7 ms·

Due to pricing insanity (not that Apple prices weren’t insane before the ram/ssd shortages) I’m not in the market but I do wonder if my next computer should be

Due to pricing insanity (not that Apple prices weren’t insane before the ram/ssd shortages) I’m not in the market but I do wonder if my next computer should be a Mac Studio instead of a MBP that lives its life docked. Might be better to just run a Studio and Neo for the very few times I actually need remote capabilities.

appplication 2mo ago
I had the same thought, I grabbed a studio two years ago for this reason and it’s been great. 99% of the time lack of portability isn’t a concern. Every now and then (e.g. travel) I notice the limitation, but it’s not much of an inconvenience to just not do some work for a bit.
- Gareth321 2mo ago
  Plus remote work is getting easier and easier. There are so few instances when I'm not able to get online. If we lived in a world where hardware were getting cheaper, it might make sense to splurge. In this environment I think the Neo is perfect.
  - dannyw 2mo ago
    Build quality of the Neo is extremely good, I love the keyboard — it’s more tactile and reminds me of early 2010s MacBooks. I’ll be selling my M4 MBA soon, I genuinely use the Neo more. Huge difference in typing experience. Great repairability is a plus. It was super easy, and actually fun to open. Felt like unboxing an Apple product. Applied the thermal paste mod for $10 which works excellently; I’ve had it shortly after launch. And I love the notchless display, even if I wished the color gamut was a bit better.
    - havaloc 2mo ago
      The Neo keyboard just feels nicer than even an M5 Air.
tamimio 2mo ago
That’s what I have been doing for years, it remains in the house secured while I ssh into it from an old thinkpad. You can get air to pair it with it if you really wanna have that seamless flow, otherwise, ssh works well.
super_mario 2mo ago
I was in the same situation, I used maxed out 15'' M3 Max MacBook Pro docked to Studio Display closed on vertical stand behind the screen. It was fine for office work, but running local LLMs would definitely overheat it. The battery started degrading purely due to heat issues. And it was audible as well. I decided to get Mac Studio M4 Max, also all maxed out config and the cooling is so much better that I can run local LLMs like Gemma 3/4, gpt-oss 120b all day long without any heat issues or any audible fan noise. So for my use case it was the right decision. I subsequently added 15'' M5 Max MacBook Pro all maxed out to my collection and even though it is slightly faster on LLM inference (I get 100 tokens/s with Gemma 4 27b model), you just can't run LLMs longer than a few minutes. It starts overheating and gets really loud.
- seanmcdirmid 2mo ago
  Weird, I’ve run LLM batch sessions for hours on my Max M3 MBP. It doesn’t get very loud, though I’m not getting anything close to 100 tok/s on a 27b model, I use a 35b MoE model just to get 90 tok/s. The fan comes on but thermally it never overheats. I do have it in a vertical closed position, though.
jermaustin1 2mo ago
I've been holding out, because I think my next purchase will be a Studio with an Ultra Chip in it. I'm wanting it to be a "forever" server, so I'm holding out while I can.
- simonh 2mo ago
  Buy in 2 years, or buy now and have it last 2 years less than forever.
- jubilanti 2mo ago
  Then you'll always be waiting, there's always something new the industry tries to tempt you with.
  - jermaustin1 2mo ago
    I just wait for a cycle or two where the leaps and bounds are more like hops and steps. So if the M7 Ultra improves inference by 2x over the M5, but the M9 Ultra only improves by 1.2x over the M7, that's my signal to buy. Unfortunately they haven't slowed down yet.
- Gareth321 2mo ago
  Supply rumours are next year we see an M7 AI-focused chip with large inference performance upgrades. It's unlikely we'll see heavy upgrades in other areas. If you care about AI, it's worth waiting. If you don't, pull the trigger now. RAM constraints are likely to get worse next year. Or wait 2-3 years and prices should be back to Earth (plus newer and even better chips). I'm waiting this out.
  - ahknight 2mo ago
    Yeah, but how many years until 128GB+ is attainable by mere mortals again? My 2021 home server build was 64GB of RAM. My 2025 build was 32GB and zram. :/
    - xhkkffbf 2mo ago
ape4 2mo ago
How about business where you send in all your old devices and get back a SSD using using their memories
try-working 2mo ago
Laptops can't do agentic engineering. They get hot as hell and battery drains instantly. I think this will promote a switch to desktops for the next couple of years, until we have new mobile chips.
- steve1977 2mo ago
  But laptops can remote into boxes that can run agents. So a combination of a powerful desktop and a "cheap" laptop might indeed be attractive.
- jonathanberger 2mo ago
  Are you referring specifically to agentic engineering with locally hosted models?
hectdev 2mo ago
I dusted of my lightest computer with an M1 chip and use Tailscale to make my network virtual from anywhere. Been running a. Pi5 as a main house hub and an M1 Pro as an always on Mac. It would be nice to go all out and make a Studio a hub I can just screen share into for major compute.
hirvi74 2mo ago
Do it! I went with the Mini/Neo combo. I don't need MBP power when out and about. When at home, the Mini is all I use.
jgwil2 2mo ago
If all you want to do is remote into your desktop, Neo seems like overkill. Why not just get a $200 Chromebook and save yourself $500?
- rjrjrjrj 2mo ago
  Because the screen, keyboard, and especially trackpad on a $200 Chromebook sucks?
  - bredren 2mo ago
    Also: the enclosure, and the hinges.
  - frollogaston 2mo ago
    Also it'll be truly too slow. You need to at least be able to access a shared document while a video call is going. The funniest recurring thing when working at Google was new hires getting baited into taking a Chromebook, then not being able to switch to a Mac for like 2 years. Our team made sure new people didn't fall for that.
- ahknight 2mo ago
  Because who hates themselves that much? It's the thing I touch and interact with. That's exactly the part that needs to be sturdy, smooth, and pretty. It's the facade to the beast at the other end.
- PennRobotics 2mo ago
  This comment got me curious, so I searched for cheap laptops with mobile internet. There's at least one LTE Chromebook now for about 300 euros. This might be my next laptop if it can run Tailscale and remote desktop.
- olyjohn 2mo ago
  Also remoting into a Mac sucks on anything that isn't a Mac. It runs like shit when using any VNC client that isn't Apple's.
PaulRobinson 2mo ago
I've been thinking about this a fair bit recently. We make a lot of price/performance compromises for having an attached screen and keyboard on our computer. That was what got me started. Then I remembered the days of having to go to a special corner of the house to use a computer, vs now when I have a computer with me all the time. In my bag, on the sofa, on the train. Hell, I'm writing this on the work MBP while waiting for an appointment. And you know what, I think I got more done when I went and sat in a corner of the house all those years ago. I set up an area for "computer work", and it worked really well. I have a home office, but it's a jumble of cables going into docking stations and all sorts of weird stuff. I think if I streamline it and turn it into a proper "computer room", I might get some of that mojo back. I might even convince my partner that surrendering the home office and having a corner of the den might be good - she can watch TV while I tinker. And I won't be balancing a laptop on my knee and trying to do two things at once. And the price/performance thing comes back in. Hmm.
- AshleyGrant 2mo ago
  There is a definite mental aspect for most WFH folks to having a space that is dedicated to work. I'm not unique in saying this, but the way I put it is "If you work from anywhere in your house, then you're always at work." And that, from mental load standpoint, is not healthy for most folks.
  - jrrv 2mo ago
    Or, if you're like me then "if you work from anywhere in your house, then you're never at work."
    - mjcohen 2mo ago
      [flagged]
      - clickety_clack 2mo ago
        I read it as though he’s “working”, like quiet quitting or something.
armadyl 2mo ago
That’s nearly what I do but on a smaller scale. My iPad Pro serves as my laptop 90% of the time, and the 10% of the time I need to actually code and test in a chromium browser I remote into a mini.
ThouYS 2mo ago
Having replaced my MacBook with a Mac Mini, I would reconsider. The MacBook is just such a _complete_ package. Great speakers, great keyboard, fantastic screen, the fingerprint sensor thingy.. Takes a lot of gear to match that
- cj 2mo ago
  If your computer never leaves your desk, the iMac is pretty competitive with those features. Even comes with a TouchID keyboard.
  - mikestew 2mo ago
    I’ve had iMacs for almost 20 years. My last one was indeed my last. Without target display mode (use the Mac as a monitor), I’m ditching a perfectly good monitor. I was going to buy a Mac Studio and a good monitor to replace the iMac until the spouse reminded me that we are now retired and will spend time in a camper. So a MBP for me (and BenQ’s Mac-specific monitor), but others might do well to consider a Mac Mini/Studio. iMacs are great for a lot of use cases, but my image of the typical HN user would prefer to keep the monitor separate.
