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It's crazy that I'd literally trust a Chinese AI company with my data over anything Musk is involved with. Like, even if you don't care about (or even like) hi

It's crazy that I'd literally trust a Chinese AI company with my data over anything Musk is involved with. Like, even if you don't care about (or even like) his politics and can look past how unlikable he comes off as, the damage he's done to his own reputation in this domain just makes using his products like this a no-go. He's literally so rich that he can get caught personally looking through chat sessions and it wouldn't slow him down a bit. He's too rich to be held accountable, and that makes it impossible to trust his businesses. It's a funny dynamic that I don't think is appreciated enough, but I know that if Google or Amazon or OpenAI or Anthropic (etc.) got caught doing something like that, the backlash would be astounding and the reputation hit they'd take would be brutal. Here, Musk would just awkwardly come out attacking people for not letting him behave unethically even more than he already is, and that'd be it. Beyond that, the obvious astroturfing that occurs on this site (along with reddit, etc.) when it comes to Grok isn't helping. All I hear about Claude, GPT, Gemini, etc., are how terrible they are, yet any discussion of Grok seems to always revolve around sensible, but confident, assertions that it's actually a great product and every new release is the point where Grok finally catches up.

itsdesmond 2mo ago
[flagged]
- throwaway-blaze 2mo ago
  Not unless you're here illegally. And it has nothing to do with skin color. Just the basic fact that a country not in control of its borders ceases to be a country.
  - ChoosesBarbecue 2mo ago
    >> [Twitter user] Go anywhere in the UK and look around, you'll just see foreigners everywhere. >> It's truly sickening the damage that has been done to our nation and our people. >> We have to stop immigration and start remigration before we can even begin to reverse the damage that has been done. > [Elon] Remigration is the only way [0] [0]: https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1962406618886492245 https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1962406618886492245
  - itsdesmond 2mo ago
    > Remigration is a far-right concept referring to the ethnic cleansing[1] via mass deportation of non-white minority populations, especially immigrants and sometimes including native-born citizens, to their place of racial ancestry.[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remigration https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remigration It’s right there at the top. One google search is all it takes. You didn’t even, for a second, think to familiarize yourself with the remigration concept. You jumped immediately to me being wrong, even though I was discussing something you were ignorant of. That’s embarrassing.
    - whatthesmack 2mo ago
      I reject your (and Wikipedia’s) theory of “remigration” arbitrarily defining something that is (not actually) happening in the US. People are being deported from the US based on their lack of legal presence in the country, which is what every country also does. Nobody is being deported because of their skin color. Also, nobody is jumping to the conclusion that you’re wrong about something that is not actually happening. It’s just a simple fact that what you’ve stated is preposterous to begin with and is not the policy of any recent law or administration in the US.
      - itsdesmond 2mo ago
        No one is saying it is currently happening, you goof. Remigration is an idea proposed by identitarian assholes like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Sellner https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Sellner, author of a book called Remigration, who Musk has promoted in tweets. It is not currently happening, but the richest man in the world is among those actively working to make it happen. Again, you types confidently misunderstand a discussion.
  - bakies 2mo ago
    Trump is doing everything in his power to make people illegal. Outright revoking visas and making immigrants unemployment so their visa sponsorship is expired. This is nationalism and doesn't have anything to do with border control but with brutalizing minorities. We had all the border control, the border encounters being exactly 0 since Trump took office? Pretty obviously bullshit, it's the same as before with extra brutality. Despicable and disgusting people think like you and support this policy.
oulipo 2mo ago
[flagged]
- aturek 2mo ago
  [flagged]
- neonstatic 2mo ago
  And rightfully so. Unfortunately, they are perfectly fine with a marxist-leninist AI, and that's troubling.
  - tavavex 2mo ago
    Can you name a "Marxist-Leninist AI" that's made by a real AI lab (i.e. no finetunes of open models made by someone on the internet)? I'm just trying to understand what the other side's equivalent of MechaHitler is here.
    - slater 2mo ago
      It's just their latest "everything i dislike is woke" thing, with a new (old) twist.
      - ben_w 2mo ago
        In fairness, Marxism–Leninism is the official ideology of the actual Chinese Communist Party. I leave it as an exercise for the reader if they're just saying that.
      - greenregiment 2mo ago
        Slater you are a miserable loser with 0 life accomplishments
    - throwawaypath 2mo ago
      Can you name a "Nazi AI" that's made by a real AI lab (i.e. no finetunes of open models made by someone on the internet)? I'm just trying to understand what the other side's equivalent of MechaStalin is here.
re-thc 2mo ago
> It's crazy that I'd literally trust a Chinese AI company with my data It's crazy how much Chinese = bad the media or US companies have washed into you. Why lump it together? Like any place and any company there are good and bad 1s. It's not the Wild West over there...
- crimsoneer 2mo ago
