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AI can do anything that it was trained on based on humans. As soon as humans are not involved, AI will have nothing to train on, and hence, the rate of improvem

AI can do anything that it was trained on based on humans. As soon as humans are not involved, AI will have nothing to train on, and hence, the rate of improvement will approch zero, and the AI will collapse.

Rover222 13d ago
what a dumb thing to keep repeating at this point
- lolakutty 13d ago
  Why?
  - esafak 13d ago
    Because all the models train on synthetic data too, plus they can collect their own data with robots.
    - lolakutty 13d ago
      Synthetic data can only help the model to capture existing patterns in the current training data more efficiently. So it can improve the performance upto certain point, but not beyond it. >they can collect their own data with robots... This is still sci-fi.
      - cindyllm 13d ago
        [dead]
jazzpush2 13d ago
Just ignoring all the recently solved math problems human, huh?
- tacomonstrous 13d ago
  If you understood how they were solved, you'd see that you're only bolstering the point you were responding to.
  - jazzpush2 13d ago
    > If you understood how they were solved My guess, based on this response alone, is that you're an academic, given the holier-than-thou pretention. I understand how lean works, having done enough pure maths in my statistics PhD, and now work for a frontier lab. And yet, I don't see how any of it bolsters the point. I do see realms of Math PhDs posting, 'iT's sO OvEr' blog posts and lamenting time spent studying math. I'm sure they understand the proofs better than I ever will, and they seem quite rattled. Probably just not as smart as you.
deleted 13d ago
[deleted]
bpodgursky 13d ago
Human knowledge races up to the frontier through formal education and then nudges past the frontier a little bit at a time and AI will train on AI outputs that do the same. But, it will do it 1000x faster than humans because that's just how they work.
- charcircuit 13d ago
  >1000x faster than humans Some of the process of expanding the frontier is not parallelizable and is built on top of previous discoveries. And pushing the frontier requires doing things in the real world, or running experiments that take significant real world time that can hurt your 1000x faster claim.
felipeerias 13d ago
Nowadays training relies heavily on reinforcement learning with verifiable rewards (RLVR), which assesses a model's output according to objective automated checks, not subjective human judgments.
senectus1 13d ago
sorry, while I'm no proponent of AI... you cant make this claim with anything more than "feels" how can you be so sure that AI cant improve to a level where it has original thoughts, Creativity and imagination. remember that our input is limited to our sensor capability. AI has an unlimited ability to add more sensors and as a consequence collect input that we are not aware of, then whats stopping it training on information we dont have access to? you cant. no one can. we haven't maxed out this technology or the amount of compute we can throw at it yet. (we may have maxed out the economic viability of it though... I think we'll find out in the next 12-18 months.)
blackoil 13d ago
.1 percentile will still be working.

Rover222 13d ago

what a dumb thing to keep repeating at this point

lolakutty 13d ago
Why?
- esafak 13d ago
  Because all the models train on synthetic data too, plus they can collect their own data with robots.
  - lolakutty 13d ago
    Synthetic data can only help the model to capture existing patterns in the current training data more efficiently. So it can improve the performance upto certain point, but not beyond it. >they can collect their own data with robots... This is still sci-fi.
    - cindyllm 13d ago
      [dead]

jazzpush2 13d ago

Just ignoring all the recently solved math problems human, huh?

tacomonstrous 13d ago
If you understood how they were solved, you'd see that you're only bolstering the point you were responding to.
- jazzpush2 13d ago
  > If you understood how they were solved My guess, based on this response alone, is that you're an academic, given the holier-than-thou pretention. I understand how lean works, having done enough pure maths in my statistics PhD, and now work for a frontier lab. And yet, I don't see how any of it bolsters the point. I do see realms of Math PhDs posting, 'iT's sO OvEr' blog posts and lamenting time spent studying math. I'm sure they understand the proofs better than I ever will, and they seem quite rattled. Probably just not as smart as you.

deleted 13d ago

[deleted]

bpodgursky 13d ago

Human knowledge races up to the frontier through formal education and then nudges past the frontier a little bit at a time and AI will train on AI outputs that do the same. But, it will do it 1000x faster than humans because that's just how they work.

charcircuit 13d ago
>1000x faster than humans Some of the process of expanding the frontier is not parallelizable and is built on top of previous discoveries. And pushing the frontier requires doing things in the real world, or running experiments that take significant real world time that can hurt your 1000x faster claim.

felipeerias 13d ago

Nowadays training relies heavily on reinforcement learning with verifiable rewards (RLVR), which assesses a model's output according to objective automated checks, not subjective human judgments.

senectus1 13d ago

sorry, while I'm no proponent of AI... you cant make this claim with anything more than "feels" how can you be so sure that AI cant improve to a level where it has original thoughts, Creativity and imagination. remember that our input is limited to our sensor capability. AI has an unlimited ability to add more sensors and as a consequence collect input that we are not aware of, then whats stopping it training on information we dont have access to? you cant. no one can. we haven't maxed out this technology or the amount of compute we can throw at it yet. (we may have maxed out the economic viability of it though... I think we'll find out in the next 12-18 months.)

blackoil 13d ago

.1 percentile will still be working.