    - deleted 2mo ago
      [deleted]
    - frollogaston 2mo ago
      It's like, you pay laptop prices for laptop performance but without laptop portability or desktop modularity. This only sorta made sense back when Apple had no "prosumer" desktop offering unless you wanted a cheap used Mac Pro (which is what I ended up doing at some point).
- pebble 2mo ago
  Not an option if you're trying to drive 3 decent screens.
  - joshstrange 2mo ago
code-blooded 2mo ago
<deleted>
- swozey 2mo ago
  I'd never go x86 again after owning an m1. I'd have replaced an x86 laptop 2 or 3 times by now (2020 m1). My last $3500 dell xps 13z before buying the m1 was absolutely horrible.
- SubiculumCode 2mo ago
  I can't wait for an actual competitor to the M chips from apple. It's frustrating.
- ogrisel 2mo ago
  What CPU / GPU combination would you recommend? Can use unified host+device memory?
epolanski 2mo ago
For a desktop you may find yourself better on a Linux or Windows machine price/performance wise. I personally own an M3 ultra, an M1 max as laptops, but my desktop is a Ryzen desktop I built in 2022 and it was a third in price of the ultra for more power.
bearjaws 2mo ago
Recently took a Minisforum 7840hs PC out of rotation as a media PC and made it a full time coding workstation with Proxmox. I do a VM per project due to the nature of agentic editors. I was using a VM setup on my MBP but it felt like a huge waste, having to leave a laptop on 24/7 when all it did was run Claude Code inside VMs. I likely will stick with a Macbook Air 15" for next purchase, and beef up my "Claude Server" down the road.
sanderjd 2mo ago
Yep, this is my exact thought. The pendulum has swung back toward a desktop making more sense for me than a laptop. It all depends on whether there is anything useful to do with an amount of computation that can't be fit into a laptop package. For a long time there wasn't, now there is.
herpdyderp 2mo ago
This is my setup (except I have an Air because the Neo didn't exist yet). And it's great. Tailscale makes it trivial.
- b15h0p 2mo ago
  So, do you use VNC (or ssh) to access the Mac Studio at home? Or do you only access other stuff that's living in your home network?
  - javier123454321 2mo ago
    not OP but tailscale ssh does the trick for me.
  - herpdyderp 2mo ago
    ssh in terminal and/or through VS Code. When needed, I also use Apple's Screen Sharing app.
jasode 2mo ago
>I do wonder if my next computer should be a Mac Studio instead of a MBP that lives its life docked. Having owned 3 MacBook Pros since 2008, the decision to make my next computer be a Mac Studio came down to (1) MacBook thermal throttling that slows down CPUs when it starts to overheat and (2) easier upgrade of Mac Studio SSD with after-market storage module whereas the MacBook requires more complicated disassembly and hot air gun to dislodge the surface mounted SSDs. I have a brand new M5 Pro MacBook Pro I don't like it when the fans turn on. The Mac Studio will be faster and quieter for the same workloads.
- 4fterd4rk 2mo ago
  You don't want a computer that does thermal throttling but also do not like it when the fans turn on?
  - jasode 2mo ago
    >but also do not like it when the fans turn on? Sorry for not being clearer. I don't like the MacBook's noise when the fans turn on. The Mac Studio has bigger heat sinks to delay the need for thermal management -- and if its fan does need to turn on, the bigger size means it's still silent instead of the high-pitched whooshing noise the tiny fans make in the MacBook.
    - jmalicki 2mo ago
      You can get large under-laptop cooling pads with giant fans that can help this somewhat. It's not part of the laptop, but help if it's docked at home. It's not totally ideal since the bottom of your laptop doesn't have radiator fins, but does help.
- shaunkoh 2mo ago
  I used to game on my 2014 MBP. That was a bad idea - took about 5 years, but eventually my batteries became spicy pillows. Turns out that even with the fans at full blast, the batteries didn’t like being so hot over prolonged periods. I’m happy with my M4 mini now, with a separate windows pc for gaming.
bdhdhduuyd 2mo ago
I have been thinking a lot about buying a very fast desktop and a cheap laptop that uses remote desktop to connect to the fast computer. But in the end I ended op buying a Lenovo Legion and put Linux on it. Laptops are so fast these days that I didn't want to be bothered with setting up connectivity to a remote desktop. But if your laptop never leaves your desk I think a desktop computer is a great option. Relatively cheaper and easier to maintain and upgrade.
saidinesh5 2mo ago
At my current job, one of my biggest blunders was thinking "Let me just order the same hardware as most of my teammates to avoid unnecessary complications". Most, if not all, of our current work happens on remote cloud vms. Now I'm stuck with carrying a 3KG monstrosity to work.Every day. Absolutely no positives compared to my ThinkPad that weighed less than half in my previous job. Remote development is "good enough" these days. With VS Code, Development containers etc... Having a light weight, portable laptop is so much nicer than a laptop that you can't even rest on your lap for long duration. The only thing you need to be mindful of using light weight laptops is not having enough RAM to fit all your browser tabs..
- digitaltrees 2mo ago
  I totally agree I use containers through propelcode.app which means I can code on any device including my phone and the environment is the same as the server target. It’s even more important with agents that can delete files and change OS settings. I never need to worry that a coding session ends up breaking my main OS environment by deleting or changing a file.
- wombat-man 2mo ago
  Yeah I stepped down to a smaller MBP. the only reason I didn't go for an air is my home setup with dual monitors involves using the HDMI port. There probably is a dock or something out there though.
znpy 2mo ago
I’m doing essentially this, and got a MacBook Neo. Fir kinda the first time in my life I don’t really have development tools on my personal laptop. I ghostty and openvpn client installed. I have a large remote linux workstation (2x 8c/16t xeon cpus, 256gb ram, 2x8tb spinning rust disk) and i have my tools over there (along with some VMs). It works surprisingly well. Also, the macbook neo is a surprisingly capable little machine.
deleted 2mo ago
[deleted]
pjmlp 2mo ago
Apple prices have always been insane, there is a reason why during the days it almost went bankrupt, in Europe it could not rival with PC, Amiga, Atari, Acorn.
matt-p 2mo ago
Another option is a 'maxed out' mini e.g M5 Pro/64GB. Mini is super easy to travel with if you know there'll be a 'dock' at the far end e.g office<>home or whatever.
- msdz 2mo ago
  So I can somewhat speak to this, as I actually did this for a while c. 2021 and 2022. The issue (apart from my Mac mini still having the old, bigger form factor back then) is that this requires a full shutdown (obviously), and that is more friction than opening a closed laptop lid. It just takes a moment for every app and background service etc. to settle back in after, and depending on how your brain works, you might not like that a whole lot. It absolutely is a cool feeling to carry a pretty mighty desktop in the backpack, though.
  - matt-p 2mo ago
    I think it's actually good to have a forced reboot from time to time, but then I'm not very disciplined in closing stuff I'm no-longer using! Especially like docker containers I was using months ago, that I forgot to shutdown.
    - msdz 2mo ago
      Yeah, I agree (with the same unfortunate habit) – but up to twice a day of forced work full stop is overdoing it, too.
      - reddit_clone 2mo ago
        Is there no hibernation option ?
        tom_ 2mo ago
        You don't get the option in the UI: there's just "Sleep", which on a desktop Mac seems to suspend to RAM only. At least, it seems to on mine, as I found out when I unplugged it. (Apparently the laptops do a suspend to disk depending on battery remaining, so the OS does support it. It'd be nice to have it available! The disk space required could become annoying if you only bought the 1 TB SSD for your fancy 512 GB Mac though.)
master_crab 2mo ago
I had the same view recently. For the past year I’ve been using my iPad to remote into both my MacBook Pro M1 Max and my racked Linux workstation at home using Jump and moonlight/sunshine, respectively. Never looked back
frollogaston 2mo ago
My goto. Even ignoring speed, it's nice to have a remote machine that keeps doing whatever it's doing while your laptop is closed. And the ARM Macs idle at such low power that it's not wasteful like my MacPro4,1 was haha. My UPS's ammeter doesn't even display the Mac mini's draw. They gave me a nice MBP for my new job. I tried doing heavy work on it locally, it was fine for that, and yet it still ended up being a light terminal into an EC2 instance, partially because their stuff is on AWS and latency is way lower within that. My personal mini is running too.
spockz 2mo ago