  I mean, the Chinese government doesn't really believe in checks and balances, or corporations as autonomous to the state. That's not a conspiracy, that's just how the CCP sees it (ask Jack Ma). You could argue the US has the Cloud Act, and obviously their respect for rules based law and order as a concept has heavily deteriorated, for but it's a very different kettle of fish to a regime who just doesn't even believe in the concept.
  - toasty228 2mo ago
    Meanwhile Trump is building a surveillance state with all his tech executives friends who all massively benefit from government sponsored schemes, it's TOTALLY different!
    - crimsoneer 2mo ago
      At the risk of stating the obvious, Trump has had his tariff policy killed off in the courts (although it'll obviously come back in some form) and in a few months is going to have (probably not great) midterm elections. And there are pretty open efforts to commit genocide in Xinjiang to preserve a nationalist myth of ethnic purity. So, you know, yes.
  - KerrAvon 2mo ago
    So have you looked at what's happened in the US over the past 10 years? The US has much further to fall, but it's falling very, very quickly and if there's ever another Democratic president they're going to have to rebuild a lot of the government from scratch.
    - 2mo ago
agustechbro 2mo ago
[flagged]
- nater5000 2mo ago
  This is a matter of politics; it's a matter of reputation. I'm fine with using AI tools offered by companies like OpenAI, Anthropic, and Google despite knowing that these companies are ran by billionaires who are much more aligned, politically, to Musk than they are with me. What I'm not fine with is handing over valuable data to a guy that has literally completely captured the US government and has shown a disdain for being perceived as someone who even pretends to follow social norms or respect societal rules. You can just look at his actions with regard to Twitter and you can see, without needing any political lense, that he's openly haphazard about this kind of technology and how he wants to use it, especially for his own personal gain, because he knows he's untouchable. The guy just sucks at the job of being the face of these companies, and this is how sucking at that job affects the bottom-line. But, again, that doesn't matter to him because he has so much money that he can just personally bankroll past those inadequacies.
  - agustechbro 2mo ago
    Thats a very naive position to have my friend. You AT LEAST know Musk position/stance. What about the others CEOs? you never hear them talking about politics, perhaps some of them are 10x worst in ideology and bad influence against your values and you will buy and give your data to them without knowing. Ultimately, you are using a judgment you objetivelly can NOT do, nor trully compare the other options, so you are complicating and perhaps and ultimatelly being the grain of sand of a sand storm that can do damage to probably the most important entrepreneur of our time, who achieved so much. I Rather give him resources to achieve something, because the guy does eventually deilvers.
KerrAvon 2mo ago
Tesla has lost both house battery and car sales in my family -- we're talking hundreds of thousands of dollars -- simply because we don't trust him not to remotely shut off our power/cars for petty political reasons. Also, if you want true privacy you should run AI models on local hardware. (Guess which country's models dominate SOTA/near SOTA open weights? Yes, it's China, and it's not even close. You can run full-fat DeepSeek locally for (just) under $10K USD.)
- KronisLV 2mo ago
  > You can run full-fat DeepSeek locally for (just) under $10K USD.) Is that price not way off if you want actual decent performance, like at least 30-60 tokens per second and at least >256k context size?
  - Alpha3031 2mo ago
    Supposedly people are getting ~40 tps decode at Q8 on 2× DGX Spark (higher for Q4) which is what I assume they're suggesting is just under $10K USD. Prefill is just above 1.5k so TTFT is maybe 2 to 4 minutes? I don't have two DGX Sparks myself so I can't confirm and not 100% sure if that number is with or without speculative decoding already in use (if not probably around 60 to 80 if enabled?).
bryanlarsen 2mo ago
If I was Chinese, I'd probably trust Grok more than a local AI company. Americans would probably trust the Chinese companies more. It's less about "who is more trustworthy", it's more about "who is more willing and able to affect me".
- bmitc 2mo ago
  I think that underestimates how little the Chinese care about what Americans are doing. They're moving so fast that watching what the U.S. is doing would slow them down.
  - bryanlarsen 2mo ago
    The Chinese do care what the Chinese government does, and are interested in minimizing what the government knows about them, and are well aware of the internet firewall the government operates and that any Chinese company will give the Chinese government whatever they ask for.
- re-thc 2mo ago
  > If I was Chinese, I'd probably trust Grok more than a local AI company. Nah. There are more established companies (e.g. Tencent, Alibaba, etc) and academia (e.g. Moonshot, Zai, etc) involved than in the US (comparatively). Also there are more Chinese AI researchers involved than non-Chinese (whether they physically sit in China or not).
tosh 2mo ago
> where Grok finally catches up if the benches hold it did catch up
- ValentineC 2mo ago
  After my and many others' experience with Claude Opus 5 being hot garbage for normal agentic programming use, I'm not sure benchmarks mean much anymore. Much less Grok's, since they have a reputation for unethical benchmaxxing, among other things.
kardianos 2mo ago
[flagged]
- babelfish 2mo ago
  This is just an anti-trans dogwhistle
  - kardianos 2mo ago
    Truth is what corresponds with reality.
    - babelfish 2mo ago
      Yes, and reality (+ biology) show that trans people have been around as long as humans have. They are a biological reality. Reality has a left-wing bias.
