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My conspiracy theory is that "24" was funded by the CIA (etc.) to build public support for measures like the Patriot Act. "24" debuted 11 days after the Patriot
by antonvs 1mo ago
My conspiracy theory is that "24" was funded by the CIA (etc.) to build public support for measures like the Patriot Act. "24" debuted 11 days after the Patriot Act became law, so they were being worked on at the same time.
- nomadpenguin 1mo agoIs that even a conspiracy? It's well documented how closely the military works with Hollywood -- of course government apparatuses are interested in funding media that aligns with their goals.
- classified 1mo agoAnd it was a Fox production. Using the most obvious shill isn't very covert.
- mr_roboto 1mo agoThe democrats introduced the patriot act...
- soraki_soladead 1mo agoexcept that's not true: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Act > On October 23, 2001, U.S. representative Jim Sensenbrenner (R-WI) introduced House bill H.R. 3162, which incorporated provisions from a previously-sponsored House bill, and a Senate bill introduced earlier in the month.[5] The next day, October 24, the Act passed the House by a vote of 357–66,[6] with Democrats comprising the overwhelming majority of "no"-votes. > The bill, which removed most of the changes from the Senate version, passed Congress on March 2, 2006, and was signed by President Bush on March 9 and 10 of that year.
- SturgeonsLaw 1mo agoDepends what counts as "introduced", the Patriot Act was based on the Omnibus Counterterrorism Act written by Joe Biden. This is something Biden was proud of, and confirmed in his own words many times https://www.c-span.org/clip/senate-committee/user-clip-joe-biden-says-he-wrote-the-patriot-act/4876107 https://www.c-span.org/clip/senate-committee/user-clip-joe-b... The surveillance state has bipartisan support.
- inigyou 1mo agoeven if that were true it would be completely irrelevant to the context in which you replied? Check if you have DDS.
- antonvs 1mo agoIt’s a conspiracy theory in that there’s no evidence of funding, support, or even cooperation in the particular case of “24”. The 24 pilot was filmed before 9/11. After 9/11, the show had to be modified because reality has become uncomfortably close to it. That included delaying the premiere and removing a scene involving an exploding passenger aircraft. The Washington Post reported on a trend of shows about counter-terrorism and spies, on August 4 2011: https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/2001/08/04/speaking-of-spooky-tvs-new-spy-crop/a790e44a-1087-46d7-a617-23ed21ed79c5/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/2001/08/04/... That article mentions that some of those shows relied on government consultation, with the CIA and FBI, to help with realism, etc. “24” was not one of them. “24” co-creator Joel Surnow is on record saying there was no government involvement. Quote from the WP for context: > Coming this fall [2001]: A new primetime drama series takes a close-up look at an elite federal agency and the dedicated men and women who hunt deadly terrorists and treacherous criminals. > The new show's on CBS. It's also on NBC. And ABC. And Fox. Some years it's twenty-something sitcoms. Sometimes it's doctors, or vermin-oriented "reality" shows. This fall, the trend is Fed TV: No fewer than five new network series depict the exploits of people with civil-service pay grades, shiny employee ID badges and very large guns. But it was “24” that did the most to normalize the “torture the bad guys till they reveal the plot” and other such right-wing wet dreams.
- rayiner 1mo ago[dead]
- JuniperMesos 1mo agoHow many of those same people are Republicans today, because of various shifts in the political positions the different American political parties take with respect to demographic groups such as men?
- rayiner 1mo agoMore than a few—this was Georgia Tech and these are all southern white guys—but not the majority.
- aisenik 1mo agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_and_superstructure https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_and_superstructure
- Blazara 1mo agoDon't scare people with an article explicitly calling it Marxist! They'll have a fit!
- mindslight 1mo agoWhy do you need the detour through the CIA? Our de jure Constitutional government is merely part of a much larger de facto government formed by large corporations and the billionaire (oligarch) class. The same group of people who funded the lobbyists that had the "Patriot" Act ready and waiting on September 10th also funded "24", the politicians and think tanks behind the Iraq War, and so on. The main difference is that production of "24" was a direct bona fide business expense for tax purposes.
- antonvs 1mo agoA conspiracy theory without a shadowy government organization is just a conspiracy.
- mindslight 1mo agoFair!