Yes, except that the only way to get a fancy screen is also to put the fancy cpu in it. If there would be an Air with the screen of the pro I would buy it. Maybe even a Neo with that screen.
kylehotchkiss 2mo ago
Oh yeah. Throw it behind tailscale. Herdr multiplexer in terminal is cool, it’ll remember your session if you open it in ssh from the neo
rafaelmn 2mo ago
I would not use Neo, Air with 24 GB ram should be your minimum because you will want to do some work locally even when you're running a VPN/SSH thin client setup. I'm currently SSH-ing into my workstation from my M4 Air with 24 gb ram and it's ideal for this flow. Slack/editors/clients/browsers/etc. easily gobble up over 16 GB. I have no more dev tools/compilers/source on my client machines, everything is dockered up on remote workstation in isolated VMs (too much supply-chaining). My only downside to using a pro is not having 120/4k HDMI port on air and my dock won't support it with Apple (it does with windows)
- bilsbie 2mo ago
  Can that run qwen? Also can you explain what you meant by the downside ?
  - rafaelmn 2mo ago
    If I was going to run LLMs locally I would definitely go for a pro. I meant the only downside of not using a pro for my use-case is that I don't have a HDMI port on device with high refresh rate. I have a decent dock that can give me 4k/60hz HDMI but not 120hz refresh for macs (it works on windows). It's a minor thing but having 120hz is nice when I'm docked at home.
- jwrallie 2mo ago
  It heavily depends on your workflow and how many (electron) programs you need to run simultaneously. I found that if I’m mindful of closing things I’m not actually using, and let macOS do its swap magic, the Neo will just work. I’m also the kind of person who close tabs and I like to work on one task at a time.
- davedx 2mo ago
  I'm sorry but that's a bit ridiculous. I'm still using an M1 Pro with 16GB of RAM and I have quite heavy usage - docker, other heavy native apps, a bunch of VS.Codes and coding agents, things running in the terminal, background processes. It's just a big exaggeration that general regular productivity apps "easily gobble up over 16GB" (Edit: saying this as someone who just paid for a new 128GB M5 Pro Studio -- but that's for LLM's, not regular work)
nullfern 2mo ago
Cheap Linux laptop with Tailscale back into the Studio when traveling?
- frollogaston 2mo ago
  No iTerm2, weird shortcuts, random issues in video calls?, also not really cheap to get a laptop that reliably works with Linux and has decent battery life
zer00eyz 2mo ago
Im writing this from a MacBook Air. Everything is a container or VM now, and none of it runs locally for me. I have a desktop (older intel) with giant monitors and a keyboard for when I sit at the desk. I have the laptop for when I travel, go out or just want to work from the couch. When I do my next upgrade to "better hardware" I'm not migrating a machine, rather I'm migrating the containers. My workflow is such that if I loose one of the boxes I sit at to a cup of coffee I really wont care other than the financial loss of a new laptop or keyboard. The biggest win in all this was dumping the off the shelf firewall/router and moving to Opnsense. Wireguard vpn lets me route all my traffic through home for all my devices (and what is now a growing home lab). There are scopes of work that this setup would not work for. I would not want to be a video editor with this set up, it's not ideal if you want to play AAA games. But for what I do, it is pretty ideal.
vidarh 2mo ago
I used to have a high-powered laptop, but just use a combination of ssh and NFS to my machine at home from a low powered laptop for travel these days. It works well. Makes managing both backups and handling failure scenarios involving loss or unauthorised access to the laptop less of a hassle as well.
jmalicki 2mo ago
Why not a non-mac cheaper desktop/workstation and a Mac laptop for use? E.g. what most major tech companies have - a laptop that is for VSCode via ssh/web browsing, and a beefy Linux dev box you ssh into for everything else? It's way cheaper, and what I use at home too - a lot cheaper than a Mac studio for everything, especially with RAM and storage.
- dannyw 2mo ago
  A lot more upgradable too. Those empty DRAM slots can get populated one day!
- sylens 2mo ago
  The unified memory is the big appeal of a beefy Mac Studio
- mswphd 2mo ago
  if you do want to do local LLM stuff, mac studio is significantly better than most linux dev boxes.
  - hedora 2mo ago
    As of a year ago, the strix halo AMD (system on chip, unified ram) was within single digit percentages of the mac, but it’s a linux box, so much better for most dev and as an llm server. I know AMD has announced the replacement, and it will be faster, but I’m not sure when it’ll ship. Also, you can cluster strix halo if you need more than 128GB of ram.
  - dannyw 2mo ago
    Better than a DGX Spark running Linux? Absolutely not (I own both). Real-world matmul is about 4x higher on a DGX Spark than a M3 Ultra.
- jfb 2mo ago
  For specifically unified memory reasons, Apple machines are much, much better at running local LLMs.
Aurornis 2mo ago
I’ve debated Mac Studio or MBP at each generation. For equal spec machines the price premium to get a MBP over the Studio is always smaller than I expected, so I pay the extra amount and get the MBP. This changes when you get into connotations that aren’t available in the laptop form factor, but with RAM prices the way they are those configurations are more than I want to spend on a local machine right now. For running local LLMs the high memory Mac options always look appealing, but the processing speed (prefill) is so much slower than GPUs that it hurts. For situations where you have no rush and can let something work in the background for 24 hours it can some times be ignored, but the speeds I get from a real GPU setup are so much faster that I never use the larger models on a high memory Mac any more.
pixelready 2mo ago
I got an M1 Max studio w/ 64gb when they first came out and I love it. Price was obviously a lot more reasonable at the time. I’m fortunate to have dedicated office space, and there is definitely a nice psychological effect to having a desktop in a specific spot and “going to the office”. I’ve since purchased an m3 MacBook Air as my thin client and for lightweight travel use, and when my wife needs to take a call in the office or whatever I pop out to the living room and either hop on Remote Desktop or SSH into my Studio. Highly recommend this setup. If you’re primarily doing thin client on a local network, a neo should be fine for that (and to use as a media player/communicator around the house). That said, I have been eyeballing Omarchy…
contingencies 2mo ago
Happy with M4 Mini, although I recommend using a well ventilated M.2 enclosure instead of the integrated docks as I just had a 2TB Kingston die which I'm pretty sure was caused by "zero thermal forks given (chopsticks only)" UGreen hub design. Also can use as a laptop and replace screen/keyboard/whatever when failed/unsuitable. Higher resulting device longevity, especially with Asahi Linux making such great progress. https://github.com/vk2diy/hackbook-m4-mini https://github.com/vk2diy/hackbook-m4-mini
- shaunkoh 2mo ago
  I got an OWC Express 1M2 precisely because of thermal fears. The heatsink is huge, but no fans. Only real issue is needing to be careful to not nudge the cables. I also suspect that trying to stream larger LLM models from disk hammered the USB 4 connection too much - lead to system hangs, so now stream from the internal SSD instead.
  - contingencies 2mo ago
    Cool product, thanks. Sent back for Kingston RMA, expecting a new drive soon.
duxup 2mo ago
I’ve wanted the idea of a home server or even home “mainframe” and some terminals for me and family forever but the idea never takes off….
- JohnBooty 2mo ago
  Same. For me, it’s one of those “solutions in search of a problem.”
  - duxup 2mo ago
    It just seems somewhat more efficient to take all the computing storage, memory processes, processors, or at least all the money that go into it… the in one spot. If you’re running a big task or small, everything scales to the appropriate size, regardless of the hardware sitting on your lap or under your desk. At least that’s how I think of it.
lo_fye 2mo ago
I've been using the free version of TailScale to use macOS's built-in screen sharing app to use my home Mac mini from my work MacBook Pro. Works great! That combined with ChatGPT/Codex's "remote" feature is an amazing combination. I think you'd be totally fine with a Mac Studio + Neo.
- samsolomon 2mo ago
  I have been considering this. I bought a Macbook Air in the interm waiting to see what the Macbook Ultra looks like, but honestly—it's the best form factor ever. I love it! Even though it's only like a pound heavier, the Pro feels like a monster. Thinking about getting a Mini or Studio with more horsepower to stay at home. Any other apps or suggestions? I'm still not exactly sure what working this way looks like.
transitorykris 2mo ago
I've been running a desktop Mac in addition to MacBook and iPad for the past decade (currently a first gen Studio still holding quite strong). It's primarily a focus thing, secondarily it's a way to keep work happening locally while I'm elsewhere, and never have the frustrations of docking and screen geometries all re-arranging, etc. The iPad is at the opposite extreme, it's for recreation, burn out management. The MacBook exists for when I actually need to do "real work" outside of the house.