      - throwawaypath 2mo ago
        [flagged]
        babelfish 2mo ago
        Are you able to differentiate between sex and gender, or is any nuance too complicated for you? Maybe Grok can explain it!
        throwawaypath 2mo ago
        [flagged]
        blaps 2mo ago
        [flagged]
        2mo ago
tavavex 2mo ago
> He's literally so rich that he can get caught personally looking through chat sessions and it wouldn't slow him down a bit. Looking through chat histories is boring, mundane stuff. He's richer than that, think bigger. I think he could kill a random person in front of thousands, and by the next day we'd see articles arguing why the random person actually deserved it and why it's not that bad. Whatever consequences would be lined up would inevitably face unexpected roadblocks which would all result in nothing happening.
- calldacopsidgaf 2mo ago
  > He's richer than that, think bigger. that's the hilarious paradox at the center of his antics. Musk is infamously petty and insecure. We're talking about the guy who tweaked Grok's system prompt to flatter him and paid someone to boost his fucking Diablo character for clout. I wouldn't put "looking through chat histories" past him for one second.
  - tavavex 2mo ago
    I'm not saying Musk isn't petty, I just think that in this crazy world, especially with the lines between public and private slowly blurring, we could have news like "some AI lab let the owner or a higher-up read chat histories" come out of any company and barely make a splash in the mainstream. Maybe it would be discussed for a few days on HN before something else takes the attention away.
  - Jensson 2mo ago
    Reddits owner is also petty and insecure and edited other peoples posts, Elon hasn't done that yet. Didn't seem to stop reddit from getting popular, people don't really care that much.
    - calldacopsidgaf 2mo ago
      ...but people don't just hate Elon because he's petty? they hate him for the prejudiced BS and his actually harmful meddling in politics
ben_w 2mo ago
> All I hear about Claude, GPT, Gemini, etc., are how terrible they are, yet any discussion of Grok seems to always revolve around sensible, but confident, assertions that it's actually a great product and every new release is the point where Grok finally catches up. Ironically, I only see coments like yours regarding Grok. Tesla self driving cars, (somewhat) as you say, but even the biggest proponents of Grok are like "oh no the best model is this, ugh".
txrx0000 2mo ago
It doesn't seem like Grok is being astroturfed, if anything the opposite. There are two Chinese models on the front page while this is on the second page as of writing. And there would always be so many comments personally attacking Musk whenever his company releases something. I think this is being CCP bot farmed.
- Philpax 2mo ago
  I think you might be underestimating how many people genuinely despise Musk.
- petu 2mo ago
  Two Chinese models are open weight. What interesting going for Grok that it would overshadow all bad PR?
  - txrx0000 2mo ago
    Qwen3.8 is, but DeepSeek-V4-Pro-0813 is not open weights yet, though they do have a good track record. Grok would be the best open-weights model if they released the weights right now. Elon supported Jensen's open weights letter last month, we'll see if he follows through.
narrator 2mo ago
The next model in two weeks is going to be even better and you won't use it cause you're paranoid and believe propaganda.
nailer 2mo ago
> Beyond that, the obvious astroturfing that occurs on this site (along with reddit, etc.) when it comes to Grok isn't helping. Your comment is at number 1 on the thread. It has no rationale for why you consider Musk so unlikeable. It might instead be possible that unjistified anti-Musk content is unreasonably elevated.
- gafferongames 2mo ago
  There is no such thing as unjustified anti-Musk content.
  - nailer 2mo ago
    Yes there is. Same way there is any other kind of content without a justification. Make a comment, provide zero supporting arguments. If you have a justification and don't provide it, the comment is worthless regardless of the subject. Of course you have an opinion different than other people: many people do, that is not interesting and is a waste of people's time.
s08148692 2mo ago
> the obvious astroturfing that occurs on this site (along with reddit, etc.) when it comes to Grok isn't helping. All I hear about Claude, GPT, Gemini, etc., are how terrible they are, yet any discussion of Grok seems to always revolve around sensible, but confident, assertions that it's actually a great product and every new release is the point where Grok finally catches up. this is the exact opposite of my experiences on HN and Reddit. In my experience, Grok is typically reduced to hitlerbot and CSAM generator and rarely taken as a serious competitor. People let their hatred of Musk blind them to the tech of his companies
bakies 2mo ago
Musk is in bed with my authoritarian government, what's China gonna do to me?
- Rover222 2mo ago
  laughable thinking the us govt is authoritarian. unless you were referring to some other govt
  - bakies 2mo ago
    Laughable thinking they aren't
    - Rover222 2mo ago
      we have free speech, don't be so gullible. you think Chinese citizens can go out in the streets and say anything they want. pathetically ignorant.
      - deleted 2mo ago
        [deleted]
      - bakies 2mo ago
        We're not China no, but where's Snowden right now? Free speech doesn't make the government not authoritarian. It's not binary either.
        Rover222 2mo ago
        That's true, it's a spectrum. And the US has wayyy more free speech than even Great Britain. I'm a fan of Snowden, but suggesting that we're living in an authoritarian state because he's in exile is a stretch, IMO.
        bakies 2mo ago
        It's a spectrum, we've got it better than others but still ruled by an oligarchy that thrashes our rights including speech

