, etc. It only supports Openfront for now. Even if the store you want to interface with has a custom software, you can write the adapter code and they are added.
DonsDiscountGas 11d ago
Amazon still probably make it via AWS, but other websites you may be right.
jatora 11d ago
The new era of ads is this comment right here. shudders
- mirthflat83 11d ago
  I legitimately thought the parent comment was satire
  - upupupandaway 11d ago
    Reminds me of a message I got on LinkedIn on Memorial Day weekend. "Memorial Day is an opportunity to slow down and think about the service of those who gave their lives for America and for our freedom. We offer you freedom from the hassle of hiring your own internal engineering team by providing you with vetted, experience software engineers in the same time zone as your company."

johndhi 11d ago

Sounds cool. Needs network effects of lots of highly rated stores to succeed, I think.

theturtletalks 11d ago
Yes but users can build adapters and bring their own stores.

varispeed 11d ago

Why it would be a threat? Unless Amazon is manipulating the marketplace for the customer to buy a product different from what they want. In that case such practice surely should attract a look from regulators?

peri-cl 11d ago
Tricking customers into buying things they otherwise wouldn't is the core concept of adtech. If you insulate humans from the manipulative dark patterns (though agent intermediaries), it's possible for them to spend less, spend more efficiently, optimize out information-asymmetries that are profit centers for entities like Amazon. Of course Amazon will fight this.
- chadgpt5 11d ago
  Realistically the agents will inject their own dark patterns. Whoever owns the glass owns the revenue stream, for they have the ultimate power to replace anyone else's revenue stream with their own. Some TVs detect ad spots in video content and overlay ads that pay the TV manufacturer instead.
  - peri-cl 11d ago
    Right. Agents in the hands of consumers (truly under their control) empowers them; agents in the hands of retailers does quite the opposite.
- varispeed 11d ago
  This is equivalent of Amazon setting up a maze in a physical store and then complaining someone is selling the maps.
cush 11d ago
> Amazon is manipulating the marketplace for the customer to buy a product different from what they want There is no expectation or regulation that a store is supposed to only show customers what they want. A retailer is going to sell you the items you're willing to buy based on what they think will help them drive the most profits. Imagine for a moment you're a store that sells millions of different products. Now, imagine a customer walks into your store, and as per some government regulation "you're expected only to show the customers who walk into your store products that they want". It's a fairly ridiculous expectation.
- pbhjpbhj 11d ago
  Also Amazon actively prevent you finding what you want, their search and filter get worse every time I use it.
jmspring 11d ago
Amazon has generally been a shadow of itself. Fakes and less than reputable options. An opensource / legit sourced marketplace could be useful.

DaveFr 11d ago

I don't want "vetted" stores. I don't care if it's open-source or decentralized or interoperable (though, fine I guess if it is). What I actually want is stores that are scraped, preferably adversarially. When Amazon, Walmart et. al. try to shut you down, I will know you have something worth using.

theturtletalks 11d ago
You can use our vetted stores but add your own, it’s not restricted.

truncate 11d ago

I've mixed opinions on that. For example, there are products like Google Shopping or Google Travel etc. They show up bunch of stores where you can buy a flight ticket or a particular product from. However, in the end most people just end up buying it from top 2-3 marketplaces anyway, not because its cheaper, but also because they can trust it, it arrives in 2 days, and you can easily return it if you don't want. So if I'm going to most likely buy something from Amazon anyway, why not just use Amazon web page. They've had one click buy button for ages.

Marsymars 11d ago
> However, in the end most people just end up buying it from top 2-3 marketplaces anyway, not because its cheaper, but also because they can trust it, it arrives in 2 days, and you can easily return it if you don't want. I've got enough complaints about the amazon customer and user experience that I'm not going to list them here, but returns are so easy. I click the button, and then I don't need to print off a shipping label or even package the item back up, I just drop it off at the convenience store by my house, they scan a QR code on my phone, and take the bare item from me.
theturtletalks 11d ago
Yes Amazon’s power is very difficult to overcome. The hope with my marketplace is that stores will offer cheaper prices since we are interfacing with them directly and they are not paying Amazon a cut. Also, Amazon Prime is affordable now, but it will get more and more expensive. They have a large distribution network but most of their drivers are contractors. Amazon also is not as powerful in non-Western countries. They still rely on many different websites depending on need.