pantulis 2mo ago
YMMV, but when I got my iPad I realized that my "mobile" needs were only contempt consumption and my MBP was used as a desktop computer connected to a 32'' monitor. So every time I renewed my laptop the expensive screen went with it, and I had to pay for another one that I would be using as a second screen! Thus, my current workhorse is a Studio.
- alexgoodhart 2mo ago
  I almost bought a studio a couple years ago, but I was starting a PhD and so I figured I had to prioritize MBP. These prices make that decision so bittersweet. I feel so shut out from being able to use AI as economic productivity without being able to take on debt for a local-inf capable mac studio
  - pantulis 2mo ago
    Last year I was able to justify a 128GB/1TB M4 Max Studio for 4600€. This cycle's M5 Max with 128GB/1TB goes for 6219€. The M5 has to be obviously a better machine, but it's now above the price point I would pull the trigger for. Guess I got lucky in the futureproofing lottery this time, anyway.
- thsv32r2 2mo ago
  > I realized that my "mobile" needs were only contempt consumption Is that the new phrase for social media? I hope it is...
  - pantulis 2mo ago
    My contempt consumption is reading feeds, books and sheet music, and some casual games... ... and a lot more social media I'd like to admit.
tarruda 2mo ago
> not that Apple prices weren’t insane before the ram/ssd shortages Funny that after the price started to increase last year (I think October/November), there was a window of a few months where Apple prices stayed the same as they were before, thus making apple prices actually good when compared to the rest of the market. It was a unique opportunity to have acquired a 512G M3 ultra for $10k.
- suriyaG 2mo ago
  not as crazy a config, but I got a 128GB M5max the day before the price increase for $2K less. still proud of the call to buy it.
  - tarruda 2mo ago
    Also proud of having spent $2.5k on a used 128G M1 Ultra back in September 2024. Despite being outdated in terms of compute, it stills let me run very good recent models locally, with Deepseek V4 Flash 0731 being the greatest one right now, and hopefully Qwen 3.8 Flash will also fit well when it is released tomorrow! The M1 ultra definitely leaves to be desired in terms of its token speeds, but I think 20 tps generation and ~200 tps prompt processing (which is what I get with DSv4 flash), is already enough to do a lot of serious work when you combine with the decent prompt caching provided by llama.cpp.
- tomcam 2mo ago
  You're killing me here lol
stevejb 2mo ago
I have a Mac Studio M2 Max as my main driver. It's fantastic. I will get the best M5 Studio I can afford when the higher RAM options come out because I am very involved with local inference. I find that with Tailscale I can either use screen sharing if I've got a good enough internet connection or just SSH and Mosh if it's a little bit laggy. That has been good enough for me. A Mac Studio and a Neo as a companion is a really good combination. My laptop is an Apple M4 Air but it basically does nothing except for running ScreenShare and a terminal.
lostlogin 2mo ago
> I do wonder if my next computer should be a Mac Studio Would you get away with a Mini?
geophile 2mo ago
Slightly off-topic: I decided to go with a Mac Mini to start playing with AI. My daily driver is a Linux laptop (with a negligible GPU). I also have a few Raspberry Pi machines for backup, and a low-end AWS server. I was always cobbling together ad hoc network access, to get from one machine to another. Access to my Mac Mini while traveling was a pain. Bringing it with me is ridiculous, and network access was a PITA. Tailscale is wonderful magic. Free (for my usage), so easy to set up, and now no matter where my various computers are, they are all accessible trivially via a single ssh connection. So get a beefed up desktop Mac, set up Tailscale, and then use any random laptop, anywhere, to use it headless.
jfb 2mo ago
Yeah, I have an MBP for Reasons, but it sits docked 90% of the time. I'd rather spend the engineering budget on better thermals and more ports; I always have it plugged into a fixed monitor and other peripherals.
nsbk 2mo ago
I’m in the same camp as you. I’ve just decided that the M5 Ultra is gonna be my next machine. Plus an Air for the few times when I need a computer on the go. I’m invested in Tailscale already so an ubiquitous Studio Ultra seems like a sweet idea
- ikomrad 2mo ago
  I don’t even know what a Mac Ultra looks like and I want one. It will be new Mac with more GPU cores for ai, right? It would sit in my basement server room providing local inference.
emp_ 2mo ago
I have exactly this setup and use a Macbook Air with Tailscale to just connect via High Performance Screen Sharing both at home and on the go (when not sitting at my desk, I move around a lot around the house after 3pm or so while I keep my workflow identical) HPSS works well via 5G, and Tailscale is incredible for the setup as much as the hardware. Edit: I ended up getting a 15" M5 Air but honestly trying it on a 13" M4 Air was actually superior because when all you care is mobility (since the Studio does the heavy work) its nice just going around with almost no weight / bulk.
- derrasterpunkt 2mo ago
  I almost forgot that HPSS was a thing, thanks for the reminder. https://support.apple.com/en-my/guide/remote-desktop/apdf8e09f5a9/mac https://support.apple.com/en-my/guide/remote-desktop/apdf8e0...
hebetude 2mo ago
M4 Max Studio + Macbook Air. I've been running this for several years. Mac is a really poor server environment and none of the apple ecosystem makes up for it. So, I still prefer my linux server, but the M4 Max is much more suited for inference tasks so here it is. I wouldn't say it's much better than a MBP except the sustained throughput is much higher and the fan noise is barely noticeable. I'd get a linux equivalent if there was one.
ChrisMarshallNY 2mo ago
I used laptops for years. However, after retiring, I realized I never undocked my MBP. So I got an M4Pro Mini, and I've been thrilled. If I ever get to where I travel a lot, again, I'll get a laptop, but I don't see a need, right now.
SoftTalker 2mo ago
I can't really imagine buying a new computer in this market. But I also wonder how long it will be before prices drop again, if ever.
- groundzeros2015 2mo ago
  Oh you will be imagining some time soon.
JohnTHaller 2mo ago
If it's your remote-in laptop, I'd suggest getting a used MacBook Pro or Air with an M series processor in your preferred 13/15" size and memory/storage configuration. You can get a used MacBook Air M3 with 16GB of RAM for about the same price as a MacBook Neo. It'll have similar single core, GPU, and NPU performance as the Neo and about 38% better multi-core performance. Plus you'll have 16GB of RAM for future-proofing and apps. And you can spend a bit less if you want or a bit more depending on what you need. You could get a used MacBook Air M1 8GB for under $400.
tqi 2mo ago
I wonder if apple could or would offer a subscription for a OSX VM that you could remote into? That plus a neo would be an excellent combo for me
Terretta 2mo ago
Yes, and.. Just Tailscale into the Studio from iPad Pro 13" with magic keyboard and Kit Knox's rootshell: https://github.com/kitknox/rootshell https://github.com/kitknox/rootshell Note that the iPad Pro can also drive a 4K second screen if you like, and most anything else a Macbook with a single port could drive. Why not Macbook Air? Because the iPad Pro is also a tablet, touch screen, and 5G...
- westoque 2mo ago
  this is exactly my setup! the ipad pro 11 m5 cellular is such an amazing device especially with the 5G. only downside is obv the iPadOS, it's still very limiting and shortcuts and power tools (like easily prefilling passwords) are non-existent. for passwords, you still have to manually click the pre-fill and/or enable full keyboard to be able to tab into it but still annoying.
- _rwo 2mo ago
  thanks for this link! I was constantly struggling with remote-ipad setup - tried so many things (including paid options), but everything was _iffy_ at best (on-call4live, lol) And I'm also gonna ride my M1Max Studio until it dies (hopefully it will outlive me xD)
davedx 2mo ago
Yeah, I was about to say "or an iPad Pro", but the Neo is shockingly cheaper than an iPad Air. There's definitely an option for everyone if you want to go down the "fixed supercomputer, remote terminal" route.
chocrates 2mo ago
Why use mac at all? If you want a docked machine you can build a PC with the exact specs you want. Throw a Linux distro on it and you will have a similar experience
- Damogran6 2mo ago
  Because it's NOT the same experience. iCloud access, shared messages, Cut and paste between other Mac devices..I say this with a Ryzen 9 + rtx4090 super right next to the macs. (A studio and an M1 MBP with a new battery). While they're theoretically at parity, in actual use, they're not.
Spooky23 2mo ago
This was my perspective for a long time. The issue is the Macbook Pro screen is awesome, and the display story for desktop computers is pretty grim.