itsdesmond 2mo ago

[flagged]

throwaway-blaze 2mo ago
Not unless you're here illegally. And it has nothing to do with skin color. Just the basic fact that a country not in control of its borders ceases to be a country.
- ChoosesBarbecue 2mo ago
  >> [Twitter user] Go anywhere in the UK and look around, you'll just see foreigners everywhere. >> It's truly sickening the damage that has been done to our nation and our people. >> We have to stop immigration and start remigration before we can even begin to reverse the damage that has been done. > [Elon] Remigration is the only way [0] [0]: https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1962406618886492245 https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1962406618886492245
- itsdesmond 2mo ago
  > Remigration is a far-right concept referring to the ethnic cleansing[1] via mass deportation of non-white minority populations, especially immigrants and sometimes including native-born citizens, to their place of racial ancestry.[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remigration https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remigration It’s right there at the top. One google search is all it takes. You didn’t even, for a second, think to familiarize yourself with the remigration concept. You jumped immediately to me being wrong, even though I was discussing something you were ignorant of. That’s embarrassing.
  - whatthesmack 2mo ago
    I reject your (and Wikipedia’s) theory of “remigration” arbitrarily defining something that is (not actually) happening in the US. People are being deported from the US based on their lack of legal presence in the country, which is what every country also does. Nobody is being deported because of their skin color. Also, nobody is jumping to the conclusion that you’re wrong about something that is not actually happening. It’s just a simple fact that what you’ve stated is preposterous to begin with and is not the policy of any recent law or administration in the US.
    - itsdesmond 2mo ago
      No one is saying it is currently happening, you goof. Remigration is an idea proposed by identitarian assholes like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Sellner https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Sellner, author of a book called Remigration, who Musk has promoted in tweets. It is not currently happening, but the richest man in the world is among those actively working to make it happen. Again, you types confidently misunderstand a discussion.
- bakies 2mo ago
  Trump is doing everything in his power to make people illegal. Outright revoking visas and making immigrants unemployment so their visa sponsorship is expired. This is nationalism and doesn't have anything to do with border control but with brutalizing minorities. We had all the border control, the border encounters being exactly 0 since Trump took office? Pretty obviously bullshit, it's the same as before with extra brutality. Despicable and disgusting people think like you and support this policy.