Shakahs 11d ago

This was Google's big announcement at their last I/O conference: That Google would become the agent handling all forms of commerce on behalf of the average person worldwide.

theturtletalks 11d ago
It’s because LLMs are a threat to Google Shopping too. But as a consumer, why would I want another middleman?

ericd 11d ago

Nice, have a github repo? This is something I've thought about trying to build, seems like the future.

theturtletalks 11d ago
https://github.com/openshiporg/marketplace https://github.com/openshiporg/marketplace

leviathant 11d ago

The funny thing to me is that, for years, Shopify has been trying to position their Shop app as an Amazon alternative, but just can't get the traction. Shopify and Amazon are two very different business models - but man, Tobi and Harley want that money! ChatGPT comes along, and suddenly it has a real shot at the global customer capture that Shopify could never manage, so they jump in bed, and release a series of garbage collaborations, some of which got rolled back (Shop on ChatGPT, but you can only have one item in your cart, lulz), and some of which just keep mutating. Shopify fumbled pretty badly, and it was wild to watch the entire industry go from "You'll be buying through the LLMs this year" to "So, let's talk about AEO, GEO, and discovery..." like nothing happened. None of the AI companies seem to have their heads screwed on straight about ecommerce, except potentially Google. The payment processors are sniffing around, too, since at the end of all the discovery, that order needs an easy means of processing payment. I think your open-source, decentralized, interoperable marketplace is a noble effort, but you're up against multi-billion-dollar business interests who are looking to capture revenue from processing, and have dozens, if not hundreds of people on the case not only from a development standpoint, but from a business and marketing standpoint. Maybe you've got a team like that under you, too. Best of luck. I've thought from the start that the strongest possibilities for ChatGPT to monetize boil down to advertising (so many ethical problems), and becoming a marketplace that finally dislodges Amazon. But that is a VERY tall mountain to climb.

theturtletalks 11d ago
Exactly, Shopify can become a new Amazon with Shop but then you’re just trading Amazon for Shopify. It’s why I’m building open-source SaaS for every vertical and that’s what powers the marketplace. You can read the ethos to learn more[0] 0. https://marketplace.openship.org/ethos https://marketplace.openship.org/ethos

hmokiguess 11d ago

Amazon is not just the frontend. There is a whole supply chain side of it with warehouses, distributors, couriers, etc. Inventory and stock readiness, shipping, and other things will continue to be bottlenecks for consumerism at scale.

theturtletalks 11d ago
3PLs and warehouse distribution channels have gotten better and are cheaper than using FBA shipping outside Amazon. Did you know the biggest sellers on Amazon normally have their own website and in fact, orders from Amazon flow directly into their OMS (order management system). Amazon is simply a sales channel. Also Amazon has a stronghold in western countries but much less so in gulf states, South Asia, and Africa.
- lotsofpulp 11d ago
  Amazon's biggest feature is free returns. I would not buy even a quarter of the stuff on Amazon if I was not confident that I could easily return it.
  - theturtletalks 11d ago
    But even that is being enshittified. You have to pay for some returns now. And people have been putting defective to get free shipping returns and Amazon has just started a fee for returning items for the wrong reason.
    - lotsofpulp 11d ago
      I only buy the stuff that says free returns (for any reason) up front.
- linkregister 11d ago
  Can you give some more information for buyers who want to route orders directly to sellers instead of via Amazon? Right now the only benefit for using Amazon is a unified shopping interface and free shipping using Prime.

kelvinjps10 11d ago

Isn't the value on same day delivery? Returns, warehouses, drivers, customer support all of that? How chatgpt is going to help with that?.

theturtletalks 11d ago
Before I could build this decentralized marketplace, I had to build open-source SaaS that the sellers use. All of that is handled by that platform. The chat simply interfaces with the API just like the built in storefront does. The marketplace is also built in a way that you can add a Shopify adapter, BigCommerce, custom, etc. It only supports Openfront for now. Even if the store you want to interface with has a custom software, you can write the adapter code and they are added.

DonsDiscountGas 11d ago

Amazon still probably make it via AWS, but other websites you may be right.

jatora 11d ago

The new era of ads is this comment right here. shudders

mirthflat83 11d ago
I legitimately thought the parent comment was satire
- upupupandaway 11d ago
  Reminds me of a message I got on LinkedIn on Memorial Day weekend. "Memorial Day is an opportunity to slow down and think about the service of those who gave their lives for America and for our freedom. We offer you freedom from the hassle of hiring your own internal engineering team by providing you with vetted, experience software engineers in the same time zone as your company."