appplication 2mo ago

I had the same thought, I grabbed a studio two years ago for this reason and it’s been great. 99% of the time lack of portability isn’t a concern. Every now and then (e.g. travel) I notice the limitation, but it’s not much of an inconvenience to just not do some work for a bit.

Gareth321 2mo ago
Plus remote work is getting easier and easier. There are so few instances when I'm not able to get online. If we lived in a world where hardware were getting cheaper, it might make sense to splurge. In this environment I think the Neo is perfect.
- dannyw 2mo ago
  Build quality of the Neo is extremely good, I love the keyboard — it’s more tactile and reminds me of early 2010s MacBooks. I’ll be selling my M4 MBA soon, I genuinely use the Neo more. Huge difference in typing experience. Great repairability is a plus. It was super easy, and actually fun to open. Felt like unboxing an Apple product. Applied the thermal paste mod for $10 which works excellently; I’ve had it shortly after launch. And I love the notchless display, even if I wished the color gamut was a bit better.
  - havaloc 2mo ago
    The Neo keyboard just feels nicer than even an M5 Air.

tamimio 2mo ago

That’s what I have been doing for years, it remains in the house secured while I ssh into it from an old thinkpad. You can get air to pair it with it if you really wanna have that seamless flow, otherwise, ssh works well.

super_mario 2mo ago

I was in the same situation, I used maxed out 15'' M3 Max MacBook Pro docked to Studio Display closed on vertical stand behind the screen. It was fine for office work, but running local LLMs would definitely overheat it. The battery started degrading purely due to heat issues. And it was audible as well. I decided to get Mac Studio M4 Max, also all maxed out config and the cooling is so much better that I can run local LLMs like Gemma 3/4, gpt-oss 120b all day long without any heat issues or any audible fan noise. So for my use case it was the right decision. I subsequently added 15'' M5 Max MacBook Pro all maxed out to my collection and even though it is slightly faster on LLM inference (I get 100 tokens/s with Gemma 4 27b model), you just can't run LLMs longer than a few minutes. It starts overheating and gets really loud.

seanmcdirmid 2mo ago
Weird, I’ve run LLM batch sessions for hours on my Max M3 MBP. It doesn’t get very loud, though I’m not getting anything close to 100 tok/s on a 27b model, I use a 35b MoE model just to get 90 tok/s. The fan comes on but thermally it never overheats. I do have it in a vertical closed position, though.

jermaustin1 2mo ago

I've been holding out, because I think my next purchase will be a Studio with an Ultra Chip in it. I'm wanting it to be a "forever" server, so I'm holding out while I can.

simonh 2mo ago
Buy in 2 years, or buy now and have it last 2 years less than forever.
jubilanti 2mo ago
Then you'll always be waiting, there's always something new the industry tries to tempt you with.
- jermaustin1 2mo ago
  I just wait for a cycle or two where the leaps and bounds are more like hops and steps. So if the M7 Ultra improves inference by 2x over the M5, but the M9 Ultra only improves by 1.2x over the M7, that's my signal to buy. Unfortunately they haven't slowed down yet.
Gareth321 2mo ago
Supply rumours are next year we see an M7 AI-focused chip with large inference performance upgrades. It's unlikely we'll see heavy upgrades in other areas. If you care about AI, it's worth waiting. If you don't, pull the trigger now. RAM constraints are likely to get worse next year. Or wait 2-3 years and prices should be back to Earth (plus newer and even better chips). I'm waiting this out.
- ahknight 2mo ago
  Yeah, but how many years until 128GB+ is attainable by mere mortals again? My 2021 home server build was 64GB of RAM. My 2025 build was 32GB and zram. :/
  - xhkkffbf 2mo ago

ape4 2mo ago

How about business where you send in all your old devices and get back a SSD using using their memories

try-working 2mo ago

Laptops can't do agentic engineering. They get hot as hell and battery drains instantly. I think this will promote a switch to desktops for the next couple of years, until we have new mobile chips.

steve1977 2mo ago
But laptops can remote into boxes that can run agents. So a combination of a powerful desktop and a "cheap" laptop might indeed be attractive.
jonathanberger 2mo ago
Are you referring specifically to agentic engineering with locally hosted models?

hectdev 2mo ago

I dusted of my lightest computer with an M1 chip and use Tailscale to make my network virtual from anywhere. Been running a. Pi5 as a main house hub and an M1 Pro as an always on Mac. It would be nice to go all out and make a Studio a hub I can just screen share into for major compute.

hirvi74 2mo ago

Do it! I went with the Mini/Neo combo. I don't need MBP power when out and about. When at home, the Mini is all I use.

jgwil2 2mo ago

If all you want to do is remote into your desktop, Neo seems like overkill. Why not just get a $200 Chromebook and save yourself $500?

rjrjrjrj 2mo ago
Because the screen, keyboard, and especially trackpad on a $200 Chromebook sucks?
- bredren 2mo ago
  Also: the enclosure, and the hinges.
- frollogaston 2mo ago
  Also it'll be truly too slow. You need to at least be able to access a shared document while a video call is going. The funniest recurring thing when working at Google was new hires getting baited into taking a Chromebook, then not being able to switch to a Mac for like 2 years. Our team made sure new people didn't fall for that.
ahknight 2mo ago
Because who hates themselves that much? It's the thing I touch and interact with. That's exactly the part that needs to be sturdy, smooth, and pretty. It's the facade to the beast at the other end.
PennRobotics 2mo ago
This comment got me curious, so I searched for cheap laptops with mobile internet. There's at least one LTE Chromebook now for about 300 euros. This might be my next laptop if it can run Tailscale and remote desktop.
olyjohn 2mo ago
Also remoting into a Mac sucks on anything that isn't a Mac. It runs like shit when using any VNC client that isn't Apple's.

PaulRobinson 2mo ago

I've been thinking about this a fair bit recently. We make a lot of price/performance compromises for having an attached screen and keyboard on our computer. That was what got me started. Then I remembered the days of having to go to a special corner of the house to use a computer, vs now when I have a computer with me all the time. In my bag, on the sofa, on the train. Hell, I'm writing this on the work MBP while waiting for an appointment. And you know what, I think I got more done when I went and sat in a corner of the house all those years ago. I set up an area for "computer work", and it worked really well. I have a home office, but it's a jumble of cables going into docking stations and all sorts of weird stuff. I think if I streamline it and turn it into a proper "computer room", I might get some of that mojo back. I might even convince my partner that surrendering the home office and having a corner of the den might be good - she can watch TV while I tinker. And I won't be balancing a laptop on my knee and trying to do two things at once. And the price/performance thing comes back in. Hmm.

AshleyGrant 2mo ago
There is a definite mental aspect for most WFH folks to having a space that is dedicated to work. I'm not unique in saying this, but the way I put it is "If you work from anywhere in your house, then you're always at work." And that, from mental load standpoint, is not healthy for most folks.
- jrrv 2mo ago
  Or, if you're like me then "if you work from anywhere in your house, then you're never at work."
  - mjcohen 2mo ago
    [flagged]
    - clickety_clack 2mo ago
      I read it as though he’s “working”, like quiet quitting or something.

armadyl 2mo ago

That’s nearly what I do but on a smaller scale. My iPad Pro serves as my laptop 90% of the time, and the 10% of the time I need to actually code and test in a chromium browser I remote into a mini.