oulipo 2mo ago

[flagged]

aturek 2mo ago
[flagged]
neonstatic 2mo ago
And rightfully so. Unfortunately, they are perfectly fine with a marxist-leninist AI, and that's troubling.
- tavavex 2mo ago
  Can you name a "Marxist-Leninist AI" that's made by a real AI lab (i.e. no finetunes of open models made by someone on the internet)? I'm just trying to understand what the other side's equivalent of MechaHitler is here.
  - slater 2mo ago
    It's just their latest "everything i dislike is woke" thing, with a new (old) twist.
    - ben_w 2mo ago
      In fairness, Marxism–Leninism is the official ideology of the actual Chinese Communist Party. I leave it as an exercise for the reader if they're just saying that.
    - greenregiment 2mo ago
      Slater you are a miserable loser with 0 life accomplishments
  - throwawaypath 2mo ago
    Can you name a "Nazi AI" that's made by a real AI lab (i.e. no finetunes of open models made by someone on the internet)? I'm just trying to understand what the other side's equivalent of MechaStalin is here.

re-thc 2mo ago

> It's crazy that I'd literally trust a Chinese AI company with my data It's crazy how much Chinese = bad the media or US companies have washed into you. Why lump it together? Like any place and any company there are good and bad 1s. It's not the Wild West over there...

crimsoneer 2mo ago
I mean, the Chinese government doesn't really believe in checks and balances, or corporations as autonomous to the state. That's not a conspiracy, that's just how the CCP sees it (ask Jack Ma). You could argue the US has the Cloud Act, and obviously their respect for rules based law and order as a concept has heavily deteriorated, for but it's a very different kettle of fish to a regime who just doesn't even believe in the concept.
- toasty228 2mo ago
  Meanwhile Trump is building a surveillance state with all his tech executives friends who all massively benefit from government sponsored schemes, it's TOTALLY different!
  - crimsoneer 2mo ago
    At the risk of stating the obvious, Trump has had his tariff policy killed off in the courts (although it'll obviously come back in some form) and in a few months is going to have (probably not great) midterm elections. And there are pretty open efforts to commit genocide in Xinjiang to preserve a nationalist myth of ethnic purity. So, you know, yes.
- KerrAvon 2mo ago
  So have you looked at what's happened in the US over the past 10 years? The US has much further to fall, but it's falling very, very quickly and if there's ever another Democratic president they're going to have to rebuild a lot of the government from scratch.
  - 2mo ago

agustechbro 2mo ago

[flagged]

nater5000 2mo ago
This is a matter of politics; it's a matter of reputation. I'm fine with using AI tools offered by companies like OpenAI, Anthropic, and Google despite knowing that these companies are ran by billionaires who are much more aligned, politically, to Musk than they are with me. What I'm not fine with is handing over valuable data to a guy that has literally completely captured the US government and has shown a disdain for being perceived as someone who even pretends to follow social norms or respect societal rules. You can just look at his actions with regard to Twitter and you can see, without needing any political lense, that he's openly haphazard about this kind of technology and how he wants to use it, especially for his own personal gain, because he knows he's untouchable. The guy just sucks at the job of being the face of these companies, and this is how sucking at that job affects the bottom-line. But, again, that doesn't matter to him because he has so much money that he can just personally bankroll past those inadequacies.
- agustechbro 2mo ago
  Thats a very naive position to have my friend. You AT LEAST know Musk position/stance. What about the others CEOs? you never hear them talking about politics, perhaps some of them are 10x worst in ideology and bad influence against your values and you will buy and give your data to them without knowing. Ultimately, you are using a judgment you objetivelly can NOT do, nor trully compare the other options, so you are complicating and perhaps and ultimatelly being the grain of sand of a sand storm that can do damage to probably the most important entrepreneur of our time, who achieved so much. I Rather give him resources to achieve something, because the guy does eventually deilvers.