- quietsegfault 1mo agoIt doesn’t even need to be secret or underhanded. The government can simply foster the media that drives their strategic goals. Same kind of idea as stochastic terror.
- JuniperMesos 1mo agoAnd just like stochaistic terror, it's a label you can apply to basically any media you don't like, that seems to support a political agenda you are opposed to.
- inigyou 1mo agoHuh? What label? The conversation wasn't about a label.
- RobotToaster 1mo agoI was going to say the same about James Bond, but it turns out they literally boast about helping in its production on their website, so it's not really a conspiracy theory https://www.cia.gov/stories/story/the-cia-and-pop-culture/ https://www.cia.gov/stories/story/the-cia-and-pop-culture/
- rayiner 1mo agoYou’re missing something else that happened right before 24 debuted on November 6, 2001.
- 3hsga14 1mo ago[flagged]
- mapontosevenths 1mo ago>And Epstein friends Lutnick, Larry Silverstein, Sarah Ferguson and Michael Jackson all had appointments in the WTC on 9/11 and all canceled last minute. I looked into this so I could call you out for spreading disinformation. Except what I found was that this statement is factually accurate as far as I can tell. Each person had their own separate story as to why they didn't go that day. Huh. Not sure what to make of this.
- tgma 1mo ago> Not sure what to make of this. Not much as the sample has (literally) survival bias.
- mapontosevenths 1mo agoI feel like it's just a statistical fact that many people used to visit and cancel visits there every day, but it's hard to say how unlikely this was without numbers.
- Apocryphon 1mo agoSeth MacFarlane and Mark Wahlberg were famously supposed to be on American Airlines Flight 11, and Jackie Chan was supposed to start filming a movie at the World Trade Center that very morning. I’m sure more near-brushes exist.
- 1mo ago
- GolfPopper 1mo agoDon't forget the X-Files spinoff The Lone Gunmen. During its pilot episode, first airing March 4th, 2001, members of the U.S. government remotely hijack an airliner and try to crash it into the World Trade Center, blaming anti-American terrorist groups in order to start a new global war on terrorism for the profit of defense industry contractors.
- lazide 1mo agoIt may also have contributed a bit to the planning - HEAT (the movie) came out before the North Hollywood bank robbery and shootings, but clearly influenced them. I don’t think there is any plausible direct relationship, just zeitgeist/influence.
- thereforegrin 1mo agoyes, there are no coincidences, only signs. There was also an art exhibition called 'The B-thing', before the attack: https://publicdelivery.org/gelitin-b-thing/ https://publicdelivery.org/gelitin-b-thing/ Then there are reports of FBI expelling from the USA some 100+ foreign art students after the attack. There are a lot more dots to connect in this case, so it gets even easier but if people expect to be told the truth by a news anchor it can take 75+ years - that is the word we live in.
- marcosdumay 1mo agoBoth throwing airplanes at buildings and taking the World Trace Center down were pretty widespread "hidden" ideas at the time. It's not surprising that several people connected them.
- XorNot 1mo agoExcept people love torture anyway. Even people who say they're opposed to torture usually do so in terms of "it's bad to torture people, but like, it would totally work". It is a ludicrously common sentiment. The actual conspiracy was the CIA told the Zero Dark Thirty producers that the Intel to find bin Laden came from torturing a detainee, which was a straight up lie (namely: under standard interrogation he provided the intelligence they needed...then they waterboarded him over 100 more times which provided absolutely nothing).
- blaufuchs 1mo agoSame with Homeland. How many times do you see Carrie stymied by the law and cheer when she eventually breaks it?
- chrisweekly 1mo agoYeah; how many times in 24 hours can one vigilante commit acts of thinly-narratively-justified but actually-illegal torture without audiences clueing in?
- shevy-java 1mo agoI don't know if that is a conspiracy theory; it probably is a bit unlikely to have a direct connection to the CIA. But what is definitely not a conspiracy theory is that the USA uses taxpayer's money to fund propaganda, e. g. a pro-war image. There are numerous examples for this, also for directors who refused to accept such deals since that heavily ruined movies. The movies with bribes from the US military are often incredibly dumb and simplistic. Propaganda often works in such a way that it dumbs down everything. Then again, movie quality also declined a LOT in the last some 20 years or even 30 years now. With AI movies upcoming, the slop spam section has finally won. People are not going to pay money for awful AI slop.
- michael0church 1mo ago[dead]