ThouYS 2mo ago

Having replaced my MacBook with a Mac Mini, I would reconsider. The MacBook is just such a _complete_ package. Great speakers, great keyboard, fantastic screen, the fingerprint sensor thingy.. Takes a lot of gear to match that

cj 2mo ago
If your computer never leaves your desk, the iMac is pretty competitive with those features. Even comes with a TouchID keyboard.
- mikestew 2mo ago
  I’ve had iMacs for almost 20 years. My last one was indeed my last. Without target display mode (use the Mac as a monitor), I’m ditching a perfectly good monitor. I was going to buy a Mac Studio and a good monitor to replace the iMac until the spouse reminded me that we are now retired and will spend time in a camper. So a MBP for me (and BenQ’s Mac-specific monitor), but others might do well to consider a Mac Mini/Studio. iMacs are great for a lot of use cases, but my image of the typical HN user would prefer to keep the monitor separate.
  - deleted 2mo ago
    [deleted]
  - frollogaston 2mo ago
    It's like, you pay laptop prices for laptop performance but without laptop portability or desktop modularity. This only sorta made sense back when Apple had no "prosumer" desktop offering unless you wanted a cheap used Mac Pro (which is what I ended up doing at some point).
pebble 2mo ago
Not an option if you're trying to drive 3 decent screens.
- joshstrange 2mo ago

code-blooded 2mo ago

swozey 2mo ago
I'd never go x86 again after owning an m1. I'd have replaced an x86 laptop 2 or 3 times by now (2020 m1). My last $3500 dell xps 13z before buying the m1 was absolutely horrible.
SubiculumCode 2mo ago
I can't wait for an actual competitor to the M chips from apple. It's frustrating.
ogrisel 2mo ago
What CPU / GPU combination would you recommend? Can use unified host+device memory?

epolanski 2mo ago

For a desktop you may find yourself better on a Linux or Windows machine price/performance wise. I personally own an M3 ultra, an M1 max as laptops, but my desktop is a Ryzen desktop I built in 2022 and it was a third in price of the ultra for more power.

bearjaws 2mo ago

Recently took a Minisforum 7840hs PC out of rotation as a media PC and made it a full time coding workstation with Proxmox. I do a VM per project due to the nature of agentic editors. I was using a VM setup on my MBP but it felt like a huge waste, having to leave a laptop on 24/7 when all it did was run Claude Code inside VMs. I likely will stick with a Macbook Air 15" for next purchase, and beef up my "Claude Server" down the road.

sanderjd 2mo ago

Yep, this is my exact thought. The pendulum has swung back toward a desktop making more sense for me than a laptop. It all depends on whether there is anything useful to do with an amount of computation that can't be fit into a laptop package. For a long time there wasn't, now there is.

herpdyderp 2mo ago

This is my setup (except I have an Air because the Neo didn't exist yet). And it's great. Tailscale makes it trivial.

b15h0p 2mo ago
So, do you use VNC (or ssh) to access the Mac Studio at home? Or do you only access other stuff that's living in your home network?
- javier123454321 2mo ago
  not OP but tailscale ssh does the trick for me.
- herpdyderp 2mo ago
  ssh in terminal and/or through VS Code. When needed, I also use Apple's Screen Sharing app.

jasode 2mo ago

>I do wonder if my next computer should be a Mac Studio instead of a MBP that lives its life docked. Having owned 3 MacBook Pros since 2008, the decision to make my next computer be a Mac Studio came down to (1) MacBook thermal throttling that slows down CPUs when it starts to overheat and (2) easier upgrade of Mac Studio SSD with after-market storage module whereas the MacBook requires more complicated disassembly and hot air gun to dislodge the surface mounted SSDs. I have a brand new M5 Pro MacBook Pro I don't like it when the fans turn on. The Mac Studio will be faster and quieter for the same workloads.

4fterd4rk 2mo ago
You don't want a computer that does thermal throttling but also do not like it when the fans turn on?
- jasode 2mo ago
  >but also do not like it when the fans turn on? Sorry for not being clearer. I don't like the MacBook's noise when the fans turn on. The Mac Studio has bigger heat sinks to delay the need for thermal management -- and if its fan does need to turn on, the bigger size means it's still silent instead of the high-pitched whooshing noise the tiny fans make in the MacBook.
  - jmalicki 2mo ago
    You can get large under-laptop cooling pads with giant fans that can help this somewhat. It's not part of the laptop, but help if it's docked at home. It's not totally ideal since the bottom of your laptop doesn't have radiator fins, but does help.
shaunkoh 2mo ago
I used to game on my 2014 MBP. That was a bad idea - took about 5 years, but eventually my batteries became spicy pillows. Turns out that even with the fans at full blast, the batteries didn’t like being so hot over prolonged periods. I’m happy with my M4 mini now, with a separate windows pc for gaming.

bdhdhduuyd 2mo ago

I have been thinking a lot about buying a very fast desktop and a cheap laptop that uses remote desktop to connect to the fast computer. But in the end I ended op buying a Lenovo Legion and put Linux on it. Laptops are so fast these days that I didn't want to be bothered with setting up connectivity to a remote desktop. But if your laptop never leaves your desk I think a desktop computer is a great option. Relatively cheaper and easier to maintain and upgrade.

saidinesh5 2mo ago

At my current job, one of my biggest blunders was thinking "Let me just order the same hardware as most of my teammates to avoid unnecessary complications". Most, if not all, of our current work happens on remote cloud vms. Now I'm stuck with carrying a 3KG monstrosity to work.Every day. Absolutely no positives compared to my ThinkPad that weighed less than half in my previous job. Remote development is "good enough" these days. With VS Code, Development containers etc... Having a light weight, portable laptop is so much nicer than a laptop that you can't even rest on your lap for long duration. The only thing you need to be mindful of using light weight laptops is not having enough RAM to fit all your browser tabs..

digitaltrees 2mo ago
I totally agree I use containers through propelcode.app which means I can code on any device including my phone and the environment is the same as the server target. It’s even more important with agents that can delete files and change OS settings. I never need to worry that a coding session ends up breaking my main OS environment by deleting or changing a file.
wombat-man 2mo ago
Yeah I stepped down to a smaller MBP. the only reason I didn't go for an air is my home setup with dual monitors involves using the HDMI port. There probably is a dock or something out there though.

znpy 2mo ago

I’m doing essentially this, and got a MacBook Neo. Fir kinda the first time in my life I don’t really have development tools on my personal laptop. I ghostty and openvpn client installed. I have a large remote linux workstation (2x 8c/16t xeon cpus, 256gb ram, 2x8tb spinning rust disk) and i have my tools over there (along with some VMs). It works surprisingly well. Also, the macbook neo is a surprisingly capable little machine.

deleted 2mo ago

[deleted]

pjmlp 2mo ago

Apple prices have always been insane, there is a reason why during the days it almost went bankrupt, in Europe it could not rival with PC, Amiga, Atari, Acorn.

matt-p 2mo ago

Another option is a 'maxed out' mini e.g M5 Pro/64GB. Mini is super easy to travel with if you know there'll be a 'dock' at the far end e.g office<>home or whatever.

msdz 2mo ago
So I can somewhat speak to this, as I actually did this for a while c. 2021 and 2022. The issue (apart from my Mac mini still having the old, bigger form factor back then) is that this requires a full shutdown (obviously), and that is more friction than opening a closed laptop lid. It just takes a moment for every app and background service etc. to settle back in after, and depending on how your brain works, you might not like that a whole lot. It absolutely is a cool feeling to carry a pretty mighty desktop in the backpack, though.
- matt-p 2mo ago
  I think it's actually good to have a forced reboot from time to time, but then I'm not very disciplined in closing stuff I'm no-longer using! Especially like docker containers I was using months ago, that I forgot to shutdown.
  - msdz 2mo ago
    Yeah, I agree (with the same unfortunate habit) – but up to twice a day of forced work full stop is overdoing it, too.
    - reddit_clone 2mo ago
      Is there no hibernation option ?
      - tom_ 2mo ago
        You don't get the option in the UI: there's just "Sleep", which on a desktop Mac seems to suspend to RAM only. At least, it seems to on mine, as I found out when I unplugged it. (Apparently the laptops do a suspend to disk depending on battery remaining, so the OS does support it. It'd be nice to have it available! The disk space required could become annoying if you only bought the 1 TB SSD for your fancy 512 GB Mac though.)

master_crab 2mo ago

I had the same view recently. For the past year I’ve been using my iPad to remote into both my MacBook Pro M1 Max and my racked Linux workstation at home using Jump and moonlight/sunshine, respectively. Never looked back

frollogaston 2mo ago

My goto. Even ignoring speed, it's nice to have a remote machine that keeps doing whatever it's doing while your laptop is closed. And the ARM Macs idle at such low power that it's not wasteful like my MacPro4,1 was haha. My UPS's ammeter doesn't even display the Mac mini's draw. They gave me a nice MBP for my new job. I tried doing heavy work on it locally, it was fine for that, and yet it still ended up being a light terminal into an EC2 instance, partially because their stuff is on AWS and latency is way lower within that. My personal mini is running too.