KerrAvon 2mo ago

Tesla has lost both house battery and car sales in my family -- we're talking hundreds of thousands of dollars -- simply because we don't trust him not to remotely shut off our power/cars for petty political reasons. Also, if you want true privacy you should run AI models on local hardware. (Guess which country's models dominate SOTA/near SOTA open weights? Yes, it's China, and it's not even close. You can run full-fat DeepSeek locally for (just) under $10K USD.)

KronisLV 2mo ago
> You can run full-fat DeepSeek locally for (just) under $10K USD.) Is that price not way off if you want actual decent performance, like at least 30-60 tokens per second and at least >256k context size?
- Alpha3031 2mo ago
  Supposedly people are getting ~40 tps decode at Q8 on 2× DGX Spark (higher for Q4) which is what I assume they're suggesting is just under $10K USD. Prefill is just above 1.5k so TTFT is maybe 2 to 4 minutes? I don't have two DGX Sparks myself so I can't confirm and not 100% sure if that number is with or without speculative decoding already in use (if not probably around 60 to 80 if enabled?).

bryanlarsen 2mo ago

If I was Chinese, I'd probably trust Grok more than a local AI company. Americans would probably trust the Chinese companies more. It's less about "who is more trustworthy", it's more about "who is more willing and able to affect me".

bmitc 2mo ago
I think that underestimates how little the Chinese care about what Americans are doing. They're moving so fast that watching what the U.S. is doing would slow them down.
- bryanlarsen 2mo ago
  The Chinese do care what the Chinese government does, and are interested in minimizing what the government knows about them, and are well aware of the internet firewall the government operates and that any Chinese company will give the Chinese government whatever they ask for.
re-thc 2mo ago
> If I was Chinese, I'd probably trust Grok more than a local AI company. Nah. There are more established companies (e.g. Tencent, Alibaba, etc) and academia (e.g. Moonshot, Zai, etc) involved than in the US (comparatively). Also there are more Chinese AI researchers involved than non-Chinese (whether they physically sit in China or not).

tosh 2mo ago

> where Grok finally catches up if the benches hold it did catch up

ValentineC 2mo ago
After my and many others' experience with Claude Opus 5 being hot garbage for normal agentic programming use, I'm not sure benchmarks mean much anymore. Much less Grok's, since they have a reputation for unethical benchmaxxing, among other things.

kardianos 2mo ago

[flagged]

babelfish 2mo ago
This is just an anti-trans dogwhistle
- kardianos 2mo ago
  Truth is what corresponds with reality.
  - babelfish 2mo ago
    Yes, and reality (+ biology) show that trans people have been around as long as humans have. They are a biological reality. Reality has a left-wing bias.
    - throwawaypath 2mo ago
      [flagged]
      - babelfish 2mo ago
        Are you able to differentiate between sex and gender, or is any nuance too complicated for you? Maybe Grok can explain it!
        throwawaypath 2mo ago
        [flagged]
        blaps 2mo ago
        [flagged]
        2mo ago

tavavex 2mo ago

> He's literally so rich that he can get caught personally looking through chat sessions and it wouldn't slow him down a bit. Looking through chat histories is boring, mundane stuff. He's richer than that, think bigger. I think he could kill a random person in front of thousands, and by the next day we'd see articles arguing why the random person actually deserved it and why it's not that bad. Whatever consequences would be lined up would inevitably face unexpected roadblocks which would all result in nothing happening.