spockz 2mo ago

Yes, except that the only way to get a fancy screen is also to put the fancy cpu in it. If there would be an Air with the screen of the pro I would buy it. Maybe even a Neo with that screen.

kylehotchkiss 2mo ago

Oh yeah. Throw it behind tailscale. Herdr multiplexer in terminal is cool, it’ll remember your session if you open it in ssh from the neo

rafaelmn 2mo ago

I would not use Neo, Air with 24 GB ram should be your minimum because you will want to do some work locally even when you're running a VPN/SSH thin client setup. I'm currently SSH-ing into my workstation from my M4 Air with 24 gb ram and it's ideal for this flow. Slack/editors/clients/browsers/etc. easily gobble up over 16 GB. I have no more dev tools/compilers/source on my client machines, everything is dockered up on remote workstation in isolated VMs (too much supply-chaining). My only downside to using a pro is not having 120/4k HDMI port on air and my dock won't support it with Apple (it does with windows)

bilsbie 2mo ago
Can that run qwen? Also can you explain what you meant by the downside ?
- rafaelmn 2mo ago
  If I was going to run LLMs locally I would definitely go for a pro. I meant the only downside of not using a pro for my use-case is that I don't have a HDMI port on device with high refresh rate. I have a decent dock that can give me 4k/60hz HDMI but not 120hz refresh for macs (it works on windows). It's a minor thing but having 120hz is nice when I'm docked at home.
jwrallie 2mo ago
It heavily depends on your workflow and how many (electron) programs you need to run simultaneously. I found that if I’m mindful of closing things I’m not actually using, and let macOS do its swap magic, the Neo will just work. I’m also the kind of person who close tabs and I like to work on one task at a time.
davedx 2mo ago
I'm sorry but that's a bit ridiculous. I'm still using an M1 Pro with 16GB of RAM and I have quite heavy usage - docker, other heavy native apps, a bunch of VS.Codes and coding agents, things running in the terminal, background processes. It's just a big exaggeration that general regular productivity apps "easily gobble up over 16GB" (Edit: saying this as someone who just paid for a new 128GB M5 Pro Studio -- but that's for LLM's, not regular work)

nullfern 2mo ago

Cheap Linux laptop with Tailscale back into the Studio when traveling?

frollogaston 2mo ago
No iTerm2, weird shortcuts, random issues in video calls?, also not really cheap to get a laptop that reliably works with Linux and has decent battery life

zer00eyz 2mo ago

Im writing this from a MacBook Air. Everything is a container or VM now, and none of it runs locally for me. I have a desktop (older intel) with giant monitors and a keyboard for when I sit at the desk. I have the laptop for when I travel, go out or just want to work from the couch. When I do my next upgrade to "better hardware" I'm not migrating a machine, rather I'm migrating the containers. My workflow is such that if I loose one of the boxes I sit at to a cup of coffee I really wont care other than the financial loss of a new laptop or keyboard. The biggest win in all this was dumping the off the shelf firewall/router and moving to Opnsense. Wireguard vpn lets me route all my traffic through home for all my devices (and what is now a growing home lab). There are scopes of work that this setup would not work for. I would not want to be a video editor with this set up, it's not ideal if you want to play AAA games. But for what I do, it is pretty ideal.

vidarh 2mo ago

I used to have a high-powered laptop, but just use a combination of ssh and NFS to my machine at home from a low powered laptop for travel these days. It works well. Makes managing both backups and handling failure scenarios involving loss or unauthorised access to the laptop less of a hassle as well.

jmalicki 2mo ago

Why not a non-mac cheaper desktop/workstation and a Mac laptop for use? E.g. what most major tech companies have - a laptop that is for VSCode via ssh/web browsing, and a beefy Linux dev box you ssh into for everything else? It's way cheaper, and what I use at home too - a lot cheaper than a Mac studio for everything, especially with RAM and storage.

dannyw 2mo ago
A lot more upgradable too. Those empty DRAM slots can get populated one day!
sylens 2mo ago
The unified memory is the big appeal of a beefy Mac Studio
mswphd 2mo ago
if you do want to do local LLM stuff, mac studio is significantly better than most linux dev boxes.
- hedora 2mo ago
  As of a year ago, the strix halo AMD (system on chip, unified ram) was within single digit percentages of the mac, but it’s a linux box, so much better for most dev and as an llm server. I know AMD has announced the replacement, and it will be faster, but I’m not sure when it’ll ship. Also, you can cluster strix halo if you need more than 128GB of ram.
- dannyw 2mo ago
  Better than a DGX Spark running Linux? Absolutely not (I own both). Real-world matmul is about 4x higher on a DGX Spark than a M3 Ultra.
jfb 2mo ago
For specifically unified memory reasons, Apple machines are much, much better at running local LLMs.

Aurornis 2mo ago

I’ve debated Mac Studio or MBP at each generation. For equal spec machines the price premium to get a MBP over the Studio is always smaller than I expected, so I pay the extra amount and get the MBP. This changes when you get into connotations that aren’t available in the laptop form factor, but with RAM prices the way they are those configurations are more than I want to spend on a local machine right now. For running local LLMs the high memory Mac options always look appealing, but the processing speed (prefill) is so much slower than GPUs that it hurts. For situations where you have no rush and can let something work in the background for 24 hours it can some times be ignored, but the speeds I get from a real GPU setup are so much faster that I never use the larger models on a high memory Mac any more.

pixelready 2mo ago

I got an M1 Max studio w/ 64gb when they first came out and I love it. Price was obviously a lot more reasonable at the time. I’m fortunate to have dedicated office space, and there is definitely a nice psychological effect to having a desktop in a specific spot and “going to the office”. I’ve since purchased an m3 MacBook Air as my thin client and for lightweight travel use, and when my wife needs to take a call in the office or whatever I pop out to the living room and either hop on Remote Desktop or SSH into my Studio. Highly recommend this setup. If you’re primarily doing thin client on a local network, a neo should be fine for that (and to use as a media player/communicator around the house). That said, I have been eyeballing Omarchy…

contingencies 2mo ago

Happy with M4 Mini, although I recommend using a well ventilated M.2 enclosure instead of the integrated docks as I just had a 2TB Kingston die which I'm pretty sure was caused by "zero thermal forks given (chopsticks only)" UGreen hub design. Also can use as a laptop and replace screen/keyboard/whatever when failed/unsuitable. Higher resulting device longevity, especially with Asahi Linux making such great progress. https://github.com/vk2diy/hackbook-m4-mini https://github.com/vk2diy/hackbook-m4-mini

shaunkoh 2mo ago
I got an OWC Express 1M2 precisely because of thermal fears. The heatsink is huge, but no fans. Only real issue is needing to be careful to not nudge the cables. I also suspect that trying to stream larger LLM models from disk hammered the USB 4 connection too much - lead to system hangs, so now stream from the internal SSD instead.
- contingencies 2mo ago
  Cool product, thanks. Sent back for Kingston RMA, expecting a new drive soon.

duxup 2mo ago

I’ve wanted the idea of a home server or even home “mainframe” and some terminals for me and family forever but the idea never takes off….

JohnBooty 2mo ago
Same. For me, it’s one of those “solutions in search of a problem.”
- duxup 2mo ago
  It just seems somewhat more efficient to take all the computing storage, memory processes, processors, or at least all the money that go into it… the in one spot. If you’re running a big task or small, everything scales to the appropriate size, regardless of the hardware sitting on your lap or under your desk. At least that’s how I think of it.

lo_fye 2mo ago

I've been using the free version of TailScale to use macOS's built-in screen sharing app to use my home Mac mini from my work MacBook Pro. Works great! That combined with ChatGPT/Codex's "remote" feature is an amazing combination. I think you'd be totally fine with a Mac Studio + Neo.

samsolomon 2mo ago
I have been considering this. I bought a Macbook Air in the interm waiting to see what the Macbook Ultra looks like, but honestly—it's the best form factor ever. I love it! Even though it's only like a pound heavier, the Pro feels like a monster. Thinking about getting a Mini or Studio with more horsepower to stay at home. Any other apps or suggestions? I'm still not exactly sure what working this way looks like.

transitorykris 2mo ago

I've been running a desktop Mac in addition to MacBook and iPad for the past decade (currently a first gen Studio still holding quite strong). It's primarily a focus thing, secondarily it's a way to keep work happening locally while I'm elsewhere, and never have the frustrations of docking and screen geometries all re-arranging, etc. The iPad is at the opposite extreme, it's for recreation, burn out management. The MacBook exists for when I actually need to do "real work" outside of the house.

pantulis 2mo ago

YMMV, but when I got my iPad I realized that my "mobile" needs were only contempt consumption and my MBP was used as a desktop computer connected to a 32'' monitor. So every time I renewed my laptop the expensive screen went with it, and I had to pay for another one that I would be using as a second screen! Thus, my current workhorse is a Studio.

alexgoodhart 2mo ago
I almost bought a studio a couple years ago, but I was starting a PhD and so I figured I had to prioritize MBP. These prices make that decision so bittersweet. I feel so shut out from being able to use AI as economic productivity without being able to take on debt for a local-inf capable mac studio
- pantulis 2mo ago
  Last year I was able to justify a 128GB/1TB M4 Max Studio for 4600€. This cycle's M5 Max with 128GB/1TB goes for 6219€. The M5 has to be obviously a better machine, but it's now above the price point I would pull the trigger for. Guess I got lucky in the futureproofing lottery this time, anyway.
thsv32r2 2mo ago
> I realized that my "mobile" needs were only contempt consumption Is that the new phrase for social media? I hope it is...
- pantulis 2mo ago
  My contempt consumption is reading feeds, books and sheet music, and some casual games... ... and a lot more social media I'd like to admit.

tarruda 2mo ago

> not that Apple prices weren’t insane before the ram/ssd shortages Funny that after the price started to increase last year (I think October/November), there was a window of a few months where Apple prices stayed the same as they were before, thus making apple prices actually good when compared to the rest of the market. It was a unique opportunity to have acquired a 512G M3 ultra for $10k.

suriyaG 2mo ago
not as crazy a config, but I got a 128GB M5max the day before the price increase for $2K less. still proud of the call to buy it.
- tarruda 2mo ago
  Also proud of having spent $2.5k on a used 128G M1 Ultra back in September 2024. Despite being outdated in terms of compute, it stills let me run very good recent models locally, with Deepseek V4 Flash 0731 being the greatest one right now, and hopefully Qwen 3.8 Flash will also fit well when it is released tomorrow! The M1 ultra definitely leaves to be desired in terms of its token speeds, but I think 20 tps generation and ~200 tps prompt processing (which is what I get with DSv4 flash), is already enough to do a lot of serious work when you combine with the decent prompt caching provided by llama.cpp.
tomcam 2mo ago
You're killing me here lol

stevejb 2mo ago

I have a Mac Studio M2 Max as my main driver. It's fantastic. I will get the best M5 Studio I can afford when the higher RAM options come out because I am very involved with local inference. I find that with Tailscale I can either use screen sharing if I've got a good enough internet connection or just SSH and Mosh if it's a little bit laggy. That has been good enough for me. A Mac Studio and a Neo as a companion is a really good combination. My laptop is an Apple M4 Air but it basically does nothing except for running ScreenShare and a terminal.

lostlogin 2mo ago

> I do wonder if my next computer should be a Mac Studio Would you get away with a Mini?

geophile 2mo ago

Slightly off-topic: I decided to go with a Mac Mini to start playing with AI. My daily driver is a Linux laptop (with a negligible GPU). I also have a few Raspberry Pi machines for backup, and a low-end AWS server. I was always cobbling together ad hoc network access, to get from one machine to another. Access to my Mac Mini while traveling was a pain. Bringing it with me is ridiculous, and network access was a PITA. Tailscale is wonderful magic. Free (for my usage), so easy to set up, and now no matter where my various computers are, they are all accessible trivially via a single ssh connection. So get a beefed up desktop Mac, set up Tailscale, and then use any random laptop, anywhere, to use it headless.

jfb 2mo ago

Yeah, I have an MBP for Reasons, but it sits docked 90% of the time. I'd rather spend the engineering budget on better thermals and more ports; I always have it plugged into a fixed monitor and other peripherals.

nsbk 2mo ago

I’m in the same camp as you. I’ve just decided that the M5 Ultra is gonna be my next machine. Plus an Air for the few times when I need a computer on the go. I’m invested in Tailscale already so an ubiquitous Studio Ultra seems like a sweet idea

ikomrad 2mo ago
I don’t even know what a Mac Ultra looks like and I want one. It will be new Mac with more GPU cores for ai, right? It would sit in my basement server room providing local inference.

emp_ 2mo ago

I have exactly this setup and use a Macbook Air with Tailscale to just connect via High Performance Screen Sharing both at home and on the go (when not sitting at my desk, I move around a lot around the house after 3pm or so while I keep my workflow identical) HPSS works well via 5G, and Tailscale is incredible for the setup as much as the hardware. Edit: I ended up getting a 15" M5 Air but honestly trying it on a 13" M4 Air was actually superior because when all you care is mobility (since the Studio does the heavy work) its nice just going around with almost no weight / bulk.

derrasterpunkt 2mo ago
I almost forgot that HPSS was a thing, thanks for the reminder. https://support.apple.com/en-my/guide/remote-desktop/apdf8e09f5a9/mac https://support.apple.com/en-my/guide/remote-desktop/apdf8e0...

hebetude 2mo ago

M4 Max Studio + Macbook Air. I've been running this for several years. Mac is a really poor server environment and none of the apple ecosystem makes up for it. So, I still prefer my linux server, but the M4 Max is much more suited for inference tasks so here it is. I wouldn't say it's much better than a MBP except the sustained throughput is much higher and the fan noise is barely noticeable. I'd get a linux equivalent if there was one.

ChrisMarshallNY 2mo ago

I used laptops for years. However, after retiring, I realized I never undocked my MBP. So I got an M4Pro Mini, and I've been thrilled. If I ever get to where I travel a lot, again, I'll get a laptop, but I don't see a need, right now.

SoftTalker 2mo ago

I can't really imagine buying a new computer in this market. But I also wonder how long it will be before prices drop again, if ever.

groundzeros2015 2mo ago
Oh you will be imagining some time soon.

JohnTHaller 2mo ago

If it's your remote-in laptop, I'd suggest getting a used MacBook Pro or Air with an M series processor in your preferred 13/15" size and memory/storage configuration. You can get a used MacBook Air M3 with 16GB of RAM for about the same price as a MacBook Neo. It'll have similar single core, GPU, and NPU performance as the Neo and about 38% better multi-core performance. Plus you'll have 16GB of RAM for future-proofing and apps. And you can spend a bit less if you want or a bit more depending on what you need. You could get a used MacBook Air M1 8GB for under $400.

tqi 2mo ago

I wonder if apple could or would offer a subscription for a OSX VM that you could remote into? That plus a neo would be an excellent combo for me

Terretta 2mo ago

Yes, and.. Just Tailscale into the Studio from iPad Pro 13" with magic keyboard and Kit Knox's rootshell: https://github.com/kitknox/rootshell https://github.com/kitknox/rootshell Note that the iPad Pro can also drive a 4K second screen if you like, and most anything else a Macbook with a single port could drive. Why not Macbook Air? Because the iPad Pro is also a tablet, touch screen, and 5G...

westoque 2mo ago
this is exactly my setup! the ipad pro 11 m5 cellular is such an amazing device especially with the 5G. only downside is obv the iPadOS, it's still very limiting and shortcuts and power tools (like easily prefilling passwords) are non-existent. for passwords, you still have to manually click the pre-fill and/or enable full keyboard to be able to tab into it but still annoying.
_rwo 2mo ago
thanks for this link! I was constantly struggling with remote-ipad setup - tried so many things (including paid options), but everything was _iffy_ at best (on-call4live, lol) And I'm also gonna ride my M1Max Studio until it dies (hopefully it will outlive me xD)

davedx 2mo ago

Yeah, I was about to say "or an iPad Pro", but the Neo is shockingly cheaper than an iPad Air. There's definitely an option for everyone if you want to go down the "fixed supercomputer, remote terminal" route.

chocrates 2mo ago

Why use mac at all? If you want a docked machine you can build a PC with the exact specs you want. Throw a Linux distro on it and you will have a similar experience

Damogran6 2mo ago
Because it's NOT the same experience. iCloud access, shared messages, Cut and paste between other Mac devices..I say this with a Ryzen 9 + rtx4090 super right next to the macs. (A studio and an M1 MBP with a new battery). While they're theoretically at parity, in actual use, they're not.

Spooky23 2mo ago

This was my perspective for a long time. The issue is the Macbook Pro screen is awesome, and the display story for desktop computers is pretty grim.