calldacopsidgaf 2mo ago
> He's richer than that, think bigger. that's the hilarious paradox at the center of his antics. Musk is infamously petty and insecure. We're talking about the guy who tweaked Grok's system prompt to flatter him and paid someone to boost his fucking Diablo character for clout. I wouldn't put "looking through chat histories" past him for one second.
- tavavex 2mo ago
  I'm not saying Musk isn't petty, I just think that in this crazy world, especially with the lines between public and private slowly blurring, we could have news like "some AI lab let the owner or a higher-up read chat histories" come out of any company and barely make a splash in the mainstream. Maybe it would be discussed for a few days on HN before something else takes the attention away.
- Jensson 2mo ago
  Reddits owner is also petty and insecure and edited other peoples posts, Elon hasn't done that yet. Didn't seem to stop reddit from getting popular, people don't really care that much.
  - calldacopsidgaf 2mo ago
    ...but people don't just hate Elon because he's petty? they hate him for the prejudiced BS and his actually harmful meddling in politics

ben_w 2mo ago

> All I hear about Claude, GPT, Gemini, etc., are how terrible they are, yet any discussion of Grok seems to always revolve around sensible, but confident, assertions that it's actually a great product and every new release is the point where Grok finally catches up. Ironically, I only see coments like yours regarding Grok. Tesla self driving cars, (somewhat) as you say, but even the biggest proponents of Grok are like "oh no the best model is this, ugh".

txrx0000 2mo ago

It doesn't seem like Grok is being astroturfed, if anything the opposite. There are two Chinese models on the front page while this is on the second page as of writing. And there would always be so many comments personally attacking Musk whenever his company releases something. I think this is being CCP bot farmed.

Philpax 2mo ago
I think you might be underestimating how many people genuinely despise Musk.
petu 2mo ago
Two Chinese models are open weight. What interesting going for Grok that it would overshadow all bad PR?
- txrx0000 2mo ago
  Qwen3.8 is, but DeepSeek-V4-Pro-0813 is not open weights yet, though they do have a good track record. Grok would be the best open-weights model if they released the weights right now. Elon supported Jensen's open weights letter last month, we'll see if he follows through.

narrator 2mo ago

The next model in two weeks is going to be even better and you won't use it cause you're paranoid and believe propaganda.

nailer 2mo ago

> Beyond that, the obvious astroturfing that occurs on this site (along with reddit, etc.) when it comes to Grok isn't helping. Your comment is at number 1 on the thread. It has no rationale for why you consider Musk so unlikeable. It might instead be possible that unjistified anti-Musk content is unreasonably elevated.

gafferongames 2mo ago
There is no such thing as unjustified anti-Musk content.
- nailer 2mo ago
  Yes there is. Same way there is any other kind of content without a justification. Make a comment, provide zero supporting arguments. If you have a justification and don't provide it, the comment is worthless regardless of the subject. Of course you have an opinion different than other people: many people do, that is not interesting and is a waste of people's time.

s08148692 2mo ago

> the obvious astroturfing that occurs on this site (along with reddit, etc.) when it comes to Grok isn't helping. All I hear about Claude, GPT, Gemini, etc., are how terrible they are, yet any discussion of Grok seems to always revolve around sensible, but confident, assertions that it's actually a great product and every new release is the point where Grok finally catches up. this is the exact opposite of my experiences on HN and Reddit. In my experience, Grok is typically reduced to hitlerbot and CSAM generator and rarely taken as a serious competitor. People let their hatred of Musk blind them to the tech of his companies

bakies 2mo ago

Musk is in bed with my authoritarian government, what's China gonna do to me?

Rover222 2mo ago
laughable thinking the us govt is authoritarian. unless you were referring to some other govt
- bakies 2mo ago
  Laughable thinking they aren't
  - Rover222 2mo ago
    we have free speech, don't be so gullible. you think Chinese citizens can go out in the streets and say anything they want. pathetically ignorant.
    - deleted 2mo ago
      [deleted]
    - bakies 2mo ago
      We're not China no, but where's Snowden right now? Free speech doesn't make the government not authoritarian. It's not binary either.
      - Rover222 2mo ago
        That's true, it's a spectrum. And the US has wayyy more free speech than even Great Britain. I'm a fan of Snowden, but suggesting that we're living in an authoritarian state because he's in exile is a stretch, IMO.
        bakies 2mo ago
        It's a spectrum, we've got it better than others but still ruled by an oligarchy that thrashes our rights including speech